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S03.E18: Listening To A Heartbeat

Snazzy Daisy

By Snazzy Daisy
in Will Trent

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wonderwoman

wonderwoman

4 hours ago, HappyBelly15 said:

Peyton Place, that’s it! I recognized the music but couldn’t place it. Thank you! I’m old enough to remember the show and my parents watching it, but my mom clutched her pearls at the thought her child would watch it, so I never got the chance. 

my parents were the same way about the novel. used to spend a lot of time at a neighbor’s — read it there! can’t remember if my parents ever found out. no harm, no foul:)

  • Like 1
Dowel Jones

Dowel Jones

(edited)
2 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

Yet there is a different visceral experience when you're actually in the middle of an event.  Otherwise, people who experience mass shooting events wouldn't feel as traumatized as they do

Exactly.  Reading about, or seeing a dead body on TV (even the news), is far different than someone being shot right in front of you.  

Edited by Dowel Jones
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Sarah 103

Sarah 103

1 hour ago, Dowel Jones said:

Reading about, or seeing a dead body on TV (even the news), is far different than someone being shot right in front of you.  

To clarify what I meant, I was referring to the archery team as Generation Z, who are known for dark/gallows humor. While being trained for what to do in case of mass shooter event from the time they are six is different from actually experiencing one, the fact that they are being trained for it and that the possibility of mass shooter events are a fact of life for them (among other things/factors) has contributed to their sense of humor. This is why their snarky comments during the firefight seemed realistic and didn't surprise me. (also TVLand rules/logic-it's funnier/unexpected if the teens are making snarky comments as opposed to screaming and freaking out).  

4 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Also, Angie got to do a Die Hard!

I forgot to mention that putting Angie in Die Hard was fantastic and something I did not even realize I needed/wanted until it happened. 

peeayebee

peeayebee

22 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

Did they show how Nico got infected?

Yes, as someone else said, it must have been because Nico was in such close contact with the guy. But boy, when we first see her sick, I thought she was the one who was going to die. 

18 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

On a positive note, did everyone catch the short of Betty dunking on the basket during the commercial break?  Too cute!

No, I didn't see that. Where can I see it now?

14 hours ago, cardigirl said:

The tumor names in the middle of a gun fight were also not realistic but highly entertaining, so I LOVED it!! 

There were several times where the joking around kind of bugged me, but like you said, it was funny and entertaining, so I decided to allow it. And enjoy it.

Quote

I read today that one of the show's writers and creators, Liz Heldens, also created The Big Leap, another favorite show of mine that sadly only got one season. Scott Foley was amazing on that show. And Kevin Daniels (Franklin) was also on The Big Leap.

I don't know if it was you or someone else who mentioned The Big Leap in an earlier thread, but I hope it's streaming somewhere. I'd love to watch it.

12 hours ago, TVForever said:

Maybe it's the state of things these days, but I found this episode absolutely terrifying.

Yes. Plus, for me, I just kind of hate domestic terrorism plots because they're so disturbing. I just have to keep reassuring myself that, at least in a regular TV drama, the good guys will win.

Loved Angie doing the Die Hard business in the air ducts, though I kept saying she needed to shut up so the bad guys wouldn't hear her. Loved that she used the laser pointer to get Amanda's attention, and that Amanda then spoke in code so Angie would find the gun.

Good episode. Very tense but satisfying. I'm sure Amanda will be ok. I think Ormewood will be too.

 

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peeayebee

peeayebee

(edited)
10 hours ago, catrice2 said:

I forgot to say how effectively they used all the supporting characters, everyone who pops up sometimes had something to do. 

Pete wasn't in this ep, was he? 

7 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

About 30 minutes in there is an ad for the NBA games.  Will is also featured, striking a pose, and then Betty is there in an Atlanta jersey dunking a basketball.

I watch on Hulu without ads. I'll check out YouTube. It might be there.

