Hallmark Movies: Small Town Royalty Magically Celebrating Rekindled Love! - General Discussion

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Happywatcher said:

But ABC Disney will maybe peel off some family viewers back to the train wreck ABC Family and Disney channels--which is the point of them attacking Hallmark. We ended up watching the Descendants movies with some teens. I would never allow a preteen to watch Disney now, they are really bad

Huh? I’ve been following this since the beginning and The New York Times and pissed off people are the ones driving this story. This began to take off late Friday and ABC, along with most other news sources, didn’t start covering it until this morning. SNL addressed it before most of the news channels. 

Edited December 16, 2019 by Guest

[JAYJAY1979]

It's fascinating that both Ashley and Kimberly Williams smile too much.. yet I enjoy watching K. Williams in movies/tv shows... and I don't Ashley..hmmm.

Hallmark Channel has been like this for the last several years.  I had made peace with the fact that diversity was low on their list, but I was at least hoping for some diversity in movie content at least.  Not the same rinse, lather, and repeat that's been going on for the last five to six years.

[Kaoteek]

Eh, everybody has his favorites and least favorites : I happen to enjoy Ashley Williams, but on the other hand, I strongly dislike Meredith Hagner, which is a fan-fav around these parts. CCB is a no-go. Ashley's sister, Kimberly, I'm pretty indifferent to, and year after year, the more her speech and acting mannerisms get noticeable, the less I like Alicia Witt. To each their own, I guess.

[In2You]

2 hours ago, twoods said:

This is also the final straw for me with Hallmark. I’ve stopped DVRing the new movies and will stick to Lifetime, UP and ION for my holiday movie fix. I’m glad that some stars are speaking up because having this much outcry over one commercial is ridiculous. There are half clothed women in some commercials but that’s okay for the kids to watch? Blah.

I don't understand the conservatives rational about the children to begin with because these romance movies are too damn boring for children to watch. The kids see more action on the channel catering to them! I really haven't watch Hallmark closely in a few years so this is no loss to me. I've mainly been tuning in to Lifetime, UP, and ION for Christmas movies.

[oakville]

9 hours ago, PennyPlain said:

Absolutely true. I don't watch Hallmark channel but I do watch Hallmark movies at Christmas because they air on the W channel here.  W as in women's network which is not a channel I associate with conservative "christian" values.   They air these movies because they appeal to many women (and some men too I guess) not because they are catering to the million bigoted moms.

I live in Canada and watch the Hallmark movies on the W Channel. I thought they did have a few Christmas movies that featured same sex couples. Is it possible that they were airing Lifetime Christmas movies ? I am confused.  I know that the Bank of Montreal has aired commercials with same sex couples on the W channel.

[formerlyfreedom]

Just a reminder; the entire Hallmark/Lola commercials situation is appropriate to be discussed in this topic, and most of the posts have been fine; however, the site’s ‘Politics & Primetimer’ policy is still in effect. Posts that bring in politics will be removed. If you have any questions, please PM the forum mods, @Athena and @saoirse. Please remember discussion of mod actions is not allowed in topic. Thank you!

[doodlebug]

6 hours ago, DanaMB said:

They probably don’t know. I didn’t know about those actors until this post. 
Now I’m wondering how these actors feel about what is going on. 

I'm sure the gay actors don't like it, but, most actors are not independently wealthy and they've got themselves and maybe families to support.  I don't blame any actor, gay or straight, for taking a role in a crummy Hallmark movie to pay the bills.

Tonight's evening news had a story about the Million Moms.  They issued a statement chastising Hallmark for promoting the 'LGBTQ Agenda' for airing the Zola commercial which, BTW, for those who haven't seen it, shows a lesbian couple getting married and kissing at the end of the ceremony.  You know, like married couples do at their wedding.  So, apparently, even acknowledging that same sex couples exist and get legally married is promoting an 'agenda'.  Because the world was so much better when everyone pretended that gay people didn't exist and they didn't have the legal right to live as they wished.  There is definitely an agenda here, but it ain't LGBTQ.

[Kaoteek]

Then again, when Itsawonderfulmovie, the leading page for Hallmark (and other networks) Christmas movies, news and stuff, is openly warning its readers whenever a gay couple or anything considered untoward appears in a movie, one can't really be surprised with such pseudo-controversies.

