Feeeemales Are Strong As Hell - Season One (as a whole) Discussion

[Mya Stone]

Hi, I'm Mya, and I am a binge watcher. Here's a place to discuss the season as a whole, for those of us who tend to binge watch.

I thought the season really picked up steam 3-4 episodes in, and it got to the point where I couldn't stop watching. Especially when we got to JON HAMM. His casting was pitch perfect. As well as Marcia Clark and Chris Darden. I know that will be lost on a lot of younger folks, but their complete ineptitude had me in stitches.

[SeanC]

I quite liked the show, on the whole. It feels a bit different from the other Netflix original content I've seen, in that this was originally going to be an NBC sitcom, and was presumably developed and initially written like one -- there's a lot more of what feels like the writers fine-tuning the show as the season goes on, instead of it being a complete, preconceived unit (the way various characters from the pilot and early episodes are shuffled offstage, especially).

[jjjmoss]

Thanks to this forum, I understand the joke about the prosecutors.

 

While watching I was just like, "Oh, so they're bad lawyers, I guess that's funny." Though not having seen any of the OJ trial footage I don't have a basis of comparison...

Edited March 9, 2015 by jjjmoss

[JAYJAY1979]

I thought the first nine episodes were great, but starting with episode ten.. the show started to become too over the top and too much of a spoof for me.

 

Also, I think having Tina Fey and Jon Hamm guest star actually distracted me from the show.  Jon Hamm just isn't funny to me.  He's good in drama, and certainly has no qualms about looking foolish.. but he just doesn't have comic timing imho.

 

Still I think overall the show was decent, loads better then 30 Rock, Parks & Recreation, etc.  And I do think the last episode had to have been modified for Netflix because it had cliffhangers.  When it comes back for season 2, lose the step-dad character and keep having the former bunker women pop up from time to time with updates on their lives outside the bunker. 

[DB in CMH]

I thought the first nine episodes were great, but starting with episode ten.. the show started to become too over the top and too much of a spoof for me.

 

Also, I think having Tina Fey and Jon Hamm guest star actually distracted me from the show.  Jon Hamm just isn't funny to me.  He's good in drama, and certainly has no qualms about looking foolish.. but he just doesn't have comic timing imho.

 

I agree. The last few episodes veered really far into self parody, and bordered on cringey. The Marcia Clark thing has been done a million times before, so it fell completely flat for me. The only characters that I consistently enjoyed over the season were Kimmy and Jacqueline - the rest were a mixed bad that sometimes border on obnoxious. 

 

Good for a binge during a hangover, but not must-see TV. Overall, a B. 

Edited March 9, 2015 by DB in CMH

[Mya Stone]

I think for me, having the OJ Team work this particular case, given that Kimmy was sort of stuck developmentally in the 90s (light up converse, Billy Madison joke, constant Clueless quoting), is what made it work. Of course it would be them, coming out of hiding after all these years. The irony worked for me. But I can see how it wouldn't have landed for others.

[Ms Blue Jay]

What was the Billy Madison joke?

 

Constant Clueless quoting?  I remember "As If"; was there anything else?

Edited March 9, 2015 by Ms Blue Jay

[mortonsalt]

I thought the first nine episodes were great, but starting with episode ten.. the show started to become too over the top and too much of a spoof for me.

 

Also, I think having Tina Fey and Jon Hamm guest star actually distracted me from the show.  Jon Hamm just isn't funny to me.  He's good in drama, and certainly has no qualms about looking foolish.. but he just doesn't have comic timing imho.

 

Still I think overall the show was decent, loads better then 30 Rock, Parks & Recreation, etc.  And I do think the last episode had to have been modified for Netflix because it had cliffhangers.  When it comes back for season 2, lose the step-dad character and keep having the former bunker women pop up from time to time with updates on their lives outside the bunker. 

 

I agree that I really enjoyed the first nine episodes especially from episode 3 on, but after that I think the Dong dilemma and the trial take it too over the top. Also, I usually enjoy Tim Blake Nelson, but I really disliked Randy because of how stupid that they made him. I hope that they cut out his character next season or at least not make him as dumb if they feel that they have to keep the character.

 

I also love the suggestion of getting to see the lives of Kimmy's bunker mates from time to time. 

 

What was the Billy Madison joke?

 

Constant Clueless quoting?  I remember "As If"; was there anything else?

 

I know there was one when she tried enrolling in the eighth grade. Something about how she should be able to do it since Billy Madison did it, but the lady that Kimmy pointed out that Billy wasn't a real person and that he also came from money unlike Kimmy. 

[Nancybeth]

The boyfriend and I watched the first 8 or 9 episodes on Friday and then I finished up the season this weekend.  Overall I thought it was hysterical, but things definitely hit a speed bump when we got the trial.  Hopefully they've finished up that plot line and won't revisit Indiana or Richard Wayne Gary Wayne again, except in flashbacks (which are generally pretty funny). 

 

I ended up watching the first four eps twice, and there's so much you catch on the second go-around.  I'm going to have to rewatch them all.  And dammit, the song is stuck in my head.