BTW, in addition to Peyton Place, the show has referenced General Hospital. Have they included any other soap operas?

Edited by peeayebee
peachmangosteen

peachmangosteen

(edited)
22 hours ago, fishcakes said:

Nico must have gotten something to eat and then gotten sick, but there's no way she didn't share her food with Betty, so at least we know that Betty was immune and would have been fine regardless.

 

14 hours ago, DEL901 said:

Re Nico…remember in the last episode she was sitting with and holding the hand of patient zero? 

 

11 hours ago, peeayebee said:

Yes, as someone else said, it must have been because Nico was in such close contact with the guy. But boy, when we first see her sick, I thought she was the one who was going to die.

Nico uses they/them pronouns.

This truly is the best show on television right now and it is a real shame it doesn't have a much bigger audience and never gets any recognition from awards shows.

However, if they kill off Ormewood or Amanda I'm probably gonna be out.

Edited by peachmangosteen
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Chaos Theory

Chaos Theory

(edited)

The little throw away moments is why I love this show.   Angie’s ring tone for Will “We are never ever ever getting back together.”  but that awkward moment in the hospital where they both admit that they both thought eventually Will would be the father of her baby and that simple choice (not saying if it was wrong or right but it did have consequences for them Both) changed the trajectory of their relationship probably forever.

Say what you want about Will being the one to save the day in the end but Ormewood was a bad ass and it was worth it just for the “Bro! See what I did.”  Moment between them.  
 

And yeah the archery team was fun

Edited by Chaos Theory
  • Like 12
possibilities

possibilities

In addition to NOT killing Amanda or Oremwood, I really want them to stop torturing Will.

I am grossed out by the "barely sober, in a new relationship, but we guess she's ready to be a parent and it's twu luv between her and her new guy" plot, but I'm accepting it because I'm tired of seeing Angie be stuck. On any other wshow, I'd stop watching, because the propaganda about pregnancy redeeming women and magically giving them mental health is dangerous and false and one of the most sexist things ever to be propagated.

But they need to also show some love to Will, and not make this into a ceaseless misery porn extravaganza for his character. I'm still not over how they killed Cricket and replaced her with no-chemistry Marion who clearly didn't understand him at all.

I'm glad they stopped the on-again/off-again with him and Angie, but they really need to stop making him the receiver of nothing but pain and disappointment. He met and then lost contact with his uncle. Now they've given him a dad who I frankly do not like at all despite their attempt to give the guy a few sympathetic beats. LIke Marion, he just doesn't have the chemistry with Will that both Angie and Angela-- and Faith and Oremwood (and Cricket) (and Rafael!) all have. 

This show is best when it's mixing humor with badassery and developing its characters. I love Nico, I love Angie's sponsor and the coroner. They do a fantastic job creating characters and making them immediately compelling. Rafael was very interesting and that whole arc was complex and illuminating in numerous ways. 

But they seem to love to create hope for Will and then rip it away from him. I'm not a masochist. I don't want to watch a show that makes me love someone and takes pleasure in crushing his heart over and over again.  So knock it off, show! 

I thought using the archery team as parts of the solution was great, but I hated the sexist way they characterized the girls. Believe me-- if it was a male archery team, they would not have played them to be such idiots. Do better, show.

--

Amanda has been extra fed up and irritible for a few episodes now. I kept waiting to find out why. I would have preferred to see that explored, rather than to see her shot in what in any even moderately realistic scenario would be instant death.

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tinderbox

tinderbox

2 hours ago, possibilities said:

 

…This show is best when it's mixing humor with badassery and developing its characters. I love Nico, I love Angie's sponsor and the coroner. They do a fantastic job creating characters and making them immediately compelling. Rafael was very interesting and that whole arc was complex and illuminating in numerous ways…

2 hours ago, possibilities said:

 

Hear hear to this part of your post, in particular.

