I Saw The Signs: A Rewatch Thread

[Lsk02]

3 hours ago, ginger90 said:

I don’t recall that. Was it in their book, or discussed in an episode?

It was in an early episode, when Christine talked about her fears with this pregnancy and her choice to give birth in a hospital instead of at home. I think it was a late miscarriage/stillbirth before Truely and Christine hemorrhaged at home and was very, very sick.  

[Twopper]

On 2/2/2022 at 6:28 AM, LilyD said:

I just watched this episode and know a lot of people blamed Christine for letting it get this far but in truth, she wasn't even around when Truely got sick! She'd been away to San Francisco with the other wives and   Kody had offered to watch all the kids with the help of Aspyn and Logan Kody told Aspyn and Logan to watch the kids for him. When she came home, Truely had already been sick for days!  Kody was the parent on watch, twho was responsible for her welfare and he quickly dismissed her illness as nothing serious. 

It's true that Christine did not take her to the hospital straight away but I get that. Children can be incredibly sick for just a day or a day or two and then bounce back.(Two of my young kids got Covid recently with a raging fever of 104F but were absolutely fine within 2 days!)  I have a gut feeling no one told Christine that she'd been this sick for days. Kody had only said that Truely didn't feel well but that it probably was just a flu.  So with that knowledge, it is pretty hard to decide whether or not to call a doctor.

When Truely started to look cross-eyed the next day, Christine grabbed her and drove her to the doctor who then referred her to the hospital as his first concern was meningitis. (Christine does say just before they drove to the doctor "apparently she's been like this for days...") Not in this episode, nor the next one is a reference for Aspyn telling her parents that this was very serious as some have said...Asypen did watch her for a while when Christine was running an errand and it was Mykelti who said that she'd seen Truely look cross-eyed that morning when Christine mentioned it. Yet Mykelti didn't recognise this as serious trouble either and only said it because her mom mentioned it.

On hind-sight, it's always easy to say what you should have done. But on the very rare occasion that I am away from home, I trust my husband to take the decisions. If he tells me that a child is sick but it is nothing serious, I would believe him too. Christine did recognise the signs that really meant trouble like being lethargic and be crossed-eyed, but she must have really believed Kody when he said that there wasn't really anything wrong when they talked on the phone. I'm sure she would have taken Truely to the hospital there and then if she had known Truely had been this sick for days. So yes,  Douchebag is the one who needs to carry most of the blame.

I am not sure where we had this discussion, but when I rewatched this episode it appears to have been edited. There was a part of it where kody tells aspen to give Truly some kind of drink that they were probably selling as an mim

[Sandy W]

27 minutes ago, Twopper said:

I am not sure where we had this discussion, but when I rewatched this episode it appears to have been edited. There was a part of it where kody tells aspen to give Truly some kind of drink that they were probably selling as an mim

That's what I recall from the original episode too (I haven't re-watched).  Kody was charring something on the patio grill, Aspyn came to the door and expressed her concern.  Without going in to check on her himself, he told Aspyn to give her some LIV water, the MLM that they were involved with (and still may be).

[Maire]

Stuck home with this cold weather and have been rewatching from the beginning. It’s interesting that in the beginning they had many more group outings involving everyone. Later they’d focus one of two events per season(pregnancy, wedding etc. ) so we didn’t see the whole dynamic. Easier to hide the whole family issues.

It’s also crazy to see now how the wives tried to be buddies and even talked about traveling together with each other in the future. They were really putting a happy, fake face on things. 

[kicotan]

1 hour ago, Maire said:

It’s interesting that in the beginning they had many more group outings involving everyone.

Between Janelle, Christine & Meri they pumped out 12 kids in 10 years 

Logan-94

Aspyn, Mariah & Madison-95

Mykelti-96

Hunter-97

Paedon, Garrison-98

Gabriel & Gwendolyn-01

Ysabel-03

Savannah-04

12 kids stretched over10 years -oldest being 16 and youngest being 6 when we met them in 2010, yeah, I could see there would be a LOT more group outings and family time.  Christine was pregnant with Truly, the last of the 13 the original three agreed to breed for him when he announced the courting of a 4th wife who already had 3 kids and would add another 2 on top of that.

Even in a monogamous marriage, life is going to change with 16 kids as they grow up and spread their wings. My husband’s grandparents had 11.  Just between the two of them.  Their oldest daughter & her husband had 15.  They weren’t even polygamists!  The big kids helped raise the little kids, until they left and had their own.

