S13.E10: You Can Look (But You'd Better Not Touch)

[moonorchid]

This episode was a good episode except for the fact that it was a bottle episode to start off the second half of the season so it revealed nothing about the cliffhanger we've waited two months to learn the resolution of, AND, i honestly could not feel sympathy for the prisoner. 

She was combative and petulant from minute one. Everything out of her mouth was a whine or a scream. She breaks the doctors finger for not giving her more food. She can't be bothered to hold still while instruments are in her belly and next to her unborn child and puts herself under so much stress that she goes into labor early. She is in a maximum security prison doing 20 to life. It wasn't for a damn misdemeanor. 

I also did not appreciate the emotional manipulation by the show not telling us or the them why she was in there. I would have maybe felt more in that birth scene when bailey took her hand if they knew why she was in there, and still found compassion for her in that moment. 

And really, all three but especially Arizona, a big FU! You don't know why that girl was in there and you don't know what her mother was put through, so just because you watched her cry for her mommy doesn't mean that that's the whole story. PLUS, you all didn't want to know in the end and because they wanted to pass judgement, them choosing to not know makes them all freaking COWARDS!!!

I get they didn't need to know to treat the patient, but the patient was the baby, not the mother. I'm not saying they shouldn't show compassion, but it would have said more about all three if they showed that level of compassion knowing what she did. 

[lizstar300]

Anyone else spend a good chunk of the episode wondering how she got pregnant in the first place? Was she pregnant before she went to prison? It seemed like she was in that ward for more than a couple months. And she was what? 16? Do they have conjugal visits for minors? Was she raped in prison by a warden? Those unanswered questions bothered me more than what she was in for.

[StaceyNotStacie]

I didn't care for this episode. It was a little interesting, but I didn't care for the patient or her mother. I half expected the teen girl to die during childbirth. As for the mother, I wondered if she wanted the baby more so that the father's family wouldn't keep her. They made no mention of the baby's father, but I wondered if he was also from a wealthy family. 

[Lesia]

I kept thinking the prisoner was going to pop up in the back of the car, having escaped in a laundry basket.  It was tense there for a moment, like something big was going to be revealed. Aaand it wasn't.

[Court]

1 hour ago, lizstar300 said:

Anyone else spend a good chunk of the episode wondering how she got pregnant in the first place? Was she pregnant before she went to prison? It seemed like she was in that ward for more than a couple months. And she was what? 16? Do they have conjugal visits for minors? Was she raped in prison by a warden? Those unanswered questions bothered me more than what she was in for.

I wondered that as well. I decided that the father and her murdered both their families and the mom was the only one who survived. Maybe they went on the run.

She likely got pregnant before they were caught.

[OtterMommy]

Sigh...I'm conflicted about this episode.  I liked the overall story, but I think where they placed it in the season--first ep after a cliffhanger--was not only odd, but detrimental to the flow of the storytelling.  I don't really feel that any of the characters came out feeling any different, vomiting aside, about what was happening to Alex and, honestly, I would have much preferred this episode at some other point.

I also felt no sympathy for Kristen.  Color me cynical, but she came across as a master manipulator.  Also "stuff happens" and "making a mistake" does not land you in a maximum security prison for 20 to life.  Sorry.  And why didn't Bailey, Arizona, and Jo know what she had done?  Isn't it a matter of public record?  Don't they have access to google?

Why was Bailey there?  Was it because she is the chief of surgery?  Was this episode to show that she's over her head as chief of surgery?  I'm hoping the purpose of this episode was to introduce GSMH's new surgeon, Dr. Eldridge because, honestly, she was what I liked most about this episode.

I also found the whole guard/security thing inaccurate.  My niece's husband works in a prison with a hospital wing--it's not an exact match up: his is a psychiatric hospital, but it also isn't maximum security.  But, from what he has said about protocals where he works, there is absolutely NO WAY 3 civilian doctors would have been in a room with a prisoner like that with just one guard.  Also, the lawyer would never have left.  And, when the prison doctor had left, all of the doctors would have left until she returned.  Oh, and Kristen would have been sedated.  And, yes, prisons would have had that medication--they may not have had gauze, but they would have had plenty of sedatives.

