B&B: What's Up Today at Forrester Creations? - Daily Chat

[Artsda]

Bill tried to kill Ridge, blew up Sally in a building, among other things but he did all that for his family? Taylor shot Bill.

So it's ok for they to try to kill people but Deacon is irredeemable?

[BoldDays]

While I agree Bill throwing shade is ridiculous I’m just enjoying having him back on my TV screen. Between DD and SK, my soap opera crush level is on maximum overload.

And it was only when $Bill and Liam were speaking about Beth that I realised that her grandparents are $Bill, Deacon, and Brooke. That’s some gene pool! If she doesn’t turn out to be the swaggiest most stunning kid ever, it’s a crime. Just need to ensure Hope keeps up with the Sharpe swagger she’s suddenly discovered. Oh, and work out how to keep her away from her mind-numbingly dull father…

[Anna Yolei]

7 hours ago, Waldo13 said:

Didn’t Stuffy sleep with Bill when he was still married to Katie?  

She tried to. Steffy however was stupid enough to do this in the house with her mother, who cockblocked her and told her "Um excuse me, WTF r u doing." Which is a complete turnaround from the advice she'd give her two years later about going after Liam when the Italy wedding proven  invalid on a technically, but I digress.

But to answer the question, they've only banged the one time.

5 hours ago, Skarzero said:

Off tangent: Only thing worse than this would be Summer whining to Nick about Sharon stealing him away from her own ain't shit mommy

While I mostly view Summer as Steffy without any of her very few positive traits, I will give her credit on this: she is quick to call out Nick and especially The Mantis on their bullshit and I've heard her mention more than once that Phyllis blows up her own relationships. Other than whatever the absolute fuck that was with her simping for bargain bin Ridge aka Billy, she's mostly just done with her parents' shit and never in a million years would she encourage either to go back to the other. Even for an intellect that would make Homer Simpson look like MENSA material, even she is not that stupid.

Great, B&B is so bad, I've just spent an entire paragraph defending that worthless lemming. Thanks, Show :|

[RuntheTable]

Thank the Lord for FF'd buttons; makes days like yesterday much more manageable. 

I watched about five minutes of the Marone gang, and yelp, FF'd. I didn't need to watch it cause I have heard the same nonsense for the past two days: Brooke is the antichrist, the Logan's are the scourge of the earth, they need their parents back together, and blah, blah, blah. 

Poor Bill, they are really trying to ruin him too. All we get from him lately is him begging Katie for another chance and then scenes like yesterday, where you want to smack the taste out of his mouth. 

But the winner of the biggest asshat of the day has to go to Liam. Did this bonehead actually try to say Bill's transgressions were acceptable because he did it "for family?" I..........WHAT? Lookie here stupid ass, it doesn't matter the fucking reasons, if you break the law, you break the damn law. If you harm someone, then you harm someone. The only plausible reason is self defense. Bill did what he did because he could and because he wanted to. Was he thinking about his fucking family when he mounted your wife? Was he thinking about his family when he conspired to ruin you and Hope? How about when he punched you in the face and disinherited you? Worse still was the underlying elitist vibe, clearly saying that those with money and means are exempt from contempt and consequences for their actions. Bill doesn't have blood on his hands, but he certainly hasn't proven to be a nice guy, or above breaking the law and hurting those he loves. OTOH, Taylor, Steffy and Thomas have all been responsible for the death of at least one person and have attempted to kill again. Ridge also has no blood on his hands, but is a serial waffler and betrayer, who allowed his mother to control his life. All of these clowns are acting like spoiled children who aren't getting their way and are making Deacon shine like the brightest diamond. They are all running their yaps about how horrible he is, and how he hasn't changed, and how he is going to do this or that. But what evidence do they really have other than their over active imaginations? Deacon has done nothing. He comes to see Hope when she invites him, he has not once risen to the challenges that Ridge has thrown out, has not lost his cool one time, has allowed Ridge to insult him and manhandle him, all the while repeating that all he wants is to get to know his daughter. Deacon doesn't really have to do anything to right the ship; these idiots are doing all the heavy lifting for him. 

And just look at him though? Deacon is an absolute breath of fresh air. Picking up that mop to clean the floors, and almost giving in to the awfulness of it, but no, he thought about Hope and realized this was just the beginning and he had to stay the course. Then going to his little broom closet and laying down and smiling?  Heavens! But I wanted to go through my screen and give him a big ole "ATTA BOY!" I love how he keeps trying to lighten things up, like the other day reminding Brooke about how they were together, and yesterday with his phone saying "girl just won't leave me alone". And other than Hope, he is the only one making Brooke smile. He isn't a Debbie Downer. He brings positivity and the thought that maybe things can be better. 

Deacon makes me happy. Deacon makes me smile. 

[Skarzero]

6 hours ago, Anna Yolei said:

While I mostly view Summer as Steffy without any of her very few positive traits, I will give her credit on this: she is quick to call out Nick and especially The Mantis on their bullshit and I've heard her mention more than once that Phyllis blows up her own relationships.

Lol, is it weird that I'm the opposite? I've almost always found Summer to be more defendable than Steffy. Not likeable mind you just defendable. Maybe it's cos I watched Y&R long before I watched B&B. 

But yes, at least Summer calls out her parents as stated, I'll also add that she doesn't make her childhood ills, real or perceived, Sharon's or her children's problem. She took shit up with the woman actually responsible, her sucky ass mother. While she did so pathetically and stupidly, she still did it. Now what does Steffy do? Brooke's drama this, Brooke stole my daddy that, mommy is such a good human, Logan wahmen bad! Blah blah...I find it hilarious that I'm supposed to root for this chick as the underdog boss queen when she's dumber than Dummer Newman herself! With her own shitty, hypocritical attitude, thrown in the mix! Steffy bullied Hope just like Summer bullied that kid(name has escaped me), Steffy is just lucky Hope never tried to take her own life because of it. Summer manages to have a good relationship with Faith (for now) despite not liking her mother. Meanwhile, Steffy and Thomass are ready to put their own baby brother out just cos Taylor came back to hell with Brooke and her genes.  

I could go on but that's all I can stand lmao, most Y&R cast seems more defensible than B&B. Not morally, but certainly narratively. Even Grampire, and Adam. That's how bad the characterizations are over here when the weakest female Newman is narratively on par with the "strongest" female Forrester somebody fucked up, big time.   

6 hours ago, Anna Yolei said:

Great, B&B is so bad, I've just spent an entire paragraph defending that worthless lemming. Thanks, Show :|

It's gonna get worse XD, since Taylor is back I have a feeling in a few weeks we'll have an easier time defending Buttbiscuit than just about any of the clowns in L.A 😂😂😂

Edited December 10, 2021 by Skarzero

[Anna Yolei]

3 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

Ridge also has no blood on his hands

No, but he was still willing to let Nick take the fall for that Shane McGrath bloke who shot himself when Ridge used his boat to dump the body.

3 hours ago, Skarzero said:

But yes, at least Summer calls out her parents as stated, I'll also add that she doesn't make her childhood ills, real or perceived, Sharon's or her children's problem. She took shit up with the woman actually responsible, her sucky ass mother.

Yep.

Given how close in age Summer and Faith would be if not for SORASing and the fact that infidelity is the reason they both exist, the whole "you stole my daddy!" bit would've made far more sense than it ever did for Steffy. Because Brooke or no Brooke, Taylor was gone for most of their childhood. For all of Ridge a fault, being an absentee father was not one of them.

