And Just Like That in the Media

[ifionlyknew]

MPK is going to do what MPK is going to do.  I don't think he has ever taken any criticism from the audience or reviewers to heart.   

It appears to be he is using SATC characters to tell stories he wants to tell instead of telling the stories of SATC characters.  It is lazy and unimaginative.  And sadly I'm not surprised.

[Yeah No]

38 minutes ago, ifionlyknew said:

MPK is going to do what MPK is going to do.  I don't think he has ever taken any criticism from the audience or reviewers to heart.   

It appears to be he is using SATC characters to tell stories he wants to tell instead of telling the stories of SATC characters.  It is lazy and unimaginative.  And sadly I'm not surprised.

He's for sure not listening to his audience or the reviewers, but I think he has been highly influenced by the criticism of his peers and/or conforming to social pressure from a very progressive end of the LGBTQ community to make his characters more reflective of their agenda, which is not necessarily his agenda.  Which is one reason why I think it's coming off so forced, OTT and not right.  It's coming off like a forced-fit overreaction to criticism from somewhere, like "You don't think my characters are progressive enough for today's culture?  Well, here's more progressive for you"....POW, right in the kissa!

[qtpye]

Supposedly, all the women of color are supposed to be mirrors of the main characters. That is why they called Charlotte’s mommy friend “Black Charlotte”.

[Maysie]

15 hours ago, funnygirl said:

Showrunner Michael Patrick King agrees that Miranda is feeling “trapped” at this point in her life: “At the concert, she seems to be responding to the word ‘change’… and Miranda’s always been a bit of an outsider. Even within the group, she was the one who was the least successful at dating. She was the one who was the most angry at society. So Miranda’s always been somebody who went her own way.”

I think the revisionist history about Miranda and Steve’s marriage has been covered well. I also take exception to the above by MPK. Miranda was the least successful at dating? By whose yardstick? Because she often put her career first? Because she got pregnant when she wasn’t planning to? Because she didn’t score a swanky apartment in a breakup, or have a boyfriend in the loony bin, or have a boyfriend break up with her on a post it, or berate a man because he wasn’t physically in her league? I could go on because Charlotte and Carrie aren’t what I envision when I think of “successful dating,” and I didn’t see either of them passing time with their infant and Blair Underwood.

And “most angry at society”? Is he kidding? Because she wants to have a serious career and not sit around talking about boys all day she’s the most angry at society??? What exactly did she do in the past to indicate she had any anger at society? I did pick up a vibe that she got frustrated at wanting to be taken seriously on her own and didn’t see why she needed a man to define her happiness and success-that’s a far cry from “angry at society.” I guess he thinks anyone in Me Too and BLM are anarchistic radicals.

What a fucking tool. An elitist white male tool. Any chance of me watching this just went out the window. And shame on the actors for going along with this bullshit. Did they need the paycheck that badly? Boy, I wonder if this nonsense is what kept KC out of the picture. Regardless I have a lot more respect for her now and my respect for SJP has plummeted because she’s right there with MPK in all this.

[Cementhead]

15 minutes ago, Maysie said:

my respect for SJP has plummeted because she’s right there with MPK in all this.

To say that I am sadly disappointed in SJP for agreeing to let all involved basically tear down and destroy the original series like this would be an understatement.  She was one of those actresses I always held in such high esteem and I have always felt nothing but affection for her because of SATC.  What a giant fucking letdown this has been.  I guess Keanu Reeves really is the only actor who isn't a giant asshole after all.  I hope the money is worth it to her and those all involved, because it comes at the cost of the original series' characters and fans. 

 

[PRgal]

Was the cast that desperate for work?  Because I would have pulled a KC if I knew the script was going to be such crap.  Unless they were only presented with an idea and not even a draft of any episode.

