S21.E11: Songs & Duets

[luvthepros]

I think you can say that for every single dance style on this show since most of these people aren't trained dancers. In what world were two untrained dancers going to "master" Fosse/Chicago in two days? And people have been referencing iconic dances, musicals, etc. on this show for many seasons and I don't remember there ever being any expectation that they master these iconic dances and styles.

 

For this show and not being professionally trained dancers, in my opinion, I thought Bindi and Alexa did very well. They were in sync, on time, showed great musicality, sold the performance and gave it their all. And I'm sure that's all the judges wanted. If they wanted perfect Fosse they can always go see the musical with the professionally trained performers. 

Absolutely agree. Couldn't have said it better myself.

[mtlchick]

 

I didn't really see Val as shading Tamar, but I do think this is a totally new situation for Val.  He is used to having partners that while they may have had some other things going on, it didn't really get in the way of DWTS.

 

That is what I was thinking, though I don't he used the right wording to express that.  Doing DWTS can be a long term commitment for up to 3 months.  Even Andy said he cancelled a few shows just so he can focus on this.  Backstreet Boys were on Best Time Ever without Nick last week and Brian said "he's busy with his dance pants right now" or something.  It becomes a question of "how much are you willing to fully commit to this and can you drop a few things in the meantime."  I take for Tamar, that answer is a solid "I can't cancel on anything."  And I think Val has this sense of frustration that she can be really good if she had the time.

[sinkwriter]

Can I just say, what is UP with the wigs they make Bindi wear? Alexa's was all sleek and Velma Kelly cool, but Bindi's looked like some half-assed Halloween costume wig. Surely there's a 20's style wig with marcel waves out there that looks more decent than that? (I did have a chuckle when all her dancing partners were trying to smooth it out for her during the judging. Heee.)

[Neerbeena]

 

 

Who should be Top 3: Bindi, Nick, Tamar

Who will be Top 3: Bindi, Nick, Alek

 

Of course they want Derek (I mean Bindi) to win his 50th trophy - the only one who might stop them is backstreet boy Nick.

 

Someone earlier asked about Carlos' fan base.  Seriously, who is this guy?  I knew Alexa from SpyKids, but I've never heard of him.

[howmanywords]

Carlos was in the same boy band James Maslow from season 18 was in, Big Time Rush. They had a weekly comedy on Nickelodien I think they broke up in 2013 but they definitely still have fans. Carlos is also going to be playing Kenickie in the upcoming Grease live on FOX.

[truthaboutluv]

Can I just say, what is UP with the wigs they make Bindi wear? Alexa's was all sleek and Velma Kelly cool, but Bindi's looked like some half-assed Halloween costume wig. Surely there's a 20's style wig with marcel waves out there that looks more decent than that? (I did have a chuckle when all her dancing partners were trying to smooth it out for her during the judging. Heee.)

 

It is really bad. That thing looked like something that was dragged out from under a bed. Weird...

[Wings]

 

Agreed with the second comment. I think some may be underestimating how many viewer votes Alek is getting and I don't get the feeling that Carlos is so popular. So I can absolutely believe he was really in jeopardy and hell it'd be hilarious if he goes next week since he was so desperate for it be him, let's see how he reacts if it happens. Something tells me he won't be too thrilled.

 

 

I can see that.  But it seemed fishy for husband and wife to be bottom two.  Way too fishy.  I don't think Carlos has a big fan base either.  

[luvthepros]

Alan Salazar - semi-official DWTS dramaturg. Dance-aturg? Who since not getting that Emmy nomination with Witney seems to have gotten much more vocal about what dances he's helped with (and hopefully got himself an official contract with the show) - he's been helping Lindsey a lot this season as well. 

I'd never heard of him. Does he post on social media about who he helps with choreography? I don't do SM so I wouldn't know.

[Missy Vixen]

I'm really glad that Tom had everyone sit down for the judging, but even with that I was so afraid for Tamar. She looked like she was going to pass out any second. I was yelling at my TV, "Get the woman a glass of water and some oxygen! Can't you see how much she's laboring for every breath??" That was really scary to watch. 

