S07.E06: WHAT A RIDE

[imjagain]

1 hour ago, CofCinci said:

C&T were definitely disrespecting B&T's limits and boundaries with the partial pics of Carly.  Not cool.  Not cool at all.

Honestly, as much as it may hurt Catelynn, I hope B&T never offer an afternoon again.  Catelynn wasn't happy with just the trip to the park and wanted a beach DAY.  Nothing will ever make C&T happy except for Carly moving in with them --- which is never going to happen because the child is being raised in a different class with a different set of values and standards.

This why I'm so gobsmacked by C&T, what do they really expect? To share custody of Carly?  The way they speak of her is as if they don't consider B&T her parents.

[CofCinci]

24 minutes ago, imjagain said:

This why I'm so gobsmacked by C&T, what do they really expect? To share custody of Carly?  The way they speak of her is as if they don't consider B&T her parents.

They don’t consider B&T to be parents — only play parents. Not ‘real’ parents. In their warped minds, B&T are Carly’s guardians and the child will be handed over to C&T on 05/18/2027.  They probably have a reminder set.

[gunderda]

19 hours ago, Linny said:

Alright, let me get this straight: Amber ends her tumultuous and toxic relationship with Matt and almost immediately begins talking to a guy who hit her up on social media (just like Matt), 

no no noooooooo she was totally still going to go see matt UNTIL newMatt showed up. Then amazingly she was over Matt. Shenanigans. 

12 hours ago, CofCinci said:

Are we all in agreement that Amber was ridiculous with her anger towards Gary’s reluctance to let Amber see Bew Bew within 30 minutes? Like the kid is a Dominos pizza.  You don’t see the kid for weeks and have the nerve to demand to see her in 30 minutes?!

Super ridiculous. I so badly wanted Gary to tell her "no, you can't try to call and come over last minute, you must PLAN" but I have a feeling Gary didn't have a reason to lie and say no so she just let her do it. 

9 hours ago, druzy said:

Was the meet and greet between B&T and C&T in a state that B&T do not reside? B&T said they wanted to do things as a family and it seemed like they too rented a house for the visit. I think B&T moved to a different state and they don't want C&T to know where they live.  I can't blame them after the harassment they experienced.

I think originally they were to never know where B&T lived.  Letters always went through a middle man and phone calls were set up a certain way so that numbers weren't exchanged (I think). I pretty sure they didn't even know their last name. I think with the lovely age of the internet their 'fans' probably did detective work for them.

2 hours ago, Claire85 said:

De-lurking to say, was anyone else annoyed that pictures of Carly were used? Yes, her face was not shown. And maybe B&T were okay with it. But I yelled at my TV, “how many time do they have to TELL YOU to stop with the pictures of Carly!?” 

I'd say there's a pretty good chance those photos were approved.  They do that every time there's a Carly visit and they're obviously professional photos.  I think they don't allow filming but they do allow someone from MTV to take photos. 

 

I almost feel bad for Sophia.  That poor kid is so brainwashed and she's a complete weirdo on top of it. She flipped a 180 on her grandma on her own?? I don't think so!! You can tell she loved hanging out with Deb with Deb lived with them or was able to visit a lot. And now she's homeschooled and will never have friends....

[Caracoa1]

I believe Cate and Tyler are extremely disappointed that Nova was not the "big draw" they felt she would be to Brandon and Theresa.  I'm sure they thought there was no way they could resist having her in Carly's life....they would be guaranteed several visits a year and co-parent together! It's like they are trying to horn in on the Davis Family to make up for the shit family they grew up in......and for the record...they aren't raising Nova.....April is!

[TheRealT]

2 hours ago, CofCinci said:

Catelynn is NOT Dawn’s client. Brandon and Teresa are/were her clients.  Dawn is under no professional obligation to assist C&T.  Catelynn most likely waived representation during her pregnancy and had no advocate looking out for her. Not even her dirtbag parents could be bothered to help.

I think that's correct according to Dawn/the agency, but that means that C&T were lied to and manipulated by Dawn and the agency.

[mamadrama]

"I'm a cinematographer" says one cameraman of a trashy reality show to the cameramen of another.

Meanwhile...

Producers and cameramen are kicking themselves for their ethics. Instead of backstabbing each other to climb up to the role of exec, they could've been wooing the dummies.

[CofCinci]

11 minutes ago, TheRealT said:

I think that's correct according to Dawn/the agency, but that means that C&T were lied to and manipulated by Dawn and the agency.

Catelynn isn’t the first and won’t be the last. 

https://www.thenation.com/article/shotgun-adoption/

[Vandy10]

Man, Farrah really looked like Leela from Futurama in that restaurant with her pony tail, hair color, and lips. In my head, her two eyes were merging into Leela's one. It was almost enough to distract from Sophia's antics.

 

As an in-process adopting mom, Cate and Tyler's segments are hard to watch. I feel so bad for B&T. They never should have agreed to the adoption, but they couldn't have had a clue the show would still be going 8-9 years later. And I truly believe that    the show is a big part of the mess that is now their situation; the producers and fans have been egging them on for years. I feel bad for C&T too. I believe their pain is real, but handled so unhealthily. And Dawn's a moron.

[mamadrama]

Seeing Frenchie made me miss Rock of Love and Charm School.

Oh, VH1 and your days of "celebreality." How I miss you...

[TheRealT]

2 minutes ago, Vandy10 said:

As an in-process adopting mom, Cate and Tyler's segments are hard to watch. I feel so bad for B&T. They never should have agreed to the adoption, but they couldn't have had a clue the show would still be going 8-9 years later. And I truly believe that    the show is a big part of the mess that is now their situation; the producers and fans have been egging them on for years. I feel bad for C&T too. I believe their pain is real, but handled so unhealthily. And Dawn's a moron.

I think that all sides of the Carly adoption suffer greatly from the TMI Syndrome that being on the show causes. We see it a lot with the sets of bioparents/family when things are said on camera (and therefore revealed to other concerned parties) that would ordinarily not be shared. There are good reasons that humans have mostly developed social norms of not sharing every thought with everyone, particularly when relationships are inherently complicated (like coparenting exes, in-laws, adoptive/birth families, etc.).

