The Bastard Executioner - General Discussion

[solea]

and the guy getting his hand chopped off particularly looked cornball as hell

 

I shouted at the screen, "It's only a flesh wound!".

[phane00]

As a fan of period action shows, like Spartacus, Deadwood, and Rome, I have long since learned that the pilots for such shows typically blow sheep. Spartacus took 4 episodes to really take off. Deadwood had to burn through half the first season before Al got the proper amount of screentime to make it awesome. Patience is required for shows like this to settle properly.

I will hang around, mainly to make certain I have the characters' names correct before the good stuff truly starts. 3-4 eps should do it.

[Sandman87]

Another thouoght, now that I've had a few hours to think things over: Why do the soldiers on this show bother wearing mail armor? It clearly offers roughly the same level of protection as wet toilet tissue.

 

 

ETA after reading posts I skipped this morning:

 

I kept wondering about the electric guitars I heard during the show. Where did one plug them in back in the 1300's? 

 

 

A battery made of sheep dung?  Maybe?

 

Brilliant! Obviously Mr. Dances With Sheep would be the one making the batteries. Doesn't he look like he could be the roadie of a punk-metal band named SHŸTË?

Edited September 18, 2015 by Sandman87

[candall]

Oh, gosh, I'd really been looking forward to this--the title alone is so intriguing and seductive.

 

Didn't make it through the first hour.

 

 

 

P.S> I thought a cable-lite Game of Thrones would be okay; I miss that show.  But dream Daenarys and a dream dragon before the five minute mark is just rude.

 

.

 

 

 

 

[Febgirl]

Sutter, Sagal, AND Sagal's daughter all in this.  This show is so unintentionally funny. 

[BusyOctober]

I love (most) period pieces.  I am a history nut, specifically anything to do with the Kings of England.  I am not so entrenched in real facts that I can't let some stuff go for the sake of a TV show.  Never watched SOA.  Have always hated Katey Sagal in anything.  So, I went into this with very little expectations and I'm glad my entertainment bar was set low...like, in the basement low.

 

Most of you already pinged the Dra-cluelessness of Katey's performance in this, so no need to go there. I like some of the characters and I'm interested enough to watch next week, but I don't know if I have the stamina to tolerate the egomaniac power couple show runners.

 

And as for the comparisons to (or Sutter's desire to be compared to) GoT...I've read GoT.  I've watched GoT. This, Sir, is no GoT.  Do not blaspheme aagain and take you sad-ass CGI "dragon" with you. Spend the special effects budget on writers and historical advisors instead.

[peacefrog]

I really wanted to like this. I had several issues with it, the biggest one is that I could barely understand what they were saying. Everyone was mumbling. I could not figure out anyone's name until I came here!

I love shows that have great world building, The Walking Dead, GoT, Outlander, Black Sails and Vikings. I just did not get that here. These shows also feel like I am watching a movie, they are cinematic,where as TBE felt like a tv show. The sets/locations looked off and the costumes could have been borrowed from a renaissance festival. Production quality just didn't measure up to a lot of other shows out there.

It was over the top gory and violent and I watch some bloody stuff. This was distracting yet at the same time everyone looked far to clean after bloody battles.

I'm still going to continue to watch because hopefully it will find its footing. I can overlook the above if the acting and writing make up for it. I did not watch SOA so I'm not familiar with the showrunner and this is just to be expected. I'm rooting for it because I love historical fiction with fantasy thrown in.

[MrsRafaelBarba]

What a hot mess, simply awful.

[chloerose2]

Can anyone PLEASE tell me what Katey and Kurt said right at the end.   I barely understand anyone but those last two sentences were totally blank....The captioning that they were using to tell us where they were was to small.  Very frustrating. 

 

Who wants to take one for the team and tell Kurt on Twitter?

 

[walnutqueen]

I loved SOA.  And yet when I read WalnutQueen's post, my response?  Awwwww.  (laughs really loud) WQ, why you gotta say such things. (continues to laugh).

 

To make you laugh, CuriousParker.  I live to serve.   :-)

[SmithW6079]

I did notice that this is the second Sutter series where ethnic minorities get token appearances, not even substantial supporting roles.

As this is set in 14th-century Wales, there are probably not a lot of "ethnic" minorities roaming around.

[Ohwell]

As this is set in 14th-century Wales, there are probably not a lot of "ethnic" minorities roaming around.

Yes, actually given the time frame and location, I was surprised to see the black man and woman.  I guess they were African transplants?

