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S01.E01: In Fair Verona, Where We Lay Our Scene

Tara Ariano

By Tara Ariano
in Still Star-Crossed [V]

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Tara Ariano

Tara Ariano

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The premiere of the drama about the Montagues and Capulets following the tragic deaths of Romeo and Juliet. First up: the rivaly between the families escalates; and a new royal takes the throne and struggles to determine what is best for his city.

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Delwyn

Delwyn

When I saw the title of this show for the first time, I thought it was an ill-advised sequel to the CW's Star-Crossed from a few years ago.

I read somewhere that the book was used as the bones for the first season and (if it makes it), the idea for future seasons is that all of Shakespeare's characters exist in the same universe, so there likely will be cross-overs. Looking forward to MacBeth murdering Hamlet for whining too much.

We also have a Dante's Peak/Volcano and Armageddon/Deep Impact situation on our hands with TNT's Will premiering this July. I'm half expecting Will to be more enjoyable in a trashy trainwreck sort of way.

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adam807

adam807

So, is this the awful show from TVLine's Blind Item? http://tvline.com/2017/04/27/blind-item-bad-tv-series/

I don't know that it's THAT bad. I mean, don't watch it, but "unwatchable" is extreme. But it fits the "costly" description so maybe!

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ratgirlagogo

ratgirlagogo

(edited)
On 5/26/2017 at 4:02 PM, Delwyn said:

I read somewhere that the book was used as the bones for the first season and (if it makes it), the idea for future seasons is that all of Shakespeare's characters exist in the same universe, so there likely will be cross-overs. Looking forward to MacBeth murdering Hamlet for whining too much.

*poisons self*

*stabs self with dagger*

fuck it.

*shoots self in the face*

ETA: tried to clean up my messy post. hope it worked this time.

Edited by ratgirlagogo
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Ms Lark

Ms Lark

On 5/26/2017 at 11:54 AM, Merneith said:

Aw, bugger. I have to watch this for Anthony Head, but I know it's going to give me hives.

Yeah, me, too. *sigh* Frankly, this show ranks rankly right up there with Reign.

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Kuther2000

Kuther2000

5 minutes ago, ihavenoidea said:

I guess I'll be the lone weirdo.  I liked it.  I love me some mindless romantic cheese.  Already shipping Rosaline and Benvolio.  I loved the arranged marriage trope on my soaps.

You are not alone. I was pleasantly surprised that I enjoyed it as well.

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SimoneS

SimoneS

(edited)

What an odd show. I couldn't really keep track of what was going on or all the names, but I kinda liked it. I presume that Rosaline and Benvolio (thanks @ihavenoidea) will fall in love after resisting the arranged marriage. I like them as a couple. They do the love/hate very well. Also, I recognized the male lead from "Please like me," an Australian comedy. 

Does anyone know how many episodes were made?

Edited by SimoneS
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Greta

Greta

It was gloriously awful. I just DVR'ed the season.  

I actually did love the bit about Montague Sr. being the one pulling the strings on R+J's illicit romance.

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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

(edited)

I liked the costuming and the fight choreography. I will watch, pilots are difficult (I didn't read the novel). I want to see more of Rosalind and her sister Livia(?) and their relationship. Based on how they were talking I thought they had spent years a "servants" to their uncle- well perhaps it has been years, but I was under the impression that it was most of their life (since they were small kids). Since Livia wanted to be a wife etc she might have been the better Capulet maiden to marry off, but the Prince thought he was doing his former love a favor. His sister (the princess of Verona) could be a compelling character or she can end up one note. I guess we will see. 

Edited by Scarlett45
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Irlandesa

Irlandesa

23 minutes ago, ihavenoidea said:

I guess I'll be the lone weirdo.  I liked it.  I love me some mindless romantic cheese.  Already shipping Rosaline and Benvolio.  I loved the arranged marriage trope on my soaps.

Me too. It's my catnip.  But I stopped watching soaps a long time ago.  And it has been even longer since I've been able to get through a pure romance novel.  And since Hallmark doesn't do this trope, I'm desperate.  My bar is low and so far it's meeting it.  I'm here for the season. If it wraps up and is cancelled this season, maybe even better. 

I do think she has chemistry with both of the guys, though, so it could probably go either way.

7 minutes ago, Greta said:

I actually did love the bit about Montague Sr. being the one pulling the strings on R+J's illicit romance.

That was probably the only interesting twist regarding Romeo and Juliet.  I liked the people cast as Romeo and Juliet but they should have been dead in the first five minutes.  I think the intensity would have played better.

Right now the women interest me the most. I like the lead. I like her sister. And I'm curious about Escalus's sister. 

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legaleagle53

legaleagle53

(edited)
20 minutes ago, doram said:

I'm curious about Lady Capulet who's obviously batshitcrazy. The pilot pretty much spoilt a major twist in the source material so I'm wondering how they plan on playing her going forward.