[Yeah No]

1 hour ago, Maysie said:

I think the revisionist history about Miranda and Steve’s marriage has been covered well. I also take exception to the above by MPK. Miranda was the least successful at dating? By whose yardstick? Because she often put her career first? Because she got pregnant when she wasn’t planning to? Because she didn’t score a swanky apartment in a breakup, or have a boyfriend in the loony bin, or have a boyfriend break up with her on a post it, or berate a man because he wasn’t physically in her league? I could go on because Charlotte and Carrie aren’t what I envision when I think of “successful dating,” and I didn’t see either of them passing time with their infant and Blair Underwood.

And “most angry at society”? Is he kidding? Because she wants to have a serious career and not sit around talking about boys all day she’s the most angry at society??? What exactly did she do in the past to indicate she had any anger at society? I did pick up a vibe that she got frustrated at wanting to be taken seriously on her own and didn’t see why she needed a man to define her happiness and success-that’s a far cry from “angry at society.” I guess he thinks anyone in Me Too and BLM are anarchistic radicals.

What a fucking tool. An elitist white male tool. Any chance of me watching this just went out the window. And shame on the actors for going along with this bullshit. Did they need the paycheck that badly? Boy, I wonder if this nonsense is what kept KC out of the picture. Regardless I have a lot more respect for her now and my respect for SJP has plummeted because she’s right there with MPK in all this.

I don't want to defend him because I do think he is an elitist white male tool, but perhaps he was saying those things about Miranda in a supportive sense, like it seemed was the case in SATC when she did the speed dating and felt compelled to fake her career to something men found more feminine and sexy in order to get a date.  As in the "this is what's wrong with society" and "she has a right to be angry at society" for this sense, not because he thinks there's any justification for her being less successful at dating just because she's a lawyer.  Not that I even think she was less successful at dating anyway, that part is IMO revisionist history as is what he said about why she married Steve.

[Maysie]

3 hours ago, PRgal said:

 

Was the cast that desperate for work?  Because I would have pulled a KC if I knew the script was going to be such crap.  Unless they were only presented with an idea and not even a draft of any episode.

 

It seems Cynthia Nixon gets ample work; I don’t know about the rest of the cast because I’m not as dialed into pop culture as I used to be.

 I grew to hate Carrie the character because I thought she was so self absorbed and selfish, beyond what normal people are, but I tried to remember that was a character and not the actor. I will say that I haven’t been overly impressed with SJP’s range-there seems to be a bit of the cute, creative ingenue in many of her old roles that I see in Carrie, and when I tried to watch Divorce, it just seemed a bit like a riff on Carrie (note: I gave up on that show really early so it may have gotten better and my assessment could be wayyyy off).

I think it’s hard to be anything but young in Hollywood, and so maybe the actors felt that at least it was work??? I can see SJP’s motivation because the show is centered around her character (unflattering as it is, though she may not see it) and it appears that she has some creative control in all this, and as an executive producer she is probably getting some good money out of it. But for the life of me, I don’t understand why Cynthia Nixon signed off on it because she doesn’t seem to lack for work that’s better than this.

Out of curiosity I googled the salaries they’re pulling for this, and depending on who you believe it ranges between $650k and one million per episode for each of them. So I guess that explains it.

[LegalParrot81]

44 minutes ago, Maysie said:

It seems Cynthia Nixon gets ample work; I don’t know about the rest of the cast because I’m not as dialed into pop culture as I used to be.

 I grew to hate Carrie the character because I thought she was so self absorbed and selfish, beyond what normal people are, but I tried to remember that was a character and not the actor. I will say that I haven’t been overly impressed with SJP’s range-there seems to be a bit of the cute, creative ingenue in many of her old roles that I see in Carrie, and when I tried to watch Divorce, it just seemed a bit like a riff on Carrie (note: I gave up on that show really early so it may have gotten better and my assessment could be wayyyy off).

I think it’s hard to be anything but young in Hollywood, and so maybe the actors felt that at least it was work??? I can see SJP’s motivation because the show is centered around her character (unflattering as it is, though she may not see it) and it appears that she has some creative control in all this, and as an executive producer she is probably getting some good money out of it. But for the life of me, I don’t understand why Cynthia Nixon signed off on it because she doesn’t seem to lack for work that’s better than this.