3 hours ago, Skarzero said:

we'll have an easier time defending Buttbiscuit than just about any of the clowns in L.A 😂😂😂

That's the most depressing thing I'll read all day 🙃

[Foghorn Leghorn]

NuTaylor looks a lot like OldTaylor before she became FakeTaylor!  Ridge melted when he saw her after yet another temper tantrum about Deacon.  

Love Deacon!  He really is enjoying his scenes especially with Sheila.  Glad he won’t succumb to her “charms”….

[madfortv]

When Steffy and Taylor started talking about how Taylor couldn't return earlier because of Ridge and Brooke, I zoned out.  The writers need to be fired like yesterday.

Added:  I like the the actress playing Taylor but the story line is a joke.

Edited December 10, 2021 by madfortv
Added mention about new Taylor.

[LittleIggy]

Now Taylor and Stuffy can share bad wigs.

[Gam2]

I also wondered why nuTaylor’s hair looked so bad that she had to cover it with a bad wig.

[backhometome]

NuTaylor looks pretty similar to pre surgery face HT. 

[TobinAlbers]

55 minutes ago, Gam2 said:

I also wondered why nuTaylor’s hair looked so bad that she had to cover it with a bad wig.

Krista Allen said she had literally cut her hair down to a pixie cut the day before she got the call re Taylor. She bought a wig on Amazon to help her in the audition since she knew Taylor's hair was longer. Today's wig is supposedly temporary as she said they've been working on her look and have hit on a better wig supposedly. We'll see.

I'll give B&B this. They've slowly folded in returning characters (Sheila, Deacon, and Taylor) where when they each hit, they cause a ripple effect; just as they recovered from Sheila, here comes Deacon; as they're getting their bearings on Deacon, here comes Taylor.  It's causing a nice perfect storm where characters are galvanized in more organic ways (although Taylor's issue in returning should be Sheila's presence; she should be wrathful this woman showed her face but also harbor some fear of her given she nearly killed her once before).  I'll enjoy it while it lasts since this show will start strong (Quarter) and then crash and burn.

[Waldo13]

 Krista Allen looks like see could be Hunter Tylo’s kid sister. DID TIIC do that on purpose?  

It looks like Stuffy and Lurch will get their family back because when Ridge sees the younger version of Taylor, how can he resist. Maybe he will check out a few of her Emanuel movies 😜.  Ridge looks at Taylor and it’s like Brooke who?  

WTF Brooke!  Ridge works with Stuffy and Lurch and drops in with Stuffy anytime he wants so isn’t that enough time?  

Round and round we go. The wheels on the hate bus go round and round.  

Ridge you are so dumb. Right in front of Hope you tell Brooke that Deacon was the worse mistake of her life. A Schmuck personified. 

[Anna Yolei]

Is KKL writing her own lines? Cuz Brooke was right that Taylor could show up and make the effort if she wanted to.

Thus far Krista Allen looks fine as nuTaylor. The wig they got for her needs some moisturizer but it's far from the worst wig on the show. It's too bad she's still hung up on Ridge though.

ETA: after finishing the episode, I gotta say once again that Ridge is DUCH a petulant child, by far the brattiest he's ever been and that's saying a lot when he was willing to drive FC out of business because he had a fight with Rick or Eric or some other bollocks.

He's really not used to Brooke not falling for his "respect muh authoritah!" routine. Too effing bad.

Also rich of him to accuse Hope of falling for a "little girl fantasy" when his own spawn are still making shit up about the wonderful life they had before Big Bad Brooke got in their way and he didn't do boo to discourage that shit. Gee Ridge, did it ever occur to you that if you'd been truly caring of Hope that maybe she wouldn't need to have this connection to begin with? Ridge of all people should know biology does not a family make.

Edited December 11, 2021 by Anna Yolei

[Anna Yolei]

2 hours ago, Waldo13 said:

WTF Brooke!  Ridge works with Stuffy and Lurch and drops in with Stuffy anytime he wants so isn’t that enough time?  

And this is why I can't completely hate Brooke. After all those rotten brats have done to her and Hope, she can still say she loves them and feels bad that they feel this way.

[CountryGirl]

NuTaylor looks more like Steffy’s older sister. She should be catnip to Ridge. 

[CharlizeCat]

That's exactly what I came here to say. NuTaylor looks very young compared to Brooke and Sheila. (She is! She's a good 10+ years behind KLL and KB). I noticed the contrast between KA and JMW. KA doesn't look old enough to be her mother. 

Obviously, I can't really form an opinion until I've seen several episodes, but I immediately liked KA. She seems to be bringing a warmth to the character that I felt just wasn't there. While HTy was stunningly beautiful (before), I always felt she made Taylor seem very cold and reserved. I don't know if that was a conscious decision or just overall lack of acting skills. I also noticed the way Taylor looked Ridge up and down when they first looked at each other. I hope it wasn't KA thinking, "Oh, dear ... this is the subject of decades of angst?" 

I hated the way Ridge stood in front of Hope and (again) chided her about her affair with Deacon, saying it was her "biggest mistake ever." Burn. I wish would speak up to that ogre and set him straight that it was none of his business because he was married to Taylor at the time. I wish she'd throw in that she loved Deacon at the time, but you know she's never going to admit that. 

BTW, isn't about time for TK to go on his 6-month sabbatical? I mean any time now!

[hypnotoad]

Quote

NuTaylor looks more like Steffy’s older sister.

I think she looks younger than Steffy! I mean they did a good job with the casting, since she certainly resembles original face Taylor.

Quote

Round and round we go. The wheels on the hate bus go round and round. 

I am so over this same conversation again and again and again. It almost makes me wish we could go back to Eric's alleged ED. By the way, what is happening with Eric and Quinn? I mean Ridge, Brooke and Katie were soooo invested in all of that. Does no one wonder about the outcome?!?

I do not understand why this show cannot manage more than one story at a time. These endless conversations about one topic is ridiculous. I wonder if the actors ever say 'so is this a new script or the same one from yesterday and the day before?'

[Anna Yolei]

9 minutes ago, hypnotoad said:

It almost makes me wish we could go back to Eric's alleged ED.

Nothing is as bad as that story was, but at least no one could chose it for lack of originality!

11 minutes ago, hypnotoad said:

I do not understand why this show cannot manage more than one story at a time.

Right. And it has nothing to do with the show being a half hour long because the entire first season determined that was a lie. As did every other half hour soap, which prior to the 1980s was the industry standard. This is a Brad Bell problem because he doesn't understand how pacing or plotting works or realize that a soap opera should never have one story or character carrying the show. He did fuck all to set up for an eventuality without Susan Flannery and boy did that show real quick and she and RM both left at the same time.

He's a bigger hack than George Lucas--Bell had a show gift wrapped to him and he managed to run it into the ground.

[norcalgal]

35 minutes ago, hypnotoad said:

I think she looks younger than Steffy! I mean they did a good job with the casting, since she certainly resembles original face Taylor.

 

46 minutes ago, CharlizeCat said:

That's exactly what I came here to say. NuTaylor looks very young compared to Brooke and Sheila. (She is! She's a good 10+ years behind KLL and KB). I noticed the contrast between KA and JMW. KA doesn't look old enough to be her mother. 

