S02.E09: 209

[Tara Ariano]

Alison weathers a momentous journey alone; Helen receives unexpected attention from a sexy but exasperating source; Noah faces a terrible reckoning; Cole is pushed to the edge by an array of challenges.

[Primetimer]

This week the question isn't 'Who's the father of Alison's baby?,' but rather 'Where is the father of Alison's baby?' as Noah finds himself stuck in a hurricane. At least Helen manages to find a doctor who not only makes house calls but also has a very modern approach to co-pays.

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[HumblePi]

Damn that was a great episode!  There's going to be plenty of comments forthcoming on this one, but I'll just say for now that I think Cole is the father of Alison's baby and they're going to remarry. Hal might have killed Scotty because they had the deal together with the nightclub in Montaug. Helen will marry Doctor No-Heart.  With any luck, Noah will spontaneously combust. 

[SoWindsor]

Why did Cole burn the house down?

I really want that baby to be his.

He did show Noah levels of selfishness though by thinking her infertility was about him.

Noah was just awful this episode. I knew that was going to be Whitney! Kind of odd her Dad would just leave her there but I guess she's 18. Just seemed really off.

Enjoyed Helens scenes quite a bit. I'm really liking her POVs.

Interesting how they gave Cole and Allison a POV too. That was a first for the show.

[AlliMo]

The whole time all I could keep thinking was, "Pffftt, there's no way that doctor would spend that much time with Allison. A nurse, sure, but that doctor isn't showing up until the kid is crowning."

[sking24450]

Noah is 

 

[GeminiDancer]

I think Cole burned the house down as a way of letting go. He was blaming other people for the stuff that he's holding onto. All I know was that as soon as the image of Gabriel appeared, I was all "Let him go. Let him go."

 

I'm calling it, Cole is the father. It's no coincidence that Alison screaming while in labor also happened during Cole's scene. It linked them together.

 

I'm so disappointed that the doctor turned out to be an asshole. Was it just me or did he get uglier the more and more he talked?

 

Stay classy, Noah. Stay classy. Dick. There's no redeeming him, to be honest.

[healthnut]

Wow. Good stuff. Didn't think it was possible for me to dislike Noah anymore and this episode happens and he sucks even more. He's doing drugs now, unbelievable. He left Whitney at the party, Really?!

Poor Allison. I actually feel bad for her in this episode. Don't blame her for leaving Noah's ass in the waiting room.

Dr. Who-dude was hilarious. I'm going to go with jerk that plays nice. His whole line about the heart is a muscle was classic. At least Helen got some.

And Cole...Allison doesn't deserve him but I hope he figures out that's his baby. Was that the look he threw Allison's way at the courthouse. Hmm. Totally knew he was going to burn the house down. Heartbreaking scene.

[Otherkate]

Well, that wasn't terribly subtle. (Allison + Cole + baby)

 

Can't really imagine many worse things than my own father getting his rocks off watching me make out with someone. Going to take a while to wash that memory away, is my guess.

[HumblePi]

The whole time all I could keep thinking was, "Pffftt, there's no way that doctor would spend that much time with Allison. A nurse, sure, but that doctor isn't showing up until the kid is crowning."

I thought the same thing, I called 'bullshit' on that one. Usually the doctor shows up with just enough time to put gloves on and hand off the newborn to the waiting arms of a nurse. There's no 33 year old OB/GYN who spends her time sitting with a woman in labor and since when can a doctor feel a woman's belly and is able to tell she's 5 cm dilated? 

 

edited because I watched that part again when she's being examined by the doctor and it looks like she had at least one gloved hand doing a vaginal exam for a split second. but I still call bullshit on this.

Edited November 30, 2015 by HumblePi

[Wavy]

That was some episode!  Sooo much going on.  Noah's doing lines of coke now?  Geez, is there a debauchery he won't indulge in ?!

[Irlandesa]

Noah was bad this episode but I didn't think he was the worst.  Eden hiding his phone?  So childish.  And what was up with him happening to run into both his daughter and Max at the same hurricane party? 

 

But I thought Cole was the worst.  Normally, I wouldn't be but he seriously made Luisa's infertility about him and his family's curse.  That was bad.  I loved that she told hiim off.  I only wish she would have told him that he doesn't have to worry about her fertility since he could just go and find someone else to breed with.  That whole segment was overwrought and burning down the house was overly dramatic.  I do hope the baby is his, though, but I don't want him hurting Luisa.

