S01.E05: Flight Of The Living Dead

[EyewatchTV211]

I loved Lowell as well, and it is nice to have Bradley James back on screen. I hope he is in more episodes -

IMDB only showed one.

 

 

I think I will give RT a chance to develop Major. I feel bad for the dude, but unfortunately I blame Teddy Dunn for many of the issues with Duncan. I read a pretty recent interview with him about his time on the show and choices. Just in case anyone has not watched VM and might decide to, I will put this part in spoiler tags:

Apparently he knew that Duncan had psychological issues and was medicated. So he chose to play the role of a guy whose medication making him kind of apathetic and unemotional. I forget what exact words he used to describe his personality choices for Duncan. And he saw that those choices did not seem to translate well to the fans.The interview was with TV guide if anyone wants to find it.

I guess you could blame RT for not over-ruling his choices, though.

[FurryFury]

I blame RT for the issues with Duncan because Duncan never really had a POV, which is essential to creating a well-rounded character. Plus, he was supposed to be a viable suspect for most of s1 which really harmed him as a character. TD really sucked, too, but it was a complex issue, not just the actor's fault.

 

As for IMDB, it's not always an indicator, the narrative makes it clear that 

Lowell's supposed to be there, I'll be pissed off if he suddenly disappears after this ep.

Edited April 15, 2015 by FurryFury

[Primetimer]

Has Liv found a man whose heart beats in time with hers?

Read the story

[Minneapple]

Who goes into a shady part of town and picks a fight with a clearly stronger guy just after emphatically being told not to do it?

I'm guessing someone who is upset, worried, frustrated and tired of fighting with authorities about the situation.

[dcalley]

I thought he was turning the runaways into tasty entrees, not minions.

Filet minion?

[ElectricBoogaloo]

This show is like Forever, where I enjoy the character interactions and don't care about the case of the week. The CotW is there to give us the character interactions.

Same here. If the COTW turns out to be super interesting then I am not going to complain but the procedural aspects of both shows are the least interesting part to me. I am here for the characters because I like them and find them far more interesting than how/why the victims died.

[ParadoxLost]

Well this episode did something that the Walking Dead has not yet.  It made me react from the POV of food.

 

About the time they revealed that Lowell could use dye and makeup to disguise his zombiness, I decided that it would be best if Liv told the government everything immediately.  The zombies remain intelligent.  The zombies are making other zombies.  The zombies are setting up criminal enterprises and conspiracies.  The zombies can hide in plain site.

 

Someday they'll make this an allegory of this show for racial profiling or something and I'll need to hang my head in shame.  But although Liv hasn't killed or harmed anyone, she also doesn't care how other zombies get food.  We don't know the long term effects of zombiehood, she could go full on zombie mode full time at any time.  She needs to turn herself in and get locked up and monitored. 

[Julia]

Except there are already people in the government setting up criminal enterprises and conspiracies, at the very least protecting the people who are making other zombies, and hiding in plain sight. It seems very unlikely that if she turned herself in she would be fed before her humanity and her intelligence were gone, if they let her live at all. They still haven't explained how her ethical doctor friend ended up starving in that hole.

Edited April 15, 2015 by Julia

[FurryFury]

She would be wise to assume that the government wouldn't be very kind to her were she to turn herself in. Probably experiments and isolation from other people. I wouldn't want that for myself, at least. Not to mention they could just want to profit from her disease.

Edited April 15, 2015 by FurryFury

[OrientalAmish]

Ryan Hansen was the best thing in this episode!

Blaine, come back, I miss you!

[justcris]

Agreed, a little Ryan Hansen always brightens my day, but I need some David Anders in my life too.

I thought the episode ended a bit out of nowhere, but it was a good one.

I laughed like a crazy person at the line "And I thought the insides of my thighs were pale!" haha!

All in all, I didn't looove the new guy, but I'll give him a chance to win me over.

[SanLynn]

I was surprised by the ending because it wasn't as wrapped up in a bow as it usually is but I love that they truncated it for setting up some mythology.