Can you imagine, as a woman, agreeing to having as many kids as possible with one guy and at least 2 other women when all of you are as fertile as you are ever going to be?  I mean, I understand the DickTater Kodouche being all in, because obviously these women don’t give a shit about anything other than the sperm donation.  But I just can’t get past the brood mare mentality of these women who married him and had all these kids with him…knowing FULL well he’s not going to physically be able to give each and every one of  them all the time and attention they deserve.  They weren’t all kept in a basement.

[LilyD]

 

Quote

That's what I recall from the original episode too (I haven't re-watched).  Kody was charring something on the patio grill, Aspyn came to the door and expressed her concern.  Without going in to check on her himself, he told Aspyn to give her some LIV water 

I'm starting to wonder whether they edited this episode later on? It seems like I've watched a totally different episode from you all?? I know this happens (like editing scenes or people out later on).  I totally believe your recollections from this episode.

 I've just re-watched the two episodes again on Discovery Plus and then went back and forth several times and I can't find any scene that describes the scenes above. The only thing that comes close is Ysabel stubbing her toe and Kody being called away from his grill to look after it. He then burned his steaks. But that was long before Truely got ill.

The scene were Aspyn expressed her big worries was lafter the pool party and bowling  and was as follows:

Aspyn: Truly doesn’t feel well at all, she kept me up all last night. Kody: She doesn’t really have a fever. I don’t know what’s wrong Aspyn: She was really warm. Kody: She wasn’t that hot! I know a fever!    There was no reference to any drink whatsoever, nor a reference to Kody consulting a doctor as was later claimed by Christine. Kody obviously dismissed it as nothing serious.

Christine said  the following when they left  SF "Kody, Aspyn and Mykelti tell me she is really sick. Kody thinks she’s got a flu but without the fever. Aspyn and Mykelti were freaked out by her behaviour."  When Christine came home, it was Mykelti who came across very concerned and said: "She was literally bawling in her room, sometimes we could hold her for a bit and then we weren't allowed to touch her at all."

In the next episode (Browns in Crisis) Christine suddenly mentioned that Kody did take Truely to the doctor, though there was no reference in the previous episode like I said. She also said  that " it's been five days (of being ill)  and this morning she turned cross-eyed.

I can't tell how many days there were between Christine coming home and going to the hospital. The editing is mixed up. My gut feeling says it was the day after they came home (after the flower shopping) as Aspyn and Mykelti watched Truely. Then Mykelti says to Christine that Truely went cross-eyed that morning. Which was when Christine rushed her to a doctor. The editing makes it look like days though...

Two other interesting "fun" quotes from this episode:

Robyn: "I know I'd be stressed out if I had to take care of so many kids!" (yeah we know babe, not your cup of tea!)

Aspyn: "Dad called me 16 times after 3 pm last night! 16 times!! (When Kody was watching some kids on his own)

Sorry for the long post guys!

 

Edited February 7, 2022 by LilyD
added italics

[Sandy W]

4 hours ago, LilyD said:

 

I'm starting to wonder whether they edited this episode later on? It seems like I've watched a totally different episode from you all?? I know this happens (like editing scenes or people out later on).  I totally believe your recollections from this episode.

 

 

My memory isn't infallible, so my recollection could be mistaken, but I also seem to recall on-line outrage over Kody dismissively telling Aspyn? or Mykelti? to administer LIV water without going in to check on her himself.  Could be it was edited out because of the mention of one of their side businesses by name.  Notice Mykelti, Meri and Christine never mention LLR by name, the closest reference has been something like --- a line of clothing.  Ditto for Janelle with her Strive enterprise.  There was one episode where a LIV bottle was evident on a kitchen counter, I wonder if that too has been edited out.

I do recall the toe stubbing incident, the burning of the steaks and them wrapping Truely in a blanket to take her to the bowling alley. 

The sequence of events leading to Truely to eventually get adequate medical attention could also have been shifted to present the family in a more positive light.

[aimlessbird]

17 hours ago, ginger90 said:

I don’t recall that. Was it in their book, or discussed in an episode?

I'm pretty sure that it was in the book.  It has also been mentioned 2 or 3 times on the show.

[Elizzikra]

6 hours ago, LilyD said:

 

Aspyn: Truly doesn’t feel well at all, she kept me up all last night. Kody: She doesn’t really have a fever. I don’t know what’s wrong Aspyn: She was really warm. Kody: She wasn’t that hot! I know a fever!   

 

Did he even use a thermometer or did he just decide that she didn’t have a fever through some laying on of hands?