 

I was confused by Helen's segment.  At first I was happy she was getting some.  And it's amazing how much more comfortable basement sex looked compared to her sex-fest with Max in a luxury hotel.  But there were little red flags that would make me reduce him to 'slam bam, thank you man.'  Drinking while on call?  Calling a client a bitch in front of me?  Uh no.

 

Allison?  Whatever.  I hate birth scenes. They aren't as interesting as many shows seem to feel they are.

[nara]

I thought it was interesting that they left their normal episode structure and showed 4 POVs and no future.  It's more like a typical drama structure, but was necessary to show such separate events.

 

A lot of us were hoping that Helen would get together with the doctor, and I guess we got our wish, but I'm not sure I'm thrilled with how it played out.  On one hand, his complete lack of sentimentality might be a good change from Noah's artistic temperament.  However, I wasn't impressed by the fact that he was drinking while on call (or was that a joke and he was drinking coke?) and the way he was two-faced with the mother of his patient.  Interesting that the doctor lives in Harlem... especially since Helen is reverting to the "wild girl" she was when she and Noah lived there.  And he did have a good rapport with the kids...

 

Can anyone tell me if Martin was being a baby about the injections or if they really do hurt that much?  I don't have enough experience in that area to judge.

 

I felt really sorry for Alison in this episode, having to go through a dangerous, scary, early delivery on her own.  Especially when she said she didn't want the baby--don't know if that was just fear of if that was her real feelings coming out.  Either way, it was a nice parallel to Helen's confession that sometimes she hates being a mother.  Glad she seemed to bond with the baby in the end.  I'm also glad she didn't immediately allow Noah into the room when he finally showed up.  However, the salient point is that the baby was "5 weeks early" but sure looked full term...

 

Just when you thought Noah couldn't get worse...Really?  cocaine during a business meeting?  Also, even if he misplaced his phone, couldn't he have called Alison from someone else's phone to see how she was doing in the hurricane?  Not only does he not seem to love her, but he seems completely indifferent to her! I really thought he might drown in the pool, given how high/drunk he was.  Did NOT expect the Whitney/Chrissy (from Williams--right?) hook up.  I thought at first that it was a drug-fueled dream, but I suspect it was real because Chrissy was with her.  I hope that awkward encounter scared him straight.  I also hope that it was his drugged up state that caused him to leave Whitney at a party where alcohol and drugs were flowing.  BTW, I'm a little concerned that Max was there too.  Is it possible that he got the girls invited or brought them with him?  It seems too much of a coincidence that Noah, Whitney and Max were all there separately.   I'm hoping that Noah's breakdown in the car was the start of his redemption--he needs it!

 

Max's unpleasantness--I wonder if he was really that bad or if Noah is just distancing himself from him emotionally.

 

Cole lost a lot of my sympathy.  Everything is about him, including Luisa's infertility.  Looks like Scotty was right on that count.  Is it possible that Scotty will end up as the better Lockhart?  Also, I hated the fact that he burned down Alison's house.   However, seeing Gabriel and hearing him seemed to be Cole acknowledging the guilt he feels for not going into the water with his son and "letting" him drown.  That's a good sign that maybe he's hit rock bottom and is ready for an upswing, hopefully paralleling what Noah experienced..

[grumpypanda]

I found it interesting that this episode wasn't shown through anyone's specific POV. I guess we are to take everything that happened as fact.

Noah perving out watching Whitney make out with some girl was disturbing. I actually think it was best that he left her there. She's 18 by now and forcing her to leave would have made things even more awakened.

Noah showed what a wonderful father he really is this episode, his oldest daughter is partying it up doing all kinds of crazy stuff and he misses the birth of his youngest daughter.

I want to feel sorry for Alison having her baby alone but I have a tough time finding sympathy for her.

What was up with the doctor? He might be a dick, he might be a nice guy. Either way he's smoking hot so I hope he stays awhile.

Edited November 30, 2015 by grumpypanda

[Ellaria]

Well, that wasn't terribly subtle. (Allison + Cole + baby)

No, it wasn't. Safe to say that it IS Cole's baby as many suspected. I'm a little surprised at the left turn that this show took with the paternity issue and the Lockhart curse. Let's see where it goes but I'm concerned.

The doctor turned out to be an asshole but I don't think that we are done with him yet. Is he good for Helen? Not sure.

That was quite the party...with Whitney and Max in attendance. Why does Whitney keep showing up everywhere?