[In2You]

10 minutes ago, Kaoteek said:

Then again, when Itsawonderfulmovie, the leading page for Hallmark (and other networks) Christmas movies, news and stuff, is openly warning its readers whenever a gay couple or anything considered untoward appears in a movie, one can't really be surprised with such pseudo-controversies.

A couple of years ago UP had a movie where the girl was trying so hard to form a relationship with a guy with the intent of getting married so she could take over her family's company. Well the guy revealed he wasn't that into her because he was gay. The folks at ItsaWonderfulMovie threw a fit saying the movie wasn't family friendly. The way they ranted you would've thought the movie had a gay love scene.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, In2You said:

A couple of years ago UP had a movie where the girl was trying so hard to form a relationship with a guy with the intent of getting married so she could take over her family's company. Well the guy revealed he wasn't that into her because he was gay. The folks at ItsaWonderfulMovie threw a fit saying the movie wasn't family friendly. The way they ranted you would've thought the movie had a gay love scene.

Married by Christmas. I just watched that movie last week. I loved it. If anything made that movie not family friendly it’s the fact the lead’s family was awful to her. I’d much rather have the gay guy in my family then her selfish sister. 

Out of curiosity does It’s a Wonderful Movie ever actually review any movies? Every time I end up there it says the review and recommendation are coming soon. Snow Bride...coming soon. Trading Christmas...coming soon.  

Do they even watch the movies or just keep track of the schedule and collect ad revenue?

Edited December 16, 2019 by Guest

[In2You]

7 minutes ago, Dani said:

Married by Christmas. I just watched that movie last week. I loved it. If anything made that movie not family friendly it’s the fact the lead’s family was awful to her. I’d much rather have the gay guy in my family then her selfish sister. 

Out of curiosity does It’s a Wonderful Movie ever actually review any movies? Every time I end up there it says the review and recommendation are coming soon. Snow Bride...coming soon. Trading Christmas...coming soon.  

Do they even watch the movies or just keep track of the schedule and collect ad revenue?

Yes, her sister was a bitch. Wasn't even interested in the family company until she heard about that marriage stipulation and decided to take it away from her sister.

I don't visit the site anymore. Stopped visiting it when I noticed how hateful they were to gays and dismissive of POC. However they used to do reviews but then stopped doing them. Like you said they mostly just keep track of the schedule, collect ad revenue, and collect revenue from affiliate links. 

Edited December 16, 2019 by In2You

[Veronica]

Hallmark reversing course  CEO apologizing for pulling ad. 

[Pickles]

CNN is reporting Hallmark has changed course and reversed their decision. 

[kirinan]

So Hallmark has rethought its stand, it appears.

[msani19]

Well that was fast enough to give us whiplash. I can only imagine the intense meetings that the executives must have had all day today to manage the disaster that they self-created. The money they saw they stood to lose must have outweighed the faux-outrage over the Zola ad. 

What stands in sharp contrast to me is that the posters in this thread alone have noted how lacking Hallmark movies have been for YEARS. Whether they decided to pull the ad or not, it was apparent that the network was making a conscious decision to maintain the very specific view which did not include any people of any color nor LGBTQ characters...dare I say an "agenda" even? 

I've heard of this million moms group before, I think they got mad at Ellen some years ago. It has nowhere near 1 million of anything, so way to cave to them, real brave.

[Guest]

33 minutes ago, Veronica said:

Hallmark reversing course  CEO apologizing for pulling ad. 

That’s good but it’s going to take a lot more than that to change my opinion of Hallmark. I might watch one or two of their upcoming movies but their feel good image has taken a huge hit in my eyes over the last year. 

Edited December 16, 2019 by Guest

[dubstepford wife]

This channel is such a clusterf*ck lately.  And by "lately" I mean like, the last four years.  

They want it both ways.  Their base is evangelical Christians and they know it, which is why they pulled the ad, but they also don't want to risk their already dwindling viewership numbers shrinking even more by alienating those who believe in inclusivity.  So they hide behind their excuses of "we avoid controversy" and "we *want* to have diverse roles, it's just that the scripts aren't there...it's the writers fault, blame them!"  

Except that it's 2019.  Almost 2020.  You don't get away with stuff like this anymore.  Especially not when your position as "the Christmas movie" channel was already under assault by Netflix and other channels, which are now doing the same thing, but better.  And minus the bigotry.  