Obviously, I can't really form an opinion until I've seen several episodes, but I immediately liked KA. She seems to be bringing a warmth to the character that I felt just wasn't there. While HTy was stunningly beautiful (before), I always felt she made Taylor seem very cold and reserved. 

Not that she’s aged horribly, but did anyone watch Krista Allen when she was on Days of our Lives decades ago?  She was absolutely gorgeous/stunning!!!  Does anyone know if she had work done, or if KA aged naturally? 

[Artsda]

Ridge grabbed the bottle of liquor then took it all the way to Steffy's? She doesn't have her own?

Funny how Taylor shot Bill but she's no danger to hurt anyone, only Deacon.

[RuntheTable]

It seems they went out of their way to find an actress that embodies a very young HT. She not only looks like original Taylor, she speaks like her too, in that soft, very feminine voice. 

I am not ready to make any assessments just yet; I want to see more interactions with Taylor's history, but I do agree with @CharlizeCat, that there is definitely more warmth, and I would also say, refinement, with this actress. 

I think they want us to forget the last few years and are trying to act like crazy Taylor never happened. She didn't sneak back to LA to shoot Bill, and she didn't cause a scene at Hope's wedding, and she didn't hit on Ridge, and she wasn't involved in baby buying. No, I think they want us to remember Taylor pre-James confession, when she and Ridge were happily married. And they want us to believe that Brooke interfered in their marriage and that Ridge didn't walk out on his lying, hypocritical wife. It also seems they are in full on Taylor redemption mode and have brought her halo back out of retirement and are letting each of her champions rub it to return its luster. First, we have Steffy waxing on about how wonderful her mom is, then we have Ridge warning Brooke off her negative Taylor comments, then we have Steffy once again, extolling to her mom about all her good deeds, going over there to help out those less fortunate. And all because of Brooke. But Taylor is back now! She has regained her courage, and is willing to fight the big bad wolf of LA. No, her return has absolutely nothing to do with seeing her new grandchild, or meeting her new son-in-law, or because Sheila has returned.  Oh, my, my, my. I do believe this is gonna be a tough ride for those of us who actually watched the real SLs. 

It is way past time for Brooke to call a bitch out. Ridge has crossed so many lines, and she just keeps making excuses for him. He's just stressed. He's just frustrated. He only wants the best for us. NO. NO. And NO. He is stressed and frustrated because you and Hope won't come to heel and obey his commands. And he only wants what is best for him; which is to act like Deacon never happened. But to have the audacity to stand in Hope's face and say that Deacon was Brooke's biggest mistake? Then what the fuck does that make Hope? And maybe it was her biggest mistake, but it isn't your call; you had made your choice back then, and it wasn't Brooke. And to have the further audacity to talk to Hope about a "little girl fantasy", when you just spent an entire afternoon listening to your grown ass children whining about wanting their mommy and daddy back together? Saying how they miss you, when they see you every fucking day, and have done so for their whole entire lives? How convenient for everyone to forget that the TayTots were always the winners in the battle of the families. Brooke and her children were seen as dispensable and disposable whenever the door was opened for Ridge to return home to his "real family." Bridget and Rick were continually let down by Ridge, who viewed them as playthings, to be put away when his real duty called. And Brooke has always been accused of being the bad parent. 

Hope has been treated no differently. Ridge has played at being a father figure to her, then of course there was Nick. But the girl has never had any continuity when it comes to her paternal parentage, and it is so absolutely egregious of Ridge to belittle, and make fun of, and attempt to humiliate Hope for wanting something every child wants, and for wanting something every child deserves. Well, every child but Deacon's. 

And just look at that clod. Eye fucking Taylor right out of the gate. And right there is one of the reasons you are such a waste. You run when the going gets tough. Brooke isn't obeying, so now you will turn to Taylor, and if it wasn't Taylor, it would be Shauna. And you will dump Brooke and Brooke will try to move on, and when she gets close to any type of real commitment you will start interfering, because Logan can't be happy without you. 

Deacon and Sheila are really a hoot. A much needed break from the nonsense. But is Sheila really hot for Deacon? I honestly can't get a handle on that. But I am glad Deacon is staying the course and doing the right things. 

What ever happened to Justin tailing Deacon? Seems he would have been reporting back about him and Sheila still seeing each other. 

 

Edited December 11, 2021 by RuntheTable

[Skarzero]

I really liked NuTaylor's outfit. She also seems calmer and less crazy. A step in the right direction even in the face of her ever present delusions about herself and Ridge. 

I maybe wouldn't mind a Taylor redemption arc if they actually focused on the relevant things they need to redeem her for. Instead of rug sweeping everything, telling us how great she is and parading her around as if she's the anti-thesis of Brooke (when she's so not). 

I don't have much to say about Ridge that hasn't been said already, but for good measure, Ridge eat shit. Where do you get off telling Brooke not to lay into Taylor when she (and her hateful daughter) have made a career out of dragging Brooke? Maybe if you had kept your Tay Tots in better check growing up Hope wouldn't feel the need for Deacon to be in her life. She'd actually feel the protection you claim you want to provide. Can TK's 6 month sabbatical come the fuck on already? Sheesh!! 

[hypnotoad]

Quote

This is a Brad Bell problem because he doesn't understand how pacing or plotting works or realize that a soap opera should never have one story or character carrying the show.

I wish I could like this a million times. This show is an absolute mess as far as pace and plot. I'm glad the show isn't an hour, because I know it wouldn't be any better with additional time - it would just be more repeating.

Quote

I think they want us to forget the last few years and are trying to act like crazy Taylor never happened. She didn't sneak back to LA to shoot Bill, and she didn't cause a scene at Hope's wedding, and she didn't hit on Ridge, and she wasn't involved in baby buying.

Well personally I'd rather we just ignore the last few years of Taylor because none of that seemed very Taylor to me. I'm not saying pretend it never happened, but rather not focus on it. Or acknowledge it and have her say she realizes she was off the rails and got therapy. Whatever. I suppose I will have to sit alone at my table because I am a semi-Taylor fan or at least a fan of the original Taylor way back when she was first on. I always preferred Taylor to Brooke.

Quote

I maybe wouldn't mind a Taylor redemption arc if they actually focused on the relevant things they need to redeem her for.

This. Also I sure wish she wasn't still pining for that idiot Ridge. Uggghh.

Quote

But to have the audacity to stand in Hope's face and say that Deacon was Brooke's biggest mistake? Then what the fuck does that make Hope? And maybe it was her biggest mistake, but it isn't your call; you had made your choice back then, and it wasn't Brooke.

No he should not be saying that kind of stuff to Hope. But I think that even if he was with Taylor at the time, hearing about that affair had to affect him in some way. Brooke was a huge part of Ridge's life and that affair was a big thing. I have no idea if they actually showed anything like that onscreen.

And Brooke's affair with Deacon probably was her biggest betrayal - I refuse to say mistake, it makes it sound as though she accidentally fell on Deacon's dick. Brooke made a choice and she made a supremely bad one. However, that doesn't mean the result of that betrayal is a negative. Hope has always tried to be a good person and she has managed to navigate the truth of her conception rather well.

[RuntheTable]

21 hours ago, hypnotoad said:

Well personally I'd rather we just ignore the last few years of Taylor because none of that seemed very Taylor to me. I'm not saying pretend it never happened, but rather not focus on it. Or acknowledge it and have her say she realizes she was off the rails and got therapy. Whatever. I suppose I will have to sit alone at my table because I am a semi-Taylor fan or at least a fan of the original Taylor way back when she was first on. I always preferred Taylor to Brooke.