 

I did not see the Sergeant or Chief or whoever he is being a Zombie coming. But it makes a lot of sense now why Major was getting stonewalled everywhere he went to try to find Jerome (and Eddie before Jerome). I wonder who else on the force is a zombie. Probably at least whoever is in Missing Persons.

 

Major was actually doing pretty well against Zombie guy until he brought the red eyes out, LOL. And I can see why he thinks he's all alone but going to the skatepark without backup was dumb. I mean those kids weren't even trying to help, just skateboarding around him going "wake up wimp". That's cold.

 

I loved Lowell and Lowell/Liv together. I hope they keep him around for a while. And I agree with whoever said Liv was hyped up on Holly brains and being able to be open and flirty with someone to ask the "where do you get your brains" kind of questions. Hopefully she will follow up on that. Otherwise it's a pretty big plot hole and definitely not consistent with Liv's character up to this point.

 

The best thing about this show remains Liv's friendships with Peyton, Ravi and Babineaux particularly Ravi. Their conversation at the beginning was great and I didn't take that beginning conversation as her being out and loud about her zombieness. There wasn't anyone really around them so it's not like she was shouting it from the rooftops or something.

 

Also that small moment in the morgue where she is hesitating with the scalpel by Holly's body and he gently comes over and takes the scalpel out of her hands. It just shows much they care about each other. It's a really neat relationship.

 

This show continues to be great. I know some thought this wasn't a particularly strong episode but I quite liked it.

Edited April 16, 2015 by SanLynn

[shapeshifter]

Here a zombie, there a zombie, everywhere a zombie. Rather than apocalypse or conspiracy, I think it'd be cool to make zombies a metaphor for outsiders and have them eventually campaigning for civil rights--to brains, doncha know.

...I too thought it was Major in the body bag, but I think it'd be too soon for him to die. Any I'd rather there be time for her to explore her chemistry with Lowell before a full blown triangle occurs. Because even if Major had been in that bag, I also thought he'd be a zombie, for storytelling sake. Plus they just moved Ravi in with him last episode, which brings him into their storylines a bit...

I think the Lowell-Live-Major zombie triangle could work with Major being Ravi's roomate and Ravi being in on all three of their zombie status. Plus, Ravi wants to study zombies. I just think he might want to start sleeping while wearing a football helmet.

Clive is very attractive. Shouldn't some one notice?

[ParadoxLost]

She would be wise to assume that the government wouldn't be very kind to her were she to turn herself in. Probably experiments and isolation from other people. I wouldn't want that for myself, at least. Not to mention they could just want to profit from her disease.

 

OK.  You missed the part where I said my point of view was that of Zombie food.  If Liv has to turn herself and others in to safeguard the world from a zombie hoard then I'm ok with that.  She doesn't know the long term effects of being a zombie.  I know she wouldn't be treated well, but self interest.  I'm pretty sure pigs, cows, and chickens would create an army to take out people if they could (and no, I'm not a vegetarian :). 

 

But this show is going to go slippery slope on us very soon.  I suspect that the conspiracy is going to become clear to Liv soon and Liv is going to know bodies are piling up.  At what point is not telling anyone, even if its a long shot that they will help and not be corrupt, going to be unforgivable?

 

I guess they'll do BTVS.  The police can't deal with demons, we our band of high schoolers will save the world each week ourselves.  Zombies can only fight zombies.  But we're on episode 5 and the show is implying that the body count is already 40-60 people.

[biakbiak]

Who goes into a shady part of town and picks a fight with a clearly stronger guy just after emphatically being told not to do it?

Until he went into full Zombie mode, Major was more than holding his own. Since he couldn't have predicted Zombie mode, he may be confident in his fighting skills.

[shapeshifter]

Until he went into full Zombie mode, Major was more than holding his own...

Yeah, but that was so unrealistic. The guy looked to be at least a head taller and 75 pounds of mostly muscle heavier. Anyway, the way the camera looked down on his blood-spattered, unconscious form seemed to telegraph dead.

And again with the camera work and editing: They cut away from the body bag before we get to see what Liv sees when she unzips it...

--and then cut to her happily riding the bicycle. But that could be a flashback to her riding the bike earlier in the episode when she was experiencing the adrenaline high of her former sorority sister's brain.

