S02.E13: Wrath Of The Villains: A Dead Man Feels No Cold

[Tara Ariano]

Gordon, Bullock and Barnes turn to the wife of Victor Fries for help in finding him; Penguin meets Hugo Strange; and Alfred shares information with Bruce about his parents' murderer.

[Primetimer]

An iconic villain gets his iconic look and engages in some iconic mayhem.

Read the story

[Lantern7]

Meh episode overall. Victor is a credible bad guy . . . who knows what will motivate him now that Nora is dead. Also, Hugo Strange is a bad guy. Of course he is. His friggin' name is "Hugo Strange."

 

Jim continues to be a doof around Leslie. At least he hasn't lost his head like Oswald. I did like his impression of a "goose."

 

Hi, Barbara! Bye, Barbara! And was that Theo in the vat at the very end? It's been awhile since I've seen him. I'm guessing fate doesn't want Jim to commit cold-blooded murders that will stick.

 

ETA: Forgot about Victor's handiwork in the beginning of the episode. He can freeze bullets in mid-air? I call bullshit, even though it does look cool (no pun intended).

[Pyralis]

Not my favourite episode.  However I liked Bruce's reference to "the other Bruce Wayne". And guest starring in tonight's episode - the big ole "coat of pregnancy"

[Spartan Girl]

Man, it would be so easy to put a pillow over Barbara's face while she's comatose. Just saying...

It's not a good sign being bored only two episodes in. I know I should have felt sorrier for Norma, but I can't deal with enablers of serial killers. Would have loved it if instead of that oh so loving goodbye, she told him that she'd rather die than be saved by a monster like him.

[Biggie B]

Post-freeze, Victor looked like Billy Idol. I thought his white hair was quite flattering.

 

I thought that Lee might have ended up frozen, as that would have been a convenient way to deal with the actress' absence from the show for maternity leave (if that's necessary; I don't know when they filmed this. For all I know, she's already long since had her baby).

 

Bruce is getting a bit hard core now, isn't he.

[The Wild Sow]

 

Hugo Strange is a bad guy. Of course he is. His friggin' name is "Hugo Strange."

And BD Wong just seems to be having the time of his life with the role!

 

Post-freeze, Victor looked like Billy Idol. I thought his white hair was quite flattering.

But the freaky pale blue contacts were, well......freaky!

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Victor screamed Village of the Damned to me.

Looks like the end is nigh for Jim and Leslie.

[MarkHB]

I thought David Mazouz killed it tonight... that look on his face when he was talking to Lee, that was Batman even if he didn't realize it.  And to end it with him in profile with the big window in the background.... that was a deliberate shout-out to this....

 

[VCRTracking]

Wow, didn't expect Nora to commit suicide. In the canon she's usually alive but cryogenically frozen until they find a cure for her disease. Now Victor has nothing to live for.

ETA: I didn't know until now that in the pre-52 comics Nora was put in the Lazarus pit gained fire powers and became a crazy supervillain named Lazara!

 

I love B.D. Wong is Hugo Strange so far! Great villain.

 

David Mazouz must have gone through a growth spurt recently. He's towering over Selina now!

Edited March 8, 2016 by VCRTracking

[Jediknight]

Jerome's coming back!  He was there in one of the tanks, yeah baby.

 

Wasn't a fan of them killing off Nora.  I know they're doing their own spin on characters, but what makes Freeze great is that he was doing it all for Nora.  He was doing it all to save his wife, and only became Freeze because an even bigger villain had no compassion for life.  You believed that Victor could be good, he wasn't evil, he was a desperate man doing horrible things to save the woman he loved.  Batman had compassion for Victor and Nora, and would try to help Victor cure Nora.  This ending for Nora is also hurt by the Arkham video game series wrapping up their story for Freeze, and it was perfect.

[thuganomics85]

Surprised that they seem to be going against canon, by having Nora actually die, since usually she's kept alive by some kind of frozen chamber.  And they've also already made Victor become Mr. Freeze more or less, only this time he's simply working for Hugo Strange, instead of continuing to find a cure for his wife.  Not sure if I'm wild about this particular change, but I'm curious to see where this goes.  The actor playing Victor continues to be solid enough, but B.D. Wong is really the one stealing the show.  Loving every scene with Strange; especially how much fun he was having manipulated things so that Victor could get to Nora.

