S11.E01: Great Scot! The Hurricanes Are Coming / S11.E2: A Sheep Is Going to Eat Us!

[gonecrackers]

Just saw this... was good to see them use the show to bring a face, both human & furry, to the devastation in Houston, & how he helped out the shelter with donations. I hope we'll get updates on "Houston", the puppy.

For the trips I get that Jen had to work so why not bring the family but that kind of trip is kind of lost on kids that age, & makes it tougher for the adults to enjoy. I also wondered why they didn't do the castle the first day & save the distillery for the second (while Grandma watched them for a while or something). The kids seemed less tired & grumpy day one, because even though the distillery was clearly not appropriate they behaved better.  Also, Jen wasn't as interested in the distillery, would've been able to catch at least some of the castle that she did want to see, & the kids seem to respect her more especially when "Mommy uses her serious voice."  So that probably could've been planned better.

I wondered about the media failing during her keynote, & whether or not that was a TLC stunt. I could just picture the coaching to the audience - 'now just stare straight ahead at Jen & we'll make this look really uncomfortable' LOL.

[BitterApple]

I think it was a TLC stunt. When Jen was wrapping up her speech, the slide behind her said "Thank You" in big letters with smaller text underneath. I'm assuming that was the end of the media presentation. 

[Kid]

On 9/19/2017 at 9:22 PM, LocalGovt said:

Let me say, I really like this family.  I was, however, disappointed in Bill's lack of parenting his kids on this vacation. The grands, I'll give a pass to, because they're not around the kids often enough.  But Bill -- in that castle -- slamming cannons, swinging ancient gongs....and Bill just kind of...let it go on. I don't know if the kids don't have many boundaries, or are not told not to do certain things (I had a niece who didn't ever want to tell her son "no", because she felt it was too negative). I've worked with preschoolers and young children in a teaching environment, so I've seen others this age in action, so to speak.  

I totally agree. Those kids are cute but they were out of control and that isn't cute.  Especially Zoe. She and I would've had a come to Jesus moment.

Edited September 22, 2017 by Kid

[IndianPaintbrush]

As a historian and museum lover, I was horrified by how the kids acted in that castle. Kids can be taught not to touch things and not to interrupt the tour guide. Bill's attitude just plain sucked. And the kids should not have been at the distillery at all. Why couldn't Jen have done something with them separately since she's not a fan of scotch? 

Edited September 23, 2017 by IndianPaintbrush

[bybrandy]

My brother and I, for reasons I cannot explain, loved house tours from the time we were very, very little.  H liked the movies that set the scene and time period of the house before the tour and I liked the actual house tour part.  So the house tours were the part of the vacation my brother and I often picked when picking activities.  I know H and I are weird.  But I also know a young child can be told how to behave on something like that.  

As for taking them to the distillery  I'm sure the distillery paid for them to come, so....  eh... But I think that is the rare occasion when I probably would have set them up at the end table with a tablet and a movie.   I'm not a huge zone your kids out on tablet thing but it was such a grown up activity and I'm sure Bill didn't get the experience he wanted because of the kids, either.  

My parents always prefaced every vacation experience with, "This is the thing that x picked" (everybody got to pick at least one thing while on vacation) And it may be the most fun thing ever, and it may not be bit we do not complain and we do act appropriately and we will all do the same when it is time to do the activity you picked.   I think it is because of that that I really enjoy a really wide array of activities when traveling because respecting everybody's choice was what was expected and I had a lot of fun doing a lot of things I might not have tried otherwise.   

I think not doing things because kids might hate them really keeps your kids from learning and growing, but I do think you need to have real discussion with your kids about what it is your doing and what is expected of them while you are doing it.  Obviously, we don't see everything that happens around their excursions but I would have liked a scene where Bill explained to the kids that they were going to a castle and it would have very old things and that they needed to be careful and not touch anything.

[mythoughtis]

Yes- if they had to bring the kids to a distillery- bring their tablets and headphones.  The pub was fine. The castle would have been fine, since there was a playground at the end.  HoweverBill should have held Zoe's hand and had Will stand next to him or Bills parents. Until they learn to behave better- doesn't matter what their chronological age is.   I'm going to agree that they still have catching up to do there- given their early history.  That was probably some of the worst tour behavior I've seen televised- except for the Duggar tribe at Stonehenge. 

 

But it is nice to see this family who obviously get great joy out of each other and their kids. 

