S32.E05: The Devils We Know

[Ms Blue Jay]

I'm clearly in the minority here, but I am enjoying this season for the most part.  I think/hope Peter and Nick are being given the Drew edit, and we will see some beautiful downfalls in the upcoming weeks.  I don't necessarily like a lot of the players but I'm not getting a visceral "make it go AWAY" reaction like I was with Dan and Will from any of them.  And for me, almost any Survivor is better than no Survivor.

 

Very much feel like you.  And I'm really enjoying this season, far better than That One with Dan, and That One with the Amazing Race Twins (nothing against those twins; I like them, but god, what an awful season.)

 

While I still kind of like a lot of people left in the game...Debbie doesn't bother me, Neal doesn't bother me, most of beauty except Nick seems nice, etc...there isn't anyone in the game who I like as much as I liked Jeremy last year.

 

Ha!!  Forget just Jeremy, there isn't anyone I like more than Jeremy, Spencer, and Woo!  Although I think I prefer Tai over Joe.   Maybe even Peih-Gee too.  But they are all close.  But yeah, I also don't mind most of the cast.  If I'm REALLY being honest, I don't mind any of the cast except Kyle Jason, and how Scot is when he's around Kyle Jason.  (Is it Jason Kyle?)   (I don't care.)

 

Had no idea Cydney went to UPenn. She must be smart then, but doesn't seem particularly socially smart.

 

I never held the impression that Ivy Leaguers were seen as socially smart anyway.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Ms Blue Jay

[Bryce Lynch]

Glad you asked! For me it was he spent the first two episodes talking smack about the "old" people behind their backs ..clearly biased against their age and they have NO CLUE he's not really a nice person and they have even aligned with him...and then there is his stupid bow tie and pants....I hate SURVIVOR contestants who have to bring some sort of schtick to the show...be it Russel's hats, the dimbulb ice cream scooper and his yellow shirt or Colby "I'm such a Texan I brought the Lone Star flag".

In this case I think I'd give him a pass because the 2 old people happen to be rather annoying, overbearing and a bit crazy.

[Special K]

I don't understand why Tai is getting flack for turning on his alliance with Anna when she spent the entire episode going to every person on the tribe to talk trash about Tai and explain why he should be voted out.  I couldn't help noticing that for a professional poker player, she sure telegraphs her agenda really clearly.  She was absolutely transparent and so not one person bought what she was selling.

 

Yeah, I think she made a pretty big mistake.  Scot was the odd man out.  All she had to do was create or strengthen her tie with Tai (see what I did there), and next episode Beauty is sitting pretty once Julia returns.  And if she thought Tai and Scot were bonding, she could have shored up support against Peter.

[iMonrey]

So, apparently there was someone named Anna. Who knew?

 

Personally I find Tai more annoying than endearing. And the thing that annoys me is that he seems to have a very child-like personality and talks like a baby. And I don't mean the way he substitutes W's for R's, I mean the way he natters on endlessly, narrating everything his does. Like when he was up in the tree picking mangoes and telling Scot "This is fun for me I'm not even afraid or anything." He sounds like he's about five years old. 

 

Also, I think the editors are laying it on a little too thick with the "big strong jocks love Tai!" confessionals - first Caleb and now Scot. I'm not sure either one was quite as enamored of Tai as much as the producers would have us believe. 

 

Aubry and Joe played a very dangerous game and it's lucky for them Peter is too arrogant to accurately assess the situation. They were very dismissive with him about whether to vote out Anna or Tai and made it clear the decision was in their hands alone, that they would confer between the two of them and then tell him their decision. Peter knew damn well he was at the bottom of the Brains alliance and this was the perfect opportunity to jump ship, align with Scot, Tai and Anna and remove his former tribe members from power. Fortunately for Aubry and Joe, Peter just got so caught up in being back in a power situation he didn't even think of this, but Aubry and Joe were pretty damn arrogant too. It could have bitten them in the ass if Peter weren't worse.

[blackwing]

Probst is already hyping Anna up to be Kelley Wentworth 2.0:

 

Anna was my pick to win it all, so that shows you how much I know. Did I overestimate her gameplay or was she just the victim of bad Survivor luck with the tribe swap?  I think Anna has a LOT more game in her.  She is a hustler, a negotiator, great in challenges, and a person willing to throw others under the bus to save herself. What’s not to like! She might be a great “Second Chance” nominee!

 

Hey, I don't blame him. Parvati is officially retired, and like someone said earlier, Kim Spradlin is birthing babies left and right. He needs more suitable women for that eventual All-Stars season or whatever they'll call it.

Ugh.  Really?  Isn't it telling that the editing made it look like she just joined the game last night, 12 days in?  I don't think she had ANY "game" at all.  The minute she was shown starting to play the game, she demonstrated that she was completely terrible at it.  Any hustling or negotiating she did was obviously a failure, and if she was so great in challenges, it's very interesting, because I truly had no idea she was in the game until yesterday.

 

She did the entire puzzle and the walk back to camp with her nipple hanging out. 

