S03.E05: The Secret Origin Of Felicity Smoak

[Chaser]

It certainly looks like the episode blew up twitter…Hope thats a good sign for the ratings.

[shapeshifter]

...Still curious about who the father is, since he was brought up so much, and is suppose to be where Felicity got her smarts from....

Could boss Ray be her half brother? 'Cause, ya know, that's how they roll on Arrow.

...Cooper, you know how great Felicity is at hacking, so you leave her in front of the computer when you and your minions wait for the armored car....

A comic book trope if ever there was one, but Felicity puts the F in feminist girl ass-kicking and brain power, so it is permitted.

[Artsda]

Loved Felicity saving herself and just all the Felicity in this episode. Loved her momma and the back story. I kind of loved the vampy lipstick, she should bring that back.  Her apartment was also great.

 

Diggie's comment on who the baby would tell was hilarious. That entire scene starting with Oliver walking in on Momma and Felicty was all types of win.

 

I fast forwarded the Laurel, only watched the one scene because it included her dad where she ordered a swat team and messed up like normal. How she's DA, is ridiculous. How she has a law degree is just not believable.

 

Love Thea's new apartment. 

 

So Roy killed Sarah, he's brainwashed and doesn't remember, interesting choice of a killer. I guess question is now, how did he get brainwashed. 

 

I like Ray, he brings some humor and light to all the depressing and dark in Felicity's world and on the show. 

[NumberCruncher]

The Secret Origin of Felicity Smoak Recap

 

http://prattschris.tumblr.com/post/101903403230

I literally cackled...

[Chaser]

The best recap. Bar none. 

[BkWurm1]

I wondered if now that he knows Malcolm is alive and believes that Thea doesn't, that as well as wanting to keep her close as family, he also thinks he can protect her from Malcolm if they live together.

Thea does officially know Malcolm is alive. Oliver told her after he found out but Thea has been playing it that since he hasn't contacted her yet, he's not going to.

[Lady Calypso]

Amazing episode. I truly think the show does better when they are allowed to have light hearted moments. Also, Felicity Smoak and Mama Smoak. Lots and lots of Smoak. This is the only time I will ever condone smoaking. (Heh, I'm so clever).

 

I really do love Oliver/Felicity moments. I've missed them a whole lot and I love when Oliver does slip up. That being said, there is something missing in their interactions now, but I can buy that it's because of what happened in the premiere episode and they're in an 'awkward' in between stage. But Oliver listening to Felicity, while still managing to make some of it about himself, actually worked well to help Oliver grow. He did seem concerned and I love how he was immediately concerned when Felicity didn't come back after an hour and immediately got Diggle to call in ARGUS. Also, Sara being in the lair and Oliver immediately being concerned was hilarious. It's almost like it was right out of a fan's head, or out of a fanfiction. "Who's she gonna tell, Oliver?". Seriously, I didn't know I wanted this moment to happen until it happened. 

 

Mama Smoak is simply amazing. She was a bit too quirky in her first scene, but I fell in love with her by the end. Lots of layers, lots of family drama and a lot of recollection. Please come back, Mama Smoak. And if you happen to hook up with Quentin, I won't complain. It'll just be funny if Laurel loses Oliver to another 'sister' again. Speaking of Laurel, I honestly find it better when she's, you know, not in any scenes. She takes me out of the show. Her 'black. Definitely black' bothered me because it's the show speaking directly to us and it's annoying. Also, Ted is the worst character I've seen on this show yet and his actor is so wooden, I get why he's paired with Katie Cassidy. Let them just only have scenes with each other. And one scene every fifth episode would be fine, if we have to have them. 

 

Ray's creepy as hell. I love Brandon Routh, but Ray's getting creepier. I like how he's there for Felicity and all, but dude, be less creepy. Also, the emotional moments must be saved up for Oliver. As long as Ray and Felicity just stay friends, then I'll be happy. 

 

The last scene must be a red herring of some sort. I found it weird that Roy was throwing the arrows, so I do think it's entirely possible that it's him flashing back to killing that cop. I'm pretty sure he had punched the guy a few times, right? I do love how they have been building up to this since episode 2, though. I thought it was weird that Roy was more subdued and mature and stuff. I just thought it was because of Thea or something, but it's nice to see that there is a reason for Roy's change. 

 

Thea's scenes with Oliver were decent enough. I like how Oliver finally met her halfway, even if he's not thrilled with the apartment being connected to Malcolm. I get why he's so concerned, but it is Thea's choice ultimately. 

The Felicity flashbacks were great; EBR looks great as a brunette/dark haired female. Even the cliche of her looking entirely different five years ago didn't bug me.

[Chaser]

"It chimes on the hour. And apparently when we die." - Felicity got more then just her mothers strength 

Edited November 6, 2014 by 10Eleven12

[Password]

Oh my gosh the prattchris recap is the best one yet!!!!!

 

 

I literally cackled...

 

This is the best one! It made me crack up because it's soooooo accurate. Even the intensely creepy look on his face matches the words precisely.

[calliope1975]

Ray has total crazy eyes. I've noticed it in several scenes. Is this a BR thing or Ray specific? (I haven't noticed it in other work, but I can say I'm a big BR fangirl.)

[Jediknight]

Best of all, Ollie finally got that stick out of his butt, and allowed himself to be fun again.  Loved his scenes with Donna, and actually being supportive of Felicity, and not being a dick like normal (this season).  Stephen Amell seemed to be having fun, which was a plus.

Oliver has massive PTSD issues, but it's not Laurel, Thea, or even Moira or Tommy that get him to open up, and smile.  The ones that get Oliver to do that, are Diggle, Felicity, and even Roy.  I love that about this show, with those 3 Oliver is a completely different person and gets to be happy once in a while.

