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The Duggalos: Jinger and the Holy Goalie

frenchtoast

By frenchtoast
in Counting On

cm-soupsipper
Message added by cm-soupsipper,

Closure Notice: This Thread is now closed due to the name (and much of the posting within it). Please be mindful going forward by naming topics in a way that invites a healthy community conversation. If you name something for a cheap laugh, this thread may be closed later because it encourages discrimination and harm. 

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

I didn't watch Jeremy's video (I just can't) but many religions campaign heavily against Roe v Wade and gay marriage. Politicians frequently sight the Bible when stating their beliefs. Every president that I recall ends his speeches with God bless America. 

I'm pretty sure part of the Fundy scheme is to get into powerful political positions in order to influence policy. Josh worked at FRAC.

Religions and churches have been, and will always, be involved in politics. 

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Spencer Hastings
Spencer Hastings

Tough crowd!  She's wearing modern shoes with closed toes, pants, and a shirt that literally calls back to her family's ridiculous rules and there are still 35 things wrong with what she's doing. 

Churchhoney
Churchhoney

That's okay. He's forgotten it a few times himself. 

GeeGolly
GeeGolly

My push presents after having my kids were my kids. 

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Missy Vixen

Missy Vixen

7 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

Religions and churches have been, and will always, be involved in politics. 

 

They shouldn't be. They have tax-free status and one of the requirements for keeping that non-profit status is to remain apolitical.

If the new building being renovated is a church, hopefully the Holy Goalie is keeping an eye on the construction. Let's just say KJB's cut-rate fell off a truck crap won't go so well if they didn't bother to leave load-bearing walls alone.*

*Got my General Contractor's license from watching 23230948739082 hours of the Property Brothers. It works for the Duggars, doesn't it?

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Absolom

Absolom

The building was made as a four bedroom four bath house.  Whether JB is trying to "restore" it for resale or repurposing it we'll have to wait and see.  Maybe it will be part of an episode next season.

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

(edited)
1 hour ago, Absolom said:

The building was made as a four bedroom four bath house.  Whether JB is trying to "restore" it for resale or repurposing it we'll have to wait and see.  Maybe it will be part of an episode next season.

The FJ expert (I can't get into her links without knowing counties or addresses) also noted: 

Quote

This property and the undeveloped parcel next door were purchased by Duggar Properties, LLC in late 2014. Both parcels were transferred to the revocable living trust in October 2016. Hmm.

This house is also a whopping 10.100 square feet. Plenty of space for large crowds. Hmmm...

Can you transfer a commercial property into a trust? Or can they operate it as a homechurch without it ever being zoned as such? I really have no clue, but I guess if it's not zoned commercial, they get no tax breaks as a church.

Edited by Sew Sumi
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Christina87

Christina87

3 hours ago, Absolom said:

The building was made as a four bedroom four bath house.  Whether JB is trying to "restore" it for resale or repurposing it we'll have to wait and see.  Maybe it will be part of an episode next season.

He is "purposing" to repurpose it into a church! HAHA!

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

(edited)
4 hours ago, Missy Vixen said:

They shouldn't be. They have tax-free status and one of the requirements for keeping that non-profit status is to remain apolitical.

If the new building being renovated is a church, hopefully the Holy Goalie is keeping an eye on the construction. Let's just say KJB's cut-rate fell off a truck crap won't go so well if they didn't bother to leave load-bearing walls alone.*

*Got my General Contractor's license from watching 23230948739082 hours of the Property Brothers. It works for the Duggars, doesn't it?

I was under the impression that churches can't endorse candidates, but can lobby for or against policy changes. 

Edited by GeeGolly
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RazzleberryPie

RazzleberryPie

Churches can't specifically donate or officially endorse particular candidates, or require people to vote a certain way to be a member, but pastors, congregants, etc., can AS PRIVATE CITIZENS endorse and donate to whoever they want. Most of the big denominations do list political stances on major issues (not specific candidates, but platforms) as part of their tenants of faith on 'hot button' issues like abortion, euthanasia, gay rights, etc.

Also - no matter what is officially legal, I'd bet most smaller churches in just about every denomination, ESPECIALLY more conservative evangelical churches and charismatic churches absolutely preach from the pulpit who and how to vote. Since I was a kid, I've heard pastors, visiting evangelists, etc., absolutely 100% preach for or against specific candidates by name. Usually relentlessly and without a lot of factual evidence. It's sickening.