Sorry, but I can't agree with that at all. Why should Taylor get a pass on her shitty and criminal behavior? I have never been a fan of the character, but I was able to tolerate her before she was fully under Stehpanie's auspices and became her henchwoman. Taylor lost her shit when Ridge called her out as a hypocrite and walked out on her. Her muddled mind could not process the fact that Ridge wasn't so upset about her betrayal with James, or even about keeping it a secret for decades; he was angry because Taylor had spent their whole entire marriage disparaging Brooke as a worthless tramp. The second big blow to Taylor was Stephanie's acceptance of Brooke at the end of her life. 

In truth, Taylor was her own worst enemy; she should never have accepted Ridge's proposal in St. Thomas. Yes, Ridge said all the right things, but deep down Taylor had to know differently. Brooke tried to tell her in a scene right after Taylor and Ridge returned. Brooke came to Taylor's office and told her this was just a ploy to keep her with Eric. After months of planning a future together, Ridge decided that he didn't want to take Brooke from his father and came up with a plan to make Brooke think he was stepping out. He asked a model to come to his place and act like they were having sex, which Brooke walked in on. At first she was devastated and believed it, but then Ridge disappears, and no one knows where he is, and Brooke starts doing some investigating and finds out about the model. So, when Taylor and Ridge get back, she goes to see her and tell her what Ridge had done, and how this marriage proposal was meant to seal the deal. Of course Taylor was having none of it, to which Brooke pointed out that as a doctor, Taylor should be able to see what was happening here, because everyone else did. But Taylor chose to live in her fantasy world and believe that Ridge had magically gotten past his feelings for Brooke overnight. Even so, I was always a bigger fan of Taylor and Ridge than him and Brooke. And I do believe he came to truly love Taylor, something I have never believed he feels for Brooke. She is more like a possession; his fall back girl when things go bad. Brooke should have hung that destiny shit up a long, long, time ago. 

None of that absolves Taylor from being held accountable for her actions. Brooke could have had her medical license revoked for reading another doctor's records. She could have had her arrested for shooting Bill. But she doesn't work that way because she isn't malicious like Taylor. I won't accept any whitewashing or handwaving away of Taylor's actions in order to redeem the character. I also want her to acknowledge that her urgency to secure a second child for Steffy, an action she thought would bring Liam back, is what set BethGate in motion. Yes, Taylor has much to answer for. 

21 hours ago, hypnotoad said:

No he should not be saying that kind of stuff to Hope. But I think that even if he was with Taylor at the time, hearing about that affair had to affect him in some way. Brooke was a huge part of Ridge's life and that affair was a big thing. I have no idea if they actually showed anything like that onscreen.

And Brooke's affair with Deacon probably was her biggest betrayal - I refuse to say mistake, it makes it sound as though she accidentally fell on Deacon's dick. Brooke made a choice and she made a supremely bad one. However, that doesn't mean the result of that betrayal is a negative. Hope has always tried to be a good person and she has managed to navigate the truth of her conception rather well.

Ridge had his chance to voice his opinion about Deacon decades ago. The only people who had any real say in what happened were Bridget and Eric, the betrayed and the betrayed's father, both of whom have long since moved passed it. But now Ridge keeps dragging it out and throwing it in Brooke and Hope's face; it is offensive and it is cruel. With the many heartless and horrible things he has done to Brooke he has very little wiggle room here, and I think it speaks volumes that Brooke is not pulling out any of those cards and lobbing them in his cloddish face. No, Brooke is trying to act like a civilized adult, and is trying to allow her daughter to have agency over her life and her choices. Ridge just wants his way, and he will say and do whatever he has to in order to get it. 

Edited December 12, 2021 by RuntheTable

[Anna Yolei]

4 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

In truth, Taylor was her own worst enemy; she should never have accepted Ridge's proposal in St. Thomas.

I had no idea that whole thing in St Thomas came about as a ploy on Ridge's behalf. No wonder Taylor had to resort to tricks and lies by omission to keep him.

I also agree that there's no way to whitewash her absolute insane behavior over the past few years (arguably beginning when she came back in '05 but I'll settle for the shit from 2013 onwards) and move the character forward. Taylor couldn't predict what Dr Buckingham would pull but her motivation for pushing this adoption to begin with had nothing to do with Steffy and everything to do with Brooke and being mad that she "won" because Hope got Liam. As if Lame is any sort of prize worth fighting over, since he's not even a fun waffle like Ridge was.

[hypnotoad]

Quote

Sorry, but I can't agree with that at all. Why should Taylor get a pass on her shitty and criminal behavior?

I'm not suggesting ignoring what she did - I think in the very least she should apologize, acknowledge she was off the rails and move on. These writers can't even manage to write more than one story at a time, so I don't know how they would incorporate a let's go over Taylor's crimes story which let's face it everyone has moved on from.

What character on this show doesn't get a pass on shitty or criminal behavior?  Bill hasn't suffered any real consequences for anything he's done, Quinn hasn't - Thomas hasn't, Liam never suffers even after he cheats on his wife because of a mannequin! Ridge and Steffy skate through everything. Flo became an official Logan after what she did! Eric has been manipulating Quinn, Carter and Donna - fired Donna and every character still talks like he is so beloved. Even Brooke hasn't exactly suffered for her nonsense. Trust I would never forgive my mom for having an affair with my husband. And my sister would never talk to me again if I had an affair with her husband. Oh and when Brooke had a wall bang with Hope's boyfriend? Nothing happened. Oh ho ho Brooke couldn't tell the difference between a 20 year old kid and Ridge. Has Sheila paid for any of the crimes she has pulled?

So I am sorry but I'm not going to expect much as far as Taylor and paying for her nonsense.

 

[Skarzero]

Even ignoring the last few years, Taylor is unnecessarily passive aggressive(at least HT's Taylor was), was in cahoots with Stephine against Brooke, and encourages her adult children to be the worst versions of themselves. It's been said that even from day one she was a bit of a shit stirrer. Whether criminal/crazy Taylor is OOC or not doesn't matter much. Because none of her usual, pre-2010's BS was all that okay either. Letting her recent history go only matters to the degree her other flaws will be properly addressed, if they even are (they won't be).   

If TPTB ever do mention it, I predict it will be "oh she got help and it's ok now! :)" after all. Bill probably won't even do the bare minimum of dangling her freedom in her face via blackmail, like he did Deacon and Deacon didn't even do anything to him.

6 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

Ridge had his chance to voice his opinion about Deacon decades ago.

Didn't he have his say and then some when he came back to the show in late 2002-early/mid 2003 anyways? Did he not seize his chance to drag Brooke for it? Either way he has dick all to say about it 19 years later. Bridget, and Hope can talk all they want about it until 2032, 2042, and forever because it happened to Bridget. And Hope has had to deal with being the product of such an affair her whole life. If they choose not to disparage Brooke fine, but that is not an invitation for others to do so in their place. They can both speak for themselves. Ridge, Taylor, and their insufferable spawns can have a big ole glass of shut the fuck up lmao 

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, Skarzero said:

Even ignoring the last few years, Taylor is unnecessarily passive aggressive(at least HT's Taylor was), was in cahoots with Stephine against Brooke, and encourages her adult children to be the worst versions of themselves. It's been said that even from day one she was a bit of a shit stirrer. Whether criminal/crazy Taylor is OOC or not doesn't matter much. Because none of her usual, pre-2010's BS was all that okay either. Letting her recent history go only matters to the degree her other flaws will be properly addressed, if they even are (they won't be).   