Edited November 6, 2014 by Jediknight

[El Seed]

The Felicity flashbacks were great; EBR looks great as a brunette/dark haired female. Even the cliche of her looking entirely different five years ago didn't bug me.

 

 

IMO it's entirely appropriate for college age Felicity to look different. Just about everyone I knew in college experimented with their appearance to some degree, whether it was small changes or big ones. I actually find the idea that she should have looked the same to be more strange.

 

Unpopular opinion, but I don't find Ray creepy or stalkerish at all. He comes across as really focused on and enthused about his ideas and projects that social niceties are forgotten or come second place. Intense? Sure. Pushy? Yep. Creepy? I'm not seeing it.

[fantique]

These 2 caps just made me LOL

 

 

All laughs and jokes aside, something just hit me you guys.

In light of finding out that her previous love might as well have committed suicide for being too committed to his cause, imagine the horror of Oliver choosing to do the same in a more passive and drawn out manner. She already lived through that once and she refused to go through that again and that's good storytelling on the writers' part. That's on point for me.

 

PS: I actually think that, while it makes me laugh when people call him a stalker, Ray isn't that bad (once I got over the 50 shades business move). I just think he is that "business all day everyday" guy who just does not care for anything but results. Mixed with a scientifically curious mind and inventor status it's pretty likely that he would be that type of boundary pushing freight train. He just wants to get things done and niceties and other social concepts get in the way of getting to work.

Edited November 6, 2014 by fantique

[SleepDeprived]

God, this episode! It feels like it's been way too long since an Arrow episode gave me so many feels that are not at all bitter or filled with exasperation. Hi, Show, I have missed you so!

 

 

This is the kind of show that I've been hoping Season 3 would be more like. Team Arrow crime-fighting as a unit, a good balance of dramatic and lighter moments, great character development... I didn't even mind Laurel's scenes too much, aside from the cursed plotline of NOT TELLING QUENTIN THE THING!

 

I don't think I can express any better what everyone else has already said about the absolute adoration I am feeling for Felicity. Or the newfound love I have for Mama Smoak. Please, can we keep her? I actually caught myself brushing tears off my cheeks when she and Felicity had their fight. Both women feeling like they were never enough for each other... I felt for both of them so much in that scene.

 

And Oliver! You angst-ridden, pining, lovesick, thoughtful, sweet, lovely man, you. As much as I loved him indirectly telling Felicity that he's in love with her, I think my favorite scene of his was when he told her to go be with her mother. And, of course, him and Diggle meeting Mama Smoak. And telling Digg that the Digglette can't go down the basement (Diggle continues to give the best reaction shots). And being a pretty good brother to Thea. Okay, I just loved Oliver in this episode. I missed this dude.

 

I'm worried that Thea is playing Oliver off of Malcolm's advice/influence and that she might be complicit in any nefarious plans that Malcolm is planning. I need the Queen siblings to please be a united front and have lots of brother-sister moments. Queen family feels is third only to Team Arrow feels and Felicity/Oliver feels, for me.

 

I'm with everyone else on Roy being a red herring as the perpetrator of the unnecessary fridging plot. I do believe his mind is juxtaposing his actual murder of a cop, while Roy-ded out with Mirakuru, to the murder of Black Canary. Also, I'm still leery of Ray. He's a great boss for letting Felicity have so many days off (how I'd love to have a boss like that, minus the stalker-vibe). But something's not exactly clicking for me.

 

Anyway, this episode was just lovely. Definitely going to be a favorite of mine and will be rewatched multiple times. Felicity Smoak is a freaking superhero and I will fight anyone who says, otherwise.

[twoods]

I like Ray. I don't see him as stalkerish and he seems as awkward as Felicity. I like their working relationship now.

More Smoak family please. Felicity's mom was awesome. The Oliver/Felicity scenes gutted me. It's like the show likes my heart feeling as if it's thrown against the wall. I just want those two crazy kids to be happy.

They better not make Roy Sarah's killer. He was so badass with his arrows.

Please can someone tell Quentin about Sarah? It's not fair for him to be left in the dark.

Loved how team a Arrow got up Felicity seconds after she sent the message. Got to love warped speed in Starling City. Same with Felicity's inappropriate strappy and peek a boob dresses disappearing so she can make her "you're not happy with my no cleavage outfits" to her mom.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

This episode definitely had the intended effect of making me love Felicity even more. First on a super shallow note, she looked hot. I am a straight girl and even I was admiring her ass in those pajamas. Even though I wasn't crazy about the goth hacker cliche, her eyes looked so amazing with the black hair and all the eyeliner. Hotness aside, I loved that this episode gave us so much more insight into Felicity. It's not surprising that she has mom issues. It's pretty common so I didn't mind that either. What I liked is that in her day to day life in Starling City, you wouldn't guess her mom issues or her college boyfriend went to prison and committed suicide issues because she is very focused and professional but bring her mom into the picture and she emotionally regresses to being a kid again, frustrated and embarrassed by her mom. Seeing her in the context of her mom and her ex-boyfriend gave her more depth so that she isn't just the smart girl who is in love with Oliver.

 

I freaking love Charlotte Ross. I first saw her as Evie the singing hooker on Days of Our Lives. I even watched The Heights because of her! I love seeing her pop up on shows (as Quinn's mom on Glee and as a regular on Hit the Floor which is cheesetastically awful). I hope we get to see Donna again, especially now that she and Felicity have mended fences.

 

Ha, I loved the look on Oliver's face when Felicity said that Donna was her mother. Also hilarious: the look on Diggle's face when he got the same information.

