Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[BitterApple]

The Duggars have socialized with many non-white families since the beginning of the show. I've never seen any indication that they are full on racist nor do we have any evidence that they disapprove of Marjorie because she's half-Latina. I know these people are the media's current whipping boy but I hate it when traits are assigned to people with no proof.

[JoanArc]

 

I always wondered about the Duggars' views on race.  I can't imagine they're very progressive and accepting.  Every interaction I've seen them have with a person who is not white has seemed awkward and condescending.

Yep, which is why I thought the wheels were coming off the wagon.

 

I wonder how Marge's family feels about having Jill babysit their kids? Was Josh ever over there? I bet there's a lot of soul searching going on.

 

 

I know these people are the media's current whipping boy but I hate it when traits are assigned to people with no proof.

FWIW, these were my views long before this scandal broke. and QF does have a huge racist underbelly. I'll leave it there and won't go OT.

Edited May 22, 2015 by JoanArc

[sigmaforce86]

FRC isn't a typical corporate employer. They're a DC-based political lobbying entity with a specific agenda. I doubt that their funding or finances are transparent (they aren't a charity or a publicly held) corporation. FRC is in the PR/spin biz AND with a "holier than thou" allegedly "Christian" agenda. So,  FRC's going to cut loose a problematic spokesman in a hearbeat, whatever it costs them in money for a confidential severance deal. That's how that world works. It's not the typical corporate employer/employee situation. 

So I believe Josh got some amount of money and probably a deal that included continuing insurance coverage for his family, in return for making a BS non-statement and going quietly and quickly.

 

 

I was thinking that too - That it's pretty good odds they gave him a "severance" package that included money and the company paying their benefits for a period of time to get him out the door as quickly and quietly as possible.

 

There is a part of me that doesn't want to see the show cancelled - I think it's because of the family size and the idea that everyone is going to be punished for this.  Jill and Jessa lose money for themselves and the kids still at home end up with even less when the family income drops.  I can only hope that Michelle and JB invested for a rainy day.

If they keep on TLC is going to have a lot of meetings to figure out how - do they force the family to drop the fake face they put on and start to be real or does JB demand they go on trying to make us think they have the perfect family and all is always well.

I'd still love to see Jinger and Jana demand their parents give them the TLC money they earned for appearing on the show as adults (they had to have signed their own contracts but I wouldn't be surprised if it had a clause that the money go to the parents or they just turned the money over when they were paid)...............take that cash use it to start a real life, go to school, date, whatever.  Any solution though pretty much screws over the young ones.

 

Sadly they still have their admirers - besides the support on Facebook I noticed articles at "The Stir" are getting a lot of responses along the lines of - This is fake, It's all gossip, It's blown out of proportion, How dare you tell them how to parent (seriously?) and (my favorite - not) This is a family issue and the person who "blabbed" to the authorities should be ashamed.   Just sad.

[Cherrio]

I am musing about the countless possibilities of who started this.   

I keep coming back to Ben, Jessa and Ben's family.   On just looks alone which is of course no foundation , Ben's dad strikes me as a no nonsense and stern man.

           My thinking is that maybe after a few months of marriage and time spent away from her home and with Ben's family, Jessa might of purged it all to Ben.    Ben,underneath his coming across like an idiot probably has a deep macho desire to protect his new wife.

 The two of them had already gone against the money making machine and refused to kiss for the camera's.  That had to have "bin" a very big deal.

             Jessa has always had that bit of don't mess with me vibe and has made clear some of her dislikes.  The camera's early on even alluded to her of being a bit of a bully.

         So, I am thinking that after Jessa told Ben, he was going to beat Josh to a pulp at first chance.   In the interim, they went to Ben's parents to talk and for advice. Jessa having experienced a somewhat normal family might of been comfortable enough to spill everything and put a stop to it.    Yes, I think there are a lot of bad things going on in that house. To try and save the rest of the children who still live there.

      Just a theory.

[Guest]

I understand this situation is different than Honey Boo Boo's, which is why I agree with most of the posters on here who are saying TLC will probably lay low with this family until trying to release the new season this fall.