Ummmm... I didn't notice this and have deleted the ep already, perchance can anyone point us (me) to where there exists a screenshot?  :)

 

I do think that instead of turning on each other, Tai and Anna should have convinced Scott that he wasn't going to go anywhere with Brains.  They would use him for the numbers and vote him out before the merge.  They should have been more forceful on voting Peter out, getting Julia back, and then the four of them can go into the merge together.  Now of course, he could be suspicious that the 3 Beauty would turn on him as well, but he seems to have had a good bond with Tai.  Plus, he thinks Tai is going to join his idol with Kyle's idol, and then use it on him.

[ghoulina]

I don't understand why Tai is getting flack for turning on his alliance with Anna when she spent the entire episode going to every person on the tribe to talk trash about Tai and explain why he should be voted out.  I couldn't help noticing that for a professional poker player, she sure telegraphs her agenda really clearly.  She was absolutely transparent and so not one person bought what she was selling.

 

I don't really get it either. I don't think those two were very close going in anyhow, given Anna was in a tight alliance with the other Beauty girls. Tai was already worried about what that meant going forward, since they lost Caleb. And there's a Beauty girl on the impromptu Exile Island. So he might have figured he should take advantage now and keep those three split up. 

 

It happens a lot when there are just two members coming into a group like that - they try to throw each other under the bus. No big deal, IMO. What was the alternative. Try to work together and convince Scot to go with them? Force drawing rocks? Peter may be on the outs a bit with his tribe, but they clearly weren't ready to lose the numbers advantage yet. And no one wanted Scot out, due to his size and strength. That leaves Tai or Anna, so of course he's going to want Anna to go. 

[thehepburn]

Ugh.  Really?  Isn't it telling that the editing made it look like she just joined the game last night, 12 days in?  I don't think she had ANY "game" at all.  The minute she was shown starting to play the game, she demonstrated that she was completely terrible at it.  Any hustling or negotiating she did was obviously a failure, and if she was so great in challenges, it's very interesting, because I truly had no idea she was in the game until yesterday.

 

You may be confusing her with the other brunette Beauty. Anna has been shown to be the leader of the 3 girls. She was the one who approached Caleb about the fourth in their alliance. The edit has also shown her saying that she doesnt trust Tai which bore fruition in this episode. The edit obviously thinks she is savvy, even if you dont agree.

[Special K]

Ugh.  Really?  Isn't it telling that the editing made it look like she just joined the game last night, 12 days in?  I don't think she had ANY "game" at all. 

 

Oh come on.  She was clearly shown (dwelt on, even) in a previous episode with her buff clinging precipitously to her nipples.

[piequinn35]

How could you miss the busty Anna :>

For me, she is the eye candy of this season, byebye Anna...

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

We're Not Here To Cause Any Trouble, We Just Wanna Do The Survivor Tribe Shuffle
When the tribes get mixed up, everyone tries to adjust accordingly, to varying degrees of success.

[ljenkins782]

She did the entire puzzle and the walk back to camp with her nipple hanging out.

Ummmm... I didn't notice this and have deleted the ep already, perchance can anyone point us (me) to where there exists a screenshot?  :)

Not much to see, just a blurred boob area. 

 

You may be confusing her with the other brunette Beauty. Anna has been shown to be the leader of the 3 girls. She was the one who approached Caleb about the fourth in their alliance. The edit has also shown her saying that she doesnt trust Tai which bore fruition in this episode. The edit obviously thinks she is savvy, even if you dont agree.

 

The beauty tribe got so little airtime as it was and the Tai/Caleb relationship plus Tai's idol search sucked up the majority of that small portion of airtime, but when there was any strategy shown from the women, it was typically coming from Anna. 

 

Who knows, the Kelley Wentworth comparison could be apt, Kelley didn't get a chance to do much on her first season and went deep on her second, Parvati got close to the end in her first season but wasn't too much of a factor in the game and then dominated in her next 2. 

 

However, I really don't want to see Anna again, this one episode was quite enough for me. Also, I was watching some of the bonus clips and my God, she screams her interview clips with that valley girl inflection, makes me crazy. I would actually rather listen to nut job Debbie being nuts than listen to Anna go on and on.

[piequinn35]

Haha Anna's screams at the IC was annoying.

[Special K]

How hilariously unconvincing was Kyle talking to Nick at the well.   "I like Michelle.  Oh, yeah, and I, uh, like you, too!"

 

Like Nick is just the kind of guy Kyle wants to bond with! He is not a good liar.   Fortunately, being a cyborg, Nick may not be able to detect lying.

[ellie2205]

I'm not a fan of Debbie; in fact, I would probably cry if I had to be on the same deserted island with her for a week. BUT, you gotta give her props for doing all those pull-ups!! I don't care how skinny she is and how weird it was while she was actually swinging around on that tree, I'm still impressed. I'm relatively fit and currently of normal weight, but I can't do them.

[KimberStormer]

Haleth, on 17 Mar 2016 - 05:41 AM, said:Haleth, on 17 Mar 2016 - 05:41 AM, said:

I don't mind that Tai betrayed his alliance mate Anna.  It was clear to him that the other 4 were voting for her so why should he stick his neck out and burn his idol for her?  The "anyone but me" strategy is a fine one if the player isn't going to be an immunity monster.  Tai is certainly better off in a 5 person alliance than a 2 person one.