I've read that Lady Capulet is actually far from the passive bystander that most people think she is in the original play.  She was the one who really tried to push Juliet into marrying Paris because she (Lady Capulet) had ambitions of her own that would be furthered by such a marriage.  The only reason that Lord Capulet insisted on the marriage was that he thought it would cure Juliet of what he misread as Juliet's depression over her cousin Tybalt's death.  So Lady Capulet was actually closer to Lady MacBeth in character, and that seems to be the characterization the show is giving her here.

Edited by legaleagle53
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thuganomics85

thuganomics85

Well, that was... interesting.  The first half was just dropping the viewers in the middle of the Romeo & Juliet saga, and then latter half was the aftermath of their deaths, where the Montagues and Capulets feud gets even worse.  I haven't read the book it was based off of and I need to brush up on my Shakespeare, but I could have sworn their deaths was suppose to be a catalyst for peace between the families finally, so it kinds of makes their deaths feel wasted, since everyone is still trying to kill one another.

Like the cast, but I'm struggling to warm up to the younger characters with Benvolio coming off like the typical cocky jerk, Rosaline thinking it's a good idea to openly challenge Lady Capulet like she did, and the Prince being a lovesick and naive dud, who is probably going to be in over his head, until his craftier sister somehow betrays and overthrows him.

Took me a while to place Grant Bowler as Lord Montague.  He was so much different clean shaven and with the British accent, compared to the scruff and Southern twang he had on Defiance.

That said, I'll likely watch the entire season because a) it's the summer, b) love Zuleikha Robinson ever since I first saw her on Rome, and c) Anthony Freaking Head being his normal awesome self, even if the material is silly.

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TwistedandBored

TwistedandBored

3 hours ago, ihavenoidea said:

I guess I'll be the lone weirdo.  I liked it.  I love me some mindless romantic cheese.  Already shipping Rosaline and Benvolio.  I loved the arranged marriage trope on my soaps.

You are not alone. This seems like a such summer show. Like it is stupid and fun and not to be taken seriously. Plus, I love arranged marriage tropes too. Sadly soaps have stopped doing arrange marriage tropes which I am really sad about. So, this show would do for now. 

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FlowerofCarnage

FlowerofCarnage

So Rosalind marries Benvolio but  continues to see the Prince on the side? Shonda sure loves her adultery. Lol 

I am calling it now: the sister whose name escapes me falls for fuckboi Paris while nursing him back to health.

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Featherhat

Featherhat

(edited)

Considering some of the reviews I was expecting a lot worse. I did find the dialogue cringey and stilted a lot of the time and it was obviously quite cheesy but for summer entertainment, I kind of enjoyed it. It's nowhere near as gloriously, terribly bat shit as "Reign" in the first season but it kinda mirror's their less batshit, still basically historical fanfiction later seasons, which is fine for a summer show, especially one that is Shakespear via YA.

I can see why it didn't get a slot either fall or midseason though, which is kind of a failure for such an expensive show.

I do wish they'd got the Romeo and Juliet portion over sooner though, it was basically just a run though of that story for over half the episode, they could have had an up to 10 minute version and hit most of the same points before getting the actual story started sooner.

I'll give it another episode.

Edited by Featherhat
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irisheyes

irisheyes

I enjoyed it. It's summer, the people and costumes are pretty, and it's full of soapy goodness.  I don't expect much from my summer shows, and this one will work. Just let it go one season, however.  These shows have a limited life span. 

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AzureOwl

AzureOwl

One detail I liked is the way they fleshed out the feud.

By involving practically the entire population of Verona into it by way of webs of patronage and employment, they avoid the plot hole of why the Prince doesn't just put his foot down and destroy both families. 

And they also seem to provide a reasonable enough explanation as to how it started. A conflict between old money and upstart new money is easy enough for the audience to understand, and believable as an ongoing problem.

2 hours ago, Kuther2000 said:

I'm wondering why Lady Capulet has Paris hidden out in that room especially with him dying if she is trying to keep him alive.

Lady Capulet seems to be somewhat unhinged. She may be paranoid, thinking the Montagues will come to finish him off if they find out he is still alive. 

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adam807

adam807

  11 hours ago, legaleagle53 said:

I've read that Lady Capulet is actually far from the passive bystander that most people think she is in the original play.  She was the one who really tried to push Juliet into marrying Paris because she (Lady Capulet) had ambitions of her own that would be furthered by such a marriage.

Ooh that is interesting. I've read the 'Friar wanted them dead to force peace' theory but not the Lady Capulet one. 