HBB was cancelled while the show was between seasons. TLC had filmed an upcoming season that was totally scrapped. All reruns were yanked off the air. I still maintain that TLC will move forward with this show considering they have 10 years of reruns in their vault and this family is far more lucrative to them than the Boo Boos. The Boos also couldn't haul out the time-honored "God has forgiven us" line since the foundation of their show was never "look at us! Jesus loves us best!"

In a sense, I not only feel sorry for those poor, poor girls but Josh (to a much lesser degree) as well. Theirs was a toxic stew of repression and ignorance brought about solely by those awful parents who need to held accountable. Not praised as godly, not rewarded by TLC with more seasons, not paraded around like the victims they will inevitably claim to be. I knew they were frauds from the get go. It's no comfort that, with the release of this information, I turned out to be right.

[MarysWetBar]

Still in shock. I have been reading so much since the "news" broke that my head is in a spin, but a couple of thoughts have come through:

* Josh's apology is all about himself, what he went through and how he has recovered and gotten on with his life. No true repentance for what harm he has caused, or actions he has taken to obtain forgiveness for his "mistakes". (Calling it mistakes makes me see red every time I read it.)

* The comments from Anna read like a well worn script. This is what a good Gothard wife says and does.

* As so many other have said, it explains so much about various reactions from the older girls. To me, it explains the anxiety I have seen in Jana when it seems that things may be out of her control. I first noticed it in the Weight Watchers episode, where I recognised the look on her face as she lined up for weigh in. and later on when she was listening to the leader at the meeting and JB was goofing off. Another example is how she took Jill's bridesmaids' dresses and came up with alterations on the spot and did them all herself. Control over something she was doing, not thinking about anything else, being part of, yet separate to what was going on.

* I just hope that someone is looking after the other kids properly. They may not have access to the internet, but would know something is happening. Kids always do. While I do not think they need to be given the bald facts, they need to know something is happening. I truly doubt JB and M are thinking of the younger ones needs now.

* That Josh and John David never really seemed to get along. Yes, John David does come off as a bit of a doofus, but for all his ways, I think he is smarter than he appears. And he and Jana are still close. One of the older girls commented in an episode when they were preparing to go back home after the Josie/Little Rock eps, that JD was supposed to be doing something for them, but wouldn't, but Jana would speak to him and get it all sorted as she was the only one who could talk to him, and he would do things for her.

This is a bit longer than I thought it would be. Apologies for that. Thoughts will pop up as I type.

I have actually been thinking about JD too this morning and isn't hindsight amazing? Has anyone else ever thought he was just a bit of a dismissive smartass? I know i did. He seemed rather sarcastic and you could tell he didn't want to be filmed much. Loved his response to the flamingos painting fiasco too recently. Well looking back,he knew about this sickening shitshow, and the way he looks at JB shows his real feelings about him as head of household. He knows what happened to his twin. And he would likely fuck off everytime the cameras showed up cus he could taste the hypocrisy. My thoughts is all. I am reeling here and need more time to process but agree wholeheartedly that Jana was one of them and Jill was the one who told. .cus she seemed to be JBs fave and likely the most fundie brainwashed. Edited May 22, 2015 by MarysWetBar

[GEML]

Also, Oprah probably gets tons of poison pen type things regarding famous people on her shows. One of the reasons this could be swept under the rug is people were threatening (or did) call CPS on the Duggars over the blanket training or because or sleeping in dormitories or an episode like Josie's seizure which are unpleasant to watch, but aren't the type of thing CPS is going to take children away from their parents. People cried wolf so often, I figure CPS just began rolling their eyes after a certain point.

Oprah probably gets a lot of that too. People are really nasty towards successful people. She had no way of knowing if this were true or not. That she sent it at all is noteworthy.

[TheFinalRose]

Anna won't leave.  She does not have the immense courage it would take. Plus, we do not know if her parents would emotionally support that decision, either.  Also, Josh will sweet talk her into forgiving him some more, 7 x 70 as Jesus said. It's her decision, but really, it's sad because she might feel she has no options.

[charmed1]

I'm just so sad for the girls. They've already lived a nightmare; now they get to repeat it in the public eye. It's unfair, and it beyond sucks that once again they're getting the short end of the stick.