 

Hey, a Barbara sighting!  Seems to be comatose, but I doubt it's permanent.  And I have a feeling when she does wake-up, she'll remember those kind words Leslie said to her.  Yeah, I have a thinking Barbara will try something against Leslie again.

 

Bruce is becoming stone cold now, and just wants to shoot his parent's killer.  He's got Alfred and even Selina like "Whoa, man!"

 

That insanity plea didn't quite work out for you, did it, Oswald?

 

Bullock continues to have the best lines.  I loved his "Nooooo." to Barnes asking if he had a better plan, and him telling Jim to tell Leslie himself about their brilliant "Use Nora as bait" plan, because Bullock is smart, and knew that Leslie would totally not be happy about that.

 

So, Hugo's got a bunch of corpses hanging around, which he wants to bring back to life.  I thought I saw Jerome and Theo, and I'm pretty sure this

is how Fish is going to come back too.

 

Edited March 8, 2016 by thuganomics85

[Kathemy]

Short review version, great episode. Worse pacing than last one but much, much stronger. The Lee/Jim-Nora/Victor parallells were hamfisted. Bruce Wayne was absolutely incredible in this episode. The dialogue was top notch and David is brilliant with his subtle changes in facial expression. One second he looks like a young teenager boy, the next he's a goddamn Sith lord.

[Agent Dark]

One thing I've noticed in these last two episodes is the change in the soundtrack.  I remember the soundtrack being perhaps my biggest disappointment when Gotham first aired, being this utterly unsubtle, blaring of sound.  Nothing at all like I expected a Batman soundtrack to be.  But it seems they've dialed the music way back, and there is definite elements of the brooding music from Batman (1989) and Batman: The Animated Series especially in the scenes with Bruce Wayne.

[Kathemy]

The soundtrack has been improving for a long time. It's done by Graeme Revell, a truly competent veteran.

[MarkHB]

Regarding the tanks at the end, did anyone recognize the guy who was missing his left forearm, or the black woman in the farthest one? 

I realize the last one could be intended to be Fish.

[The Kings Foot]

I dont think Nora's dead. I dont recall any of our good guys confirming her death after entering the basement.

 

Alternatively I'm betting Strange has her stored there too.

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Short review version, great episode. Worse pacing than last one but much, much stronger. The Lee/Jim-Nora/Victor parallells were hamfisted. Bruce Wayne was absolutely incredible in this episode. The dialogue was top notch and David is brilliant with his subtle changes in facial expression. One second he looks like a young teenager boy, the next he's a goddamn Sith lord.

Baby Bat was giving me life last night.

David Mazouz is shutting down all the folks that complained about his acting.

Is it just me or he has grown some more?

[Delphi]

Bruce and Selina give me life. I missed them last week because honestly they ate the main reason I watch this. I don't really care about Jim that much.

I am bit miffed that they killed Nora because a) you don't kill Nora and b) this show is really bad about killing female characters. I mean they kill men as well, but I don't count nameless male cops and civilians as characters. At this point the only girl I think is safe is Selina.

[darkestboy]

Interesting route they went with both Nora and Victor's storylines and rather surprising too.

 

Having Victor now at Indian Hill with Hugo Strange influencing him has a lot of potential, doesn't it?

 

Oswald really is suffering the consequences of faking insanity. How much longer can they actually keep him in there though?

 

Gordon/Leslie's domestics were not that interesting and the sooner Barnes is killed off the better. He continues to add nothing of worth to the show.

 

I did like Barbara's brief appearances and was that Jerome along with Theo in those tanks at the end?

 

The Bruce storyline is interesting but I can't see him going through with murder though, 7/10

[Kathemy]

this show is really bad about killing female characters

Common Fandom Myth™

 

Before talking about how the show is "problematic" for killing off Nora please consider that Nora Fries is the literal definition of the "girl in the refrigerator". There's only so much the show can do.

[VCRTracking]

I dont think Nora's dead. I dont recall any of our good guys confirming her death after entering the basement.