  9 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Rosaline thinking it's a good idea to openly challenge Lady Capulet like she did,

In all fairness, she was severely provoked. The 'conversation' started with Lady C declaring that Rose and her sister should have died instead of Juliet and went downhill. I actually felt she was deliberately needling Rose to goad the girl enough so she'd (Lady C) have a reason to slap her. ?

I may be skewed by my high school production that gave a ton of Lord C's lines to Lady C because she was a better actor (though I've worked on it again since), but it's true that Lady C is all about marrying Juliet off. It's not necessarily textual but in the Luhrmann movie she pretty clearly wants to jump Paris herself (and, I mean, Paul Rudd...)

In the play, Friar Lawrence wants the MARRIED to force peace, not dead. He tries to talk Romeo down at first, like "Dude, weren't you in love with Rosaline TWO SECONDS AGO?" but then he realizes both that Romeo is serious and that it could be a good opportunity. The plan is to marry them in secret (which he does) and then announce it like "Haha! You have to make up now!" But Romeo killing Tybalt and getting banished screws everything up. The faked death is so they can run off together.

Weirdly, hardly any mention is made of the fact that Rosaline is a Capulet also. I guess because she's a cousin it's not such a big deal?

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slade3

slade3

I liked it. It was entertaining and pretty.

I agree it was a mistake to give the first 30 minutes of the pilot to the Romeo and Juliet backstory. For me, it's because I had time to realize I prefer the actor playing Romeo over the actor playing Prince Escalus. Lucien Laviscount (Romeo) seemed a bit sexier. For the critics, maybe showing so much of Romeo and Juliet made them judge the show in a harsher way than if it had started with the funeral, or post-funeral, so the show wouldn't be so closely associated with Shakespeare. I know they wanted viewers to understand how Romeo and Juliet came to commit suicide, but if you don't know the story, this show shouldn't feel the need to explain. Viewers can read the play, or the wikipedia page about it. 

I haven't read any reviews of the pilot yet, so I'm not sure why it's being panned. The acting didn't seem bad, and I thought there was decent chemistry between Benvolio and Rosaline. Enough chemistry for me to be looking forward to the moment they realize they want to have sex with each other. (I'd probably be shipping Rosaline with Prince Escalus, too, if they'd cast Lucien in that role.)

I enjoyed Rosaline and Livia, and the hints of their story since who doesn't love a storyline about wicked relatives making noblewomen servants? I agree Livia will fall in love with Paris as she nurses him back to health, but she seems too young for him.

I'm happy to see Anthony Head again, and I like Grant Bowler as Lord Montague. I also think Princess Isabella is interesting.

My one complaint is the way the camera would pan over Verona as it moved from the Capulet's house to the Montague's. That was a bit cheesy.

But this show does something only Kenneth Branagh used to do - cast actors of all colors as family members. I find that delightful to watch, so I'm here for this show and hope it lasts. Unless the next 2 - 4 episodes are awful, I don't see how this is the TVLine blind item. 

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adam807

adam807

23 minutes ago, doram said:

It's why he suggested the "pretend to kill yourself" scheme to Juliet and why his message didn't get to Romeo on time. 

That seems like a stretch. Unless he arranged for the messenger to get stuck in traffic or whatever. Which I guess he could have done, but it seems like a lot to me. If Romeo himself waits like 5 minutes to drink the poison, Juliet wakes up, so there's a lot of perfect timing involved for Lawrence to have planned it all. Then again, it's a terrible plan to begin with...

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meep.meep

meep.meep

It's just summer TV.   It doesn't have to make much sense.  It's like Galavant without the singing.   I like that it focuses on two minor characters from the actual play.

If only they could work in a tiny red cow, then all would be perfect.

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Luckylyn

Luckylyn

I remember writing a paper in high school about how the Friar was a more sinister character than he appears because I felt he consistently made self motivated decisions.   I felt he helped the marriage because he thought he'd be a hero getting the families together and that the whole Juliet faked death idea was more about wanting to cover up his part after things went bad than helping Romeo and Juliet be together.

 I enjoyed this.  My expectations were low, and I was pleasantly surprised.   I think it will be compelling soapy fun.   I hate triangles and yet The Prince/ Rosalind/Benvolio has my interest, for now anyway.  I also like the arranged marriage that turns to love trope.  

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Snow Apple

Snow Apple

1 hour ago, Luckylyn said:

I remember writing a paper in high school about how the Friar was a more sinister character than he appears because I felt he consistently made self motivated decisions.    

Off topic, but if that's your version of Friar Lawrence, have you read the book Juliet's Nurse by Lois Leveen? Made me see him and other characters in a whole new way.

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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

(edited)

Who was it that told Benvolio "you have nothing that's not mine!"- was that Grant Bowler aka Dad Montague? Refresh my memory but Benvolio was under his uncle's guardianship in the play or the show just didn't feel like casting his dad?

