S02.E05: The Gift Of The Magi

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Floyd takes action, and Charlie tries to prove himself. Peggy and Ed disagree about what to do next, while Lou finds himself sidelined during Ronald Reagan's campaign tour.

[Rhetorica]

Interesting title. What or who are the sacrificial gifts? Will Floyd sacrifice Dodd, will Peggy sacrifice Ed?

[bosawks]

Dear Cristin Milioti,

Stop taking parts where you'll break my heart in the end.

Sincerely,

bosawks

[AimingforYoko]

Interesting title. What or who are the sacrificial gifts? Will Floyd sacrifice Dodd, will Peggy sacrifice Ed?

I see where the title came from. Well guys, your heart was in the right place. For once. Peggy grows a conscience and Ed grows a four-leaf clover out of his ass. Oh well, God favors fools, drunks and small children. Better sirens and lights than Hanzee.

I so want Hanzee vs. Milligan.

[Primetimer]

Which is important, because all the other families this season are past 'dysfunctional' and actively devouring themselves.

Read the story

[ToastnBacon]

I was expecting action this episode, but not that much. Wow!

I also figured the plot to kill Ed was doomed, but I wasn't expecting that. There are so many possibilities for fallout from how that went down.

I'm looking forward to seeing Bear blow his stack, he is super creepy and probably more twisted than Dodd.

Great writing on this show.

[bmoore4026]

Pigtailed girl at the butcher's annoyed me with the "Life is pointless" talk.  Which is why what happened in the backroom of the butcher's was so interesting.  Turns out she didn't want to die.  Nor did she want Ed to die.  Or Charlie.  God, the complexities!

 

Well, they know that Peggy is the one who killed Rye.  That's faster than I expected them to find out.  And again, she's a little perky Lady Macbeth, thinking of how to get out situations on the fly.  Still, this will probably bite her in the ass, much like Lady Macbeth.  But she left that car with the mechanic.  He'll probably die now.

 

Another thing that was wrapped up fast was the Gerhardt/Kansas City war.  First minutes of the show then it's over.  I would have expected it to happen in the middle of the show or at the end.  Again, this show subverts expectations.

 

Mike remains deliciously evil, but The Kitchen Brothers irritate me.  Always have.  Looked up on IMDB that they're actually played by actual twin brothers and not by one guy and special effects.  I know those are different things, but that's just the way I think.

 

Jean Smart's character reminds me of Barbara Stanwick's character from The Big Valley, only more ruthless and imposing.

 

Sooooo hoping Bear kills Dodd.  That would be so satisfying.

 

Loved Bruce Campbell as Ronald Reagan.  Him trying to compare the war movie he was in as the same as Lou's actual war experience was pretty good, as was his shallow reassurance.

Edited November 10, 2015 by bmoore4026

[atir]

There was sooooo much killing tonite! That hatbox?! Glerg. Pretty disgusting.

I thought Joe would be around longer in the series. I also thought both Kitchen brothers were dead.

[DrScottie]

 

it's awful to watch a smart, funny, loving woman have to face her own decline, and her own mortality

 

On How I Met Your Mother, the smart, funny, loving woman was established throughout the final season and her decline and mortality was conveyed in a 5 second shot of her in a hospital bed with Ted's narration. At least Fargo isn't about Lou asking Molly's permission to pursue an old flame after Betsy passes. 

 

But, wow! That was a great episode. I'm still processing Bruce Campbell as Governor Reagan. 

[Maire]

That moment with Ronnie Reagan in the bathroom was all politics everywhere for all time.

Politician: " there's no problem an American can't solve"

Voter: "but how?"

Politician: ....................

[thuganomics85]

Seriously, I can't believe this is only the fifth episode.  There was some stuff here that I would have expected to happen more around mid-season or near the end.  I hope this means it isn't going to run out of steam, but that's just me not getting my hopes up.  Right now this show has more then earned my trust. 