[ginger90]

I was looking for something else that was mentioned in another thread. No luck, but I came across this:

 

 

[ginger90]

11 years ago:

 

 

[ginger90]

 

 

 

 

[LilyD]

2 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

Did he even use a thermometer or did he just decide that she didn’t have a fever through some laying on of hands?

Of course he didn’t use a thermometer. His magic touch was enough to know Truely didn’t have a fever. I hate it when people say you can’t be seriously ill if you don’t have a fever!

[deirdra]

7 hours ago, Sandy W said:

My memory isn't infallible, so my recollection could be mistaken, but I also seem to recall on-line outrage over Kody dismissively telling Aspyn? or Mykelti? to administer LIV water without going in to check on her himself.  Could be it was edited out because of the mention of one of their side businesses by name.  

Yeah, I was amazed that they left the "LIV" water in the first time I watched.  Maybe TLC thought he was saying "leave" or something other than a brand name. And I recall seeing a couple of bottles that said LIV on them when they were thinking of running a gym.  I wasn't aware of the brand, but people on here pointed it out at the time. Another time Kootie was wearing a shirt with his gun company logo on it that was blurred out in later showings. I could actually read it the first time, googled it & found it & Kody listed as not having paid his business license fee.  You'd think TLC would say NO LOGOs so that they didn't have to spend money to obliterate it.

Edited February 8, 2022 by deirdra

[Cetacean]

52 minutes ago, deirdra said:

You'd think TLC would say NO KODY so that they didn't have to spend money to obliterate it.

FIFY

[LilyD]

This editing actually turned into a rather interesting small discussion. I've watched most episodes (apart from the period of the infamous catfish thing and after which I found horrible) and I have never spotted anything like the LIV water for instance. I only learned here that this is one of their infamous MLM ventures. On several occasions, I have felt that something was edited out or in. My memory is pretty decent, especially when it comes to images. I can't always tell what changed though, but know there's something... Take the Truely episode for instance; when I rewatched it, I really felt that something was different, I just couldn't figure out what...

I should add we're in Europe and generally behind (sometimes a lot!) when it comes to broadcasting. For once we aren't with SW as the new episodes are broadcast a few days after you watch it. Also, rules regarding commercials and promotions are different within the EU which would explain a lot of things regarding the MLMs. Heck, I've even seen the big white Apple sign on the back of Kody's computer blurred out on more than one occasion, though not consistently.

In short, yeah, convinced they're messing with the original episodes for sure!!

[Sandy W]

7 hours ago, LilyD said:

This editing actually turned into a rather interesting small discussion. I've watched most episodes (apart from the period of the infamous catfish thing and after which I found horrible) and I have never spotted anything like the LIV water for instance. I only learned here that this is one of their infamous MLM ventures. On several occasions, I have felt that something was edited out or in. My memory is pretty decent, especially when it comes to images. I can't always tell what changed though, but know there's something... Take the Truely episode for instance; when I rewatched it, I really felt that something was different, I just couldn't figure out what...

 

I'm sure that when contracts were signed, the ground rules for product placement were clearly laid out.  That however didn't stop Kody from thinking he was smarter than the lawyers who drew up the contracts and attempting to skirt the rules by wearing a t-shirt emblazoned with the logo of his gun business and prominently displaying LIV water bottles. 

The audacity of him!  The whole family should be profoundly grateful to TLC for giving them the opportunity to pull themselves from the life of food stamps, rotating bankruptcies and the mold-infested home in Lehi with an income stream they could never had imagined. 

They blew it anyhow with real estate investments in Flagstaff that were beyond their reach.  The only real benefits they have capitalized on by exposing their lives are the various MLM's exploited by some of the females in the family.  Kody has parlayed this Golden Goose to a nothingburger that has exposed him as the fraud of a father and husband he must have been from the start.

Edited February 8, 2022 by Sandy W
thought of other reasons to be grateful to TLC

[Not Buyin It]

I am also doing a lot of rewatching of episodes. Something struck me the other day while watching the episodes covering Ysabel's surgery: why didn't all the mothers gather round that girl and insist that Kody go to NJ to be with THEIR daughter for her major surgery? Aren't they all supposed to be one big family? Don't all the children belong to all the mothers? Seems to me they would have rallied and told Kody and Christine to go take care of Ysabel while they hold down the fort, caring for all the other kids and households.

Seems their talk about being one big, happy polygamist family is just that: talk.