I know it's a big maybe, but maybe the girls feel somewhat relieved that this horrible secret they've had to keep for all this time is finally out there. That finally someone knows, even if they couldn't tell them. Those poor girls. My heart goes out to them. The victim shaming isn't restricted to only fundies. Locally, a 12 year old girl was just sexually assaulted in an elevator by a 20 year old man in her apartment building. The facebook comments from those claiming to know the suspect are almost all claiming that he was probably a victim himself, only God can judge, and that the little girl probably lied about her age.

[JenCarroll]

Marjorie's mom is Guatemalan. I think it's a little presumptuous to label all South Americans as "non-white." Quite a lot of them are of European extraction and are not necessarily on-board with being "othered" in this way based on where they were born. (I have this from my cousin who is a close friend and whose mother was born in South America. Obviously no one person speaks for all Latin Americans and mileage varies on this a lot.)

Until either Marjorie or her mother self-identify as non-white, I wouldn't do it for them. I'm not aware of any such statement from either one. If they've made such a statement, then I'd withdraw my objection in their particular case, but stand by the practice of cautiousness in choosing other people's ethnic identities for them.

ETA: Sorry! Off-topic. Do I need to move this to the Marsiah thread?

ETA AGAIN: There was a comment referring to Marjorie as not 100% white. I thought I quoted it and now can't find it. Sorry again!

Edited May 22, 2015 by JenCarroll

[Bella]

Let's not get into race, okay? It hasn't come up as a factor. We do know that FRC is an anti-LBGTQ organization, so that is an acceptable branch for discussion. But let's keep race out of this unless it comes up as a specific issue in the various reports.

 

There's way more than enough to talk about without bringing in things that haven't even been identified as factors.

 

Thanks!

 

ETA: We prefer that people stay in the right threads to the extent possible, but that's not our main concern at the moment.

[JoanArc]

http://www.salon.com/2015/05/22/here_are_some_high_profile_republicans_who_are_buds_with_josh_duggar_child_molester/

 

Heh, Jeb Bush looks like he wants to get away as quickly as possible. The Duggar name is POISON now.

[trimthatfat]

If Anna leaves, it will not be any time soon. She's pregnant, her husband just left his job which I am sure is a hit financially, he likely will have no career prospects for a long time, and she's been raised to believe that a wife is to stick by her husband. I don't believe for one second that Josh ever confided in her that he molested his sisters. I think he might have said he made a 'mistake' in the past, but his heart is pure now because he's been forgiven and blah, blah, blah. Anna is a lot of things, but I couldn't see her accepting Josh's past with a smile, especially now that she has a daughter and another on the way. Anna and Josh are presenting a united front now, but I bet their home situation is tense right about now.

 

Oprah's staff did exactly what was appropriate which was forward the information to the authorities. It was not their place to do beyond that because they had no way of knowing if the accusations are valid. I don't think the staff should be criticized for how they handled the situation. It is not their job to go to the press to spread what was a rumor at the time.

[SunnyBeBe]

I suspect the show will be canceled, but I'm not sure what else can be done.  The girls involved are now adults and no one can force them to get therapy.  Two of them are married and no longer live in the home.  Josh doesn't live in the home or the state of Arkansas.  The statute of limitations has passed, so they can't charge Josh with a criminal charge.  So, I'm confused as to what people want to see done about it.  He's made a public apology and resigned his job.  I'm no fan of the parents, but at this point, they have no real legal control over it either.  I'm not sure how you punish Josh now.  Public shaming for something that happened when he was an immature teen might feel good for the masses, but I'm not sure how effective it is for a person who has turned their life around and is not an abuser.  At this point there is no evidence that anything else happened since he was a teen.  I certainly do not condone his behavior. but wonder if the public attack on Josh is helping the victims.  If so, then perhaps its the right thing to do, but I'm not so sure about that.  

[gunderda]

They won't cancel the show.  I bet they will remove Josh and Anna from it, at least for awhile but I highly doubt they will cancel it completely. 