 

Because of the way the impromptu Exile Island worked, using the idol would have swapped Julia in for Peter, making it a 3 person alliance, and as he had clearly won over Scot (what reason does Scot have to go with the Brains anyway except the fact that Julia was coming back?  That reason gone, he should stick with the Beauties until the merge at least) he would have a 4 person alliance.  Right now Tai has, at best, a weak 2-person alliance with Scot, he's not "aligned" with the Brains just because he voted with them out of desperation.

 

ghoulina, on 17 Mar 2016 - 10:01 AM, said:ghoulina, on 17 Mar 2016 - 10:01 AM, said:

I don't really get it either. I don't think those two were very close going in anyhow, given Anna was in a tight alliance with the other Beauty girls. Tai was already worried about what that meant going forward, since they lost Caleb. And there's a Beauty girl on the impromptu Exile Island. So he might have figured he should take advantage now and keep those three split up. 

 

It happens a lot when there are just two members coming into a group like that - they try to throw each other under the bus. No big deal, IMO. What was the alternative. Try to work together and convince Scot to go with them? Force drawing rocks? Peter may be on the outs a bit with his tribe, but they clearly weren't ready to lose the numbers advantage yet. And no one wanted Scot out, due to his size and strength. That leaves Tai or Anna, so of course he's going to want Anna to go. 

 

See, I'm all about being aggressive in taking out power players, and doing it before it's too late, which I usually think is long before most people think; but there is still a time when it's too early.  I just think it's silly to say "Well that's a tight three!  Break it up!" when there's 2/3rds of the game to go and you could give your tribe the numbers at the merge.  I mean, as I've said, if he's fourth behind the girls, all he needs to do is get rid of one of them and he's in the F3.  Striking now to break up that threesome just makes no sense at all to me--plenty of time for that when the other people who are left are losing and need him to flip or they're going home, rather than putting them in the power position for the rest of the game and, what?  Hoping one of them will flip when you're losing and need them to?

 

Sticking together, I think, is a better idea, but absent the idol I wouldn't blame them for throwing each other under the bus.  With the idol, however, there was a golden opportunity to ensure a Beauty-dominant merge tribe, and now it is almost certain that the Beauties will be severely weakened by merge time.  I think it was extremely short-sighted, and a bad play by Tai.

Edited March 17, 2016 by KimberStormer

[Wandering Snark]

Agreed with people who believe Tai was blinded by his man love for the physically imposing Scot. While Scot has dreams of the 'Super Idol' coming together when back with his bro Kyle everyone else will soon have "flush out the idol" plans and Tai's Idol and thereby Scot's dreams will come to nothing. It doesn't "save" you if you just go home the next IC after the 'flush'.

 

ETA: Forgot to mention that yes, the 'Beauty Girls' realllly got screwed like no alliance before by game machinations. Ouch. Penthouse to outhouse.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Wandering Snark

[laurakaye]

Tai took one look at Scot and thought, "Ooh that guy could probably toss me right up the mango tree with one hand!"  I was somewhat taken aback by how quickly Tai forgot all about Cuddle-Bunny Caleb.  Fickle much, Tai?

 

That said, I did think it was kind of cute how quickly Scot reciprocated the man-crush.  Tai seems to have that effect on people, which makes him dangerous to take too far in the game.

[lyric]

Sincere question...is the dude's name Jason or Kyle?

I don't know from where "Kyle" came, but he's referred by that name on here more often than "Jason", yet Probst calls him Jason. Is this like a Justin Bobby thing?

[mojoween]

First name Kyle, last name Jason.

I guess he doesn't like his first name so everyone calls him Jason in life. His behavior, naturally, makes people want to do the opposite of what he wants so Kyle it is!

Edited March 17, 2016 by mojoween

[Lamima]

I agree that this season kinda sucks! The annoying people are getting the most airtime and seem to be in power while the likable folks are getting the axe. I think that's because the likable folks are dumb and have ZERO gameplay. God, I miss last season. 

 

I also am going to be the one dissenter and say that I don't mind Peter so much. Yes, he is sooooo vain but he is an open book...you know exactly what you're getting with him. And he's a great target to have around.

 

I still hate Jason and I am waiting for Debbie to get on his nerves and make him blow a gasket. It's coming. Scott seems a little better being away from Jason..we shall see if it lasts.

 

Anna...so how much would it cost me to get glorious boobs like hers? And, yes, why didn't she blow Tai's idol secret? I would have said 'there is an idol, I saw it today and a guy has it' on my way up to snuff out my fire thing.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Lamima

[himela]

Tai has no strategy. 3 brain - 2 beauty - 1 brawn + 1 beauty on the way.

 

This means, save the one beauty (Anna) with your idol. Get rid of a brain (Peter).

 

What you have after Julia joins is:

 

3 beauty - 2 brain - 1 brawn

 

Even if you lose the next immunity challenges you still have the numbers to make it to the merge.

 

Am I too smart or is there something I'm missing?

[blackwing]

Tai has no strategy. 3 brain - 2 beauty - 1 brawn + 1 beauty on the way.

 

This means, save the one beauty (Anna) with your idol. Get rid of a brain (Peter).

 

What you have after Julia joins is:

 

3 beauty - 2 brain - 1 brawn

 

Even if you lose the next immunity challenges you still have the numbers to make it to the merge.

 

Am I too smart or is there something I'm missing?