[ApathyMonger]

I know there was one when she tried enrolling in the eighth grade. Something about how she should be able to do it since Billy Madison did it, but the lady that Kimmy pointed out that Billy wasn't a real person and that he also came from money unlike Kimmy. 

 

I loved how unfazed that receptionist/administrator was by the entire thing, especially the Breakfast Club raised fist gesture.

[ApathyMonger]

The "raw footage" used for the theme song:

 

 

Also, look at these sunglasses I found! Unbreakable!

[Slovenly Muse]

I really enjoyed the season. But I did notice that when I watched three or four episodes in a row, and then took a long break to watch or do something else, I tended to enjoy the first ep after the break better and my enjoyment would slowly diminish until the next break. I think a show like this maybe isn't the best to binge watch, just because it starts to wear thin a bit or the energy becomes a bit too relentless if you don't sleep on it and come back to it fresh every so often. That said, I thought this season was brilliant, and I can't wait for season 2. A reviewer (Sepinwall, I think?) mentioned that he thought it seemed like the sitcom was tailored a bit for network television (since it was made for NBC), and it felt like Fey and Carlock wanted to go in some different directions with it, like exploring the darker side of what happened in the bunker, for example, but veered away from or glossed over some of what they wanted to do because it wouldn't play well on NBC. Season 2, being developed for Netflix, will be made without those kinds of restrictions or considerations, and I have high hopes that it will be able to keep "finding itself" and becoming the show it wants to be. Netflix is a good place for this show, definitely!

 

I didn't even notice, until it was pointed out to me, that UKS does this, but it is extremely rare these days to find a sitcom (or TV show in general) that does not have one straight white man in its main cast. Well played! That is an over-represented demographic I didn't miss in the slightest.

 

And as for Jacqueline's backstory, I didn't find it offensive or racist, and I don't think it was intended to be. I agree that the casting of a white woman for the role was a bit iffy, but since JK was probably lined up before the storyline was even written, I'm not losing sleep over it. I liked that rather than using a First Nations character to trade on racial stereotypes the way Fey sometimes does with other races, they used it as a way to dispel and confront some of those stereotypes. And the idea of a First Nations girl who can "pass" as white trying to re-write her identity as a white woman is not racist or even far-fetched. It happens! Especially in First Nations communities, since the colonization of this continent was rooted in the idea of removing First Nations people from it, either through genocide or through attempts to forcibly strip First Nations children of their cultural identity and assimilate them into "white" society against their will. Race relations are complicated when it comes to these communities. But it is the same with all racial groups who may not be immediately identifiable on sight, and those who are biracial, there is something of a choice to be made as to how to identify, or how to present themselves to BE identified by others. While I'm not entirely ok with "white people" being the ones to tackle this issue, since it's not really their story to tell, I can't argue that UKS did the issue a disservice. Yes, they played it for laughs, but they also touched on it in a way that was sensitive to the fact that it's a tough, emotional situation that many people in our society face every day. Plus, they get bonus points for having Jacqueline find her way to the courthouse through actual practical wisdom like "the sun rises in the east" rather than some sort of "mystical Indian" guidance, like "my spirit animal will show me the way," which is what often happens when TV shows decide to take a set of complex religious and cultural beliefs and reduce them into a cheap storytelling device, or worse, a laugh. So, while I think it could have been done better (i.e., not almost exclusively by white people), I enjoyed Jacqueline's backstory and appreciated the ongoing twists and turns of her journey of self-discovery.

 

I'm really looking forward to season 2. I think it's gonna be rad!

[Chaos Theory]

Ok I finished. I thought it was pretty good and I didn't particularly like 30 Rock. I think I liked the wide eyed and Innocent Kimmy more then I ever liked Liz Lemon. Besides that I thought the show had its moments that both worked and didn't. I am not sure about making Jacqueline Voorhees and Indian but I don't want to get into the politics of hiring a non-indian to play and Indian. I think the story itself worked....kinda. Other then that the only other thing that I didn't particularly care for was the love triangle stuff. I thought that dragged the story down. I did like the trial stuff and I don't mind Tina Fey inserting herself into the story. I thought she did well and picked a good character for herself. I thought the trial was funny and how each of the "Mole Women" were integrating into life was interesting.

I liked how the jokes sometimes flew at you and yet others took entire episodes to develop. I loved the Shame Puppet and the YUKO3000. I think my favorite episode was "Kimmy Goes To A Party." However I think my favorite joke was the one with the construction worker (I forget now which episode). He of course makes a luid comment to Kimmy who takes it as a complement and compliments the construction worker who spends the rest of the episode contemplating life. I thought that was hilarious.

Considering this was almost completely a NBC comedy (and I don't really like those) I enjoyed it more then I thought I would. I think the show only moved to Netflix after it had been shot so the only thing moving effected was editing decisions. I will be more interested in what Tina Fey does with the 2nd season now that the reins are off. It will either be glorious or horrifying .....maybe both. I'm hoping for both.