Edited by Scarlett45
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Spartan Girl

Spartan Girl

2 hours ago, Luckylyn said:

I remember writing a paper in high school about how the Friar was a more sinister character than he appears because I felt he consistently made self motivated decisions.   I felt he helped the marriage because he thought he'd be a hero getting the families together and that the whole Juliet faked death idea was more about wanting to cover up his part after things went bad than helping Romeo and Juliet be together.

 

Perhaps you'd like to read Juliet's Nurse by Lois Leveen, another retelling of the story. That version of the friar definitely wasn't as saintly as he appeared.

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Kuther2000

Kuther2000

(edited)
9 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

Who was it that told Benvolio "you have nothing that's not mine!"- was that Grant Bowler aka Dad Capulet? Refresh my memory but Benvolio was under his uncle's guardianship in the play or the show just didn't feel like casting his dad?

That's kind of what I got as well. Lord Montague is the guardian of Benvolio. He is also head of his family whi decides marriages.B might even be the next heir after Romeo. I did think it was funny when Benvolio was like, "it wasn't my fault that both families only managed to squeeze out one child."

Edited by Kuther2000
Spelling error
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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

1 minute ago, Kuther2000 said:

That's kind of what I got as well. Lord Montague is the guardian of Benvelio. He is also head of his family whi decides marriages.B might even be the next heir after Romeo. I did think it was funny when Benvelio was like, "it was my fault that both families only managed to squeeze out one child."

I edited my original post because Grant Bowler is Dad Montague, but I just loved that line because all of these pouty aristocratic kids kill me, you have to toe the party line if you want the party benefits! At least Rosalind seems to understand this and is willing to commit herself to a nunnery to have some physical and emotional freedom- freedom isn't free.  

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Kuther2000

Kuther2000

10 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I edited my original post because Grant Bowler is Dad Montague, but I just loved that line because all of these pouty aristocratic kids kill me, you have to toe the party line if you want the party benefits! At least Rosalind seems to understand this and is willing to commit herself to a nunnery to have some physical and emotional freedom- freedom isn't free.  

Yeah. Looking at these shows, I've thought about where would I like to be placed in a line of succession to receive all the perks but none of the downsides.

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jhlipton

jhlipton

(edited)
22 hours ago, ihavenoidea said:

I guess I'll be the lone weirdo.  I liked it.  I love me some mindless romantic cheese.  Already shipping Rosaline and Benvolio.  I loved the arranged marriage trope on my soaps.

I'm in the "like it" group.  Black women in lead roles are so rare I'd give it a lot of leeway anyway, and Livia is CUTE!!!!  A bit of fun nonsense.

22 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

but they should have been dead in the first five minutes.  I think the intensity would have played better.

Probably a hard choice to make -- you want to make sure non-Shakespeare fans are caught up (if they have to go to Wikipedia, they won't watch), but you don't want to bore those who are familiar with the play.

9 hours ago, adam807 said:

Weirdly, hardly any mention is made of the fact that Rosaline is a Capulet also. I guess because she's a cousin it's not such a big deal?

 thought they stressed that quite a bit.  The only reason the Duke summoned her was because she was a Capulet.

 

ETA: I disagree with the recap on virtually every point.

Edited by jhlipton
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Scarlett45

Scarlett45

4 minutes ago, Kuther2000 said:

Yeah. Looking at these shows, I've thought about where would I like to be placed in a line of succession to receive all the perks but none of the downsides.

I've always wanted to be a royal bastard of a favorite mistress. You get invited to all the swanky parties and you're rich, but no one is trying to kill you since you can't inherit anything. Medivial kings used to have their bastard sons lead their armies, because 1. They'd be loyal to the cause as it benefits them, 2. There's still the sibling affection there but 3. No rivarly because of the strict social rules. Yup definately if I was a guy a royal bastard, as a woman, maybe a 2nd or 3rd daughter. 

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Kuther2000

Kuther2000

7 minutes ago, jhlipton said:

I'm in the "like it" group.  Black women in lead roles are so rare I'd give it a lot of leeway anyway, and Livia is CUTE!!!!  A bit of fun nonsense.

 thought they stressed that quite a bit.  The only reason the Duke summoned her was because she was a Capulet.

 

ETA: I disagree with the recap on virtually every point.

Olivia or Livia is a very pretty girl. Also I believe the poster was referring to the book not making alot of mention of Rosa being a Capulet. It wasn't deemed as spectular as with Juliet. I personally think it probably has to do with Juliet being the daughter of THE Lord Capulet while Rosa was a cousin possibly further away in relation than the series Rosa and OLivia.

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jhlipton

jhlipton

18 minutes ago, Kuther2000 said:

I believe the poster was referring to the book not making alot of mention of Rosa being a Capulet. It wasn't deemed as spectular as with Juliet.

Thanks for explaining!

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