Edited September 25, 2017 by mythoughtis

[sATL]

On ‎9‎/‎20‎/‎2017 at 0:58 PM, Evagirl said:

Regarding the house in Houston - Bill said it had been renovated after they moved and this was his first time seeing it after the renovation.  I noticed the kitchen counters were highger, so I'm thinking (since he used the word renovated on a brand new house), that they had everything customized for littler people re-modified to accommodate average height people.

First and most important, my heart and prayers go out to all residents of Houston. The loss of lives and devastation as reported on some of the news stories made me teary eyed.

Now back to the house - given all we saw on the news, didn't anyone think the house was in above average "pristine" order when Bill and his brothers drove up? Yard perfectly manicured, grass luscious green and thick, no visible water signs, white paint nice and shiny, no tree damage, flowers standing tall, driveway all clean and pressure washed? after 5 feet of rain?  My house &yard doesn't look that good after a drought - let alone a massive rain storm.

Edited September 25, 2017 by sATL

[sATL]

On ‎9‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 10:12 PM, gonecrackers said:

I wondered about the media failing during her keynote, & whether or not that was a TLC stunt. I could just picture the coaching to the audience - 'now just stare straight ahead at Jen & we'll make this look really uncomfortable' LOL.

I was appalled. at both TLC and Jen. TLC made Jen look foolish by not being prepared to give her presentation if the media failed. And Jen - the Dr. extraordinaire,  that travels all over the world sharing her knowledge - not a good look in front of your peers and the hospital(s) you are representing. TLC shouldn't be messing with someone's primary occupation & coin - esp. if it is saving lives. A couple of opening jokes is fine, but this is a medical conference - I would expect information, not someone who is trying to be on Def Comedy Jam.

First of all, I'm sure Jen has delivered a version , if not an exact copy, of the presentation before. why in Hell didn't she have a hard copy of her notes in her carry on bag? Yes, one can still print documents on paper. Secondly, given her experience with presentations, why didn't she email an advance copy of her slides to the staff , giving them time to play with the media equipment? And the hotel/conference center could also have printed notes, if  need be. Why couldn't she take 5 minutes and upload her presentation to some site and let the video equipment play from the site, or email it to the attendees, to pull up on their device?  Jen is not some grade school kid with limited resources - she really could have brought or shipped ahead her own equipment to show on the big screen.

Edited September 25, 2017 by sATL

[Absolom]

Yes to all of the above.  My daughter has to give presentations much like Jen's address and she's there in plenty of time before the presentation to check out the media situation.   She always has presentations in the Cloud, on the laptop, on a stick, and who knows how many other places.  Anywhere she and her husband can think of it seems plus on actual paper especially for big ones I've seen.  I wonder if this was a TLC driven event during a break in the real program for whoever they could get into the seats.  

[mythoughtis]

It seemed to me that Jen forged ahead once she determined that the assistants couldn't or wouldn't fix the slides. Presumably they fixed it while she was speaking.  She was just nonplussed for a minute. 

[jumper sage]

On 9/21/2017 at 10:12 PM, gonecrackers said:

whether or not that was a TLC stunt

I think it was a stunt.  My guy loves to cut up our family videos so they look like something else, just for fun.  He walked in and said that they shot the audience and he thinks either they cut out her speech, and inserted the ers, and ums later or asked the audience if they wanted to be on a tv show and had them sit through the crap we saw.

 

On 9/23/2017 at 11:45 PM, bybrandy said:

I'm not a huge zone your kids out on tablet thing

I am!  Especially at restaurants and such.

I could not believe they aired that very poor parenting.  Even if they had a closed set, having the kids run around like that is not good parenting because they are too young to understand why now and not later?

[jaybird2]

i was channel hopping and found this.  they are in scotland at a distillery ...why would parents take their children to a distillery where they're tasting?

[Whyyouneedaname]

On 9/22/2017 at 1:44 PM, Kid said:

I totally agree. Those kids are cute but they were out of control and that isn't cute.  Especially Zoe. She and I would've had a come to Jesus moment.

Rewatching the castle episode, not sure if I missed it or not but I never once saw an adult explain the ropes, what they were used for or this significance of what was behind it. They may not have understood what all was behind the ropes but they would have understood, "we walk on this side and we do not go over the ropes." If they hadn't I'm sure a pop on the butt or leg would have showed them a little more of what was allowed. 

[ThinkerBell]

On 22/09/2017 at 7:58 PM, IndianPaintbrush said:

As a historian and museum lover, I was horrified by how the kids acted in that castle.

