Plastic Surgery Run Amok, or Renee Zellweger: What Were You Thinking?

[methodwriter85]

The 90210 ladies got made up in their 90's looks and it made me think about what really obvious work that Tori Spelling and Jennie Garth got:

I do think Gabrielle probably had work done but she looks more or less natural. Shannen looks fantastic! You can really see how much she left her face alone, and how shunning sun her entire life has really helped her out.

[Bruinsfan]

I like that Gabrielle has let herself age naturally for the most part. I mean, the age gap is finally much more apparent than it was back when 90210 was airing, but she looks like she just came in from a day of energetic gardening and playing with the grandkids rather than being wheeled in from her plastic surgeon's on a dolly like the two on the right do.

Also glad to see that Shannen is looking pretty healthy. It wasn't all that long ago that she was undergoing some pretty aggressive cancer treatment.

[krankydoodle]

During the promotion for Dark Phoenix, I was sad to see that Famke Janssen has had some serious work done on her face. I'm no expert, but would've thought with her features and bone structure that she wouldn't need much--if anything--and certainly not whatever was done to her cheeks.

Edited July 17, 2019 by krankydoodle

[Mabinogia]

That is a shame. She was always so stunning. 

[JessePinkman]

On 7/16/2019 at 2:38 PM, methodwriter85 said:

The 90210 ladies got made up in their 90's looks and it made me think about what really obvious work that Tori Spelling and Jennie Garth got:

I do think Gabrielle probably had work done but she looks more or less natural. Shannen looks fantastic! You can really see how much she left her face alone, and how shunning sun her entire life has really helped her out.

I don't think Jennie looks overly done?

Looks like mostly botox and maybe a browlift. Certainly nothing compared to what Tori's done.

[Bruinsfan]

Yeah, but then I can see Cher advising Tori to back away from the plastic surgery for a while. Jennie does look a lot more natural in that second photo.

[topanga]

I saw Jennifer Grey on the "I Am Patrick Swayze," documentary, and I must say that I'm officially used to her face now. (Not that she cared anyway). I guess I'm also happy that she overlooked whatever tension existed between them over the years and was able to say nice things about him for the movie. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 7/18/2019 at 3:19 PM, JessePinkman said:

I don't think Jennie looks overly done?

Looks like mostly botox and maybe a browlift. Certainly nothing compared to what Tori's done.

That's funny because I agree.  I'm always the first to point out plastic surgery and I think Jennie Garth looks pretty good.  Maybe because I'm a big fan of "What I Like About You" so I'm very used to how she looks.

The person who looks EXTREMELY good is Brian Austin Green in my opinion.  My jaw dropped when I saw him. He ages WELL.

I came to this thread thinking everyone would be talking about Simon Cowell.  I want to cry/scream when I see him.

Edited August 22, 2019 by Ms Blue Jay

[JessePinkman]

7 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I came to this thread thinking everyone would be talking about Simon Cowell.  I want to cry/scream when I see him.

Holy. Crap.

I am so...confused. His eyes are freaking me OUT. It looks like they were photoshopped in...upside down.

[methodwriter85]

Is anyone else kind of impressed that Kirsten Dunst really seems to be going with minimal intervention if anything? I love it- I love that we can see a 37-year old woman with a face that moves, as seen in the trailer for her new t.v. show:

It's doubly impressive given that KD was known as a teen actress and she's always going to have the mental image of 17-year old Torrance Shipman to be compared to.

I really hope she holds out strong against the general Hollywood belief that you need to be botoxed up after 25. It feels kind of like Kirsten was finally freed from her former ingenue image after doing Fargo.

13 hours ago, JessePinkman said:

I am so...confused. His eyes are freaking me OUT. It looks like they were photoshopped in...upside down.

I remember when Rupert Everett also got really bad eyework done.

According to Natalie Wood's biography Natasha, Natalie was considering eye work but someone talked her out of it because it can go bad really easily. Of course, she might have gotten it done anyway if she had lived past 43. From what I understand though, other than a nose job she got as a teenager, this was Natalie's almost naturally aged face:

Just outstanding. It's possible she could have gotten a facelift, but in that era they were a lot more obvious and I don't think she did. Per her bio, Natalie had quit smoking and was pretty fanatical about working out so I think that probably helped her with the youthful glow she still had leading up to her death.

