Spoiler Discussion Thread

[BkWurm1]

7 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

What is EBR like? No one seems to say much about her.

She seems really airy fairy on instagram (I don't mean that in a mean way. She just seems like she's off with the pixies)

I've never heard a thing bad said about her from people that meet her.  Even the guy over at Ksite gushes.  Closest to bad mouthing I've ever heard was the dude that plays WildDong pretty much shrugging and changing the subject when people kept asking question about what it was like to work with her.  Otherwise, it sounds like she's a very friendly person and an equally prepared and giving actor.  

 

Oops, I forgot, the Canadagraphs guy hates her cause she won't give him anymore autographs for him to hawk but really, he don't count.  ;)

Edited January 11, 2017 by BkWurm1

[dtissagirl]

5 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

The big question it brings up to me, though, is when did the writers know that they would have to bring in a new BC? After or before they killed off Laurel?  Were they planning it last season, or did it come up this summer, forcing the writers to change their plans? 

If I had to guess, sometime after SDCC. The sizzle reel had Laurel's deathbed line be something else about Oliver not doing it alone, and that is the one single piece of promo material that the EPs and writers room have a say in.

And then the line changed to America's Next Black Canary in broadcast.

[insomniadreams88]

1 minute ago, dtissagirl said:

And then the line changed to America's Next Black Canary in broadcast.

Imagine if they held auditions for the next BC with OTA as the judges. 

[LeighAn]

1 minute ago, JJ928 said:

Late to this convo, & I'm indifferent to KC and never cared for LL. That said, whether rumors of her being difficult are true or not, I feel like the bigger problem would be MG. That man gives me such bad vibes, and not just him AK & GB as well. Also, SA has always seemed petty and let's face it, he hasn't always been nice about KC/LL. Hell, this past year he has't been too nice about FS, and I wouldn't be surprised if he was a diva bts. I kinda get the vibe that maybe this set isn't all too friendly for women. But that just may be my active imagination lol. 

Lexi Alexander tweeted out after Greg made comments they'd like more female directors but can't convince them to "leave their families" to go to Vancouver. Her comments referred to the set as a frat and hinted that it might not be the most female friendly work place and again that could be a production side.

 

7 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

What is EBR like? No one seems to say much about her.

She seems really airy fairy on instagram (I don't mean that in a mean way. She just seems like she's off with the pixies)

You got to remember Emily is still a girl really. She's what 23? She still technically college aged working out her life thing. And she wants to do what most young girls in their early 20s do and hang out and go on trips with her friends and resist grown up concepts like settling down. 

My sisters her age and she's exactly the same she prioritises her social butterfly life with her friends slightly more then her career.

So I think that explains some of the "airiness" of Emily. But that's just me speculating on very little evidence to go on just her social media profiles.

[Trini]

1 hour ago, tangerine95 said:

All that totally sounds like this was something that was mandated by DC/WB, I don't think they want BC on the show anymore and I don't think they would have brought on a 3rd one if they really had a choice.But I also don't get why WB or DC would do that either. Like it's ridiculous to have 3 versions of the same character in the span of 4 seasons. If Arrow did anything for BC it was damaging the name and the character imo. ....

I agree it's ridiculous. Killing off two versions of the character was a mistake.
 

46 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

But it sounds like DC/CW wants an active Black Canary for their BTS reason.  Sending Laurel to another city wouldn't have accomplished that.

If she's still alive, she could have appeared on a recurring/guest basis, on several of the shows, even. I don't know what DC/WB supposedly wants for Black Canary, but I don't think she needed to be a regular -- if there was any "drama" with Cassidy that needed to be avoided.

[Starfish35]

3 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

If I had to guess, sometime after SDCC. The sizzle reel had Laurel's deathbed line be something else about Oliver not doing it alone, and that is the one single piece of promo material that the EPs and writers room have a say in.

And then the line changed to America's Next Black Canary in broadcast.

That makes sense.  I wonder how much of this season's plans got changed because of it?