[enlightenedbum]

 

Here a zombie, there a zombie, everywhere a zombie. Rather than apocalypse or conspiracy, I think it'd be cool to make zombies a metaphor for outsiders and have them eventually campaigning for civil rights--to brains, doncha know.

If they name the leader of such a movement Reg Shoe I'll be super impressed.

[Izeinwinter]

It occurs to me that this is an important plot point - Liv keeping her condition a secret when she believed that she was dealing with the consequences of a single event (the boat-party) was sort of fine - the risks to her, personally, of going public are high, and the world isn't as far as she knows in any particular danger, since she is not making more zombies. But if zombism is spreading, and she becomes aware of that, doesn't that create a rather overriding duty to ring all the alarms? 

 

Gosh, really starting to see some problems with how exactly this show is going to sustain itself long-term. Blaine is stirring far too much shit just on his own, and if he isn't even the only one infecting people? 

[Sakura12]

With all the zombies running around, if Buffy and TVD can have vampire and other supernatural creatures running around and still have people in the town not notice. I can buy people not noticing all the zombies, especially since these versions are more like vampires. They can think and just have special dietary needs.

Edited April 16, 2015 by Sakura12

[FurryFury]

Well, on TVD vampires can glamor or compel or however it's called, so I guess this is why people don't notice them. On Buffy, it was kind of a problem, but they did try to justify it by the Mayor building the town so as to cover all the shady supernatural stuff. Here, the degree of realism is slightly higher, I think, but overall, zombies aren't as obvious as even (classic) vampires.  Just pale skin and strange dietary needs.

[dubbel zout]

But it makes a lot of sense now why Major was getting stonewalled everywhere he went to try to find Jerome (and Eddie before Jerome)

 

Major also made the point that these were at-risk kids on the margins of life. That's not a demographic that has much influence. 

 

I mean those kids weren't even trying to help, just skateboarding around him going "wake up wimp". That's cold.

 

That pushed it a bit far for me. It was so heavy-handed.

Edited April 16, 2015 by dubbel zout

[LoneHaranguer]

 

With all the zombies running around, if Buffy and TVD can have vampire and other supernatural creatures running around and still have people in the town not notice.

The folks in Sunnydale did notice, but mostly stayed anyway (maybe it was the cheap property values).

[sacrebleu]

 

How do rocker guy and the police captain and the bully at the skate park all keep their regular skin and eye coloring but Liv can't ?

Yeah, I'm starting to call shenanigans on how Liv seems to be the only zombie not trying to cover up. I especially call shenanigans on zombie's of color (Dante from last week, the police captain) being able to maintain consistent pigmentation. They can't all resort to spray tanning. While I appreciate any attempt to show diversity in a show. The whole loss of pigment in hair and skin is a pretty big component of zombie-hood (zombie-ism? zombism?).

[shapeshifter]

...I mean those kids weren't even trying to help, just skateboarding around him going "wake up wimp". That's cold...

That pushed it a bit far for me. It was so heavy-handed

I found it disturbing at first too, but given that there was a wall of missing persons posters at the skate park, and given that the skate park was obviously (to me) a zombie feeding ground, I wondered if the kids were used to the losers in the zombie fights popping back up after they die. Edited April 16, 2015 by shapeshifter

[lezlers]

I don't think she's on the run. The shower curtain is probably missing because whoever disappeared her used it to wrap her body.

Exactly this.  Why would someone on the run take a shower curtain and leave a casserole baking?  She was obviously killed. 

[lezlers]

It occurs to me that this is an important plot point - Liv keeping her condition a secret when she believed that she was dealing with the consequences of a single event (the boat-party) was sort of fine - the risks to her, personally, of going public are high, and the world isn't as far as she knows in any particular danger, since she is not making more zombies. But if zombism is spreading, and she becomes aware of that, doesn't that create a rather overriding duty to ring all the alarms? 

 

Gosh, really starting to see some problems with how exactly this show is going to sustain itself long-term. Blaine is stirring far too much shit just on his own, and if he isn't even the only one infecting people? 