Maybe a chemical peel? That was pretty popular at the time. If there was any kind of work done, it was pretty damn good. Again though, I kind of lean towards this being a naturally aged (for Hollywood) face. She kind of reminds me of Diane Lane. I wonder if she would have started fucking with her face when she hit her 50's, but of course, Natalie never left her early 40's.

Edited August 23, 2019 by methodwriter85

[Ms Blue Jay]

10 hours ago, JessePinkman said:

Holy. Crap.

I am so...confused. His eyes are freaking me OUT. It looks like they were photoshopped in...upside down.

When people started sharing the photo online I thought it was some kind of meme meant to disturb everyone, and that someone altered the photo to be funny.  Not so much.  The photos I've seen online are even worse.  Horrifying.

[Bruinsfan]

Are the eye tucks the only things he had done? When I look at other parts of his face in isolation everything else looks the same, but he's almost unrecognizable. Wow, if there was ever a surgery to choose your plastic surgeon very carefully for...

Why do these people not ask Jane Fonda for her recommendation? Whoever did her work must have a magic wand on his instrument tray!

[festivus]

Whoa Simon Cowell. I haven't seen him for years but he looks like a different person. He's reminding me of someone else, an actor I think, but I can't pin it down.

Yeah I agree about Jane Fonda. Obviously she's had plastic surgery but she still looks like herself.

[Wiendish Fitch]

17 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I came to this thread thinking everyone would be talking about Simon Cowell.  I want to cry/scream when I see him.

I don't, because I'm a petty brat who can't stand that noxious, untalented, nowhere-near-as-witty-as-he-thinks-he-is Simon Cowell, and the fact that he's aging like a banana gives me my daily dose of schadenfreude. 

I recently saw a picture of him alongside Susan Boyle, and she's barely changed at all in the past ten years, save for a lighter hair color these days. Hey, if you look no worse than you did a decade ago, you're doing something right!

[Luciano]

On 8/23/2019 at 12:45 AM, JessePinkman said:

Holy. Crap.

I am so...confused. His eyes are freaking me OUT. It looks like they were photoshopped in...upside down.

He looks like an NPC in TES: Oblivion.

[Jaded]

I wonder if Simon actually thought people would believe that his face looked that different because of weight loss after going Vegan. He looks like he went to that butcher Kenny Rodgers did years ago or someone that uses the same methods.

[Snow Apple]

Yikes! If you put the "after" picture up by itself and asked us who it was, I'd have never guessed. I'm not going to comment on his personality but his looks were always fine enough. Why do people keep doing this to themselves? Haven't they seen other celebrities ruining their good looks with too much surgery? 

[Ms Blue Jay]

2 hours ago, Snow Apple said:

Yikes! If you put the "after" picture up by itself and asked us who it was, I'd have never guessed. I'm not going to comment on his personality but his looks were always fine enough. Why do people keep doing this to themselves? Haven't they seen other celebrities ruining their good looks with too much surgery? 

I agree, he always looked perfectly fine to me, even handsome.  I find it so sad, so depressing.  Honestly, it really upset me.

[methodwriter85]

I don't know, Rupert Everett depressed me more, although in his case, I think it's a combination of alcohol/drugs and bad plastic surgery.

There are parts where his face seems to settle and he looks good again, and then there are the moments where he looks absolutely horrifying.

Dude, I get it- you were a pretty boy when you were young and that's hard to let go of,  especially when the gay community declares you "gay dead" when you hit 30 and you're now twice gay dead, but man, PLEASE hit up Madonna to get the number of whoever does her work.

Here, he looks like a plastic version cross  between Kevin Kline, Thomas Gibson and Bruce Cambell.

Edited August 25, 2019 by methodwriter85

[Shannon L.]

On 8/23/2019 at 8:44 AM, Bruinsfan said:

Why do these people not ask Jane Fonda for her recommendation? Whoever did her work must have a magic wand on his instrument tray!