Edited November 30, 2015 by Ellaria Sand

[racked]

What a great episode. It's hilarious to me that in the wake of Treem talking about how the writers love Noah so much they keep making him a worse and worse human being. I'd almost say he's cartoonish at this point but I know enough guys like him to say he's still realistic.

Martins doctor...I guess him being more real and not a total swoon worthy dream man is a good thing? That wrist kiss at the end was kind of hot.

I felt for Allison and do like her most of the time but if she's knowingly lying about the paternity of her child...that's pretty unforgivable. Ruth Wilson was amazing tonight though.

[izabella]

This episode told us that Noah is the kind of guy who would drive off in a hurricane if sufficiently motivated, and he'd do stupid things with his car.  Makes it seem possible that he'd drive off in a huff during a storm and run over Scotty.

 

Last we saw Cole, he was standing in the middle of the fire.  He obviously got out since he was doing fine at the trial.  So did he choose to get out, or did Lucia get him out of there?

[taragel]

It's really interesting to me that I never quite saw Cole as the way he was always described in interviews and occasionally even by the narrative in season one, as an emotionally-stunted repressing his feelings, man's man kind of guy, but in s2 in his own POV, he DOES finally come across that way. I thought that not only was he being a dramatic, self-involved jerk, but that the narrative itself was overly dramatic. Him hearing the baby cry as Alison gave birth was a little much. As was the fire. As was Noah seeing Whitney at that party to be honest. It'll be interesting to see if this really was a reckoning for both men. Looks like another time jump in the previews.

I was not getting what Helen saw in that doctor at all. Good-looking enough but he was a total jerk from the get-go (and without any charm at all, in my opinion). I guess she really does have a type. It was sort of funny to see the usual "bad bedside manner" trope flipped, but honestly I would hope that was a one-and-done.

It's difficult to tell how things are going to get from this point to the future-present where Alison is attending Cole's wedding and Noah and Allison and baby seem like a cozy little family when he gets arrested.

[izabella]

I was confused by Helen's segment.  At first I was happy she was getting some.  And it's amazing how much more comfortable basement sex looked compared to her sex-fest with Max in a luxury hotel.  But there were little red flags that would make me reduce him to 'slam bam, thank you man.'  Drinking while on call?  Calling a client a bitch in front of me?  Uh no.

 

 

He got another Tinder match right in front of Helen, so I'm not expecting him to stick around as a love interest for Helen.  Maybe a hook-up though.

[mjc570]

 I liked the doctor, and thought his behavior was absolutely realistic for a surgeon.  I would love it if he'd be a regular on the show, in a weird way I think he'd be good for Helen, and the kids. 

 

That party went on way too long.  I was so bored (watching in real time, couldn't FF), I actually started reading a book.  Thank goodness I looked up in time for the Whitney appearance.  I knew there was something that would happen to make Noah run out into the storm. 

 

Much as I like Louisa (and her straight-talking), her story WAS NOT FUNNY.  But - wasn't there mention in an earlier episode that Cole was  also remarried with a child? 

[Adultosaurus]

Wow. Good stuff. Didn't think it was possible for me to dislike Noah anymore and this episode happens and he sucks even more. He's doing drugs now, unbelievable. He left Whitney at the party, Really?!

 

Eww - he HAD to leave Whitney - he was about to try to join in Whitney's fun.

 

 

[iggysaurus]

Some people are referencing "So-and-so's POV" while talking about this episode but the way I interpreted it, this episode departed from the POV format. There were no title cards announcing it was anyone's POV, and it was instead based around what the characters were doing at particular times during the day. It showed Alison at 12 pm at first, and then Helen at 1 pm at the cafe, and so on through the night. So I think this episode was meant to show "reality," not someone's memory. 

[DiabLOL]

I don't much like Luisa i guess I find her sort of that mix of exhausting and boring. I can't bother to watch every episode since they met to verify but maybe he reacted the way he did was the ghosts of Allison and Gabriel were already weighing heavily on him and he was already seeing a future with Luisa and maybe she coudl have told him earlier before he fell deeply in love with her. Then again I'm sort of bored with their romance storyline as well. I just don't care about them being together. I find her abrasive.