Agreed. I like Bill a lot, but he needs to realize that allowing his kids to play with Scottish antiques and walk freely in areas clearly roped off from public access is pretty disrespectful. There was no way those kids were ever going to have the attention span required to appreciate the setting they were in. The castle tour guide sure deserved a raise and a big glass of whisky to calm his frayed nerves after that ordeal.

Edited September 27, 2017 by ThinkerBell

[mythoughtis]

Moving on to London. Did they plan 1 single activity for a 4 and 6 year old? 

[sATL]

Grandma to Will: " Did you have fun in London" ?

Will:  " I got to go Pee".

Umm - quoting Forrest Gump or what?

Edited September 27, 2017 by sATL

[sATL]

Horse experts: Is it normal for a horse to foam at the mouth?

Edited September 27, 2017 by sATL

[Ina123]

7 hours ago, sATL said:

Horse experts: Is it normal for a horse to foam at the mouth?

Not an expert, but I owned them. Yes, usually with a bit in it's mouth. Mine slobbered a lot.

[RemoteControlFreak]

On 9/21/2017 at 11:10 PM, BitterApple said:

I think it was a TLC stunt. When Jen was wrapping up her speech, the slide behind her said "Thank You" in big letters with smaller text underneath. I'm assuming that was the end of the media presentation. 

It might have been a TLC editing stunt to make it look like her slides were missing for Jen's entire presentation not just for a part, but there is no way -- NO WAY -- that TLC messed with the actual event.   Not only would this be highly unethical but TLC doesn't have access to conference room set-up.

I think this is probably what you meant but subsequent posters seem to think it's possible that TLC messed with Jen's actual presentation.  Even the most scheming reality TV show would not do this.

[SunnyBeBe]

Where's the thread for episode 2?

[humbleopinion]

2B-you stepped right into the thread, combined with episode numero uno.

Not enjoying but not blaming the behaviors of Will and Zoey on them, who to be fair are jet lagged and dragged to these adult activities that require them to use inside voices and keeping their hands to themselves.

Poor sound guy...Will is too loud and Zoey can barely be heard...the dials being wildly turned left and right depending on who is speaking.

Hopefully, the Arnold-Kleins are looking at the episodes with a critical eye and are deciding if the kids are better off away from the camera.

Perhaps it is time....

[winsomeone]

Seeing 7 year old Will with the tailor's tape measure perfectly sums up his development and his behavior. I felt sorry when his grandmother was carrying him..he may be short, but he is no light weight.

[SunnyBeBe]

Oh, I see!  

I'm afraid that I had to divide my time last night and only caught portions of the show.  I"ll watch it all later on.  The parts that I did catch, sadly, included the kids ignoring their parents instructions again.  lol  I'm sure there were other parts where they were more cooperative.  I'll withhold my comments about that, until I see more.  I liked the way Jen insisted on the handholding when in certain areas. 

Those London scenes took me back to my trip to London years ago.  OH, I had such a great time and want to return.  IT's my favorite city in the world and I would live there in a heartbeat.   I hope the kids are old enough to take some of those memories with them.   At least much of it was captured on tape, so they can view it as they grow up. 

[AZChristian]

We just watched the castle visit along with the London visit last night.  

• I  never told my kids, "I'm going to count to three."  That just gives them two counts to continue doing what they're doing.  I'd tell them, 'I'm going to count to one."  In other words, "Stop it NOW."
• I was glad to see that the restaurant where they had high tea appeared to be closed for the filming of the Kleins' high tea.  I've been to London and had tea in similar places.  It is NOT cheap to do that, so I'd have been unhappy to have all that noise in the immediate area.  Same with the London Eye.  It costs a lot (if it wasn't "comped") to have a private car, but that's what they needed to do so that they didn't ruin the experience for anyone else.
• Why do they order full plates for themselves and the kids?  There was a lot of wasted food.
• ESPECIALLY when away from home, the parents need to keep a tighter rein on the kids, and the kids need to listen.  It is not SAFE for them to continue running away from their parents/grandparents in a crowded area like they were doing at Buckingham Palace.  They could fall and hurt themselves, or someone could grab one of the kids and take off.  I'd be willing to bet that the tour guide on the double-decker bus told the kids in no uncertain terms that they could NOT stand up on their seats.  It's the only time we saw them sitting and not disrupting the entire area.