Yeah, the sheer number of zombies we've seen the past 5 episodes make it hard to see the current set up of the show going long term.  At the rate they're going, it's going to be The Walking Dead by season 2 and that is SO not the vibe, here.

[MisterGlass]

I enjoyed this episode.  Lowell reminded me more than a little of Mason on "Dead Like Me."  I'm interested in Liv having an opportunity to have a relationship again without being a threat to anyone or becoming involved with the local brain dealer.  And he commented on the 'Liv Moore' joke.

 

Add me to the list of people who thought Major was in the body bag.  He felt more genuine this episode because he had his own story sections.

 

I don't think Blaine started the zombie apocalypse, I just think he has a controlling interest in the local chapter.  Comments about the utopium he was selling having been contaminated with something and the statement this episode that a product turned one in every thousand people crazy make the zombie population boom sound inevitable.  And as others have commented, having the zombies in disguise means that no one will have a real sense of the pervasiveness until it's too late.  Right now, as far as Liv knows, there are three zombies in the world.  It's possible that Lowell was transformed by one of his sponsor's products without ever meeting Blaine.  Maybe he's digging up graves for food.  Maybe he is actually patient zero, and not Blaine.

 

Random: what happens if they eat non-human brains?

 

 

I think it's a bit early to complain that Ravi or Clyde have no lives or love interests.

 

I tend to agree.  Five episodes isn't much, and I'd argue that the reason we know something about Major's love life is that Liv was/is interested, and she's the main character.  I think Ravi and Peyton might be put on a course towards one another in the near future.

 

I don't think it can be said enough that Ravi is an appealing character.  He's charming.

[snarkastic]

Exactly this.  Why would someone on the run take a shower curtain and leave a casserole baking?  She was obviously killed. 

 

I thought it was Lowell that killed her, being pretty close to the situation and needing some brains. And then the episode just... ended and I was all ???? (It would be another one of those vague VM parallels, if Major is Liv's Duncan, then Lowell would be her Troy.)

[dcalley]

I thought something seemed a little off with Ravi in this episode (distracted? upset? I can no longer remember), and I kept waiting to find out what was bothering him, but as the end of the episode approached, I told myself I had misread things and that he was fine. But I still wonder.

[twoods]

I don't want Ravi to be a love interest- it will ruin the great friendship vibe he has with Liv. I do want him to have a life outside the coroner's office- same with Clive.

I like Major when he's not pushed at Liv. The thought of Jerome dead makes me so sad, and I hope Blaine pays for it.

Bradley James was even hotter than I imagined him to be as a zombie. We better be seeing more of him.

[tennisgurl]

I continue to love Ravi. He really is the best. I hope we get more of him in the near future. Him teasing Liv was pretty adorable. I don't want them to get together, romantically. They are great as friends/partners.

 

 

I tend to agree.  Five episodes isn't much, and I'd argue that the reason we know something about Major's love life is that Liv was/is interested, and she's the main character.  I think Ravi and Peyton might be put on a course towards one another in the near future.

I totally agree. We are only on episode 5 right now, and Liv is the main character. Of course we mostly see people through her point of view. We have plenty of time to get to know everyone. And Clyde seems like he will be just as important in the missing kid plot as Major. Speaking of, I like Major. I like that he is trying to help the missing kid. It gives him more an identity outside of Liv, which will hopefully happen with the other supporting characters soon.

 

Dick!!!!! I got so excited to see Dick!!!! Ryan Hanson needs to show up on my TV screen, always. And he`s into guys? I always thought he and Logan on VMars had some chemistry. If Logan and Veronica weren't meant to be...

 

I am really trying not to let Vmars affect my viewing of this show. Yeah, I can see similarities, but it seems like they are trying to do their own thing. Like, Blaine is in no way Logan. He is a straight up nasty bastard, not just a screwed up teenager. So even now, the possible love triangle will be different. 

 

New zombie guy is cute. We will see if he pops up again. I don't have a problem with more zombies showing up. it is a zombie show, after all. 

[Julia]

Exactly this.  Why would someone on the run take a shower curtain and leave a casserole baking?

 

That was such a bizarre detail. If I thought about it, I would picture her buying a box of sushi at Whole Food on the way home from krav maga class and leaving most of the rice, not making a casserole.