[Ms.Lulu]

9 hours ago, Not Buyin It said:

I am also doing a lot of rewatching of episodes. Something struck me the other day while watching the episodes covering Ysabel's surgery: why didn't all the mothers gather round that girl and insist that Kody go to NJ to be with THEIR daughter for her major surgery? Aren't they all supposed to be one big family? Don't all the children belong to all the mothers? Seems to me they would have rallied and told Kody and Christine to go take care of Ysabel while they hold down the fort, caring for all the other kids and households.

Seems their talk about being one big, happy polygamist family is just that: talk.

To state the obvious:

We know why Robyn didn't, Kody told us that Robyn didn't want her birth spawn to spend 2 weeks without Kody--apparently they are goldfish with 6 second memories.  If they don't see Kody everyday they might think someone else is their father--just ask Mr Jessep.

I wouldn't be surprised if Janelle suggested it to Kody, especially as Kody accused Janelle and Christine of being a clique.  It may have happened off camera.

Nobody cares what Meri thinks.  Kody has acquaintance zoned her and I suspect she goes months without Kody moments.

Edited February 10, 2022 by Ms.Lulu

[LilyD]

5 hours ago, Ms.Lulu said:

Nobody cares what Meri thinks.  Kody has acquaintance zoned her and I suspect she goes months without Kody moments.

In the tell all nothink-episode part 1 Kody talked about quarantine and “having to deal with 4 pods, no wait 3 as Meri and I no longer live together.” He also said that he no longer felt any connection at all, that they would never recover and that they barely spoke. 

Meri has frequently said that he doesn’t come to see her. They had a date for their anniversary and their next date was their next “anniversary” In the car, Meri said to him that she often asked him to come. Kody’s cruel reply: “And I’m not coming!” Then set her free douchebag!! It’s clear Meri is incapable of releasing herself. So far for this strong independent woman. Clinging to a person who wants to have nothing to do to you is sad and shows you have no self-esteem.

I find it amusing they both still call it a marriage. It’s literally nothingk at all… Even acquaintences have more contact than they do!

[ChiCricket]

On 2/6/2022 at 8:56 AM, ginger90 said:

Back in the day….

Oh! I forgot about the terrible black hair dye on Mariah.

[Elodia]

1 hour ago, ChiCricket said:

Oh! I forgot about the terrible black hair dye on Mariah.

Although Mariah DID have (still has?) a terrible black hair dye, this picture shows Maddie, whose hair color is just as awful. Acually Mariah looked pretty in that family picture (standing next to Meri).

[Maire]

Up to season 6 on the rewatch and I think the disintegration is really coming through when they buy the houses on the cul de sac. They finally have some money and it’s all going back out to the mortgages. Even worse Robyn, who just got there, gets a big share.

Meri is insufferable, crying about getting her house last. She screwed around with her paperwork and ended up last. Her fault! 

I can’t imagine how the wives felt looking back at this season. They got what they supposedly wanted and things weren’t better. 

[Cetacean]

3 hours ago, LilyD said:

In the car, Meri said to him that she often asked him to come. Kody’s cruel reply: “And I’m not coming!” Then set her free douchebag!! It’s clear Meri is incapable of releasing herself.

I'm not sure what else Kootie can do, though. He's made it plain as day that he can't stand her but Meri keeps creeping round the periphery trying to get his attention. Does he need a formal "begone, witch" announcement to set her free?  Not sure that would even penetrate that thick "maybe someday he'll take me back" skull of hers. 

She's freaking hopeless and a minus ten on the self esteem meter no matter how many stupid platitudes she steals from the internet and posts on her SM sites for her adoring fans.

[TurtlePower]

25 minutes ago, Cetacean said:

I'm not sure what else Kootie can do, though. He's made it plain as day that he can't stand her but Meri keeps creeping round the periphery trying to get his attention. Does he need a formal "begone, witch" announcement to set her free?  Not sure that would even penetrate that thick "maybe someday he'll take me back" skull of hers. 

She's freaking hopeless and a minus ten on the self esteem meter no matter how many stupid platitudes she steals from the internet and posts on her SM sites for her adoring fans.

I’m surprised he hasn’t. The woman really cannot take a hint and what Meri’s doing is kinda nuts. Meri says she understands where their relationship is at, then throws in some remark about having “hope” it will improve. I dislike Kody but he can’t seem to get the message across to Meri.

Her unwanted flirtation sometimes borders on harassment (recalling last season) and women never get called out on that behavior—if it was a man doing it to a woman, people would be all over it. 