Tai wanted to make Scott happy, so Tai listened to Scott.  Scott's dream is to reunite with his true love Kyle, but he sees that Tai is in love with him so is just using him until the merge.  Scott could probably tell Tai, "give your idol to Kyle and the three of us will be unstoppable" and he would do it.

 

I feel a bit bad for saying this, but when Tai kept talking about how Scott should give him a boost so he could get the mangos, what I heard was "I need you to put your hands on my butt".  He sure indeed move on from Caleb in a hurry.  Next Tai will be trying to introduce Scott to crispy fried fish skin.

[fishcakes]

Voting out Peter would have been a decent move, especially for those of us who have to watch the show, but I don't think Tai going against Anna was terrible either. Julia's going to join the new Yellow tribe, so if they lose the next IC, at worst, he's in the same position next time as he was this time. More important, he's still got his idol, and they're at 12 now so a merge is imminent and could even happen next week. Cagayan merged at 11, San Juan Del Sur and Worlds Apart at 12, and Cambodia at 13 (although they started with 20). Once the merge happens, he's got a lot of breathing room because people are going to be focused on taking out individual IC threats. At some point, people are going to realize they can't let him get to the end because everyone there seems to like him, so better for him to have an idol than to have burned it on someone who would have, at best, made him the 4th person in her alliance.

[Alapaki]

Well, there go two of my biggest reasons for tuning in this season.

 

Is it me, or did it seem like the idols got a heck of a lot easier to find as they were discovered?  Seemed like Tai had a hard time getting his, Brawn had a little trouble with theirs, but for Neal?  Seemed like it was nothing.

 

 

Unless you're an ex-FBI agent.  With doofuses like him no wonder it took so long to track down the Unabomber back in the day.

[LanceM]

I don't understand those saying that we were just seeing Anna for the first time last night when she has been the only featured women on the Beauty tribe through the first 4 episodes and who had about 10-12 confessionals.  It is also kind of hard to miss her for a couple of reasons that I can think of but anyway now we know why she was featured more than the other two Beauty women and that is because she went home last night. Julia and Michele on the other hand haven't been featured much but I do believe that is going to change as I suspect both are going to go deep in the game, Michele in particular whose edit seemed to really pick up last night. Overall I am really liking this season and this cast.

[ByaNose]

I didn't realize that Julia was that young. I thought 23 or 24. I'd be interested to hear what age she is telling people, too.

[Ms Blue Jay]

I do take Joe's words about not believing in idols at face value.  Not because I normally take people's words at face value (although hmm -- maybe I do) but because of the LOOK on Joe's face.  If he was acting, that is some masterful acting.  I really believed him. So, who knows.  I will keep a tiny slice of my mind open that he could be tricking me, but most of my mind is made up that Nah, he's not.

 

I don't know.  Speaking about waiting to see people's comeuppance, I suddenly want Joe and Aubrey's for some reason.  Aubrey annoys me more than Peter, because Peter has actually no power and nobody else's respect.

 

I agree that Tai needed to be a lot less scared of them  (much like super huge Scot) and try to find the fractions within the Brains, but those perfect game players are so few and far between.  

 

Am I the only one who severely cringed when Julia said what she said when she was Exiled?  

 

Jeff:  How do you feel?

Julia:  I guess I'll be the Odd Man Out coming back..... but it all depends on.... (pause, realizing that she shouldn't be saying this) whether a Beauty is voted out at Tribal.

 

Ouch.  That totally made Tai and Anna kind of nuts and act accordingly when their tribe lost immunity.

[calico]

Peter has the  stereotypical arrogance and terrible beside manner of a surgeon, which he is not.

 

I hope the next time he's bent over using his mad doctor skilz to "pander to" and "exploit" the mere mortals on his team one of those cute little monkeys vomits up some half-masticated mango on his enlarged head.  If there were an ounce of humanity between him and the small head guy it would die of loneliness.

 

I love how Tai was all "I don't like that guy" after less than 24 hours in his presence.  Straightforward and to the point.

[needschocolate]

Is it me, or did it seem like the idols got a heck of a lot easier to find as they were discovered?  Seemed like Tai had a hard time getting his, Brawn had a little trouble with theirs, but for Neal?  Seemed like it was nothing.

 

If I recall correctly, Neal was the only one who had the actual "tool" to get the key out with. I think the others had lost it and had to come up with another solution.   

 

LOL!  Seriously though, how off-putting is Dr. Peter?  It didn't take him long to alienate two thirds of his original tribe.  Then, at the tribe swap, all three of his new tribemates agreed after spending just a few days with him that he's smug and cocky.  Wow.  He's so smug that it just oozes through the TV screen at tribal.

 

 

Peter is so unlikable that no one seems tobe considering him as a goat because they don't want to stay around him that long.  

 

Joe saying that he thinks there's not an immunity idol this season was odd.  I cannot believe he's not taken any notice of anyone on his tribe scouting around for idol clues.  Didn't Liz say that she spotted Neal looking for an idol clue in the supplies they brought from the boat on Day One?  And Joe hasn't noticed anything?  Not buying it.  Perhaps Joe is trying to play at being clueless.  I think he's way smarter than that.

 

I don't think we ever saw anyone on Brains looking for idols - which doesn't mean it didn't happen, it just means that we don't know if they did and, if they did, we don't know how they did - were they all out in a group?  No one on Brains found an idol until shortly before the swap.  