[FurryFury]

You have two major male characters that are not white and they are treated as if the show would not even consider them being romantically interested in Liv or vice versa.

 

Ravi KNOWS she's a zombie. Even if he did like in this way (which I'm personally not sure about, I just don't think they have this kind of chemistry), it would probably put a damper on it. As for Clive, I dunno, for me he looks kinda old, like, late 30s (I may be wrong). And he and Liv just don't know each other that well yet. I just really don't see any romance between any of them and Liv at this point, and their race doesn't really matter here.

 

in this case I find Ravi to be much more interesting than either Major or Lowell who are bland and boring. I know it's all personal preference but if I were an actor, I would rather be the smart funny sidekick than the boring love interest without a personality.

 

Exactly. 

 

It would be another one of those vague VM parallels, if Major is Liv's Duncan, then Lowell would be her Troy.

 

I've also thought about it. However, it's interesting that Lowell might actually be named for Chris Lowell who played Piz on VM and seems to be a good friend of RT (both characters are/were also connected to music).

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Lowell might actually be named for Chris Lowell who played Piz on VM

Who was named after Mark Piznarski who directed the first two episodes of VM!

[FurryFury]

Haha, I've forgotten about that! Now, this is a line of naming that's bound to be intentional!

[Sakura12]

I expect Chris Lowell to show up here, since he's also friends with Rose McIver. His character's name should be Logan. 

[FurryFury]

I remember a guy who played Logan on Gilmore Girls showing up on VM playing a character pretending to be Logan's brother. Good times.

[Silly Angel]

I want Ravi's love life outside the office to be with me.

Best line: "...Willie the Wino..." "Last name?" "The wino?"

[LoneHaranguer]

 

The new guys who are POC are not zombies, and at this point she does not think she can date a non-zombie, so she has roadblocks up to even thinking of going there. They could introduce a new zombie who is a POC.

They just did, but it's Clive's boss, so I don't see her taking that kind of interest once she knows.

 

 

Why would someone on the run take a shower curtain and leave a casserole baking?

She didn't have a suitcase so she grabbed a big sheet of plastic into which to throw a few things in a hurry?

[Bort]

She didn't have a suitcase so she grabbed a big sheet of plastic into which to throw a few things in a hurry?

Who doesn't have a suitcase?

And before people come out if the woodwork telling me they don't have a suitcase, I will rephrase it to: Who doesn't have a suitcase that has a job where they travel a lot? As that sports drink lady seemed to.

[possibilities]

Liv's lack of curiosity or concern about where other zombies are getting their brain fix is not limited to her crush on Lowell. She had originally been planning to meet with Blaine to give him some brains, when she saw him with others she considered shady, and decided not to help him. She at no time seems to have asked herself: I wonder what he'll do for brains if I'm not helping him? Ravi hasn't asked her, either. It's a bizarre lapse for them both.

 

 

 

what happens if they eat non-human brains?

I wondered about that, too. Maybe there will be an episode where we see Liv eat the brains of some roadkill and see her act like a squirrel or raccoon. Given Ravi's scientific interest, I think he might also suggest they try something like this, even with cow brain or some other brain you can acquire from a farmer or other food-vendor on the legal market. I bet hunters would have deer brains or other similar game heads. Maybe fish brains make you a good swimmer.

 

 

 

This has nothing to do with whether a man and a woman can just be friends. This has to do with asking why are the men who are not white the ones who are just friends with Liv while the white men are the love interests.

 

 

Major was already established as a past love interest for Liv. The new guys who are POC are not zombies, and at this point she does not think she can date a non-zombie, so she has roadblocks up to even thinking of going there.

They could have cast a man of color for Major's role, or Lowell's. They could have cast any mix of white/poc/zombie/non-zombie they wanted for any of the roles.

 

So far we have had POC who are: dead/victims (the kids Major is looking for), asexual sidekicks (Ravi, Clive), 1 murderer/flirtation target due to brain influence (the wife in the artist episode-- flirtation played for laughs, she was sexually rejected by her husband who was a sleazy pedophile, yet she was still unsympathetic because she was a murderer), Clive's boss (a corrupt cop/zombie), non-zombie criminals (the gang members from a previous episode).