 

 

When a person's head cracks in the middle and the top part shifts, that person is probably dead.

[Perfect Xero]

Damn, Jim, why you so dumb? If a dude is taking the heat for killing a man that you killed with him, you at least play along with him and promise to investigate the guy he says is torturing him, even if you think he's full of it. Don't call him out for copping an insanity plea.

[blackwing]

The tanks at the end, definitely Galavan and Jerome (Joker?).  And I'm pretty sure the one at the end is Fish.  Some time ago we saw a woman floating in a tank and she had that shock of coloured hair just like Fish.

 

I don't really care to see Galavan again.  The character is tired and played out, and I'm bored with always seeing James Frain play the "nice on the outside, sinister on the inside" type character all the time.

 

I call BS on them bringing Nora into the same room as Barbara.  That place is enormous, you'd think they'd be able to find a private room.

[Kathemy]

Damn, Jim, why you so dumb? If a dude is taking the heat for killing a man that you killed with him, you at least play along with him and promise to investigate the guy he says is torturing him, even if you think he's full of it. Don't call him out for copping an insanity plea.

To be fair Jim has never been portrayed as particularly clever.

[Philbert]

 

David Mazouz is shutting down all the folks that complained about his acting.

 

Anybody complaining about the acting on this show is a douche. The acting and cinematography are what's keeping most of the fanbase going. It's the writing and overall storytelling that's often a problem. This episode didn't bother me but I freely admit it's a bit of a letdown after the last one. There were some very good moments in it mind, like Strange trapping the cops in his corridors and cackling gleefully while Bullock huffed and puffed in frustration. B.D Wong is having the time of his life with this character and is a welcome addition to the cast-which remains the best part of this show.

[Kathemy]

Anybody complaining about the acting on this show is a douche. The acting and cinematography are what's keeping most of the fanbase going. It's the writing and overall storytelling that's often a problem. This episode didn't bother me but I freely admit it's a bit of a letdown after the last one. There were some very good moments in it mind, like Strange trapping the cops in his corridors and cackling gleefully while Bullock huffed and puffed in frustration. B.D Wong is having the time of his life with this character and is a welcome addition to the cast-which remains the best part of this show.

Unlike most of the online reviewer sites, which I often find to have their heads stuck up their asses, I thought this episode was a vast improvement over the previous outing.

 

Full review here: http://kathemy.tumblr.com/post/140699649731/review-2x13

[Chaos Theory]

Bruce and Selina give me life. I missed them last week because honestly they ate the main reason I watch this. I don't really care about Jim that much.

I am bit miffed that they killed Nora because a) you don't kill Nora and b) this show is really bad about killing female characters. I mean they kill men as well, but I don't count nameless male cops and civilians as characters. At this point the only girl I think is safe is Selina.

Nora was always going to die/be put in suspended animation. That is part of the Mr. Freeze story arc and always has been. You might as well ask for Bruce's parents not to die tragically and in front of him.

I think the shows problem is the lack of females that aren't there as love interests/tragic figures in the male characters lives but again it's a comic and there is only so much the show can do.

[Perfect Xero]

It's a shame that they screwed up the Montoya character so badly and then had her vanish from the show, never to be mentioned again.

 

ETA: Also, I was confused about Nora. I thought they whole point was to freeze her, store her in a cryo pod thing, and wait for a cure to be found, then thaw her out. Instead Victor froze her, then stuck her under the heat lamps and tried to thaw her out right away ...

Edited March 8, 2016 by Perfect Xero

[Philbert]

 

I think the shows problem is the lack of females that aren't there as love interests/tragic figures in the male characters lives but again it's a comic and there is only so much the show can do.

 

I think it was a major mistake to remove Montoya from the cast and Essen should have stayed around at least until the middle of the season.

[blackwing]

ETA: Also, I was confused about Nora. I thought they whole point was to freeze her, store her in a cryo pod thing, and wait for a cure to be found, then thaw her out. Instead Victor froze her, then stuck her under the heat lamps and tried to thaw her out right away ...