Sigh...I guess this is a case of what could have been....

[iMonrey]

Quote

But if I didn't want to see my killer daughter ever again, I wouldn't want to raise her child. That's what's for me messed up.

Yeah . . . even without knowing Kristen's crime, what we saw of her pretty clearly demonstrates some level of psychosis or at least sociopathy. She jumps out of her bed and onto the doctor to pummel her? She has to be kept away from the other prisoners for their safety? I'm not inclined to assume her crime was committed in self defense or even as a result of years of abuse. Something's wrong with her. Ever hear of The Bad Seed? I'd be worried about her baby too.

[bikebrh]

Yeah, I totally thought she was there for murdering her dad.

I liked it a lot more than I thought I would.  It even did a good job of shining a light on prison conditions without being overly preachy, as they're prone to be on this show.  It also served well to point out how dire Alex's situation will be if he goes to prison.

I was a little off-put by the episode making the prisoner overly sympathetic.  Like has been stated many times already, for her to end up where she is means she did something truly heinous.  By the way she had been acting all episode, I halfway expected her to break her daughter's neck when Jo handed her over.

Arizona mentioning how she didn't get to see her daughter pissed me off because it reminded me of the stupid custody agreement she thought was somehow a good idea. 

Yeah, I totally think that Kristen took an axe, and gave her father 40 whacks....

Although, unlike Lizzie Borden, she MUST have had some predictive history of violence to be the way she is now.

[shantown]

I keep wondering if that scene between the prison doctor and Bailey (when they each said to come to them if the other was looking for a job) was indicating a future storyline - Either Bailey starts a quest to get better prison patient care or the prison doctor shows up for a job at SGMWGSMH and clashes with others because of her mentality/methods.

[proserpina65]

2 hours ago, OtterMommy said:

I also felt no sympathy for Kristen.  Color me cynical, but she came across as a master manipulator.  Also "stuff happens" and "making a mistake" does not land you in a maximum security prison for 20 to life.  Sorry.  And why didn't Bailey, Arizona, and Jo know what she had done?  Isn't it a matter of public record?  Don't they have access to google?

If she's in maximum security, she was tried as an adult and her case would be a matter of public record, so not sealed like a juvenile case would be.  So yeah, couldn't one of them just whip out her phone and google it?

[OtterMommy]

Just now, proserpina65 said:

If she's in maximum security, she was tried as an adult and her case would be a matter of public record, so not sealed like a juvenile case would be.  So yeah, couldn't one of them just whip out her phone and google it?

Jo was too busy looking up gross pictures of whatever it was that had feet and teeth (cardiac twin?  was that the term?)

 

46 minutes ago, shantown said:

I keep wondering if that scene between the prison doctor and Bailey (when they each said to come to them if the other was looking for a job) was indicating a future storyline - Either Bailey starts a quest to get better prison patient care or the prison doctor shows up for a job at SGMWGSMH and clashes with others because of her mentality/methods.

My hope is that Dr. Eldridge shows up as the new Chief of Surgery.  She has got to be more capable--and less entangled--than Bailey.

[kdm07]

Odd place for a bottle episode but I enjoyed it more than I thought I would since it only featured three of the Grey's cast.

[oceanblue]

Here's my assumption on her crime:  she's mentally ill, huge anger issues, and got into drugs young, ran with a bad crowd, started stealing for drug money, and brutally killed people while high either while robbing them or just for the thrill of it.

 

I grew up in the town where Lizzie Borden lived, and this girl is no Lizzie Borden.  Lizzie had some issues like kleptomania, but otherwise a nice enough person until she possibly murdered her parents.  She was acquitted. A Discovery Channel episode offered the theory that she was sexually abused by her father, her stepmother knew, and because it was the 19th century she still had to live with them as an unmarried adult.  She went on to have a perfectly normal life after the acquittal and never hurt a fly.   Scared the hell outta my dad once, but not her fault.

[lorbeer]

I really like that lawyer. Anyone knows who is the actress? I feel like I've seen her already but I can't put the face to a name...