 

Given Joe's deciding that Debbie was right that the water doesn't need to be boiled, I think he is the type of guy who says "They said there was a twist. I have not found an idol, none of my alliance has found one, there must not be one - that must be the twist." 

 

First name Kyle, last name Jason.

I guess he doesn't like his first name so everyone calls him Jason in life. His behavior, naturally, makes people want to do the opposite of what he wants so Kyle it is!

 

Plus, there are a lot of people who feel that being called by your last name on Survivor has to be earned (the exception being people who have the same name - like the two Kellys last time being called Wentworth and Wigglesworth).   Kyle certainly hasn't done anything awesome enough to get to be called by his last name.  

 

Tai has no strategy. 3 brain - 2 beauty - 1 brawn + 1 beauty on the way.

 

This means, save the one beauty (Anna) with your idol. Get rid of a brain (Peter).

 

What you have after Julia joins is:

 

3 beauty - 2 brain - 1 brawn

 

Even if you lose the next immunity challenges you still have the numbers to make it to the merge.

 

Am I too smart or is there something I'm missing?

 

But Tai couldn't know for sure if it were him or Anna that was targeted.  He could have played his idol for Anna and he gets 4 votes and is sent home.  Plus, he knows that the 3 female Beauties were very tight and he wasn't part of their alliance.  And Scot may have told him that Anna was gunning for him earlier.  

Edited March 17, 2016 by needschocolate

[yamashinaryu]

Anna was telling everyone how they caught Tai looking for idol. So I didn't care if she went home.

Scott, I found him adorable this episode. Must be the Tai effect. Two of the not so liked cast aways saving Tai. That's saying something.

I really hope Debbie - Cydney will have a strong bond like mother and child. They would be an unxpected alliance.

I am also warming up with Aubrey.

[LanceM]

 

Anna...so how much would it cost me to get glorious boobs like hers? And, yes, why didn't she blow Tai's idol secret? I would have said 'there is an idol, I saw it today and a guy has it' on my way up to snuff out my fire thing.

 

According to Anna on RobC's podcast she didn't out Tai's idol because she did not want to mess up Julia's game when she returned.  Had she let the rest of the tribe know he has an idol than Tai immediately becomes a target and by extension so would Julia if they were afraid Tai would play it to save himself. 

Edited March 17, 2016 by LanceM

[fishcakes]

I kind of doubt she thought all that through in the ten seconds or so between Jeff reading the votes and her leaving TC. I can see her saying it now because it makes it sound like she was thinking strategically even after getting voted out, but I don't know. It's possible, but honestly she looked too gobsmacked to be thinking much of anything when she got voted out.

[violet and green]

Well, I am loving this season after a shaky start, and just loved that episode.

 

Debbie working her magic with her new tribemates, rubbing on that softsoap, and swinging from her 'bar' grinning like a loon.

 

Tai being a cheeky monkey in his confessionals, spotting Dr Peter's colors pretty well instantly, scampering up trees to find mangoes, being flung up trees by his new giant friend, walking beside his new giant friend, shots of actual monkeys - all so cute.

 

I am glad he kept his idol and glad they saved Dr Peter so we can get to see him moving amongst the common people for a while longer.

[Hera]

Props to the three women from Beauty for all independently acknowledging that this switch was bad for their alliance and that whoever was on the losing tribe was probably going to go home (and props to the editors for showing this). I don't know that other players would have so immediately seen how bad this was for them.

 

I don't think Tai was dumb for not saving Anna. No one likes Peter (and I believe that if Tai and Scot didn't see that right away, they will soon), he has no control over the game, and he has high goat potential. Anna had a tight (though untested) alliance with the other two women on Beauty, which Tai was explicitly not part of. She also worked very hard to try to get Tai out this round until she found out he had an immunity idol that could save her. The benefit to her was clear, but I don't think she had anything credible to offer Tai in return. I also think Tai is probably going to need that idol for himself—he seems like someone who will targeted as a likeability threat down the line.

 

I'm curious about Nick's statement that he was coming up with new lies and new stories to his tribe. What lies did he tell his old tribe and what purpose could they possibly have served? I will never understand gratuitous lying on Survivor.

 

Also, I got my wish that Jason and Debbie be on the same tribe and they got along just fine. How disappointing.

[Trick Question]

Aubry and Joe played a very dangerous game and it's lucky for them Peter is too arrogant to accurately assess the situation. They were very dismissive with him about whether to vote out Anna or Tai and made it clear the decision was in their hands alone, that they would confer between the two of them and then tell him their decision. Peter knew damn well he was at the bottom of the Brains alliance and this was the perfect opportunity to jump ship, align with Scot, Tai and Anna and remove his former tribe members from power. Fortunately for Aubry and Joe, Peter just got so caught up in being back in a power situation he didn't even think of this, but Aubry and Joe were pretty damn arrogant too. It could have bitten them in the ass if Peter weren't worse.

I disagree, I think Aubry/Joe did a good job of making Peter feel like he was part of the mix.  Remember, Peter was the one suggesting Anna was the bigger threat while they were initially leaning towards Tai (though not with a big preference either way).  While they did go off and confer just the two of them, they came back and went with Peter's suggestion.  Even a simple "hey Peter, we talked it over and realized you were right, let's vote Anna" would go a long towards reinforcing that blowhard's ego.  Peter might even think he's calling the shots at this point.