Edited March 10, 2015 by Chaos Theory

[LJonEarth]

I thought the first nine episodes were great, but starting with episode ten.. the show started to become too over the top and too much of a spoof for me.

 

Also, I think having Tina Fey and Jon Hamm guest star actually distracted me from the show.  Jon Hamm just isn't funny to me.  He's good in drama, and certainly has no qualms about looking foolish.. but he just doesn't have comic timing imho.

 

Still I think overall the show was decent, loads better then 30 Rock, Parks & Recreation, etc.  And I do think the last episode had to have been modified for Netflix because it had cliffhangers.  When it comes back for season 2, lose the step-dad character and keep having the former bunker women pop up from time to time with updates on their lives outside the bunker. 

The show almost felt like three different shows. The first episode or two felt very much like a pilot. Funny, shaky, with some retreads from 30 Rock (kind of like the first season of Parks & Rec). The middle settled in and was fantastic. I saw some unique stuff and the plot really moved. I cried laughing more than once.

 

I can't put my finger on what was up with the final few episodes. It almost felt like the sketch part of the 30 Rock, which they backed off a bit as that show progressed. I love Tina and Jon, but on a show full of over the top characters, it felt odd to go to another town with three times as many ridiculous people. It was still very funny, but I'd like them to stay in New York and stick with Kimmy's growth next season.

 

There's no way that this would have lasted on NBC. I still think it takes a special type of person to endure this style of comedy, and there aren't enough of us to satisfy NBC's bottom line.

[CleoCaesar]

On the whole I really enjoyed the season. But I did think the first half dozen episodes were the strongest, and most unexpected in terms of comic timing/reactions. After a while Kimmy's and Titus's mannerisms grow just the tiniest bit old.

 

I also kept being taken out of the show by Kimmy/Kemper's incredible resemblance to a young Renee Zellweger. It was uncanny at times with the straight hair especially.

 

On a shallow note, I loved Kimmy's wardrobe. And I generally don't care about fashion.

 

LOVED seeing Tina Fey, but the whole Indiana storyline fell flat for me. Didn't find the trial that amusing so much as over-the-top and a little irritating. But still, a wonderful show on the whole and something to remind me of my beloved 30 Rock.

[joelene]

I agree with the general consensus that the last three episodes didn't work as well as the first nine, which I thought were pretty damn great overall. I didn't think the trialisodes were bad but, and maybe this was just in the mood I was in, I couldn't help feeling disturbed by how dumb the the whole courtroom was except for a couple of the mole women, because I felt uneasy about how dumb the jury can be IRL and in my mind it played like a horror show as much as a comedy show, so I had a hard time just sitting back and enjoy it. Obviously I know it was all parody, but for some reason I couldn't distance myself fully from the idiocy of real life.

Jacqueline (who, besides Kimmy, is my favorite character) and Lillian's story in those last episodes weren't my favorite either. But I did love them all - Lillian and Titus include. All of them hit and miss from time to time but I don't think there are many characters from any first comedy season you can say are a complete hit.

Kimmy's dad (Randy?) fell kind of flat to me. Kiernan didn't really work in her role either I thought, but maybe it was the script.

And Kimmy's storyline with Dong left me kind of cold. But the love triangle storyline did bring us Daddy's Boy which was one of the funniest things in the whole season.

I think my favorite episode was the one with Jacqueline's party where her husband and partner presents the robot. The disposal of the body in the garden had me howling.

Jacqueline's hidden Native American past was one of my favorite subplots.

And the intro song is amazing.

All in all the season was great and I think I can say it's one of my favorite American comedy shows currently on, along with Broad City, Review, Inside Amy Schumer, Veep and Getting On.

Edited March 10, 2015 by joelene

[Kel Varnsen]

I was lookling forward to this show as soon as I heard about it but it really surpassed my expectations. I think with Parks and Rec done and Cougar Town really taking a slide in funny (and losing their best character) this might be my favourite show on TV.

I thought the season really picked up steam 3-4 episodes in, and it got to the point where I couldn't stop watching. Especially when we got to JON HAMM. His casting was pitch perfect. As well as Marcia Clark and Chris Darden. I know that will be lost on a lot of younger folks, but their complete ineptitude had me in stitches.

The Marcia Clark stuff was probably the only thing that didn't really work for me. And I remember the OJ trial. It seemed like something I would expect from Jay Leno.

 

 

Still I think overall the show was decent, loads better then 30 Rock, Parks & Recreation, etc.  And I do think the last episode had to have been modified for Netflix because it had cliffhangers.  When it comes back for season 2, lose the step-dad character and keep having the former bunker women pop up from time to time with updates on their lives outside the bunker. 

I hope for season 2 we see Kimmy's mom appear. And we have no idea who her dad is either.

 

Fey and Carlock wanted to go in some different directions with it, like exploring the darker side of what happened in the bunker, for example, but veered away from or glossed over some of what they wanted to do because it wouldn't play well on NBC. Season 2, being developed for Netflix, will be made without those kinds of restrictions or considerations, and I have high hopes that it will be able to keep "finding itself" and becoming the show it wants to be. Netflix is a good place for this show, definitely!