[LakeLover]

Just watched this and we, too, flipped on the closed captioning, which we NEVER have to do. I'll echo the thoughts of others - we really had trouble understanding what the hell was going on, most characters were hard to tell apart, and the violence turned me off, probably for good.

[Sam215]

I am going to buck the trend and say I honestly didn't think it was that bad. It could be because I read the comments from earlier so I knew I had to pay attention- no computer work- read the captioning for locations and muddle through the accents. I was prepared in advance. Thank you all for that.

While it was a slow first hour and painfully obvious who would die and when and even by whom, the second hour was interesting and the deviousness of the chamberlain was interesting to watch play out.

I didn't care for the final scene and have idea quite what was said but I left it on the TiVo season pass. Not much else is on and reruns of Seinfeld and the office are getting tedious.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Should You Hang With The Bastard Executioner? / A new hero from the creator of Sons Of Anarchy Wales on his enemies.

[dr pepper]

Yes, actually given the time frame and location, I was surprised to see the black man and woman.  I guess they were African transplants?

 

Simple-- actors are not limited to playing characters of their own ethnicity. Else where would we get ancient egyptians, neanderthals, elves, or klingons?

[eurekagirl mOo]

I loved SOA so I was really looking forward to this show. Loved Katey as Gemma. What a disappointment! Bloody I didn't like but could handle BUT I could not understand one dam thing anyone was saying!!! Quit after 1/2 hour. Not worth it.

[dr pepper]

Ok, my take on this.

 

First, they need to resolve the supernatural aspect. Was our hero really stabbed through the chest in a way that would seem totally fatal, then healed by an angel? Or was it more of a sideways cut that didn't go as deep as it looked, and he hallucinated during the long and feverish recovery? And is Segal's character a real witch or just a herbalist?

 

Second, anyone who commits to watching for the long hall needs to be prepared for no happy endings. The very best that we can hope for is the appointment of a only slightly brutal baron. A nice one won't do, the other barons would take it for weakness and attack. We know there will be no successful revolt in Wales. We won't even get a firm hand from the top because we know how Edward II's reign went.

 

Third, i expect i'll end up rooting for the chamberlain because he at least has a realistic goal and some ability to plan. He might even be the best candidate for slightly brutal baron.

 

Fourth, i did like the moral dilemma at the end, Kill a man for his own convenience? Follwoed by the reminder that his wife's killers are all here and this is the best opportunity to stay close to them. Besides, the man in question surely deserves death for other things he's done. Plus, the angel seems to think that becoming an executioner is the proper punishment for his taking up the blade again. Result: 10 out of 10 and the adulation of the audience. They can't wait to see him do it again!

 

I also liked the chamberlain's attitude. You're a fake, but it suits me to believe you as long as you can be useful to me.

 

So i'll give it a try. I only ask one thing. Don't have the baroness throw herself on him, in a desperate hope of finally achieving pregnancy and quickly enough to pass it off as her husband's.

[ljp]

I tried. I like historical (Rome, Vikings etc), I like fantasy (game of thrones), watch violence, gore and sex no problem. I even like A Knights Tale, campy pseudo history. I could not bring myself to get past the first half an hour. I almost always watch with captioning due to shitty sound on my tv, so it's not even the accents. Although the captioning was bad too, I swear it skipped whole bits of dialogue. This was a hot mess. A boring hot mess. And I like extended world building stuff, so it wasn't that there wasn't enough plot. It was just dumb half the time. The sheepfucker joke went on wayyyy to long, I got it the first time and didn't needed it repeated 6 different ways. I'm not sure why I'm supposed to care if the baron is constipated, unless that's why he's such a lousy lay? I had high hopes for this show too.

I watched more as it felt unfair to only give it 30 minutes. More sheepfucker jokes. And bad acting, particularly the rebels and the sheep lover. Although the guy trying to get main character to meet with other rebels isn't bad (and looks familiar). And how did the messenger get back to the baron, and the baron and entourage ride out and beat the rebels to the village? That makes no sense. The soundtrack is too loud. It's intrusive. This is excruciatingly awful. I give up at 1 hour and 6 minutes

Edited September 21, 2015 by ljp

[ShortyMac]

I almost always watch with captioning due to shitty sound on my tv, so it's not even the accents. Although the captioning was bad too, I swear it skipped whole bits of dialogue.

 

My captioning did the same thing, it wasn't just yours. It was really annoying.

[Sandman87]

Yes, actually given the time frame and location, I was surprised to see the black man and woman.  I guess they were African transplants?

Simple-- actors are not limited to playing characters of their own ethnicity. Else where would we get ancient egyptians, neanderthals, elves, or klingons?