Out of curiosity I googled the salaries they’re pulling for this, and depending on who you believe it ranges between $650k and one million per episode for each of them. So I guess that explains it.

SJP has worked steadily since this show went off, including another series for HBO.  She's also getting ready to appear on Broadway again, with Matthew in Plaza Suite.  

Kristin hasn't worked quite as steadily as the other two, but some.

Edited December 17, 2021 by LegalParrot81

[RealHousewife]

1 hour ago, Maysie said:

Out of curiosity I googled the salaries they’re pulling for this, and depending on who you believe it ranges between $650k and one million per episode for each of them. So I guess that explains it.

Bingo. Even if they're not crazy about the writing themselves or people talking about their ages and looks, they are being payed VERY well. Even if it's more 650K an episode, that's not the kind of money most people would turn down. 

[Snazzy Daisy]

And Just Like That, the Sex and the City Kids Are All Grown Up! Meet Who Plays Them Now

 

Edited December 17, 2021 by SnazzyDaisy

[Snazzy Daisy]

Cynthia Nixon Says “There Are Many More Changes Coming” for Miranda

 

[Snazzy Daisy]

Sara Ramirez talked about the "shotgun" scene...

And Just Like That star Sara Ramirez on Che's 'intimate' moment with......

 

Edited December 17, 2021 by SnazzyDaisy

[Toodleoo]

19 minutes ago, SnazzyDaisy said:

And Just Like That star Sara Ramirez on Che's 'intimate' moment with......

What kind of discussions did you have about making sure Che isn't just there to teach Carrie and her friends about representation and LGBTQ+ life?

“….I also requested that I get some support from GLAAD to ensure we were not causing harm to the queer and trans community through this representation.”

That’s interesting and kind of cool, IMO.

Last question: Do you own a Peloton?

“I don't, but I know a lot of people who do, and yeah, I have questions.”

Hahaha!

 

[Snazzy Daisy]

Stanford Blatch’s Last Bow

The stars and creatives of Sex and the City and And Just Like That … remember their friend and colleague Willie Garson.

[Sweet-tea]

On 12/16/2021 at 12:33 PM, SnazzyDaisy said:

Kristin has a joker smile, isn’t she? Same smile like Jeff Bezos’ girlfriend, I forgot her name.

 I think she’s had filler in her lips and cheeks, probably too much and not in the right area. The face filler pushes up the cheeks, distorting her face and giving her an unnatural look. You don’t notice it as much in motion. IMO that’s why she looks better on video than photos. 

I noticed this in myself when I got filler once. I didn’t think I looked that different until I saw myself in pictures. I looked horrible. This was years ago and I haven’t gotten it again. I’ve also seen the same thing with countless other celebrities. 

I think SJP and Cynthia Nixon look good and more natural, although I don’t like SJP’s makeup. 

I was surprised to read the comments from Kristin Davis. I wonder if she’s more sensitive because she’s getting a lot of comments that she looks odd, whereas before on SATC she probably mostly got compliments. I’m not sure I believe her that she’s upset about the pear-shaped comments. She’s bothered by that all these years later? I don’t think so. She probably doesn’t like the scrutiny she’s getting about her current look, the unflattering cosmetic work. 

 

 

Edited December 18, 2021 by Sweet-tea

[Winston Wolfe]

On 12/17/2021 at 8:07 PM, Sweet-tea said:

I’m not sure I believe her that she’s upset about the pear-shaped comments. She’s bothered by that all these years later? I don’t think so.

Neither do I.  Sometimes it seems like women don't truly understand what we men find attractive.  Unless a guy is into the lean look, "pear shape" works for so many of us. The curves are, ah, visually appealing.