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Missy Vixen

Missy Vixen

25 minutes ago, RazzleberryPie said:

Since I was a kid, I've heard pastors, visiting evangelists, etc., absolutely 100% preach for or against specific candidates by name. Usually relentlessly and without a lot of factual evidence. It's sickening.

 

The last straw for me with my former church was hearing my pastor rail against Planned Parenthood from the pulpit. 

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RazzleberryPie

RazzleberryPie

1 hour ago, Missy Vixen said:

The last straw for me with my former church was hearing my pastor rail against Planned Parenthood from the pulpit. 

I hate political talk from the pulpit, too. Many churches think it's their duty to preach on what they see as protecting God's commands or morality or whatever. 

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Nysha

Nysha

On 11/27/2016 at 7:12 PM, Marigold said:

Looks like a sweet little church but I heard Jeremy try to preach a few sermons on youtube and it was really, really disjointed and disorganized preaching. He had no notes prepared and was just talking for an hour off the top of his head.  

All the more reason to head to Arkansas and preach at the First Church of JimBob - great job security, plus the added benefit of a TLC paycheck.

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

Back to the house/church, I just realized that the timing of when Boob transferred that property to his trust is VERY suspect. Just before the wedding? Hey Jeremy, here's a church for you, right by your wife's family!  See you soon! 

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Nysha

Nysha

21 minutes ago, Lemur said:

 

Well, if Boob really is planning his own megachurch, he's picked two of the least charismatic young men to minister to it.  Seriously. 

 

I don't think Boob's desire is for a megachurch as much as it is to control his adult children's lives. With a church of his own, he's got all three of his current SILs under his 'umbrella'.

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lulu69

lulu69

17 minutes ago, Nysha said:

I don't think Boob's desire is for a megachurch as much as it is to control his adult children's lives. With a church of his own, he's got all three of his current SILs under his 'umbrella'.

I wonder if KJB fancies himself the 'natural' heir to the Gothard empire?  Of course, KJB isn't charismatic & can't preach, enter the preacher SILs (not that they're particularly charismatic or well spoken either lol).

Considering Booob's giant-ass ego & sanctimonious nature, I wouldn't put it past him.

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Zahdii

Zahdii

(edited)
2 hours ago, Lemur said:

Well, if Boob really is planning his own megachurch, he's picked two of the least charismatic young men to minister to it.  Seriously. 

I don't think JB cares about charisma, he only cares if the sermons spout the party line.  The last I heard, when JB last had his own church, it was by invitation only.  If this is indeed a new church for the Duggars, I expect JB to only allow like-minded people and leghumpers who will gladly sit through bad sermons if it means they can bask in the reflected arrogance/holiness that are the Duggar family.

2 hours ago, Nysha said:

I don't think Boob's desire is for a megachurch as much as it is to control his adult children's lives. With a church of his own, he's got all three of his current SILs under his 'umbrella'.

JB may have already struck a deal with his SILs, but if not, I think that at this point only Ben and Jessa are on board right now.  Jeremy might agree to move to AR if it means he's the head preacher, but I bet JB will still go over the sermons to make sure they're Duggar friendly.  Derick might come on board if JB offers to fund Dericks mission work, especially if SOS Ministries aren't thrilled with how poorly Jill handled the Danger America posting.

2 hours ago, DangerousMinds said:

A megachurch in a 4-bedroom house?

Sew Sumi says that that house is over 10,000 sq ft.  I'm sure she's checked her sources, so I'm going with that number.  Anyway, there is an article online that says that a church of 300 or more members, each parishioner needs 12-24 sq ft, depending on the floor plan of the church.  If the floor plan is favorable, the building in question could easily fit more than 500 people.

Actually, the article seems to devote more room to parking than anything else.  I guess if this 'house' has an insanely large parking lot, we'll know what's up.

2 hours ago, riverblue22 said:

Seems like it would be easier to turn the TTH house into a church.  No neighbors, industrial kitchen, rooms upstairs to use as classrooms.  And that nice big waiting room they have right in the center

JB spent the majority of his marriage living in small houses owned by other people until he was able to get into the TTH.  Once he realized he wasn't going to be a big time politician, but he could still get lots of attention by breeding an ever growing family and getting his own TV show, he was happy to let TLC complete construction and furnish the TTH.  I don't think he'll easily move out again, as the TTH probably represents some kind of 'win' in his book.