In non-televised adoption situations I'm sure it's common for both sides to feel/talk about things that might be problematic for the other side to hear. That's why they talk about it among themselves. In this situation, B&T hear a lot of C&T's "private" thoughts via the show/social media/etc. and I don't think it's helpful. To make matters worse, C&T are too dumb/immature to realize that they are not helping themselves achieve their goal of having as much contact with Carly as possible and the MTV staff manipulate them into sharing their feelings on camera without regard for how B&T will react. As horrible as I think Dawn is, she at least tries to discourage them from saying things that will likely upset B&T on camera. Maybe she only does that to protect her real clients' (B&T's) interests, but I think it's also ultimately in C&T's best interests as well.

[woodscommaelle]

5 hours ago, LilaFowler said:

I don't have much sympathy (or any, really) for Mackenzie. She knew what she was doing when she married him. Boo hoo, bitch.

I don’t get it. What’s her end game here? She seems kind of miserable, so what’s the point? It can’t just be ‘fame and fortune,’ could it?  God that’s depressing.  

[alexa]

Though I think Sophia was acting odd I do think she sincerely dislikes David on her own based on what she has seen when with him. Though Farrah is an influence kids can understand creepy pretty quickly. So I think it also makes her uncomfortable around her grandma who was already weird to begin with. I think the distance from her and the time spent with Michael has made Deb even more uncomfortable to be around (since he is somewhat normal and doesn’t talk to her like she is 3). 

[eskimo]

Gary and Kristina should petition the court to cut Amber's visitation down to the bare minimum, considering she doesn't use it anyway. I think it's worse for Leah to know that her mom could be with her at least 8 days a month (and Gary would let Amber see Leah more than that if she were responsible) but chooses to spend 0-1 day a month.  I'm of the 'all-in-or-all-out' mindset when it comes to a significant person in a child's life. 

Then they need to fight to stop Leah from being filmed at all.  (Like many have already said, she is too old now.  This show is really about the drama of the adults anyways, the parents could still bitch about each other without showing the children.)  If Amber refused, then just file a motion with the court.  That ought to throw her back into bed for several months.  If all else fails, offer to forgive back child support in exchange.  Not filming Leah would have no effect on Amber anyway. 

[hoosiermommy]

7 hours ago, imjagain said:

I agree with your whole post, the part I bolded  started me thinking. Why haven't B&T made these visits stop. I get that they are nice kind people who have wanted to leave an opening for C&T to see their daughter from time to time. I just can't see myself dealing with all this BS (Teen Mom, MTV , crazy fans.) I would never let our visits happen while TM was filming. If they can't bring  themselves to say absolutely no more visits, they could definitely say not while you are filming. Idk, I couldn't deal with all the "she misses us" or "she called me daddy" (Tyler a few years ago).  That stuff just makes  C&T fans "scream give them their baby back!" I'm sure they are nice. I just think I'd have a hard time with these delusional people. 

Because it isn't about B&T or even C&T. It is about Carley and allowing her to know her heritage and blood relations.

 

My son is 5. He sees his birth mother yearly. He has told me before he misses her. I don't know what he misses, but yes, kids that age can know and miss people.

 

Adoption is hard. Adoptive parents go in knowing that their children's reality is a whole other set of parents.  And sometimes it really sucks to have to acknowledge and accept that. But if B&T cut off C&T because they are "crazy" or "immature" or whatever, when the day comes when they have to explain why, an adoptee could make the jump that, since they share blood, they have the same undesirable traits and of mom and dad didn't like it with birth parents, they don't like it with me.

 

A lot of adoptees struggle with feelings of inadequacy...no need to make it more likely or worse.

[mamadrama]

1 hour ago, hoosiermommy said:

Because it isn't about B&T or even C&T. It is about Carley and allowing her to know her heritage and blood relations.

 

My son is 5. He sees his birth mother yearly. He has told me before he misses her. I don't know what he misses, but yes, kids that age can know and miss people.

 

Adoption is hard. Adoptive parents go in knowing that their children's reality is a whole other set of parents.  And sometimes it really sucks to have to acknowledge and accept that. But if B&T cut off C&T because they are "crazy" or "immature" or whatever, when the day comes when they have to explain why, an adoptee could make the jump that, since they share blood, they have the same undesirable traits and of mom and dad didn't like it with birth parents, they don't like it with me.

 

A lot of adoptees struggle with feelings of inadequacy...no need to make it more likely or worse.

There's a line, though, there and if the birth parents continue to cross it then it might be better for the child to close the adoption even if it DOES mean some harder conversations and questions later. They don't have to use words like "crazy" or "immature" to describe C&T. They can, however, use words like "addicts", "boundary crossing", "endangering," "disrespectful", "baiting" (which is what they do to their fans in regards to B&T), etc. 

[guilfoyleatpp]

@hoosiermommy and @TheRealT all salient points. I hadn't thought of those before.

I know a few adults who were adopted as infants and even though they never knew their birth parents, there is a sense of...something. It could certainly be a coincidence that the personality trait they share is a leaning toward loner-ness.

I also know a few parents of adopted children and I've often thought how challenging that must be, especially trying to negotiate a relationship with troubled birth parents.

I realize that Carly's adoptive parents are in a tight spot. C&T do say things about their frustration with b&T that would be better left unsaid, especially in front of the cameras.

They also, SO WEIRDLY, have zero empathy for Brandon and Teresa.  We never hear them ponder about how b&t might have approached some sort of kid behavior without knowing xxx about Carly, especially since they now have Nova. They don't ever seem to consider how their words and behavior might appear to b&t, even though they've felt repercussions for saying or doing certain things. It's so odd that they're 100% focused on how they feel without ever seeming to even realize that people other than CARLY are directly impacted by their actions. What is that? Narcissism? 

[TheRealT]

2 hours ago, hoosiermommy said:

Because it isn't about B&T or even C&T. It is about Carley and allowing her to know her heritage and blood relations.

 

My son is 5. He sees his birth mother yearly. He has told me before he misses her. I don't know what he misses, but yes, kids that age can know and miss people.

 

Adoption is hard. Adoptive parents go in knowing that their children's reality is a whole other set of parents.  And sometimes it really sucks to have to acknowledge and accept that. But if B&T cut off C&T because they are "crazy" or "immature" or whatever, when the day comes when they have to explain why, an adoptee could make the jump that, since they share blood, they have the same undesirable traits and of mom and dad didn't like it with birth parents, they don't like it with me.