Like most of you I don't feel any sympathy for Kristen. I think her mother was kind of scared of her and scared that the baby could turn into her... I guess some mental issues and great manipulator and... like mother said... she hadn't been given enough attention so she did something to get her parent attention forever. Maybe killed her 'perfect' sibling? :)

And I think it's really lazy of the writers to not to tell us why she was convicted...

[dalek]

Sadly, a 16 year old would not necessarily have to do something super bad and violent to end up charged as an adult and serving his or her sentence in an adult maximum security prison.  It depends on the law of the state you are in.  There are a number of states where 16 and 17 year olds are automatically charged as adults.  And they don't go to juvenile facilities when arrested, they go to adult jail if they can't make bail.  They are supposed to be kept separate from adult prisoners until convicted, which means being kept in solitary, unless you have so many juveniles that you have a separate facility.  For instance, on Rikers Island in NYC, the Adolescent Reception and Detention Center is the jail for juveniles charged as adults.  And if convicted, they are likely to be sent to adult facilities.

Also, depending on the laws in a particular state, yes you can end up with a long sentence in a maximum security facility for a nonviolent crime.  For instance, thanks to New York State's Rockefeller Drug Laws, purchase of 2 oz. of cocaine is likely to get you charged with possession with intent to distribute (even if bought for personal use).  If convicted, that's an automatic 15 to life sentence, and because it is a class A felony, you are going to a maximum security prison.  And NY is one of the states where 16 and 17 year olds automatically get charged as adults.

No idea if this is the case in Washington State or what Washington State law is like.  And clearly Shonda Rimes didn't care, because that wasn't the point she was trying to make.   The guards kind of being assholes, as much due to that being the way prison bureaucracy works as actually being assholes seemed about right to me.  I  wasn't really impressed with the episode.  Lot's of places in the US, women prisoners have to give birth while shackled, and medical care in US prisons in notoriously bad, esp. if you wind up at a privately run, for profit prison.  If Shonda was trying to make a prisoners' rights argument, it could have been done better.  OTOH, it is not unreasonable to make the argument that all prisoners, regardless of the crime they committed, are entitled to be treated humanely and to decent medical care, etc.

[LadyJaney]

I have a strange feeling that somewhere down the line that the mother and baby will end up at SGMWGSMH and Arizona will have to face the mom again after her snarky comment.  It will be then that we find out what Kristen did and why the mother wants nothing more to do with her.

My theory: Kristen killed rich step-dad, who is also baby's father.  Kristen's mom wants nothing more to do with her, but wants to raise the baby since it is all that is left of him...

Didn't care for Kristen either, she was just so nasty and volatile and manipulative that it was hard to take too much pity on her.

Wouldn't be surprised to see prison Dr at SGMWGSMH before too long.

[DearEvette]

8 hours ago, esco1822 said:

I have no issue with the doctors not wanting to know what she did. They are supposed to do everything in the best interest of the patient and maybe they felt like if they knew what she had done, it might impact their feelings toward helping her.  Regardless of their feelings for her, they have to do their jobs so if ignorance makes that easier to do and makes it easier for them to empathize with the patient, which made eventually made her more cooperative, with i'm 100% on board with that decision. They had to do what was best for the baby which was to keep the mother out of distress. 

Yeah, I had no issue with that piece of it either.  And if they had just left it at that, then it would have been fine with me.  But then Arizona had to go and get all self righteous with the mother. 

1 hour ago, lorbeer said:

I think it's really lazy of the writers to not to tell us why she was convicted...

I think they did it deliberately.  Look how much discussion and speculation it is generating.  This is exactly the sort of thing they'd want.  I also think they not only left her crime a big question mark, but they also left much of her life deliberately blank just so people could have as much latitude as they need to headwank.  All we know for sure is that she has a mother, she's at least upper middle class to wealthy, and she loves her mother.  Other than that we got nothing.  We don't know anything about a father or any siblings or anything.  The absence of mentioning them would lead one to believe that they don't exist but that is not necessarily so.  They could have cut her off so completely that they don't even want to visit or have anything to do with the baby, only the mother.  Or she could have killed them all just to keep her mother for herself.