 

I don't have huge love for Tamar's performances because of her lack of facial expression, but tonight all I wanted was for them to give the woman a damn break, just tell her she's safe and let her go rest.

I'm currently recovering from pneumonia. The fact Tamar was allowed to dance at all is ridiculous and shows that DWTS is more interested in drama than they are the lingering effects of Tamar's illness. Here's another thought: If she was not on antibiotics, she was CONTAGIOUS.

 

She needs to bow out of the show for her health's sake. And the DWTS production group can kiss my (recovering and still exhausted) ass.

[spanana]

I'd never heard of him. Does he post on social media about who he helps with choreography? I don't do SM so I wouldn't know.

 

He does more so now than he used to, for obvious reasons I guess.  My understanding is Alan is from Utah and so he's close with all the Utah girls, though maybe not Witney anymore.  He also supposedly choreographed solos for the Witney, Lindsay, Jenna and probably Brittany when they were on SYTYCD.  Here is a choreo reel he posted in February of this year, where he claims to have had a hand in most Alfonso/Witney numbers, Janel's trio salsa, an Allison/Jonathan number and etc. I know he's worked with Lindsay a lot this season, but he definitely has the Utah connection.

 

[kitcloudkicker]

I'd never heard of him. Does he post on social media about who he helps with choreography? I don't do SM so I wouldn't know.

 

I only heard of him when the Emmy nominations came out this year - he put up a post on his instagram about how sad he was that he helped create Witney's dances but wasn't put on the nomination, because he didn't have an official contract in place. There was a whole thing about how the pros may pay someone to "ghost" on their choreography, and if they are paid by the pro without an official contract from the show, it's not an official co-choreography credit and the Emmys won't put you on the ballot. 

 

Since then he's been posting a bunch about helping out with Alek and Lindsey. Witney seems to not be using him this season? It is on social media, I only know what he seems to be presenting on his instagram which is here: https://www.instagram.com/alnsalzr/

 

Here's his choreography reel, DWTS stuff starts at 1:19 - seems he's helped out Val as well.

 

 

Edit: 

Whoops, jinx @spanana. 

Edited November 10, 2015 by kitcloudkicker

[Uke]

They made Charlie do it on his season as well.  I'm sure it must be a preferred look, but I have to say, I'd much rather see a man with chest hair poking through than a completely hairless chest.  

 

I wonder if it's a fairly new "preferred look".  There's some older pics of Corky & Shirley's competition days floating around and Corky was in open shirts and a full chest of hair.   I think it's cool that Tristan dug in his (latin) heels and kept his chest hair.  I think some of the guys would look better with than they do without.

[realdancemom]

He does more so now than he used to, for obvious reasons I guess.  My understanding is Alan is from Utah and so he's close with all the Utah girls, though maybe not Witney anymore.  He also supposedly choreographed solos for the Witney, Lindsay, Jenna and probably Brittany when they were on SYTYCD.  Here is a choreo reel he posted in February of this year, where he claims to have had a hand in most Alfonso/Witney numbers, Janel's trio salsa, an Allison/Jonathan number and etc. I know he's worked with Lindsay a lot this season, but he definitely has the Utah connection.

 

Alan Salazar used to be the hip-hop director of The Vibe.  That's the studio that Lindsay and Witney are from.  He also taught hip-hop at Center Stage and Dance Club.  He also teaches at workshops since my DDs have taken classes from him and they don't go to any of those studios.

[Danseur]

Derek's and Julianne's accents were formed in Utah, Mark's in England. Although, for the last two weeks I would almost swear I've heard Julianne saying "Durk" as if his name only has one syllable, typical of the U.S. southwest. Maybe I'm hearing it through a southern grid.

[UncleChuck]

 

It's a dance show with no prize money, guys, not Sophie's Choice.