 

The surgeon did indeed read realistic to me as well. I'm on the fence if he's a dick or not. On the one hand he was not awesome with the "needy bitch" comment about a patient who seemed to have good reason to call him (concern about her daughter's machine getting jammed up in a big storm) but I didn't feel like he was supposed to be all romance and roses to Helen at this point either. This was what, the second time they'd even seen one another? He's got the single hot rich guy in NYC thing going and so he's not about to delete his Tinder profile because a patient's mom screwed him in her basement. Personally I'd find him too much work. He would probably be a great guy if he fell for her but who needs that much misery. Helen's been through too much lately to be on needles and pins about which way he'll "swipe" day to day.

 

If I see Helen in one more depressing sex/romance scenario I don't know what I'm going to do.

 

After the shampoo scene I'd lost any potential to feel sympathy for Allison so I'm glad she was miserable tonight.

 

Noah is a terrible person.

 

Oh and yeah I'm still sore from the sledgehammer of who the daddy is. Five weeks "early" and Allison's screams mingled with Cole's overwrought fire scene and finally banishing Gabriel's ghost? I can't image they did all that for nothing. It would be insane.

[Adultosaurus]

I think Cole is the father, we won't see hot doctor again (which is good, no more sad sex for Helen), and Whitney killed Scotty (nothing new this episode, I just still really think it).

[jrlr]

Was a reason ever given for the Lockhart curse to skip an entire generation?  I'm trying to make sense of this: Gramps (presumably Cherry's father-in-law) becomes a child killer which makes the Lockharts cursed to die out, but his son (Cherry's husband and Cole and Scotty's father) son manages to avoid the curse and father four sons upon whom said curse is now, what, activated?  I know it's a picky point but it keeps bugging me even when I'm laughing out loud about the infamous curse.   

[ScoobieDoobs]

But there were little red flags that would make me reduce him to 'slam bam, thank you man.'  Drinking while on call?  Calling a client a bitch in front of me?  Uh no.

 

Totally.  I mean, look, the guy is hot as hell.  But drinking like a fish & acting like it's no biggie, while he knows he's gonna go back to the hospital?  And then calling the mother of a patient a "needy bitch"?  Man, that turned me off.  Was he showing he's human & flawed & not the perfect doctor?  Well, that would be OK.  But this I didn't care for.

 

So Treem, Cole is really gonna turn down millions from Alison?  Really?  This character is written so senselessly.  Btw, cue up spooky/skeery music . . . it's the Lockhart curse!!!!  Guess it's a good thing Alison kept the Bailey name, eh?

 

And what's next for Whitney, Treem?  Hooking?  Stripping?  Porn vids?  Yawners on this track, Treem.

 

Oh, and what a guy that Noah is, right?  His daughter is at a "wild" party & instead of yanking her the fuck outta there & being concerned about her, Noah leaves all embarrassed, while buttoning up his pants.  You may love this character, Treem, but he still seems like a shithead to me.

 

Max?  What is there to say?  Treem & her crew know how to write major league assholes.

Edited November 30, 2015 by ScoobieDoobs

[Adultosaurus]

You may love this character, Treem, but he still seems like a shithead to me.

 

I don't think her loving the character and him being a shithead are mutually exclusive things.  I believe she's written him as a shithead on purpose.

[Muffyn]

It’s pretty funny when one of the sexiest sex scenes was between Helen and Dr. Muscle Heart on a basement floor.  I enjoyed the reality moment of her moving something her head was smacking into. 

 

If we were supposed to feel sorry for Noah at any point in this episode that was a fail.  Wow!  If ever someone deserved to be stuck in the mud in a hurricane, it is Noah.  Father, husband and partner of the year.   I thought he was going to drown in the pool or try to get close to the wrong woman and get into a fight.  Little did I know the wrong woman would be his daughter.  Is being a bad boy author really a thing?

[ScoobieDoobs]

Wow, Eden looked so different with her hair NOT in that flat, flat, flat stick straight style we've only seen her with.  I almost didn't recognize her in the hazy party scene.  Sheesh, I can't stand her flirty/teasing style, but a lot of PR chicks do operate this way.  I cringed when the slimy producer smacked her ass & she pretended to enjoy it.  But this does happen.  I've seen it & been nauseated by it.

[HunterHunted]

I have to call double shenanigans on George Clooney wanting to play Noah in the film version of Noah's self indulgent masterpiece and George Clooney wanting to come to hellscape of a party. The man just married a human rights lawyer. For the past 25 years, his closest friends have been the Hollywood version of the PTA. If they said DiCaprio was coming to the party, I'd believe that. And a slightly fictionalized Noah is exactly like a character Leo would play.