 

While I understand Oliver saying he doesn't feel comfortable having a baby in the Team Arrow Lair, conveniently located under an abandoned club, I was with Diggle. She is like, how many days old? She isn't going to remember any of this so I think it's okay for her to come downstairs for a few hours while they try to save the city again.

 

The footage of Laurel in the boxing ring was hilariously bad but I'm guessing that's intentional so we can see her progress as her training continues. I have no interest in that storyline at all (maybe I've seen too many training montages) but I know it's inevitable so I'm somewhat resigned to it.

 

What really annoyed me (aside from Laurel getting snippy with the cop who had the audacity not to know that the DA is out of town which automatically put Laurel in charge) was that she said no one else knows Sara is dead. That is a total lie, missie! Oliver, Diggle, Felicity, and Roy all know that Sara is dead. While Sara wasn't their blood sister, that doesn't mean they don't exist or that their grief isn't as worthy as Laurel's. For her to say that no one else knows is totally dismissive of their relationships with Sara, especially Oliver's. Secondly, telling some guy you barely know that NO ONE knows your sister is dead and you can't tell anyone sounds sooooooo shady. If someone I just met told me that, I would be giving them some serious side eye and wondering if you killed your sister and that's why you can't tell anyone.

[looptab]

Although the plot was a bit predictable, I liked this episode a lot. It had all the interactions I've been missing, and the scene where Mama Smoak meets Oliver and Diggle was golden :)

I don't mind Ray, I didn't even mind him showing up at Felicity's, cause he's just the kind of guy that thinks something and acts on it: he had that idea about the power and just showed up at her home to share it with her. (it was a set-up to provide the McGuffin, but let's just ignore that). He surely is the most tolerant boss ever!

I even liked Laurel, because finally all her craziness from previous episodes seems like it has a purpose, and her last scene with Ted Grant was good, and felt true (aside from that damn heavy-handed remark about the BLACK robe, at least I hope that means she'll stare at that in her downtime instead of at Sara's jacket).

Goth Felicity was fun, and that scene when she's visiting Cooper in jail made me tear up..

Overall the episode conveyed the feeling that Felicity was on the edge, and I liked how supportive the Team and Oliver have been, it's been a nice reversal of roles.

One thing that pulled me out of the show a bit was the timeline of Mama Smoak movements: she's at the club, but when Thea's there she's nowhere to be seen, then she appears at QC saying she has waited countless hours at the club first and then at the apartment, and Baby Sara was supposed to be with her the whole time (then where did she left her while she was confronting Felicity?). I laughed out loud at ARGUS agents picking up Sara and babysitting. That bit about the baby made no sense lol.

[Chaser]

I couldn't figure out what about Roy was stopping me from really taking him seriously, but it finally hit me. Roy is Small. He is like Fun-Size. Add the baggy hood from the costume and he is like a Pop Doll shooting little toy arrows with his itty-bitty arms.

[doesntworkonwood]

AHH!!!! I absolutely loved that episode, it went beyond all of my wildest imaginations. 

 

I loved Donna's first scene, it started off like a sitcom, and what I would do for one starring Felicity and Mama Smoak. 'The Smoaks' maybe?

 

I loved how they were able to make Donna such a layered character, and her relationship with Felicity so interesting, in such a short amount of time. 

 

I loved the Diggle scenes, every single one of them, from when he was carrying baby Sarah down the street to when he was in his mask with his guns. One correction, if we are going to give Diggle a mask (and we really should), it should be an eye mask, like Oliver and Roys, purely because I;m a massive sucker for DR's dimples. 

 

Admittedly, I did skip some parts, but the rest of the episode flowed really well, and felt super comfortable. I hope that tone carries on through the rest of season 3. 

 

I think EBR did a really good job, especially during the prison scene. It was probably the best she's done so far. 

Edited November 6, 2014 by doesntworkonwood

[Humbugged]

Loved Felicity saving herself and just all the Felicity in this episode. Loved her momma and the back story. I kind of loved the vampy lipstick, she should bring that back.  Her apartment was also great.

 

Diggie's comment on who the baby would tell was hilarious. That entire scene starting with Oliver walking in on Momma and Felicty was all types of win.

 

I fast forwarded the Laurel, only watched the one scene because it included her dad where she ordered a swat team and messed up like normal. How she's DA, is ridiculous. How she has a law degree is just not believable.

 

Love Thea's new apartment. 

 

So Roy killed Sarah, he's brainwashed and doesn't remember, interesting choice of a killer. I guess question is now, how did he get brainwashed. 

 

I like Ray, he brings some humor and light to all the depressing and dark in Felicity's world and on the show. 

 

Nobody commenting on the Robin Hood poster on the wall ? And she has @s as bookends (of course she does).But I didn't see any computer stuff .

 

Ray turning up doesn't bother me as they seem to be playing it as socially inept genius is socially inept .He has an idea and has to get it out and Felicity penance for getting the big office,being able to hack Dbases in front of him for randoms who phone her at work ,probably really well paid and apparently flexi time at work that would make a politician envious is to put up with his brain wave ideas that he just has to get out straight away .Hate to compare it to the opposition but they are trying to have her be the Pepper to his Tony.

[Morrigan2575]

Ray turning up doesn't bother me as they seem to be playing it as socially inept genius is socially inept .He has an idea and has to get it out and Felicity penance for getting the big office,being able to hack Dbases in front of him for randoms who phone her at work ,probably really well paid and apparently flexi time at work that would make a politician envious is to put up with his brain wave ideas that he just has to get out straight away .Hate to compare it to the opposition but they are trying to have her be the Pepper to his Tony.

That's what I'm getting from the character as well.

[Pothunter]

Much as I liked this episode, and everything Smoak, Diggle and Oliver, I was annoyed by the crying. It was fine in places, but I expected something more during the tied-to-chairs scene.