Well, to be fair, there is a prize of sorts.  We have seen from a few of the minors' contracts (Shawn and Bindi) that the stars receive a guaranteed fee for their participation based on how long they stay.  By this point in the competition, I think the "fee" is $30,000 per week and it goes to $50,000 per week by the finals.  Carlos might have been crying for the hit on the family bank account rather than for his wife.

 

As for Tamar,  I am sorry that she has overscheduled herself to the point of exhaustion and illness, but if she is too sick to perform, then she should withdraw.  Unfortunately for us, all this "will she/won't she" drama is just bullshit.  If you are too sick to give it 100% then stay home!!!!

That duet rhumba was one of the most poorly executed dances I have ever seen on DWTS.

The judges are fond of saying that they CANNOT judge on sympathy or back story--ONLY on what they observe during the performance.  Well, they dropped the ball!  If they had truly judged that mess with fairness, they would have grossly OVERSCORED with 5s.  Tamar reminded me of when I used to watch grade school dance recitals.  There was always one girl in the back row who waited to see what the other girls would do next, then try to catch up.  Out of sync is a generous criticism.  A better description would be LOST!  Cloris Leachman and Master P did better than this mess.

 

But of course, DWTS has nothing to do with performance, just sympathy--so tonight we guaranteed a final of Tamar and Alek.

[mtlchick]

 

Carlos is also going to be playing Kenickie in the upcoming Grease live on FOX.

 

Where a certain judge is appearing as Sandy as well.  Huh. 

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Rockin' Pneumonia
Tamar pulls off a dramatic escape from the hospital to avoid letting down her partner in the final six.

[spanana]

Where a certain judge is appearing as Sandy as well.  Huh. 

 

Yes, but shockingly there is no ABC connection.  Grease Live will be airing on Fox.  But rehearsals start a few days after DWTS ends.

[just prin]

Much as I love pain, sorrow, tears, and drama, I much prefer my dancing shows to be sunny and warm! Therefore, I can't help but think of how much more fun this year's DWTS would have been had the married couple chosen had a sense of humor rather than a sense of angst! If they could have laughed together--instead of...Just sooo sad!

[majormama]

I wonder how many people expressing " concern" for Tamar and suggesting she drop out because her health is more important, really just want her gone so their fave can stay in. I will keep voting for her and Val ( along with Alek ) because I like watching them dance and I don't like being manipulated by producers to make me dislike them.

When these two are gone...could be next week...I will probably vote for Nick, half heartedly though.

 

I can't speak for everyone. I, for one, enjoy watching Tamar. I think she has arguably the best technique this season, though others may match/exceed on performance. I would love to see her in the finals. However, she has been fighting illness for some time and is clearly getting worse. Hearing her gasp for breath and seeing her eyes start to roll back was not entertaining. In my non-professional opinion, she needs to take a week or two off from EVERYTHING and recover. If she really, really insists on still working, she needs to pick just one thing to focus on and drop everything else. With her voice and lung capacity compromised by pneumonia, singing is almost definitely out regardless. That leaves The Real and DWTS, one of which would be much more conducive to recovery than the other (hint: the one where she just sits and talks). It really will be a shame if she withdraws, but sometimes life sucks and you do what you gotta do.

Edited November 10, 2015 by majormama

[PTVjones]

Val just announced that he is filling in for Tamar on Friday so clearly he's doing his best to support his partner. Despite all the showmances, be them real or producer-manufactured, I think this is the most we've seen Val dedicate to a partner, rather than the other way around. 

[luvthepros]

 

And Mark's accent! It bugs me too. I don't understand why it comes and goes in consecutive sentences, and sometimes even within the same sentence.

Mark has said on AfterBuzz that when he spends time with his mother, his Brit accent comes out. He is very aware of it.

[Jal]

Well, to be fair, there is a prize of sorts.  We have seen from a few of the minors' contracts (Shawn and Bindi) that the stars receive a guaranteed fee for their participation based on how long they stay.  By this point in the competition, I think the "fee" is $30,000 per week and it goes to $50,000 per week by the finals.  Carlos might have been crying for the hit on the family bank account rather than for his wife.

