The Star Wars Saga

[Joe]

She has become one with the Force.

[starri]

Edited December 27, 2016 by starri

[anna0852]

I have a terrible feeling that Kylo is going to commit matricide.

[starri]

14 minutes ago, Joe said:

She has become one with the Force.

Well, that made me choke out a sob.

[ulkis]

15 minutes ago, anna0852 said:

I have a terrible feeling that Kylo is going to commit matricide.

I really hope they don't do that. There are a couple of options I think they have available but I don't want to discuss them today.

Edited December 27, 2016 by ulkis

[MrsR]

Sigh. Sadness abounds.

[Spartan Girl]

[StaceyNotStacie]

4 hours ago, anna0852 said:

I have a terrible feeling that Kylo is going to commit matricide.

I hope this doesn't happen. At this point they should just kill both Luke and Leia off and have Rey see a hologram vision of a young L&L and Han at the end of Episode 9 similar to the end of Episode 6. 

[starri]

I'm hoping they don't kill her.  I would prefer they do what Furious 7 did with Paul Walker.  Give Leia a happy ending with some movie magic.

[anna0852]

I think the options are very limited and that a large segment of the fan base is going to start screaming no matter what. According to Vanity Fair she had finished filming her parts of Episode 8 and depending on how that story played out, Lucasfilm is going to have some very tough decisions to make. And unfortunately someone over there has the very unhappy task of starting that ball rolling. I don't envy them that task. 

Edited December 28, 2016 by anna0852

[Morrigan2575]

I don't even know how they begin to do it. Sadly, I just can't see Leia giving up the fight and retiring, especially after losing Han and Ben (it counts). The Rebels/Resistance is all she has left. I think the only real solution is to kill of Princess Leia ?. Of course the how is the question. Do they go back and reshoot some scenes, use CGI and kill her on screen? Do they add her death to the Episode 9 Crawl? 

I don't even want to think about, I feel real bad for the people at Disney, Bad Robot and I guess Lucasfilm.

Edited December 28, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[Ronin Jackson]

I think they should just put it in the Episode 9 crawl and give Luke and Kylo their moment to grieve or recognize it. No more CGI Leia.

[ulkis]

I would be okay with another actress playing Leia to wrap it up, especially if she doesn't have a large role. It feels more fitting to me to have Leia's storyline wrapped up the way it was intended to wrap up than unceremoniously killing her off-screen and just dropping it off in the opening crawl.

but I'm sure people are as opposed to that as opposed as I feel to Leia's son turning to the dark side, then killing the love of her life, then her being killed off. Like @anna0852 said, a lot of people are going to be screaming no matter what, and I don't envy them either (the people at the studio who have to make the decision, I mean).

Edited December 28, 2016 by ulkis

[methodwriter85]

I honestly wouldn't be unopposed to a recast. I know it's verboten, but they did it with Harry Potter. I could see Melissa Leo in the part.

[Joe]

1 hour ago, ulkis said:

I would be okay with another actress playing Leia to wrap it up, especially if she doesn't have a large role. It feels more fitting to me to have Leia's storyline wrapped up the way it was intended to wrap up than unceremoniously killing her off-screen and just dropping it off in the opening crawl.

Yes, I'd prefer this too.

[Ronin Jackson]

I can't imagine they'd consider recasting the role. As Carrie herself put it, when she first got the call that she got the part, she had never been Princess Leia before, and she would never not be Princess Leia again. For her becoming Princess Leia forever came with a lot of baggage, and she spent many years coming to terms with that. And she did. And now Princess Leia cannot not be Carrie Fisher.

Dumbledore was too integral a character not to recast. It was not a character that was originated by Richard Harris playing him and Harris had only been known in the role for two years. This is something different. Princess Leia became known to the world as Carrie Fisher and they've been known together for 40 years. 

It does depend on how involved the character was meant to be but somehow, even with her being Kylo Ren's mother and all, I don't think they ever planned to get the character much more than ceremonially involved in the new trilogy. And because this happened between episodes, they have the opportunity to change the story to account for the character being gone. As much as it it possible, I think this is the simplest and most tactful way of handling it.

[Jediknight]

9 hours ago, questionfear said:

I think you might get your wish, considering that I just read that Disney actually ASKED for the darker ending to Rogue One...the writers originally thought Disney wouldn't let them, and wrote in a happier ending, but Disney came back and said "Uh, that makes no sense...just stick the landing here." So maybe we really will get full-on unredeemably evil Ren.