 

It would be interesting to see if they do go a little darker. Not too much because this isn't Law and Order SVU. But at the same time, the Reverend didn't actually believe in the apocalypse so why was he kidnapping teenage girls? 

Edited March 10, 2015 by Kel Varnsen

[joelene]

But at the same time, the Reverend didn't actually believe in the apocalypse so why was he kidnapping teenage girls?

Because weird sex stuff in the bunker? Also, he's nuts.

[Kel Varnsen]

Because weird sex stuff in the bunker? Also, he's nuts.

Yea I remember that line being mentioned now. You would think that if they wanted to they could go a bit darker for season 2 just based on the fact that they are not on network TV.  The thing where Kimmy said she wanted to go to the next level with Logan and then knocked him out was hilarious (but so wrong).

[jellysalmon]

I feel like this show is custom tailored for my enjoyment. It hits on a lot of things on my checklist.

 

• D'Fwan and Jenna (two of my favorites from 30 Rock)
• 90s references
• Jokes at the expense of the uber rich
• Jokes at the expense of Indiana
• Interracial couples
• Spanish jokes.

 

I really enjoyed the season as a whole and look forward to what they come up with next, but I agree that the last few episodes were a little shakey. I mostly blame it on Randy. All of his plotlines seemed so out of tone with the rest of the show. There's cartoonish and then there's saturday morning cartoonish. I hope they scale him back like they scaled back Rachel Dratch's characters on 30 Rock. 

 

Also. Although I'm straight, I definitely learned that "straight guys don't sit next to each other in movies" thing until my 20s.

Edited March 10, 2015 by jellysalmon

[Sakura12]

I loved this, and like most I think the last few episodes had a different feel to them (too cartoonish?) and were not as enjoyable. 

 

I agree on scaling back or getting rid of the Randy character, he's not really necessary. I'd rather meet Kimmy's mom that ran away once her kidnapped daughter was found. 

 

I love that Kimmy is bubbly and optimistic (traits I usually find annoying) but can go into fits of sudden anger and rage. I like that they are not completely sugar coating what happened to her. She's innocent but not. Her dated references were great. My favorite was her Breakfast Club freeze frame. 

 

I'm loving the relationships between Kimmy and Jacqueline and Kimmy and Titus. It's also great seeing Carol Kane here as well as on Gotham where she's playing the Penguin's mother. 

Edited March 10, 2015 by Sakura12

[Kel Varnsen]

I loved this, and like most I think the last few episodes had a different feel to them (too cartoonish?) and were not as enjoyable. 

The court room stuff  Tina Fey playing a parody of a real person and Jon Hamm showing up doing a crazy over the top thing it was a bit too much like an SNL sketch for my tastes. It was still funny, but Kimmy and her life was on a whole other level of hilarious.

 

Her dated references were great. My favorite was her Breakfast Club freeze frame.

 

The dated references are hilarious, especially since I am old enough where I get almost all of them. Her really lame burns on Zan, that she some how made effective were really funny.

Edited March 10, 2015 by Kel Varnsen

[Cherpumple]

I really enjoyed this show and definitely need to re-watch at some point to remember all the rapid-fire jokes that I caught, but then quickly forgot as soon as the next one came along. I agree that the last few episodes felt "off", as eloquently expressed by joelene:

 

I couldn't help feeling disturbed by how dumb the the whole courtroom was except for a couple of the mole women, because I felt uneasy about how dumb the jury can be IRL and in my mind it played like a horror show as much as a comedy show, so I had a hard time just sitting back and enjoy it.

 

 

Starting with Kimmy being so desperate to disassociate from all her memories of the bunker by focusing on spin classes, and then feeling so utterly frustrated and helpless watching the trial being manipulated into a circus, those last few episodes made me really uneasy. I think it's because at that point it became impossible to separate the horrifying premise of the show from the silly absurdist jokes in each scene, and it must have been really difficult for the writers to balance the tone. They never really shied away from the premise in earlier episodes, but it wasn't quite so "in your face" when the focus was on Kimmy meeting guys, studying math, or navigating her job. So when you actually had to think about what Richard Wayne had told them, done to them, etc., and see people not believe them as well as the girls blaming each other for not overcoming his brainwashing (so infuriating!), it was just harder to watch.

 

Not sure where season 2 will go, but I hope it's mainly in New York, although I wouldn't mind a trip to South Dakota- Jackie Lynn's parents are the best!

[Trick Question]

I agree with the consensus about the last three episodes.  Surely the show had to revisit the kidnapping plotline if for no other reason to wrap it up, and obviously Richard Gary was going to wind up in the jail at the end of it, yet seeing such a dark subject play out in such a broad way was just off-putting.  Maybe Fey/Carlock felt that making it cartoony would help detract from the reality of the situation, but it might've just made it worse.  Also, I've seen goofy Indiana towns on my TV, and Durhamsville, you are NO Pawnee.