I've seen Jane in person, from a fairly close distance, and she's gorgeous.  I leaned over and said the same exact thing to my husband about others getting a doctor recommendation from her! 

[LilWharveyGal]

9 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

This is Rupert?! Holy crap, I would never have guessed that correctly in a million years. To me, it looks vaguely like a brunette Cary Elwes.

[Mabinogia]

Nicole Kidman is one of the saddest to me because she had the bone structure to have aged beautifully. And I don't think she's had a lot done, just enough to make her look fake which is so sad. 

Then you have someone like Helen Mirren who at 74 years old is STUNNING. Though she said she did get her eyebrows tattooed on. lol Which, honestly, I would consider. I hate having to pencil them in every day. But her face structure looks exactly like it did when she was young, only it has lines now, it has lived! 

But yeah, if you're a rich celeb and you feel like you have to have plastic surgery, get Jane Fonda's doc! Other than a few times when her face has looked really tight, probably right after a procedure, that woman looks great! She also doesn't look like she's trying to look super young, just trying to look a little better. I think that's the key. Don't try to take off 10-20 years, just try to look like a really good whatever your age is. 

[Bruinsfan]

On 8/25/2019 at 9:35 AM, LilWharveyGal said:

This is Rupert?! Holy crap, I would never have guessed that correctly in a million years. To me, it looks vaguely like a brunette Cary Elwes.

When I glanced at that picture before reading the accompanying text I thought it was Stephen Moyer after putting on some weight. I do have to say though, Everett looks pretty good in that picture. Absolutely unrecognizable, but it sure doesn't make me recoil with crossed fingers like when the camera zoomed in on him for a close-up in Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children.

[JessePinkman]

On 8/25/2019 at 1:07 AM, methodwriter85 said:

Dude, I get it- you were a pretty boy when you were young and that's hard to let go of,  especially when the gay community declares you "gay dead" when you hit 30 and you're now twice gay dead, but man, PLEASE hit up Madonna to get the number of whoever does her work.

Madonna?

[methodwriter85]

I mean, she's not Jane Fonda but I wouldn't say she's terrifying. I'd put her work on about the same level of Cher. She recently backed away from the hardbody stuff and her work looks better as a result:

I do remember when she got cheek implants people kept commenting about how they created a weird divot and the problem was that at the time she was on her super-low bodyfat kick so it just didn't look right.

Quote

Absolutely unrecognizable, but it sure doesn't make me recoil with crossed fingers like when the camera zoomed in on him for a close-up in Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children. 

It's so weird with him, because sometimes there are moments where he still looks good but then other times he looks absolutely horrifying. Like he looked pretty good on his episode of Black Mirror playing a Simon Cowell-like character.

Edited August 27, 2019 by methodwriter85

[methodwriter85]

Re-watching the first season of The Office made me ponder again if John Krasinki got a nose job, or if he just lucked out in the aging process. Sometimes I feel positive he did, and the doctor did a really subtle job that also made him look really good while not changing his nose much, and other times I just think the aging process was really good for him.

[teddysmom]

On 9/29/2019 at 3:32 PM, methodwriter85 said:

Re-watching the first season of The Office made me ponder again if John Krasinki got a nose job, or if he just lucked out in the aging process. Sometimes I feel positive he did, and the doctor did a really subtle job that also made him look really good while not changing his nose much, and other times I just think the aging process was really good for him.

I have wondered the same thing!  I just compared S1 of The Office to Jack Ryan.

I think he just lost some baby fat and his face slimmed down.  He is much more muscular than he was back in 2005. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

I was thinking the same about Adam Pally over the course of Happy Endings, but also wondering if maybe he just lost weight and had a better hairstyle?  Sometimes I find him so attractive, but in the first few episodes of the show he wasn't looking as great.

[Bruinsfan]

I liked his look better in the pilot than later on. But I'd think changes in his appearance could be explained by that cocaine bust he was caught up in a couple of years ago.

[absnow54]

On 10/11/2019 at 11:05 PM, Bruinsfan said:

I liked his look better in the pilot than later on. But I'd think changes in his appearance could be explained by that cocaine bust he was caught up in a couple of years ago.