Exactly. I can't reasonably expect Taylor to be dragged in the mud when the more active players in BethGate have all gotten passes. Even for as horrible as Taylor can be, I have to think not even she would have wanted this mess.

But all the other shit? Absolutely needs to be touch upon, not the least of that being how her insecurities have ruined her lives and impacted the way her children have turned out and will likely affect her grandchildren--especially Kelly who, let's be honest, is gonna be given the Chinese bootleg version of Steffy's already weak story when she and Beth are SORASed because Bell refuses to write anything new. Actually address her damn insecurities and let her actually move on from Ridge and take some responsibility for her life.

2 hours ago, Skarzero said:

Didn't he have his say and then some when he came back to the show in late 2002-early/mid 2003 anyways?

Ridge found out at some point after Taylor's not-death and was fairly disgusted by it. It's worth pointing out he and Bridget had grown close as his kids took to bonding with her but before that gross ass incest story, so Ridge's reaction was more anger on Bridget's behalf than jealousy IIRC. And even there, he wasn't one-tenth as callous or spiteful about it as he's been the past four weeks.

I hate Ridge.

[hypnotoad]

Quote

Actually address her damn insecurities and let her actually move on from Ridge and take some responsibility for her life.

Amen. I want to hear Taylor got some therapy and while working overseas the last couple of years has seen the error of her ways. Maybe have a talk with Bill over the whole shooting him thing. Not obsess over Ridge nor want him back. I typed it before and I'll type it again: I'd much rather see Brooke and Taylor bury any lingering issues and be tolerant of each other. As if the writers would ever do that!

Quote

so Ridge's reaction was more anger on Bridget's behalf than jealousy IIRC. And even there, he wasn't one-tenth as callous or spiteful about it as he's been the past four weeks.

Well let's face it, Ridge has changed quite a bit as a character since this recast. Not saying Ridge used to be perfect or great but at least he was willing to listen, to discuss. TK plays Ridge like a lumbering ogre or maybe that's how Ridge is now written too. I don't know but I really want him to go away. When is this break happening? It seems like we've been waiting forever! Plus I'd prefer if Ridge came back played by a different actor. Pretty sure I'm not going to get my way on that.

[Skarzero]

3 hours ago, hypnotoad said:

Flo became an official Logan after what she did!

Yeah that level of rug sweeping is going to be hard to top. I've never seen anything like it except on General Hospital when Sonny Corinthos shot his own son in the chest. Then had the nerve to blame his baby momma for not telling him he was his son! Completely ignoring the fact that "Hey! you shouldn't just shoot people in the chest you thug! And maybe that's why she didn't tell you buddy!" (Not bullshitting this was a SL people defended). Then there the never ending free passing loony bin in Salem from DOOL 😂Hey! Maybe we should start a petition to send Felony to Salem! With all the "reformed/redeemed" killers out there in broad daylight, she'll be wasted GTA 5 style in no time! Or maybe Mardevil can kill with her horns, a pitchfork or whatever lol.    

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, hypnotoad said:

Well let's face it, Ridge has changed quite a bit as a character since this recast. Not saying Ridge used to be perfect or great but at least he was willing to listen, to discuss.

So true. I've been watching the first two seasons of B&B and coincidentally I just watch an episode where Ridge understandably freaks out at Kristen inviting her then boyfriend Clarke to see one of the new designs. Kristen is still miffed about his behavior the next day and asks him to apologize--he does so because he has the bigger news of Eric and Stephanie's divorce to share and it wasn't worth making a huge scene to beat his chest behind. Ridge was always abrasive with people who disagreed with him but with the exceptions of Amber and Darla, he used to try to temper that and listen to people. 

Speaking of which, watching these kids handle the news of their parents' divorce in 1988 versus the way the Taytots have acted about their parents is something to behold. Ridge as the oldest was younger than these brats are now and even he asked Stephanie "Um, are you SURE you want a man who is in love with someone else?"

As I've said before, I could've looked past the poor physical casting if they'd tried to capture the things that worked about the character instead of turning him into male Phyllis Summers. 

[nilyank]

Despite Taylor's many, many faults, the only ones that I want to be addressed are her horrible advice and ideas that she has encrouraged to her kids over the past last years or so.

Thomas - oooh Douglas' mom is dead, Hope's baby died. Put them together and you get Hope as a package deal.

Steffy - Liam is married and having a baby with Hope, oooh go adopt another baby as soon as that baby is born so Liam will want to play Daddy to that kid because you will have two.

Thomas - oooh you have acted like a completely crazy person stalking Hope and terrorizing you son. Let me become you therapist and treat you over the phone for weekly sessions. Ignore how unethical and unprofessional it would be for a mother to treat her son.

Steffy - you want a baby this very second. Why bother with using lawyers, going through social worker visits, background checks and the other steps in adoptions that you would have easily gotten through when I met this complete stranger who just happens to have access to newborn babies. For a tiny fee. All in cash.

Then that Taylor has literally stayed away while Thomas has lost his mind, appeared to have almost died a few times and losing the only friend in world. Steffy suffered losing a blackmarket baby, almost dying in motorcycle accident, drug addiction, rehab, another pregnancy and getting married to someone not named Liam.

Hayes whom Steffy named after Taylor (and her exhusband's last name) was born in July but now Taylor suddenly mustered the pain of Brooke being with Ridge to finally see her children and grandchildren. 

It is a lame as Ridge not being there when  his mother died or coming to her funeral.

[RuntheTable]

15 hours ago, Anna Yolei said:

Ridge found out at some point after Taylor's not-death and was fairly disgusted by it. It's worth pointing out he and Bridget had grown close as his kids took to bonding with her but before that gross ass incest story, so Ridge's reaction was more anger on Bridget's behalf than jealousy IIRC. And even there, he wasn't one-tenth as callous or spiteful about it as he's been the past four weeks.

As a Brooke supporter the whole episode with Deacon was a tough time for me, and to be honest, I was put out that Eric and Ridge weren't angrier and more disgusted with Brooke. I remember really wanting to take Eric to task when he was telling Bridget to get past it and forgive her mother. He was upset with Brooke, but once the shock wore off, he just switched gears and wanted to protect her, and I felt that was at the expense of Bridget's feelings. Ridge was also angry, but as you say it was more for Bridget and her pain. The one thing RM Ridge had the ability to do was overlook things when he wanted to. 

12 hours ago, Anna Yolei said:

So true. I've been watching the first two seasons of B&B

 

12 hours ago, Anna Yolei said:

Speaking of which, watching these kids handle the news of their parents' divorce in 1988 versus the way the Taytots have acted about their parents is something to behold. Ridge as the oldest was younger than these brats are now and even he asked Stephanie "Um, are you SURE you want a man who is in love with someone else?"