[Chaser]

3 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

If I had to guess, sometime after SDCC. The sizzle reel had Laurel's deathbed line be something else about Oliver not doing it alone, and that is the one single piece of promo material that the EPs and writers room have a say in.

And then the line changed to America's Next Black Canary in broadcast.

If that is the case, that late makes me wonder just how much they have planned for Tina this season. If they are planning her around other characters (like say connected to WD).

[lemotomato]

7 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

What is EBR like? No one seems to say much about her.

Judging by how EBR seems to be friendly with everyone on the cast and even the guest stars, I think she's pretty well liked. Amy Gumenick (Cupid) and JR Bourne (Double Down) both singled her out for praise after their stints on the show.

[way2interested]

Just now, Starfish35 said:

That makes sense.  I wonder how much of this season's plans got changed because of it?

Part of me honestly thinks not that much from the BC side (as in Tina won't actually have as big a role besides support newbie), but then again part of me also kind of thinks it might have been mandated for them to have the newbies in general so not all the way sure.

[tangerine95]

Well they did film the BC version of the promise in 4.18 so they had some idea that a new BC storyline was possible. But it does seem like they were leaning more towards no BC at the end of season 4 imo.I mean outing LL as BC and the whole thing with how much it bothered the team to have Evelyn pretending to be her doesn't seem to me like they were setting up a new BC.It seemed like they were burying BC with LL.

[dtissagirl]

37 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

That makes sense.  I wonder how much of this season's plans got changed because of it?

 

35 minutes ago, Chaser said:

If that is the case, that late makes me wonder just how much they have planned for Tina this season. If they are planning her around other characters (like say connected to WD).

I figure Tina showing up so late in the season of boobs is probably due to the writers having to shift stuff around to fit making a new BC happen. On top of having to make KC's deal happen as well. I imagine they decided they needed to get rid of KC again before tackling the next BC, and they probably worked the timeframe after knowing when they were gonna have KC on set.

If these writers weren't so incompetent I'd feel bad for them to have to deal with all of this crap. But it serves them right. :)

Edited January 11, 2017 by dtissagirl

[statsgirl]

28 minutes ago, tangerine95 said:

It seemed like they were burying BC with LL.

That's why it seems so likely that when they filmed the scene in 4.18, the plan was to have Laurel's mystery words be something like "Don't think you can do this alone. You're better with a team", which would have set up the new team at the start of season 5. But then after SDCC, the word came down to have an new Black Canary and they shot the scene with Laurel saying "Don't let me be the last Black Canary. I want to be out there with you always" or whatever she said.

Classic example of taking a bad situation (forced to have a new BC) and making it much worse (making Laurel narcissistic in always wanting to be with him).

[dtissagirl]

8 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

But then after SDCC, the word came down to have an new Black Canary and they shot the scene with Laurel saying "Don't let me be the last Black Canary. I want to be out there with you always" or whatever she said.

There was some con panel that said they shot 4 or 5 different takes of Laurel's last words when they shot the death episode. One of which was the BC one. They totally had an inkling when they killed Laurel that this was an option, hence shooting different takes, but the go order most likely came after SDCC

Edited January 11, 2017 by dtissagirl

[Trisha]

1 hour ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Crazy Ex and Jane The Virgin get renewed because they've received Golden Globe nominations and awards. That is priceless to the CW, a network that is still mocked for being the tween channel. 

Vox did a really great article today on why CEG got renewed - and how that's a clue about where the future of TV is going - and the critical acclaim/noms was just one reason. (Arrow will never have that, but I think the DCTV dominance across four nights of TV gives them another kind of edge.) One of the things the Vox article focused on was Netflix, which Pedowitz says tells him which shows are doing well. Seeing as Arrow is always in the top 5 of the annual most downloaded TV shows list, I wouldn't be surprised if they also do well on streaming. 

Unless a newer, shinier DCTV show comes along for Wednesday nights that could take its place in the crossovers, I'd be really, really surprised if Arrow ended before SA's contract was up. And if it does, it probably won't be for ratings reasons.