Edited November 6, 2014 by Pothunter

[ostentatious]

Yeah, I continue to like Ray. Nothing he has done has bothered me. It helps that there is no sexual undercurrent to it. I assume he is going to become attracted to her, though, and this behavior must not overlap with that.

How can Roy be mixing up the two murders in his mind when his mind repeated the dialogue we saw when Sara was killed? "Hello, Sara"/"What are you doing here?" is a direct quote.

I'm glad Cooper turned out to be unforgivably bad, because they were sexy together and then sad together, so they really had to make him Not An Option, and waving a gun in her face and completely erasing that sweet, sexy concern thing was the way to do it. I was trying to reconcile all that and decided that he claimed he wrote the virus because he wanted to be recruited. 5 years at the NSA alone doesn't work for me as motivation to for his transformation into eeeevil. But letting her live with guilt when he wanted to take credit for his own purposes helps.

[apinknightmare]

How can Roy be mixing up the two murders in his mind when his mind repeated the dialogue we saw when Sara was killed? "Hello, Sara"/"What are you doing here?" is a direct quote.

 

I mean, this could be a red herring fakeout situation where we write it off because it's so obvious and he does wind up being Sara's killer, but the dialogue on the rooftop is just generic enough that they might try to pass off Roy dreaming of it as a coincidence.

Edited November 6, 2014 by apinknightmare

[Ariah]

Frankly, I fell in love with 90% of this episode and I want to have it's babies.

 

Basically it was the comeback to the dynamic I loved in season 1 and half of season 2, with Team Arrow together in the Foundry, Laurel marginally present and a villain of the week with a return-potential.

 

Papa Smoak was mentioned as a) very smart and b) present till Felicity's 6th year of age. So she should remember his face (sort of). I still think he'll resurface in mid-season finale. Or close to the actual finale.

 

Felicity being able to save herself was all sorts of awesome - it's a direct comeback to the Count situation. Perhaps Felicity gathered that Oliver will kill Cooper if she remains passive. And she didn't want that to fall on Oliver's conscience (again). Also, her hiting Cooper in the jaw must have been cathartic.

 

The Roy dream in the end was a total mood-slasher. And it would seem a miraculum-Roy was present in the dream (the strength, the zombieness). I'm behind the theory that Roy is channeling someone else's emotions and positions himself in these situations as a viewer, not perpetrator.

 

Ray... Oh, stalkery, no-boundries present Ray. Oliver never visited Felicity at her place, Digg only waited for her outside in the car. Guys know their boundaries, Ray does not. Still, he comes off as less creepy and more socialy inept. Like an absent-minded scientist who forgot that people have lives other than work-mode. And when Felicity asked him wheather he had created something small that grew out of proportions - I think it will become significant.

 

Maybe the blueprints he wanted her to find on the burned HD were using his technology? I mean he invented something, QC stole/ bought it from him and turned it into a totally different, scary thing.

 

Also, I must say that Oliver tonight was... really great. From saving a random woman on the street in his civil-mode (see? you can be Oliver Queen and do good!) to sheepishly admiting he's never fallen out of love for Felicity... My heart broke for them in that final scene, when it was so painully obvious they were talking about themselves ("lovers?" "I have to go"). I admire Felicity's stern mindset that she's not going to take a step forward Oliver (I also wonder what must happen for her to give them a second chance - Oliver seriously hurt?)

 

Before the events of 3.01, she would have hugged him, he would have touch her arm reassuringly - now they no longer have that comfort. Somehow I believe Felicity limits her physical contact with Oliver, because she's afraid she can break and give in. Oliver is also less open with her, though his smiles this episode were a nice change. Only Felicity can make him smile like that...

 

Thea - I can't decide wheather she's working with Malcolm and knows her brother is Arrow, or is Malcolm playing them both and setting up the stage for the grand finale. We'll see.

 

And I don't know if the new rules allow me to say what I want to say about Laurel, but... here goes:

I actually though making her a DA for the night will result in some good decision making and showing the grace-under-pressure thing... But it didn't. She failed the city. Good that it was addressed and not swept away too soon.

Still - a chance to make the character competent was lost. Because you see, Dear Writers: you can't have a character who is incompetent as a vigilantee, incompetent as a lawyer and equally incompetent as a daughter. Make her good at something! (and let thsi not be barking orders...)

 

Whew.

Ok, now I'm waiting for the influx of MamaSmoak talks about the billionaires in her daughter's life fanfics!

[pootlus]

Well that was really fun mostly because Mama Smoak is amazeballs and EBR was acting her socks off.

 

What needs to be said has mostly been covered by others, particularly of note being Felicity SAVING HERSELF and Oliver's lovestruck puppy face.  If Amell looks that way at his wife (which I assume he does) she must be a permanent puddle.  The man is adorable.

 

Glad Laurel was supposed to be terrible (a terrible boxer, a terrible ADA, a terrible daughter).

 

 

This.

 

Oh and now that Paul B has shaved his head he doesn't look remotely old enough to be Laurel's dad.

 

I'm assuming Roy is affected by Mirakertigo.  The voice distortion and stuff sounded like what Oliver went through in the season opener.

 

David Ramsey is comedy gold, he's funnier just by giving looks than 99% of people are by telling jokes. "Who's she gonna tell, Oliver.", he said, moments after I said exactly the same thing to the TV.

 

Willa Holland's boobs really made a starring appearance in this episode, but I admit to having NFI what Thea is up to.

 

MORE MAMA SMOAK PLZ.

 

Oh and loving Brandon Routh. "Get better", with airquotes. Heh.