[AnJen]

I tried to read as much of the thread as I could, but it keeps updating quickly, so I've been skimming the last few pages, and I would really like to add my opinion here. I've seen a lot of people, both in this thread as well as others, who don't seem to be taking the abuse as seriously as I think it should be taken. I've seen a lot of "Well he was 14 and grew up in that environment, so he's kind of a victim too" and I couldn't disagree more. Are the parents responsible for what happened? Yes. Does that lessen Josh's own responsibility? Hell no.

 

The thing for me, is that yes, sure, he's 14 and growing up in a very sex-obsessed family; his parents are boinking like bunnies at every available opportunity, while continually talking to the kids about how sex is evil. I understand that this is a repressive environment for anyone, let alone a sexually frustrated teenager in the middle of puberty.

 

However. Josh was 14, and clearly able to tell right from wrong. I am sorry to be so blunt, but the point I keep coming back to in thinking about this is: Josh had healthy options to get his sexual urges out; masturbating in the shower is a pretty common thing among teenage boys.

The clincher here for me is that Josh knew both of these things were wrong; touching himself for sexual gratification or touching his sisters for sexual gratification; in his family and religion, both of these are wrong, but only one hurts someone else. He willingly chose the latter, and that is a very telling choice.

 

His behavior also escalated, according to the admissions in the police report. He began by touching girls who were asleep and eventually progressed to touching them when they were awake. He cornered one sister when she was alone doing laundry and lifted her onto a washing machine (or dryer?) so that she couldn't escape. Then progressed to touching at least one girl in front of another sibling. And this behavior continued over a period of months to years; had no sibling gone to the parents, I think it's very likely that the behavior would have continued to escalate. Sexual abusers typically escalate over time, and Josh displayed very similar behavior.

 

I think it's also important to point out that sexual abuse often has very little to do with sex and a whole lot to do with power and control.

 

My heart breaks for the Duggar girls. Everyone in their world is hurting them. They are taught that any abuse they receive is their fault, that they should be submissive to the men and "keep sweet" at all times. I can't imagine having to go through something like this and not only not be allowed to work through it in therapy, but to also have to constantly live with the abuser. 

[Jellybeans]

Josh's relationship with his parents has always appeared "off". I am willing to be that now Josh has seen how the real world operates, he harbors a lot of resentment towards his parents for his upbringing. Had Josh been raised by normal parents, this probably would never have happened.

[Literata]

I don't care how dirty Jill's feet are or how crunchy Jinger's hair is; I'll never snark about any of the girls again.

 

The pain I feel for them takes my breath away. And in retrospect, so much makes sense now: Jill's rule-following and devotion to control and order. Jana's obvious sadness and relinquishment. Jessa's fuck-you self-protection. Jinger's devastation at losing Jessa, and Joy's at losing Jill. And throughout ALL of it, they cooked the meals and raised the kids and functioned as indentured servants to the very people who were obligated to protect them, but didn't.

[JoanArc]

Looks like a huge backlash on Twitter about the marathon. Good. Many news services are reporting it. Here's one:

 

http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/tv/tlc-airs-19-kids-counting-marathon-sex-admission-article-1.2231863

[galax-arena]

9 times Josh Duggar lectured people on family values before his hypocrisy was revealed.

 

We all knew he was a hypocrite, but it pisses me off even more to see all those examples laid out like that. In one tweet, he wrote, "Islam attacks women!" Oh, really, Josh? Tell me more about attacking women... 

Edited May 22, 2015 by galax-arena

[JAYJAY1979]

This could explain why Jana seemed unwilling to marry.

I think if the show refocused on the two daughters and their new marriage with little to no involvement of.the family ...it might save the show...might being the key word.

Edited May 22, 2015 by JAYJAY1979

[Literata]

TLC needs to come up with some sort of statement. Even "we're evaluating the future of the show" is preferable to ... crickets.

[truthtalk2014]

I am musing about the countless possibilities of who started this.   

I keep coming back to Ben, Jessa and Ben's family.   On just looks alone which is of course no foundation , Ben's dad strikes me as a no nonsense and stern man.