Edited February 10, 2022 by TurtlePower
Punctuation

[Noergli]

I saw the 30th anniversary few days ago and it was so cringe to see how desperate Meri was teasing Kody with the "what he would do if she would try to kiss him now". I was really not sure if she just wanted to wind him up or if she was really so desperate for affection from him. I hope it's the first one but if it is the second one, poor woman 😳

[kicotan]

2 hours ago, TurtlePower said:

I dislike Kody but he can’t seem to get the message across to Meri.

I’m pretty sure she’s gotten the message, loud and clear, that he doesn’t want to cuddle, kiss, have sex, be romantic toward each other, etc.  I’m not sure if “for better or worse, through sickness and health & til death do us part” was in their particular vows, but I’d be willing to bet that if they truly believe the stuff their religion teaches about the afterlife, it doesn’t even matter if they lay eyes on each other fully clothed  from across the room-they are spiritually married for eternity-unless they jump through the hoops and get officially un-sealed by their priesthood.

Hilarity ensues.

Edited February 10, 2022 by kicotan
Spelling

[Sandy W]

3 hours ago, Noergli said:

I saw the 30th anniversary few days ago and it was so cringe to see how desperate Meri was teasing Kody with the "what he would do if she would try to kiss him now". I was really not sure if she just wanted to wind him up or if she was really so desperate for affection from him. I hope it's the first one but if it is the second one, poor woman 😳

Even if it's the first one, what's her point?  If he doesn't care for her at all, it just rolls off his back and she is left spinning her wheels and wasting her life.  No possible satisfaction in that as I see it.

[LilyD]

On 2/10/2022 at 1:13 PM, Maire said:

Up to season 6 on the rewatch and I think the disintegration is really coming through when they buy the houses on the cul de sac. They finally have some money and it’s all going back out to the mortgages. Even worse Robyn, who just got there, gets a big share.

Meri is insufferable, crying about getting her house last. She screwed around with her paperwork and ended up last. Her fault! 

I can’t imagine how the wives felt looking back at this season. They got what they supposedly wanted and things weren’t better. 

Iirc the houses were fully financed. The Lehi house wasn’t sold until the summer of 2016 (as confirmed by Kody on SM and the new owner on her website) and the Browns had wasted an awful lot of money on expensive rentals around Vegas and that ridiculous move without any plans in place. Also, there was about 400k (Janelle’s inheritance) locked away in the Lehi house, which they also sold at a loss.

As for getting equal shares: I was actually more upset with Meri than with Robyn. Meri demanded the same huge house and budget as anyone else for just ONE person. (Mariah went to college 6 months after she got the keys so she lived there alone) Particularly the budget annoyed me like hell. She had the same weekly budget as Janelle who had 6 more mouths to feed. And four of those belonged to insatiable teenage boys that eat 24/7 during puberty!

[Sandy W]

13 minutes ago, LilyD said:

 

As for getting equal shares: I was actually more upset with Meri than with Robyn. Meri demanded the same huge house and budget as anyone else for just ONE person. (Mariah went to college 6 months after she got the keys so she lived there alone) Particularly the budget annoyed me like hell. She had the same weekly budget as Janelle who had 6 more mouths to feed. And four of those belonged to insatiable teenage boys that eat 24/7 during puberty!

The Plan of Subdivision would have called for houses of approximately the same square footage, so I can't fault Meri too much for a house of the same size as the others.  All of the houses were "builder's basic"  ---  lowest grade carpeting, no millwork around windows or interior door frames, fireplace mantels, minimal baseboards etc.  Where Meri got greedy was her insistence on upgrades such as the wet bar and french doors.

Shortly after they moved in, TLC posted a tour of the homes on their site.  I noted with interest that Meri's laundry room was equipped with matching front load washer and dryer on platforms and by contrast, Christine with 6 kids had what looked like mismatched w/d that appeared to be something she had dragged from the Lehi house. Meri claims she didn't put him up to it but Kody had the nerve to go to Christine, who was under budget, and ask if she would kick in her surplus to defray Meri's over-run.

[ginger90]

These are the same people who had window blinds added to their mortgages if I recall correctly. Meri probably did the same with her washer and dryer. 🤷🏼‍♀️

[WhatsUpDummy]

If I'm remembering right, Meri ended up being about $5K over budget and she said she would pay the difference out of pocket.  Kody did make some comment to Christine (who was significantly under budget) about giving up some of her money to offset Meri's overage, but Christine said no and she ended spending her money on the stone on the outside of her house.  I'm not really bothered by Meri going overboard on her choices because at this point, they're no longer solely living off of Kody and Janelle's income. They're all on tv and they're all "working" for TLC, and they're all getting the same paycheck.  It's her money, she can spend it how she likes. Although, I would like to know what everyone's grocery budget was.  If there was any place in the budget where Meri could have given back a bit, that was it.  