 

Since the woman (I didn't catch her name) was praying in a foreign language when she got killed, I suspect the official explanation would have more to do with being descended from prisoners taken during various Crusades. Unless she was praying in Klingon. :)

[sugarbaker design]

The black man was described as a Moor by one of his colleagues.

[karasmom]

Well, I can see I am in the minority here -- at least in this forum - but I loved it!  I reminded me of Vikings, one of my favorite shows.  I don't expect perfection from my tv shows so maybe I am a little more tolerant of the errors, but I thought the show was fast paced, the plot was interesting and the acting passable.  It probably helps that blood and gore doesn't bother me.  And I've loved all of Kurt Sutter's shows (well, Shield and SoA -- are there more?)  I'm in for the long haul!   

[Ohwell]

The black man was described as a Moor by one of his colleagues.

Ah, ok thanks for that explanation.

[SimoneS]

The acting continues to be embarrassingly bad and the plot is nonsensical and meanders, but this episode was slightly better than last week which isn't saying much since it could only go up.

[Primetimer]

An enduring TV star deserves better material than an overdone witch-doctor with a Dracula accent. Blah!

Read the story

[Broderbits]

I will continue to monitor this forum just in case the show improves, but I was done 10 minutes into this episode. Between not being able to understand what people are saying and the lack of any charisma in the leading man, why bother.

[ShortyMac]

I liked this episode a lot more than the two pilot episodes. But, I still found my mind wandering during the show. I think I just have to adjust to the setting and all of the characters. 

 

I like Lady Love's and Isabel's relationship. I also like Annora. Wilkin is okay.

 

I'll keep watching for now.

[Straycat80]

This episode was a little better, not so rushed. I still don't know everyone's name yet.

Every time Katey Sagal speaks, I cringe, that accents kills me.

I'm confused who the rebels and the Wolf are. That scene of the slaughtered animals and dismembered guy was crazy. And what was Anorra doing to the body and the snakes thing must mean something , but I don't understand yet.

I'll keep watching since so far nothing else is on Tuesday nights that I care to watch.

[thuganomics85]

I'm starting to wonder now if Kathy Sagel's horrid accent might end up being my favorite thing.  I mean, it's truly bad, but it is at least making me laugh.

 

I had read a review that claimed something horrifying was going to happen, and if they were referring to the girl getting her nose sliced of, well... it was bad, but I've sadly seen much, much worse on TV.

 

Great, not only is the lead seeing visions of his dead wife, the dead wife is already trying to set him up with The Baroness.  She's one hell of a wingwoman: speaking to him from the dead just to make sure her widower can get some!

 

Milus having sex with those twins at the end, only made me think that it probably isn't even in the top ten of craziest sex scenes Stephen Moyer was apart of it.  This was probably nothing for him.  Probably just like "Twins?  Please... I've done in covered in blood!  And with my actual wife in front of the camera!  Bring it!"

[Sandman87]

Most memorable line (not necessarily the best line): "I'd lose me baubles if they weren't attached to me dingle!"

Something is very wrong when they show me a scene that's supposed to be horrible and it makes me laugh. Yes, I mean the arm-leg guy.

That is one badass priest. I'm gonna start calling him Father Breve, because of the scar over his eye.

Moderately clever, using snakes to represent Evil. The whole Garden of Eden thing and all.

[dr pepper]

Episode 3 featured not one, but two, cut and even bound books. Those would have been super expensive at that time. This was long before Gutenberg, so any printing would have been from individual wooden blocks. More likely they would have been hand written. And the medium was parchment, not paper. Cutting every page squarely was a very delicate undertaking. Nonetheless the baroness has one, that she was using as a nose press. And one of the revenge gang has one, a koran, that looks crisp and bright despite his apparent opening it for regular devotionals out in the woods.

[dr pepper]

Oh, and speaking of our token moslem, i'm guessing he is supposed to be a spanish moor.After all, the Reconquista has another 200 years to go. Was he someone important? Is that why he has a koran that looks as if it came from a modern bookstore? No backstory, of course.

[dr pepper]

Also i see that the priest is using one of those hit location tables that doesn't take weapon type into account.

"I got a crit!"

"Ok, now roll percentile."

"99!"

"The table says clean decapitation."

"But i'm using a mace."

"So? The table says clean decapitation."

"Isn't that kind of sidestepping the weapons rules for clerics?"

"You can do penance later if you want."

[The Real Chon]

Perhaps Sutter is striking for empathy between the audience and some of the victims; I'm not sure what we did, though, to be sentenced to the ministrations of a punisher.
In the words of my ancestors, "Nem jo."