      

I really would like to know as well. If Jill wasn't one of the molested ones, maybe she told Derrick and he told the boy scout brother.  Derrick wasn't at the interview.  I know they said he had dental surgery but I found that strange because he got braces before that.  Typically if you need any dental surgery they do it before getting braces.  Maybe he or his brother did it and didn't want to be around Joshlestor.  Of course I am purely speculating based on the weirdness with Jill that day and Anna as well.  Actually it was weird all around. 

[StaceyNotStacie]

Looks like a huge backlash on Twitter about the marathon. Good. Many news services are reporting it. Here's one:

 

http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/tv/tlc-airs-19-kids-counting-marathon-sex-admission-article-1.2231863

 

They've dropped the scheduled 12 pm episodes.  They're showing The Little Couple in its place.

[graefin]

It would not surprise me at all if the show continued in spite of this. I also expect Anna to stay. I think people have these expectations that this family would have the same kind of reactions that mainstream people do, but it's evident that they do not--just look at how the parents handled this? It's not really surprising that Josh refers to it as basically a youthful indiscretion, because to them, that's all it was. Why do we think Anna would think differently? She was raised in the same cult. I would imagine that the Dillards and Seewalds will be supportive of them too, but it would be nice to be wrong.

 

Also, remember that clip where Josh is talking about Jill, and how he can't remember her ever doing anything wrong, and whenever he did, she would "go and tell MOTHer" (said disdainfully) and he would "get a talking to"? In the following segment, Jana was questioned by producers as to whether Jill was a tattle tale, and she said, "no; she just wanted to make sure everyone stayed accountable." How disturbing this all is in light of what we know now.

[Literata]

They've dropped the scheduled 12 pm episodes.  They're showing The Little Couple in its place.

 

Boob and MEchelle have also been replaced on the landing page. The center photo now is the Willises.  "19 Kids" is still listed under shows, but the attention is scaled back.

[questionfear]

I am musing about the countless possibilities of who started this.   

I keep coming back to Ben, Jessa and Ben's family.   On just looks alone which is of course no foundation , Ben's dad strikes me as a no nonsense and stern man.

           My thinking is that maybe after a few months of marriage and time spent away from her home and with Ben's family, Jessa might of purged it all to Ben.    Ben,underneath his coming across like an idiot probably has a deep macho desire to protect his new wife.

 The two of them had already gone against the money making machine and refused to kiss for the camera's.  That had to have "bin" a very big deal.

             Jessa has always had that bit of don't mess with me vibe and has made clear some of her dislikes.  The camera's early on even alluded to her of being a bit of a bully.

         So, I am thinking that after Jessa told Ben, he was going to beat Josh to a pulp at first chance.   In the interim, they went to Ben's parents to talk and for advice. Jessa having experienced a somewhat normal family might of been comfortable enough to spill everything and put a stop to it.    Yes, I think there are a lot of bad things going on in that house. To try and save the rest of the children who still live there.

      Just a theory.

That's a pretty plausible theory. I really do think the Seewalds will do what they can to extricate Ben and Jessa, especially if Josh and Anna move closer. 

 

And if Ben really wants a future in ministry, his best bet is to get AWAY from the Duggars right now.

[Barbie]

http://www.mediaite.com/online/mike-huckabee-stands-by-duggar-family-good-people-make-mistakes/

 

hope it's ok to share this link... Huckabee statements...

[toodles]

Maybe this has already been mentioned, but I think part of their solution is the ridiculous Nike concept. Put a stupid bandaid on the boy's feelings and call it good.

[lottiedottie]

I have actually been thinking about JD too this morning and isn't hindsight amazing? Has anyone else ever thought he was just a bit of a dismissive smartass? I know i did. He seemed rather sarcastic and you could tell he didn't want to be filmed much. Loved his response to the flamingos painting fiasco too recently. Well looking back,he knew about this sickening shitshow, and the way he looks at JB shows his real feelings about him as head of household. He knows what happened to his twin. And he would likely fuck off everytime the cameras showed up cus he could taste the hypocrisy. My thoughts is all. I am reeling here and need more time to process but agree wholeheartedly that Jana was one of them and Jill was the one who told. .cus she seemed to be JBs fave and likely the most fundie brainwashed.

Makes it even more interesting that he was absent for the big family interview that aired this week. He had to work? I'm giving the side-eye to that excuse.