Edited by Zahdii
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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

2 hours ago, DangerousMinds said:

A megachurch in a 4-bedroom house?

It IS a 10,000 square foot place, and he bought an empty lot next door. Plenty of room for expansion, but for now he can easily fit his former congregation in it if he blows out most of the framing and hires a real engineer to place steel beams to carry the load of a mostly open space (I bet they'd keep the kitchen). 

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

I couldn't read all of it. I imagine this is a sermon. Will this be the direction of the blog, just his voice (preaching) and nothing of Jinger?  I was hoping we'd get to know her better through social media, but that seems less and less likely now. Why out yourself out there for free when there's a monetized blog to bring in some much-needed cash? Yes, they have money from the People spread, but that probably paid for the honeymoon, at least in part. I can't see them making more than $5k/episode for the ones in which they are the Feature. Maybe double for the wedding. Decent for now, but focus will be on Joy and Jessa's birth soon enough. 

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Marigold

Marigold

1. I skimmed Jeremy's post, didn't deep read it.  Seems Jeremy can write pretty well! Maybe he can tutor Ben? 

2. Re: the building/church speculation for Jeremy.  That building was a house? Looked commercial to me. Wow. I thought it was an old library or old church.

3. Is Jeremy actually Pastor Vuolo? 

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Absolom

Absolom

Yes, the building is a house.  It's listed with four bedrooms and four baths.  It's actually a 4800 plus square foot house with over 5000 square feet of basement. 

Jeremy does have much better writing skills than anyone else in the family.  Perhaps we won't be assaulted by horrible grammar with him.

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Missy Vixen

Missy Vixen

5 hours ago, Zahdii said:

The last I heard, when JB last had his own church, it was by invitation only.  If this is indeed a new church for the Duggars, I expect JB to only allow like-minded people and leghumpers who will gladly sit through bad sermons if it means they can bask in the reflected arrogance/holiness that are the Duggar family.

 

 

Two words, and I know you all probably think I'm nuts on this topic: 

MANDATORY REPORTERS. KJB can't allow just anyone to attend his brand-new church, if that's what it is, and thanks to Sew Sumi for the mad research ninja skills.

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OpieTaylor

OpieTaylor

9 hours ago, DangerousMinds said:

A megachurch in a 4-bedroom house?

If it's not going to be a church, perhaps Boob saw an opportunity to get a really large place for his ever-expanding family. If all the married kids are going to have unlimited kids, they're going to need big houses. A couple of the married families could even share this big house, but then that could get weird - temptation could develop between the various spouses (such as Jessa-Jeremy, Bin-Jinger, etc.).

Or it could be that Boob is going to fix up this ginormous house, sell it, and try to make a big profit off of it.

I'm rooting for it to be a church though! I think that'll be the most intriguing plot line.

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

The weird thing is that Boob bought the place in 2014. Smuggar was in his glory in DC, and at the time, only Jessa was courting, and that didn't even happen until September. He had the house in a Duggar LLC. It was moved to the Duggar Trust this year, so he's not selling it. It COULD be a remodel for the Smugs, but the renovations looked a lot more intensive than a new kitchen. And who needs FIVE bathrooms (and 2 half-baths)? I saw the house on Google Earth (can't post here because of street names). It's shaped like a horseshoe; it was definitely a custom build. It's also curious that Boob also bought the empty lot next door. Both lots are almost 3 acres. Is Boob going to build a mini compound there? But who would be its leader? Smuggar certainly can't be trusted in this position. Are they going to finally get Jessa out of the Mold House and move JinJer into it, or use it as enticement to move from the tiny apartment in Laredo? 

Yeah, a lot of questions about who gets the place if they continue to use it as a residential property. 

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BitterApple

BitterApple

Maybe Jessa will get the renovated house and Babe and Cringe will move into the Mold House? Jessa claims she doesn't want a lot of square footage, but Jana's still unmarried and available to clean, so it shouldn't be a problem. I'm guessing whatever arrangement Boob has with Austin's father entails Joy becoming an indentured servant at Family Camp, so she's out. Maybe it's a reward for Joshie for good behavior?