[Jaded]

I'll believe they've changed their position when I see actual change in their movies and not scheduling the few non white majority cast movies differently then they would their usual ones.

[Guest]

Hallmark CEO Apologizes After Removing Zola's Same-Sex Commercials: "This Was the Wrong Decision"

I find a few things about the official statement interesting. One is that it came from the CEO and President of Hallmark Cards Inc and not the CEO of Crown Media. Also the language indicates they are trying to separate Hallmark from Crown Media. It’s what I expected and if they’re smart Bill Abbott will be shown the door shortly. Now let’s see if they are actually committed to improving or if this is just blowing smoke. 
ETA the full statement posted to Hallmark’s Facebook. 

Quote

Earlier this week, a decision was made at Crown Media Family Networks to remove commercials featuring a same-sex couple.

“The Crown Media team has been agonizing over this decision as we’ve seen the hurt it has unintentionally caused. Said simply, they believe this was the wrong decision. Our mission is rooted in helping all people connect, celebrate traditions, and be inspired to capture meaningful moments in their lives. Anything that detracts from this purpose is not who we are. We are truly sorry  for the hurt and disappointment this has caused.” said Mike Perry, President and CEO, Hallmark Cards, Inc.

Hallmark is, and always has been, committed to diversity and inclusion – both in our workplace as well as the products and experiences we create. It is never Hallmark’s intention to be divisive or generate controversy. We are an inclusive company and have a track record to prove it. We have LGBTQ greeting cards and feature LGBTQ couples in commercials. We have been recognized as one of the Human Rights Campaigns Best Places to Work, and as one of Forbes America’s Best Employers for Diversity. We have been a progressive pioneer on television for decades – telling wide ranging stories that elevate the human spirit such as August Wilson’s The Piano Lesson and Colm Tóibín’s The Blackwater Lightship, both of which highlight the importance of tolerance and understanding.

Hallmark will be working with GLAAD to better represent the LGBTQ community across our portfolio of brands. The Hallmark Channel will be reaching out to Zola to reestablish our partnership and reinstate the commercials.

“Across our brand, we will continue to look for ways to be more inclusive and celebrate our differences.” Perry said.

Edited December 16, 2019 by Guest

[BlackberryJam]

The “Million Moms” website had under 29k supporting the letter to Hallmark against LGBTQ ads. 

I don’t watch the Christmas films. To sappy, formulaic and terrible acting. I do watch the Mysteries and was looking forward to the Jeff Jackson series because I enjoyed the books. So happy I don’t have to stick up for my principles 🙂

[Bronx Babe]

12 hours ago, Direwolf said:

Ashley Williams??

Thank you, @Direwolf, that's the one.  That smile is frightening, reminds me of the title character in the horror movie Mr. Sardonicus!

 

5 hours ago, Happywatcher said:

Ashley Williams. I carefully watched the Lights movie because I really wanted to know why her character was wearing Navy Aviator wings. No explanation was given

Thanks, @Happywatcher -- nothing makes much sense in these movies, lol.

 

5 hours ago, MerBearHou said:

Agreed 1000% — Ashley Williams’ manic, huge non-stop smiling is a no-go for me as well.  She is far too saccharine for me.

I'm telling you, that smile scares the hell out of me.

[msani19]

3 minutes ago, Bronx Babe said:

I'm telling you, that smile scares the hell out of me.

Like she's secretly plotting "how to murder you and dispose of the body so no one will ever find" it scary?

Her movies can lay of the cute a little heavy, I generally don't have problems with her. I might be more interested in watching her movies though, if it then becomes the"how will she kill this character". Like every time we she her smile, we have to come up with the disturbing murder scenario she's concocting in her head. 

[IWantCandy71]

I don't have a problem with Hallmark removing the ad, and I wish they would have stuck with the decision. It's far more disturbing to me that they now look wishy washy all because of a group that bullied them because they didn't like what they did.

Bottom line, people have different morals. If you don't like what a channel does, turn it off. But they have equal rights to express those beliefs and shouldn't be bullied, and they don't owe anyone on the face of the earth, an explanation as to why they do what they do. Bullying someone on social media and spewing hate just because they don't agree with you, just makes YOU look like....a whiny bully throwing a fit because you didn't get your way.