2 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Those London scenes took me back to my trip to London years ago.  OH, I had such a great time and want to return.  IT's my favorite city in the world and I would live there in a heartbeat.   I hope the kids are old enough to take some of those memories with them.   At least much of it was captured on tape, so they can view it as they grow up. 

We've been there four times.  I'd go back again as well.  So much to do, so much to see, and a transportation system that is absolutely awesome.  

Edited September 27, 2017 by AZChristian

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Seeing Will in his grandmother's arms sucking his thumb and tucking his head in and then him getting the tape and playing with it then refusing to give it back wow both these behaviors sum up his lack of development...if the kids were that tired why weren't they left at the hotel with a babysitter...the parents expectations of what the kids would enjoy was out of touch with reality.  Yes Jen asked that the kids hold her hand but Will pulled his hand away and so did Zoey at one point taking the grandmother's hand instead.  

Jen often says she doesn't feel it is worth the battle with the kids well that is resulting in extreme poor behaviour in the  kids who don't listen.  Will screaming in excitement at every little thing is toddler behaviour but Jen is so happy the kids are happy!  Ugh!

I hope they call it a day as this is not fair to the kids.

I was surprised to see Zoey in speech therapy as Ithought she spoke well but then again she didn't speak a lot so that might be the problem.  

And Bill if you want to be a comedian get your own show, his couch repartee was getting on my last nerve!  

I love that grandmother and think the  kids do too!  

[Absolom]

2 hours ago, RemoteControlFreak said:

I think this is probably what you meant but subsequent posters seem to think it's possible that TLC messed with Jen's actual presentation.  Even the most scheming reality TV show would not do this.

My thought was that it was staged before or after her real presentation with people they pulled in from the hall or maybe even in a different room entirely.  That was a small room for a keynote address, but maybe those conferences are smaller than I expected.

[CalicoskiesNC]

Geesh, judge much?  So opinionated in raising other people's children. I think we have very happy kids and very happy parents. They make me happy watching their experiences. The kids are often corrected and behave appropriately.  I think both Will and Zoe are extremely bright kids and may have more challenges developmentally than other children. That said, all issues are being addressed and this family truly is filled with love. Life with kids is about teaching not constant punishment.  I wish we could see the Kleins travel more!  Cute stuff with the Abbey Road photos. 

[TwirlyGirly]

Something is weird in the way the season/episodes are numbered/named here. They aren't correct, according to TLC (or my DVR).

According to the TLC website, this is season 9, not 11.

The first episode, which aired on 9/19/2017, was NOT numbered (so I guess we could call it "0"), was entitled "Daddy, Are You Gonna Go Save People?" (S9/E0). It probably wasn't numbered because it was filmed AFTER the rest of the season episodes were filmed, in response to the hurricanes in both Houston and Florida.

The episode that aired right after that, on the same night, S9/E1, was "A Sheep is Going to Eat Us!"

The episode which aired last night, S9/E2, was "Hold On Everybody".

Can someone please correct the threads to reflect the correct season number, episode numbers, and episode titles?

[BW Manilowe]

33 minutes ago, TwirlyGirly said:

Something is weird in the way the season/episodes are numbered/named here. They aren't correct, according to TLC (or my DVR).

According to the TLC website, this is season 9, not 11.

The first episode, which aired on 9/19/2017, was NOT numbered (so I guess we could call it "0"), was entitled "Daddy, Are You Gonna Go Save People?" (S9/E0). It probably wasn't numbered because it was filmed AFTER the rest of the season episodes were filmed, in response to the hurricanes in both Houston and Florida.

The episode that aired right after that, on the same night, S9/E1, was "A Sheep is Going to Eat Us!"

The episode which aired last night, S9/E2, was "Hold On Everybody".

Can someone please correct the threads to reflect the correct season number, episode numbers, and episode titles?

I asked about the season numbering before. They have reasons they've left it like that.

[BW Manilowe]

59 minutes ago, CalicoskiesNC said:

Geesh, judge much?  So opinionated in raising other people's children. I think we have very happy kids and very happy parents. They make me happy watching their experiences. The kids are often corrected and behave appropriately.  I think both Will and Zoe are extremely bright kids and may have more challenges developmentally than other children. That said, all issues are being addressed and this family truly is filled with love. Life with kids is about teaching not constant punishment.  I wish we could see the Kleins travel more!  Cute stuff with the Abbey Road photos. 

I thought Bill was at least trying to discipline at 1 point. I didn't see the screen, but I swore I heard him say something to Zoey at 1 point about she had better stop doing whatever she was doing (which I didn't see) or he was gonna go over to her & she wouldn't like what would happen if he did. 