That's not what happened.  His earlier experiments with freezing, the body always degenerated, but after the pharmacist came back alive, he realised his new formula worked.  He was all set to confess in the police station, then saw the defrosted pharmacist, walked out, and made plans to get Nora.  Then he was going to freeze Nora with the new formula and preserve her until medical advances were made that would help her condition.  But instead, she realised that she had created a monster, and switched the new formula with the old one so she would die and he would stop this crusade of killing people just to try to save her.  She told Lee that it was her fault, that she should have recognised that he was unstable and put an end to all of it.

 

So she put the old formula into his gun.  He froze her with it, but it didn't work, and her body started falling apart.  Then he realised he killed her and attempted to kill himself.

 

I think it was a major mistake to remove Montoya from the cast and Essen should have stayed around at least until the middle of the season.

I don't agree about Montoya... the way they wrote that character, she was thoroughly unlikeable and there was going to be no way to turn that around, so I think it's better she is gone.  But I loved Essen, and I'm still pissed that they ushered out a black female in an authority position for the usual macho gruff white guy.  I can't say that I have enjoyed the addition of Michael Chiklis.  His character is pointless.  I'm not sure if he is supposed to represent this "tough new approach" on crime, but whatever he is doing, it doesn't work with me at all.  I don't understand why Essen couldn't have had the task force or whatever else has been done.

[Kathemy]

The problem for me was that the actress playing Montoya completely fell flat.

 

There is no problem with the male-female death ratio on the show. The problem is that female deaths are treated as a Far Bigger Deal while men tend to be used as cardboard knockovers, which is sexist against both genders, but that's something the show has in common with 99% of all television shows, and it's not even very pronounced here.

 

The fact that there is an uneven ratio when it comes to the casting of a show is not necessarily sexist or racist. Nobody whined about Sex And The City needing more male leads. Nobody would expect a show about an English upper-class boarding school in the late 19th Century to feature a lot of colored people, and nobody would be surprised that a show about a cheerleading team has a lot of girls.

 

Gotham is a show about organized crime in a major city and women only make up 15% of all police officers at local police departments in major cities. Nearly all violent felons sentenced to prison are men, and the mafia has never been known to be women-friendly. Based on that I'd wager that women are actually vastly over-represented on Gotham given its setting, not that there's anything wrong with that, Regardless I find criticizing the show for sexism on this ground to be disingenious.

 

I disagree that we have a lack of "females that aren't there as love interests." I guess you left out the word "only". Leslie, for example, is a highly qualified medical professional who certainly has an agenda apart from serving as Jim's love interest. Tabitha certainly isn't "just a love interest" for Butch - the very sentiment is laughable. And Selina isn't "just a love interest" for Bruce.

[Perfect Xero]

That's not what happened.  His earlier experiments with freezing, the body always degenerated, but after the pharmacist came back alive, he realised his new formula worked.  He was all set to confess in the police station, then saw the defrosted pharmacist, walked out, and made plans to get Nora.  Then he was going to freeze Nora with the new formula and preserve her until medical advances were made that would help her condition.  But instead, she realised that she had created a monster, and switched the new formula with the old one so she would die and he would stop this crusade of killing people just to try to save her.  She told Lee that it was her fault, that she should have recognised that he was unstable and put an end to all of it.

 

So she put the old formula into his gun.  He froze her with it, but it didn't work, and her body started falling apart.  Then he realised he killed her and attempted to kill himself.

 

With the previous formula the body stayed intact until he thawed them, then they broke/dissolved/whatever and he was able to tell if it had been a success or a failure. Since Victor's plan (as I understood it) was to freeze her and stick her in one of his pods to keep her in cryo until they found a cure for her disease, she shouldn't have broke in front of him like that, because he would have been keeping her frozen, not thawing her out. He'd have only found out that she had died whenever he tried to thaw her out in the future or he checked the canister of formula that he'd used and realized it had been switched. Indeed Victor has the yellow/orangish heat lamps on over Nora when she breaks, he then turns them off before he decides to freeze himself before the police come in.

[Kathemy]

To be fair that was the case of the previous unsuccessful formula which we saw him use in the last episode. But, the working formula was #16 and the one she switched to was #03, which would be an early prototype. Things cracking when freezing them is hardly uncommon.

 

The lamps could have been there simply for the light or they could have been a gaffe.