[Adultosaurus]

I have to call double shenanigans on George Clooney wanting to play Noah in the film version of Noah's self indulgent masterpiece and George Clooney wanting to come to hellscape of a party. The man just married a human rights lawyer. For the past 25 years, his closest friends have been the Hollywood version of the PTA. If they said DiCaprio was coming to the party, I'd believe that. And a slightly fictionalized Noah is exactly like a character Leo would play.

 

I think you're being a little too literal for a dramatic serial.  George Clooney was used because of his status and his approximate age to Noah.  The real life man marrying a human rights attorney doesn't have anything to do with it - and what's with the Leo shade? :)

[Glade]

I didn't appreciate the format of the show being abandoned for a "very special episode!"  A lot of the psychological drama is lost without the split narratives and then this resembles a lot of other night-time soaps.

 

I really hate Luisa.  She's insensitive, self-righteous, stereotypical and one-dimensional.   You can't compare pain and trauma, or how it effects people long term.  Also, Cole doesn't have to take care of his family.  I'm sure with the family business and with his father committing suicide when he was 10, he felt like he had to take care of them, but he doesn't.  They are all capable of fending for themselves, Cherry's pseudo-curse means there are no children, or elderly relatives.  Shaming Cole for leaving his emotionally toxic family is wrong.  I hope after this Cole finds someone else, someone who isn't so invested in shaming men for having emotional pain or for not being 'providers' to people who don't need it.  Cole doesn't need a lifetime of trashy quarrels with her. 

 

If that really was Whitney, she certainly has no qualms about embarrassing herself via making huge public scenes. I kept expecting to see Max recording Noah on his smartphone for some petty revenge, but maybe he just left?  I really don't like the way Noah is being written anymore, it's kind of insulting.  I hope that this is supposed to be a turn-around arc for the character, but I don't think he really needs to hit rock bottom in order to change.

Edited November 30, 2015 by Glade

[ScoobieDoobs]

Sorry to bring up the Millennial discussion in this thread too, but it was brought up in this ep. So that server gal snidely said to Helen how Tinder is for Millennials, whereas Match would be for divorced people like her (translation -- oldsters over 40 like Helen). Really? Who says? Is server gal speaking for Treem & her crew in this POV? I know zillions of 40-plus-ers who use Tinder. Even Andy Cohen, who is 47, says he uses it all the time. Is this Treem (who I still think is kinda/sorta a Millennial herself) mocking us over-40's again? Guess it's just me (silly old, old, old over-40 me) & I'm projecting & plenty will disagree. Well, at least those under 40 will probably disagree.

 

Btw, was this the first ep where there was no POV? So Noah actually did leave Whitney at the fuck party & couldn't care less about her? Nice.

 

I kept expecting to see Max recording Noah on his smartphone for some petty revenge, but maybe he just left?

 

I expected Max to be filming Whitney doing it with that chick & whoever else & himself too, no doubt.

 

 

I think you're being a little too literal for a dramatic serial. George Clooney was used because of his status and his approximate age to Noah. The real life man marrying a human rights attorney doesn't have anything to do with it - and what's with the Leo shade? :)

 

This kind of party would not be Clooney's scene at all now. Maybe some years ago, but def not now. It looked like something out of Entourage. And that's very much Leo's thing -- even still. He is 41 now, so he's only a few years younger than Noah. Just one quick look at the Daily Mail will show you Leo's thing is for billions of hot 20 year old models. He'd totally fit in at this party. No Leo shade, that's just who he is.

Edited December 4, 2015 by AmandaPanda

[Adultosaurus]

 

If that really was Whitney, she certainly has no qualms about embarrassing herself via making huge public scenes. I kept expecting to see Max recording Noah on his smartphone for some petty revenge, but maybe he just left?  I really don't like the way Noah is being written anymore, it's kind of insulting.  I hope that this is supposed to be a turn-around arc for the character, but I don't think he really needs to hit rock bottom in order to change.

 

If that really was Whitney?  Her screaming "Dad, what the fuck are you doing?" sorta seals that it was Whitney.

[Quiche]

Not my favorite episode.  The best part was at the end when Allison told the doctor to let Noah wait will she spent more time with her newborn baby.  Go Allison!  Now she's getting her priorities straight.

It was during Cole's segment that I realized why Allison was determined to get rid of the beach house.  Too many bad memories with Gabriel and maybe she's afraid of another child drowning.

IMO, both Noah and Cole are worthless.  Both are creeps.  It just is that Cole is more sexy.