The age old question in Hollywood, nose job or coke problem?

[Mabinogia]

2 hours ago, absnow54 said:

The age old question in Hollywood, nose job or coke problem?

How did that never become a game show? 

[methodwriter85]

Quote

The age old question in Hollywood, nose job or coke problem?

That reminds me of Belinda Carlisle, who mentioned in one of her bios (while still hiding her active cocaine problem) that people thought that she had gotten work done right before her solo career launch in 1986 but it was really just losing 30 pounds.

Edited October 14, 2019 by methodwriter85

[StatisticalOutlier]

On 8/23/2019 at 10:23 AM, festivus said:

Yeah I agree about Jane Fonda. Obviously she's had plastic surgery but she still looks like herself.

Is that the standard now?  That the person be recognizable as his/herself?  Because I think Jane Fonda looks ridiculous.  She's over 80 years old and has the face of someone waaaay younger than 10-years-younger Helen Mirren.

[methodwriter85]

Josh O'Connor, a British actor I know from his turn in a gay indie called God's Own Country, is playing 1960's/70's Prince Charles on the Crown right now. He feels grateful that he didn't pin his ears back.

I'm glad he kept them that way. It really gives him a unique look! (And it allowed him to play Prince Charles!)

[topanga]

On 11/23/2019 at 7:50 PM, StatisticalOutlier said:

Is that the standard now?  That the person be recognizable as his/herself?  Because I think Jane Fonda looks ridiculous.  She's over 80 years old and has the face of someone waaaay younger than 10-years-younger Helen Mirren.

I just think there’s so much bad cosmetic surgery out there that seeing someone who doesn’t look like an alien is considered a victory. Also, Goldie Hawn. She’s 74 and shouldn’t have a wrinkle-free face, but she still looks like herself and doesn’t have a Joker mouth. 
 

On the other hand...I recently saw Helen Hunt in a Netflix movie. I love her as an actress, and I’m glad to see her working, but whoever did her plastic surgery should have their medical license revoked. She looked terrible. She had her eyes done, I guess, but they had a strange, unnatural shape. And she had cheek implants, but they made her face look bloated. No contouring or shape whatsoever. I’m not trying to age-shame, and I’m not trying to berate Helen Hunt. But I’m upset at the medical professional who jacked up her beautiful face. 
 

 

[methodwriter85]

I recently discovered the YouTube channel of a society woman who analyzes plastic surgery work. Here is her episode on Margot Robbie:

She thinks it's a subtle nose job, some light lip filler, Botox, and Buccal fat removal. (Or basically, lower cheek fat liposuction.) The results look great, but the tradeoff aged her to where she basically had to show a picture of herself as a 13-year old reading Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix to prove she was the age she said is.

Lorry also has two videos on Zac Efron. In her first video on him, she also analyzed Brad Pitt and Ryan Gosling.

At the time, she thought Zac Efron was the result of possibly a nosejob and just weight loss as he was doing the vegan thing in 2019. (She has since revised this thinking after more careful analysis of his face, particularly the 2012-2015 era.) Lorry believes that Brad Pitt hasn't done surgery work but he has done a chemical peel, laser treatment on his acne scars, and intermittent botox/dermal fillers. The reason she doesn't think he got a Facelift is because his face seems to go back and forth- sometimes he's got deep wrinkles, sometimes he doesn't, and if he had gotten a Facelift his face would be more consistently wrinkle free. Ryan Gosling, she thinks had at least two nosejobs, a chin bone shaving, and upper eyelid surgery. I do think Ryan Gosling did not have a leading man's face in his early/mid-20's, but he did by the time of Crazy Stupid Love.

Lorry did a revised video on Zac Efron in April 2021:

She now thinks that he started doing surgeries on his face between 2012 and 2015.

Basically, he kept subtle in that era and it flew under the radar but then went with a second, bigger chin implant that just threw off his face.

It would explain why he looked so terrible during the Baywatch era- the totally shredded body exposed his chin implant and just looked weird. I remember there being comments that he looked like he had steroid jaw at that time, and it would make sense that in fact losing so much fat exposed the implants and made them stand out more than they did when he first had them around 2013-2014.