[Danielg342]

If Hugo Strange is going to become "the new Galavan" and become the leader of the criminals of Gotham, I could get behind that. No one screams "criminal mastermind" more than B.D. Wong does, because by gosh is he absolutely killing it. Hopefully he makes it until the end of the year, if not the end of S3. Or beyond.

 

(One thing I will say is that if we absolutely have to have Galavan come back, leave it until the end of this year and substantially reduce his role. Oh, and leave him subservient to Strange. He's the far better character).

 

Having said that, I did find the main storyline to be a bit of a bore. Maybe it's just me, but I could never get behind Victor Fries, no matter how much I may have felt sorry for his wife, Nora. The character basically got to do whatever he wanted without facing much of a challenge, nor did I really feel that he had any real remorse for what he was doing. Everyone was kind of just "there" for the ride and the whole exercise felt pretty...routine.

 

...but, hey, those frozen cops and bullets were cool though.

 

I will say that I did enjoy Nora talking to Lee about how she failed to stop Victor from embracing the dark side, resonating with Lee about how she seems to be doing the same thing with Jim. It's here where I'll say I have no issue at all with Nora's death, because it was Nora's choice and sent Victor a very strong message- no matter how noble your goals are, if you don't do the right thing, you don't get what you want. Great that Nora was the one who delivered Victor's comeuppance, and it becomes an important message in a city that could use it- without a moral centre, the people- and the city- become nothing.

 

Which brings me to Bruce. His storyline was a bit pedestrian too, but I did like how determined he was and how sure he would be that he would embrace his dark side. Sounds like dealing with Matches will be a pivotal point in Bruce's journey, as Selina, Lee and Alfred were all right in trying to steer Bruce away from that line of thinking- essentially it became the "if you kill them, you will become them" idea. Avoiding it essentially is what makes Batman who he is- no matter how brutal things are, Batman won't kill, because it's the only thing that separates him from the rest of the deviants in Gotham. Sounds like this is Bruce's version of that lesson. We'll see how it goes, though.

 

The Bullock Meter

 

6- Not as heavily featured as last week, but Harvey Bullock did get some memorable moments, such as his protestation for bringing Nora to Arkham and Barnes barking back at him causing him to beat a hasty retreat. I liked how Harvey was the only one who really understood how silly the idea was- Arkham is the very definition of a "cardboard prison"- but Barnes was right, was there another option? I also enjoyed him bantering with Strange, getting angry at how slowly Strange was at "fixing" the wiring issue.

 

So, not bad...but he was largely a bystander. I want him to get more active in the plots.

 

Episode Grade: C+

[Snookums]

And BD Wong just seems to be having the time of his life with the role!

 

 

He's just having a blast! He's a cross between a hellish imp and the mysterious proprietor of the worst opium den on the docks. And the actress playing Peabody is doing great work too--she clearly has her own little agendas and the way she was perving on Barbara? "Sleeping Beauty, I call her..." Heh, gross.

 

I really don't get Jim's motivations anymore, honestly. Is he dark side? Does he care about the city and his fellow officers? Is he even happy about the baby? It seems like he just has no accumulated memory or experience--he's known Penguin how long now and he just blows him off publicly?  I mean, granted, Gotham's force is so pathetic that a madman killing who knows how many innocents in his mad effort to freeze his wife until random medical advances find a cure for her illness offing himself is considered a win, so it's not like his professional morale is ever that high, but dude, either pick a path or just leave Gotham. Get on a bus with Lee and go to Chicago or something.

 

Oswald really is suffering the consequences of faking insanity. How much longer can they actually keep him in there though?

 

 

 

If the show is still pretending to exist in the confines of the United States, the usual rule is "Until you are shown to no longer be a danger to yourself or others." Which would be a while, really, even if this weren't Gotham. Hugo Strange and his methods aren't helping at all but let's not forget that Penguin really is off his nut. He's a vicious little rat of a sociopath whose mom frelled him up beyond the telling of it. Even if he was in a hospital with actual medical professionals that didn't just burst out laughing and yell PEACE OUT during the taking of their Hippocratic Oath he'd be in there a while.

 

 

Is it just me or he has grown some more?