[LemonSoda]

On 12/17/2021 at 5:07 PM, Sweet-tea said:

 I noticed this in myself when I got filler once. I didn’t think I looked that different until I saw myself in pictures. I looked horrible. This was years ago and I haven’t gotten it again. I’ve also seen the same thing with countless other celebrities. 

Thank you for this! I had a similar issue once. This is the awkward stuff no one talks about. I, along with some friends got Botox for a friend’s wedding. It was a silly bridesmaid thing. I did not like the way I looked. In photos and videos my smile, my eyes looked so off. The scary part is despite being horrified how I looked, I understood how people, especially celebrities go too far. It was bizarre. My mirrors showed one face but pictures and videos showed a completely different face 

Edited December 19, 2021 by LemonSoda

[ifionlyknew]

I always thought Miranda was the character who had the worst wardrobe during SATC. This might explain why.

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/patricia-field-kim-cattrall-absence-cynthia-nixon-175446462.html

 

From the article:

Cynthia Nixon thinks she knows everything — and she doesn’t!” Field laughed. “Even today, when I speak with Molly, it’s about Cynthia. I say, ‘I remember what you are going through.'"

[Lethallyfab]

I guess I see where she’s coming from but hasn’t there been an upswing in folks reclaiming Miranda’s original wardrobe as aspirational?   I ALSO would have been perfectly happy with said original wardrobe being very gender-and-sexuality fluid without the writers currently writing Miranda as such.  

Also, call me Marie Kondo, because I am here because I love mess.  Pat siding with Kim!  
 

I barely use Instagram but for those that do, I just checked and the brilliant ‘Every Outfit on SATC’ account is also covering AJLT.

1 minute ago, Lethallyfab said:

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by Lethallyfab

[Ms Blue Jay]

Kristin Davis pops up in television movies a lot.

She was in "Deadly Illusions" this year which was HORRIBLE.  And I watch a LOT of television movies (Hallmark, Lifetime, Netflix) so I'm not a snob.  it was horrible.  One of the worst of the year.  Also, the work she's had done on her face is just so hard to look at and I also think it's negatively affecting her acting.

[Jillybean]

12 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Also, the work she's had done on her face is just so hard to look at and I also think it's negatively affecting her acting.

I agree.

She was in a cute 2019 Netflix movie called Holiday in the Wild with Rob Lowe (a movie which by the way reflects her love of and involvement with elephants) and I thought she looked great at the time! 

 

 

[Surrealist]

On 12/17/2021 at 9:23 AM, PRgal said:

Was the cast that desperate for work?  

It's possible they were simply interested in exploring where their characters ended up.

And because it's a limited series, workwise, they could still do their other roles and projects.

[Ms Blue Jay]

I'm kind of shocked that they released this!  I thought that Kristin and SJP especially are so close to Chris.  I wonder if they know certain things.

 

[Jane Tuesday]

1 hour ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I'm kind of shocked that they released this!  I thought that Kristin and SJP especially are so close to Chris.  I wonder if they know certain things.

 

Personally, I thought they were very careful to NOT say, "we believe the women". "We support them and know it was hard to come forward with these allegations" is not the same thing. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

Saying it was a difficult thing to do implies belief to me, but that's me!

[Maysie]

I read the statement as a “we have to say something and show support for other women but also try to stay neutral” kind of thing. It was a safe, generic statement, imo. And honestly, I can’t fault them for that if they don’t have any negative experience with Noth, and I’m willing to bet they don’t. My guess is if he did what he’s accused of (and I have no reason to believe he didn’t), he’s smart enough to not shit where he eats (forgive my crudeness). I figure he knows well enough to not pull that shit onset, especially on a show that is so women-centered. It’s not like he was Harvey Weinstein and had a whole system set up to do damage control. He’s likely just one of those assholes who knows he’s famous, charismatic and uses it to get - or take - what he wants.

So, until I hear/see otherwise, I’m willing to believe that TPTB on Sex and the City didn’t know about Noth’s behavior or at worst, only heard unsubstantiated rumors. I hope that’s the case because if otherwise, this group is even worse than I thought.