It ain't a great look. If your "morals" can bend just because someone on the opposite side has a hissy fit, they aren't very strong morals, are they ?

I have gay friends, but I am a Christian, and they know where I stand. I love them to death and would do anything for them in a heartbeat if I could. I would die for them, if I ever had to for any reason. I am not a "homophobe", nor am I "bigoted" or a "hatemonger".

But I'll never, ever apologize for how I believe. And I feel sorry for people who feel they have to. It's a shame.
 

But back to the Hallmark channel quality, which should be the topic-their Christmas movies have been wash, rinse and repeat for years now.

"The Most Wonderful Time of the Year" with Henry Winkler and Brooke Burns, is one of the best Christmas movies they've ever done.

[Bronx Babe]

A Cheerful Christmas, oh...my...God.

Normally I lap up anything cringeworthy, lol, but even for me this was just too, too awful.   After twenty minutes I was yelling at the t.v. screen "Please make it STOP!!"  

So I turned it off.   I was that embarrassed!

[Irlandesa]

34 minutes ago, BlackberryJam said:

The “Million Moms” website had under 29k supporting the letter to Hallmark against LGBTQ ads.

There was already a protest started about a week ago when someone at Hallmark mentioned potentially having a gay couple in one of their movies and it gained very little traction.  This probably would have not made a blip either had Hallmark not capitulated. And because they capitulated, they actually created the controversy they claim they wanted to avoid.

That's why Hallmark made such a big mistake when they pulled the ads.  Their audience might feel more comfortable watching movies about white people and straight people but I believe the number who were actually going to stop watching over seeing a same sex couple in an ad were pretty small if they even actually paid attention to the ads.

[MerBearHou]

8 minutes ago, Bronx Babe said:

A Cheerful Christmas, oh...my...God.

Normally I lap up anything cringeworthy, lol, but even for me this was just too, too awful.   After twenty minutes I was yelling at the t.v. screen "Please make it STOP!!"  

So I turned it off.   I was that embarrassed!

I had the exact same impression and turned it off after 15 minutes.  Awful, awful!!  

[Bronx Babe]

15 minutes ago, msani19 said:

Like she's secretly plotting "how to murder you and dispose of the body so no one will ever find" it scary?

Her movies can lay of the cute a little heavy, I generally don't have problems with her. I might be more interested in watching her movies though, if it then becomes the"how will she kill this character". Like every time we she her smile, we have to come up with the disturbing murder scenario she's concocting in her head. 

@msani19, lol, yes.

[Crs97]

I am thrilled that the CEO of Hallmark cards stepped in to reverse the decision, and I hope he takes it further to green light movies that exemplify the inclusion he says the company values.  The fact that small group could bully the channel into removing ads that show nothing but joy and love is infuriating.  People who don’t like it can choose not to watch or can petition the religious channels to start making their own movies.  Hopefully the silver lining of this debacle is the CEO taking a serious look into the problems of the network and working to diversify their stories and casts.

Ashley Williams always strikes me as someone not fully comfortable in front of a camera.  Sometimes I think we get her maniacal smile because there isn’t a line for her to say and she doesn’t know what else to do.  I can’t believe no director has ever told her to stop it.  Does she watch herself on film?  How has no one told her to fix it?!?

[Bronx Babe]

6 minutes ago, MerBearHou said:

I had the exact same impression and turned it off after 15 minutes.  Awful, awful!!  

Wasn't it??  Glad I'm not the only one who had such a visceral reaction!  That sister who wound up doing the royal decorating -- I don't know the actress' name -- was a nightmare of perkiness.  I can imagine her and the creepily grinning Ashley Williams starring in an episode of Tales From The Darkside. 

[formerlyfreedom]

*tiny voice* I actually really like Ashley Williams. I also like Erin Krakow. But I can appreciate why some don't like them. Now I shall run away and hide from the fruit pelting. 😉

[Guest]

21 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

There was already a protest started about a week ago when someone at Hallmark mentioned potentially having a gay couple in one of their movies and it gained very little traction.  This probably would have not made a blip either had Hallmark not capitulated. And because they capitulated, they actually created the controversy they claim they wanted to avoid.

That's why Hallmark made such a big mistake when they pulled the ads.  Their audience might feel more comfortable watching movies about white people and straight people but I believe the number who were actually going to stop watching over seeing a same sex couple in an ad were pretty small if they even actually paid attention to the ads.