 

 

I swear you can actually see him unfurling during his scenes. When they showed the flashback to baby Bruce watching his parents buy the farm I was honestly shocked at how wee he was.

[Amerilla]

I swear you can actually see him unfurling during his scenes. When they showed the flashback to baby Bruce watching his parents buy the farm I was honestly shocked at how wee he was.

 

It's really noticeable in Batcat scenes. Even late last season, David and Camren were eye-to-eye. Now he's looking down on her.

 

I thought the stand-out this week was Oswald. His confused little "I'm a penguin" during the Duck-Duck-Goose game was excellent work by RLT. Oswald probably isn't going to win this war, but I was impressed that he's not going to give up his last shreds of sanity without a fight.

 

Erin Richards clearly had the easiest week. (Eh, just take a nap. We'll wake you when you wrap for the day.) I agree that Lee should have taken this once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to "trip" over a cable or smother her with a pillow, because Sleeping Beauty ain't going to sleep forever.   

[Philbert]

 

I don't agree about Montoya... the way they wrote that character, she was thoroughly unlikeable and there was going to be no way to turn that around, so I think it's better she is gone.

 

They should have done more with her, and I think they were starting to and then....bam. She was gone. I don't disagree about the writing. She was very cardboard during the first few episodes, extremely one note and I don't blame the actress. I just don't think she was given much to do. Kind of what happened to Erin Richards through much of the first season. I saw a number of people questioning her acting ability...until she was given something to do. Sadly I think Montoya was cut before they reached that point.

[jhlipton]

Forgot about Victor's handiwork in the beginning of the episode. He can freeze bullets in mid-air? I call bullshit, even though it does look cool (no pun intended).

Frozen bullets are hardly the most unbelievable thing about this show!

 

 

The fact that there is an uneven ratio when it comes to the casting of a show is not necessarily sexist or racist.

Responding in Small Talk.

[Delphi]

Erin Richards clearly had the easiest week. (Eh, just take a nap. We'll wake you when you wrap for the day.)

Where have we seen that before, I wonder? Emile de Ravin could give her tips.

[The Bullpen]

The previously.tv review says the tanks in the final scene have partially-formed clones of Galavan in them, but I think it's pretty clear looking at the photo that the second body is Jerome, the fourth body is Fish, and the third body is... well, I don't know who the third body is. Anyone have an idea?

The review also says that the freaky lab is underneath Arkham Asylum. I'm confused about this. It seems like it's under Arkham, since Strange took an elevator to get there, but Indian Hill, the "toxic waste dump," is supposed to be a separate location. Arkham and Indian Hill are definitely two distinct properties. So what gives?

Finally, are we to believe that Dr. Tompkins knew Dr. Strange when she worked at Arkham? How long has Dr. Strange been the chief psychiatrist at Arkham? Why haven't we seen him until now?

I'm just full of questions tonight, I guess.

[Kathemy]

He wasn't the chief psychiatrist during, for example, "Arkham". I don't think we're supposed to think she knows him.

[Delphi]

I think we're to believe there is an underground system that connects Indian Hill to Arkham Asylum, so you take the elevator down and then walk through corridors.

[HoodlumSheep]

The previously.tv review says the tanks in the final scene have partially-formed clones of Galavan in them, but I think it's pretty clear looking at the photo that the second body is Jerome, the fourth body is Fish, and the third body is... well, I don't know who the third body is. Anyone have an idea?

The review also says that the freaky lab is underneath Arkham Asylum. I'm confused about this. It seems like it's under Arkham, since Strange took an elevator to get there, but Indian Hill, the "toxic waste dump," is supposed to be a separate location. Arkham and Indian Hill are definitely two distinct properties. So what gives?

Finally, are we to believe that Dr. Tompkins knew Dr. Strange when she worked at Arkham? How long has Dr. Strange been the chief psychiatrist at Arkham? Why haven't we seen him until now?

I'm just full of questions tonight, I guess.

The third body looked like it was missing an arm. Either that, or I didn't see it well enough.

Watched the episode! I don't think it was quite as strong as last week's, but I still enjoyed it.