[LanceM]

I didn't realize that Julia was that young. I thought 23 or 24. I'd be interested to hear what age she is telling people, too.

 

She tweeted out tonight.that she told people that was 22.

[SnideAsides]

We have a thread for spoiler-free preview discussion. We have a thread for spoiler discussion. Those are where discussions of previews and stuff we haven't seen yet belong, not in the episode threads. Thanks.

[KimberStormer]

needschocolate, on 17 Mar 2016 - 3:39 PM, said:

But Tai couldn't know for sure if it were him or Anna that was targeted.  He could have played his idol for Anna and he gets 4 votes and is sent home.  Plus, he knows that the 3 female Beauties were very tight and he wasn't part of their alliance.  And Scot may have told him that Anna was gunning for him earlier.  

 

If he didn't know they were voting Anna, then he's even dumber, because he didn't play it for himself either.  I'm pretty sure he knew, because he was going on and on about not wanting to go home with an idol in his shoe.

 

fishcakes, on 17 Mar 2016 - 12:17 PM, said:

Voting out Peter would have been a decent move, especially for those of us who have to watch the show, but I don't think Tai going against Anna was terrible either. Julia's going to join the new Yellow tribe, so if they lose the next IC, at worst, he's in the same position next time as he was this time. More important, he's still got his idol, and they're at 12 now so a merge is imminent and could even happen next week. Cagayan merged at 11, San Juan Del Sur and Worlds Apart at 12, and Cambodia at 13 (although they started with 20). Once the merge happens, he's got a lot of breathing room because people are going to be focused on taking out individual IC threats. At some point, people are going to realize they can't let him get to the end because everyone there seems to like him, so better for him to have an idol than to have burned it on someone who would have, at best, made him the 4th person in her alliance.

 

In the same position on this tribe, but not in the same position in the game.  If he's thinking about the merge, he should be wanting maximum Beauties there.  Now the Brains have the advantage.  It's true he probably won't be targeted early in the merge, but early or late, better to have the numbers.  This also reminds me that one thing I liked about Russell (henripootel, this is your cue for conspiracy theories!) is that he didn't sit on his idols, but played them, in the cocky confidence that he could get another.  I feel like experience is teaching us that people who find one idol can often find another--Russell, Tony, Malcolm, Jeremy, Kelley.  I feel like, go ahead and play those idols!  Plus as a viewer an idol that never gets played, like Kim's, is impressive, but disappointing.

 

Hera, on 17 Mar 2016 - 5:15 PM, said:

I don't think Tai was dumb for not saving Anna. No one likes Peter (and I believe that if Tai and Scot didn't see that right away, they will soon), he has no control over the game, and he has high goat potential. Anna had a tight (though untested) alliance with the other two women on Beauty, which Tai was explicitly not part of. She also worked very hard to try to get Tai out this round until she found out he had an immunity idol that could save her. The benefit to her was clear, but I don't think she had anything credible to offer Tai in return. I also think Tai is probably going to need that idol for himself—he seems like someone who will targeted as a likeability threat down the line.

 

No one likes Peter, and no one trusts him, yet Aubry and Joe kept him, because they knew having Brains numbers at the merge is crucial.  Maybe in Second-Chances-influenced future seasons there will be fluid voting blocs (which would be great) but at the time of filming, and in previous seasons, tribal unity is your best bet.

 

The one thing I can say in favor of Tai is that, assuming they merge before final 9 (which seems like a fair assumption), there's no chance of a Tandang situation, where one tribe has the majority, and maybe it's good to be in a smaller tribe in a 2-small-tribes-vs-1-big-tribe situation.  But I think that's a long, long shot.  White Collar didn't team up with No Collar, they went with Blue Collar for some reason (I don't remember because I quit that season soon after the merge.)  Better to have Beauty numbers, rather than just Scot kinda-sorta hoping to keep you around.  (Even Julia, when she joins the tribe, may not be inclined to work with Tai, since he has betrayed the Beauties and her best friend out there.) 

 

It might be different if he was, like, completely despised by his tribe, and they would go after him even before other tribe members.  But that's clearly not true in reality, and it would be pretty silly of him to think it if he did.  I dunno, I just don't think this was a good move for Tai in the long run.

[green]

Tai has no strategy. 3 brain - 2 beauty - 1 brawn + 1 beauty on the way.

 

This means, save the one beauty (Anna) with your idol. Get rid of a brain (Peter).

 

What you have after Julia joins is:

 

3 beauty - 2 brain - 1 brawn

 

Even if you lose the next immunity challenges you still have the numbers to make it to the merge.

 

Am I too smart or is there something I'm missing?

 

Yeah I think you are.  Save your idol as long as possible.  Far better to save the idol and make the merge with it still with you. 

 

They are down to 12 after tonight's vote.  With a final 3 that leaves 9 others.  How big is the jury usually?  Doesn't this mean next week is the merge?  I'm not spoiled.  I don't know.  But seems it is about this time in the game they usually do it, right?  So no one should be thinking of some new tribal alliance long term at this point.  Just surviving that TC shown tonight or at most one more challenge and possible (only if you lose) TC before making the merge.