Edited February 11, 2022 by WhatsUpDummy

[Awfarmington]

10 hours ago, WhatsUpDummy said:

If I'm remembering right, Meri ended up being about $5K over budget and she said she would pay the difference out of pocket.  Kody did make some comment to Christine (who was significantly under budget) about giving up some of her money to offset Meri's overage, but Christine said no and she ended spending her money on the stone on the outside of her house.  I'm not really bothered by Meri going overboard on her choices because at this point, they're no longer solely living off of Kody and Janelle's income. They're all on tv and they're all "working" for TLC, and they're all getting the same paycheck.  It's her money, she can spend it how she likes. Although, I would like to know what everyone's grocery budget was.  If there was any place in the budget where Meri could have given back a bit, that was it.  

In the very early episodes, it was pointed out that Mariah would go eat what Christine was making, instead of what Meri cooked. If the food allowance was the same for Meri and the other moms, that alone is crappy. But then your kid is going to Christine’s to eat dinner most nights?? What are the chances Meri reimbursed Christine for that…I’m guessing zero chance. 
 

On a related note. Meri had the POV that she should still get the same budget as the other moms because it’s not her fault she wasn’t able to have several kids, even though she wished she could have. Robin offered to make that happen and she messed around deciding, until Kody said forget about it. Also, she could have adopted children, offered to cook regular meals for the  ‘bonus’ kids, etc. I believe Meri didn’t really want more children. Having only one child makes her a martyr AND she has more than her fair share of the income. 

[LilyD]

Great post @Awfarmington, you're right about the food thing. Mariah would usually go and eat with Christine because she preferred her food over Meri's. Meri indeed exploited her "only one-child grief" saying that she shouldn't be punished more by being denied an equal share. It wasn't just the LV house. She had the most expensive rental in Vegas, with a pool, and she was called out by Janelle for that. Meri whipped her straight back into the doghouse with her "unfair punishment claim" making Janelle feel awful and guilty.

I'm just not 100% into your suggestion that Meri's refusal for IVF or using Robyn as a surrogate is proof that she didn't really want more kids. I have seen several people around me going through IVF and it is hard! It drains emotionally and physically with all the hormones and puts a huge strain on your relation. Also, when Kody suggested it, Mariah was 15 or so and Meri in her early 40s. It's a big thing to start all over again at that point. Lastly, adoption is a wonderful thing, but it's just not for everyone. That too, is a very personal decision. We have friends who weren't blessed with kids of their own but they accepted it as fate and opted against adoption because it didn't feel 100% to them.

This is one of the few occasions where one of the wives takes a decision they actually really thought through.  Normally they just jump to all kinds of big decisions without giving it much thought. 

 

 

[Joan of Argh]

I wonder if Meri wishes that she would have taken Robyn’s offer and had another kid?

IIRC Robyn made the offer after Sols birth so the child would be around 8? now and that might mean more contact with kody plus if the baby was birthed by Robyn it would magically gain some royal status in Kootie eyes.

[Pickleinthemiddle]

4 hours ago, LilyD said:

Great post @Awfarmington, you're right about the food thing. Mariah would usually go and eat with Christine because she preferred her food over Meri's. Meri indeed exploited her "only one-child grief" saying that she shouldn't be punished more by being denied an equal share. It wasn't just the LV house. She had the most expensive rental in Vegas, with a pool, and she was called out by Janelle for that. Meri whipped her straight back into the doghouse with her "unfair punishment claim" making Janelle feel awful and guilty.

I'm just not 100% into your suggestion that Meri's refusal for IVF or using Robyn as a surrogate is proof that she didn't really want more kids. I have seen several people around me going through IVF and it is hard! It drains emotionally and physically with all the hormones and puts a huge strain on your relation. Also, when Kody suggested it, Mariah was 15 or so and Meri in her early 40s. It's a big thing to start all over again at that point. Lastly, adoption is a wonderful thing, but it's just not for everyone. That too, is a very personal decision. We have friends who weren't blessed with kids of their own but they accepted it as fate and opted against adoption because it didn't feel 100% to them.

This is one of the few occasions where one of the wives takes a decision they actually really thought through.  Normally they just jump to all kinds of big decisions without giving it much thought. 

 

 

I agree,  I think Meri had pretty much made up her mind she was done having kids.  