[galax-arena]

Huckabee is still in Josh's corner.

“Josh’s actions when he was an underage teen are as he described them himself, ‘inexcusable,’ but that doesn’t mean ‘unforgivable,'” Huckabee said in a statement posted on Facebook Friday. “He and his family dealt with it and were honest and open about it with the victims and the authorities. No purpose whatsoever is served by those who are now trying to discredit Josh or his family by sensationalizing the story.”

Honest and open about it? You mean the way Jim Bob enlisted a personal buddy of his to give Josh a stern talking-to? You mean the way they never addressed it again until someone at Oprah's studio apparently forwarded a tip to the child abuse hotline? That's honest and open? 

 

Oh, Huckabee, you dolt. 

[phoenix62]

I wondered if these kids were getting proper care, but I confess that I never thought something this horrid was going on.

My heart breaks for these girls...I can't even imagine the pain they have had to suppress.

I've had personal experience with a foster sister( she was 5 years older than I) trying to do some of what Josh admitted to doing, and she forced me to do a few things as well.....needless to say when my foster mother caught her one night, we were not sharing a room any longer. If my foster parents reported it to the social worker, I'm not sure. I rather doubt it, because I'm quite sure we both would have been forced into therapy, and considering the foster family wasn't the greatest place.....well....

(My apology for a personal comment, but I'm going somewhere with this...)

What I wonder is this....what happened to these kids that's not been reported? I suspect that he's done a bit more than fondle the victims in question. I hope I'm wrong....

It's just heartbreaking all around. And.....well, I don't believe in a hell, but if there IS one, Michelle and JimBob need to be in the 9th circle of hell for letting those kids (the ones who were molested) be placed in jeopardy.

Oh, that's right, though, being Christian and all, they prayed a lot, and they aren't perfect....they are just forgiven. *rolls eyes*

That makes it ok, I suppose.

I just hope that they cancel the f'n show and pay for secular therapy for all the people who were harmed. They can do that much, surely?

[Darknight]

I think this has been brought up to bring the Duggars down.

[Jellybeans]

The show was very odd- Derick not there, Jill acting uncomfortable, dagger eyes from the girls, Jim Bob shushing Josh's daughter (hey, hey, hey, tend to your Josie when she's running on countertops) .... do you guys think they knew the news was about to break? I wonder...cuz Anna was holding on to Josh as if that was the last time she would see him...

Edited May 22, 2015 by Jellybeans

[JoanArc]

The show was very odd- Derick not there, Jill acting uncomfortable, dagger eyes from the girls, Jim Bob shushing Josh's daughter (hey, hey, hey, tend to your Josie when she's running on countertops) .... do you guys think they knew the news was about to break? I wonder...cuz Anna was holding on to Josh as if that was the last time she would see him...

Josh said his family is always a phone call or plane ticket away, then Anna cried and said it was because she's pregnant. Nope.

[Darknight]

I'm kinda glad the Duggars got exposed. I mean being gay, having premarital sex, holding hands, kissing, hugging are all sins. Michelle said transgender people wants to molest children. Yet her very own child did it. I'm glad that this brought them down big time. They aren't this perfect christian loving family. Christians can do things like this. I'm feel sad for his victims though. I don't they they will speak out. Maybe JB is blaming them or telling them this will pass over. I hope not. I hope they get therapy. Josh fought so hard with the frc denying gays rights and women abortions. Now he's been exposed.

Edited May 22, 2015 by Darknight

[CofCinci]

Oprah is not a mandated reporter. By 1:17pm that day she had someone on her staff figure out how to report the email they received. Oprah probably receives thousands of emails a day. Without Harpo involvement there would not have been an investigation or a paper trail to the sexual abuse. They went above and beyond because the email could have been easily ignored or deleted.

[BuddyMom]

Mods- I apologize in sdvance if this is the wrong thread for this.

If those of us who have been following the Duggars for years have heard the rumors of "sin in the camp", why is the full story only coming out now in the media?

This family has been all over the TV, magazine covers and social media for the last few years. It's just so strange that it was hidden.

Those poor kids....