 

As for Tamar,  I am sorry that she has overscheduled herself to the point of exhaustion and illness, but if she is too sick to perform, then she should withdraw.  Unfortunately for us, all this "will she/won't she" drama is just bullshit.  If you are too sick to give it 100% then stay home!!!!

That duet rhumba was one of the most poorly executed dances I have ever seen on DWTS.

The judges are fond of saying that they CANNOT judge on sympathy or back story--ONLY on what they observe during the performance.  Well, they dropped the ball!  If they had truly judged that mess with fairness, they would have grossly OVERSCORED with 5s.  Tamar reminded me of when I used to watch grade school dance recitals.  There was always one girl in the back row who waited to see what the other girls would do next, then try to catch up.  Out of sync is a generous criticism.  A better description would be LOST!  Cloris Leachman and Master P did better than this mess.

 

But of course, DWTS has nothing to do with performance, just sympathy--so tonight we guaranteed a final of Tamar and Alek.

 

...or you just don't like Tamar. There's no way that rhumba was "one of the most poorly executed dances" on DWtS. It looked like it had a lot of potential and could've been great during the live show.

[luvthepros]

Is Tamar contagious?

I am concerned for her health, and do not enjoy her dancing, AND wish she were gone.

According to an article I just read, pneumonia is not contagious. The bacteria or virus that caused the pneumonia is contagious and that is how pneumonia takes hold to begin with in a person who has risk factors such as being elderly and immune surpressed.

Edited November 11, 2015 by luvthepros

[Mbeaker]

Jal, I think you might be confusing Tamar's Rumba with her Contemporary. The Rumba was her Duet Dance with Nick and it was performed live.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Mbeaker

[escape]

First it was Hayes Grier, then Andy Grammer, now Alexa Vega. 

 

Alek Skarlatos should have left before all of them.

[luvthepros]

He does more so now than he used to, for obvious reasons I guess.  My understanding is Alan is from Utah and so he's close with all the Utah girls, though maybe not Witney anymore.  He also supposedly choreographed solos for the Witney, Lindsay, Jenna and probably Brittany when they were on SYTYCD.  Here is a choreo reel he posted in February of this year, where he claims to have had a hand in most Alfonso/Witney numbers, Janel's trio salsa, an Allison/Jonathan number and etc. I know he's worked with Lindsay a lot this season, but he definitely has the Utah connection.

 

 

Thanks for the information and the choreography reel.

[PBGamer89]

Bindi has also danced last several  times and has never danced first, which at least Tamar and Nick have both done. 

 

 

True, but Bindi has only danced last twice, the last time being in Week 4, so it's been quite a while.

[spanana]

Val just announced that he is filling in for Tamar on Friday so clearly he's doing his best to support his partner. Despite all the showmances, be them real or producer-manufactured, I think this is the most we've seen Val dedicate to a partner, rather than the other way around. 

 

It's not exactly a hardship for Val to make a talk show appearance.  It's free promo for him.  Yes, he's supporting Tamar but I don't really see this as any major sacrifice on his part.  He has agents and managers as much as anyone else in the biz.  They had a number of guest hosts the Janet Jackson week when Tamar was sick as well.

[LadyMustang65]

I thought we were rid of Tamar, dammit.

 

I do not share your dislike for Tamar, but you  have gotten your wish.  Tamar withdrew from the competition.  She went back to the hospital, and doctors figured out she did not have pneumonia.  She has something much more serious - blood clots in her lungs.  She won't be doing anything for a while.  I am sad to see her go.  I had been hoping for a Nick/Bindi/Tamar finale.  Sending prayers for a full and speedy recovery for her.