 

This being sald, the Mole Women storyline seems to be more or less wrapped up, so it's quite possible the second season will move on entirely to Kimmy's adventures in New York.  Not that the premise should be abandoned or anything, but they can incorporate it into Kimmy's general arc like in the first nine episodes rather than having it quite so front and center.  This would be ideal since the first nine episodes were fantastic-bordering-on-great and I'm so glad that another season is already in the mix.  The four main cast members are outstanding, most of the side characters are very funny (though I could get by with never seeing Randy again) and it's just generally great having another Fey/Carlock show in our lives.

 

A Fey cameo was probably inevitable, but I would love to know her logic in picking that specific character.

[KarateKate]

Gretchen's crank songs... I know we only got two (right?), but "Crank you for being a crank!" is stuck in my head (Jimmy crack crank, not as catchy). Crank becomes the apocalypse cult version of Smurf - any song can be a crank song.

[Duke2801]

The dated references are hilarious, especially since I am old enough where I get almost all of them. Her really lame burns on Zan, that she some how made effective were really funny.

 

 

Heehee I love them too.  What was the one about bitch?  Something like?  "Oh as in female dog?  That can have puppies?? Thanks for the AWESOME compliment!" 

 

I only have episode 13 left to watch, but the courtroom episodes aren't bothering me.  I am finding Tina and the other guy's roles as super-incompetent lawyers fairly amusing.  And the Titus REMIX song?  Totally sophomoric humor .... that cracked me right the hell up.

[April Bloodgate]

I agree with the consensus about the last three episodes.  Surely the show had to revisit the kidnapping plotline if for no other reason to wrap it up, and obviously Richard Gary was going to wind up in the jail at the end of it, yet seeing such a dark subject play out in such a broad way was just off-putting.  Maybe Fey/Carlock felt that making it cartoony would help detract from the reality of the situation, but it might've just made it worse.  Also, I've seen goofy Indiana towns on my TV, and Durhamsville, you are NO Pawnee.

Yes, thank you! There is a way to do "dopey small town Midwestern characters that don't get it" to great comedic effect (Pawnee/Parks & Rec), and then there's "everyone is so completely brainless that it's just obnoxious and terribly unfunny" (Durnsville/UKS).

[bettername2come]

I really liked the show. One of my favorite (disturbing yet funny) things that hasn't been mentioned was Kimmy's willingness to get still get into random dudes' vans - including the "bra salesman" - and Titus's reaction. I also liked that Donna Maria's understood English nearly the whole time just because it's really obvious from her response to the first question in the interview from the pilot. "None of these bitches learned Spanish."

[LJonEarth]

I agree with the consensus about the last three episodes.  Surely the show had to revisit the kidnapping plotline if for no other reason to wrap it up, and obviously Richard Gary was going to wind up in the jail at the end of it, yet seeing such a dark subject play out in such a broad way was just off-putting.  Maybe Fey/Carlock felt that making it cartoony would help detract from the reality of the situation, but it might've just made it worse.  Also, I've seen goofy Indiana towns on my TV, and Durhamsville, you are NO Pawnee.

There are some racism claims rumbling around about this show. I hope that it stays just a rumbling. But, because I'm easily swayed if given enough evidence, I can see where people take issue. But I'm hoping that the Durhamsvillian yokels will show that there's really no group of people who don't look like cartoons on this show.

[scartact]

Just binge watched UKS this past week and I really loved it! Kemper is just incredibly well-utilized on this show and really holds everything together. Her combination of naiveté and grounded strength sold me even on some of the more unbelievable aspects of the show. I really liked how through the flashbacks we could see and understand why Kimmy wouldn't want to just return back to normal in Indiana and how she would want to overcome and redefine herself as more than just a victim. It's empowering without being overly sentimental, and it affirms her optimism as not a misplaced character trait, but as her source of strength.

 

Other things I liked:

 

I really liked the rest of the ensemble. Jane Krakowski was wonderfully hilarious (I haven't seen 30 Rock, so I have no point of comparison for her, other than that this is not necessarily unfamiliar ground for her), and I really loved Titus and his friendship with Kimmy. There were definitely also a lot of moments I burst out laughing because of him. And while not necessarily my favorite, Lillian really grew on me after awhile. I definitely wasn't too fond of the depiction of Randy though, and found him to be my least favorite of the smaller cast. I hope the show figures out how to hone in his character more. And same with the depiction of Durnsville in general.

 

I admittedly squee-ed over Kiernan Shipka and Jon Hamm as guest stars for the show. It's nice to see Shipka in a non-Sally Draper role! I'm seriously looking forward to her post-Mad Men career. As for Hamm, despite finding a lot of tedium in the trial, I was moreso excited to see him interacting with Kemper since I'm a meta-nerd and it's mildly hilarious to consider Hamm kidnapping his former high school drama student and trapping her in a bunker for fifteen years with three other women. I definitely laughed out loud when I learned Hamm was Reverend Richard Wayne Gary Wayne.

 

I randomly loved that Titus's nemesis is Coriolanus. How very literary!