And in Force Awakens we were introduced to Rey, and Finn, both came from harsh backgrounds, yet they turned out good.  They had darkness in their pasts and tragedy, but they rose above it.  Hell, Poe's mother died when he was a child, and he rose above that tragedy.  They'll stick with the story that sometimes great people come from horrible backgrounds and rise above it all, and that sometimes a horrible person comes from a loving background.

As has been said multiple times, Kylo is a school/mass shooter.

[ulkis]

8 hours ago, Ronin Jackson said:

It does depend on how involved the character was meant to be but somehow, even with her being Kylo Ren's mother and all, I don't think they ever planned to get the character much more than ceremonially involved in the new trilogy. And because this happened between episodes, they have the opportunity to change the story to account for the character being gone. As much as it it possible, I think this is the simplest and most tactful way of handling it.

Well, if they really feel like they can't use another actress or a cgi Leia, I'd prefer she just be absent from episode 9 and they can add in an epilogue that she died after the new republic was re-established. I suppose she can die in battle and that would be appropriate too but honestly, then I would want some sort of hope for Ben/Kylo Ren at least. Maybe not full on redemption but like I said in the Force Awakens thread, maybe he goes wandering the galaxy seeking repentance. Perhaps redeeming him even a little bit is cliche, but if it is, I'll admit to wanting it.

I'm not someone who thinks the main characters have to go on and on. One of the main reasons I thought the extended alternate universe books were kinda annoying was that 40, 50 years later after ROTJ the main trio didn't really seem to relinquish the main action to the next generation. But the sequel trilogy concluding with Han, Luke and Leia as force ghosts a la Anakin, Yoda, and Obi-Wan doesn't seem quite right, unless they say it's 20 years later or something.

Well, as weird as it is to think about I'm sure they did already discuss this possibilty when they decided to include the original cast.

Edited December 28, 2016 by ulkis

[stealinghome]

I'd be firmly against a recast. There are ways to keep Leia off-screen that don't have to involve killing off the character. I hope they go that route--just refer to what she's doing without ever seeing her.

[starri]

StarWars.com put up an incredibly lovely obituary and basically says there's no Leia without Carrie.  So no recast, I don't think.

[Spartan Girl]

Just don't have Leia die of a broken heart like Padme. Ugh.

[Morrigan2575]

You can't recast Princess Leia (sorry). Totally opposed to that idea.

The crawl is the easiest to do and probably the easiest (on me) emotionally but, it also cheats the character.

A quick CGI scene or a combination of cut scenes and a CGI death might be the right way to go. 

I don't know it's all so sad to think about. 

[ulkis]

11 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

Just don't have Leia die of a broken heart like Padme. Ugh.

Oh, they would never. Not with anyone besides Lucas in charge. And probably not even him. 

Edited December 28, 2016 by ulkis

[Skyline]

For those hoping Disney kills off Kylo I fear you'll be disappointed. Rey isn't a Skywalker and someone has to continue the line. Kylo will most likely be redeemed. 

[anna0852]

No one has proved yet that Rey *isn't* a Skywalker. And if Kylo is the last, then maybe it is time to end the line.

[MrsR]

Ugh. What a dilemma.  

They won't recast.

As guilty as we all felt when the news came and we thought, "Shit what about the movie?" they must be overwhelmed. 

 

When she first appeared in TFA and she was so changed and considering her history, I wondered if they had a contingency plan.

 

 

"

[VCRTracking]

I think Leia should die offscreen. It's been done before.

Shakespeare also did it with Falstaff in Henry V. There's stuff you can criticize about the Gilmore Girls Netflix revival but not how they handled the death of Lorelei's father Richard whose actor Edward Herriman died two years ago. He was such an important character to the show and is such a loss but Amy Sherman-Palladino handled it very well.  They his importance and how his death effected the other characters especially his now widowed wife Emily. His memory was felt throughout the four movies. Episode IX could open with Leia's funeral and someone (hopefully Luke) talking about her final moments.

[slowpoked]

19 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

I honestly wouldn't be unopposed to a recast. I know it's verboten, but they did it with Harry Potter. I could see Melissa Leo in the part.

I would be against a recast. Carrie Fisher as Princess Leia is just so...iconic, and timeless. It's hard to see anyone else but her. Harry Potter and Hunger Games recasts were done with lesser iconic characters whose actors weren't as attached to the character for decades, like Carrie/Princess Leia.

RIP Carrie Fisher. You were the first badass chick I watched and remembered on a movie.