If I had to headwank her crime, I would go with the one where she killed one or more members of her immediate family.  Her mother seems like a nice lady.  She didn't come off as one of those cold, snotty distant mothers who have never shown affection to their children.  I imagine she would forgive her daughter almost anything no matter how bad.... except killing a sibling or other close family member and then exhibiting no remorse. 

[Veronica]

They were on their way out, having already treated the girl, when the prison doctor asked if they wanted to know. Knowing at that point would have had no impact on her treatment. 

[Ohwell]

47 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

I think they did it deliberately.  Look how much discussion and speculation it is generating.  This is exactly the sort of thing they'd want.  I also think they not only left her crime a big question mark, but they also left much of her life deliberately blank just so people could have as much latitude as they need to headwank.  All we know for sure is that she has a mother, she's at least upper middle class to wealthy, and she loves her mother.  Other than that we got nothing.  We don't know anything about a father or any siblings or anything.  The absence of mentioning them would lead one to believe that they don't exist but that is not necessarily so.  They could have cut her off so completely that they don't even want to visit or have anything to do with the baby, only the mother.  Or she could have killed them all just to keep her mother for herself.

And this is what I'm afraid of--that they'll revisit the story somewhere down the line.  I really, really don't want to see her anymore, but kudos to the actress for playing such a believable vile bitch.  

[Joana]

I agree that the doctors didn't need to know what she had done. And really, they possibly would not have given her the best possible treatment if they had known that she had tortured and murdered her entire family and then ate their corpses, or whatever that is that a privileged white girl had to do to get herself a life sentence at the age of 16. They were probably aware of that themselves, it's human nature, so I get why they wanted to be in the dark in order to do their job right.

HOWEVER, that doesn't mean that they get to pass off whatever heinous thing she must have done as a "mistake" and "stuff that just happens". Bailey's epiphany in the end was ridiculous. And even more so, they don't get to judge the mother who must have been through God only knows how much and that they have absolutely no idea about. Looking at you there, Arizona.

Generally, it wasn't the worst episode ever. Or even this season. I appreciate they were trying to do something different that doesn't include Meredith, for a change. Of course, the timing of this episode is everything but perfect. 

Also, did you know that Jo used to live in her car?

Edited January 28, 2017 by Joana

[StaceyNotStacie]

9 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

And this is what I'm afraid of--that they'll revisit the story somewhere down the line.  I really, really don't want to see her anymore, but kudos to the actress for playing such a believable vile bitch.  

Didn't they say the baby was going to be in the NICU?  Maybe she will be treated at their hospital. 

[KaveDweller]

2 hours ago, LadyJaney said:

I have a strange feeling that somewhere down the line that the mother and baby will end up at SGMWGSMH and Arizona will have to face the mom again after her snarky comment.  It will be then that we find out what Kristen did and why the mother wants nothing more to do with her.

My theory: Kristen killed rich step-dad, who is also baby's father.  Kristen's mom wants nothing more to do with her, but wants to raise the baby since it is all that is left of him...

Didn't care for Kristen either, she was just so nasty and volatile and manipulative that it was hard to take too much pity on her.

Wouldn't be surprised to see prison Dr at SGMWGSMH before too long.

The thing that trips me up is Kristen believed her mother was going to be there for the birth and would be bringing the baby to visit. If she killed her father/step-father or other family members, she probably would have known the mother didn't really plan on doing that.

I'm not saying she didn't do something horrible, she clearly did. But I doubt it was that.

Edited January 28, 2017 by KaveDweller

[Ohwell]

6 minutes ago, Stacey1014 said:

Didn't they say the baby was going to be in the NICU?  Maybe she will be treated at their hospital. 

I don't mind seeing the baby, just not the baby's mother.

[OtterMommy]

2 hours ago, dalek said:

Also, depending on the laws in a particular state, yes you can end up with a long sentence in a maximum security facility for a nonviolent crime.  For instance, thanks to New York State's Rockefeller Drug Laws, purchase of 2 oz. of cocaine is likely to get you charged with possession with intent to distribute (even if bought for personal use).  If convicted, that's an automatic 15 to life sentence, and because it is a class A felony, you are going to a maximum security prison.  And NY is one of the states where 16 and 17 year olds automatically get charged as adults.