Edited September 23, 2015 by The Real Chon

[stanleyk]

Well, your all's commentary tears it for me. I have the pilot and second episode sitting on my DVR, and as entertaining as it is to read the forum for this show, I cannot allot any of my limited tv-watching hours to this dreck. More power to those who vow to see this thing to the bitter, likely quick end, however!

[Ohwell]

Well, I tried but I'm out.  The lead guy is boring and I can't stomach medieval Gemma.  I'll just read the forum posts from now on.

[ganesh]

I didn't this was nearly as bad as depicted here. I barely read more than one sentence about a new show. I think I saw 10 seconds of the tail end of a commercial for this. I stay as unspoiled as possible for a show, and I'm convinced that it results in a completely different viewing experience.

I also haven't watched SOA so I don't know if that colors my response. After the opening scene I figured it was going to be a b movie Braveheart type show. It kind of is. There's nothing wrong with that. It's amusing for me to see Bill from True Blood playing a scheming noble. I think this an example that B-/B shows get way more heaped on them because we generally expect every single tv show has to be A+ or it sucks. 

 

The first part dragged because it's a pilot. The second part picked up nicely. After the baron died, I didn't expect them to pull the classic switcheroo with the executioner. 

 

So, there's going to be some court intrigue and double dealing? That sounds like it could be fun. From what it looked like to me, yeah, the baron's widow doesn't hold any claim, but Bill from True Blood (I don't know his name yet) seems to be angling to marry her and be baron himself? I don't know how that would work since the baron's next male kin would have the strongest claim. 

 

I admit that the witch's accent was weird. But whatever. 

[magdalene]

I just can't get into this.  I thought Sutter's previous shows were flawed but interesting and involving and I watched both of them to the end even though I grumbled quite a bit about the later seasons of SOA.  But between the bad acting and the odd tone that strikes me as very wrong for a historical drama I could barely get through the pilot and I couldn't get through last nights episode. I am bored and maybe Sutter's voice is just too contemporary to be believable on a historical drama?

[Bizabra]

I am distracted terribly by that long hair every time the witch is on-screen, but this episode when they were dismembering animals, etc. I was horrified that she would have it swinging all around with all that blood and stuff!  I don't know how you would manage to keep that hair from dragging around in the blood!  It was gross! Realistically, a woman with hair that long would pull it back into a bun or braids or SOMETHING when doing goopy work like butchering animals, or doing the washing up, or arranging dead body parts! Gross!

[DrLar]

And it would be a marriage of pure convenience and he likes men, I wonder about the sleeping arrangements..

[Captanne]

Ganesh, I "liked" your review mainly because of how fair you are.  I am 50% Welsh (just ask 23andMe.com) -- by blood and family -- also I loved Sons of Anarchy.  Soon, I will have time to watch this show.  Perhaps tonight!  But, I am holding out hopes that it isn't as terrible as PTV is making it out to be.  I am withholding judgement.  

 

Fingers crossed.  Wish me luck.  

 

I'm going in.....

 

ETA:  Oh, you guys.  You won't believe this.

 

I didn't hate it.

 

I kind of liked it.

 

Sorry.

 

OOPS:  Wait -- I'm only half way through it.  I thought it ended at an hour.  Silly me.  It could still go south.

 

Nope, it didn't.

 

I liked it.

 

The Welsh accents were a little watery and I could have lived without Old Lady Butt, but otherwise.  Yeah,  I liked it.

 

I'll continue to read here but I won't try to defend it.

Edited September 25, 2015 by Captanne

[mustbekarma]

Well, I decided to wait a few days before I posted my response to the pilot because I wanted time to ruminate over what I'd say. It was also time to let some of my hatred and vitriol die down.

 

My biggest problem with the episode was the dialogue. E-N-U-N-C-I-A-T-E!  I swear to Grilled Cheesus, I couldn't understand half of what was said. I'm not new to accents, I love watching British dramas and mysteries on Netflix and watch BBC America regularly. Take some elocution lessons, people.

 

My second biggest problem was the predictability of the story. When Chekhov's Smoking Man trudged behind the Weirdly Accented Witch, I knew he was introduced for a reason. When the Bastard Executioner's wife showed she trusted the person, I knew it had to be him wielding the knife. The knife reveal at the end of the pilot didn't surprise me at all. Of course he did at at the Witch's bidding. She needed the wife to be dead so she could set the Anti-Hero on his Executioner's Journey.