[Shanna]

I'm glad Cooper turned out to be unforgivably bad, because they were sexy together and then sad together, so they really had to make him Not An Option, and waving a gun in her face and completely erasing that sweet, sexy concern thing was the way to do it. I was trying to reconcile all that and decided that he claimed he wrote the virus because he wanted to be recruited. 5 years at the NSA alone doesn't work for me as motivation to for his transformation into eeeevil. But letting her live with guilt when he wanted to take credit for his own purposes helps.

I think that is definitely plausible. I thought he was shady as hell in the early scenes, but convincing with felicity at the prison so it was hard to see why he would hate her so much just for going corporate. I think that was a smoak (hee) screen because he wasn't good enough to hack it by himself. But bringing her mother there was pretty damned evil, so I think he had to have already been leaning that way before the NSA. Maybe he resented her for being better than he was? That would make sense to me but he can't admit it so he comes up with another reason.

I love this. Oliver's face was hilarious.

Edited November 6, 2014 by Shanna

[looptab]

So, I've been reading some reviews, and most of them are saying the episode was kind of  a missed opportunity, in terms of showing what's really behind Felicity's transformation, and weak WRT the plot.  This are actually points I  agree with. If I put my All-things-Felicity/Mama Smoak/Team Arrow/Olicity-high aside, this wasn't objectively speaking the best episode of the series, but I (and I think most of you would agree) loved it anyway because of those character moments that were missing since what felt like forever.

 

However, it's always interesting reading different opinions, so here are some links for who's interested:

 

http://www.tv.com/shows/arrow/community/post/arrow-season-3-episode-5-the-secret-origin-of-felicity-smoak-review-141514474888/

 

http://www.avclub.com/tvclub/arrow-secret-origin-felicity-smoak-211490

 

http://nerdbastards.com/2014/11/05/tv-review-arrow-s3e5-the-secret-origin-of-felicity-smoak/#more-171857

 

http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/11/06/arrow-the-secret-origin-of-felicity-smoak-review

[apinknightmare]

So, if Roy did kill Sara and this isn't some red herring, how does the rest of the season play into it? I don't think anyone on the team would take issue with him since they know all about the mirakuru and its effects and they would forgive him, but how does Laurel wanting vengeance for Sara's death come in? Does she find out that it's Roy and does that put her at odds with Oliver and the team? Does she ultimately forgive him and drop the vengeance so that we all know what a good person she is?

How does Ra's play into it? Oliver basically told Nyssa that the League needed to stay out of the crimefighting in Starling, so...would they come back and start a mini-war to avenge Sara's death? Ra's didn't seem upset that she died, so I can't really see him coming to town to avenge her, unless it's one of those "you don't kill my people, I kill my people" kind of things.

I really hope it wasn't Roy. I want the person who killed her to have been gunning for her specifically while fully aware of what they were doing. Unless it was someone under mind control, in which case I would prefer that person not be Roy or anyone else on Team Arrow. Although I can see why Roy would be a prime mind-control candidate.

Edited November 6, 2014 by apinknightmare

[BkWurm1]

Much as I liked this episode, and everything Smoak, Diggle and Oliver, I was annoyed by the crying. It was fine in places, but I expected something more during the tied-to-chairs scene.

I was okay with the crying while tied to the chairs because it wasn't just Felicity herself in danger, that she could handle as we know, but it was someone threatening her MOM!!! That changes all the rules so what I as first thought of as out of character ended up making sense.

I really liked that Mama Smoak got her chance to express her faith in Felicity. It I think is what helped Felicity set aside her fears for her mother and fall back on the training she must have been given to get out of just that kind of situation. It was the perfect level of fighting skills for her to have, being able to execute a self defense move against a hacker with a gun.

The idea that Cooper wanted the credit for writing the Super Virus also passed through my mind. As long as he hadn't gone evil, it just seemed like he was protecting Felicity but hindsight suggests something more sinister.

[ostentatious]

The best reason I have been able to think of for Sara's murder is that it is intended to create discord between Nyssa and Ra's. Of course, since Malcolm is the one who planted that thought in her mind, that would indicate his involvement. Since the Brother Eye thing is about mind control used to create killers, I have to think there is a connection there.

I loved the use of Laurel in this ep, because both Quentin and Oliver said straight out she was Doin It Wrong. This convinced me that the show DOES intend me to see Laurel as I see her. She is Amanda Waller in spirit, if not in reach. Those two should meet. She's a natural heir to that demon.

Edited November 6, 2014 by ostentatious

[AnalyzeAndCritique]

So, I've been reading some reviews, and most of them are saying the episode was kind of a missed opportunity, in terms of showing what's really behind Felicity's transformation, and weak WRT the plot. This are actually points I agree with. If I put my All-things-Felicity/Mama Smoak/Team Arrow/Olicity-high aside, this wasn't objectively speaking the best episode of the series, but I (and I think most of you would agree) loved it anyway because of those character moments that were missing since what felt like forever.

However, it's always interesting reading different opinions, so here are some links for who's interested:

http://www.tv.com/shows/arrow/community/post/arrow-season-3-episode-5-the-secret-origin-of-felicity-smoak-review-141514474888/

http://www.avclub.com/tvclub/arrow-secret-origin-felicity-smoak-211490

http://nerdbastards.com/2014/11/05/tv-review-arrow-s3e5-the-secret-origin-of-felicity-smoak/#more-171857

http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/11/06/arrow-the-secret-origin-of-felicity-smoak-review

I don't have time to read the reviews (work beckons). To your point isn't Arrow a series of missed opportunities whether in the storytelling or the editing? One consistency with Arrow is their mediocrity. Arrow isn't an amazing show. It is a decent to good show with strength in casting and stunts. It is good enough for entertainment purposes but it isn't trailblazing TV. This episode had far less WTF moments and need to hand wave or fill in missing points. Honestly it was a stronger episode writing wise. They even managed to make it appear as though Laurel's barking orders has a purpose and isn't just bad acting.