The writing was in a different stratosphere back then. The Forrester's really came off as the quintessential rich society family with layers of dysfunction. From the beginning it was intimated that there was trouble between Eric and Stephanie. There was the icy discord between Stephanie and Kristen, based on Stephanie's jealousy over Kristen's relationship with Eric. Something that was on full display the day Stephanie told Kristen her father was having an affair, and she was trying to discover who the other woman was. Stephanie asked Kristen how she felt about it and Kristen replied something like "whatever makes daddy happy." There were always undercurrents with Ridge and Thorne; it was clear they loved each other, but there was jealousy and dislike too. Ridge was just rotten but had enough charm and charisma to save the character. I think that was best displayed when he proposed to Caroline 1.0. They were dating, but it was just that until Caroline's dad came calling. Bill Spencer wasn't having it; he did not like or trust Ridge and swore him off of Caroline. Ridge proposed that evening and couldn't wait to get over to Bill's apartment to tell him the good news. Stephanie also had a troubled relationship with a young Felicia, who was the original rebel. The characters were fleshed out, they had depth, and the show drew on its history and had continuity and was believable. 

17 hours ago, hypnotoad said:

What character on this show doesn't get a pass on shitty or criminal behavior?  Bill hasn't suffered any real consequences for anything he's done, Quinn hasn't - Thomas hasn't, Liam never suffers even after he cheats on his wife because of a mannequin! Ridge and Steffy skate through everything. Flo became an official Logan after what she did! Eric has been manipulating Quinn, Carter and Donna - fired Donna and every character still talks like he is so beloved. Even Brooke hasn't exactly suffered for her nonsense. Trust I would never forgive my mom for having an affair with my husband. And my sister would never talk to me again if I had an affair with her husband. Oh and when Brooke had a wall bang with Hope's boyfriend? Nothing happened. Oh ho ho Brooke couldn't tell the difference between a 20 year old kid and Ridge. Has Sheila paid for any of the crimes she has pulled?

This is all very true; I think the difference with most of the stuff on your list is the era in which the action occurred. Show no longer holds anyone accountable, but in the early years it was much more likely that characters were called out and had some consequences for their actions. Which is why I stand by my statement that Brooke has paid for her transgression with Deacon. Of all the characters I think she has paid the most. She endured years and years and years of Stephanie referring to her as "The Slut from the Valley." She was dissected and judged by Taylor, who was part and parcel to so many heinous actions against Brooke. And to this day, Brooke has her past and her history thrown in her face. In reality all the talk of scandal is just so much blah, blah, blah. Brooke's history was cultivated and stroked by Stephanie who could not accept that Eric fell in love with her, and she made it her life mission to destroy Brooke. Outside of Deacon, Brooke is no better or worse than any other character but is different in that she isn't mean spirited or malicious. She is selfish when it comes to her own happiness though and isn't above hurting those she loves to achieve it. 

Edited December 13, 2021 by RuntheTable

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, RuntheTable said:

Outside of Deacon, Brooke is no better or worse than any other character but is different in that she isn't mean spirited or malicious. She is selfish when it comes to her own happiness though and isn't above hurting those she loves to achieve it. 

Her lack of malicious intent has always been a double edged sword for the character. It's one thing with her delaying a letter that Caroline still saw in enough time to cancel her wedding if she chose and another thing entirely to bang your son-in-law, even if she thought the marriage was going to end. If TIIC had just kept her outta hurting her own family--although one can argue that ship sailed the minute she got involved with Eric years ago--i reckon she'd have had more people willing to defend her. But that, along with her passivity that's maybe one rung above Liam's , that has driven me batshit for as long as I've watched this show.

Edited December 13, 2021 by Anna Yolei

[CountryGirl]

I have never been a Taylor fan. From the moment she came onscreen, it was clear she was brought on to be the saintly good doc, the antithesis to Brooke's slut sinner from the valley. I can never forget that she was Caroline I's oncologist (which apparently transitioned to psychiatry at the drop of a hat a few years later). She was completely unprofessional with her interest in the soon-to-be-grieving-widower, Ridge, and had designs on him before Caroline even died, using her role as Caroline's doctor to go well beyond the doctor/patient relationship (and Ridge was certainly not her patient) to make inroads with him and be his shoulder to cry on.

Brooke gets a ton of shit for hiding the letter Caroline wrote to Ridge on her wedding day to Thorne but guess what? Taylor upped the ante. She hid a dying woman's letter (Caroline's to Ridge) because she was scared that Ridge would find out that she wanted him to be with Brooke. 

So much for the saintly doctor.

She also had an affair with ex-Blake while involved with Ridge, most infamously screwing Blake, then Ridge, with nary a shower in between. Ridge still doesn't know that their involvement was not ancient history. 

She hid behind Stephanie's skirts, with her famous shrieking of "Stephanie! DOOOO Something!!!" so that Stephanie could do all the dirty work with Brooke while she, Taylor, could keep her halo all shiny. Never mind that it was gold-plated vs the real thing. And people fell for that act, over and over again. 

She hated on newborn Bridget and didn't even bother to hide that she disliked the innocent baby because SHE she wanted to be the mother of his first child as, at the time, Bridget was believed to be Ridge's daughter.

She devirginized James while very much married to Ridge and kept it a secret for decades. 

She had an affair with Eric, her former father-in-law, while he was still married to Stephanie.

She got drunk and set herself and her beach house on fire just so she could get attention from Ridge. Which backfired as it was Thorne to the rescue. And she did this when she realized she had been duped into thinking the runway proposal was real when it was all a stunt for Ridge to get back at Brooke. Just like St. Thomas. Sound familiar?

She became pregnant with Ridge's child and lies that it's Thorne's and guess who got blamed for that? Not lying fat lips Taylor, but Brooke of all people? Because apparently it was Brooke's fault that Taylor lied about the paternity.

She got into a fight with Morgan, who was pregnant with Ridge's child, causing Morgan to fall down the stairs and miscarry. Morgan was no prize, with conning Ridge (but how stupid do you have to be?) into sleeping with her with a fake hallpass from Taylor, but she didn't deserve that.

She convinced Brooke her father (Stephen Logan) was dying so that Brooke would move to Paris to be with him in his final days. She ended up falling off the Eiffel Tower and nearly dying for her trouble. 

This was all before Dirt Nap #2 (Sheila shooting).

When she came back from the dead (again), she got almost got Gabby deported because she had sex with her grown-ass-man son Thomas. 

She had an affair (there was, at minimum, kissing) with Hector while still married to Ridge. Don't think he knows about that one, either.

She later went back on the bottle and mowed down Darla when she shouldn't have been driving in the first place because hello! Drunk! And she had a suspended license for a previous DUI so even sober, she shouldn't have been driving. She gets Hector and Phoebe to cover for her. She conveniently keeps the truth from Thorne (another grieving widower) and Ally. 

She also sleeps with Rick Forrester and became engaged to him shortly after Phoebe broke up with him, not giving two shits about the heartache to her own child. 

When she was involved with Nick, she wanted him to burn photographs of Brooke's kids, including Hope, and also bailed on her innocent baby son, Jack, when she learned he was Brooke's biological son due to a mishap at the lab. 

In addition to vehicular homicide and obstruction of justice on her resume, she later commits another felony, by going through Brooke's doctor's records to learn that Brooke was pregnant (by Bill) and miscarried. The dear sweet doc decides to out that at a birthday party for Brooke. Had she been Katie, fine, as Bill was married to Katie then, but this was none of her damn business!

We can see where Thomas got his hand-waving of too intoxicated to consent as, in addition to Ridge sleeping with Brooke when she was taking heavy medication., Taylor did the same with Ridge, when he was married to Brooke. Yeah, that's called RAPE where I come from. 