 

A lot of adoptees struggle with feelings of inadequacy...no need to make it more likely or worse.

Yeah, I don't think B&T do the visits to be nice to C&T (nor should they); they do it for Carly. From what we've heard/seen of Carly on the show, it seems that she is interested in having some kind of relationship with C&T (and now Nova). Some adoptees feel very attached to their bio families (however that manifests) and some don't. I wouldn't assume that an adoptee doesn't/shouldn't feel any connection to their bio family or that feeling connected to their bio family is some kind of slight toward/rejection of their adoptive family.

59 minutes ago, mamadrama said:

There's a line, though, there and if the birth parents continue to cross it then it might be better for the child to close the adoption even if it DOES mean some harder conversations and questions later. They don't have to use words like "crazy" or "immature" to describe C&T. They can, however, use words like "addicts", "boundary crossing", "endangering," "disrespectful", "baiting" (which is what they do to their fans in regards to B&T), etc. 

IMO, C&T are certainly fucked up in a general sense, but I don't think they pose any threat to Carly. IMO, being "crazy" (in the way that they are) or "immature" isn't sufficient reason to cut a kid's bioparents out of her life if she is interested in knowing them. From B&T's perspective (holding all the power), "boundary crossing" can be addressed through communication and explicit boundary setting, even if that's a pain in the ass and an ongoing struggle. It's not ideal for B&T, but it shouldn't be about them; it should be about Carly. They agreed to an open adoption knowing that C&T were fucked up teenagers from fucked up families. As older, wiser, more stable people, they should have at least considered that the relationship with C&T might not always be sunshine and roses. I could understand them closing the adoption if C&T did something to jeopardize Carly's well-being, but I think it would be wrong for them to close it because C&T have issues (which mostly don't affect Carly), make comments that B&T don't like (when Carly isn't present), etc.

Edited January 3, 2018 by TheRealT

[MoonMountain]

C&T are so damned delusional, and for everyone's sake, I wish they would stop beating themselves up for choosing adoption for Carly. I wish they would change their perspective a bit, and acknowledge that sometimes they have feelings of sadness or go through the what-ifs, but by and large made a totally respectable and appropriate decision. The disrespect they have for B&T is alarming. B&T couldn't have known when they filmed 16 and pregnant that these people would grow up to be ungrateful narrow-minded a-holes.

Why did McKenzie and Ryan get married again? That dude has zero redeeming qualities. I cannot see how someone would think he is so great to be around that you want it to be your full-time life.

Farrah is ridiculous. Why she enjoys berating her family members in public places on a regular basis is beyond me. I was only half-watching the preview for next week, and totally thought she put DebzOG on her wedding invites. I pushed rewind and was bummed to see that wasn't the case. Haha. For someone who seems so concerned about appearances, I'm surprised that Farrah allows Sophia to look like the girl from the Ring, and be filmed looking like that. For god sake's, someone get that girl a hairbrush. 

[kitkat343]

Sofia’s situation demonstrates that it really sad that children can be homeschooled by any raving lunatic in this country. The best thing in the world for her would be to go to school and hopefully learn how to behave like a less feral child by her teachers and counselors.  Now she’ll spend all day long listening to her mother complain about everything, meeting porn stars, and preparing for her career as a model.  That’s a pretty insane career goal for an attractive child, but absolutely nuts for Sophia who would be laughed out of every modeling gig not looking for mtv cameras.  

 

And i I have no idea what mackenzie will do to fill her days after her second wedding is over.  Do you think she’ll hold a vow renewal at 6 months?

[onatrek]

23 minutes ago, kitkat343 said:

Sofia’s situation demonstrates that it really sad that children can be homeschooled by any raving lunatic in this country. The best thing in the world for her would be to go to school and hopefully learn how to behave like a less feral child by her teachers and counselors.  Now she’ll spend all day long listening to her mother complain about everything, meeting porn stars, and preparing for her career as a model.  That’s a pretty insane career goal for an attractive child, but absolutely nuts for Sophia who would be laughed out of every modeling gig not looking for mtv cameras.  

 

And i I have no idea what mackenzie will do to fill her days after her second wedding is over.  Do you think she’ll hold a vow renewal at 6 months?

The more we've seen of Sophia lately, the more I'm wondering if the real reason behind the homeschooling is it being suggested maybe she be tested or something and Farrah being incensed and yanking her out of that school (and avoiding putting her elsewhere) because she's afraid it's going to come up elsewhere as well.

[imjagain]

Spoiler

 

Of all the TM children it's Leah I feel the worst for.

Bentley,  yes his dad is a junkie and Maci may or may not be a drunk but I feel he is genuinely loved by his family. 

Sofia, while I think she will be messed up . Her mother aND Grandmother  are complete self absorbed  bitchy assholes. The thing is I have a feeling that Sofia will be too. I think she will be incredibly self absorbed that she will not notice/care how messed up she is. 

Nova, yes she will have a Carly complex  (will never live upto the sister that  her parents had to give away) but I think C&T do love her and while they will probably never change. They will still be Lazy and delusional  but they do care for Nova  and Cate/ Tyler moms seem to love her so there's that.

Leah will see how much Amber didn't choose her time and time again. She will never be able to understand why her mom didn't want to be in her life. All that whole bew bew bullshit will start to annoy the hell out of her. Leah is pretty smart and will see how fake Amber is and know at the end of the day Amber will put  Leah third behind men and of course Amber herself . While I think  Leah will have a good family with Gary and his wife and those siblings.  I can see how that will hurt more. she will know how a real family/mom act.  Unlike Sofia who will know no difference,  Leah will . And that'swhy feel for her the most.

Eta: idk why there's a spoiler box lol.

Edited January 3, 2018 by imjagain

[Calm81]

9 hours ago, Vandy10 said:

Man, Farrah really looked like Leela from Futurama in that restaurant with her pony tail, hair color, and lips. In my head, her two eyes were merging into Leela's one. It was almost enough to distract from Sophia's antics.

 

As an in-process adopting mom, Cate and Tyler's segments are hard to watch. I feel so bad for B&T. They never should have agreed to the adoption, but they couldn't have had a clue the show would still be going 8-9 years later. And I truly believe that    the show is a big part of the mess that is now their situation; the producers and fans have been egging them on for years. I feel bad for C&T too. I believe their pain is real, but handled so unhealthily. And Dawn's a moron.