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snarktini

snarktini

My heart broke for Will after the ultrasound. I could feel that pain! Even if you have let go, what might have been is strong and watching your ex move hurts. I think the baby is the doctor's, because she didn't even blink before saying it was his. There was no hesitation or conflicted-look foreshadowing. I believe more time has passed than it might seem.

My wish for the script was that she would miscarry. Then they could take her through the arc of this making her realize she does actually want to be a mom and doing the work to get clean first. We'd get growth for her without it starting in such a messy way.

Like everyone else, I don't want Ormewood or Amanda to die -- and the show would be dumb to do that! Things are going well, what would the point be unless one actor wants to leave? But if not, why write it so both end up in mortal danger? TV-writing logic says one lives, one dies. But hoping for a double miracle.

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Orbert

Orbert

That was a fun episode.  Scary, but with enough humor sprinkled throughout to keep things from getting too dark.  Yeah, it's not realistic to have "fun banter" during life-or-death situations, but hey, it's TV.  Discussing dinner plans while barricading perps, tumor nickname pun lists?  It's all part of the job.

I saw it asked but not answered.  Roy the homeless guy died.  There was a shot of a TV report naming people confirmed dead from the then-unknown pathogen, and Roy was the first person named.

I'm glad the archery team got to play a role in taking out the bad guys, but it wouldn't have made sense for them to actually shoot anyone.  I wouldn't want to see the trauma of killing someone, even a domestic terrorist, inflicted on a high school kid.  Being a teenager these days is insane enough as it is.

One trope nitpick complaint: Angie sneaking through the air vents, talking to herself (or really her unborn fetus) out loud.  Yes, she was speaking quietly.  But come on, you're trying to sneak around and not be discovered; you don't make any noise at all that you don't need to be making.

Oh, sorry, two trope complaints: Potential fatal injury as season cliffhanger.  We saw Amanda take that hit, directly above her heart if not actually grazing it.  I was sure she was a goner and was already pissed about it, but she's in critical condition until next January, which actually pisses me off even more.  Similarly, Ormewood may or may not make it.  In the old days, and perhaps even now, they did this when they thought they might shake things up between seasons (that is, get rid of a few characters) or maybe some contracts were still up in the air.  Maybe they come back, maybe they don't.  But they actually listened to whoever said "Hey, what if we make Ormewood not an asshole?" and he's been great this season.  Why change him to be actually likeable, then kill him off?

  • Like 9
AnimeMania

AnimeMania

3 hours ago, Orbert said:

I'm glad the archery team got to play a role in taking out the bad guys, but it wouldn't have made sense for them to actually shoot anyone.  I wouldn't want to see the trauma of killing someone, even a domestic terrorist, inflicted on a high school kid.  Being a teenager these days is insane enough as it is.

They may or may not have already killed 5 terrorists, what is one more to prove who is the best archer on the team.

snarktini

snarktini

4 hours ago, Orbert said:

One trope nitpick complaint: Angie sneaking through the air vents, talking to herself (or really her unborn fetus) out loud.  Yes, she was speaking quietly.  But come on, you're trying to sneak around and not be discovered; you don't make any noise at all that you don't need to be making.

There was also a moment where she's messaging from inside the air shafts, her phone volume is on and you can hear the sent noise. C'mon, son.

  • Like 1
Clanstarling

Clanstarling

On 5/13/2025 at 9:08 PM, agathapenny said:

Will finding out his dad loved his mom! Yay!

I hoped that Will's origin wouldn't be as sleazy as it seemed like it might be. I'm glad that's the way it went.

On 5/14/2025 at 12:01 AM, Dowel Jones said:

When the Sheriff and Will were blocking up the door, I kept thinking of the Blues Brothers movie.  

I didn't think of that, but thought it was a great scene. Now that you mention it, I can't keep the Blues Brother's out of my mind. It is one of our top movies to rewatch here in our house.