That sounds like discipline to me, anyway. Or at least an attempt at it, so I think he was at least trying.

[Quof]

You mean the time Bill said "I'm going to 3", then repeated "I'm going to count to 3" two more times?   That's 9, Bill, and she still isn't behaving.  

[Libby]

When Jen and Pop Pop were enjoying themselves singing "The Wheels on the Bus", Zoey yelled "Stop Singing". Jen said "ok" and they stopped. Jen should have told Zoey that she was being mean and rude. I think that Jen and Bill desperately need parenting classes. The kids are ruling the roost in that family.

[Ina123]

These kids are too little and immature for "history" trips. Unless your little one has developed an interest, go somewhere kid-friendly. I rarely post anything here and even rarely would it be critical, ( I really like these people), but the kids are old enough to have learned some general basics of behavior. Hold mom's hand, walk with us, listen when we talk or at least look like you care that we are speaking. The tape measure thing was a real no-no for me. It should have been taken from him when he refused to give it back. I won't fault the grandparents. It's difficult to know where the line is to interfere.

As for Bill's comedy...I usually smile. He's just playful. Gen is intellectual and still has trouble coming down to the kids level. That said, I respect these guys and I expect it will all come together. There is love and it shows.

[gonecrackers]

There's no doubt they love those kids. I don't think they want to see things be difficult for them, given their own challenges in life. But discipline & boundaries are part of loving & guiding them, as tough as it can be for us parents.

1 hour ago, Foghorn Leghorn said:

 Yes Jen asked that the kids hold her hand but Will pulled his hand away and so did Zoey at one point taking the grandmother's hand instead.

I haven't seen this one yet but reading the comments here & this one in particular about the kids & grandma makes me wonder... kids have a need to feel safe with their elders. I wonder if the combination of (possible, since I don't see their lives) lack of consequences (or enough consistency with consequences), the parents small statures, etc, make them feel a bit unsafe or insecure somehow.  I wonder if they've gravitated toward Jen's parents while in public as well over them...just speculating.

[BusyOctober]

I get that W & Z were tired, or jet lagged (who plans a long trip for such a short turn-around with 2 small children in the first place??)  But even with that, I thought Jen & Bill let Zoey's rude behavior pass twice when they could have gently reminded her how to ask for something or express herself with respect.  When she shouted at them to stop singing, as Libby noted was one opportunity.  The other was at the Fish n' Chips place when Zoey was standing her chair yelling in her mom's face "And Ketchup!! Ketchup!!".  I am a parent and I've had that exact thing happen to me in public when my daughter was 3 or 4.  I remember apologizing to the waitress and asking her to please give me a second.  Then I turned to my little girl and said firmly, "That is not how you ask for something.  I heard you, and we will ask for the pickles, but ask nicely. Let's try that again please."  She looked at our server and said, "Excuse me, can I please have pickles in a dish? Not on my burger?"  Then I told my daughter that shouting is not only rude to me and the lady taking our order, but it is rude to the other people around us. My husband and I had no problem removing her from a restaurant or store if things escalated, which was rare but did happen a few times.  And we only have the one child, so we didn't have to split our attention. Whether it's because of the cameras, or their own embarrassment or insecurity in the situation, I think Bill & Jen let a lot of things slide when it comes to W & Z's behavior.  In the moment, it may be easy to say "Oh she's tired/hungry!" and let it go.  After a while without being reminded of courtesy and respect, bad behavior becomes habit. Burping at the table or screaming in a parent's face may be excused in their family's home, but it may not be in their friend's homes...or school...or dance class.

 

Never been to London, and if I ever go, I would definitely go to Abbey Road and try to reenact the photo too.  But I couldn't help feel bad for all the locals who have to put up with tourists clogging the traffic, pretending they are the Beatles!

[AZChristian]

18 minutes ago, BusyOctober said:

In the moment, it may be easy to say "Oh she's tired/hungry!" and let it go.  After a while without being reminded of courtesy and respect, bad behavior becomes habit. Burping at the table or screaming in a parent's face may be excused in their family's home, but it may not be in their friend's homes...or school...or dance class.

Never been to London, and if I ever go, I would definitely go to Abbey Road and try to reenact the photo too.  But I couldn't help feel bad for all the locals who have to put up with tourists clogging the traffic, pretending they are the Beatles!