Pics or it didn’t happen. Lol. I was too lazy to pull a screen grab from the actual show but dang you’re spot on in your assessment. Nice!

 

[Uncle JUICE]

1 hour ago, Calm81 said:

Pics or it didn’t happen. Lol. I was too lazy to pull a screen grab from the actual show but dang you’re spot on in your assessment. Nice!

 

I can't wait until like three years from now when people are looking at z-list celebs and Youtubers with this glitterface and thinking "Why on earth would that be a look you'd do on purpose? You looked like one of The Holograms."

[Tatum]

11 hours ago, TheRealT said:

I think that's correct according to Dawn/the agency, but that means that C&T were lied to and manipulated by Dawn and the agency.

Bethany Christian Services or whatever has come under a lot of fire for being dishonest to both adoptive parents and birth parents, but I have yet to see anything Dawn specifically did that was shady. She asked them upfront what their expectations were as far as open adoption. Cate said she wanted to see pictures and maybe call. Those expectations have been met. Dawn was honest about the emotional cost of giving up their baby. Dawn has continued to politely manage C&T when they (or their entitled, obnoxious family members) cross the line. Perhaps something happened off camera, but we have seen no evidence of any manipulation coming from Dawn. Tyler was dead set against keeping the baby and Cate was dead set on keeping Tyler.

 

And honestly? While it's not shocking that an adoption agency that makes money off adoptions would be pushy and/or dishonest with the birth parents, the specific complaints I've read from birth parents who used that agency are hard to take seriously.

 

One of the complaints I read by a woman claiming to be a birth mother who used Bethany was that she was lied to (she didn't say specifically how) and then asked something like, how would you (meaning the person reading her complaints), feel about watching your flesh and blood call a complete stranger mommy? Like, if that baby is old enough to call someone mommy, she's probably been there long enough to bond with that person and it's not a complete stranger. It is his or her mother.

 

Adoption agencies certainly can be shady, but I absolutely don't believe even the most unscrupulous of agencies would tell a pregnant woman considering adoption, "oh, this is still totally your baby. The adoptive parents are just going to raise it until you change your mind, at any given point over the next 6 decades. You are still this baby's mother and will be treated as such." I think some of these people are angry at the choices they made and are looking for someone else to blame.

[AirQuotes]

Maci was the most likable of this episode.  I'm glad she had fun skydiving, and I want to hang out with Taylor's barber.

Farrah is vile.  Absolutely vile!  I can't think of any descriptors for Sophia that are better than those already mentioned ~ goblin, gremlin, feral child, etc.  David is a shitty creep that Debz OG needs to reconsider marrying, but where in the world would Farrah get the idea that it is a good idea to have Sophia throw down the gauntlet about it!  It just goes to show how deranged and bizarre Farrah can be.

Amber is gross and I really don't like her fingernails.  They remind me of when I was a kid and my friends and I would put Bugles (those cone shaped snack chips) on the ends of our fingers like they were pointy witch fingernails. lol

Mack is the unofficial 5th mom, and I'm kind of loving the crazy she brings.   Ryan's totally back on drugs, and Mack is living in a fantasy world staging engagement photo shoots with her husband (that was too high to fend her off when she dragged him to the outdoor justice-of-the-peace wedding.  Admittedly, I'm a very playful adult who loves toys and board games, but even I thought Ryan was being really weird with his toy truck.   When he put it on his head, I was lol.  (It reminded me of the scene years ago when he was riding around in a wheelchair in the driveway popping wheelies and such.)  I can see Mack every anniversary setting up an elaborate wedding disguised as a vow renewal.  Now I think we can be fairly certain the Christmas photos this year were staged in a photography studio.

Cate ~  their visit with Carly was hard for me to watch.  Let me begin by saying again, I'm glad my adoption was not open, and I didn't have to deal with the confusion of reconciling my family against my birth family.  I don't think these visits are healthy for Cate, and they need to stop.  These visits are on par with picking a scab.  How can she ever heal if the wound isn't allowed to close?  Cate has what I think is cognitive dissonance, and they do lots of projecting onto both Carly and Nova.  TM has not done any of them any favors. 

Cate was crying about Carly wanting to ride in their car and Theresa saying no, but Cate was acting like Carly wanting to ride with them is some sign of her deep longing to be with them.  Ummm, no.  Kids like to do stuff that is different just because.  Example from my personal life ~ one of my best friends lives about an hour away and we meet up to do stuff.  My kids always want to ride in her car and her kids want to ride in my car.  It doesn't mean her kids want to come live with me and vice versa!  BUT there is a bigger issue underneath the surface and that is Cate's reaction to Theresa saying no.  It would be totally inappropriate for Carly to be alone with C&T because of *their* lack of boundaries AND they are known drug users.  In fact, they are *proud* of their drug use and belligerently brag about it on social media.

Carly is not obsessed with Nova.  Good gravy.  These people and their delusions!  Nova didn't even give a shit about Carly.  When they brought up stuff about the visit, Nova talked about stuff from the park like the train.   My kids are like @ghoulina 's kids.  They will meet a new kid and be their bff, including exchanging phone numbers.  Once we leave wherever, within 5 minutes the new friend is forgotten.  That's just kids.

I have one last example.  My mom had one brother who moved away to Florida, and his daughter (my favorite cousin) is 2 months younger than me.  They came home to visit for a week every summer, and it was one of the highlights of my year every year growing up.  I knew them and I loved them and I loved their visits, but I never longed to run away and go live with them.  C&T are doing lots of projecting.  Lots of projecting.

Even though this is a trashy reality show, I'm not sure adoption has ever really been shown like this before.  I guess some adopted kids might naturally struggle with feelings of inadequacy, but I don't.  Maybe it comes down to a glass half empty/half full mindset/outlook.  My birth parents placed me for adoption, and I could be fucked up and all "boo hoo!  They didn't want me!  Poor me!" and waste my life crying about it OR I can be realistic and know something was happening.  Some circumstance prevented them from being able to properly parent me and they had the awareness to love me so much they wanted better for me!  My birth parents had such great love for me that they wanted me to have the best life possible and they were willing to sacrifice their own happiness for mine.  My parents made a planned and conscious effort to be parents!  That's incredible.