Edited December 29, 2016 by slowpoked

[ulkis]

9 hours ago, VCRTracking said:

Shakespeare also did it with Falstaff in Henry V. There's stuff you can criticize about the Gilmore Girls Netflix revival but not how they handled the death of Lorelei's father Richard whose actor Edward Herriman died two years ago. He was such an important character to the show and is such a loss but Amy Sherman-Palladino handled it very well.  They his importance and how his death effected the other characters especially his now widowed wife Emily. His memory was felt throughout the four movies. Episode IX could open with Leia's funeral and someone (hopefully Luke) talking about her final moments.

I think that's apples and oranges though. Richard was elderly, and he left a family legacy where no one became a murderer and his wife hadn't been killed by their daughter. You (the generic you, not you specifically, VCRTracking) can say that a free galaxy is Leia's legacy but it feels depressing as hell that Leia had so many burdens and losses before she died. I mean, they can go that route but I think Han being killed by his own son is already grimness enough for the entire trilogy.

I think @stealinghome 's suggestion is probably the best way to go.

Edited December 29, 2016 by ulkis

[SimoneS]

Debbie Reynolds has died. She apparently had a stroke. I can only imagine how difficult it must have been on her to lose her daughter. My condolences to their family and friends.

[Frost]

Poor Todd Fisher.  He lost his sister and his mother one day apart.

[Morrigan2575]

3 minutes ago, Frost said:

Poor Todd Fisher.  He lost his sister and his mother one day apart.

I was thinking of Billie Lourde but yeah, poor Todd and Billie. This is just so sad, how horrible for that family.

[MrsR]

Wow. Somewhat expected but not so soon.

Those girls, they had such a bond. Couldn't bear to bury her daughter.

[starri]

I don't know what you'll think of me saying this, but since it seemed like it was about to be Debbie's time anyway, I'm glad she didn't have to be without Carrie for too long.

"If you lose a spouse, you're called a widow, or a widower.  If you're a child and lose your parents, then you're an orphan.  But what's the word to describe a parent who loses a child?  I guess that's just too fucking awful to even have a name."

[Macbeth]

Well shit.  I was expecting Carrie to die once I heard she had a major heart attack, but I cried when I heard about Debbie.  Debbie and Carrie lived right next to each other.  They were so close.  I am heart broken.  Poor Todd and Billie.... and Gary - I know he's a dog, but he will be grieving as well - He lost his mother and his grandmother too.

[pennben]

As I've seen in a few tweets, and thought to myself when I heard the news......of course Debbie couldn't let Carrie have the limelight even in death!!!  I say that with a big laugh because it is such a part of their story together...the back/forth, push/pull competition part of their relationship.

How horribly sad to have lost them both in two days, but strangely appropriate that Debbie would not want to live without Carrie, they became so close and seemingly co-dependent in the last decade or so.

[Danny Franks]

Recast Princess Leia? I really don't know how I'd feel about that. But then, I'll feel pretty crappy about any other potential solution that's been mentioned as well. Leia dying? Offscreen? I don't want that either.

Unless they somehow knew she was in poor health and wrote her role in Episode VIII accordingly, then they're in a really tricky position. No matter what they decide to do, people won't like it. Because what people would really like is for Carrie Fisher to be alive.

I can't imagine how awful this is for the family, and especially Billie Lourde, Carrie's only child. They must have been so close, and twenty four is no age to lose a parent.

[CofCinci]

With Star Wars as a billion dollar product and Fisher's history of relapse, I wouldn't be surprised if they prefilmed as much as they can with her. 

[SnoGirl]

34 minutes ago, CofCinci said:

With Star Wars as a billion dollar product and Fisher's history of relapse, I wouldn't be surprised if they prefilmed as much as they can with her. 

If they didn't, I'm sure they are wishing they did now.

I'm torn. I don't want them to recast AND I don't want them to change Leia's story. Carrie Fisher is Leia, and for her not to be able to finish the story is tragic. And on the other hand, Leia was a game-changer for girls. A warrior who fought for what was right even though she could have easily been just a damsel. To die off-screen, ugh. Leia deserves better. I'm torn in the worse way, and I don't envy whoever has to make the final decision. My geeky heart is broken with the loss of Fisher.

I hated that they killed off Solo, and now I'm wondering if Disney is also kicking themselves for that. I wonder if Luke is going to make it out of the story alive now. Or if they'll do reshoots to VIII to write out Leia. 

After this year, I wonder if studios will change how they shoot giant blockbusters with older actors. 

[Lugal]

To lose both Carrie and Debbie one day apart.  My heart goes out to their family.