That was the Hollywood Reporter podcast with Crown Media CEO Bill Abbott. The ironic thing is that when you listen to the whole interview it is clear that he was just trying to placate the hosts who pushed him hard on the diversity question. Him saying they were “open to any type of movie and any type of relationship” was complete BS. So if Hallmark does become more LGBTQ friendly it will be a direct result of one million moms freaking out unnecessarily. 

[msani19]

An interesting aspect to the Hallmark changing their minds story is that Zola was ready yo pull ALL their advertising from the various channels. I mean their decision smacked more of a financial one than a principled stance, but the threat they must have faced was likely significant. 

They also have so much more competition from other networks, as has been mentioned. They were pioneers in this type of cheesy, saccharine Christmas movie fare. But as with all pioneers, you get eclipsed as newer and better brands get introduced. Hallmark was destined to decline whether or not they have gay characters looking at each other in a movie or not. 

If it's really that serious for these groups, as someone noted above, why not start their own channel - all white, hetero, 1950s gender roles movies which will not play any upsetting ads ever? Seems simple enough to me.

[IWantCandy71]

Except that race wasn't a part of the commericals, so there's no reason to even bring race up. Hallmark is mostly white people movies, true. But that's true of 99% of networks and shows. 

And yes it's true that any group who doesn't like the commercial, doesn't have to watch Hallmark, just like it would be true, if Hallmark chose to exclude the ads, that people who don't like that decision, wouldn't have to watch either. There are bullies on both sides, and that's a fact. 

Edited December 16, 2019 by IWantCandy71

[Bronx Babe]

1 hour ago, saoirse said:

*tiny voice* I actually really like Ashley Williams. I also like Erin Krakow. But I can appreciate why some don't like them. Now I shall run away and hide from the fruit pelting. 😉

No pelting from me.  Compared to most of them I think Ashley is a decent actress -- it's her perplexing and perpetual smile that overshadows everything else.

[Shorty186]

2 hours ago, IWantCandy71 said:

I don't have a problem with Hallmark removing the ad, and I wish they would have stuck with the decision. It's far more disturbing to me that they now look wishy washy all because of a group that bullied them because they didn't like what they did.

Bottom line, people have different morals. If you don't like what a channel does, turn it off. But they have equal rights to express those beliefs and shouldn't be bullied, and they don't owe anyone on the face of the earth, an explanation as to why they do what they do. Bullying someone on social media and spewing hate just because they don't agree with you, just makes YOU look like....a whiny bully throwing a fit because you didn't get your way.

Right, and in this case, the whiny bullies were One Million Moms. Hallmark had made the decision to air the Zola commercials. OMM freaked out and Hallmark caved and agreed to remove the ads. People tweeting or posting to Hallmark that they should be inclusive, especially around the holiday built around love and family that they dedicate SOOO much of their programming to, isn't bullying. 

People saying "let's treat everyone as equals and give them the respect that we would want ourselves" is never going to be the wrong thing to do. How people like OMM can defend what they are arguing for is "right" is beyond me. And I say this as a Catholic and Christian. Not sure why the heck it matters but apparently Christians feel the need to point out that we're Christian.

[DollEyes]

My verdict: not good. I've never watched any of the Hallmark Christmas movies because to me they're "SS,DA" ("Same Shit, Different Actors "). Since Hallmark is a private company,  they're entitled to their policies & their opinions, but they're not entitled to be protected from the legal consequences of them, whether it's getting dragged on social media or potential boycotts.

If Hallmark was serious about diversity, it not only would have happened a long time ago,  they never would have let OMM intimidate them in the first place. All Hallmark's actions have done for me is make me appreciate Lifetime & Netflix's Holiday movies even more. At least they know that interracial, LGBTQ+ & interfaith couples exist.

[Was-MArsenault]

Not surprising that Hallmark reversed course.

[DanaMB]

7 hours ago, dubstepford wife said:

So they hide behind their excuses of "we avoid controversy" and "we *want* to have diverse roles, it's just that the scripts aren't there...it's the writers fault, blame them!"  

Which in itself is bullshit as we all know. Lifetime Christmas movies often have POC as leads and interracial romances. It can be done Hallmark. 