In my experience, people want to push their negativity off on me and try to make me feel rejected/inadequate.  Quite frankly, I have none of that, and I'm quite confident to defend myself and my parents.  I talk about it here, but in real life it isn't something I really discuss.  Mainly I have to discuss it with medical professionals because my family medical history is unknown so I have to disclose that in my medical records and my children have to disclose it.   

[vmcd88]

A couple of questions..... Did Brandon and Theresa change Carly's name?  is it just Catelynn and Tyler calling her Carly?Does Carly know who Tyler and Catelynn are?  Good lord they need to close that adoption (like 3 years ago already).  

[MaggieG]

Good God, Amber is ridiculous. Gary is a better person than me, I would not have let her come over. She owes him almost 10 grand in child support?! And NewMatt is already driving her around?! She doesn't see Leah but is already pregnant with this guy after dating him for 2 minutes??!! I caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaan't (TM Roxanne from TM2)

I don't have words for Sophia. I just feel bad for the poor kid. She will never be normal. 

[Lusterleaf]

20 hours ago, hokeypokeyFOIA said:

The problem with that is they don't have a crystal ball to know how Carly will feel about that later. If they completely break it off, it could come back to haunt them later. Carly's only 8 or 9 right now, but she's just a few years away from turning into a teen who will have a LOT of questions. All these teen mom kids are going to have a ton of questions for their parents. 

Most parents at least get a pass on their kids having questionable memories of the younger years. Not these kids. 

But I feel like it hurts Catelynn more when she does see Carly because she wonders "what if"... it might be better for her if they close it and she moves on and then when Carly turns 18 she can decide whether or not she wants to pursue a relationship with C&T....  Also, I don't blame B&T if they close it, since C&T always talk trash about them.

[GreenlinetoHarlem]

19 hours ago, Calm81 said:

When Sofia is in college she will have to defend to a lot of people about her mom selling her Butthole and vag online. I know it’s a legal profession but most people in the industry go under a pseudo name and have any connection to family members not be obvious. Teenagers and twenty somethings in college are not that kind or forgiving to something like that and may bully Sophia.

I don't judge sex workers, and neither do my teenage children, because our family values are to be non-judgmental and accepting of other people's choices unless they are actively hurting people. The least of my concerns for Sophia is being teased by some asshole teenagers and young adults later in life because her mom had her hustle going selling adult toys. It's the parents who raise bullies (who are usually judgmental assholes themselves) that are responsible for bullying children, and by college, that's on the young adult bullies, not Farrah. It will serve an older Sophia well to learn to ignore/avoid  legitimate "haters" who will judge and be mean to her based on what they know about her family of origin. Same for Nova, Jenelle's kids, and  the other TMspawn unfortunates. I just hope they all can find their way to some good therapists and there will be resources to pay for  it, because it won't be easy, but kids are resilient and I hold out hope for all of the kids at this point.

That being said, home schooling is a terrible idea for Sophia! She was at her most normal in terms of manner and voice at her slumber party in Austin. She needs her routine and structure and peers very badly in order to thrive. This is a really bad move on Farrah's part, imo. 

[Quilty]

Now Farrah is going to homeschool Sophia. There's no hope left for that kid. Going to school was her only escape .

[AirQuotes]

If kids are so resilient, why are there so many screwed up adults?  Kids really are powerless to do anything about whatever situation they are dealing with.  The anger and hostility manifests in the teen/adult years.

Sophia is at an impressionable age and being around so many hypersexual adults can have a negative effect on her.  I pity sex workers; I would never be mean towards them, but I do pity them.  Truly mentally healthy people do not willingly go into sex work.  That isn't judgment; it is reality.  Back in my younger days, I had several friends who got into working as strippers.  They all had to dope themselves up to get up there and do it.   Outwardly they sold it with bravado, but to really know them was a different story.  It is a hard way to make a living.  Quite sad.  Many want out but it is a trap.

[Lusterleaf]

30 minutes ago, Quilty said:

Now Farrah is going to homeschool Sophia. There's no hope left for that kid. Going to school was her only escape .

I have a feeling Sophia was probably bullied in school, and that is probably why Farrah is homeschooling her. But I agree, being around Farrah and her lifestyle is not good for a child.

[AirQuotes]

11 minutes ago, Lusterleaf said:

I have a feeling Sophia was probably bullied in school, and that is probably why Farrah is homeschooling her. But I agree, being around Farrah and her lifestyle is not good for a child.

I can see that being the most likely scenario.  Teachers probably had a hard time dealing with Farrah and her superiority complex.    I seem to remember a year or so ago Farrah put something on twitter about Sophia getting in trouble at school for wearing make up.

[Tatum]

28 minutes ago, AirQuotes said:

If kids are so resilient, why are there so many screwed up adults?  Kids really are powerless to do anything about whatever situation they are dealing with.  The anger and hostility manifests in the teen/adult years.

Sophia is at an impressionable age and being around so many hypersexual adults can have a negative effect on her.  I pity sex workers; I would never be mean towards them, but I do pity them.  Truly mentally healthy people do not willingly go into sex work.  That isn't judgment; it is reality.  Back in my younger days, I had several friends who got into working as strippers.  They all had to dope themselves up to get up there and do it.   Outwardly they sold it with bravado, but to really know them was a different story.  It is a hard way to make a living.  Quite sad.  Many want out but it is a trap.

Yeah, I can't say there are no sex workers in the industry that are happy, well adjusted people who just chose this line of work because they can make a lot of money at it, but it has been reported in numerous publications that there is a strong link between female sex workers and childhood sexual abuse. That's not to say that all sex workers have that history, but there is a significant correlation.

 

Farrah herself is not a poster child for the notion of a happy, well adjusted woman who works in the sex industry. I am certain there was some kind of abuse (be it physical or emotional) going on in the Abraham household when she was growing up, and there have been several hints that Farrah was sexually assaulted while working on her Backdoor Teen Mom project (I am not talking about the allegations against James Deen).

[ReadMeLattice]

3 hours ago, Tatum said:

Bethany Christian Services or whatever has come under a lot of fire for being dishonest to both adoptive parents and birth parents, but I have yet to see anything Dawn specifically did that was shady. She asked them upfront what their expectations were as far as open adoption. Cate said she wanted to see pictures and maybe call. Those expectations have been met. Dawn was honest about the emotional cost of giving up their baby. Dawn has continued to politely manage C&T when they (or their entitled, obnoxious family members) cross the line. Perhaps something happened off camera, but we have seen no evidence of any manipulation coming from Dawn. Tyler was dead set against keeping the baby and Cate was dead set on keeping Tyler.