[statsgirl]

45 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

There was some con panel that said they shot 4 or 5 different takes of Laurel's last words when they shot the death episode. One of which was the BC one. They totally had an inkling when they killed Laurel that this was an option, hence shooting different takes, but the go order most likely came after SDCC

So working out the timeline, they had an inkling when they shot 4.18 but even in early July at SDCC it wasn't determined yet because they went with the "get a new team".  On the other hand, they could have been told be decided to go with the new team clip because it was less spoilery.

Either way, it couldn't have been pleasant for KC,  paving the way for her replacement before she was even dead on the aired episodes.

[Proteus]

So "dudebros" are fans who don't like Felicity and prefer Laurel/Black Canary instead?

Speaking as a Sara fan, I don't want or care about her ever becoming BC again. The title and identity just don't matter to me. Sara is awesome just as she is and she doesn't need the baggage that identity brings with it.

As for Tina, I'm going to give her a chance. 

[HighHopes]

1 minute ago, Proteus said:

So "dudebros" are fans who don't like Felicity and prefer Laurel/Black Canary instead?

IMO, I think "dudebros" is used for fans of female characters who fight and no other kind of female character. So they like Laurel because Laurel = fighting/masks but not Felicity because Felicity is a silly female character with feelings (and no mask). 

[MaisyDaisy]

I don't think rating drops will effect renewal, I think it effects budget and ego. 

Dudebros are fans that only want female characters to exist or get screen time under a set of parameters that they with their vast knowledge and penis get to pick- ie Felicity is fine as long as she is in her comic relief box and gets absolutely no development. They think anytime spent on romance is a waste, (unless the male lead is getting laid). Even their fave female characters tend to be more for male gaze. 

They can easily be identified by their repeated active use of terms like 'Mary Sue' and 'self insert' (blind to the irony that they adore Barry Allen and in their daydreams whilst showering they are 'Oliver Queen').

Extreme dudebros might be identified by speeches about how their opinion carries more weight because they read comics, but be careful because there is a subset to the extreme that also display behaviors of issuing threats of sexual violence from the anonymity of their computer screen. 

Sometimes dudebros are also 'nice guys' the ones that hate friend zoning because it means they are never going to 'tap that' and wonder why girls are so shallow and dumb to never pick them.

Edited January 11, 2017 by MaisyDaisy

[Mellowyellow]

ahh icic! Completely different to what I had in mind!

Are dudebros an actual thing in America or just in terms of viewing audiences? Like do they exist in a certain social class in real life?

Did the dudebros like Thea? She's pretty hot and did fight!

Shouldn't dudebros like Wild Dog then? He is aggressive and low rent which sounds like he fits in with that crowd?

[BkWurm1]

37 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

So working out the timeline, they had an inkling when they shot 4.18 but even in early July at SDCC it wasn't determined yet because they went with the "get a new team".  On the other hand, they could have been told be decided to go with the new team clip because it was less spoilery.

Either way, it couldn't have been pleasant for KC,  paving the way for her replacement before she was even dead on the aired episodes.

I was thinking that the reason they had the alternative line about another Canary was if the show had a positive response to Evelyn.  To fulfill Laurel's last words, they wouldn't have had to actually call her Black Canary, just some kind of Canary.  But Evelyn was pretty much universally rejected and it seemed that the notion of another Canary was also put away only for it to arise again over the summer.  Or at least that's one possible option.  

Quote

Are dudebros an actual thing in America or just in terms of viewing audiences? Like do they exist in a certain social class in real life?

From the Urban Dictionary:

Quote

 

Dude Bro

White suburban males, usually 16-25 years of age, hailing from anywhere, USA. Characterized by their love of College football, pickup trucks/SUVs, beer,cut off khaki cargo shorts, light pink polo brand shirts (with collar "popped"), abercrombie & fitch, hollister gear, and trucker hats. Favorite bands include, but are not limited to, O.A.R., Jack Johnson, Dave Matthews Band, Avengened Sevenfold, The Fray, and often crappy radio rap (i.e. Nelly, Dem Franchize Boyz, D4L, etc.). Dude bro's are incredibly insecure in their manhood, which makes them: insanely jealous of their girl friends, overly macho, and laughably homophobic. currently, there is no cure for being a dude bro.