Then a few years later we have recent events, including the attempted murder of Bill (and she still hasn't been caught for this and let Ridge initially take the blame and went to jail for a time) and encouraging her children to commit adultery with married people (Steffy with Liam and Thomas with Hope.)

So from where I sit, Taylor has never, ever been this saintly "good girl." She just had the benefit of someone else (Stephanie) for years to allow her to keep her hands clean. And now, she's hand-waved as stressed and distraught and oh-so-hurt-and-abandoned by Ridge, which is so far from the truth its laughable. 

She was presumed dead twice and that was a good portion of years, especially the second go-round. Ridge didn't abandon her in the slightest. In fact, he abandoned the family he had with Brooke, Rick, and Bridget when he learned Thomas was his biological son and Bridget wasn't his biological daughter. So she helped orchestrate the break-up of Brooke's family, not once, but twice as Ridge left her again when she came back from the dead the second time, abandoning Hope and his blood son, RJ. 

Ridge left again when he learned his mother faked a heart attack to reunite them and also learned of Taylor's infidelity with James. But by this time, Steffy and Phoebe were 18 and Thomas even older. They weren't exactly babies in diapers (which RJ was barely out of when Ridge abandoned them for his grown kids).

So the Taybrats can spout all the revisionist history they want in yet another attempt to reunite their fambly but long-term viewers know the truth. 

Brooke's biggest sin is her affair with Deacon, a fact which is still thrown in her face even though Bridget, who is the only one whose opinion matters, has long since forgiven her. Taylor sleeping her way through two families (Ridge, Thorne, Eric, Nick, Stephen, Storm, and Rick, with affairs with Blake, James, and Hector) but the only one she was taken to task for with any real repercussions was James and that was more for keeping the secret for years and the hypocrisy. Yet Brooke is still the Slut of the Valley.

Brooke has never killed anyone as far as I'm aware, so until that changes, I'm Team Brooke. Even when she makes me want to strangle her, I will choose her over Taylor any day of the year.

 

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:

When she came back from the dead (again), she got Gabby deported because she had sex with her grown-ass-man son Thomas. 

This whole list was facts but as a nitpick, Gabby didn't get deported. TPTB had Taylor have a change of heart and fight on her behalf to have her stay.

That said, the optics of that story are absolutely terrible in hindsight for more than just Taylor's brand of pettiness. Egads, how did Bell think this was a banger story? I just feel glad that Gabby dodged a bullet with Thomas either way.

1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:

Brooke has never killed anyone as far as I'm aware, so until that changes, I'm Team Brooke. Even when she makes me want to strangle her, I will choose her over Taylor any day of the year.

All fax, no printer 👌

[CountryGirl]

4 minutes ago, Anna Yolei said:

This whole list was facts but as a nitpick, Gabby didn't get deported. TPTB had Taylor have a change of heart and fight on her behalf to have her stay.

Technically, speaking, no, Gabby wasn't deported but she could have been and all because Taylor was trying to be the morality police and expected Gabby and Thomas, who were married (to keep Gabby in the country) to not sleep together even though again, they were MARRIED and started to have feelings for each other.  She did go to immigration when she learned they had slept together, which could have resulted in Gabby being deported. That she had a change of heart (and a lot of this was driven because Thomas realized he was still in love with Caitlin so she could afford to be magnanimous) doesn't negate the wrong she did (IMO, of course).

[norcalgal]

1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:

I have never been a Taylor fan. From the moment she came onscreen, it was clear she was brought on to be the saintly good doc, the antithesis to Brooke's slut sinner from the valley. I can never forget that she was Caroline I's oncologist (which apparently transitioned to psychiatry at the drop of a hat a few years later). She was completely unprofessional with her interest in the soon-to-be-grieving-widower, Ridge, and had designs on him before Caroline even died, using her role as Caroline's doctor to go well beyond the doctor/patient relationship (and Ridge was certainly not her patient) to make inroads with him and be his shoulder to cry on.

Brooke gets a ton of shit for hiding the letter Caroline wrote to Ridge on her wedding day to Thorne but guess what? Taylor upped the ante. She hid a dying woman's letter (Caroline's to Ridge) because she was scared that Ridge would find out that she wanted him to be with Brooke. 

So much for the saintly doctor.

She also had an affair with ex-Blake while involved with Ridge, most infamously screwing Blake, then Ridge, with nary a shower in between. Ridge still doesn't know that their involvement was not ancient history. 

She hid behind Stephanie's skirts, with her famous shrieking of "Stephanie! DOOOO Something!!!" so that Stephanie could do all the dirty work with Brooke while she, Taylor, could keep her halo all shiny. Never mind that it was gold-plated vs the real thing. And people fell for that act, over and over again. 

She hated on newborn Bridget and didn't even bother to hide that she disliked the innocent baby because SHE she wanted to be the mother of his first child as, at the time, Bridget was believed to be Ridge's daughter.

She devirginized James while very much married to Ridge and kept it a secret for decades. 

She had an affair with Eric, her former father-in-law, while he was still married to Stephanie.

She got drunk and set herself and her beach house on fire just so she could get attention from Ridge. Which backfired as it was Thorne to the rescue. And she did this when she realized she had been duped into thinking the runway proposal was real when it was all a stunt for Ridge to get back at Brooke. Just like St. Thomas. Sound familiar?

She became pregnant with Ridge's child and lies that it's Thorne's and guess who got blamed for that? Not lying fat lips Taylor, but Brooke of all people? Because apparently it was Brooke's fault that Taylor lied about the paternity.

She got into a fight with Morgan, who was pregnant with Ridge's child, causing Morgan to fall down the stairs and miscarry. Morgan was no prize, with conning Ridge (but how stupid do you have to be?) into sleeping with her with a fake hallpass from Taylor, but she didn't deserve that.

She convinced Brooke her father (Stephen Logan) was dying so that Brooke would move to Paris to be with him in his final days. She ended up falling off the Eiffel Tower and nearly dying for her trouble. 

This was all before Dirt Nap #2 (Sheila shooting).

When she came back from the dead (again), she got Gabby deported because she had sex with her grown-ass-man son Thomas. 

She had an affair (there was, at minimum, kissing) with Hector while still married to Ridge. Don't think he knows about that one, either.

She later went back on the bottle and mowed down Darla when she shouldn't have been driving in the first place because hello! Drunk! And she had a suspended license for a previous DUI so even sober, she shouldn't have been driving. She gets Hector and Phoebe to cover for her. She conveniently keeps the truth from Thorne (another grieving widower) and Ally. 

She also sleeps with Rick Forrester and became engaged to him shortly after Phoebe broke up with him, not giving two shits about the heartache to her own child. 

When she was involved with Nick, she wanted him to burn photographs of Brooke's kids,  including Hope, and also bailed on her innocent baby son, Jack, when she learned he was Brooke's biological son due to a mishap at the lab. 

In addition to vehicular homicide and obstruction of justice on her resume, she later commits another felony, by going through Brooke's doctor's records to learn that Brooke was pregnant (by Bill) and miscarried. The dear sweet doc decides to out that at a birthday party for Brooke. Had she been Katie, fine, but this was none of her damn business!

We can see where Thomas got his hand-waving of too intoxicated to consent as, in addition to Ridge sleeping with Brooke when she was taking heavy medication., Taylor did the same with Ridge, when he was married to Brooke. Yeah, that's called rape where I come from. 