All the sudden Whitney is age 18?  Wasn't it just last episode when Cole was hustling Scotty away because she supposedly was jailbait.  Someone has to tell the writers that in New York State the age of consent is 17.  At age 17, Whitney was no longer jailbait.

Someone also has to tell Helen that the doctor is a creep.  But it's good to see that she's moving on, however hard it is as a mother alone.  I have a feeling that Noah was screwing around continually throughout their marriage and Allison wasn't the first fling, the way he's going at it now.

[Adultosaurus]

This kind of party would not be Clooney's scene at all now.  Maybe some years ago, but def not now.  It looked like something out of Entourage.  And that's very much Leo's thing -- even still.  He is 41 now, so he's only a few years younger than Noah.  Just one quick look at the Daily Mail will show you Leo's thing is for billions of hot 20 year old models.  He'd totally fit in at this party.  No Leo shade, that's just who he is.

 

It wasn't about it being Clooney's (in your mind as a fan of the man) scene.  It was about removing yourself from that and thinking about it from Noah's standpoint as an author who has written a book that appeals to the middle-aged mind.

 

Seriously - Daily Mail?

 

The CHARACTER of Noah would respond to Clooney.  You are projecting real life into this drama.

[DiabLOL]

Treem is possibly a Millennial? That explains a lot. Now I know I'm not in good hands here.

The George Clooney story line was really too much. If they wanted me to stop rolling my eyes at stuff like this they should have made the passages from Noah's book suck way less.

The more I think about it the more I hope Cole doesn't marry Luisa. I find her so obnoxious and pushy.

PS I know people in their 40s 50s and 60s who use Tinder.

[Bama]

Man, Cole was such an asshole to Luisa.

 

Luisa - "Oh hey, I had this horrible thing happen to me 10 years before I met you and as a result I am infertile and unable to have children."

 

Cole - "OF COURSE YOU CAN'T BECAUSE MY FAMILY IS CURSED!  IT'S A CURSE SO POWERFUL IT DESTROYED YOUR UTERUS A DECADE AGO BECAUSE YOU WERE DESTINED TO FALL IN LOVE WITH MY MISERABLE, ALCOHOLIC, PYROMANIC ASS!!!"

 

Shut up, Cole.

[Irlandesa]

I really hate Luisa.  She's insensitive, self-righteous, stereotypical and one-dimensional.   You can't compare pain and trauma, or how it effects people long term. 

She wasn't comparing pain.  She was sharing a painful event from her past and instead of offering any sympathy or empathy, he's all "why meeeeeeeeeee...curse, curse, curse." 

 

So that server gal snidely said to Helen how Tinder is for Millennials, whereas Match would be for divorced people like her (translation -- oldsters over 40 like Helen).  Really?  Who says?  Is server gal speaking for Treem & her crew in this POV?  I know zillions of 40-plus-ers who use Tinder.  Even Andy Cohen, who is 47, says he uses it all the time.  Is this Treem (who I still think is kinda/sorta a Millennial herself) mocking us over-40's again?  Guess it's just me (silly old, old, old over-40 me) & I'm projecting & plenty will disagree.  Well, at least those under 40 will probably disagree.

I'm months under 40 and I admit, the "Milennial Treem out to mock the old folk" argument escapes me. Especially in this instance.  The doctor, who looks to be over 40, was also on Tinder.  To me, it seemed like the snotty waitress was clueless and making assumptions. She was wrong, not Helen.  It reminded me a bit of how surprised some people were once their parents started joining Facebook.

[HunterHunted]

I think you're being a little too literal for a dramatic serial.  George Clooney was used because of his status and his approximate age to Noah.  The real life man marrying a human rights attorney doesn't have anything to do with it - and what's with the Leo shade? :)

I am a little bit, but I think they just hadn't thought through it enough in the writers room. They wanted a "name" and thought George is around the same age, but Clooney is 54 and DiCaprio is actually 41. DiCaprio has his own production company, is a known modelizer, and a founding member of the Pussy Posse. My Leo comments aren't shade. They're truth.

[Adultosaurus]

 So that server gal snidely said to Helen how Tinder is for Millennials, whereas Match would be for divorced people like her (translation -- oldsters over 40 like Helen).  Really?  Who says?  

 

 

 

I don't think the waitress was being snide at all.  Tinder IS a hookup app.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Someone also has to tell Helen that the doctor is a creep. 