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Barb23

Barb23

9 hours ago, Zahdii said:

I don't think JB cares about charisma, he only cares if the sermons spout the party line.  The last I heard, when JB last had his own church, it was by invitation only.  If this is indeed a new church for the Duggars, I expect JB to only allow like-minded people and leghumpers who will gladly sit through bad sermons if it means they can bask in the reflected arrogance/holiness that are the Duggar family.

 

Don't forget the leghumpers may also sit thru a bad sermon because of the pot luck lunch afterwards.  Even when they had church in that small rancher house, they made room for the food.  I'm sure the after service  lunch is a must have for JB.

I wonder how one gets admittance to the Holy Church of the Duggars.  Is there a secret handshake or code word (like Gothard spelled backwards)? How did the Seewalds get in so Ben could meet Jessa? Or did they all go to a regular church then?

How close is the renovated church/house to the TTH & other Duggar properties?  I think it has that motel lodge look from the 60's & 70's.

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

(edited)

It's in Springdale, but on the other side of town, through Tontitown. Just a little over 11 miles. Remember, the Duggars live on the very fringe of civilization out there by the dump. The Mold House in Fayetteville is MUCH closer to the TTH. I think I remember maybe 4 miles? Jill lived at the McMansion in Rogers, which is even farther out than this new development, and she still managed to remain under her father's spell. 

And yes,this place was built in 1971. It looks like an upscale version of the Brady's house. Ah, 70's architecture, the decade of the circular (or in this case half circle) house! LOL

Edited by Sew Sumi
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SpaghettiTuesdays

SpaghettiTuesdays

On 11/29/2016 at 8:24 PM, Absolom said:

Churches are, indeed, supposed to stay out of politics in the US.

Jeremy's parents were shown visiting Laredo.  However, as far as I can tell they have never lived there, but always lived in the Philadelphia/NJ areas and his father's current church seems to be in Maryland.

Jim Bob's family is currently attending another small IFB church. 

If it's in MD, I'll stake it out. I live in the beautiful state and I enjoy stalking "celebrities''.

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

I looked it up. I guess if they live in a southwestern suburb, it wouldn't be a horrible drive. Now it makes sense that they only havve Sunday night worship once a month. The website also says they minister to the Amish in Lancaster County which is to the west of Philly. Maybe there's a shortcut road between where the Amish are to the church? Otherwise, man, what a drive. I guess it's also possible that the Vuolos have moved to the exurbs after the kids all moved out. The house looked pretty 1950's/60's ranch from what we could see of it, but who knows when suburban Philly became exurban? Was it that early? 

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funky-rat

funky-rat

(edited)

Extremely tardy to the party - Had a few catastrophes over the summer and I'm just getting caught up.  I'm only on page 23, so I'm going to probably leave my quotes/comments in chunks that encompassed a number of pages.

On ‎7‎/‎2‎/‎2016 at 2:42 PM, Arwen Evenstar said:

Jessa and Bin went to Europe for theirs. No idea where they spent their wedding night, nor Jill and Derick.  We know Josh and Anna went to some nasty place in glorious Putnam County and we saw her schlepping their luggage in. No idea of their honeymoon, unless that was their honeymoon. 

Josh and Anna had a honeymoon somewhere down south at some beach.  They did an episode on it.  The only part I really remember is some thing they signed up to do called "Sleeping With The Sharks".  It involved sleeping in an aquarium, under the walk-through shark tank.  They lasted an hour before leaving.  They never really said why, other than something like "It's not for us".  So lame.

On ‎7‎/‎24‎/‎2016 at 2:22 PM, Kokapetl said:

At some place called "The Shady Maple". Ceiling tiles and chandeliers.

ETA: apparently Amish themed!?

ETA2: they had discounts for people with a gastric bypass!?

13735739_961708063928003_320485859220281

On ‎7‎/‎24‎/‎2016 at 2:30 PM, Churchhoney said:

Must be meet-the-fam time in PA. Complete with Pennsylvania Dutch cooking (Hope I don't offend anybody, but to me most of it tastes like pouring a sack of lard-imbued flour down your throat.)    