 

I don't disagree that some nonviolent crimes get some pretty harsh sentences, I don't think that was the case here.  Kristen was separated from the other prisoners for their safety.  She *was* violent and I'm sure her crime--whatever it was--was just as violent.

[Joana]

Yeah. And it's not like she's some poor soul without anyone to take care of their best interests. She has a great, devoted lawyer, obviously she would have goen hard after whatever extenuating circumstances, had there been any. 

Edited January 28, 2017 by Joana

[Court]

1 hour ago, OtterMommy said:

I don't disagree that some nonviolent crimes get some pretty harsh sentences, I don't think that was the case here.  Kristen was separated from the other prisoners for their safety.  She *was* violent and I'm sure her crime--whatever it was--was just as violent.

Agreed.

But for pretty rich white blond haired girl to be there, it's something awful. Pretty white people usually get leniency in comparison to other races. Non-white people are incarcerated at a much higher rate for committing the exact same crime. Couple that with being wealthy, she definitely committed a heinous crime for a life sentence.

[Starscream]

Kristen reminded me of Eurus, only stupid.

No way she only killed her father if he was raping her.  Poor little girl from Bainbridge being raped by her pervert father would get her a reduced sentence, maybe even an acquittal with an ace lawyer.   Or maybe she jumped the table and attacked the prosecutor for saying mean things.

Edited January 28, 2017 by Starscream

[kingshearte]

14 hours ago, deaja said:

Right?  "Oh, I should stockpile the extra?  I've been burning the extra at the end of each day. Thank you so much, Dr. Bailey. It's obvious to see how you became chief at your hospital!"

This made me snort.

12 hours ago, Deanie87 said:

It seemed just the opposite to me.  I thought it played out like someone being honest with her was what finally calmed the patient down, even if it upset her.  It may have been somewhat reckless, but I thought Jo was putting the patient's needs first. 

I agree. She knew something was up, and it was causing her to get agitated, which was not helpful for anyone. The longer they kept trying to pretend everything was fine when she knew damn well it wasn't, the more upset she was going to get. Technically, Jo shouldn't have said anything. But I don't actually blame her for doing so in this instance.

11 hours ago, lizstar300 said:

Anyone else spend a good chunk of the episode wondering how she got pregnant in the first place? Was she pregnant before she went to prison? It seemed like she was in that ward for more than a couple months. And she was what? 16? Do they have conjugal visits for minors? Was she raped in prison by a warden? Those unanswered questions bothered me more than what she was in for.

I did wonder about these things too, and would have liked them to tell us a little more about her background in general. Definitely about the baby daddy, and not just what she did, but why? What circumstances led to her doing whatever she did? And whatever it was, it was definitely something really terrible. People might get jailed for ridiculously long sentences for stupid stuff sometimes, but those people don't usually end up in maximum security, separated from everyone else, under heavy guard at all times. To warrant all that, it must have been something on an almost Hannibal Lecter-esque scale.

Overall, it was a decently compelling episode, except for the fact that, in the back of my mind, I was wondering about the Alex situation the whole time. If they insist on starting back from the hiatus with a self-contained story like this, I hope they at least do a better job of picking up the plot threads going forward than they did last year.

And add me to the list of people who were very concerned for that baby. Of course, I was also almost certain that someone was going to lose her badge or have it snatched by a prisoner, but that didn't happen either. Shonda's clearly not a big believer in Chekhov's gun.

[Scatterbrained]

1 hour ago, kingshearte said:

If they insist on starting back from the hiatus with a self-contained story like this, I hope they at least do a better job of picking up the plot threads going forward than they did last year.

Considering the fact that this was originally supposed to be episode 13, I think that means there are at least two more episodes that take place within a similar time period???  

This seems like the storm episodes of season 9 and 10.

[Amethyst]

7 hours ago, lorbeer said:

I really like that lawyer. Anyone knows who is the actress? I feel like I've seen her already but I can't put the face to a name...

Her name is Jasmin Savoy Brown.  I recognized her from Brooklyn 99, but she's also on The Leftovers.