 

I really do love the flashbacks to the bunker and seeing all four women's separate dynamics and coping mechanisms while stuck there. I wonder if future episodes will have more flashbacks with the Reverend, or how they'll revisit the Mole Women stuff if the Reverend is truly behind bars. I was actually surprised they got to the trial so quickly and moved through it fairly fast. I mean, In some ways though, I'm sorta glad. I don't quite think I'll find myself rewatching those parts of the show too often.

 

That theme song is catchy as hell!

 

Questionable stuff:

 

I want to like Dong more, but I don't think his character is well-developed enough yet. I hope the show gives him more time and that he isn't just a character who passes through. Then again, I'm also not sold yet on his romance with Kimmy.

 

Okay, so I'm really not sure about the overall treatment of POC characters in this show. I have very mixed feelings about Krakowski's character having a Native American background, but I do appreciate that her parents weren't caricatures. Part of me wishes that instead of Krakowski, it were someone of Native American origin who played that character, though I do think she's still really great in that role.

 

And also returning to the Dong issue (LOL), I sorta felt uncomfortable with his portrayal and some of his lines ("Kimmy means penis in Vietnamese" was one of my least favorite jokes in the show, though I appreciated the set-up). I do like that he's an Asian immigrant who is undocumented, so it provides an interesting struggle for his character to go through. I can't think of any main/supporting/recurring characters who've had stories surrounding their undocumented immigrant status. Too bad this wasn't on actual "TV."

 

These issues aside and whether or not they're problematic, I'm definitely gonna tune in for the next season. I'm a firm believer in that you can still criticize and call what you like out for being problematic, but also be a fan of the thing.

 

Edit: I didn't realize how much a rambled for about this show. @.@

Edited March 12, 2015 by scartact

[DrSpaceman]

I normally hate it when people focus on unimportant minor details in a show.....but the accents bug me. I haven't finish the whole season, so maybe there is a reason, but that is clearly a Minnesota accent Kimmy has, not anyways close to what you hear in Indiana

[Cherpumple]

I liked the way they've handled the romances so far. I was worried that it would turn into a drawn out "will they or won't they" between Kimmy and the tutor, so I was happy to see that arc resolved fairly quickly, followed by two more interesting, yet unsuitable men. It's realistic that the inexperienced Kimmy wouldn't settle down too quickly, and would have a skewed radar when it comes to men and relationships. However, I wouldn't mind something a little more substantial next season, and it did seem a little strange that the tutor completely disappeared from the show, which suggests that maybe we won't see Dong again (lol) because he's now married to someone else.

 

I would love for this show to be in the 30 Rock universe. I can totally see Titus kicking back watching "Queen of Jordan" or a re-showing of "Kidnapped by Danger" on Lifetime with his bottle of D'fwine, or Kimmy getting a great deal on some Christian Le Button shoes. That would be heaven for me!

[Kel Varnsen]

 I also liked that Donna Maria's understood English nearly the whole time just because it's really obvious from her response to the first question in the interview from the pilot. "None of these bitches learned Spanish."

I liked the reason that she never bothered to talk to them, was because all they ever talked about was teen-aged girl crap.

 

 

 

And also returning to the Dong issue (LOL), I sorta felt uncomfortable with his portrayal and some of his lines ("Kimmy means penis in Vietnamese" was one of my least favorite jokes in the show, though I appreciated the set-up). I do like that he's an Asian immigrant who is undocumented, so it provides an interesting struggle for his character to go through. I can't think of any main/supporting/recurring characters who've had stories surrounding their undocumented immigrant status. Too bad this wasn't on actual "TV."

I think Dong, if he sticks around could easily become like Apu from the Simpsons (which is good). Apu started off as a total caricature, but then they actually developed the character to the point where he is probably the most well rounded Indian character on TV (although really his only major competition is any character played by Mindy Kalling). I could see the same with Dong and he could easily become the most developed Vietnamese character on TV. And I liked the joke about Kimmy means Penis, nice play on all the jokes about Dong they were making (especially since at first I thought Dong's full name was Dong Wang).

[KarateKate]

I randomly loved that Titus's nemesis is Coriolanus. How very literary!

I completely missed this, but this is amazing. 

Is it telling that Coriolanus was a real guy (though Bill's account was natch fictionalized), where IIRC Titus Andromedus was a totally fictitious character? Coriolanus gets all the good parts!

[Sakura12]

I really liked the show. One of my favorite (disturbing yet funny) things that hasn't been mentioned was Kimmy's willingness to get still get into random dudes' vans - including the "bra salesman" - and Titus's reaction. I also liked that Donna Maria's understood English nearly the whole time just because it's really obvious from her response to the first question in the interview from the pilot. "None of these bitches learned Spanish."

 

Cyndee did she just didn't know it. 

 

I understand her reasoning, she was the only adult stuck with a bunch of teenage girls who never were able to matured past that for 15 years. 

[Morbs]

I think Jon Hamm looks like Fred Flintstone.  To each his own.