Anyway, nothing says "the general public views my new parents-in-law as incredibly toxic people" like featuring dumb-ass Bin in your online meet-the-fam photo album. http://www.shady-maple.com/about-us

Shady Maple is a hugely popular tourist trap masquerading as a legit place to get good PA Dutch food.  I've been there.  It's "meh".  Like Golden Corral on steroids, but the thing is that they have this huge buffet area with lots of stations, but the food just repeats over and over, so it's very deceiving.  It's really expensive for what you get.  Mr. Funky has an aunt and cousins who swear by it, but to me, it's just mass produced stuff.  I'm not offended by the comment on PA Dutch food, but I would venture to say you've never had good honest PA Dutch food.  To me, Shady Maple is to PA Dutch food as Red Lobster is to quality fresh seafood.  ETA:  Many buffet places give discounts to Gastric Bypass people.  They get a card from the hospital that they show at the restaurant.  They only have to pay for a kid's portion because they presumably don't eat much, and should just be having a bite or two of any given item.

On ‎7‎/‎24‎/‎2016 at 2:36 PM, GeeGolly said:

And they have a mission statement:

For more than 40 years Shady Maple has been a company based on faith in God, commitment to community and value to our customer. Our Values are the roots of who we are. Our Vision is rooted in our values. Our Mission is our behavior based on our value and vision.

And raking in as much cash as they possibly can without giving quality product in return.  Their gift shop sells religious nick-nacks, and stuff like that, and busses of church folks turn up in droves to support a "Good Christian Business".  Meh.

On ‎7‎/‎25‎/‎2016 at 7:52 PM, Lady Edith said:

Wow...not a cheap place to eat, by a long shot.  And it's a buffet?  I thought Lancaster was an inexpensive place to visit.  And they sure do have their refund policy down pat, don't they?  Must have experienced a lot of cheaters.  

Shady Maple isn't in Lancaster.  It's in the middle of nowhere (literally).  It's closer to Reading than Lancaster.  And because it's considered a "destination", they charge for it.  To be fair, it's usually under $20 (except for breakfast, which is cheaper yet), unless you go on a seafood night, but that's even stretching it in my opinion because of the quality.  We have a local buffet place that does better quality food but not near the variety that charges $24.99 and it's always jammed, but again, quality over quantity.  When we go to the local place, we generally just order off the menu and only do the buffet on special occasions.  The food at smorgasbord places tends to be cheaper in Lancaster because there is a lot of competition.  Places like Plain & Fancy, Hershey Farms, Miller's, etc.  For my money, Miller's is the best.  They charge a bit more - $23.95 (cheaper for breakfast), but the food is extremely good and beats the pants off of Shady Maple, and they often have good coupons that take the cost down to about $20, and your meal in the month of your birthday is free.  They take reservations for groups, and if it's your birthday or anniversary, they give you a free small cake - it's really cool.  And they make everything from scratch, and use the same recipes they've been using since the 20's.  It's touristy, but not so tacky.  Hershey Farms is not good.  Nothing there is homemade.  Plain & Fancy is owned by Miller's, but is served family style instead of buffet.  The absolute best place to get good authentic PA Dutch food was a place in Intercourse (yeah, I know) called Stoltzfus's.  It was a farm house outside of town where you could see the Mennonite ladies cooking in the kitchen.  It was $15 a head, I believe, but it was served family style - all you could eat.  It was amazing, and the family owns a meat market - everything came out of their farms.  Sadly, it was in a bad location, and they were closed Sundays and holidays, so they didn't keep it open long.  It's still there, but they rent it out for weddings and special occasions.

On ‎7‎/‎26‎/‎2016 at 2:26 PM, Sew Sumi said:

Can someone make heads or tails of what Park they were at in either Wyckoff, NJ? It's a suburb of NYC, so these have to be just fan pics. But why would they be there?

It's actually the Midland Park American Legion in Midland Park NJ.  I recognized the logo on the carpet - my Dad was a commander for a number of years.

 

On ‎8‎/‎1‎/‎2016 at 0:09 AM, riverblue22 said:

The ministers you all are talking about went to seminary.  They studied the ministry and didn't try to wing it.

I came across another example of this amateurism in ministry.  I saw an old acquaintance whose son struggled to graduate from a small, Christian college with a degree in athletic training.  I asked what he was doing now and she told me he decided to go into the ministry.  When I asked what seminary he was attending, she said he wasn't going to go to seminary, he was working as a minister at a small Baptist church.  So here is another case of a 22 year old heading off to his ministry work with no experience to speak of.