Poor Nora. :( also, I'm glad that Lee isn't putting up with Gordon's crap. I was glad she got more to do.

Still not enough Harvey for my liking.

I want to keep B. D. Wong as Hugo Strange forever.

Jim is dumb for the way he's treating Penguin. One minute they work together or he needs the Penguin's help, and then the next he's acting all high and might and basically feeding Oswald to the dogs.

And uugghh. Why can't they keep Galavan dead? He was so cartoony. He was one of the weak links in the first half of the season.

[Kathemy]

Jim is dumb for the way he's treating Penguin. One minute they work together or he needs the Penguin's help, and then the next he's acting all high and might and basically feeding Oswald to the dogs.

My gut feeling is he will pay dearly for this. If there is one single person you don't want to be pissed off at you, it's Oswald Cobblepot.

[Danielg342]

Still not enough Harvey for my liking.

So you disagree with the Bullock Meter this week I take it.

My gut feeling is he will pay dearly for this. If there is one single person you don't want to be pissed off at you, it's Oswald Cobblepot.

You'd think Jim would know this by now.

[Perfect Xero]

To be fair Jim has never been portrayed as particularly clever.

 

Oh, it's (unfortunately) consistent characterization. Gordon usually doesn't have a subtle bone in his body, this really isn't any different that the times that he stupidly confronted Loeb in Season 1 or Galavan this season and told them that he was going to get them rather than, I don't know, playing it like he was on their side and gathering evidence/information on the sly. I actually like the Jim Gordon character quite a bit and keep hoping that he'll learn not to be a moron about things like this, but, alas, he never learns but manages to keep getting away with it.

Jim is dumb for the way he's treating Penguin. One minute they work together or he needs the Penguin's help, and then the next he's acting all high and might and basically feeding Oswald to the dogs.

 

This is the thing I can't stand about the way they write Gordon, like I said earlier, he doesn't even have to like or care about Oswald, but they keep insisting that Gordon has a darkness in him now, so at least show that he's willing to play along with Penguin and act like they're friends to make sure he stays quiet about him killing Galavan.

 

Penguin's unhinged enough at this point that if you need him screaming about how Gordon killed Theo so Strange can hear it, then even Gordon offering a friendly but not immediate solution like, "I'll say I saw some questionable conditions here today and request an investigation in to Strange, but that's the best I can do," could still set Oswald off.

[HoodlumSheep]

So you disagree with the Bullock Meter this week I take it.

Nah, I'd say you're rating is about right. If we go by the grading scale, that's a D/D-, which is basically an F. I'll only be satisfied when we see enough of Harvey that warrants an 8.5+ on the Bullock Meter. While I think season 2 is stronger, overall, I thought season 1 had a better Jim/Harvey balance. Harvey feels more like a secondary character as of late.

I don't know if it's the villains or Barnes that's eating up his screen time, but I just miss Harvey being equally (or almost equally) involved in the plot.

Edited March 11, 2016 by HoodlumSheep

[mtlchick]

Good news; Not familiar at all with Hugo Strange but BD Wong is on TV who never steers me wrong and is having a blast.

 

Bad news: I can live with not following canon as they've already done that with the relationships seen on the show.  But the writing is still hit or miss especially with the Gordon Goes Dark!!! narrative. I rather deal with Bruce Goes Dark!!! (While Growing An Inch Per Episode!) 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I thought that Lee might have ended up frozen, as that would have been a convenient way to deal with the actress' absence from the show for maternity leave (if that's necessary; I don't know when they filmed this. For all I know, she's already long since had her baby).

Frances Laiz Setta Schenkka was born on March 2 (but Ben & Morena didn't release the news until March 11), so she was definitely still pregnant when this episode was filmed.

 

Damn, Jim, why you so dumb? If a dude is taking the heat for killing a man that you killed with him, you at least play along with him and promise to investigate the guy he says is torturing him, even if you think he's full of it. Don't call him out for copping an insanity plea.

Seriously. Even if you think he is the devil incarnate, at least don't let it show on your face while he's still alive, least of all when he's telling you that he is being tortured. Jim just had to act all high and mighty again and point out that Penguin is supposed to be insane. Think, Jim, think! Not even a lot. Just a little bit!