 

I kinda liked the Marcia Clark stuff because I like the idea of Tina Fey and Robert Carlock still having lingering resentment over the O.J trial.

[JayKay]

I think Jon Hamm looks like Fred Flintstone.  To each his own.

Oh my god he even has the weird watercolor marker five-o-clock shadow. Is this a trick? Is Jon Hamm a practical joke on America?

 

I hope we see more Gretchen next season. Maybe she'll start her own cult. She's just so charming to me, in a borderline unhinged way.

[BoogieBurns]

I think Jon Hamm looks like Fred Flintstone.

 

I've always thought Fred Flintstone was kinda hot. Its fine!

[mtlchick]

Still working my way through the show (only on episode 6) so I am enjoying it for the most part.  I haven't really seen Ellie in anything so she does have some mannerisms that I need to get used to but she's pretty enjoyable.  BI am cheesing that Jeff Richmond is doing the music for this.  I so miss his quirky oboe tones.  

 

The surprising thing is my sister who isn't a Tina Fey fan and who I didn't expect her to get into this, is powering her way through faster than me (she's on episode 8.)  When I asked why all she says is "But she's a damn mole woman!" 

 

Finally that theme song...it will not escape me anytime soon.

[Snarkette]

I loved it all, start to finish. Was having a rather crappy few weeks and this show put a smile on my face. Didn't care for dong or rich boyfriend (although the perfect retro musical episode end couldn't have happened without him) but loved Jane K and Carol K in particular. So many great moments.

[bourbon]

This was the first sitcom that I've found laugh-out-loud funny since Arrested Development or early 30 Rock, so on that level it gets high praise from me. And although I've seen Ellie Kemper in the Office, Bridesmaids, etc., she was a real revelation here. I knew she could do perky and relentlessly cheerful, but it goes beyond that. Her facial expressions, timing, and line readings are amazing. She's like a very twisted Mary Richards. 

 

That said...I admit to being a little squicked by the premise. This wasn't really a cult like David Koresh or the Moonies, she was straight-up kidnapped and held captive for 15 years. I don't think she'd be wide-eyed and behind on pop culture references as she would be deeply traumatized. I suppose it is debatable whether or not Moonies or Branch Davidians were free to come and go, but being held in a bunker with 3 other women and forced to wear Fundamentalist Mormon garb just doesn't = a cult.  A cult suggests some degree of willingness, at least at the outset, and we didn't have that here. Plus, there's the whole "weird sex stuff" thing, and every time she was kissing a man, it made me uncomfortable. Would she really be prepared for a normal romantic relationship?  Of course, I don't really watch Tina Fey sitcoms for realism, but I don't want them to be squirm inducing. I kind of wish they had just made her a former member of a very conservative sect like the Amish. Yeah, I know. I'm a fuddy duddy, I guess.

[Kel Varnsen]

That said...I admit to being a little squicked by the premise. This wasn't really a cult like David Koresh or the Moonies, she was straight-up kidnapped and held captive for 15 years. I don't think she'd be wide-eyed and behind on pop culture references as she would be deeply traumatized. I suppose it is debatable whether or not Moonies or Branch Davidians were free to come and go, but being held in a bunker with 3 other women and forced to wear Fundamentalist Mormon garb just doesn't = a cult.  A cult suggests some degree of willingness, at least at the outset, and we didn't have that here. Plus, there's the whole "weird sex stuff" thing, and every time she was kissing a man, it made me uncomfortable. Would she really be prepared for a normal romantic relationship?  

It is interesting that there are two sitcoms that have come out in the last little while (Kimmy Schmidt and Last Man on Earth), both involving ex-SNL people and both with premises that could be considered very dark but are played for laughs instead. I mean on this show everything is played for laughs, but you are right she is a kidnapping victim, with the weird sex stuff, who should be super traumatized. On Last Man on Earth the dude is alone for years after everyone else has died from a plague and he has no human contact. But in both cases they concentrate on making it something to laugh at instead of the reality of what really happened. 

[Sakura12]

Isn't the point that Kimmy couldn't be broken? She didn't let the kidnapping and weird sex stuff break her spirit.

Edited March 17, 2015 by Sakura12

[Kel Varnsen]

Isn't the point that Kimmy couldn't be broken? She didn't let the kidnapping and weird sex stuff break her spirit.

Doesn't the name of the show basically say that?

[Sakura12]

The poster above was talking about how Kimmy should be traumatized not smiling and quoting 80's/90's movies. Which is why I said the point was Kimmy didn't break in her kidnapping, she kept her spirit that's why she's not traumatized and retreating from the new world she's in. 

[bourbon]

I get that's she is supposedly unbreakable, but a real person wouldn't be this upbeat after being held captive and forced to do "weird sex stuff" for 15 years, and I guess that's my issue with really being able to fully enjoy the show. YMMV.

[Kel Varnsen]

I get that's she is supposedly unbreakable, but a real person wouldn't be this upbeat after being held captive and forced to do "weird sex stuff" for 15 years, and I guess that's my issue with really being able to fully enjoy the show. YMMV.