[Velocity23]

Alan Sepinwall short review

http://www.hitfix.com/whats-alan-watching/review-arrow-the-secret-origin-of-felicity-smoak-one-woman-hacking-core

[apinknightmare]

Was it the best episode? No. Were there multiple missed opportunities? Of course. Was there terrible writing and acting in places, along with the typical plot and timeline inconsistencies? Yes. But this episode felt so much like the Arrow I fell in love with and binge-watched and obsessed over with my friends (only one of whom is still watching, sadly), that I'm willing to overlook it because it was just so entertaining and fun for me. I haven't enjoyed an ep like this since...probably early season 2. Not that there haven't been great episodes since then, because there absolutely have, but I watched without a single bit of trepidation and worry that something was going to happen that would piss me off that I just enjoyed the hell out of it.

[ostentatious]

This is interesting:

Doctor Myron Forest was a scientist in the early 21st century on a parallel world known as Earth-AD. Forest worked closely with the Global Peace Agency and was instrumental in the creation of the world's most advanced artificial intelligence, Brother Eye. The Global Peace Agency assigned Forest to a special program known as Project OMAC. The GPA provided him with a candidate to physically interface with the Brother Eye network. The test subject was timid Buddy Blank, an employee of Pseudo-People, Inc. Due to Doctor Forest's work, Buddy Blank was able to tap into Brother Eye's satellite systems and transform into the "one-man army corps" known as OMAC.

[loki567]

A series of missed opportunities is a good way to describe Arrow. The writing's not horrible, but it can be incredibly inconsistent. If the quality was a little better and the pace wasn't so breakneck, it could be one of the more enjoyable shows on television. As it is, I think the actors do most of the heavily lifting and keep me tuning in. 

 

As for the episode, I enjoyed it and thought it was a sign of progress. IMO, ERB still the show's best resource and I thought she did a great job front-and-center. Felicity saving herself! Positive relationship moments between two female characters and a slightly realistic family dynamic between the Smoaks! A return to Oliver/Thea's slightly inappropriate sibling relationship! I thought it was a good episode despite the usual gaps in logic.  

[looptab]

@apinknightmare and @AnalyzeandCritique, I agree with both your posts. It's the nature of Arrow to nail some things and completely miss others. I just realized in what points it could have been so much better once they pointed them out, and  I was  kinda "sad" reading some of those reviews, because I wanted this episode to have the best recognition possible lol.  I was just offering different points of view :)

[wingster55]

Oliver has massive PTSD issues, but it's not Laurel, Thea, or even Moira or Tommy that get him to open up, and smile.

 

Tommy and Thea actually made him laugh a few times early s1. 

[AnalyzeAndCritique]

@apinknightmare and @AnalyzeandCritique, I agree with both your posts. It's the nature of Arrow to nail some things and completely miss others. I just realized in what points it could have been so much better once they pointed them out, and I was kinda "sad" reading some of those reviews, because I wanted this episode to have the best recognition possible lol. I was just offering different points of view :)

Definitely not arguing with you. There is always room for improvement.

I thought last night's episode was strong. There wasn't clear OOC behavior. Laurel is consistent in not telling her father. I was waiting for her to tell him in the middle of a city-wide crisis so it would be about her. Oh wait! OOC moment. Only slightly kidding.

I thought Felicity's story was on point. I think she dressed goth to be the opposite of her mother who clearly there is a divide between. Dark hair, dark lipstick, piercings, etc. I imagine Felicity's hair isn't naturally that dark. She's probably darker than a blonde and lighter than her MIT color.

She went through something tragic and made a life choice. She changed her appearance as a result. She is a bit closer to her mother in her hair color. She could have gone red but the blonde I think is an ode to her mother's strength.

I think it reflects how she ended up at QC in the IT department. She probably needed time to mourn and a corporate IT job wasn't hacking. It didn't carry the potential for tragedy. Oliver's presence brought out the hacktivist in her. This time though with a clear goal of good and not just playing and wreaking havoc.

I think it was a great origins story.

[Primetimer]

Felicity takes center stage as we learn her shocking secret: she was a goth in college.

Read the story

[KirkB]

I wouldn't really say I see Ray as stalkery, though I get why many people do, but more driven and as has been said, socially inept. That said, he is a much more patient boss than most people would be. Felicity has probably done the equivalent of like thirty minutes of work since he hired her. Granted, she has done more in those thirty minutes than a lot of his other employees do all day. But she has her mother show up at work, asked for time off on like her first day, has run out of the office in the middle of work for no apparent reason (from his perspective) multiple times. I imagine most bosses would have fired Felicity pretty early on.

 

I don't like babies on shows like this and as cute as the Digglet is I really don't need to see her every week, BUT Diggle's line, especially the deadpan way he said it to Oliver's face, was priceless.

 

Did Oliver tell Thea Malcolm was alive? I forget. If so, then from Oliver's perspective her using his money makes little sense. Daughter or not that's the kind of thing that would presumably get Malcolm's attention. On the other hand, maybe Oliver is suspicious (of Malcolm, Thea, or both) and is agreeing to stay with her so he can keep an eye on her.

 

I must admit, Felicity looked hot with the black hair, though I have never been fond of nose rings. And while I liked Momma Smoak, if she wants to be taken seriously she should stop running around in skin tight dresses with her boobs hanging out. Not that I'm complaining. Or else embrace her own hotness. If she enjoys showing off her body more power to her.