[TurtlePower]

40 minutes ago, Pickleinthemiddle said:

I agree,  I think Meri had pretty much made up her mind she was done having kids.  

And I wonder if this was the thing that upset Kody about Meri—when he said Meri was “not the person he thought she was” and that she damaged the intimate relationship status. Maybe it had to do with her not wanting to produce more children for him……(?). 

[Cetacean]

5 hours ago, Joan of Argh said:

IIRC Robyn made the offer after Sols birth so the child would be around 8? now and that might mean more contact with kody plus if the baby was birthed by Robyn it would magically gain some royal status in Kootie eyes.

One wonders if they would even let Meri near the kid after it was born. I'm sure Kootie and Sobyn would come up with some list of excuses why it should be raised by the Golden Couple instead of Meri - too old, should be with kids around its own age, that kind of crap. 

And honestly, would Meri even want to raise a kid at that point?  Pudge was grown and ready to fly and an infant would certainly put a damper on any outside jobs.  There would probably be no lularags or the B&B.  I think that's one of the reasons Meri was waffling about IVF for so long.

And even if it was a boy, King Sol was in the catbird seat in the Robyn era.

[Pickleinthemiddle]

1 hour ago, TurtlePower said:

And I wonder if this was the thing that upset Kody about Meri—when he said Meri was “not the person he thought she was” and that she damaged the intimate relationship status. Maybe it had to do with her not wanting to produce more children for him……(?). 

I don't think it was that.  Who knows.  It could be a lot of things that snowballed, or one major thing.  

[ginger90]

9 minutes ago, Pickleinthemiddle said:

I don't think it was that.  Who knows.  It could be a lot of things that snowballed, or one major thing.  

I think it started when Kody married Janelle. 🤷🏼‍♀️

[LilyD]

On 2/12/2022 at 4:08 PM, Cetacean said:

One wonders if they would even let Meri near the kid after it was born. I'm sure Kootie and Sobyn would come up with some list of excuses why it should be raised by the Golden Couple instead of Meri - too old, should be with kids around its own age, that kind of crap. 

Wow! That would have been truly devastating and cruel! I thought about it at the time but never believed they would actually be that cruel. 
But as we have seen, Kody and Robyn have managed to (ab)use Covid to shut the others out at all costs. Even kids were sacrificed (Truely, Ysabel, Gabe, Savanah and Garrison) in order to turn a polygamous marriage into a monogamous one.So yes, I now believe them capable of withdrawing the baby offer after the birth leaving Meri with a broken heart.

[Adiba]

I think Kody is just re-writing history to excuse his own failings in his marriage with Meri. Meri may have changed in his eyes,, but who the hell is the same person now that they were when they were 19? They got married very young— she was 19 and he was 22. They didn’t court very long, either. 
Kody, imo, compares his previous marriages with his marriage to Robyn, which is unfair.
Robyn and Kody’s courtship started when they were offered the show—and 16 years after his last marriage. Everything must have seemed exciting and new for Kody. The show brought more income —they built the Vegas homes, had their 11-day honeymoon, big commitment ceremony, etc.  Robyn has had very few reasons to not “keep sweet” in comparison to her previous marriage. She gained when she joined the family.

The other wives, in comparison, lost when Robyn entered the family. They lost resources, status, time with Kody, etc. I also think the non-Robyn kids lost out on time with their father once Robyn entered the family. 

[notnowimbusy]

On 2/10/2022 at 1:50 PM, Sandy W said:

The Plan of Subdivision would have called for houses of approximately the same square footage, so I can't fault Meri too much for a house of the same size as the others.  All of the houses were "builder's basic"  ---  lowest grade carpeting, no millwork around windows or interior door frames, fireplace mantels, minimal baseboards etc.  Where Meri got greedy was her insistence on upgrades such as the wet bar and french doors.

 

We purchased a home in a planned subdivision to use as a rental. 4 different floor plans, but all about the same size.  An original buyer had backed out, but he already put in $40K worth of upgrades that we didn't have to pay extra for, but we did add a patio in back, and shutters for all the windows.    The agent for the property made an error in something, and my agent said we were inconvenienced and they needed to do something to compensate us.   We got that 12K worth of shutters for free!!!

[WhatAmIWatching]

22 hours ago, LilyD said:

Meri indeed exploited her "only one-child grief" saying that she shouldn't be punished more by being denied an equal share. It wasn't just the LV house. She had the most expensive rental in Vegas, with a pool, and she was called out by Janelle for that. Meri whipped her straight back into the doghouse with her "unfair punishment claim" making Janelle feel awful and guilty.