 

Absolutely loved Bruce Campbell as Ronald Reagan.  A lot of it was because while he carried himself like the actual man, I felt like he avoided just being an imitation of him.  He didn't exactly look or sound like the real Reagan, but he just embodied how Reagan came off, and who I imagine was like in real life.  I could totally buy that this Reagan was someone who can be charming and say the right things, even when you really look into it, a lot of it was a whole lot of nothing and just what people want to hear (or what he think they want to hear.)  And him trying to compare his war movie to Lou actually serving, was so, so wrong.  Patrick Wilson's reaction to that entire moment was perfect.

 

The war between the Gerhardts and Kansas City has gotten nuts!  Dodd and Hanzee lied and said that Rye was killed by a hitman from KC ("The Butcher"), so Floyd allows there to be a flat-out shoot-out, which kills a ton of people, including one of the Kitchen bros (confused how the second on survived) and Joe/Brad Garrett himself.  Mike though is still alive, so he's basically threatening Simone to spy for him, or he'll kill her.  But it also looks like Bear is suspicious of what really happened, and Floyd seems to be slowly, but surely getting tired of how Dodd is treating Simone, and probably is general woman-hating attitude.  Oh, and they all are still trying to get "The Butcher", so at this point, I don't know what to think.  I'm sure this is going to end in their downfall, but I don't know who is going to take them down: Kansas City, law enforcement, or themselves.

 

While I figured Ed wasn't going to die so soon, all of his scenes with Charlie were intense.  But the man keeps on surviving.  And, of course, right when this happens and he wants to leave, Peggy suddenly has a change of heart and sells the car to get money to buy the store.  Which is currently burning down.  Oh, and it looks like the police are showing up.  I just love that these two have somehow caused all this chaos.

 

The scenes with Betsy, Hank, and Molly were nice amongst all the craziness.  Not much Hank in this one, but I loved his "We'll just be here eating sugar cereal and playing with my service weapon" line.  But I thought Cristin Milioti and Ted Danson both did a great job at making both characters try to be strong and normal, but knowing deep down how dire her condition is.

 

Carl/Nick Offerman showing up and being "moved" by Reagan's speech was great.

 

It would have been impossible, but part of me is a little disappointed that there wasn't any way for Dodd to cross Reagan's path, just to see a brief Burn Notice reunion with Jeffery Donovan and Campbell.

 

Need more time to digest it, but this might be my favorite episode yet. 

Edited November 10, 2015 by thuganomics85

[tennisgurl]

So much happens in every episode, its kind of unreal.

 

I have been waiting for Bruce Campbell as Reagan all season, and it was totally worth it. He looks nothing like the guy, but he just had this...energy that I think fits Reagan really well, especially what I would imagine a younger Reagan would be like. That being said, having just watch Ash vs. Evil Dead, I kept expected Reagan to take off his hand, replace it with an axe, and start sawing people up. Hail to the Chief baby. 

 

Ed just has a real habit of surviving, when all logic says he should be a dead man. And it turns out Peggy does have a heart somewhere in there. I really have no clue where their plot is going, especially now that everyone knows what they did. 

 

The whole metaphor of the Kansas City moving in on the Gerhardts operation, much like how big business will boot out all of the family business in the 80s is inspired, and a great way of combining social commentary, period detail, and crime drama. Its pretty damn brilliant. 

[knaankos]

I could certainly do without the heavy handed Reagan/action on the screen parallels. I don't much see the need to over politicize this show. I didn't like it in the film "Killing Them Softly" and I certainly don't like it here.

[VCRTracking]

Whoa.

 

Glad one Kitchen Brother made it.

 

To quote Nick Offerman's character about Reagan in regards to Mike Milligan, "He's got charisma, I'll give him that."

 

Dodd's such a f@#king asshole.

 

Love Bruce Campbell as Reagan.

 

Felt bad for Ed seeing his dream literally go up in flames.

 

Cristin Milioti continues to break my heart.

 

What's with the UFO?!

 

"The Gift of the Magi" was an apt title.

Edited November 10, 2015 by VCRTracking

[Ruby25]

Bruce Campbell as Reagan was AWESOME.