 

Edited January 11, 2017 by BkWurm1

[Proteus]

Thanks for the explanations.

[BkWurm1]

I love (and sometimes fear) reading the Urban Dictionary. 

[thegirlsleuth]

This seems like such a stupid, stupid move.  The only people who think that Green Arrow and Black Canary MUST be together are comic fans, and those comic fans are not going to be happy with a Black Canary that's not Dinah Lance or Dinah Drake.  So lose-lose?  I don't understand why they didn't have Laurel go off to fight crime in Gotham City or Platinum Flats, periodically coming back to talk about her new team of kickass women, or make Sara the Black Canary to honor her sister's legacy.  It's been almost a decade since I read Birds of Prey and the only romance I cared about was Oracle and Nightwing, but my recollection was that Ollie never appeared in a single panel of the Birds of Prey Comics, but instead was mentioned. So it is completely possible for them to write Black Canary and Green Arrow fighting crime separately.  It's not like they are Lois Lane and Superman.

Geoff Johns was promoted to head of DC entertainment at the end of July, right after Comic Con, and it is interesting that the Arrow party line is basically what he was saying about Green Arrow and Black Canary in the Rebirth promo interviews.  I find it funny that the comic purists are railing against Guggenheim and Mericles, calling on Geoff Johns to save Arrow, when I would eat my hat if this directive didn't come down directly from Geoff Johns.  Here's a quote from an interview:

“Let’s say you’ve been given the position of writing Green Arrow from scratch,” he posits, rhetorically. “Clean slate. You might say, ‘Okay, I’m going to write this new character,’ and when someone says, ‘Well, what about Black Canary,’ you might say… ‘nope.’ That means you completely misunderstand these characters.” For Johns, to love superheroes is to know what they love, whether it’s a romantic pairing, or a specific hope for their world.

Note:  He doesn't say Dinah or Laurel.  He says Black Canary.  

I have wondered whether they might do a last minute reveal and say that this new character's real name is Dinah Drake, and they were just using Tina Boland as a foiler name.

[Midnight Lullaby]

7 hours ago, insomniadreams88 said:

You know, thinking about what people said about Grey's bringing in new characters and killing them (I think?), if the point of all these new characters is to have people to kill off near the end of the season with whatever Prometheus is going to have planned - wonder what he'll do in May - is the point of spending all this time on them to try to make us care about them? Because I have to say, it's not working.

If it becomes very clear that Tina's not working, I won't be surprised if she dies because this interview makes it clear they just care about a Black Canary. (I wonder how many women are suddenly going to have a metahuman canary cry from being in CC if this is the case or if they'll go back to using tech.) No explanation necessary for WD. (Take him, Prometheus. Or have WD leave town. Something. I really don't want him around in S6.) They could kill off poor Rory simply because of the magic in his rags and then, between seasons, again talk about "getting back to basics" without magic. (Rory is the only one I'd miss.) 

That would be cool but the Arrow EP's style when people don't like a character is to keep shoving him/her down their throats until they do. Shonda instead kills characters, even loved ones, a lot. Recently she killed a main character on HTGAWM, I'm still shocked about that.

[Ophanim]

Catching up spoilers spec: "... around episode 15 or so ... Felicity’s character was going to parallel Oliver's in that she will have a secret that she will be keeping and other people will know about it. Oliver will be kept out of the loop… "

Throw in this more tidbits: it's HER legacy, something NOT relate to Oliver and her parents, and something very "unique" to her. What could possible be THAT secret?? Any ideas? Beside DarkBOP

My mind going to crazy places right now, and I like it. It means I am interested in this spec (positive me) BUT also means I will probably be disappointed by final product (negative me). 

[rtalive]

To be honest I dig the idea of a new fighter kick ass lady. I don't think they should call her Black Canary, but maybe some other Canary.