 

Honestly, when he said the mother of his patient was a needy bitch, that was all I needed to tell Helen to run.  And yet he clearly helped Martin, so he is a good doctor.  It's confusing.  My best friend is a doctor.  It's tricky.  Doctors are thought to be perfect & saints.  They're not.  They're human beings & flawed like everyone else & can be over-worked & tired.  I'm not passing total judgement on Dr. Hottie yet, cuz well, he's super hot & he was really great with helping Martin.  Look, I'm pretty turned off by the name-calling & the drinking, but I'd still give him a chance.

[Adultosaurus]

I am a little bit, but I think they just hadn't thought through it enough in the writers room. They wanted a "name" and thought George is around the same age, but Clooney is 54 and DiCaprio is actually 41. DiCaprio has his own production company, is a known modelizer, and a founding member of the Pussy Posse. My Leo comments aren't shade. They're truth.

 

They can be truth - they are just out of step.  You're mixing reality with a show.  That's kinda weird.

Honestly, when he said the mother of his patient was a needy bitch, that was all I needed to tell Helen to run.  And yet he clearly helped Martin, so he is a good doctor.  It's confusing.  My best friend is a doctor.  It's tricky.  Doctors are thought to be perfect & saints.  They're not.  They're human beings & flawed like everyone else & can be over-worked & tired.  I'm not passing total judgement on Dr. Hottie yet, cuz well, he's super hot & he was really great with helping Martin.  Look, I'm pretty turned off by the name-calling & the drinking, but I'd still give him a chance.

 

I'll bet you anything we'll never see hottie doctor again.  He served his purpose.  He was there to teach Helen how to soothe some of her perceived pains.

[truthaboutluv]

but I'll just say for now that I think Cole is the father of Alison's baby and they're going to remarry.

 

 

I agree with the first part but HELL TO THE NO on the second part. If the child is indeed Cole's, I'm convinced that Alison  has known that fact. At the least, she's known there was a question of the baby's paternity and said nothing so seriously, fuck her. And Luisa is good for Cole in my opinion. 

 

I like Cole, but what she told him tonight needed to be said. Yes, he has been through some really, really shitty and fucked up things - his son dies (and judging by his hallucination it's clear he harbors guilt about Gabriel's drowning being his fault), wife checks out on him and their marriage in her grief and proceeds to cheat on him and leave him for another man, family loses their livelihood and legacy and turns out they'e way more batshit crazy than he realized. 

 

So yeah, he's been dealt a really shitty hand but at some point you can't keep wallowing and feeling sorry for yourself and that's really what Cole was doing. He's basically just been sleepwalking through his life since the separation with Alison and his family losing the ranch. And it's time he lets go and put one foot forward as Luisa told him. And clearly he did that if his appearance in the courtroom in present day was anything to go by. And hell maybe if he'd stopped feeling sorry for himself for a minute he'd have done the math on that baby a long time ago. 

 

I'm so disappointed that the doctor turned out to be an asshole. Was it just me or did he get uglier the more and more he talked?

 

 

Agreed. I couldn't understand why the writers went this route with him and then all I could surmise is that maybe Helen is just attracted to assholes and she doesn't realize it - Noah, Max and now this guy. Like can poor Helen catch a break here?

 

Well, that wasn't terribly subtle. (Allison + Cole + baby)

 

 

Yup. Last week I was still weighing the possibility that the child would turn out to be Noah's after all and this is all for the drama and for the truth about Alison's fight with Scotty to come out and the fact that there was a question of paternity which she never told Noah. But now I'm thinking that kid's Cole. There was even a point when Alison was screaming and it goes back to Cole and it's almost like his subconscious was hearing her screams. 

 

Can anyone tell me if Martin was being a baby about the injections or if they really do hurt that much?

 

 

Well apparently Helen was flustered and upset having to administer them and so apparently her hands shook a lot which was causing it to hurt. And it looked like Martin tenses up which from experience, will make an injection hurt more. 

 

However, the salient point is that the baby was "5 weeks early" but sure looked full term...

 

 

Exactly. The baby wasn't early - it was only early to Alison's delusional mind that wants to believe the baby's Noah when she probably knows very well she's not. 

 

Is it possible that Scotty will end up as the better Lockhart?

 

 

Scotty had sex with and knocked up 16 year old Witney...so I feel like the answer to that is a resounding NO. 

 

So Treem, Cole is really gonna turn down millions from Alison?  Really?  This character is written so senselessly.