[ToastnBacon]

The one Kitchen Brother was left alive to take Bossman's head back to KC.

The scene a couple of episodes ago where Mike felt the Agree shampoo in Bossman's hair made a lot more sense tonight.

The way Mike touched his hair was exactly the same.

Interesting title. What or who are the sacrificial gifts? Will Floyd sacrifice Dodd, will Peggy sacrifice Ed?

I took the title "Gift of the Magi" to be a reference to the O. Henry short story of the same name.

The plot of that story loosely matches what happened between Peggy and Ed with the butcher shop.

Edited November 10, 2015 by ToastnBacon

[Spartan Girl]

Gift of the Magi, Fargo style. LOL.

Surprised that Ed and Peggy got busted so soon. Then again, under Lou, the cops are way smarter than they were last season.

Was that Brad Garrtett's head in the box? Yeesh. This season has a higher body count than last year.

[Haiti D]

This is an awesome show.

Ed and Peggy... I'm glad she didn't leave. Now more than ever they need to stick it out together. If they had both fled to CA, they might have been safe for a bit but they would have been found eventually. I like how their marriage dynamic is written; neither is always right, neither is always the fool.

I was surprised by Brad Garrett's death. KC won't be happy and most likely they'll send more men. Milligan is a mixture of mad and sad; I think the girl Gerhardt is going to get punished.

I'm glad Charlie couldn't get it done. Bear is going to be so pissed at Dodd for sending his boy.

I like Bear. He cried for Rye, Dodd did not. I hope Hanzee doesn't hurt him.

I have a feeling that little cop is going to tell Floyd Rye's death was an accident.

[ToastnBacon]

I am a not a UFO nut in real life, but here are a few things I picked up on in this episode.

Molly's picture of the UFO looking sun over the house. Hank mentioning he saw Molly staring out the window.

The "Children of the Sun" song playing as the ending credits rolled. That song played in episode one before we saw the UFO and the song is about an UFO encounter.

This isn't really a spoiler or speculation in my opinion, but I'll protect it just to be respectful of any purists who might be reading.

I read a short blurb from one of the show's producers that said the UFO stuff was in there for a reason.

[ToastnBacon]

This is an awesome show.

Ed and Peggy... I'm glad she didn't leave. Now more than ever they need to stick it out together. If they had both fled to CA, they might have been safe for a bit but they would have been found eventually. I like how their marriage dynamic is written; neither is always right, neither is always the fool.

I was surprised by Brad Garrett's death. KC won't be happy and most likely they'll send more men. Milligan is a mixture of mad and sad; I think the girl Gerhardt is going to get punished.

I'm glad Charlie couldn't get it done. Bear is going to be so pissed at Dodd for sending his boy.

I like Bear. He cried for Rye, Dodd did not. I hope Hanzee doesn't hurt him.

I have a feeling that little cop is going to tell Floyd Rye's death was an accident.

The little cop (I love that nickname for him) will certainly tell Floyd that it was an accident.

I'm getting the vibe that Hanzee might be more loyal to Floyd than Dodd thinks. He looked pissed off for being put in the position to lie about Rye's death.

A confrontation between Bear and Dodd has been building all season, but I see them keeping a lid on it until they get Charlie back.

Edited November 10, 2015 by ToastnBacon

[Should Be Working]

Could have sworn that Hanzee killed both of the Kitchen Brothers out there in the clearing. You figure a fellow so well versed in the quick and efficient murder  of VC in the tunnels of Vietnam would have made absolutely sure he finished the job. Was surprised to later see one of them answer the door to Mike's hotel room for Simone.

 

That song playing while Peggy was packing her suitcases, Let's Get Together Tonight, sounded familiar. Then I remembered that Jose Feliciano sang it at that Minneapolis show that Steve Buscemi and his hooker date attended in the Coen brothers movie.