This. It's easy to think NOW because of C&T's behavior and comments that they were misled, so a couple of weeks ago I looked back over some of the older episodes. From what we saw, at least, and what they said on camera, they were pretty damn clear about what their role was going to be. I believe they even called it a "semi-open" adoption, which they've retroactively altered to say "open," and clearly indicated that the most would be getting would be the very seldom visit and a yearly call and/or picture. 

I have sympathy for anyone who made a decision at 17 that stuck with them forever. God knows I was so dumb at that age. But that's generally why (and I say this with zero judgment) teens are discouraged from having children--because they are not prepared to make big choices. They were just underprivileged kids from abusive families, especially in Catelynn's case, and had no guidance and no fathers save for one frequently incarcerated violent asshole, so I certainly have no judgment for the decisions they made or having unprotected sex at 15 or whatever. But now, the show has made them REALLY big for their britches. They have delusions of grandeur and have developed a level of entitlement that has allowed them to justify their rampant disrespect of B&T and their subsequent rewriting of the adoption to claim it was always "open." It wasn't, and they indicated that they knew that at the time. I suspect they still know it, but have been bolstered so much by their "fans" that they can't see straight anymore. Anyone who respects them or cares for them should encourage them to seek intensive counseling to deal with their feelings of resentment and jealousy/regret, and to shut the hell up about B&T. 

[StayingAfterSunday]

42 minutes ago, AirQuotes said:

If kids are so resilient, why are there so many screwed up adults?  Kids really are powerless to do anything about whatever situation they are dealing with.  The anger and hostility manifests in the teen/adult years.

Sophia is at an impressionable age and being around so many hypersexual adults can have a negative effect on her.  I pity sex workers; I would never be mean towards them, but I do pity them.  Truly mentally healthy people do not willingly go into sex work.  That isn't judgment; it is reality.  Back in my younger days, I had several friends who got into working as strippers.  They all had to dope themselves up to get up there and do it.   Outwardly they sold it with bravado, but to really know them was a different story.  It is a hard way to make a living.  Quite sad.  Many want out but it is a trap.

And to think that webcams have made the job so convenient, not to mention lucrative, that some "sex workers" don't even have to leave their houses.  What a world.

[RamonaSenomar]

20 hours ago, Calm81 said:

I’m really starting to get pissed off for the sake of the children on this show. Most people when they grow up are able to embellish about their upbringing a little bit if they’re ashamed of something. Obviously not lie, but not shout to the rooftop to everyone about their childhood.

When Sofia is in college she will have to defend to a lot of people about her mom selling her Butthole and vag online. I know it’s a legal profession but most people in the industry go under a pseudo name and have any connection to family members not be obvious. Teenagers and twenty somethings in college are not that kind or forgiving to something like that and may bully Sophia.

Or Nova will be teased about her mom taking her grandmother to “boogie town” on the way to get a pig. Then for her mom to simultaneously enter a rehab after the pig impulse. While at the same token having everyone know her grandfather beat her grandmother and was in prison for drugs and domestic abuse. Any future in-laws she tries to become family with are going to scrutinize their son for choosing Nova knowing that she’s predisposed to a family life of drugs, addiction and abuse.

Bentleys dad was filmed nodding off in a car to his fake wedding while his mother was caught drinking shots while pregnant with her third oopsie baby before marriage while having videos of “gingers last binger” floating around on social media.

Everyone will know that Leah’s mom chose man after man after man and even prison over parenting her. Her mom is on video storming after a pornstar while dressed like a Marilyn Monroe drag queen.

I’m not trying to judge anyone for their mistakes because we’ve all made mistakes that we wouldn’t want our children and their friends - friends parents to know about but ours isn’t on television.

 

I’m still traumatized over hearing my parents bed creaking when I was 19 years old. Or when I caught my mom flash my dad her mountains while we were on summer vacation, I couldn’t imagine seeing and having to relive on video what the Teen mom franchise children have been exposed to.

I guess all of my babbling is getting at is, I feel genuine sadness for these children who had no say in whether they wanted to be apart of the Truman show. I mean, what if any of them wanted to be in law enforcement or become a teacher or a doctor where their background will be SCRUTINIZED so severely that the investigator will see ALL OF THE FOOTAGE OF THEIR LIFE GROWING UP AND THEIR FAMILY MEMBERS. ?

I have a friend that was having a background check done for the government job and they grilled him about a second cousin being in jail...these kids are going to have a hard time with respectable employment. You know their parents aren’t saving them a trust fund aside from Chelsea or maybe Gary. 

I’ll shut up now. I just foresee a lot of angry and resentful teenagers/adults in the future. ? Innocent children.

IMHO, this is all precisely what mature adults like Brandon and Teresa have figured out for Carly that immature folks like Catelynn and Tyler et. al. have not figured out for Carly. 

My own kids have even figured out by now what is and isn't an appropriate photo (and accompanying announcement) to post on my limited-friends-list-and-tightest-privacy-settings on facebook.  Pics of my kids winning a medal at a school awards ceremony?  "Post it on facebook, Mom!"  Pics of my kids with bedhead while sipping chocolate milk in their fleece jammies while playing endless Minecraft?  "You're NOT posting that on facebook, Mom!"

*sigh* But I digress.

[Tatum]

20 minutes ago, Lm2162 said:

This. It's easy to think NOW because of C&T's behavior and comments that they were misled, so a couple of weeks ago I looked back over some of the older episodes. From what we saw, at least, and what they said on camera, they were pretty damn clear about what their role was going to be. I believe they even called it a "semi-open" adoption, which they've retroactively altered to say "open," and clearly indicated that the most would be getting would be the very seldom visit and a yearly call and/or picture. 