On 5/14/2025 at 9:20 AM, wonderwoman said:

it did sound like peyton place, which was on abc. but i just checked and it’s not on any streaming service. weird. 

We have several local tv stations (not streaming) that show reruns of very old shows all day long. It might not be on a streamer, but I'd bet it's on some tv station somewhere.

  • Like 2
MBayGal

MBayGal

With the double cliffhanger of Ormewood and Amanda, I wonder if there are salary negotiations involved.

I guess DH and are in in small minority who thought the way Will met his father was a ridiculous and unsatisfying choice by the writers. The magic archery team was even more ridiculous, but it was funny and will not affect the story in the future. 

Some people have criticized Angie's welcome pregnancy as a cheap device for her become a sober and healthy person.  I think she has been working on herself and is ready to handle this life change, especially with the love and support of Dr Seth, who is also in recovery. But I suspect he will die tragically next season and she and Will will end up a couple. I'd much rather Will finds his own person, but I doubt it.

statsgirl

statsgirl

While I generally like following the book or canon, sometimes deviating produces a better story (e.g. Arrow).

On 5/16/2025 at 12:45 PM, Orbert said:

One trope nitpick complaint: Angie sneaking through the air vents, talking to herself (or really her unborn fetus) out loud.  Yes, she was speaking quietly.  But come on, you're trying to sneak around and not be discovered; you don't make any noise at all that you don't need to be making.

I assumed that the was for the sake of the audience and had it been a real situation, she would have thought it but not said it out loud.

  • Like 3
Orbert

Orbert

3 hours ago, statsgirl said:

I assumed that the was for the sake of the audience and had it been a real situation, she would have thought it but not said it out loud.

Oh, definitely.  It's just that it always takes me out of the scene because it's catering to the audience, practically breaking the fourth wall, when we know that they would never really be yapping out loud like that the whole time.

  • Like 3
truthaboutluv

truthaboutluv

(edited)
On 5/15/2025 at 11:55 AM, possibilities said:

In addition to NOT killing Amanda or Oremwood, I really want them to stop torturing Will.

I am grossed out by the "barely sober, in a new relationship, but we guess she's ready to be a parent and it's twu luv between her and her new guy" plot, but I'm accepting it because I'm tired of seeing Angie be stuck. On any other wshow, I'd stop watching, because the propaganda about pregnancy redeeming women and magically giving them mental health is dangerous and false and one of the most sexist things ever to be propagated.

But they need to also show some love to Will, and not make this into a ceaseless misery porn extravaganza for his character. I'm still not over how they killed Cricket and replaced her with no-chemistry Marion who clearly didn't understand him at all.

I'm glad they stopped the on-again/off-again with him and Angie, but they really need to stop making him the receiver of nothing but pain and disappointment. He met and then lost contact with his uncle. Now they've given him a dad who I frankly do not like at all despite their attempt to give the guy a few sympathetic beats. LIke Marion, he just doesn't have the chemistry with Will that both Angie and Angela-- and Faith and Oremwood (and Cricket) (and Rafael!) all have.

It's taken me a week to comment on the season finale because I was sort of mixed on it and I think you summed up my feelings well. On one hand, I'm happy for Angie I guess if this means she finally gets some healthy normalcy in her life. But part of me was bitter that why does SHE get to have this happily ever after scenario after all her fuck-ups, while Will gets to be alone and scared that Amanda, his "family" might be dying.

And to be very clear, to quote Angie's ringtone for Will, I decidedly DO NOT want Angie and Will getting back to together. I just hated seeing the writers give her some pseudo-happy ever after while Will slinks away alone with just his dog to cling to. And yes, I know this is a series and so Angie's happiness is probably on borrowed time but it still bugged me.

And honestly, I am not opposed to Angie remaining happy with Dr. Seth. Just give Will some happiness. I've never read the books but I have read the synopsis so I know of his romantiic interest there (won't say a name or any more in case that's a spoiler) and I think it's high time the show-runners cast that character. 