 

 

Edited June 15, 2021 by methodwriter85

[Scarlett45]

On 6/15/2021 at 1:19 AM, methodwriter85 said:

I recently discovered the YouTube channel of a society woman who analyzes plastic surgery work. Here is her episode on Margot Robbie:

She thinks it's a subtle nose job, some light lip filler, Botox, and Buccal fat removal. (Or basically, lower cheek fat liposuction.) The results look great, but the tradeoff aged her to where she basically had to show a picture of herself as a 13-year old reading Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix to prove she was the age she said is.

Lorry also has two videos on Zac Efron. In her first video on him, she also analyzed Brad Pitt and Ryan Gosling.

At the time, she thought Zac Efron was the result of possibly a nosejob and just weight loss as he was doing the vegan thing in 2019. (She has since revised this thinking after more careful analysis of his face, particularly the 2012-2015 era.) Lorry believes that Brad Pitt hasn't done surgery work but he has done a chemical peel, laser treatment on his acne scars, and intermittent botox/dermal fillers. The reason she doesn't think he got a Facelift is because his face seems to go back and forth- sometimes he's got deep wrinkles, sometimes he doesn't, and if he had gotten a Facelift his face would be more consistently wrinkle free. Ryan Gosling, she thinks had at least two nosejobs, a chin bone shaving, and upper eyelid surgery. I do think Ryan Gosling did not have a leading man's face in his early/mid-20's, but he did by the time of Crazy Stupid Love.

Lorry did a revised video on Zac Efron in April 2021:

She now thinks that he started doing surgeries on his face between 2012 and 2015.

Basically, he kept subtle in that era and it flew under the radar but then went with a second, bigger chin implant that just threw off his face.

It would explain why he looked so terrible during the Baywatch era- the totally shredded body exposed his chin implant and just looked weird. I remember there being comments that he looked like he had steroid jaw at that time, and it would make sense that in fact losing so much fat exposed the implants and made them stand out more than they did when he first had them around 2013-2014.

 

 

Thank you for sharing this! I watched the one about Zac Efron- boy oh boy did he just go too far with his gorgeous face.

I am going to watch the one about Margot Robbie, but the one about Halle Berry interested me. I think Halle most certainly had work done, but the "first nose job" the reviewer referenced I think is likely just due to aging.

My nose (as a black woman with smaller facial features- I am in NO WAY insinuating I am as pretty as Halle Berry, Paula Patton, or Meghan Markle, but if they needed an overweight cousin in a movie I would sign up, or I would hire them to play me in a movie of my life after they gained 100lbs, might gain them an Oscar!!), my nose sharpened quite a bit between 18yrs old and 22-23 or so. When I lose weight, my nose looks much slimmer. And I am a fat woman. If I was an actress getting ready for a part I am sure it would look a lot slimer. I have not had a nose job. Little changes like that can be hormonal or age related as someone goes through the mid 20s. Also, Halle his half white- my bff is half Chinese/Lithuanian, as she aged, her nose went from being much wider and resembling her Chinese mother's, and has elongated and resembles her father's nose- its been a HUGE change from 18-35 and she hasnt had a nose job either.

 

Margot Robbie- she has a mature face (which allows her beauty to read "sex pot" rather than ingenue), much like Angie Harmon, but Angie has looked almost the same for the last 20yrs. When work is very subtle, I would need to see the person up close or in high def to know if it was plastic surgery or just makeup. Makeup can do A LOT but I cannot do everything. 

[methodwriter85]

Will Poulter at 22-ish in 2016:

Will Poulter now:

If that's jawline work and a possible rhinoplasty, that's a REALLY good job. He has a leading man's face now and he didn't before.

I'm really hat's off impressed. He looks fantastic.

 

 

[Wiendish Fitch]

So, Nicole Kidman as Lucille Ball...

Let's get this out of the way: Nicole Kidman is a grown-ass woman who is free to pump all the botulism into her skull as she sees fit, and I have no right to judge her for that. 