 

White characters include: Liv (lead), Peyton (roommate/sidekick), all Liv's family, Major (love interest), Lowell (love interest), Blaine (nemesis), this week's sexy skydivers, Major's rebound girlfriend... am I missing anyone who doesn't fit the pattern?

 

I don't tend to like how TV does romance anyway, and I think the Major angst and the Lowell crush are both sickeningly boring. I was hoping that the Lowell crush was a side-effect of this week's brain-eating and that it would wear off by next week. And I am more than happy to not see people date their co-workers. But given that they are pursuing romantic stories, it's just not random that all the "off the table" characters are POC and all the "sexually active or desired" characters are POC, either. If they're going to pursue love stories, I want to see them diversify STAT. Five episodes may not be an entire series, but why start with a divide like this in the first place, and how many shows do so without maintaining it?

Edited April 17, 2015 by possibilities

[Julia]

Pretty sure she had a gym bag, and she didn't strike me as someone whose outfits took up a lot of space...

[EyewatchTV211]

They just did, but it's Clive's boss, so I don't see her taking that kind of interest once she knows.

 

Right. Especially since he is a lot older and is looking like he may be sketchy if he's the reason Blaine is getting away with what he is doing.

[Cranberry]

EDIT: Moved a bunch of posts over to the new Liv's Love Life thread (thanks, dohe, for starting that). I moved only those posts that discussed relationships in general and left those that discussed the current episode in any detail. Sorry if that breaks up the discussion a little, but it still looks fairly good to me.

[MisterGlass]

 

I wondered about that, too. Maybe there will be an episode where we see Liv eat the brains of some roadkill and see her act like a squirrel or raccoon. Given Ravi's scientific interest, I think he might also suggest they try something like this, even with cow brain or some other brain you can acquire from a farmer or other food-vendor on the legal market.

 

It does seem like an experiment Ravi would suggest, and lol at the idea of Liv going squirrel-twitchy in the middle of an investigation and freaking out around cats.

 

 

Do they deep freeze all the brainless bodies--because, certainly, if brainless bodies showed up in the morgue, they would be noticed (and no mention of that has been made yet). Is there a meat pie shop next to the brain deli? (I'm thinking about "Sweeney Todd," of course.) Or is the corporation making Soylent Green

 

I've wondered if the brain chef is selling extra special hamburger to the human customers.  It seems likely.  And if the zombie police lieutenant is there to give advice, he'd probably repeat what he told Clive - they don't go to work without a body.

 

As far as the 'abnormally short fingernails' comment, was an explanation given, or are we to assume that is so they don't scratch anyone by accident?

[Watcher0363]

For the bodies they have an nutmeg concoction.

[jhlipton]

For the bodies they have an nutmeg concoction.

 

Just wonderful smash-up!

[jhlipton]

Watcher0363's comment was a reference to Elementary.  One of the bad guys came up with a concoction that would completely dissolve a body. leaving only a hint of nutmeg behind.

[fluffysheap]

Hated this episode. God, the music! I usually only notice music when it stands out, either for good or bad. It was so obnoxious in this episode I ended up watching it on mute with the closed captioning. There was this constant low frequency droning-thumping through the entire episode that just was intolerable. Sure, once in a while you might want to underline a dangerous or ominous situation but this was like having a boom car parked outside.

Edited April 29, 2015 by fluffysheap

[AudienceofOne]

I think it'd be cool to make zombies a metaphor for outsiders and have them eventually campaigning for civil rights--to brains, doncha know.

 

 

That was True Blood and we all know how that turned out. Still loving this show, although I spent the entire episode being driven crazy by Bradley James' character because I couldn't place him (then popped by here and saw it was Bradley James). Was driving me nuts.

 

Since it was the drug that was responsible in some way for the zombies, I thought the new zombie love interest was turned that way (musician, drugs, etc). But now I'm wondering if he was turned and/or sent by Blaine to keep an eye on Liv.

 

I also thought they'd killed off Major and I was temporarily thinking that was so brave so early in the show. Nice fakeout, though.