Eta: I think acknowledging the difficulty in coming forward doesn’t necessarily imply belief. Whatever happens with the claims, true or false, the women making them are in for oppressive scrutiny, which is why (imo) women often stay silent. They knew that Noth wasn’t going to admit what he’s been accused of and everyone can pretty much guess how he’s going to respond and what that means for the women. About the only scenario that it would be hard to support the women coming forward would be if there was an obvious conspiracy of some sort, so I think that’s a pretty safe statement.

Edited December 21, 2021 by Maysie

[funnygirl]

2 hours ago, Jane Tuesday said:

Personally, I thought they were very careful to NOT say, "we believe the women". "We support them and know it was hard to come forward with these allegations" is not the same thing. 

Yeah, they released this statement to cover their asses as to not get hate from social media people (who complain about virtually everything) who would start questioning "why hasn't so-and-so said anything? they are complicit!". 

Chris is their friend and someone they've known for a very long time, it's not surprising if they exist somewhere in the gray area of these accusations. 

But if they could, I'm sure they would choose to not say anything at all and stay completely out of it. But nowadays everyone has to have a comment for everything lest they be labeled part of the problem. 

Edited December 21, 2021 by funnygirl

[Carolina Girl]

On 12/17/2021 at 10:42 AM, Maysie said:

It seems Cynthia Nixon gets ample work;

I believe she has a featured role in HBO's "The Gilded Age" working with Christine Baranski - and which I am madly looking forward to!!

[Chit Chat]

2 hours ago, funnygirl said:

But if they could, I'm sure they would choose to not say anything at all and stay completely out of it. But nowadays everyone has to have a comment for everything lest they be labeled part of the problem. 

I think they should've stayed out of it at this time.  If they had any inkling of this kind of behavior in the past, why was he allowed to be on the show?  If they didn't see this type of behavior, then it's really none of their business to comment at this stage of the investigation.  Let it play out and then comment.  If Noth is innocent, I'm sure he's not too happy with their non-support of him.   

[WendyCR72]

The TCM Remembers 2021 In Memoriam is out, and Willie Garson is included. It is set to an ironically melancholy cover of "Shiny Happy People" done originally by REM.

[Snazzy Daisy]

Bridget Moynahan on Chris Noth’s sexual assault allegations…

Bridget Moynahan Is Totally Okay With Big’s Death

 

[RealHousewife]

13 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I'm kind of shocked that they released this!  I thought that Kristin and SJP especially are so close to Chris.  I wonder if they know certain things.

 

 

2 hours ago, SnazzyDaisy said:

Bridget Moynahan on Chris Noth’s sexual assault allegations…

Bridget Moynahan Is Totally Okay With Big’s Death

 

 

11 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Saying it was a difficult thing to do implies belief to me, but that's me!

That's how I took it too. It says shared their painful experiences. That sounds like they believe the women to me. It's also not traditionally considered to be difficult for women who lie for whatever reason to come forward. As most of us know, people who lie about  things like rape and sexual assault are rare, but they are the kind of people who have no issue lying. There is also nothing in the statement to suggest the possibility Chris could be innocent. 

Bridget's comment on the other hand is truly neutral to me. She didn't work with him as much, so she could really have no idea like all the rest of us. 

As far as if Chris did show behavior and the women just dealt with it  until now. . .

I don't know about you ladies, but I know there have been men where they didn't rape or do anything horrific, but they would still creep me out. Accidentally bumping into me all the time. Unnecessary touching. Unwanted hugs. Squeezing the hell out of me when they hug me. Making lots of sexual comments in the workplace, which might be even more confusing whether or not any of this is inappropriate on a Sex & the City set. There are men I give benefit of the doubt like, he didn't mean it, just a flirt, didn't know boundaries, etc. But if I were to find out they did something serious, it wouldn't shock me. I wonder if that could be it. It is definitely sad either way though. Either he Chris did these things, or his career and legacy are destroyed over nothing. 