[Court]

44 minutes ago, Amethyst said:

Her name is Jasmin Savoy Brown.  I recognized her from Brooklyn 99, but she's also on The Leftovers.

Thank you! I don't remember her in B99 but I do remember her from Stitchers. 

[WhosThatGirl]

I don't know. In all honestly while this was a decent episode, because it was and I even said that a few pages back. Now I'm thinking I didn't really like it. It was boring. I'm probably not going to remember it and there's a bigger storyline fish to fry that we should have in all honestly been focusing on.

Yes, this episode could have been a good filler episode sandwiched in between two big episodes but we haven't seen Greys since November and we left on a big storyline. Alex sitting in jail, ready to turn himself in but he was listening to Merediths voicemail so we don't know the answer. Also I'm thinking Bailey doesn't know what's really going on either-she told Jo what Alex had said to her the night before but I don't know if we were supposed to think she hasn't spoken to Alex or Merdirth since then. 

This was such a sluggish episode and like I said I'm not going to remember any of it. Even that terrible episode back in November where all the doctors were remembering dead relatives and nights of and past selves was at least semi interesting and had a point of some kind. This episode didn't for me. 

And it didn't help that it had three characters who are either the most judgey at times or that I feel lukewarm about. 

[RedVelvetWaffles]

Jo annoys me. I want her gone or at least nowhere near Alex.

[talktoomuch]

I miss the old Bailey.

[sarkygal]

Quote

13 hours ago, OtterMommy said:

I don't disagree that some nonviolent crimes get some pretty harsh sentences, I don't think that was the case here.  Kristen was separated from the other prisoners for their safety.  She *was* violent and I'm sure her crime--whatever it was--was just as violent.

I watched this again and Bailey asked what the classification was as they entered the room. Prison doc said it was for "convicted murderers or validated gang members". Then the lawyer shut the conversation down by saying she was a minor and confidential information. 

As for the mom adopting the baby, the child is innocent and never asked to be born in those circumstances.

Arizona's judgement of the mom is rubbish. There is no one single story. I'm not assuming the kid was raped by a step father, etc. I saw a mother dealing with her daughter being too far gone by whatever crime she committed and wanting to give her grandchild a fair start in life. MMV 

[Snow Fairy]

Jo throwing up in the end made me think she was possibly pregnant. That was the first thing that crossed my mind.

But I don't know if the timeline fits

[Gladrags]

I didn't dislike this episode as much as I thought I would. The acting and production both were very good, and, frankly, I really don't care what happens to Alex anyway. 

[hellmuch]

4 hours ago, Snow Fairy said:

Jo throwing up in the end made me think she was possibly pregnant. That was the first thing that crossed my mind.

But I don't know if the timeline fits

I was wondering the same thing.  

Especially since they didn't bother all that much to conceal Camilla's baby bump in a lot of scenes.  

[mojito]

This episode was okay. As for the cliffhanger, I don't even remember what it was. Guess it wasn't very compelling.

What resolution am I anxiously awaiting to occur? Surely not the Alex situation. He deserves to be locked up for a while. Was it something else?

[bounnatalie]

23 hours ago, talktoomuch said:

I miss the old Bailey.

How does Bailey go from being a tough cookie with the residents to being a scared rabbit in prison?

[StaceyNotStacie]

3 hours ago, bounnatalie said:

How does Bailey go from being a tough cookie with the residents to being a scared rabbit in prison?

I'm guessing it's because it's not her comfort zone. At the hospital, she's a big fish in a little pond, but it's the opposite at the prison. She's out of her element and she has to follow their rules instead of being the rule maker. 

[talktoomuch]

I finally watched the last 15 mins and it pissed me off. Now I see what you guys meant about Arizona's unprovoked judginess. You have no idea what Kristen did. You didn't want to know so your judgment of her crimes wouldn't affect your patient care. But it's ok to slsp that judgment for the same crime on her mother who, for all you know, is a victim of that crime? STHU Arizona!

Bailey's big epiphany that "stuff happens to people." Her examples were Kristen and Alex? Both people who did "stuff" to hurt other people? GTFOHWTBS Bailey!