1.  They had already spent several days in Scotland before going to London.  Jet lag should have been less an excuse for poor behavior, although the kids sure looked tired.  Maybe Grammy should have stayed at the hotel with them so the two Bills could go to the distillery.

2.  We've never done the Abbey Road photo op in London (too busy doing Harry Potter stuff), but if I were a local driver, I'd sure avoid that intersection.  My observation as a pedestrian in London is:  Do NOT jaywalk.  Those cars are coming from a direction you don't expect, and they will NOT slow down.  LOL.

[TVFANATICA2000]

First, I am the only one who is sad that they left their beautiful Houston home?  I think I got more attached to it through the episodes than they did.  Lol.

I love this family and love watching the show.  I do think the kids don't have much discipline and that the way Bill and Jen respond is not because of the cameras.  If Will and Zoe were disciplined more off camera, I feel like that would translate to on camera regardless of what Bill and Jen say because they would know their parents are serious.  I think they are scared to upset them, especially Zoe, and the kids (especially Zoe) take advantage of that.   Did anyone else find it strange when Bill's stepmom was holding Will and he was kind of mumbling and sucking his thumb?  I know he was tired  but that just seemed  very behind (for lack of a better word) for a 7 year old.

[TwirlyGirly]

2 hours ago, BW Manilowe said:

I asked about the season numbering before. They have reasons they've left it like that.

But the episode names and numbering?

We're actually discussing THREE different episodes in this thread, and the third one (E2; "Hold On Everybody!") isn't mentioned in the thread title.

Edited September 27, 2017 by TwirlyGirly

[Absolom]

Anyone can start an episode thread if they are so inclined.

[CousinAmy]

I hope TCL is not encouraging the bad behavior because it's "cute." There's a lot of focus on the screaming, rolling on the ground, and running away, which the parents don't seem to mind - they even laugh at it - could it be they will still have toddler behaviors as long as the parents and network think that very little kids = adorable?

I know a 7 year old boy who also sucks his thumb when he's tired or frustrated; he also had a rough start in life and so he needs that bit of comfort. I wouldn't tell him not to do it, when it's clearly what he needs at the moment.

[Snow8585]

This episode was worse than the first. Although London and Scotland are lovely places.  If TLC is showing us the best this family has to offer than one can only imagine what goes on in their very expensive 2.1 million dollar home when the cameras are not rolling. And it's not about the travel. Will had no interest in engaging with his parents during what could have been a teachable moment using the map even before they went on the trip.  He is better behaved than Zoey now and that is sad. Jen and Bill use food to bribe the kids and that is disgraceful at this point. All Jen and Bill do is make excuses for very rude, disrespectful,uncontrollable , poor behavior. If this behavior is related to the kids' Achon condition and developmental delays, Jen is and has been in the best position to get treatment for them. And whatever she is doing, it isn't working.   I believe that this is it folks, Jen and Bill feel they are doing a great job raising their kids and their kids are fabulous. Jen and Bill are not going to change. Jen will work hard getting acclimated in a new job and Bill will do whatever he feels like doing. I do not believe they will ever get control of the kids now and be able to teach them proper behavior and manners. Those kids are in for a rough ride and no amount of fancy tea parties or travel or toys or food will fix that.

[BitterApple]

3 hours ago, TVFANATICA2000 said:

If Will and Zoe were disciplined more off camera, I feel like that would translate to on camera regardless of what Bill and Jen say because they would know their parents are serious.  I think they are scared to upset them, especially Zoe, and the kids (especially Zoe) take advantage of that.

I agree. I haven't watched the latest episode, but based on the dynamics I've seen thus far, I think Bill's parenting style is to be "the buddy" while Jen has Working Mom Guilt and doesn't want to spend her free time disciplining and having the kids mad at her. I think Will and Zoe are generally good kids, but they're getting to the age where they need firmer boundaries. I don't think they're headed for a life of crime or anything because they're overindulged, but it will make life difficult later on if it isn't nipped in the bud now. 

[floridamom]

I'm new to the forum on this show, but here goes....I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought Will and Zoe acted like brats. I'm sorry they got a difficult start in life, but kids are resilient and they forget quickly. Bill and Jan have advantages in helping those children develop correctly and I see them doing a lot for their physical development, obviously, but not for their behavioral skills. Will is 7? When his family is calling his name, it doesn't seem to register. He completely ignores them. Zoe needs some manners training although I think a trip to Europe was completely wasted on those young children. They are far too young to appreciate ANYTHING about that trip, if they remember anything about it when they're grown. Jen and Bill need to display some REAL parental authority. They seem a bit afraid of their kids....afraid to speak authoritatively to them. I was tired just watching them and tired of the unruliness of their children...mostly, tired of all the screaming from the kids.