[Danseur]

Here is a news article about her withdrawal. She evidently has a pulmonary embolism which is extremely serious. She definitely looked like she needed to be in the hospital and not on the dance floor Monday night.

http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/gossip/illness-knocks-tamar-braxton-dancing-stars-article-1.2430696

[truthaboutluv]

That sucks for her but better they found it than something way worse and tragic happening. To be honest, I was very uncomfortable and worried watching her when the judges were talking after they danced. I definitely thought she looked like she could keel over at any moment with the way her eyes kept rolling back in her head. She did not look good at all so I'm not terribly surprised to hear that she was even sicker than she realized. But again, glad they found it in time and she's getting treatment, because as I've always said, this cheesy show is not worth ruining one's health over. 

Edited November 11, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[majormama]

Holy crap, that's terrifying. Hope she gets well soon.

[mtlchick]

Oh no :(  Sorry that it had to end like that for her.  I was really pulling for her in the finals.

 

I guess next week is pretty much jockeying for votes.

[Jal]

Jal, I think you might be confusing Tamar's Rumba with her Contemporary. The Rumba was her Duet Dance with Nick and it was performed live.

Ah yes, thanks for the clarification.

 

I thought that dance was good, but not great. Certainly not the worst dance in DWtS history.

 

I hope she makes a full recovery from the very serious health problem :/

Edited November 11, 2015 by Jal

[realdancemom]

Wishing Tamar a speedy recovery.  This show is definitely not worth your health.

[legaleagle53]

Holy crap, that's terrifying. Hope she gets well soon.

 

No kidding.  I never warmed to her as a dancer, but I'd never wish something like that on her.  I hope she does make a speedy, full recovery!

[Ireland77]

When Tamar returned, Val looked ashamed for selling her down the river (again) and Julianne kept twitching as though she was being jabbed from the thorn in her side returning.

I don't think Val was selling Tamar down the river at all. I think he was being 100% protective of her and was completely and totally annoying with having to sit there and listen to them critique a routine that Tamar stumbled through during dress rehearsal while obviously very sick. I think that when he said she should not have been there and when he said it didn't even matter, he meant she shouldn't have been dancing in the first place and that the judge's comments on her dancing were irrelevant in light of her illness. Edited November 11, 2015 by Ireland77

[sinkwriter]

 

I had been hoping for a Nick/Bindi/Tamar finale.

 

That is the finale I had expected as well, and I'm sorry that we won't see it. It sucks, because she put in so much work and it ends like this, but her health is so much more important. I hope the doctors take very good care of Tamar and that she's safe and healthy very soon. That is some scary, scary stuff.

[radishcake]

Guys - make sure you move the Tamar talk over to her thread. Thanks!

[majormama]

I would have liked to see Tamar in the finals, but clearly she needs to be done for her health. It is what it is. 

 

I also would have liked to see Alexa continue. Of course we can never know what would have happened. If Tamar hadn't made it back in time, or if she had finished her dance and (in between gasping for air and eyes rolling back) had said she'd come through for her team but was now withdrawing, it would be interesting to see how Alexa would have done next week. It's possible not having had enough votes to survive this week, she also wouldn't have survived next week regardless. It's also possible with her two excellent dances she would have gotten some of the uncommitted voters and pulled through.

 

Hindsight being 20/20, I think Tamar withdrawing after dancing and before the elimination would have been best as far as allowing Alexa to continue. Now, though, I don't know how they could pull it off. Voting has already closed, so Alexa would have no votes. She'd be eliminated for sure if she danced next week, which wouldn't be fair, unless they gave her immunity for the week, which wouldn't be fair to everyone else. The only other option to bring her back, as someone else said elsewhere, would be if they throw out all the results from this week and have a two-nighter next week with dances on Monday counting for an elimination on Tuesday leading up to the finale the next week. But that puts the network in a bind as far as scheduling. 

And if Alexa doesn't come back, there's the question of changing from a 4-person finale to a 3-person finale, or having a non-elimination next week. It's all just a mess. I'm glad I don't have to figure it all out.

[Missy Vixen]

According to an article I just read, pneumonia is not contagious. The bacteria or virus that caused the pneumonia is contagious and that is how pneumonia takes hold to begin with in a person who has risk factors such as being elderly and immune surpressed.

I rode in a car with someone who had (untreated) pneumonia. BOOM. it's not a joke.