My favorite minister ever is one who came to ministry later than most.  He heard the call after a divorce, and kicking addictions.  He got his life together, remarried, and took a leap of faith.  I was at his ordination - he was in his early 40's.  I love to hear him speak because it's from the heart.  He can relate to a lot of the trials and tribulations, and redemption - and he has a great sense of humor.  Our region office moved him away and to another church, and we miss him, but it's too far for us to attend on any regular basis, but we do go a few times a year and then have dinner afterward with him and his wife.  The pastor at the church we currently attend (it's not the one where the pastor we loved was - the parishioners there left a lot to be desired) is great, but this is his first assignment after graduating seminary, and he loses me sometimes, but he's still a good speaker and will gain strength in time.  He has a lot of good ideas and thoughts, and that's half the battle.

On ‎8‎/‎4‎/‎2016 at 7:48 PM, Jeeves said:

Fundies generally do *not* dance. I am sure that hell will freeze over before there is dancing at a Duggar daughter wedding reception. Derick was performing a skit for Christ so whatever kind of dancing he did was part of that. 

I remember seeing "Jesus Camp" (and being extremely scared by it - gave me flashbacks to a church I once attended and then couldn't run away from fast enough) and being surprised the kids in that movie were dancing, but then the one young girl said that they were "Dancing for the spirit, not the flesh, so it was OK".  I recall being sad that a girl that young would even have knowledge of such a thing.

Edited by funky-rat
Incomplete thought
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Marigold

Marigold

2 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

I looked it up. I guess if they live in a southwestern suburb, it wouldn't be a horrible drive. Now it makes sense that they only havve Sunday night worship once a month. The website also says they minister to the Amish in Lancaster County which is to the west of Philly. 

They minister to the Amish??????????????????? 

My goodness, Derick ministers to the Catholics and Vuolo dad ministers to the Amish?  

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Missy Vixen

Missy Vixen

On 12/1/2016 at 2:06 PM, Kokapetl said:

Jimbob isn't an ordained minister, so I don't think he has any mandatory reporting obligations. 

KJB may not be a mandatory reporter, but others showing up at a non-"home church" will be.

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Lady Edith

Lady Edith

(edited)

Amish and Mennonites are separate sects...kind of.  The simplest way to explain it is that the Amish are, well, Amish.  The Mennonites are kind of like Amish light, with similar religious practices but different societal practices.  For example, Amish don't own cars, technology or have electricity or phones in their homes.  Mennonites do own cars and cell phones and most have indoor plumbing and electricity in their homes.  They do folllw a strict dress code (they mostly wear similarly styled plain dresses in pastel colors) and (like the Amish) the women do not cut their hair or leave home without a head covering.  At least that's what the Mennonites who live near my family's cabin do.

Edited by Lady Edith
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Absolom

Absolom

The Mennonites near me dress like most people I know, have jobs, and their houses are the same as everyone else.  They simply go to a Mennonite church.  I have seen the more plain dressing Mennonites, but they don't all seem to be of that belief.

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Marigold

Marigold

14 minutes ago, Missy Vixen said:

KJB may not be a mandatory reporter, but others showing up at a non-"home church" will be.

I'm not following you. 

If Jim Bob bought that building and wanted to hire Jeremy as a pastor, where does the mandatory reporter fit in? 

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Missy Vixen

Missy Vixen

13 minutes ago, Marigold said:

I'm not following you. 

If Jim Bob bought that building and wanted to hire Jeremy as a pastor, where does the mandatory reporter fit in? 

 

If the Holy Goalie is employed as a pastor at any church in Arkansas, he's a mandated reporter. (I was using the wrong term.)

https://www.rainn.org/pdf-files-and-other-documents/Public-Policy/Legal-resources/2009-Mandatory-Report/Arkansas09C.pdf

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cm-soupsipper
Message added by cm-soupsipper,

Closure Notice: This Thread is now closed due to the name (and much of the posting within it). Please be mindful going forward by naming topics in a way that invites a healthy community conversation. If you name something for a cheap laugh, this thread may be closed later because it encourages discrimination and harm. 

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