  This whole mess right here would've been a fantastic time for Kodouche to be the leader of the family. He should have made sure that everything was fair, and he chose not to because he couldn't be bothered, or didn't want to be the bad guy. (He's the worst guy!)

  It irks and astounds me to no end that this group of adults couldn't sit down together and hammer out exactly how the finances should be divided and why. (If Meri still wanted to bawl about her spirit children needing their own rooms, she could take a short break and do it somewhere else) Get a mediator if they couldn't be arsed to mediate themselves. There should have been clap back for Meri saying that to Janelle, but all she got was crickets. Gahhh! They're all idiots. 
 As we've seen, flying by the seat of their pants, when trying to house/feed/clothe so many people, simply does not work.

Edited February 13, 2022 by WhatAmIWatching
Just noticed autocorrect skunked me again!

[Pooky]

This family is full of it. For years they have led us to believe they are this wholesome loving family where love should be multiplied not divided and it feels like we shudda been together forever and I wanted the family not just Kody... blah blah blah. Well  you are all full of it and here are some of my  reasons why.. based on the last season alone.

Kody says Robyn in compliant etc on following the rules but in actual fact there is a scene in the early days of Covid where Sobyn states when questioned from Janelle about the family spending time together...'this has freaked me out me and the kids and me are self isolating.. so the rules were her idea..  of course she is compliant.

Kody says is it ok if Meri helps out she has been compliant to the rules (at the family three pit bbq.. ) Robyn says I'm not sure.. Kody ' I guess we shouldnt change the protocol now'... so it wasn't Kody in actual fact stopping them catching up.

 

Any other examples?

 

 

 

[Sandy W]

5 hours ago, Pooky said:

 

Any other examples?

 

 

 

The nanny and her husband, given full access to the home and family.  Robyn and Kody took the word of these relative strangers that they were following all of their protocols, yet apparently they weren't when they both came down with Covid themselves and most likely were the source of Kody's infection.

[SunnyBeBe]

Well, I’m not sure which version of events are lies, but when Robyn was invited to join the family there were discussions about it, according to the wives and Kody.  There was a family meeting about it, too.  The wives were very much in support if it.  She was welcomed by the wives and they even got her a ring.  They claimed they totally welcomed her.  Now, Christine says the blending was terrible, a struggle, so bad it left scars…….hmmmm……..where was the talk of this when they were going to therapy?

 

 

Edited February 13, 2022 by SunnyBeBe

[Sandy W]

34 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Well, I’m not sure which version of events are lies, but when Robyn was invited to join the family there were discussions about it, according to the wives and Kody.  There was a family meeting about it, too.  The wives were very much in support if it.  She was welcomed by the wives and they even got her a ring.  They claimed they totally welcomed her.  Now, Christine says the blending was terrible, a struggle, so bad it left scars…….hmmmm……..where was the talk of this when they were going to therapy?

 

 

I fully believe Christine was lying when she seemed to be on board with accepting Robyn into the family but for the sake of storylines and their newfound source of revenue aka the Show, she went along and swallowed her fillin's.

This clip shows that Janelle is just as paranoid as Christine.  The clerk was asking a polite question "is it a birthday gift?" and immediately Janelle jumps to the conclusion that the clerk was "digging". 

[Pickleinthemiddle]

24 minutes ago, Sandy W said:

I fully believe Christine was lying when she seemed to be on board with accepting Robyn into the family but for the sake of storylines and their newfound source of revenue aka the Show, she went along and swallowed her fillin's.

This clip shows that Janelle is just as paranoid as Christine.  The clerk was asking a polite question "is it a birthday gift?" and immediately Janelle jumps to the conclusion that the clerk was "digging". 

Well some people are nosy, but could have been helping to find the best gift.

[Adiba]

23 minutes ago, Sandy W said:

I fully believe Christine was lying when she seemed to be on board with accepting Robyn into the family but for the sake of storylines and their newfound source of revenue aka the Show, she went along and swallowed her fillin's.

This clip shows that Janelle is just as paranoid as Christine.  The clerk was asking a polite question "is it a birthday gift?" and immediately Janelle jumps to the conclusion that the clerk was "digging". 

Where I live in PA, I don’t know of any polygamy groups (obviously there could be some), and clerks often make small talk when you say you’re buying a gift. It doesn’t necessarily mean they’re being nosy, imo—just normal human chitchat. The clerk may not have cared, really— just saying something friendly because a camera crew was there, perhaps.