I think the Black Canary character was ruined on this show from the moment they gave it to KC and killed CL's character. So if they bring an actress that can pull off the role as good as CL, I am up for it. I really like the Arrow and Canary dynamic in season 2, I don't think it can be topped, but you never know, sometimes it is just luck.

[Cleanqueen]

12 hours ago, dtissagirl said:

If I had to guess, sometime after SDCC. The sizzle reel had Laurel's deathbed line be something else about Oliver not doing it alone, and that is the one single piece of promo material that the EPs and writers room have a say in.

And then the line changed to America's Next Black Canary in broadcast.

Yup I said this a month ago, it definitely happened after SDCC and Katie guest starring on Arrow as BS was to green light that direction. I don't think there was ever any plans for a new BC, artemis was to be their new female addition and I think the betrayal was a last minute decision as well.

[Sakura12]

I still think they should bring in Lady Blackhawk, she was in the military and as "black" in her hero name. They can half honor Laurel's weird request. 

[Sunshine]

Wild Dog - Do you think they always intended on giving him a flashback episode? I was wondering if it was a decision to try and make him more sympathetic since his reception seems lukewarm.  IIRC, promo or narrative wise they weren't selling him as being like S1 Oliver until the crossover.

[Chaser]

In a weird way, this makes me look forward to them bringing on Tina. I'm really curious about how this all plays. Narratively there was so many WTFs with bringing on another BC, I want to see how they maneuver through them (or if they don't even attempt to and lampshade everything). I'm super curious about the audience reaction cause I think it really could just annoy everyone.

[Chaser]

7 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

Wild Dog - Do you think they always intended on giving him a flashback episode? I was wondering if it was a decision to try and make him more sympathetic since his reception seems lukewarm.  IIRC, promo or narrative wise they weren't selling him as being like S1 Oliver until the crossover.

I want to say yes. 5x13 is still pretty early in the back half.

[Angel12d]

I feel like most of the general audience will be fine with a new BC tbh. Online fandom is a different story. 

As for Felicity, I know there's spec about a dark BoP kind of thing with Cupid and China White and all that but how does that work exactly? I assumed Felicity would be using her hacking skills, obviously, considering she's not a fighter. So I'm not sure how she'd end up working with those people. Unless she hacks and bribes them to help her but huh? I'm not sure I'm following the potential tbh. Thoughts?

Edited January 11, 2017 by Angel12d

[Ophanim]

I want to see more hacking by Felicity, and by that I don't mean just typing, but also some smart moves to come to certain information, like social hacking.

Also bring back Bitch with WIFI !

[Chaser]

19 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

I feel like most of the general audience will be fine with a new BC tbh. Online fandom is a different story. 

As for Felicity, I know there's spec about a dark BoP kind of thing with Cupid and China White and all that but how does that work exactly? I assumed Felicity would be using her hacking skills, obviously, considering she's not a fighter. So I'm not sure how she'd end up working with those people. Unless she hacks and bribes them to help her but huh? I'm not sure I'm following the potential tbh. Thoughts?

I think the general audience will be apathetic about who has the name, but annoyed they are doing another BC story. 3.5 (.5 is Baby Canary) in five seasons is excessive. Plus, it undermines a lot of what they did last season and about 90% of what they are doing this season. General audience may not look as in depth as the online fandom does, but they aren't stupid either.

As for Dark BOP, I'm hoping she picks these woman for very specific reasons. Ideally, I would love love love if they do some leverage type mission. I image she is going to be blackmailing. Tho I do kind of think Cupid is going to be in love with her. I would kind of like that actually. Cupid makes casual comments about offing the Reporter and or Oliver for Felicity. lol

Edited January 11, 2017 by Chaser

[Angel12d]

10 minutes ago, Chaser said:

I think the general audience will be apathetic about who has the name, but annoyed they are doing another BC story. 3.5 (.5 is Baby Canary) in five seasons is excessive. Plus, it undermines a lot of what they did last season and about 90% of what they are doing this season. General audience may not look as in depth as the online fandom does, but they aren't stupid either.