 

As for Peggy's sudden transformation from selfish sociopath to devoted housewife and partner to Ed, that might very well serve the remaining season story line, but it doesn't ring true in the least. For 4.75 episodes of Season 2, she's consistently shown herself to be totally self-serving and without concern for others, including Ed. Anyone who can casually brush her hair, as if she hasn't a care in the world, while Rye lies bleeding out on the hood of the Corvair a few yards away is missing a conscience. You don't just suddenly acquire one at a Luvurne body shop on the way to the seminar that will make you an even more magnificent person.

Edited November 10, 2015 by Should Be Working

[Ottis]

Dodd and Hanzee lied and said that Rye was killed by a hitman from KC ("The Butcher"), so Floyd allows there to be a flat-out shoot-out, which kills a ton of people,

 

 

So I got the impression that the reason they lied wasn't because they wanted a war, but because they didn't want their mom to know that Rye was killed by some nobody in an accident of some kind who happened to be a butcher. It was important to their mom's pride that Rye was killed by somebody professional, someone who is good at what he does. The comments about Rye getting in a few licks in anyway back that up. The war between the Gerhardt's and KC was coming regardless of that.

[RustbeltWriter]

That moment with Ronnie Reagan in the bathroom was all politics everywhere for all time.

Politician: " there's no problem an American can't solve"

Voter: "but how?"

Politician: ....................

 

Very apt for the current campaign

[Haiti D]

So I got the impression that the reason they lied wasn't because they wanted a war, but because they didn't want their mom to know that Rye was killed by some nobody in an accident of some kind who happened to be a butcher. It was important to their mom's pride that Rye was killed by somebody professional, someone who is good at what he does. The comments about Rye getting in a few licks in anyway back that up. The war between the Gerhardt's and KC was coming regardless of that.

Yes war was going to start regardless. But I think they lied because they wanted Floyd to believe that KC was never going to deal honestly with them, which may be true because Milligan was actively searching for Rye. And what he would have done with him, we'll never know.

[bosawks]

I wonder when that Chekov's cast of Bear's is going to go off?

[teddysmom]

Nick Offerrman/Carl saying that shaking hands with Reagan would be undignified because he made a movie with a monkey sounds like something straight out of the mouth of Ron Swanson.  Except Ron would have never caved when faced with Reagan.  And he would have added, "the man wears make up, for God's sake". 

 

The scene with Lou and Reagan in the mens' room pretty much sums up Reagan's presidency. 

[benteen]

Really good episode with an incredible amount of action.  I enjoyed it.

 

Dodd is really going to come to a bad end...he's managed to piss off just about everyone in his family.

 

So long, Brad Garrett.

 

The butcher shop confrontation was insane.  I never expected the interaction between Charlie and the butcher shop girl to be so sweet.  I'm curious to see how that whole situation plays itself out.

 

I could do without this shows political statement on Reagan though Bruce Campbell did a fine job.  That storyline was worth it for this exchange and especially Patrick Wilson's delivery...

 

-Karl: “If you get the chance, ask him if it’s true that Joan Crawford had crabs.”

-Lou: “Yeah, I’m not gonna do that.”

Edited November 10, 2015 by benteen

[Dev F]

Molly's picture of the UFO looking sun over the house. Hank mentioning he saw Molly staring out the window.

My impression was that Molly drew a fairly normal picture of her family in the sun, but then Betsy put her coffee cup down on it and the resulting ring made it look like a UFO. I think Betsy was struck by the eeriness of that coincidence rather than the sense that her daughter had seen something strange.

What struck me, too, was how the image echoed Reagan's stump speech about a "shining city on the hill," only shifted into something distant and baffling. I wonder if that's part of what the UFO stuff is meant to symbolize in general: the notion that the characters are searching desperately for this bright, shining future, but whenever they catch a glimpse of it, it seems utterly alien and unattainable. "Yeah, but . . . how?"

As for Peggy's sudden transformation from selfish sociopath to devoted housewife and partner to Ed, that might very well serve the remaining season story line, but it doesn't ring true in the least. For 4.75 episodes of Season 2, she's consistently shown herself to be totally self-serving and without concern for others, including Ed. Anyone who can casually brush her hair, as if she hasn't a care in the world, while Rye lies bleeding out on the hood of the Corvair a few yards away is missing a conscience. You don't just suddenly acquire one at a Luvurne body shop on the way to the seminar that will make you an even more magnificent person.