 

So I think Tai did absolutely the right thing.  He didn't blow his idol for nothing because now he has:

 

(1) Saved the idol because the merge happens next.  Tai isn't seen an a immunity monster and can fly under the radar in a Sandra scenario with an idol in hand.  Or,

 

(2) The merge doesn't happen until after another TC and his tribe wins so he is still safe like in (1) above.  Or,

 

(3) There is one more TC and his tribe loses but the Brains start to break apart because 2 days has passed and this sort of thing can easily happen in that time span so Tai is no longer the target.  Or,

 

(4) Worst case there is another TC and his tribe loses and the Brains stay together and go after Tai instead of the other "new" Beauty or Scot.  Tai has his idol to turn the tables.  He still gets to the merge and "disappears" as the plotters busily stab at each other and forget about him.

 

Tai is shown to be in no alliance.  The idol is his only real ally.  It was huge he kept it.  He is no threat after the merge unless people find out he has an idol.  So far only Scot knows for sure and he sees using Tai and his idol in a possible superidol scenario so he isn't going to tell anyone yet.  Maybe the other two Brawns but I doubt he'd even say anything to them unless there is a need to know.

 

Also Scot was seen to bond with Tai so Tai gives him an ally to use along with the other 2 Brawns but for his own agenda as in Tai seems loyal to him.  I see Scot keeping the heat off Tai for the next few eliminations at the very least.

 

In other news Probst is one sicko thinking that weirdly unnaturally looking fake boob poker woman is someone anyone wants to see come back.

Edited March 18, 2016 by green

[himela]

I don't understand those saying that we were just seeing Anna for the first time last night when she has been the only featured women on the Beauty tribe through the first 4 episodes and who had about 10-12 confessionals. 

 

Really? :o I would swear this was the first time I was seeing her. I didn't ever remember she is a poker player which would be something that would have caught my eye and remember it for sure.

 

But Tai couldn't know for sure if it were him or Anna that was targeted.  He could have played his idol for Anna and he gets 4 votes and is sent home.  Plus, he knows that the 3 female Beauties were very tight and he wasn't part of their alliance.  And Scot may have told him that Anna was gunning for him earlier.  

If Tai wasn't sure whether it was him or Anna that would be targeted, he would have played his idol. In the contrary he seemed really sure it was Anna getting voted out the way he noded "no" when Jeff asked if someone wanted to play the idol. If Anna had any doubt that Tai would play the idol for her she would tell the brains about his idol or do anything else to campaign for staying. In the contrary she didn't do anything and followed the plan they had which was, Tai would give her his idol and they would vote Peter out. That's why she was so shocked.

 

In my opinion what Tai did was wrong. To have the numbers is always a good thing, even if you don't feel that tight with your former tribe before the swap. 5 beauties would definetely be better than 4. What Tai is doing wrong is trusting Scot. What he doesn't know is Scot will forget about him and betray him and his idol as soon as he reconnects with evil Jason. And I think this will be Tai's downfall.

[Cynna]

Glad you asked! For me it was he spent the first two episodes talking smack about the "old" people behind their backs ..clearly biased against their age

Crazy thing about this, is Neal and Debbie aren't far apart in age, while Debbie and Joe are. Neal's 38, Debbie's 49, and Joe's 72. Maybe Neal assumed (as I had) that Debbie's in her 60's.

Edited March 18, 2016 by Cynna

[SlackerInc]

In other news Probst is one sicko thinking that weirdly unnaturally looking fake boob poker woman is someone anyone wants to see come back.

 

If I count as "anyone", he's not wrong.  Not because she's eye candy (I don't like fake boobs either, and she's actually got kind of a plain face), but I liked her personality.  But then I play poker and I always like the poker players (and they've had a number of them over the years--someone in the PTB must be into poker themselves), whereas it seems few other fans tend to.

Edited March 18, 2016 by SlackerInc

[gunderda]

This show needs to a better job of disguising who is going home. All of a sudden, this girl Anna who we have never seen before talks lots and lots and lots. It couldn't have been more obvious that she was leaving. The other candidate was the other new girl Michelle who apparently just joined the cast. But her tribe didn't lose, so it was Anna.

See and I thought for sure Tai or Peter were going home because I didn't think they featured Anna that much at all in this episode. Peter was getting cocky again and Tai was thinking about not using he idol.  There's only two tribes now so I to me it seemed easier to show more people in one episode. 

 

Oh, how I wish Tai had used the idol to save Anna.  I get wanting to save the idol for yourself, and he probably wanted to break up the 3 beauty women's alliance that seemed to be very tight. 

 

However the original plan was not for him to use it to save Anna.  That was never the plan.  He brought up the idea of using it when he was told that he was potentially going to get the votes, not Anna.  Then he learned that they were going to vote Anna so he no longer needed to use the idol.  

[ForeverAlone]

After listening to one of Anna's exit interviews, it cemented my view that Tai did the right thing. She basically said that she continued to distrust Tai, because he took that long to show her the idol in the first place, and if he had saved her with it, she would have voted him out at the soonest opportunity. She was never in an alliance with Tai, nor did it seem like she wanted to be. She wanted to use him to her own end, and promptly discard him. Which is fine, because it is the game, but Tai certainly did not owe her anything. It sounds like he broached this plan like 30 minutes before tribal, and likely only because he thought he would be targeted. Both of them were playing their own game and trying to save themselves.