As for Dark BOP, I'm hoping she picks these woman for very specific reasons. Ideally, I would love love love if they do some leverage type mission. I image she is going to be blackmailing. Tho I do kind of think Cupid is going to be in love with her. I would kind of like that actually. Cupid makes casual comments about offing the Reporter and or Oliver for Felicity. lol

Good point. I see some being annoyed and/or apathetic but generally I can't see it being a big deal. I think it depends on how she's introduced and just how quickly she suits up. I don't think anyone wants to sit through yet another drawn out BC origin story though. Please no. 

Leverage type missions sound fun! I'm reluctant to get my hopes up though, even though they kind of are already. Haha.

Edited January 11, 2017 by Angel12d

[insomniadreams88]

Bringing these over from the Heartaches and 509 threads in case it gets (too) spoiler-y:

13 minutes ago, Carrie Ann said:

At any rate, I believe that in general terms, Felicity is feeling more trauma than Oliver is right now (even though I think his specific trauma w/r/t killing Billy is about even with her grief re: losing her non-boyfriend), which makes him look extra selfish when he receives comfort after killing her non-boyfriend. But I guess my small hope for 5B is that we see that Oliver (and everyone else?) is intentionally being written as unaware of the depth of her trauma right now (even if we believe he/they should have picked up on it), and that once they realize it, they do something about it. Maybe? Please?

The thing is, that spoiler from SA says that Felicity's secret comes out in 515, and assuming that it's what happens in 510-512 that puts her on her "darker" path, that's still another handful of episodes before Oliver presumably notices that something's up with her. (And I'm not surprised, considering we have BS, recruiting Tina, Bratva, Susan, forming a connection with Tina, mayor stuff, etc. coming up for Oliver.) 

There's being "unaware of the depth of her trauma right now" and then there's what we're seeing on screen, which is that they're intentionally writing Felicity as being so okay to the point that she didn't react to her friends being kidnapped by aliens and the majority of Havenrock in the earlier episodes was about Rory and getting him back on the team. 

11 hours ago, statsgirl said:

But I wonder if in terms of the rest of the season, it was necessary for her not to blame Oliver.  I hope that wherever the show goes, it's important not to have Felicity have any feelings of anger or resentment towards Oliver.  His guilt should be enough to keep them apart for however long the show plans to.

My fear is that they're going to turn this into another way to stall a reunion by having Oliver think that Felicity won't want to get back together at all ever because he killed her BF, while Felicity doesn't blame him and instead just sees him with Susan (especially if she's around until 515) and thinks he has really moved on while she realizes that she didn't and couldn't. I don't want this to happen, but my faith in the writers is slim to none right now. 

14 minutes ago, Chaser said:

I think the general audience will be apathetic about who has the name, but annoyed they are doing another BC story. 3.5 (.5 is Baby Canary) in five seasons is excessive. Plus, it undermines a lot of what they did last season and about 90% of what they are doing this season. General audience may not look as in depth as the online fandom does, but they aren't stupid either.

As for Dark BOP, I'm hoping she picks these woman for very specific reasons. Ideally, I would love love love if they do some leverage type mission. I image she is going to be blackmailing. Tho I do kind of think Cupid is going to be in love with her. I would kind of like that actually. Cupid makes casual comments about offing the Reporter and or Oliver for Felicity. lol

At this point, I just hope that if the next BC fails, they decide that since the third time isn't the charm (let's not count Evelyn), that's a sign that they should just give up. (If only Tina could succeed as a detective but fail as BC, but I doubt we'll see enough of her as a detective for that to be possible.) 

Whatever reason Cupid is back, I want to see her interact with Felicity. 

Edited January 11, 2017 by insomniadreams88

[Carrie Ann]

6 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

The thing is, that spoiler from SA says that Felicity's secret comes out in 515, and assuming that it's what happens in 510-512 that puts her on her "darker" path, that's still another handful of episodes before Oliver presumably notices that something's up with her. (And I'm not surprised, considering we have BS, recruiting Tina, Bratva, Susan, forming a connection with Tina, mayor stuff, etc. coming up for Oliver.) 