 

I'm not even going to bother talking about the Laurel scenes.

 

Roy killing Sara is so obviously the EP's trolling us and so stupid it will probably turn out to be true. If by chance it turns out to be a red herring I can accept the idea of him mixing up the fact of him stabbing a police officer to death with an arrow last season with what happened to Sara, since Oliver somehow managed to work out most of the details of exactly how and where Sara was killed.

Edited November 6, 2014 by KirkB

[tv echo]

Best Line of the Night:
Diggle to Oliver (about baby Sara):  "Who's she gonna tell, Oliver?"
Second Best Line:
Oliver to Felicity:  "No matter what you went through in the past, it was worth it.  It created the woman you are today.  And you know how I feel about her." (small smile)
Third Best Line:
Felicity:  "Seriously, if I had two less IQ points, we never would've gotten in this mess."

 

Best Badass Moment:
Oliver/Arrow takes out the gun-shooting motion detectors, while Felicity uses self-defense moves (probably learned from Diggle) to extricate herself from Cooper's armed hold.

 

Crossing the Line Moment:
Ray Palmer shows up unannounced at Felicity's apartment early in the morning.  He's her boss!  And if he shows romantic interest in her, then that stop-by plus his previous stalkerish conduct could arguably be considered sexual harassment.  As others have said, boundaries, Ray, boundaries!  I still find Ray more creepy than charming, although I get that the EPs are going for socially awkward.

 

Mama Smoak and Felicity:
CR as Donna Smoak was a breath of fresh air in a season that has become increasingly dreary with each episode.  CR and EBR killed it in showing a complicated relationship between mother and daughter who are very different in personality, intelligence and style.  Felicity's exasperated and embarrassed reactions to a very sexy, flirtatious and outspoken mom were very natural and relatable.  By the end, however, I could also see where Felicity got her stubbornness and courage, as well as her insecurities.  Very well done relationship.

 

Daddy Smoak:
We finally learn some info about Felicity's father - meager as it is.  He was very smart, he talked a lot with Felicity, and he left his family high and dry when Felicity was 6.  Also, it really sounds like he's going to turn out to be someone known in the DC universe.

 

Cooper and Cyberterrorist Plot:
The main plotline of this episode was pretty simplistic and the 'surprise' reveal was really no surprise.  But I think the plot served as more of a device for Felicity's backstory.  She and Cooper had okay chemistry and Goth Felicity was a blast, but I was uncertain as to Cooper's motivations.  I believed that Felicity really loved him in college.  I wasn't as sure whether Cooper really loved Felicity or whether he was just using her genuis hacking skills.  Although he protected her from going to prison by telling the authorities he was the one who created the supervirus, did he do it because he loved her or because he knew he could get a sweet deal with the feds (and access to their databases) - which he did with the NSA?  And why would the NSA not keep track of him after he did his time with them?  When he revealed himself to Felicity as the greedy Brother Eye, he came across as a pretty one-dimensional villain with no sign that he ever loved Felicity.  She, on the other hand, clearly showed her past sorrow over the loss of someone she loved deeply and her shock at his reappearance.

 

Oliver and Thea:
At first I really thought Thea was a selfish, conscienceless bitch for using Malcolm's blood money to buy herself an expensive loft apartment (plus her continued protection and concealment of Malcolm).  But she partially redeemed herself by telling Oliver that she'll donate proceeds from Verdant profits to an earthquake relief charity and by offering to share the apartment with Oliver so that they can spend more time together.  Thea's idea of compromise seems to be Oliver giving in.  But I loved the ending scene with the two siblings watching TV and eating popcorn together.  Also, I'm glad they finally showed Thea trying to get into the foundry basement - but how long can Oliver hide the Arrowcave with half-ass excuses?  Can he just not afford to move his lair?  At this point, I don't think Oliver should confess to Thea that he is the Arrow.   Thea has become an ambiguous character, who could either go full evil like Malcolm or go hero like Oliver.  That makes her a more interesting character, despite her moments of unlikeability, but it doesn't make her trustworthy.

 

Laurel's WTF Moments:
Hand-waving the fact that Laurel(!) would be named acting D.A., the biggest WTF moment was when her father reprimanded her for sending in the riot squad and then said to her something like "This isn't you.  You haven't been acting like yourself lately.  You're angry... and reckless."   WTF?!  This is exactly like Laurel.  Angry, abusing her power and authority to get what she wants, overstepping her bounds, acting reckless and selfish.  Daddy Lance, where have you been for the past 2+ years?  Also, a minor WTF moment was when she confided to Ted that her sister was dead, murdered, that she's the only one who knows. and that she can't tell anyone, not even her father.  Instead of asking why, Ted simply says "now I know how to train you."  WTF!  The normal reaction would be to ask why she can't tell anyone.  Kudos to Laurel, however, for not revealing Team Arrow's involvement - I think that was why she said she was the only one who knew Sara was dead.  But most groan-worthy moment was when Ted gives her the choice of red or black workout clothes and she says "black, definitely black."

 

Felicity and Oliver:
I loved, loved that retro Team Arrow scene with Felicity introducing her mother to Oliver and Diggle.  This episode did a lot to explain Felicity's current behavior with Oliver in reaction to his rejection of a relationship with her.  Previously, her father and her first love were the two men she most deeply loved in her life - one left her and the other 'died' in prison.  Oliver would make the third man she has ever loved - if she lets herself love him.  Now that he's cut off that option, she's protecting herself by shutting him out emotionally to an extent.  Oliver, in turn, while still expressing concern, is also careful not to get too close or even to touch her (which he had done frequently in the past).  Someone else here had posted something a few weeks ago about how he doesn't touch her anymore.  That was a great observation.  However, there are still verbal signs of his love:
- That Second Best Line quoted above.
- His telling her to take an hour to talk to her mom.  (Still not even a touch on the shoulder!)
- His asking her why she never told him before about her hacktivist college days (I liked her retort about how they don't know anything about the five years he was away).
- His knowing that Felicity is never five feet away from her phone.
Incidentally, I would have loved to have seen an Oliver reaction to a picture of Goth Felicity.