I dunno, I never saw Peggy as indifferent to her husband's feelings. She's shown all along to be torn between her love for him and her own desire for self-actualization; Constance has to talk her into redirecting the money to her seminar because "'We' is a castle, hon, with a moat and a drawbridge." If anything, her forced indifference to Rye's murder seems like a byproduct of her ongoing need to walk that line, to put on the external signs of a perfect, perky housewife even when there's all sorts of shit going on inside her. Edited November 10, 2015 by Dev F

[benteen]

Yeah, I didn't see much change in Peggy.  Just her controlling the narrative again.  I think it was most noticeable when she told Ed "We were right.  Well, I was right but you were right too."  It's still all about her.

[Should Be Working]

My impression was that Molly drew a fairly normal picture of her family in the sun, but then Betsy put her coffee cup down on it and the resulting ring made it look like a UFO. I think Betsy was struck by the eeriness of that coincidence rather than the sense that her daughter had seen something strange.

  One of the few perks of being a Comcast subscriber, other than paying relatively exorbitant monthly bills for internet and cable TV service and poor customer service, is their "Xfinity on Demand" (XOD) feature, which allows you to re-view currently broadcast TV episodes as many times as you like.

 

I've got episode 5 running while I work this morning and just replayed that scene with Betsy looking at Molly's crayon drawing. That ring around the bottom of the bright sun-like object was no coffee mug stain. Molly obviously drew it as she saw it. And she colored the ring bright gold.

[Dev F]

I've got episode 5 running while I work this morning and just replayed that scene with Betsy looking at Molly's crayon drawing. That ring around the bottom of the bright sun-like object was no coffee mug stain. Molly obviously drew it as she saw it. And she colored the ring bright gold.

 

Oh, I rewatched the scene on On Demand this morning as well. You're correct that the yellow oval is part of Molly's original drawing. But it would just look like a little kid's squashed drawing of a sun if not for the perfectly round object from which it seems to be radiating. That second ring is what appears to be a stain from Betsy's coffee cup.

[BaseOps]

This is, without question, the best show on TV right now. It's insane how the series seems to take its time with everything, and yet the story moves impressively fast. Who would have thought Ed and Peggy would be ousted so quickly? Let alone with a burnt down bakery and everyone on their tail. I really sympathize with Ed. He's tried so hard to live a simple life in the 'right' way, and now it's all blown up. Peggy should be annoying, but I actually really like her too. I'm glad she didn't just run away, though she obviously isn't the brightest bulb. This is my favourite role I've ever seen Dunst play, bar none. I think both her and Jesse Plemons are phenomenal. 

 

Bokeem Woodbine continues to be the best badass on TV, too. And I can't help but sort of root for him. I was shocked that they killed off Bulo so early, and I'm sort of sad because I love Brad Garrett in this part. I was hoping to see some more of him. But now Mike has had a fire lit under his ass, and I can only imagine things are going to get more explosive from here. I wonder how Simone will play into all of it - I was worried he was going to kill her right there in the hotel room, but I like that Mike is a bit more intelligent than that. Rather than losing his cool, he knew he could use her to his own gain. I'm excited to see that. 

 

Lou and Betsy are great, and I love Hank too. I think the balance of all these stories and how they connect is basically perfect - not many other shows achieve balance the way Noah Hawley has with Fargo. The reveal of the UFO in Molly's drawing is really interesting. I wonder how they're going to pay that story off, or if it will just continue to be these sort of small tidbits here and there (which I wouldn't hate - I might actually prefer it.) 

 

The stuff with Reagan was awesome. Perfectly cast for this show, and his scene's actually added to the story. I loved his interactions with Karl (and his asking Lou to find out if Joan Crawford really had crabs) and the scene in the bathroom was fantastic. I really just love this show. 