I also thought the episode had some clunky beats - not one scene of Will with Niko at the hospital was weird. I'm sure this was an editing issue and it's probably one of multiple scenes left on the cutting room floor, but it came across very weird. That Ormewood goes to see Niko when everything has calmed down but not Will who Niko lives with and is essentially Niko's guardian of sorts. 

It was also weird how we never saw Marion again, but particularly this episode where there was a terror threat on the city, when wasn't she the Assistant DA? It's clear the writers cast Gina Rodriguez with no clear plan of what to do with her but are now stuck with the little problem of her being a regular. Maybe that will change for the upcoming season. 

I'm iffy about Will's biological father. Didn't love him but if it means they actually give Will a living parent and family that doesn't disappear or end up dead, then I guess that's not a bad thing. 

Edited by truthaboutluv
  • Like 2
peachmangosteen

peachmangosteen

10 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

It's clear the writers cast Gina Rodriguez with no clear plan of what to do with her but are now stuck with the little problem of her being a regular. Maybe that will change for the upcoming season.

I really think whoever speculated that ABC had some kind of deal with Gina Rodriguez that they needed to fulfill so they just threw her in here might have been right. I suspect she won't be back at all next season honestly.

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Irlandesa

Irlandesa

7 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I really think whoever speculated that ABC had some kind of deal with Gina Rodriguez that they needed to fulfill so they just threw her in here might have been right. I suspect she won't be back at all next season honestly.

T'was I.  And when asked if she'd be back in the post-season interviews, the show runners did their usual "oh she's alive, wonderful and we'd love to see the character again but Gina is so busy" speel. 

I'm not saying we'll never see her but I do think the character has served its purpose.

I'm surprised they made Scott Foley the father if Angie's baby.  Now he's an actor who is also very busy and gets cast in things. I wonder how they're going to navigate that.

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DearEvette

DearEvette

On 5/15/2025 at 9:20 PM, mrsbagnet said:

My favorite Franklin line was "Look at God! Won't He do it?" The captions on Hulu got that line completely wrong.

I Know!!  I had to rewind because I was sure that is what he said but the captions were telling me differently.

I agree with everyone this was a great episode.  I liked the different teams working together:

Amanda/Angie- we don't get to see them work together often, I think I liked their teamwork the best because it relied on smarts and stealth and strategy.

Faith/Ormy (ha!)/Franklin - Also a great team up.  I really enjoyed their dynamic especially when you add in the archery girls.

And then Will/Will's Dad - I liked that we got the back story on how the parents met.  But I did raise my eyebrows that dad so quickly resorted to force. I think he broke that guy's hand in the prison cell?  If Uncle Antonio makes a re-appearance I wonder what his reaction will be to knowing not only is his nephew in law enforcement but so is his father.

I love the use of humor in the show and love how over the seasons the show has incorporated humor.  As much as I liked the first season, it took itself pretty seriously.  I think the tumor jokes, the archery girls snarking on each other, Will and his father making dinner plans (and making sure of dietary preferences) while multi-tasking with stopping domestic terrorists helps to cut the tension.  There are fraught things happening but the little quips help you to breath amidst all the dire stuff.  And it gives the show a lot of re-watch potential.  I often find I'll rewatch episodes I found enjoyable over those that are just one trauma after another even when the ep is dealing with serious stuff.

I really hope they don't kill off either Amanda or Ormewood.  I am hoping this isn't that show.  The actors looked very happy and upbeat during the Disney upfronts so maybe we will get a reprieve.

Also, on a shallow note, I gasped when Amanda got shot becuase 1) it was right in the chest but also because 2) all that blood on that outfit!! I loved that plaid jacket.