 

So I want the Weirdly Accented Witch and Chekhov's Smoking Man to die in agony, preferably burned alive. I think the angry townspeople that originally burned the Smoking Man missed a few spots.

 

My third problem is with the premise of this story. I just cannot believe that the Bastard Executioner will possibly remain a sympathetic character. Sure, REVENGE! Homer Simpson is great if you're only going after the guilty parties. Technically, the Weak Little Brother was innocent, but he didn't really do anything to stop his brother's brutality, so I didn't feel that badly for him. He did get a quick death. However, the Bastard Executioner isn't going to be so lucky that he won't have to kill innocent people. He won't be so lucky that everyone will get a quick death. He'll end up having to torture, maim, and execute innocent people. Hell, in that day and age, he could end up having to torture and execute children. I really don't want to watch someone tortured every week, and watch the so-called protagonist get darker and darker.

 

My fourth problem with this show is that the show was so actually dark I had a hard time telling the four dark haired males apart. I get why the Bastard Execution had to look like the Real Executioner for the whole bait and switch plot, but I sometimes not tell who was who.

 

My fifth problem with this show is that they killed most of the sympathetic characters, There are just too many characters I just want to see dead. Watching episode after episode of nasty people who need to die but don't would sorely test my patience. Not enough of them died in this episode.

 

However, there were two things I liked about this episode. The Real Executioner's wife only needed a few seconds of observing the Bastard Executioner to know she had gotten a deal. I would have made the same choice. The Baron dying in the pilot made me decide I could possibly watch another episode.

 

As long as I get to taunt it cruelly.

Edited September 25, 2015 by mustbekarma

[WordsWordsWords]

I've tried with this series. I'll give it one more episode because this is my favourite time period -- give or take a couple hundred years -- and I do like Stephen Moyer. The actor who plays the Baroness (I don't like the term actress and don't use it) has a marvelous medieval look, though, despite her costuming being incorrect. I might watch with the sound off.

[lucindabelle]

I knew the healer would be bad every ince the mean healer on GoT.

Sigh.

I found this confusing but I'll keep watching. Sadly the Welsh accent and my ears don't like one another but now that we're in the castle I guess we'll hit that less hard.

Why did angel child take new wife away or was that just a vision?

That was an excellent execution. If he can take off a head that cleanly in one swipe Kings will be recruiting him soon.

Tara, lovely seay but this is one time I need a point for point recap! Cuz I'm a little lost....

[Sandman87]

Also i see that the priest is using one of those hit location tables that doesn't take weapon type into account.

I'd be amused if he were also using fumble tables:

 

"Have at you!"

(Fumbles)

"Oops! Sorry your Ladyship. I'll try again...Take this!"

(Fumbles)

"Oww! My spleen!"

[placate]

This is so freaking bad:

All adults acting like teenagers

"bastard executioner" gets a new family because they like him better,

problems with removing a teenagers nose who is a known rebel,

that chancelor was screwing a dude last episode but now it's twins,

Katey Segal can't accent,

Token is now a muslim and a twofer Token,

Katey can make statements on the Quran because Slav,

I'm just watching this crap because Chopped needs a counter or something.

[Captanne]

Having grown up around Welsh accents (admittedly in the 20th and 21st Centuries), these are just watery.  Not very thick, is what I'm saying.

 

Maybe Witchy-Poo and her partner are from eastern Europe to make them exotic but I think a better bet is that Katey Segal can't do a Welsh accent.  

[shockermolar]

I'm also in the minority that didn't peg it as horrible. A couple of things that have been mentioned here...

I must have missed where Annorra was said to be Slavic. I assumed that given this is Wales that this was an attempt at a Welsh accent, which would explain the tapped pr rolling sounds on her hard consonants like "r" and "d". I didn't think it was a particularly GOOD attempt, and given that literally no other actor is making a similar attempt I'm not sure I understand the point, but I never thought it was supposed to be something other than Welsh.

It's true that the Baroness would most likely be remarried quickly to a crony of the king (or more likely to whomever her husband liege lord was), the reason she remained there is because it was her inheritance. I don't think it belonged to her husband. She's meant to be Welsh herself (the 2nd episode is specific about that) and there are hints here and there, primarily through the exchanges with her maid. But also because it wasn't uncommon for a landless lord to be given a wife with property as a prize for service.

In any case, it's not great, but it's not horrible. I could do without the magical realism though.

[ganesh]

I thought the angel girl took the wife away to show that she's truly gone and he needs to get on with his life, which she warned him about in the opening battle scene. Rather than just being mopey and pining for her.