Edited November 10, 2015 by BaseOps

[ItsHelloPattiagain]

 

 

Mike remains deliciously evil, but The Kitchen Brothers irritate me.  Always have.  Looked up on IMDB that they're actually played by actual twin brothers and not by one guy and special effects.  I know those are different things, but that's just the way I think.

Kinda reminds me of the twins on Breaking Bad. Those were real twins too. 

 

It was ironic when Ed was getting choked out that Jesse Plemons almost got killed similar to how he died on Breaking Bad (yes, that's the way I think lol)

 

I have to go back and watch the whole episode again. I'm sure there were parts I missed. So much in that episode. 

[ToastnBacon]

I thought Hanzee's conversation about what happened to Rye came after the big shootout with the KC guys at the beginning of the episode, right?

The reason Dodd wanted Hanzee to lie about Rye's death to Floyd was to keep her from entering into negotiations with KC at a later date.

Dodd wants to make sure that they continue with the all out war that Floyd had already declared at the end of the previous episode.

I don't think Hanzee's lie was about helping Rye have a more dignified death, it was more about keeping Floyd's desire to keep fighting and not even consider a truce.

Oh, and I think the reason Hanzee didn't kill the remaining Kitchen Brother was so he could carry the message of what happened.

I got the impression that the Kitchen Brother was the sole survivor of the melee from the KC crew.

[Lorimac]

Everyone, including Ms. T.A., thinks Floyd is so tough and sharp, but frankly, I don't see it. Trust me, no one would like to see Floyd take charge of things and deal a good spanking to the Kansas City crowd more than me, and Jean Smart does steely-eyed determination pretty darn good, but the facts say something else - she was willing to settle/to negotiate, Dodd is the one who is running things; she is clueless as to how her youngest actually died; the sub-level operatives like Hanzee take their orders from Dodd, not Floyd; she is not respected by her oldest son, allows her middle son to hide behind her skirts, and lost control of her youngest son long ago; and she hasn't the backbone to let her husband die so she can focus her attention and energies to winning this war. So how is that tough and strong? I am just looking forward to seeing Floyd really take charge, because I don;t see that happening at all....yet.

Also, this episode turned my mind around about Ed. Up to this episode, I thought Peggy was the one in that couple who had lost her grip on reality (if she ever had one), but that scene in the basement - the condition of the basement - just shelves and shelves of magazines and books - really drives home that Peggy's mental issues are WAY BIGGER than just simple untidiness and a little hoarding tendency. She is a total crackpot and for Ed to think it would be a good idea to introduce children into this scenario shows how out of touch he is as well. This is not just pretending that the lack of marital ardor is just sumpthin' womenfolk do, but it is clear that he has been ignoring the crazy elephant in the room, which makes him out of touch as much as Peggy is.

[barbedwire]

Really good episode with an incredible amount of action.  I enjoyed it.

 

Dodd is really going to come to a bad end...he's managed to piss off just about everyone in his family.

 

So long, Brad Garrett.

 

The butcher shop confrontation was insane.  I never expected the interaction between Charlie and the butcher shop girl to be so sweet.  I'm curious to see how that whole situation plays itself out.

 

I could do without this shows political statement on Reagan though Bruce Campbell did a fine job.  That storyline was worth it for this exchange and especially Patrick Wilson's delivery...

 

-Karl: “If you get the chance, ask him if it’s true that Joan Crawford had crabs.”

-Lou: “Yeah, I’m not gonna do that.”

Agree with ya there.  All of it.  That line cracked me up.

 

I too loved the interaction between Charlie and shop girl (Maureen?).  So unexpected and so sweet.  Interesting how she didn't want to die after all.

 

Not enough Floyd last night.  Jean Smart is the best part of this show. 

 

I also think guy who bought the car is going to die.

 

Such a cliff hanging ending.  Will Peggy and Ed be able to flee?

[Nutjob]

 

This is not just pretending that the lack of marital ardor is just sumpthin' womenfolk do, but it is clear that he has been ignoring the crazy elephant in the room, which makes him out of touch as much as Peggy is.