I have sympathy for anyone who made a decision at 17 that stuck with them forever. God knows I was so dumb at that age. But that's generally why (and I say this with zero judgment) teens are discouraged from having children--because they are not prepared to make big choices. They were just underprivileged kids from abusive families, especially in Catelynn's case, and had no guidance and no fathers save for one frequently incarcerated violent asshole, so I certainly have no judgment for the decisions they made or having unprotected sex at 15 or whatever. But now, the show has made them REALLY big for their britches. They have delusions of grandeur and have developed a level of entitlement that has allowed them to justify their rampant disrespect of B&T and their subsequent rewriting of the adoption to claim it was always "open." It wasn't, and they indicated that they knew that at the time. I suspect they still know it, but have been bolstered so much by their "fans" that they can't see straight anymore. Anyone who respects them or cares for them should encourage them to seek intensive counseling to deal with their feelings of resentment and jealousy/regret, and to shut the hell up about B&T. 

I used to cut them some slack, thinking how frustrating it must have been to give Carly up because they couldn't afford her, only to basically win the lottery a year later, but look at them now- I assume Tyler gets paid independent of Cate, so these two probably have the highest household income of any of the Teen Moms, plus they had, what, 6 additional years of childless living to sow wild oats and live it up, and they are totally shit parents to Nova now. All while whining about losing Carly. Carly is nothing but an idealized, romanticized notion to them. They probably would have been even shittier parents to her back in 2009 than they are to poor Nova now.

[heatherchandler]

On 1/1/2018 at 11:33 PM, KittyKat133 said:

I know we kind to snark on C & T and that can resume after this comment. 

Watching that scene with those still shots, I’m a total mess. I am so choked up seeing caits face in that one photo where she is hugging Carly It was just so heartbreaking and I could just feel all of that pain. 

Having two children of my own (one who is only 3 months today!) makes me feel totally differently thAn I did when I saw their 16 and pregnant. 

I think that visit Alone may have sent me to a rehab or mental health facility. It’s just Almost too much to process. I just feel really bad for Caitlin in many ways. She’s had such a fucked up very sad life. 

 

I think C&T have very strong, deep feelings that they do not understand and therefore cannot explain.  They say that they "miss" her but I think what they feel is grief.  There are chemicals in our brains that create a feeling in our bodies when we are with our children - it is the way we bond, it is nothing we can even fully understand.  So, when they feel these emotions, I think it confuses them and they have not found a way to articulate what is going on/feelings the have.

They feel a need to see this child that they barely know, and I wish someone would explain to them that it is normal to feel that way and there will be sadness, but I don't think anyone has adequately explained this to them.

Also, keep in mind, these people are not very well educated.  A lot of the biology of it all just does not compute. 

 

On 1/2/2018 at 10:43 AM, guilfoyleatpp said:

Happy 4th Trimester, Kitty! I wish you 8 hour sleeps soon!

 

 

I would like to know when this 8 hour sleeping happens.  My kids are 8 and 4... still waiting...

 

19 hours ago, CofCinci said:

Catelynn is NOT Dawn’s client. Brandon and Teresa are/were her clients.  Dawn is under no professional obligation to assist C&T.  Catelynn most likely waived representation during her pregnancy and had no advocate looking out for her. Not even her dirtbag parents could be bothered to help.

 

I was just reminded of April in a meth-stupor, stomping around and slamming doors when Cait would start talking about adoption.  So awful!

 

12 hours ago, guilfoyleatpp said:

 

They also, SO WEIRDLY, have zero empathy for Brandon and Teresa.  We never hear them ponder about how b&t might have approached some sort of kid behavior without knowing xxx about Carly, especially since they now have Nova. They don't ever seem to consider how their words and behavior might appear to b&t, even though they've felt repercussions for saying or doing certain things. It's so odd that they're 100% focused on how they feel without ever seeming to even realize that people other than CARLY are directly impacted by their actions. What is that? Narcissism? 

I think this also speaks to the lack of education and lack of parenting by April and Butch.  These things are taught to you by parents.  Also, the more you learn and read and grow, the more understanding you have about the world.  You learn that other people have feelings.  

 

5 hours ago, Tatum said:

 

 

Adoption agencies certainly can be shady, but I absolutely don't believe even the most unscrupulous of agencies would tell a pregnant woman considering adoption, "oh, this is still totally your baby. The adoptive parents are just going to raise it until you change your mind, at any given point over the next 6 decades. You are still this baby's mother and will be treated as such." I think some of these people are angry at the choices they made and are looking for someone else to blame.

 

Sometimes these women only hear what they want to hear.  They are usually young, uneducated and going through crisis.  How can they fully understand what is going on?  They don't have the tools.  So, when they fully realize what adoption really is - they feel sadness and regret.  Then they look for the person to blame.  

Edited January 3, 2018 by heatherchandler

[ghoulina]

17 hours ago, Caracoa1 said:

I believe Cate and Tyler are extremely disappointed that Nova was not the "big draw" they felt she would be to Brandon and Theresa.  I'm sure they thought there was no way they could resist having her in Carly's life....they would be guaranteed several visits a year and co-parent together! It's like they are trying to horn in on the Davis Family to make up for the shit family they grew up in......and for the record...they aren't raising Nova.....April is!

Wow, I never thought about that. I always figured they had Nova to give them more of a storyline on the show (since we all know they weren't ever going to do the whole college thing they blustered about). And I do think that's part of it. But your post has me wondering if they really didn't think having another baby who is 100% Carly's biological sibling would kind of force B&T to get more involved with them? Hmmmm

 

16 hours ago, woodscommaelle said:

I don’t get it. What’s her end game here? She seems kind of miserable, so what’s the point? It can’t just be ‘fame and fortune,’ could it?  God that’s depressing.  

You have to remember that despite looking 38, homegirl is really only in her early 20s.  She's just a kid, herself. So yea, I really DO think she coveted some level of fame, and money. 

[teapot]

16 minutes ago, heatherchandler said:

 

I think C&T have very strong, deep feelings that they do not understand and therefore cannot explain.  They say that they "miss" her but I think what they feel is grief.  There are chemicals in our brains that create a feeling in our bodies when we are with our children - it is the way we bond, it is nothing we can even fully understand.  So, when they feel these emotions, I think it confuses them and they have not found a way to articulate what is going on/feelings the have.

They feel a need to see this child that they barely know, and I wish someone would explain to them that it is normal to feel that way and there will be sadness, but I don't think anyone has adequately explained this to them.

 

do you guys remember that Ashley girl from 16 & Pregnant?  She had a daughter, and her relatives adopted her, but she kept going back & forth and honestly couldn't decide whether she could parent.