 

Tamar exposed everyone she's worked with while she has had the illness. And hopefully, nobody involved is either immune suppressed or has another health issue. DWTS doesn't seem to care.

 

p.s. Radishcake, I posted this before I read your comments. If this needs to be moved, I understand.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Missy Vixen

[SmallTownMom]

Glad Tamar is out.  She needs to look after her health.  I don't care for her at all, but really felt bad for her on Monday night.

 

One thing I can't stop thinking about is Carlos and Alexa's "goodbye."  Good Lord!

 

Is he going off to war and they will maybe never see each other again?  Is one of them dying?  Such fake drama!! 

 

It's a competition, somebody goes home every week, and only one person is going to win.  Suck it up.  Don't care for either one of them, fact is, I really don't care who wins.  I do love Whitney, but Carlos is such an ass.  He didn't seem very upset that he dropped Whitney, and she took it like a pro.

 

Sorry if I am discussing this after everybody else already has, but it was one of the most amusing things ever on the show.

[sinkwriter]

 

Is he going off to war and they will maybe never see each other again?

This made me laugh really hard.  :)

[iMonrey]

 

I've got some dirt cheap oceanfront property for anyone who bought the timeline of Tamar's return Tom was giving us.

 

There was definitely something wonky about the editing because Tom said she'd just entered the building and they cut to a shot of her in the hallway in a t-shirt then like two minutes later she was in full costume and makeup and on the dance floor.

 

My takeaway from Carlos and Alexa's histrionics is that both lack emotional maturity. I know some people probably might want to give them a pass because emotions can run high in a stressful situation, but they have both been in "jeopardy" more than once, so if they did not adequately prepare themselves for the possibility that one or both of them might be eliminated then it was foolhardy and unrealistic on their parts. As numerous others have already pointed out, it's not as if they were being sent to death row. Their reactions were really over the top and more along the lines of something you'd expect from a young kid for whom everything in life is momentous and the most important thing in the world. They acted like a couple of junior high kids who were told they wouldn't be able to date anymore. It was ridiculous.

[sinkwriter]

It's interesting that you say that about their maturity, iMonrey. I didn't know much about either of them (though I do recognize the movie name "Spy Kids"), so based on their behavior in DWTS I assumed they were younger, like very early twenties, married young. But instead I see they're both in their later 20's... granted, any 20's is still young and at that age I had a lot of growing yet to do (and even now, LOL!) but I really did think they were younger than that based on their behavior. So I think yeah, they were unprepared for how crappy they'd feel when one or the other got eliminated. I think they assumed it would all be in fun and they'd cheer each other on and maybe get in some trash talking, but I don't think they realized that they'd feel bad. But after all the work put in, and especially after the week Alexa had performing, I think Carlos feels crappy that he's still in it and she's not.

 

And frankly, I think it should have gone the other way around, with him leaving first. That's not how I felt at the outset, seeing both of them perform I thought he was stronger, but in the past weeks I think we've seen her grow more and get better while he's pretty much stayed the same, so... I wish he'd been the one to go home.

[truthaboutluv]

It's interesting that you say that about their maturity, iMonrey. I didn't know much about either of them (though I do recognize the movie name "Spy Kids"), so based on their behavior in DWTS I assumed they were younger, like very early twenties, married young.

 

 

For the record, Carlos is Alexa's second marriage. 

[sinkwriter]

Wow! 

 

He was apparently 34 and she was 22? That's kind of a big gap at that age.  *wince*

Edited November 12, 2015 by sinkwriter

[MortysCleaningLady]

Super late to the game, but I hated Mark's choreography for Alexa -- she looked like she was being beaten!!

[Wings]

Super late to the game, but I hated Mark's choreography for Alexa -- she looked like she was being beaten!!

 

 

That was the point.  She was being beaten by bulimia. 

 

Glad Tamar is out.  She needs to look after her health.  I don't care for her at all, but really felt bad for her on Monday night.

 

 

What??  We don;t know that yet and won;t until Monday, next week.