ITA. I suspect Ed might snap out of it soon, but until now he is just as delusional as Peggy if he thinks her behavior is normal in any way. Also, selling the car was probably the worst thing Peggy could have done, because now it's no longer under her control.

 

Floyd is smart, but yes--she is currently being played by Dodd. I don't think it will last, and i have to wonder if Bulo's words about getting him under control will make her take some drastic measures to make sure that happens. He's a loose cannon, and he keeps screwing everything up.

 

I work in the political arena (no, I'm not an elected official or staffer), so I always find takes on politics in entertainment very interesting. I'm amused by their characterization of Reagan so far, and trying to figure out what exactly their angle is.

 

I was sort of saddened by the death of one of the Kitchen Brothers--I guess the prog rock band is no more. Also, Simone has made a deal with the devil, and now she is going to have to pay up. I was hoping she was smarter than that.

Edited November 10, 2015 by Nutjob

[BananaRama]

Floyd seems to be in over her head. How involved with the business was she before Otto's stroke? For one thing, does she ever leave the farm? She only knows what she knows from what Dodd and Hanzee tell her. Even Simone is more acquainted with the KC folks then Floyd. Also, Simone was the person who knew the connection between the typewriter salesman and Rye. Dodd and the KC folks keep referring to her as a girl and quite honestly, she is acting like a girl. Instead of swinging her "big stick" around like Dodd, she is acting rational, level-headed and nurturing. These are admirable qualities in a business woman but she is using these qualities in the wrong business.

[Maire]

Dodd wants Floyd to believe that  the war was inevitable and in fact already started before the negotiation. This way she can't blame Dodd for screwing up the business by acting the fool at the initial business meeting.

[benteen]

Floyd seems to be in over her head. How involved with the business was she before Otto's stroke? For one thing, does she ever leave the farm? She only knows what she knows from what Dodd and Hanzee tell her. Even Simone is more acquainted with the KC folks then Floyd. Also, Simone was the person who knew the connection between the typewriter salesman and Rye. Dodd and the KC folks keep referring to her as a girl and quite honestly, she is acting like a girl. Instead of swinging her "big stick" around like Dodd, she is acting rational, level-headed and nurturing. These are admirable qualities in a business woman but she is using these qualities in the wrong business.

 

Excellent post, one I don't disagree with.  It's the lack of control over her son that's the biggest problem.  He needs to be put in his place and her other son is the one who should be her right hand in this.  I can't imagine Dodd reacting well to that and that's another problem.  But Dodd is driving this family off a cliff and the only way I see that stopping is if Dodd is put down.  Or Hanzee switches his loyalty over to Floyd.

[applecrisp]

Looking forward to Dodd's demise.  The biggest brute on this show.

[knaankos]

Kinda reminds me of the twins on Breaking Bad. Those were real twins too. 

 

It was ironic when Ed was getting choked out that Jesse Plemons almost got killed similar to how he died on Breaking Bad (yes, that's the way I think lol)

 

I have to go back and watch the whole episode again. I'm sure there were parts I missed. So much in that episode. 

 

Yes I thought of the Breaking Bad twins as well. They were perhaps the weakest part of Breaking Bad, the lone weak spot really. And the kitchen brothers are the same thing almost exactly. Silent killing machines that don't really make any sense

I wonder when we will see the KC Mafia boss again. We saw him briefly at the end of episode 1 and his face was covered in shadow. I bet he will be playing a big role before the season is over

Edited November 10, 2015 by knaankos

[AuntiePam]

I loved how Ed calmly let Peggy have her say -- didn't even interrupt her -- he's so freaking polite -- after he'd just had the fight of his life. 

 

Can we hope Ed and Peggy will be in whatever passes for witness protection in Minnesota? 