Edited December 16, 2019 by DanaMB

[In2You]

4 hours ago, IWantCandy71 said:

Except that race wasn't a part of the commericals, so there's no reason to even bring race up. Hallmark is mostly white people movies, true. But that's true of 99% of networks and shows. 

And yes it's true that any group who doesn't like the commercial, doesn't have to watch Hallmark, just like it would be true, if Hallmark chose to exclude the ads, that people who don't like that decision, wouldn't have to watch either. There are bullies on both sides, and that's a fact. 

Its not bullying to want representation and love and respect shown during the holiday season. One Million Moms runs like a hate group under the guise of caring about the children.

[MissyPoo]

1 hour ago, Crs97 said:

Ashley Williams always strikes me as someone not fully comfortable in front of a camera.  Sometimes I think we get her maniacal smile because there isn’t a line for her to say and she doesn’t know what else to do.  I can’t believe no director has ever told her to stop it.  Does she watch herself on film?  How has no one told her to fix it?!?

This is still jarring to me because I first saw her in Montana Sky where she played a tough cowgirl who practically never smiled and kept people at a distance. I still think that's the best role I've seen her in. Good movie, too. She seemed way more comfortable playing that kind of character than the super-over-the-top-perky-quirky gal.

14 hours ago, Karen885 said:

Is Jessica Lowndes not part of the Hallmark stable of actresses anymore? She is in a Christmas movie on lifetime this year and nothing on Hallmark.  She seemed like the new Hallmark darling for a while.

I thought so, too, but it looks like she's doing a concert special over there so still kind of connected via that avenue. After today, who knows if that will still be a thing.

13 hours ago, Jaded said:

I still haven't forgotten the scheduling shit they did with Tatyana Ali's Xmas movie last year that they didn't do with their other ones.

Exactly and neither have I. Which is why it tickled me to see that still got higher ratings compared to this year's premiere despite the scheduling shenanigans:

https://twitter.com/SleepyKittyPaw/status/1204795123533524996

They did something similar to Tamera's movie this year.

3 hours ago, In2You said:

I don't visit the site anymore. Stopped visiting it when I noticed how hateful they were to gays and dismissive of POC. However they used to do reviews but then stopped doing them. Like you said they mostly just keep track of the schedule, collect ad revenue, and collect revenue from affiliate links. 

Good to know this wasn't all in my mind. They were way more subtle about it years ago, but it pinged my WTFdar when they kept leaving out the POC actresses from polls and conversation even after they aired. When I asked about it, I was dismissed and it left a sour taste since then. Not surprised they've become more blatant about it recently. I prefer SKP's twitter which gives better coverage, news, and inclusive discussion without sugar coating things under the guise of niceness.

[IWantCandy71]

6 hours ago, Shorty186 said:

Right, and in this case, the whiny bullies were One Million Moms. Hallmark had made the decision to air the Zola commercials. OMM freaked out and Hallmark caved and agreed to remove the ads. People tweeting or posting to Hallmark that they should be inclusive, especially around the holiday built around love and family that they dedicate SOOO much of their programming to, isn't bullying. 

People saying "let's treat everyone as equals and give them the respect that we would want ourselves" is never going to be the wrong thing to do. How people like OMM can defend what they are arguing for is "right" is beyond me. And I say this as a Catholic and Christian. Not sure why the heck it matters but apparently Christians feel the need to point out that we're Christian.

People tweeting "Ban Hallmark" is a form of bullying to passively aggressively get what you want.People calling them names is a form of bullying. 

Ellen DeGeneres getting on Social media and saying Hallmark "owes an explanation" is a form of shaming and bullying. Hallmark owes an explanation to her ? Really ? She owns the network, then ? I didn't know that.

 Hallmark should be allowed to air what they want, and anyone who doesn't like it, doesn't have to agree, and they don't have to watch. No matter what the material is.

Removing the ad doesn't trample on anyone's rights. It isn't' a representative of diversity to remove it, but it doesn't impede on anyone's rights. Hallmark wasn't calling for the commerical to be eliminated from the entire world, nor was anyone that I know of, picketing that company over the commerical or anything else like that. It was a simple choice not to air it, that they then went back on, because they were bullied into not pulling it, just like they were bullied into pulling it.