There's being "unaware of the depth of her trauma right now" and then there's what we're seeing on screen, which is that they're intentionally writing Felicity as being so okay to the point that she didn't react to her friends being kidnapped by aliens and the majority of Havenrock in the earlier episodes was about Rory and getting him back on the team. 

Right, well I think that ties into my hope that they are intentionally writing Felicity as covering so hard for the depth of her trauma that no one knows she's feeling it (maybe not even her, as she has historically been shown to shove down and deny her own feelings pretty consistently). If they knew earlier on, I don't think she could get away with...whatever "dark" things she's going to do, because they might be monitoring her a little more closely. Instead, I think they just assume she's the rock she always presents to them. So my hope is that she does these things without the team's knowledge between 510 and 515, they find out in 515, and in the resulting conversations, they come to realize that she's pretty fucked up and has been for a long time.

[Chaser]

I thought she would be keeping a secret around 5x15 but is it that the secret comes out around 5x15?

I also want to now who are the others who know.

[Carrie Ann]

4 minutes ago, Chaser said:

I thought she would be keeping a secret around 5x15 but is it that the secret comes out around 5x15?

You could be right about the timing--I have trouble keeping track of those things! Regardless of when the dark things happen or when they are revealed, I hope that this is the point of it. To show her trauma and have her loved ones help her out of it.

[statsgirl]

12 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

I was thinking that the reason they had the alternative line about another Canary was if the show had a positive response to Evelyn.  To fulfill Laurel's last words, they wouldn't have had to actually call her Black Canary, just some kind of Canary.  But Evelyn was pretty much universally rejected and it seemed that the notion of another Canary was also put away only for it to arise again over the summer.  Or at least that's one possible option. 

I like that idea, and it would have fit will with Evelyn stealing Laurel's things from the hospital and it makes more sense than this completely unknown character coming on.  But they so underwrote Evelyn in s5 compared to Wild Dong, Curtis and even Rory, that there was practically no way the audience wouldn't have rejected her.   They would have been shooting 506 by the time 502 aired and she was revealed as evil in 507.  there simply wasn't time to get an audience reaction to her before she was gone.

11 hours ago, thegirlsleuth said:

I have wondered whether they might do a last minute reveal and say that this new character's real name is Dinah Drake, and they were just using Tina Boland as a foiler name.

It's possible (I hope not because ugh the dudbro reaction) but then it would be their last shot at having a new Black Canary.  If she failed, they would be out of names.

4 hours ago, Lidach said:

Catching up spoilers spec: "... around episode 15 or so ... Felicity’s character was going to parallel Oliver's in that she will have a secret that she will be keeping and other people will know about it. Oliver will be kept out of the loop… "

Throw in this more tidbits: it's HER legacy, something NOT relate to Oliver and her parents, and something very "unique" to her. What could possible be THAT secret?? Any ideas? Beside DarkBOP

Her only interesting legacy that we know of is hacking and the sketchy father.  She's also got Las Vegas but I don't think of that as interesting enough for this show and they don't seem to want to do anything with PT any more.

[Lily-n11]

39 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

Whatever reason Cupid is back, I want to see her interact with Felicity. 

Me too.

I was wondering: Does Cupid know Felicity is member of Team Arrow / Overwatch? I think to her she is one half of Olicity. I can't remember if Cupid knows that GA works with a team. And if the show really goes for a DarkBOP will Felicity's secret identity be revealed to them. Or is she just going to go about it the same way her father did with Roy in 412?

And while taking about Roy. Colton said on twitter he will be back on Arrow. But he gave no details and I don't remember seing any talk about this... yet. Maybe something for season 6?

[Ophanim]

Yeah, that Felicity's "secret" is bugging me. I have one idea, but I do not wanna go there, even here by writing it, because is sound silly, but enough silly for EPs to go there. I will keep it for myself until I get more "proof".