I do, however, judge the decision to cast her as Lucille Ball, because you know what made Lucy such a great comedienne?

Her lack of vanity.

She was a lovely woman, to be sure, but Ball wasn't afraid to pull silly faces or generally make a delightful fool of herself. Lack of vanity means lack of inhibitions, and that's what helps physical comedy to flourish. Without Lucille Ball, we wouldn't have Carol Burnett, Gilda Radner, or any of the other talented ladies who have graced SNL and various sketch comedies.

While it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Lucy had a little plastic surgery later in life (or, hell, even more than a little), she was still able to move her face. Whereas every time Kidman's forehead puckered in The Undoing, all I could think was, "LOOK OUT, IT'S GONNA BLOW!"

Again, Kidman is free to do with her face as she wants, everyone is, but I feel that all those Botox injections are starting to take a toll on her acting ability. I mean, if your face barely moves, it's difficult to convey emotions, or be believable in certain parts. Kidman's eerily placid face seemed well-suited for her role as a creepy health guru in Nine Perfect Strangers, but as Lucille Ball?  The rubber-faced woman who had a veritable arsenal of silly facial expressions? The woman who could go from glamorous to goofy at the drop of a hat? Hard no.

Oh, well, I guess I'm not such a good little libertarian when it comes to what other people do to their faces after all. 

I wish Hollywood execs would grow a pair and cast an unknown once in a while. I know it's a business and names tend to get butts in seats, but sometimes isn't it kind of exciting when a fresh-faced nobody steps into a plum role? 

[GHScorpiosRule]

10 hours ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

I wish Hollywood execs would grow a pair and cast an unknown once in a while. I know it's a business and names tend to get butts in seats, but sometimes isn't it kind of exciting when a fresh-faced nobody steps into a plum role? 

Yeah. Like they did with Hugh Jackman when he was cast as Logan/Wolverine! 

Totally agree with you about Nicole Kidman. I was getting ready to post in the trailer thread, with all the botox she's done, how will she make all those facial expressions that Lucille was great at, when Nicole can't even move her face. Because that trailer did show scenes of her playing Lucy. And Lucy was great at the shocked 'O', making her eyes pop, and other things. I doubt Nicole can do that.

[Blergh]

12 hours ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

So, Nicole Kidman as Lucille Ball...

Let's get this out of the way: Nicole Kidman is a grown-ass woman who is free to pump all the botulism into her skull as she sees fit, and I have no right to judge her for that. 

I do, however, judge the decision to cast her as Lucille Ball, because you know what made Lucy such a great comedienne?

Her lack of vanity.

She was a lovely woman, to be sure, but Ball wasn't afraid to pull silly faces or generally make a delightful fool of herself. Lack of vanity means lack of inhibitions, and that's what helps physical comedy to flourish. Without Lucille Ball, we wouldn't have Carol Burnett, Gilda Radner, or any of the other talented ladies who have graced SNL and various sketch comedies.

While it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Lucy had a little plastic surgery later in life (or, hell, even more than a little), she was still able to move her face. Whereas every time Kidman's forehead puckered in The Undoing, all I could think was, "LOOK OUT, IT'S GONNA BLOW!"

Again, Kidman is free to do with her face as she wants, everyone is, but I feel that all those Botox injections are starting to take a toll on her acting ability. I mean, if your face barely moves, it's difficult to convey emotions, or be believable in certain parts. Kidman's eerily placid face seemed well-suited for her role as a creepy health guru in Nine Perfect Strangers, but as Lucille Ball?  The rubber-faced woman who had a veritable arsenal of silly facial expressions? The woman who could go from glamorous to goofy at the drop of a hat? Hard no.

Oh, well, I guess I'm not such a good little libertarian when it comes to what other people do to their faces after all. 

I wish Hollywood execs would grow a pair and cast an unknown once in a while. I know it's a business and names tend to get butts in seats, but sometimes isn't it kind of exciting when a fresh-faced nobody steps into a plum role? 