I will add, that I don't particularly consider Hallmark to be a Christian channel. I don't know why anyone would. Just airing movies and shows that aren't full of violence and four letter words doesn't make you Christian. 

Bullies on BOTH ends. I know it's a shocking thought. But I know it's a fact, over and over again, on many issues, because I've seen it, repeatedly.

Agree to disagree.

2 hours ago, In2You said:

Its not bullying to want representation and love and respect shown during the holiday season. One Million Moms runs like a hate group under the guise of caring about the children.

IDK anything about One Million Moms, but ultimately, it was Hallmark's decision to pull the ad. I hold them responsible, and them alone, for the first pulling, and then for going back on it. People on BOTH ends were harassing them, but they should not have let them affect their decisions.

Edited December 16, 2019 by IWantCandy71

[doodlebug]

7 hours ago, Shorty186 said:

Right, and in this case, the whiny bullies were One Million Moms. Hallmark had made the decision to air the Zola commercials. OMM freaked out and Hallmark caved and agreed to remove the ads. People tweeting or posting to Hallmark that they should be inclusive, especially around the holiday built around love and family that they dedicate SOOO much of their programming to, isn't bullying. 

People saying "let's treat everyone as equals and give them the respect that we would want ourselves" is never going to be the wrong thing to do. How people like OMM can defend what they are arguing for is "right" is beyond me. And I say this as a Catholic and Christian. Not sure why the heck it matters but apparently Christians feel the need to point out that we're Christian.

I would like to like this one million times, also a Catholic/Christian.  That there are gay people in the world and that they are able to marry just as any couple can is a fact.  OMM can pretend to ignore that fact, but it doesn't make it any less true.   They were the bullies who decided that an innocuous TV commercial devoted to wedding planning for goodness' sakes, was somehow offensive.  They and others can try to pretend that it is still 1955 and shove all the gay people back into the closet, but there is no going back and, for me, anyway, the world is a better place when everyone is allowed to be who they really are.  If OMM don't approve of same sex marriage, then they shouldn't enter into one.  It's none of their P's and Q's if other people do and,I would suggest that they get used to it because I don't think that bell can be unrung.

BTW, Hallmark Channel has plenty of commercials where people are drinking liquor or dancing  or playing cards or otherwise doing things that certain groups feel are sinful,  Why aren't OMM protesting those?  After all, it's all sinful in their world. They need to protect themselves from it!  Think of the children!  Of course, if they had done that, they'd have been shot down without a question, so they went after the gays.  I'm glad Hallmark decided to do the right thing in the end.

Now, if only Hallmark Channel would do something about the quality of their movies.

Edited December 16, 2019 by doodlebug

[absnow54]

59 minutes ago, IWantCandy71 said:

IDK anything about One Million Moms, but ultimately, it was Hallmark's decision to pull the ad. I hold them responsible, and them alone, for the first pulling, and then for going back on it. People on BOTH ends were harassing them, but they should not have let them affect their decisions.

The Hallmark Channel is a business, and they depend on viewers to succeed. That's why they listen to responses on social media, because that publicity negatively impacts their business. They make decisions not because the internet hurt their feelings, they're making decisions because negative press hurts their bottom line. Telling people to "ban" something isn't bullying, it's using your buying power to influence a company to change course. That's how supply and demand works. They pulled the adds because they feared they were upsetting their primary viewership, but in catering to them, they realized there was a much larger viewership that they were losing.

[IWantCandy71]

5 minutes ago, absnow54 said:

The Hallmark Channel is a business, and they depend on viewers to succeed. That's why they listen to responses on social media, because that publicity negatively impacts their business. They make decisions not because the internet hurt their feelings, they're making decisions because negative press hurts their bottom line. Telling people to "ban" something isn't bullying, it's using your buying power to influence a company to change course. That's how supply and demand works. They pulled the adds because they feared they were upsetting their primary viewership, but in catering to them, they realized there was a much larger viewership that they were losing.

Banning something is totally a form of passive aggressive bullying. "I'm going to withhold something from you (my money or sponsorship) to get you to do what I want". That is bullying. 

Again, agree to disagree.

[PennyPlain]

36 minutes ago, IWantCandy71 said:

Banning something is totally a form of passive aggressive bullying. "I'm going to withhold something from you (my money or sponsorship) to get you to do what I want". That is bullying. 