  • Like 10
Irlandesa

Irlandesa

On 5/15/2025 at 10:55 AM, possibilities said:

I am grossed out by the "barely sober, in a new relationship, but we guess she's ready to be a parent and it's twu luv between her and her new guy" plot, but I'm accepting it because I'm tired of seeing Angie be stuck. On any other wshow, I'd stop watching, because the propaganda about pregnancy redeeming women and magically giving them mental health is dangerous and false and one of the most sexist things ever to be propagated.

I don't know where the show will go but I don't think it's going to be smooth for Angle where having a baby magically reforms her. 

In fact, I think this may end up being another messy step for her.

  • Like 1
SHERMDOG

SHERMDOG

On 5/14/2025 at 2:01 AM, Dowel Jones said:

I was on the other end of the archery team hijinks.  The writers must have taken a page from Fire Country with all the dopey personal dialogue in a very tense situation.  What part of a shootout did you girls not understand?  But they proved their worth, I guess.

When the Sheriff and Will were blocking up the door, I kept thinking of the Blues Brothers movie.  

I'm surprised Amanda survived even to the hospital.  A large caliber bullet to the center of the chest should be fatal immediately.

On a positive note, did everyone catch the short of Betty dunking on the basket during the commercial break?  Too cute!

Yes..that commercial cracked me up...I had to rewind it to watch again. Ha

  • Like 1
bunnyface

bunnyface

On 5/22/2025 at 10:31 PM, Irlandesa said:

I don't know where the show will go but I don't think it's going to be smooth for Angle where having a baby magically reforms her. 

In fact, I think this may end up being another messy step for her.

But isn't that life?  People are seldom ever in a perfect place to have a baby.  People in really awful situations have babies every day.  It either makes them or breaks them and both outcomes are usually messy in the process.  'Tis life.

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NJRadioGuy

NJRadioGuy

Re this wild and wonderful show, and the lack of realism. As someone with PD and FD family and tangentially having worked in the field myself, as a viewer I'm generally appalled when shows take obscene liberties with medicine, fire physics and constitutional law. I'll criticize the One Chicago series, and will rag on Fire Country or 9-1-1 mercilessly because of how stupidly they portray the job and how head-shakingly bad the writing can often be.

But for this show, I can't treat it as a regular procedural because it's so very much more than that. I'll go into Chicago PD expecting (and frequently getting) a well told procedural. I go into this much as I would a stage play. It's about the characters first and foremost. The plot is often a secondary concern. Same with The Rookie, but that is just a "shut-my-brain-off-and-pop-some-corn" kind of show.

I don't think I've been more emotionally invested in any characters in a drama than I am for the core cast and even the supporting players in Will Trent. Something changed in Season 2, when it got transformed in my eyes from a simple procedural into this masterpiece of storytelling. I can't pinpoint exactly when it was, but the back half of last year and all of S3 has been above and beyond for me.

About the only thing that didn't work for me was Amanda taking a rifle shot the way she did and not being dead before she hit the floor. 5.56 and 7.62 ammunition isn't like a .22 or a 9mm, where the victim can have a shot at making it. They are brutal rounds that will do incredible damage. Now obviously I hope Amanda makes it back in Season 4 since her character is so vital to the overall story, but if they chose to have her shot in that manner, then she needed to expire, and her role as guiding mentor to Will be transferred to his newfound biological dad. And I still think that's where this is headed, unfortunately.

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possibilities

possibilities

(edited)
On 6/5/2025 at 3:22 PM, NJRadioGuy said:

if they chose to have her shot in that manner, then she needed to expire, and her role as guiding mentor to Will be transferred to his newfound biological dad. And I still think that's where this is headed, unfortunately.

If they do this, I think it will kill my love of the show. I hate the dad character and I love Amanda, and there is just nothing I can think of to recommend this choice, other than realistically paying off the stupidity of setting it up that way in the first place by shooting her.

While I tend to agree that (aside from obviously campy shows) they shouldn't set something like this up without paying it off, I think setting it up is show-killingly stupid and I'd rather they course correct than continue to kill the show due to this mistake.

Edited by possibilities
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