[sATL]

when Zoey kept interrupting Jen placing her order in London, for a "cheeseburger" that was the last straw for me. I am going to have to find another love for this show - like the trips.

Developmental issues or not, basic manners need to be taught - at the moment little ones get out of line.  And I am not a big fan letting kids treat stores as their personal playground. When Will "dropped" his newly tailored kilt on the floor, and no adult said a word to him? Did he say thank you when the salesperson gave him the kilt or when the waiter brought the bread for the hot dog? What happened to saying "excuse me", when you burp (or fart) at the table? And you're supposed to be at high tea - the ultra place of manners?

I'm old school, raised by old school, and my offspring were raised old school. I didn't do count to 3 either. My mom's phase was "I am not  a tape machine (her words for tape recorder), so we needed to mind her the 1st time something was said.

I didn't follow this show before Will and Zoey came on the scene. I do wonder if Dr. J the pediatrician has been spending too much time reading books on how to parent.

[Absolom]

The third episode of the season - London has ratings:  1.275 M viewers and a .23 rating.  

[Kid]

I never wanted kids and I never had them. When I first started watching the show and they adopted Will, he was such a delightful little guy that I began to understand why people would want children. However, there were some behaviors displayed last season, in particular by Zoey,  and behaviors exhibited by both children during the first two episodes of this season that validated my original position.  Those kids need to be taught manners and respect. And I don't think it's too young to be taught either of those things. For me, they have both ceased to be delightful.

[Kid]

19 hours ago, BusyOctober said:

But even with that, I thought Jen & Bill let Zoey's rude behavior pass twice when they could have gently reminded her how to ask for something or express herself with respect.  When she shouted at them to stop singing, as Libby noted was one opportunity.  The other was at the Fish n' Chips place when Zoey was standing her chair yelling in her mom's face "And Ketchup!! Ketchup!!

Not to mention the fact that when Will took the tape measure from the store clerk, they lost another teachable moment. Not only did they not explain to him the taking things that do not belong to him is inappropriate, Jen was letting him "measure" her with it thus reinforcing bad behavior.  I realize they are children, I realize they were jetlagged, but all of these examples is a lack of manners and respect for other people which is not surprising because the parents laugh it off.

Edited September 28, 2017 by Kid

[RedheadZombie]

17 hours ago, floridamom said:

I'm new to the forum on this show, but here goes....I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought Will and Zoe acted like brats. I'm sorry they got a difficult start in life, but kids are resilient and they forget quickly. Bill and Jan have advantages in helping those children develop correctly and I see them doing a lot for their physical development, obviously, but not for their behavioral skills. Will is 7? When his family is calling his name, it doesn't seem to register. He completely ignores them. Zoe needs some manners training although I think a trip to Europe was completely wasted on those young children. They are far too young to appreciate ANYTHING about that trip, if they remember anything about it when they're grown. Jen and Bill need to display some REAL parental authority. They seem a bit afraid of their kids....afraid to speak authoritatively to them. I was tired just watching them and tired of the unruliness of their children...mostly, tired of all the screaming from the kids.

I only started watching the show because of the kids.  I started watching a little before Zoey was adopted, but I've seen a couple of old episodes that included the day they got Will.  I thought they were the most beautiful, precious, amazing children in the world.  Then I noticed little things, and I noticed that there was very little tolerance here for anything negative about this family.  I took off last year, and I can see a big difference in the behavior of the children.

The thing that confuses me, is the fact that Jen and Bill are producers.  They set very strict boundaries for filming, and they surely have the authority to ask for editing.  The fact that these events are making it onto the show implies, to me, that they don't see any issue with the behavior.  Or perhaps think this is typical behavior.  I don't remember much about the first two episodes, the kids were loud and rude, but I just hand waved it.

I'm only six minutes into this new episode, and I find myself less than eager to watch it.  From Zoey having a little tantrum on the floor, then slapping at Grandma's hand when she tries to reach down and help her.  Then Zoey squealing and running into a dressing room with a closed curtain.  I can only hope that the store was only open for them, but how is Zoey to understand that that's not acceptable next time she's at a store?  I had a situation once where the woman next to me in the changing area let her little boy keep crawling under the stall towards me.  I am a completely passive, non-violent person, but I truly wanted to gently apply m shoe to his forehead, and tell him, no.