 

 

I think that line actually confirmed what many have speculated, that he DOES in fact take the money and that's how he buys the Lobster Roll. To be honest, I don't find it so hard to believe Cole would initially reject money from Alison and would feel like she's offering it partly out of guilt since she cheated on him (and he doesn't even know about the Oscar sex as well) and left him for another guy. 

 

And what's next for Whitney, Treem?  Hooking?  Stripping?  Porn vids?  Yawners on this track, Treem.

 

 

Because she was making out with another girl? It didn't seem like they were doing it for the male gaze in my opinion. For one thing they were off in a smaller part of the pool and were wearing their bathing suits and seemed very much into each other. 

 

So was I supposed to feel for Noah with that little boo-hoo session in his car? Um, because I was just torn between laughter and rolling my eyes very, very hard. 

Edited November 30, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[ScoobieDoobs]

I'm months under 40 and I admit, the "Milennial Treem out to mock the old folk" argument escapes me. Especially in this instance.  The doctor, who looks to be over 40, was also on Tinder.  To me, it seemed like the snotty waitress was clueless and making assumptions. She was wrong, not Helen.  It reminded me a bit of how surprised some people were once their parents started joining Facebook.

 

Well, come back here after those precious months until you turn 40 & let's see if you feel differently.  It does make a difference.  The waitress is saying the words Treem puts in her mouth.  But I'm not sure now if she was snide.  She seemed to be smirking at Helen, but maybe not.  And yeah, I didn't even think about how Dr. Hottie coulda said to the waitress he was using Tinder too.  In the end it's none of her business.  I woulda been annoyed at a server getting in my business.  But maybe that's just me.  Honestly, I don't feel all that strongly about this issue -- it was just a vague feeling I got & was wondering if anyone else felt the same.

[Adultosaurus]

Well, come back here after those precious months until you turn 40 & let's see if you feel differently.  It does make a difference.  The waitress is saying the words Treem puts in her mouth.  But I'm not sure now if she was snide.  She seemed to be smirking at Helen, but maybe not.  And yeah, I didn't even think about how Dr. Hottie coulda said to the waitress he was using Tinder too.  In the end it's none of her business.  I woulda been annoyed at a server getting in my business.  But maybe that's just me.  Honestly, I don't feel all that strongly about this issue -- it was just a vague feeling I got & was wondering if anyone else felt the same.

The waitress wasn't being snide - viewers of a certain age who date on social medial are going to feel that way, though.  The waitress was in cahoots with Helen about Dr. Hottie's hottness.  Tinder is a hookup app...that's not really up for debate.

[ScoobieDoobs]

Because she was making out with another girl? And it didn't seem like they were doing it for the male gaze - for one thing they were off in a smaller part of the pool and were wearing their bathing suits and seemed very much into each other. 

 

Well, that part was OK actually.  But the "shock" of it was intended for us.  And that's why I was asking -- so what outlandish stuff is Treem gonna go for next with Whitney?  I'd like it to be something more interesting & maybe subtle.  This character is all over the place.

[Adultosaurus]

Well, that part was OK actually.  But the "shock" of it was intended for us.  And that's why I was asking -- so what outlandish stuff is Treem gonna go for next with Whitney?  I'd like it to be something more interesting & maybe subtle.  This character is all over the place.

 

I disagree.  The shock wasn't that Whitney was making out with a woman.  The shock for us was that her shitbag Dad tried to join in.

[bunnywithanaxe]

I thought the waitress was genuinely trying to be helpful. Maybe in a slightly patronizing "Old folk don't know dating apps" way, but still, I think her heart was in the right place.

I think this makes the first occasion I can think of where Noah actually has an attack of remorse. What a wake up call.  And good Lord, poor Whitney.

Luisa called it, as far as I am concerned.  I'm glad she didn't let the"curse" comment pass.

 

I think Noah burned the house to get back at Alison, but I also bet there is a hefty insurance policy involved.

 

[Glade]

She wasn't comparing pain. 

 

Yes, she was.  She said to him "bad things have happened to me too, but I put one foot in front of the other."  Which is comparing pain, comparing responses to trauma and saying she's better then he is.   No, he didn't respond well to what she shared, because obviously it triggered strong emotions for him.  And then Luisa went off on him and made it about a bunch of other stuff, including that he drives a cab and isn't financially supporting his family.  It seems pretty clear to me that both he and Alison are suffering from PTSD after their son's death.  It really sucks when people's reaction to your PTSD is "wow, you're such a loser/such an asshole."