She was such a messed-up kid but she seemed really nice.

anyway, it seems that she stayed close to the daughter this whole time but she hasn't raised her.  she got back together w/the girl's father and now they have a son.  I follow her on instagram & she's always talking about how she loves the baby but she wishes things could have been different with the daughter.  like every time she mentions her son she also mentions her daughter...

 

and sometimes I think I need real friends instead of spying on strangers on the internet...nah, it's easier this way;  I don't have to get as involved and no one expects anything of me because they don't even know I exist!

link to a story about Ashley

http://www.intouchweekly.com/posts/ashley-salazar-16-and-pregnant-baby-boy-122747

[ghoulina]

YES. I remember that. I thought that situation was even worse; because surely you'd see the kid at family events and holidays. Sigh. I really feel for everyone involved in these scenarios. There are no easy answers. 

[hankthetank]

On 1/1/2018 at 11:33 PM, Frank the Tank said:

Ok where do I start with gaggle of misfits 

Lets start with good ol dead eyes Rhine complaining how difficult the pictures are gonna be since he has to put on a dress shirt and pants .... no wonder he won’t take a drug test he won’t pass cause he’s still high as fuck ... cmon I know a stoned bitch when I see one .... they probably had to super glue his eyelids open in the pics so he looks awake .... and how old is this fucking tool ... just sits around and puts decals on truck models .. I wish someone would just beat his spoiled ass for the fun of it . As for Mackensie I hope those photographers can photoshop in a chin for that shrek looking bitch... how desperate you gotta be for fame and money to marry a total drugged out d bag then try and play the victim card ..... with those teeth and no chin her only quality would be as a can opener.

 

ok now Farrah the human blow up doll.. she’s just too easy to go on about ... she’s thinks she’s the Mother Theresa of whores .... tries to sound intelligent but once that pez dispenser opens its mouth you see how dumb it is.... says she doesn’t associate with crazy people while her gremlin daughter is growling and snorting while licking herself ..... this is why you don’t feed Sofia after midnight ... it turns into a gremlin .... they had the no water thing going cause god knows that real life garbage pail kid hadn’t touched water or soap since it’s birth .... also Deb lay off the peyote you look like a circus clown.

Then there’s Slamber.... the human slug .... always with the excuses to why she can’t see her daughter .... talk about a waste of space ... this bitch is the epitome of trailer trash knob gobbler. She’s too depressed to see her own daughter but perfectly fine to have her new bf ... matt In sumo suit come see her.... and damn fat sumo matt is coming off as a stalker .... was I the only one who found it weird when he said he was trying to follow slugsworth from room to room so he could hear more about her .... creepy but hey serial killers need love too.

Finally the Power Couple .... Tyler and Cate .... I love how they have all the answers and the adoption parents should be lucky that they gave them Carley .... I wish .... shit I’ll pay  the adoption parents to never let those two mental giants see Carley again.... I fucking can not stand Tyler and cate .... every scene Tyler has his phone stuck in his face .... Tyler listen to me no one wants to buy your shit clothes bro .... you’re a complete d bag as is your dirty cockroach dad. And I’m still wondering in amazement how that porch swing did not collapse when jean shorts queen decided to try it out..... you know her horse is thinking to himself every time cate gets on to ride him ... what did I do to get punished .... poor horse is 2 yrs old and already has back problems for that piggly wiggly .... 

 

the only thing about maci is I wish they made her wear a mask so I didn’t have to see her man face when she talks .... I swear she’s a tranny .... she looks more masculine than that pirate she’s married to...

 

I loved this post and i love your username (almost the same as mine!!).  We should be friends. 

Edited January 3, 2018 by hankthetank

[Tatum]

Quote

And I’m still wondering in amazement how that porch swing did not collapse when jean shorts queen decided to try it out

 

Hurricane Gloria didn't break the porch swing, Monica did!

[Pepper Mostly]

2 hours ago, RamonaSenomar said:

When Sofia is in college she will have to defend to a lot of people about her mom selling her Butthole and vag online. I know it’s a legal profession but most people in the industry go under a pseudo name and have any connection to family members not be obvious. Teenagers and twenty somethings in college are not that kind or forgiving to something like that and may bully Sophia.

Or Nova will be teased about her mom taking her grandmother to “boogie town” on the way to get a pig. Then for her mom to simultaneously enter a rehab after the pig impulse. While at the same token having everyone know her grandfather beat her grandmother and was in prison for drugs and domestic abuse.

If either Sophia or Nova sticks one toe into any college in the USA I will cheerfully eat a Chevrolet. You can choose the make/model. Not that they won't get flak from mean and ignorant people, but I think that the chances of either of these kids pursuing higher education are vanishingly small! Sophia will probably emancipate herself at 16. Nova--well, if she doesn't follow in her mother's footsteps and end up knocked up as a teen, I'll be very, very surprised. (And the worst thing? This stupid show will still be on! And we'll all still be here!(

[vmcd88]

Has Amber had the baby yet?  Cause I wonder how it will be for her when she has the baby 24/7 and God forbid, has to be a hands on parent even when she doesnt feel like it.  Can you just imagine taking a full on break from parenting when are having a bad day/week/month?  Poor Leah. Poor new baby.  

Damn Sofia needs to be in therapy.  Growling when someone asks you a question is not normal.  That kid scares me.  

[CofCinci]

I think Sophia is in therapy. Her horse came from a breeder well known for therapy horses. 

[ElderPrice]

So far no one has mentioned the most disgusting part of the episode-Deb double dipping salsa when Farrah takes Sophia outside to caucus. Blech. 

Edited January 3, 2018 by ElderPrice

[DangerousMinds]

On 1/2/2018 at 6:17 PM, mrs ra said:

This is what I find so frustrating about their so called "adoption counselor". Why isn't she reminding her of the circumstances when she was 16. And helping her to not look back so much, and to help her understand that she made an unselfish loving decision that was best for Carly. 

Agreed. Their decision was NOT based solely on their lack of money. They were 16 and absolutely not in a position to parent.

[CofCinci]

Do they ever speculate what it would have been like to have an infant in the house with drug addicted Butch and April as they yelled and beat each other?  Nope. They didn’t start to get cash until 2012.  They need to stop fantasizing and accept reality.