This leads me to believe that as loving and kind as Jen and Bill are to their children, they have the same disease that many parents have - my child hung the moon, and everybody else surely thinks they're the greatest.  It excuses a lot of bad behavior, and becomes irritating in every day life.  It's the people who come to my home and let their children run mad, leaving me to correct their behavior, and take breakables away from them, and sit with gritted teeth while they trash things I value, or torment one of my pets.  And it's also when your sitting in a booth at a restaurant, or God forbid on a plane, and the parents allow their children to stand up and turn around and act like a monkey to get my attention.  Parents allow that because they can have a peaceful dinner, visit, or plane ride, and it doesn't matter that their child is disturbing other people.

I can tell that Bill's step-mom was uncomfortable with the behavior, because she was going around trying to get Zoey up off the floor, going around and taking back all the tape measurers the children absconded, and in general, being a disciplinarian.  I always suspected that Will would have a hard time because he was just so adorable with that constant grin, and his cheerful demeanor.  That leads to the adults in his life indulging him because they're charmed, and Will would have no idea that anything he did was wrong.  I was also a little disturbed at how happy he was the moment he was handed over to strangers.  He was just happy as a clam.  Children bond to their caretakers, even when they're abusive.  Yet Will seemingly left his caretakers with a huge grin on his face.  As traumatic as Zoey's adoption was, I've always felt she would be better off because she had clearly bonded to her caretaker, and was showing normal grieving at leaving her.  The one thing that's concerning is her death glares.  She means business.  By no means do I want her to be submissive, and bow to other people's expectations.  It can be hard enough for a woman in society, and she will be little as well as a woman of colour.  But I think she at least needs some manners, along with already knowing her own mind.

One last thing, I realize Jen's diagnosis of cancer simultaneous to Zoey's adoption may have created some of these issues.  Jen was incapacitated and surely didn't want to be firm with her children when she wasn't even sure that she would live.  And Bill's always about having fun, and Zoey was so suspicious of him initially, I'm sure he simply bowed and scraped to keep her from screaming.  But they did have the consistency of their nanny (Kate), and I'm assuming she applied some discipline.  I did admire Jen and Bill for shutting down filming during that time, but I also remember they allowed the footage of a very traumatized Zoey to be filmed and aired.  I think I'm joining ranks with those who feel the children would do better off of this show.  I know people here get angry when this is said because they enjoy the children, but I'm sure everyone believes the children and their safety came first.  I was always anxious when they lived in Houston.  They have a very distinctive house, and I'm sure it's not hard to find.  An unbalanced fan could have easily found their house, knocked over Jen, and gone off with one of their children.  That kind of crazy shit happens all the time.  Elizabeth Smart was taken by a man who became obsessed with her.  They tell parents to not write the child's name of their backpacks because a kidnapper can trick them into thinking they are a friend, well Will and Zoey have a ton of people who know their name.  And while I think there's little chance that Zoey would go with anyone, I could see Will getting excited and going off with someone.  And that's frightening.

Edited September 28, 2017 by RedheadZombie
They not She

[RemoteControlFreak]

18 hours ago, Absolom said:

My thought was that it was staged before or after her real presentation with people they pulled in from the hall or maybe even in a different room entirely.  That was a small room for a keynote address, but maybe those conferences are smaller than I expected.

There's no reason to do that.  It also was not a very large conference.  Here's the conference website:  http://ipssglobal.org/ipssw2016/ .  

[RemoteControlFreak]

6 hours ago, Kid said:

I never wanted kids and I never had them. When I first started watching the show and they adopted Will, he was such a delightful little guy that I began to understand why people would want children. However, there were some behaviors displayed last season, in particular by Zoey,  and behaviors exhibited by both children during the first two episodes of this season that validated my original position.  Those kids need to be taught manners and respect. And I don't think it's too young to be taught either of those things. For me, they have both ceased to be delightful.

Ages 4 and 6 is not too young to be taught manners and respect, but it may be too late. These children are undisciplined brats because their parents have not taught them to behave otherwise.  Bill and Jen present good behavior as an option, not as a requirement.  This never works.  It seems like the parents care more about having their kids like them and be their friends and so they are afraid to impose negative consequences for bad behavior.  The fallout from this will only get worse as the kids get older.

Edited September 28, 2017 by RemoteControlFreak