[Andromeda]

Also, this episode turned my mind around about Ed. Up to this episode, I thought Peggy was the one in that couple who had lost her grip on reality (if she ever had one), but that scene in the basement - the condition of the basement - just shelves and shelves of magazines and books - really drives home that Peggy's mental issues are WAY BIGGER than just simple untidiness and a little hoarding tendency. She is a total crackpot and for Ed to think it would be a good idea to introduce children into this scenario shows how out of touch he is as well. This is not just pretending that the lack of marital ardor is just sumpthin' womenfolk do, but it is clear that he has been ignoring the crazy elephant in the room, which makes him out of touch as much as Peggy is.

 

Ed's definitely blind to his wife's faults, though I don't think hoarding was talked about much as a mental illness thing in the '70s. Just something strange some people did. (OCD wasn't in the common vernacular then, either -- I think when Howard Hughes died in 1976, and people found out about his oddities such as saving his urine in jars, people became more aware of it.) Beyond that, I could see him thinking that having a baby would get her to shift her attention off of the magazines. He probably deludes himself into thinking of it as her "hobby," which, once the baby comes, she will stop focusing on in favor of raising their family.

 

When Dodd called Ed the Butcher of Luverne, my husband was thinking Ed had been leading a secret life all along, and he really was this scary former hitman. I think the explanation offered here makes more sense (that Dodd lied), because I can't see Ed being that guy -- but Ed is definitely able to take care of himself (woah, that cleaver to the head! disposing of a body in a meat grinder!), while remaining unflappable, which is an interesting aspect to his character.

Edited November 10, 2015 by Andromeda

[benteen]

Those magazines...no wonder Ed and Peggy don't have any money.  Seriously, that was excessive as hell.

[ToastnBacon]

.

When Dodd called Ed the Butcher of Luverne, my husband was thinking Ed had been leading a secret life all along, and he really was this scary former hitman. I think the explanation offered here makes more sense (that Dodd lied), because I can't see Ed being that guy -- but Ed is definitely able to take care of himself (woah, that cleaver to the head! disposing of a body in a meat grinder!), while remaining unflappable, which is an interesting aspect to his character.

I would be extremely surprised to find that Ed is really secretly the Butcher of Luvern as Dodd described.

I think it was obvious that Dodd was lying, and if the looks between Dodd and Hanzee didn't confirm it, then I think the insight we have on Ed's character does.

I'd be extremely disappointed if the writers threw us a curveball like that.

That said, I'll give your husband's theory that last bit.

Once Ed is in a fight, it does seem like second nature to him. When he killed Rye with the gardening spade, it did appear that he knew what he was doing.

Still, he hasn't been displaying the craftiness and knowledge of the criminal world that a hit man would have. He came damn close to bungling the disposal of Rye's body and the encounter with Lou.

Just the fighting skills.

Edited November 10, 2015 by ToastnBacon

[FoundTime]

The twins on Breaking Bad always gave me a chill. They were just inherently creepy. The Kitchen Brothers didn’t have that kind of impact for me, beyond the folk band possibilities, heh.

 

I'm really struck by how I kind of don't like some of my favorite actors (Plemons, Dunst, and Donovan) in these roles -- and I mean that as a compliment to their abilities.

Hard not to notice the wonderful framing in the final image -- Ed and Peggy boxed in by the doorway, and the way it was shot, showing the walls closing in.

[AuntiePam]

Ed's not a serial killer, or a gangster, and the writers don't intend for us to think so. 

 

Floyd asks about Rye's death, Hanzee responds "it was the butcher", meaning a guy who works as a butcher.  Hanzee was about to tell Floyd the truth, that Rye's death might have been accidental -- Hanzee knew that Rye was at least injured when hit by the Blomquist car and that Rye's death was covered up by Ed.  Dodd can't let the truth come out because it means Floyd might try to negotiate with KC again. Hanzee realizes this and cleverly follows along with what Dodd says.

Edited November 10, 2015 by AuntiePam

[Nutjob]

Right. Dodd wants the war, because it's what he would do if he were in charge--he's all about the slash and burn. Lying to Floyd allows him to manipulate her to get his way.

[MarkySnark]

When Brad Garrett was running through the woods, I was kind of hoping that a bull would be loose from a farm and gore him in the ass. Oops, sorry. Upper thigh.