[crutchie]

I have to say I feel sad for all the individuals involved, Josh and his sisters.  I point my finger at JB and Michelle for the way they have "parented" their children.  One of things that has erked me since the show began was the courting rules.  No real hugs, kissing, private conservation, etc.  Way to repress your children of their sexuality and natural urges.  In a lot of ways, I saw this coming, the way they conduct relationships is not normal.  I do not condone what Josh did but he was a normal teenage boy with no friends outside of his family to express himself with, no one to talk to.  His parents made him feel shame about what was totally normal for him.  In turn, the girls he was involved with feel that same shame and were probably given the response that they were the ones responsible for it as they must have tempted him.  Total BS in my mind and JB and Michelle should be ashamed of themselves as parents.  As for the statement, "God will forgive."  He may but his sisters as well as Josh will never forget.

 

We knew this train wreck was going to happen, now we will have to wait and see how many more skeletons come out of the closet.

[DoctorWhovian]

14 is too old to not know that this is wrong, don't care what environment you grew up in. All 14 year old boys are sexually frustrated, even if they're already having sex.

 

If the Oprah story is to be believed (they received an email, and reported it), I think Harpo deserves commendation. The report says he turn around time was pretty fast, and they could have used the accusation as interview fodder. But instead, they turned it into police and quietly cancelled the show and most people believed the whole story was a rumor till now.

 

The only sympathy I have for Josh is that he wasn't punished when this happened, whether it was jail time or mandated counseling or community service or anything on court records, so that it could be pointed to now and really go, Yes this happened but I'm sorry for what I did and I was appropriately punished under the law. Other than that, eff him. 

 

But the real monsters are the parents and the community that allowed this to happen. The report seems to be that they waited 3 years before reporting it, and thus it was outside the statute of limitations, so nothing could be done. Seems a bit convenient, no? Either way, they did everything to protect their son instead of his victims/their daughters, and that is disgusting and for that reason, they have everything that is coming to them. The other 18 kids are the real victims here, even the ones who weren't personally victimized, and hopefully they receive real help. 

 

Anna does not have the strength to leave Josh, at least not yet. She will parrot back lines and be the dutiful wife and bury her head in the sand. She probably believes every line Josh feeds her.

 

Any organization, including TLC, that continues to support the Duggars (by which they are supporting the parents who covered this up and failed to protect their children from an abuser), deserves all the derision that comes with it. If I was a family on another show on TLC, I would be horrified to be in this same company.

[crutchie]

I really would like to know as well. If Jill wasn't one of the molested ones, maybe she told Derrick and he told the boy scout brother.  Derrick wasn't at the interview.  I know they said he had dental surgery but I found that strange because he got braces before that.  Typically if you need any dental surgery they do it before getting braces.  Maybe he or his brother did it and didn't want to be around Joshlestor.  Of course I am purely speculating based on the weirdness with Jill that day and Anna as well.  Actually it was weird all around. 

 

I had dental surgery at 19 and it was done while I had braces, about a year and a half after getting them on.  I know others who had similar surgeries all done with braces on so they could be telling the truth.  I didn't see the interview were Josh and Anna there?

[MarysWetBar]

The show was very odd- Derick not there, Jill acting uncomfortable, dagger eyes from the girls, Jim Bob shushing Josh's daughter (hey, hey, hey, tend to your Josie when she's running on countertops) .... do you guys think they knew the news was about to break? I wonder...cuz Anna was holding on to Josh as if that was the last time she would see him...

Absolutely. Also- Derrick and JD not present. .the two who can support themselves financially and not under JBs control. Interesting. Joe away at college i can swallow. Derrick and JD? No way

[charmed1]

I'm just sick at heart over the girls Josh abused. I'm one hundred percent sure they received NO counseling, NO understanding, and no support except from their sisters.

I think their idea of counseling is that Journey to the Heart camp they kept sending Jana to.

Anna used to accompany her father to his prison ministry. I'm sure she's met her fair share of sickos but was taught to hate the sin but love the sinner.

I can definitely see Oprah addressing this on her network. Either by herself, or she'll send Iyanla out to Arkansas with her giant bag of healing props.