 

In conclusion:

Can we all take a moment of silence in honor of Emily Bett Rickards for absolutely killing it in the first Felicity-centric episode? Then again, there's very little reason to be surprised since Rickards has always been one of Arrow's strongest players.

http://tvrecaps.ew.com/recap/arrow-season-3-episode-5/

 

P.S.  Roy's nightmare about killing Sara has red herring written all over it.
P.P.S.  If Roy has a costume, why doesn't Diggle?

Edited November 6, 2014 by tv echo

[Ceylon5]

Random on-going irritation - I realise Oliver always grabs his bow for TV Dramatic Purposes whenever he says "Let's suit up", but it really annoys me.  How (and why) is he going to put on that whole complicated leather outfit while holding his bow?  PICK UP THE BOW WHEN YOU'VE FINISHED CHANGING, OLIVER!  [Okay, now I think the show has missed a golden opportunity to show us Oliver shimmying into and out of his leather trousers every week.  Because that can't be easy or quick and must be pretty funny to watch.  Less drama, more humour, Arrow!  Work with me here.]

 

Now that I have that off my chest...

 

I loved this episode so much, even though the plot was daft.  Then again, the plot is always daft on this show, and is thankfully not the reason I watch.  The character interactions really worked this week and finally giving Felicity a home, family, and past was all sorts of fantabulous.  For me, the most enjoyable parts are never the big dramatic action scenes, but rather the little character moments, like Felicity being only on her 5th sit-up instead of her 10th like the TV instructor (before deciding that was good enough).  Loved her pyjamas too.

 

With regards to Ray, I agree with those who see him just as a really focussed scientist-type, who doesn't notice when he's tripping over social boundaries because he's too busy thinking through whatever it is he's obsessing about at any given moment.  Also, I think Felicity is, for him, a revelation - at last someone smart enough to understand him and keep up with his thought processes!  So far I think he's been more of a positive force than a negative one, so I don't mind him being around thinking up cool ideas and respecting the hell out of Felicity's awesome brain.  His knee-jerk "Are you adopted?" line made me giggle - clearly Oliver and Diggle were having the same thought, but had enough sense not to actually say it!

[dtissagirl]

I almost wish it was really Roy that killed Sara in a leftover Mirakuru rage, because then the whodunit is over, it's Slade's fault and he's already in prison, and we can move on from I AM VENGEANCE Laurel onto the next Laurel.

 

I think I can see Palmer as both a socially inept workaholic genius and a sorta creepster with stalkery tendencies at the same time. What throws me off every time with him is 1. the crazy eyes and 2. the fact that he looks and sounds like he's hopped on 23 straight up Red Bulls.

[jester]

The best reason I have been able to think of for Sara's murder is that it is intended to create discord between Nyssa and Ra's. Of course, since Malcolm is the one who planted that thought in her mind, that would indicate his involvement. Since the Brother Eye thing is about mind control used to create killers, I have to think there is a connection there.

 

I'm wondering if these are just Easter eggs they are just dropping or if there is a long game connection. Brother Eye was the controlling entity of OMAC which we saw briefly on the blueprints Ray and Felicity recovered a few episodes ago. I'll be interested to see if they connect this in any way.

 

Not much to say that hasn't already been said. I've had a huge crush on Charlotte Ross since Days of our Lives, then onto NYPD Blue, and now I'd love to see more of her on Arrow for sure. She still looks amazing and was just fantastic tonight.

[bethy]

Could someone tell me what Oliver said about family to Felicity toward the end of the episode?  My stupid CW station was fritzing in and out the whole hour.  

[looptab]

Definitely not arguing with you. There is always room for improvement.

I thought last night's episode was strong. There wasn't clear OOC behavior. Laurel is consistent in not telling her father. I was waiting for her to tell him in the middle of a city-wide crisis so it would be about her. Oh wait! OOC moment. Only slightly kidding.

I thought Felicity's story was on point. I think she dressed goth to be the opposite of her mother who clearly there is a divide between. Dark hair, dark lipstick, piercings, etc. I imagine Felicity's hair isn't naturally that dark. She's probably darker than a blonde and lighter than her MIT color.

She went through something tragic and made a life choice. She changed her appearance as a result. She is a bit closer to her mother in her hair color. She could have gone red but the blonde I think is an ode to her mother's strength.

I think it reflects how she ended up at QC in the IT department. She probably needed time to mourn and a corporate IT job wasn't hacking. It didn't carry the potential for tragedy. Oliver's presence brought out the hacktivist in her. This time though with a clear goal of good and not just playing and wreaking havoc.

I think it was a great origins story.

I'll reread your post anytime I hear those bad reviewers voices that entered my head :P

[Password]

2. the fact that he looks and sounds like he's hopped on 23 straight up Red Bulls.

Haha he really does seem hopped up on something most times. But he mentioned in ep 3 he worked over over time and had 300 hundred coffees (not accurate) so I guess that's why.

[Writing Wrongs]

I liked Felicity's Adventures of Robin Hood poster. LOL

[Ceylon5]

Could someone tell me what Oliver said about family to Felicity toward the end of the episode?  My stupid CW station was fritzing in and out the whole hour.  

 

"Earlier today Thea told me that she literally has to put up with me because family is precious and that it's love, in spite of everything, that makes it precious."