Sympathy for Kristen may be more believable since she's so young, though for me it would be totally tempered by what she did (likely murder). Like I could feel sorry for the poor little rich girl unless she killed her little sister out of jealousy or another student just for sport.

But Alex? He's a grown ass man who knows he has anger issues but has done nothing about them. And now he severely beat a man to the point of possibly affecting his livelihood. I get that stuff happened to Alex when he was younger, but at this age he no longer gets a pass for taking out that stuff on other people.

[BaseOps]

On January 28, 2017 at 1:20 AM, Scatterbrained said:

Considering the fact that this was originally supposed to be episode 13, I think that means there are at least two more episodes that take place within a similar time period???  

This seems like the storm episodes of season 9 and 10.

I don't think it was ever supposed to be episode 13, it was just filmed out of order. The episode takes place the same night as 13x09 and leads directly into 13x11. Unless they did reshoots or added scenes, this was always intended as 13x10. 

[RedVelvetWaffles]

On 1/27/2017 at 11:48 AM, Lesia said:

I kept thinking the prisoner was going to pop up in the back of the car, having escaped in a laundry basket.  It was tense there for a moment, like something big was going to be revealed. Aaand it wasn't.

I'm glad I wasn't the only one. I thought she was going to pop out of the trunk when they pulled over so Jo could puke.

[Scatterbrained]

1 hour ago, BaseOps said:

I don't think it was ever supposed to be episode 13, it was just filmed out of order. The episode takes place the same night as 13x09 and leads directly into 13x11. Unless they did reshoots or added scenes, this was always intended as 13x10. 

Next episode might take place during the same time frame.   Like, while Bailey, Arizona, and Jo were doing their trip to and from the prison, Meredith was searching for Alex and Richard, Maggie, April and Jackson, were strategizing against Minnick. The episode after that will be similar, but will feature Alex (and maybe Ben) at the DA, Owen searching for Amelia (with Stephanie) and Riggs and DeLuca are in there somewhere.

[DearEvette]

3 hours ago, BaseOps said:

I don't think it was ever supposed to be episode 13, it was just filmed out of order. The episode takes place the same night as 13x09 and leads directly into 13x11. Unless they did reshoots or added scenes, this was always intended as 13x10. 

The opening and closing car scenes are the only scenes that really place it being the same night as Alex going to turn himself in.  IIRC, nothing else about the whole episode places it in any timeline context.  Without those scenes this episode could have been slotted anywhere, really.  So my guess is this probably was intended to be 13x13 but when they decided to air it as the mid-season premiere, those car scenes were shot and replaced whatever the original opening scenes were.    I am also inclined to think it was meant to be aired later is because it makes no sense to end in the winter on a cliffhanger (even if I don't really think Alex is going anywhere) and not to come back immediately to pick that right back up. 

Edited January 30, 2017 by DearEvette

[WhosThatGirl]

It would make sense that that this episode was supposed to be somewhere else. Aside from the car scenes mentioned, the episode was a vacuum. What went down in it is not going to change a actual story on the show. Bailey, Arizona, and Jo could have been any of the other doctors.

[Court]

Jo says something to Bailey about the trial being the morning when they're on their way to the hospital. 

[BaseOps]

14 hours ago, Scatterbrained said:

Next episode might take place during the same time frame.   Like, while Bailey, Arizona, and Jo were doing their trip to and from the prison, Meredith was searching for Alex and Richard, Maggie, April and Jackson, were strategizing against Minnick. The episode after that will be similar, but will feature Alex (and maybe Ben) at the DA, Owen searching for Amelia (with Stephanie) and Riggs and DeLuca are in there somewhere.

That's not how it happens, though. 13x11 takes place after 13x10, not within the same timeframe. 

[Biggie B]

That attorney spoke so quickly that I could barely understand her. But I liked how extraordinarily controlled she was with her client and how she'd clearly figured out how to deal with an extremely disturbed person in an effective, authoritative way that was not condescending. Since we weren't shown or told if Kristen was getting any sort of counseling (seemed doubtful), her attorney seemed to be her only advocate in every sense of the word. That said, I didn't like Kristen very much, which I suppose was sort of the point. Beyond redemption, perhaps? I hope we don't see her again, though. That was enough.