To be fair, from her late 40's onward, on virtually all television appearances until the last few years before her death,  Miss Ball DID use the 'clamp method' to keep her facial skin as smooth as possible. What this meant was that her natural (albeit dyed) hair was twisted into tiny braids as tightly as possible THEN pulled back and covered by gigantic red wigs anchored to said braids via the odd curls. This wasn't entirely vanity on the iconic comedienne's part but via wearing wigs, she wouldn't have to worry about her actual hair getting too wet or otherwise mussed while she was performing her stunts and could concentrate on said stunts without having to consider delaying shooting the next scene to dry off and restyle her hair.  She at first didn't like it because it challenged her from making expressive faces but eventually she was able to overcome that but it wasn't without its pitfalls. Notably, she'd gotten so numb to feeling all those twists and clamps that at one point she actually had a hat pin puncture her scalp and she didn't feel it until she had to take it off! 

[Wiendish Fitch]

3 hours ago, Blergh said:

To be fair, from her late 40's onward, on virtually all television appearances until the last few years before her death,  Miss Ball DID use the 'clamp method' to keep her facial skin as smooth as possible. What this meant was that her natural (albeit dyed) hair was twisted into tiny braids as tightly as possible THEN pulled back and covered by gigantic red wigs anchored to said braids via the odd curls. This wasn't entirely vanity on the iconic comedienne's part but via wearing wigs, she wouldn't have to worry about her actual hair getting too wet or otherwise mussed while she was performing her stunts and could concentrate on said stunts without having to consider delaying shooting the next scene to dry off and restyle her hair.  She at first didn't like it because it challenged her from making expressive faces but eventually she was able to overcome that but it wasn't without its pitfalls. Notably, she'd gotten so numb to feeling all those twists and clamps that at one point she actually had a hat pin puncture her scalp and she didn't feel it until she had to take it off! 

Ouch! I can't tell if this proves or negates my point. Dammit all, even in comedy, women have to basically subscribe to the "beauty is pain" (even if it's out of necessity) mentality, while men are free to become as old and fat as they damn well please. 

Make no mistake, I did not mean to imply that no one had plastic surgery or resorted to drastic measures back in the old days. For instance, Marlene Dietrich had her own DIY facelifting techniques, and was even rumored to have had molars removed to create the appearance of cheekbones.

The point is, whatever Lucy did or didn't do, she could still move her face. 

Is it wrong that I now admire actresses like Kathleen Turner and Kelly McGillis, who allowed themselves to age and even-gasp!- gain weight, and they don't give a blue dilly crap what anyone thinks?

[Mabinogia]

18 hours ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

I wish Hollywood execs would grow a pair and cast an unknown once in a while. I know it's a business and names tend to get butts in seats, but sometimes isn't it kind of exciting when a fresh-faced nobody steps into a plum role? 

Especially when you are casting someone as iconic as Lucille Ball. I would think that anyone interested in watching this is interested because it's Lucy not because of Nicole Kidman (and I like Nicole Kidman, but she isn't the reason I'd watch a movie about Lucille Ball. She's the reason I wouldn't, because I want to see Lucy not Nicole Kidman playing Lucy. 

I will say that the mean spirited side of me is just glad Debra Messing didn't get the role. I'm sure she wanted it but I don't like her so I'm glad she didn't get what she wanted. I'm evil. lol

[Bastet]

2 hours ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

Is it wrong that I now admire actresses like Kathleen Turner and Kelly McGillis, who allowed themselves to age and even-gasp!- gain weight, and they don't give a blue dilly crap what anyone thinks?

No, but looking at how often women like them - or women like Tyne Daly, who seek on camera work more than they do - are cast compared to women who have utilized procedures to diminish the physical evidence of aging, I don't think poorly of the latter group of women.  I prefer aging naturally - in terms of what I choose for myself (hell, I don't even dye my grey hair) and what I most respond to in famous women - but my frustrations with the prevalence of and push for "anti-aging" cosmetic procedures are not focused on the women who opt in.

Like you also said, it's anyone's business what to do with their face, but women in entertainment (most obviously, although it's not exclusive to that industry) don't make these choices in a vacuum; it's not pure vanity, there are also practical and resulting economic considerations to looking younger.  The problem is with a sexist, ageist society and an industry which takes that to the extreme; women merely take their best shots at navigating it.