Edited May 22, 2015 by charmed1

[3 is enough]

I cannot believe how many people (looking at YOU, Mike Huckabee) are actually DEFENDING Josh and downplaying his despicable behavior.  Making it sound like a minor youthful transgression- hey, kids make mistakes!  No sympathy for the victims.  What the hell is wrong with these so-called "traditional values" advocates.

 

Make no mistake, I hold Jim Bob and Michelle and their horrible parenting and unnatural lifestyle accountable for this.  If Josh had been allowed to date, kiss a few girls, and was left alone to play with himself in the shower like most teenage boys this may not have happened. Surely if masturbation is a sin, fondling your sisters is an even worse one?  And as far as Josh admitting to making "horrible mistakes", well it is only a "mistake" the first time, if it happens again and again it becomes a CHOICE.

 

I am so angry at how the REAL victims are being totally ignored by so many people. 

Edited May 22, 2015 by 3 is enough

[BitterApple]

The masses may be happy about the Duggars' downfall but I'm certainly not. Maybe it's because I've been watching since the beginning, but I feel oddly protective of these kids and don't want their futures destroyed over this. Boob and Michelle are adults and will have to face the music over their poor decision making, but the kids still have to function within their household and Fundie circles. They're already isolated enough, they don't need to be turned into social pariahs because of their brother's actions. It probably sounds illogical but I'm rooting for them and the show to continue.

Edited May 22, 2015 by BitterApple

[hwarner]

Poor Jana. How could her parents let her spend all that time in DC with Josh & Anna? She must have been extremely uncomfortable on the RV trip to visit Anna's sister. The whole situation is sick.

[Darknight]

Mods- I apologize in sdvance if this is the wrong thread for this.

If those of us who have been following the Duggars for years have heard the rumors of "sin in the camp", why is the full story only coming out now in the media?

This family has been all over the TV, magazine covers and social media for the last few years. It's just so strange that it was hidden.

Those poor kids....

A political move. Or maybe a former tlc crew leaked it.

[DollEyes]

  Delurking to say that disgusting is the kindest word to describe Josh, JB & Michelle, whether it's Josh for his crimes, JB & Michelle for covering them up or their bigotry, sanctimony & hypocrisy towards anyone who's not just like them.  This scandal is yet another example of how their ilk have done more damage to marriage, Christianity and family than the LGBT community ever has or will . Those poor girls were basically prisoners- their whole lives they've been told what to do, what to wear, what to say, what to think, have had as little contact with the outside world as possible and were physically, mentally, emotionally and sexually abused as a result.

 

 Worse, JB & Michelle treated the girls, aka the victims, like criminals while making excuses for Josh, the real criminal, using God as an excuse. Worst of all, they did it for money. No amount of money in the world can justify what Josh/JB/Michelle did nor replace what the girls have lost because of it. If I were Anna, I wouldn't want to look at Josh again, much less let him anywhere near me or the kids anytime soon, if ever. As far as I'm concerned, Josh, JB & Michelle shouldn't be trusted with plants, let alone kids.

Edited May 22, 2015 by DollEyes

[Bean421]

A political move. Or maybe a former tlc crew leaked it.

Maybe Frank Sun is finally making his big play for Jana! Step One: Get her off the air.

[Literata]

Not condoning this, but I'm wondering if TLC is trying to find a way around canceling -- not just because the franchise is the network's cash cow, but because of the members of the family who don't suck.

 

I know the powers-that-be would be motivated much more by revenues than by the welfare of a group of kids, but if the family's collective relationship with the crew is any indication, the association seems to have been mutually rewarding for the past decade. I imagine they had a far easier time letting go of the HBB gang.

I feel oddly protective of these kids and don't want their futures destroyed over this. Boob and Michelle are adults and will have to face the music over their poor decision making, but the kids still have to function within their household and Fundie circles. They're already isolated enough, they don't need to be turned into social pariah because of their brother's actions. It probably sounds illogical but I'm rooting for them and the show to continue.

 

I agree. The middles and littles are at enough of a disadvantage simply having Boob and MEchelle as parents, and from Jackson on down, they've never known anything but the cameras and crew. I hate the thought of further isolating them.