I think it works because they went so far in the other direction as far as crazy comedy. Of course in real life a person wouldn't be that up beat. But in real life a trial probably wouldn't go like one in this episode. If they made this more like real life it wouldn't be as funny. That is kind of why I drew the comparisons to Last Man on Earth, because same thing, in that show if they didn't make it really absurd, the brutal reality of the situation would make it a lot less funny.

[Captain Asshat]

That said...I admit to being a little squicked by the premise. This wasn't really a cult like David Koresh or the Moonies, she was straight-up kidnapped and held captive for 15 years. I don't think she'd be wide-eyed and behind on pop culture references as she would be deeply traumatized.

 

They allude to trauma. There's the reference to her "scream lines" in the episode with Martin Short as the plastic surgeon. After sleep walking and trying to strangle Titus in his sleep, Titus tells her, "Kimmy Schmidt, you are clearly repressing some stuff, and it is very unhealthy. For Titus! You need to talk to somebody." Later, Kimmy tells Titus she's fine and doesn't need to talk about her experience. He replies with, "Kimmy! You yell in your sleep. You bite *my* nails, and we still don't know why you're afraid of velcro." The last part is demonstrated and ends with her screaming, slapping a velcro shoe out of Titus' hand, and running from the room. This is a sitcom treatment of trauma without turning into "A very special episode."

[pon teeve]

I get that's she is supposedly unbreakable, but a real person wouldn't be this upbeat after being held captive and forced to do "weird sex stuff" for 15 years, and I guess that's my issue with really being able to fully enjoy the show. YMMV.

I can see where you're coming from. Yet interestingly, there's an article on Slate where an escapee who was raised in the Children of God cult (which is quite horrible, complete with child sex slavery) reviewed UKS. It's worth a Google. In it, she basically says how much she relates to Kimmy, actually -- as she and many 'escapees' have very relentlessly upbeat/excited reactions once released into the world, to the point of almost a mania and a desire to disassociate from her past. She concedes while much of it is exagerrated and a bit cartoony, that Kimmy's core journey rings true to her, and that she connected with Kimmy's assertion that "the worst thing that can happen to me has already happened to me".

Not all escapees would react this way, I'm sure. But apparently it speaks to a certain percentage. I also don't doubt there's a little of seeing your ideal-self in Kimmy, as in "this is how I want to imagine I'd react/be this Unbreakable" in her appeal. That and Erin's charm.

I do think there's a pretty dark edge to Kimmy and the humor at times. The part where she wants to "take it to the next level" and thus immediately headlocks and begins to assault her partner before realizing that's not normal comes from a pretty f'ed up place if you think about it's implications.

Another part that stood out as too dark for network (and makes Kimmy more layered and beyond a 'sunshine brite' character) was when she becomes the spin guru's favorite acolyte, and when confronted by Jaqueline turns it on her and immediately begins to control and ritually humiliate Jaqueline (by forcing her to drink the sweat rung from her hair). Again, the implications of where she learned/observed that as an interaction goes pretty dark.

I do think they went to buffoonish with the Reverend, which takes away some of that. It was good he was 'charismatic' (as Hamm can do). I think they could have afforded to put a LITTLE more Don Draper menace into the charm, and play the trial a little more as dark comedy than they did.

Edited March 21, 2015 by pon teeve

[swimmyfish]

I do think they went to buffoonish with the Reverend, which takes away some of that. It was good he was 'charismatic' (as Hamm can do). I think they could have afforded to put a LITTLE more Don Draper menace into the charm, and play the trial a little more as dark comedy than they did.

 

I completely agree. I really didn't like the trial episodes at all - or, at least, the parts that didn't feature Kimmy and Titus. But making the Reverend so cartoonish reminded me of a review I read of The Interview that made the point that all of the belittling and jokes about Kim Jong-Un in the film actually sort of humanized him, in addition to making light of the terrible atrocities he's committed. I mean, I do understand this is a sitcom, and ultimately they're going for jokes. But, before the reveal that Jon Hamm was the Reverend, I was mentally picturing the guy who played Don Geiss on 30 Rock in the role - he's charismatic and compelling, but also convincingly intimidating.

 

Additionally, I really didn't like how incompetent the lawyers were. For one thing, while I did expect that Kimmy would ultimately make waffles, it truly bothered me that the Reverend might have gotten off. But for another, the premise of this show is that everyone - with the obvious exception of the Reverend - is trying hard to do their best. That the show could be kind to its characters - particularly Jacqueline - but then so cruel to real people struck a very sour note to me.

 

However, while I didn't care for the trial part, I did really like the series; now that the trial has concluded and we are presumably done with the Reverend, the lawyer, and Kimmy's step-father (hooo, man - that character was a real dud) I'm really looking forward to season 2! I hope that we continue to see the other mole women from time to time, and that the guy from the credits sticks around - his story seems interesting in and of itself, not just as a warning to Titus. Also, I want Xanthippe to come back! Mostly, I guess I like the majority of the characters and want to spend more time with them.