I would love for Roy to come back, maybe for some Thea storyline.

[CooperTV]

21 minutes ago, Lidach said:

Yeah, that Felicity's "secret" is bugging me. I have one idea, but I do not wanna go there, even here by writing it, because is sound silly, but enough silly for EPs to go there. I will keep it for myself until I get more "proof".

If you want to say that Felicity's "secret" that's similar and parallels Oliver's secret from s4 is her having a baby from Billy, it will kill Olicity for good.

[apinknightmare]

I thought that said secret was going to be whatever alliance it is that Felicity builds with whoever she winds up building it with (and the things that she does with regards to that), and that Oliver's going to be let in on said alliance in 15.

I'm not sure how much SA knows about what WM has already said about this storyline, but we know she's going to be turning to people who aren't the team and going into her "darkness," so it seems like maybe he was talking about that coming out? 

I can't imagine that they'd give her that AND some other dark secret, but who knows!

[thegirlsleuth]

2 minutes ago, CooperTV said:

If you want to say that Felicity's "secret" that's similar and parallels Oliver's secret from s4 is her having a baby from Billy, it will kill Olicity for good.

Oh my god.  Kill it with fire.

That said, I can completely see the writers thinking its brilliant.

[Ophanim]

2 minutes ago, CooperTV said:

If you want to say that Felicity's "secret" that's similar and parallels Oliver's secret from s4 is her having a baby from Billy, it will kill Olicity for good.

Well, it sound silly and mega stupid, so I am afraid with reason, because IT IS ARROW WRITERS (I am legitimately traumatized).

But IT IS stupid, and they wouldn't go there, right, RIGHT?  

[insomniadreams88]

5 minutes ago, CooperTV said:

If you want to say that Felicity's "secret" that's similar and parallels Oliver's secret from s4 is her having a baby from Billy, it will kill Olicity for good.

I really doubt they'd do that. Also, I don't see how that would matter? If she's pregnant and it's not Oliver's, why should she have to tell him? Unless they're back together, which I don't see happening by that point, considering everything else going on and how much they're dragging out the reporter. Plus, she'd probably have to start showing by that point, right? Depending on when 15 (or whatever episode it's in) airs. 

1 minute ago, apinknightmare said:

I thought that said secret was going to be whatever alliance it is that Felicity builds with whoever she winds up building it with (and the things that she does with regards to that), and that Oliver's going to be let in on said alliance in 15.

I'm not sure how much SA knows about what WM has already said about this storyline, but we know she's going to be turning to people who aren't the team and going into her "darkness," so it seems like maybe he was talking about that coming out? 

I can't imagine that they'd give her that AND some other dark secret, but who knows!

That's what I thought too. I don't think there's time for Felicity to have two secrets in the next handful of episodes. 

[AyChihuahua]

9 minutes ago, CooperTV said:

If you want to say that Felicity's "secret" that's similar and parallels Oliver's secret from s4 is her having a baby from Billy, it will kill Olicity for good.

On the other hand it would cause me to laugh almost as uproariously as #PEEOTUS has. Even better if Billy really is futureWilliam and her baby is Oliver's grandchild. OMG the LOLs.

I AM SURE THAT IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN DON'T @ ME (but holy crap it'd be funny).

[CooperTV]

1 minute ago, Lidach said:

Well, it sound silly and mega stupid, so I am afraid with reason, because IT IS ARROW WRITERS (I am legitimately traumatized).

I was horrified at my own thought as well! Sorry!

2 minutes ago, AyChihuahua said:

On the other hand it would cause me to laugh almost as uproariously as #PEEOTUS has. Even better if Billy really is futureWilliam and her baby is Oliver's grandchild. OMG the LOLs.

[insomniadreams88]

5 minutes ago, AyChihuahua said:

Even better if Billy really is futureWilliam

Imagine if Billy is/was future William, heard about what his father did to Felicity and decided to travel back in time to try to be the BF he felt she deserved. He could even then be Prometheus too. (I don't think this will happen at all.)

Edited January 11, 2017 by insomniadreams88