[ellie2205]

With the idol, however, there was a golden opportunity to ensure a Beauty-dominant merge tribe, and now it is almost certain that the Beauties will be severely weakened by merge time.  I think it was extremely short-sighted, and a bad play by Tai.

 

It's tricky because you have to know what combination of short-term and long-term thinking will work the best.  I somewhat agree with you, if Tai knew for sure that he and the three girls (+/- NickBot) would stick together.  But I don't think he could know that for sure, plus he felt on the bottom of the alliance with the girls.  He may have thought the Beauty women would rather find other women to work with and so given the chance, would want, say, Cydney over him.  If that's the case, then having an idol in your pocket is definitely the better choice.

 

 

This also reminds me that one thing I liked about Russell (henripootel, this is your cue for conspiracy theories!) is that he didn't sit on his idols, but played them, in the cocky confidence that he could get another.  I feel like experience is teaching us that people who find one idol can often find another--Russell, Tony, Malcolm, Jeremy, Kelley.  I feel like, go ahead and play those idols!  Plus as a viewer an idol that never gets played, like Kim's, is impressive, but disappointing.

 

Then again, this is a good point too.  Except that there is nothing I like about Russell :)

 

 

Tai took one look at Scot and thought, "Ooh that guy could probably toss me right up the mango tree with one hand!"  I was somewhat taken aback by how quickly Tai forgot all about Cuddle-Bunny Caleb.  Fickle much, Tai?

 

I hope this (and all similar comments about Tai moving on to Scot quickly) is a joke.  Tai has mentioned that he has a boyfriend back home, plus he knows that Caleb and Scot are straight, so he's just looking for new friends/alliance members.  If this were a straight guy whose closest male ally just got voted out, and who then made friends with another straight guy, I don't think there would be any of these types of comments.  (Then again, if this were a straight woman whose closest male ally just got voted out, and who then made friends with another straight guy with some flirtations, I suppose we would still see comments like this, although I wouldn't like it then either.)

Edited March 18, 2016 by ellie2205

[ghoulina]

See and I thought for sure Tai or Peter were going home because I didn't think they featured Anna that much at all in this episode. Peter was getting cocky again and Tai was thinking about not using he idol.  There's only two tribes now so I to me it seemed easier to show more people in one episode.

 

Yea, if anyone, I thought it would be Peter. He was being SO cocky in his THs, and no one really likes him anyhow. Once we got to Tribal, I figured it was Anna. I wasn't shocked. But throughout the episode, I didn't pick up on that until the very end. I was leaning towards the lovely doc. 

[Dobian]

Anna never stood a chance, there was no upside.  If Tai and Scot sided with her, then the vote's 3-3.  Tai would have had to give her his idol to avoid a re-vote.  Now he keeps his idol, Julia will likely be picked off next like Anna was.  The problem is, Scot and Tai are leaving themslves vulnerable for when it's just them and the brains left, unless they make it to the final merge by then.  Tai might have to play his idol when he wants to save it for the merge.

[Ms Blue Jay]

If I count as "anyone", he's not wrong.  Not because she's eye candy (I don't like fake boobs either, and she's actually got kind of a plain face), but I liked her personality.  But then I play poker and I always like the poker players (and they've had a number of them over the years--someone in the PTB must be into poker themselves), whereas it seems few other fans tend to.

 

I love poker too!  I'm not an expert or anything, but I love it.  She is like nobody I know who plays poker, LOL.  She's so completely expressive and obvious about everything.  The only thing I was confused about was when I thought she was being "fake" when she was happy about Tai's idol, she actually WAS happy about it.  So when I thought she was lying, she wasn't.  All the other times I thought she was easy to read.  For example when she started talking all that smack about Tai to the other players.  I'm going to go ahead and assume FBI Joe was the one who believed her because that guy seems to believe everything at face value and he immediately wanted to kick Tai out of the tribe after speaking to her.  It's not exactly like Anna was lying about Tai, but she was being an Actor and being very transparent about her real intentions.  

 

Meanwhile, Tai seems to really hate or distrust Peter and I'm going to go ahead and assume Peter knows zero about that.  None of the Brains know about Tai's idol; they're not that smart.  You should be assuming Idols, not assuming No Idols.

 

Maybe Anna is really good at poker though.  I do wonder.  I think she's kind of proved bad at this game.

 

My gut is that Julia won't hold the Anna vote against Tai.  We shall see.

 

I am loving all of the Cyborg jokes about Nick.  It's very hard for me to remember his name, so this is helping.  

Edited March 18, 2016 by Ms Blue Jay

[himela]

There were other options than what happened and I'm curious to know how come these options were not taken into consideration - or why, if they were, we were not shown of them.

 

1) Tai and Anna forces with Scot and Peter (who is at the bottom of the brains alliance anyway and bitter about it) and vote out useless in challenges Joe.

2) 5 people vote out the lone wolf Scot.

3) Tai - Anna - Scot vote out one of the three brains and use the idol to do that.

[piequinn35]

^^

1. No one trusts Pete

2. They love the giant

3. There was no alliance between Tai and Anna

 

my 2 cents