Then a few years later we have recent events, including the attempted murder of Bill (and she still hasn't been caught for this and let Ridge initially take the blame and went to jail for a time) and encouraging her children to commit adultery with married people (Steffy with Liam and Thomas with Hope.)

So from where I sit, Taylor has never, ever been this saintly "good girl." She just had the benefit of someone else (Stephanie) for years to allow her to keep her hands clean. And now, she's hand-waved as stressed and distraught and oh-so-hurt-and-abandoned by Ridge, which is so far from the truth its laughable. 

She was presumed dead twice and that was a good portion of years, especially the second go-round. Ridge didn't abandon her in the slightest. In fact, he abandoned the family he had with Brooke, Rick, and Bridget when he learned Thomas was his biological son and Bridget wasn't his biological daughter. So she helped orchestrate the break-up of Brooke's family, not once, but twice as Ridge left her again when she came back from the dead the second time, abandoning Hope and his blood son, RJ. 

Ridge left again when he learned his mother faked a heart attack to reunite them and also learned of Taylor's infidelity with James.

So the Taybrats can spout all the revisionist history they want in yet another attempt to reunite their fambly but long-term viewers know the truth. 

Brooke's biggest sin is her affair with Deacon, a fact which is still thrown in her face even though Bridget, who is the only one whose opinion matters, has long since forgiven her. Taylor sleeping her way through two families (Ridge, Thorne, Eric, Nick, Stephen, Storm, and Rick, with affairs with Blake, James, and Hector) but the only one she was taken to task for with any real repercussions was James and that was more for keeping the secret for years and the hypocrisy. Yet Brooke is still the Slut of the Valley.

Brooke has never killed anyone as far as I'm aware, so until that changes, I'm Team Brooke. Even when she makes me want to strangle her, I will choose her over Taylor any day of the year.

 

👏👏👏  @CountryGirl  fantastic recap of all of Taylor's sins/crimes. 

[CountryGirl]

1 minute ago, norcalgal said:

👏👏👏  @CountryGirl  fantastic recap of all of Taylor's sins/crimes. 

Aw, thanks.

Sad that I can't remember what I had for lunch yesterday but can recite this list chapter/verse like it was yesterday.

[Skarzero]

2 hours ago, CountryGirl said:

She also sleeps with Rick Forrester and became engaged to him shortly after Phoebe broke up with him, not giving two shits about the heartache to her own child. 

You know, for all the bleating that Steffy and Thomass have done about poor dead Phoebe, usually to excuse their shit antics, they sure don't hold angelic mommy to account for banging the man Phoebe loved and getting her killed in the process. But they find the time/audacity to rip on Brooke for the Breacon affair and they had just been potty trained, if not still wearing pull-ups at the time it went on. At least Bridget is still alive lmao    

And thank you @CountryGirl for coming through with receipts! 🙌   

[Anna Yolei]

17 minutes ago, Skarzero said:

You know, for all the bleating that Steffy and Thomass have done about poor dead Phoebe, usually to excuse their shit antics, they sure don't hold angelic mommy to account for banging the man Phoebe loved and getting her killed in the process.

Steffy would have to rip her own skank ass too. What set Phoebe off that night she died wasn't even Rick/Taylor, who had long separated when she woke up in love with Ridge again ....no, as revenge against her dad, Rick decided to get between Steffy and her then boyfriend Marcus.--a ruse Steffy saw through and told Phoebe about in one of the only three scenes the adult twins ever shared. Phoebe was rightfully enraged that he'd use her sister in a vendetta and angrily chewed him out, which led to the infamous fight and the accident. Mind you, this happened around early December, and yet the very next episode after the yearly holiday episode ends with Steffy and Rick swapping spit because of grief or something. (I stopped watching B&B spoiler free entirely because of that scene, BTW).

So, yeah, I guess Phoebe died for nuthing 🙃

I'm of two minds because while what little of Phoebe we got wasn't bad, I have to wonder if she would've succumbed to the propaganda too if she'd been allowed to survive. No doubt they'd erase her personality upon a recast. Would've been interesting had she been an ally to Hope in the 2010s but more than likely she'd have just ended up with Lame eventually, too. Being dead is a much better fate than that!

I kid but seriously, what was the point of having twins when nothing was done with that? 

[CountryGirl]

I'm still pissed that a shark really didn't eat Steffy. Show would be a million times better if Phoebe had lived. She was sweet and loving and cared for Brooke, recalling how she had helped to raise them and Thomas after Taylor's dirt nap #2, instead of being a Logan-hater like Steffy.

[Gam2]

I remember Phoebe as a curly headed blond who could really sing. Am I remembering correctly? 

[Waldo13]

TIIC seem to be trying to distract us from the fact something is not quite right with Stuffy’s face. Bad wigs and stupid hats only draw more attention to Stuffy.  

[Gam2]

That wig on nuTaylor today looked terrible. Way too long and too straight. She’s too old to wear that and would look so much better with shorter hair with more style.

[Anna Yolei]

3 hours ago, Gam2 said:

I remember Phoebe as a curly headed blond who could really sing. Am I remembering correctly? 

She was.

Usually, B&B nails its casting in contrast to the parents* but decided to make her a blond....and this after the last set of identical twins to play them both were Anne Shirley-esque redheads!

Mackenzie Mauzy had a role as Rapunzel in the Into the Woods movie a few years back, coincidental alongside another spectaclar young daytime actor from ATWT. Was a trip to see her next to Casey Hughes but sadly Disney rewrote the entire 2nd act of that story so she didn't get to flex on her acting all that much. Boooooo.

*Speaking of which, that actress who.played Brooke's grandmother Helen back in the day bears a striking resemblance to what KKL looks like today. Someone pointed that out in comments on YouTube and now I can't unsee it!

[Chatty Cake]

The wig on new Taylor is terrible. It reminds me of the wigs on the local Disney princesses that people hire for birthday parties.

[Artsda]

Ridge said to Taylor he spends as much time with Douglas he can? Huh? The same Douglas you just kicked out and basically assigned him as Brookes grandchildren.

I was a fan of Taylor & Ridge 1.0 a d Ron Moss calling her Doc. TK doing it just not same. 

On 12/12/2021 at 4:13 PM, hypnotoad said:

What character on this show doesn't get a pass on shitty or criminal behavior?  Bill hasn't suffered any real consequences for anything he's done, Quinn hasn't - Thomas hasn't, Liam never suffers even after he cheats on his wife because of a mannequin! Ridge and Steffy skate through everything. Flo became an official Logan after what she did! Eric has been manipulating Quinn, Carter and Donna - fired Donna and every character still talks like he is so beloved. Even Brooke hasn't exactly suffered for her nonsense

Deacon apparently because he's treated by Ridge and Steffy like he's the worst person who ever lived, all while they bow down to Liam, Taylor, etc..

[CharlizeCat]

I couldn't get into the scenes with Ridge and Taylor today because all I could focus on was that awful, awful wig. I don't recall it being that long on Friday. It looks so cheap and artificial. And KA is so petite and delicate that all of that hair just swallows her up. I read her interview where she talked about her new pixie cut and then bought a wig from AMAZON to wear as Taylor and she said she watched a YT video on how to cut curtain bangs. /facepalm. At the very least, buy a nice wig and get it professionally cut and styled for a major daytime TV role. 

I always thought Taylor looked great with that vampy shag haircut she had back in the Hector days. It was age-appropriate and a great length and shape for HTy. 

TK looks like KA's father.