Carrie's had this part with all its ups and downs for the last 40 years.  I don't think they could recast, even if they wanted to, due to fan outrage alone.  They might be busy recutting Episode VIII to set up for why she's not in Episode IX.

[ketchuplover]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_4FbS4mT5E

[BetterButter]

LEIA ORGANA: A CRITICAL OBITUARY

[Morrigan2575]

I saw on Access Hollywood that fans made her a star for the Hollywood Walk of Fame and others around the country were holding Lightsaber Vigils last night. This is all so sad.

[Perfect Xero]

Before all this happened I was already expecting either Luke or Leia (or both) to be taken out of the story by the end of Episode VIII so that the story in Episode IX would fall on the new generation.

If they did already kill Leia in Ep8 it's going to be tough to watch.

[maraleia]

I'm still a mess over Carrie and now Debbie's deaths. How in the world are they going to do episode 9 because based on what Carrie said she was slated to be in that movie. I fell down the rabbit hole and watched all of her press tour and convention appearances and other videos on youtube. She was so damn talented and deserved at least 10 if not 20 years left on earth. I hate 2016 so damn much and 2017 doesn't look to get any better.

[InsertWordHere]

7 hours ago, SnoGirl said:

I hated that they killed off Solo, and now I'm wondering if Disney is also kicking themselves for that. I wonder if Luke is going to make it out of the story alive now. 

I've been thinking the same. I wouldn't even mind a soap operatic return from the dead for Han Solo now. Alas, even if they wanted to do it, they'd have to get Ford to go along, and I doubt he would. They went pretty far to have him be most completely dead what with the stabbing and the fall and the explosion. And if he did come back, there will be no Leia for him to return to.

As for Luke, I can't imagine them killing him until at least the final act of Episode IX now. I know there was speculation he would be the Yoda figure of this trilogy and die either at the end of VIII or beginning of IX but I really can't see them doing that after what's happened. If Luke did die in what they filmed for Episode VIII, I would have to think they would reshoot and change it. I do wonder if they will shoot as many key scenes with Hamill as they can early on in IX's filming, just in case, and I feel awful even speculating about that. 

Beyond Leia's ultimate fate, which I find hard to guess at without knowing what happens in VIII, I am mostly hoping that a scene between Leia and Luke was filmed for VIII and wasn't meant to be a part of IX. I was already sad we didn't get a Han and Luke reunion and the lack of a Luke and Leia moment would be obviously worse because of the real life factor. I also wonder if there was a confrontation over Han's death filmed for VIII between Kylo Ren and Leia. The setup is so obviously there but it might have been planned for Episode IX instead.

It's possible that Leia was already slated to be killed off in VIII which would of course be the easiest way for them to go, but it would awfully hard to watch. At the same time, as much as I don't want the character to go, a planned death for VIII that had nothing to do with the real life actress' death would lessen my feelings of regret that we will most like not be seeing Leia's story play out how it was intended to be played out. I honestly wouldn't mind if they told us ahead of time what their original intention had been, even if the whole thing will have to be changed. 

I am still so heartbroken over this in a way I have never been over any other celebrity death. I tear up every time I see an image of Debbie and Carrie. 

[ulkis]

I don't want either, either, but  I feel like recasting would be the best solution. I feel kinda awkward saying this, but for future generations watching the movies, I don't think it would be as jarring, since so much time passed between the original and sequel trilogies anyway. 

But then, for future generations watching the movies, to them it probably won't feel as crappy for Han, Luke, and Leia to fail and be killed off any more or less than it did when it happened to Anakin or Yoda.

So in short, I hope they don't make a decision on what may or may not cause the most fan outrage. 

[anna0852]

Short of Leia already having been slated to die in Episode 8 (as in, planned and shot, not a hasty recut) there really is no good solution. 

[Schweedie]

For me, I think the best option would be to have her appear through some kind of media, so to speak - as a hologram, or on screen through video conferences of sorts. CGI-ing her that way might be less disturbing, and would allow for her looking somewhat distorted. I don't think I could bear to see her recast, but I also don't want the terrible sort of CGI we saw in Rogue One.

[ulkis]

Quote

The "too much Vader in him" line was way too stupid for Leia to say, though. I'll bet she blames herself (and Han) for failings in Ben's upbringing rather than some mythical sins-of-the-fathers gene that skips generations.

@Bruinsfan, that's true. But then doesn't she say right after that line, "that's why I sent him to Luke"? So it sounds like she's sort of agreeing. Either way though imo it sounded weird coming from Han.