What would you suggest someone do then if they disagree with a decision a company has made?  Remain passive and allow something to go without comment?  Let's face it that's what most of us actually do do.  We may stop watching a show or a channel or stop purchasing a product but we just do it.  It's only if a company or network or whatever eventually notices a decline in viewership or sales that they might connect the dots.  Letting them know upfront loud and clear where you feel they screwed up isn't bullying.  I'm not even sure I agree that what the million bigoted moms did was bullying.  Just because I don't agree with them doesn't mean they don't have a right to voice their opinion.  

Edited December 16, 2019 by PennyPlain

[izabella]

2 hours ago, IWantCandy71 said:

I will add, that I don't particularly consider Hallmark to be a Christian channel. I don't know why anyone would. Just airing movies and shows that aren't full of violence and four letter words doesn't make you Christian. 

That doesn't make it a Christian channel, but 24/7 Christmas movies all year long can give the impression they lean that way since Christmas is inherently Christian.

[IWantCandy71]

54 minutes ago, PennyPlain said:

What would you suggest someone do then if they disagree with a decision a company has made?  Remain passive and allow something to go without comment?  Let's face it that's what most of us actually do do.  We may stop watching a show or a channel or stop purchasing a product but we just do it.  It's only if a company or network or whatever eventually notices a decline in viewership or sales that they might connect the dots.  Letting them know upfront loud and clear where you feel they screwed up isn't bullying.  I'm not even sure I agree that what the million bigoted moms did was bullying.  Just because I don't agree with them doesn't mean they don't have a right to voice their opinion.  

If a true social injustice was being done, speak up. There was no social injustice. If you have a problem with Hallmark running the ad, don't watch. If you have a problem with Hallmark removing the ad, don't watch. Problem solved without either side acting morally superior.

[BlackberryJam]

Hallmark isn't a sad teenager who wore a weird outfit to school. It's a company whose goal is to make money. It's goal is not to spread love and cheer. It's not to teach life lessons. It's not to teach morality. They just want to make fat stacks of cash, like every other business. Companies aren't emotionally vulnerable at at risk of psychological harm.

Pointing out their poor decision making and calling for a ban is not bullying. OMM said to Hallmark, "If you continue to run this ad that we find offensive, we aren't going to give you our entertainment dollars." By calling themselves One Million Moms, Hallmark thought they'd be losing a large chunk of viewers.

But this is 2019 and more people are going to deny their entertainment dollars to something they perceive as bigoted than there are people going to do so because of the bigoted action. To put it more simply, and the way Hallmark saw it, they were going to lose more viewers by refusing to air same sex ads than they were by airing them. It's math. 

Social media was used to point that out to Hallmark. How else were they going to know? It would take a year of falling ratings before they'd ever know.

But it's right to call out bigotry and prejudice. I prefer my entertainment dollars to not go to an organization or person I don't morally support. I don't watch Johnny Depp movies. I refuse to watch the Usual Suspects. I also don't have time to research everything. I wouldn't have known about Hallmark choosing to appease bigotry if not for the social media outcry. 

Keeping silent helps no one but perpetrators.

[absnow54]

1 minute ago, izabella said:

That doesn't make it a Christian channel, but 24/7 Christmas movies all year long can give the impression they lean that way since Christmas is inherently Christian.

To be fair, how many of these Christmas movies include the word "Jesus" in them. Hallmark seems to only celebrate the non-religious commercial side of the holiday. 

5 minutes ago, IWantCandy71 said:

If a true social injustice was being done, speak up. There was no social injustice. If you have a problem with Hallmark running the ad, don't watch. If you have a problem with Hallmark removing the ad, don't watch. Problem solved without either side acting morally superior.

Some consider censoring a commercial including a same sex couple and marriage to be a social injustice, and therefore felt the need to speak up.

[Aliconehead]

I also think one of the reasons Hallmark reversed course is that they could have lost a lot of the actors.  Hilarie Burton has very specific demands that they have been unwilling to meet (a gay couple and an interracial couple). Other actors that have more opportunities might also jump ship if the decision was maintained.  Ali Leibert was in a Lifetime movie and Luke MacFarlane could potentially move (I would follow his eye candyness). Jonathan Bennett has a bunch of other projects in process.  Plus if some of there better known stars jump also or refuse to go to the meet and greets it would be a problem.