[Bruinsfan]

I like Debra Messing, but if there are dolls of Nicole Kidman on the market I bet she's buying them in bulk to use for voodoo purposes.

[methodwriter85]

On 10/20/2021 at 6:19 PM, Bastet said:

Like you also said, it's anyone's business what to do with their face, but women in entertainment (most obviously, although it's not exclusive to that industry) don't make these choices in a vacuum; it's not pure vanity, there are also practical and resulting economic considerations to looking younger.  The problem is with a sexist, ageist society and an industry which takes that to the extreme; women merely take their best shots at navigating it.

Whenever I look at movies made before the 1990's, I'm always taken aback by how natural most people look. Cosmetic surgery existed, of course, but natural signs of aging were present, even in the lead female characters.

Nowadays even character actors look like they got work done.

[Scarlett45]

On 10/19/2021 at 1:36 AM, methodwriter85 said:

Will Poulter at 22-ish in 2016:

Will Poulter now:

If that's jawline work and a possible rhinoplasty, that's a REALLY good job. He has a leading man's face now and he didn't before.

I'm really hat's off impressed. He looks fantastic.

 

 

I am no expert but that could just be aging and weight loss. Losing a tiny bit of weight in the face can do a lot for the male jaw line. It’s so subtle it might just be him maturing into his looks. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 10/20/2021 at 5:51 PM, Mabinogia said:

I will say that the mean spirited side of me is just glad Debra Messing didn't get the role. I'm sure she wanted it but I don't like her so I'm glad she didn't get what she wanted. I'm evil. lol

LOL, I know what you mean.  After hearing reports of how Megan Mullally refused to show up to shooting W&G because of Debra, it does not make me look kindly upon her.

12 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

Whenever I look at movies made before the 1990's, I'm always taken aback by how natural most people look. Cosmetic surgery existed, of course, but natural signs of aging were present, even in the lead female characters.

Nowadays even character actors look like they got work done.

Every woman - and I mean every single woman in Hollywood - had a nose job, and sometimes a boob job, but it seemed like it mostly stopped there.  It's sad what has happened.  Kardashian + Instagram changed everything for the much worse.  Now every quasi celebrity thinks they have to do their entire face.  It's so sad.

[Blergh]

On 10/20/2021 at 2:31 PM, Wiendish Fitch said:

Ouch! I can't tell if this proves or negates my point. Dammit all, even in comedy, women have to basically subscribe to the "beauty is pain" (even if it's out of necessity) mentality, while men are free to become as old and fat as they damn well please. 

Make no mistake, I did not mean to imply that no one had plastic surgery or resorted to drastic measures back in the old days. For instance, Marlene Dietrich had her own DIY facelifting techniques, and was even rumored to have had molars removed to create the appearance of cheekbones.

The point is, whatever Lucy did or didn't do, she could still move her face. 

Is it wrong that I now admire actresses like Kathleen Turner and Kelly McGillis, who allowed themselves to age and even-gasp!- gain weight, and they don't give a blue dilly crap what anyone thinks?

But the sad irony of it all is that the entire time Lucy did 'the clamps' she herself was producing and OWNED her own show so there was zero danger of her getting fired or overlooked had she let her lines show on the air. 

Dietrich wasn't a technical producer of her stuff but she WAS somewhat of a free agent after her time with Sternberg- and she evidently wanted the public to think she'd stayed a flawless, youthful beauty as long as she was performing. Oh, and she herself did 'the clamps' from her 50's onward to pull this off.  Yet, even those few photos in old age that somehow had gotten taken showed she DID have an innate ageless beauty  that would have kept her fans impressed even when she clearly looked her actual age. 

[Mabinogia]

52 minutes ago, Blergh said:

DID have an innate ageless beauty  that would have kept her fans impressed even when she clearly looked her actual age. 

Marlene would have been beautiful even if she'd left her face alone. Sadly, I feel that way about Nicole Kidman too, which is why seeing her shiny, plastic face makes me sad. I feel like women are taught to be so terrified of getting a wrinkle that they start the process before they even need to.