It's easy for me to enjoy the show even if I know the women didn't all get along great IRL. Let's say SJP really isn't at at all the nice girl. I can still enjoy her as an actress. It is very different watching a show where a beloved character full of charm is a rapist IRL. Michael Jackson used to be my all time favorite music artist. I can't say I'm a proud fan since watching that documentary. 

9 hours ago, funnygirl said:

Yeah, they released this statement to cover their asses as to not get hate from social media people (who complain about virtually everything) who would start questioning "why hasn't so-and-so said anything? they are complicit!". 

Chris is their friend and someone they've known for a very long time, it's not surprising if they exist somewhere in the gray area of these accusations. 

But if they could, I'm sure they would choose to not say anything at all and stay completely out of it. But nowadays everyone has to have a comment for everything lest they be labeled part of the problem. 

Oh god, those people are so annoying! There are jerks regarding stuff like this on both sides. Extremes are rarely good people. The people who think women must be lying all the time are are terrible. It really isn't easy to talk about sexual trauma. I totally understand why some wait decades to speak out or even take their experiences to the grave. I've never shared my worst experience of sexual trauma with anyone in person. Not sure if I ever will. There's also often not any evidence. And then those who think anytime someone doesn't immediately believe a woman is a victim is complicit also get on my nerves.

There was an instance a group friends and I were discussing, where the women in the group including me didn't think it was an instance of sexual harassment. This man went off on us mansplaining sexual harassment and saying we were slut shaming. Little does this man know that a girl we all know has accused HIM of sexual harassment over something he had said. 

[Yeah No]

12 hours ago, ChitChat said:

I think they should've stayed out of it at this time.  If they had any inkling of this kind of behavior in the past, why was he allowed to be on the show?  If they didn't see this type of behavior, then it's really none of their business to comment at this stage of the investigation.  Let it play out and then comment.  If Noth is innocent, I'm sure he's not too happy with their non-support of him.   

He might not be happy with it but my bet is he understands it.  In a social climate like the one we have now not supporting the accusing women in some way would make the cast members a target of criticism themselves and probably turn into another shitstorm of outrage culminating badly for them and their careers.  And I'm sure he understands why they wouldn't want to do that.  In this kind of situation it's "every man for himself" so to speak.  I think not saying anything would have been just as bad for them and some people would take that as tacit support of him.  So they really had no other choice.

[Yeah No]

5 hours ago, RealHousewife said:

17 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Saying it was a difficult thing to do implies belief to me, but that's me!

That's how I took it too. It says shared their painful experiences. That sounds like they believe the women to me. It's also not traditionally considered to be difficult for women who lie for whatever reason to come forward. As most of us know, people who lie about  things like rape and sexual assault are rare, but they are the kind of people who have no issue lying. There is also nothing in the statement to suggest the possibility Chris could be innocent. 

In my opinion what they said in their statement was done to stave off any potential criticism they might receive for giving the appearance of supporting Noth.  Their statement gives us absolutely no idea of how they actually feel about him or the accusers.  In climates like the one we're living in people can feel forced into saying things publicly that are PC just to save their own necks.  From what I've read Noth appears to love SJP and the two have always had a positive relationship so I can only wonder how she or any of the women really feel about him right now. 

[ifionlyknew]

I understand why they made that statement.  None of them want to face the criticism other celebs have faced when they have said things like "(fill in the blank) has always been a perfect gentleman to me".  Privately they may reach out to him and then again they might just delete him from their contacts.

16 hours ago, Maysie said:

So, until I hear/see otherwise, I’m willing to believe that TPTB on Sex and the City didn’t know about Noth’s behavior or at worst, only heard unsubstantiated rumors. I hope that’s the case because if otherwise, this group is even worse than I thought.

The Beverly Johnson accusations were known when he was hired back in the late 90s.  But as far as I know these most recent accusations have been the only ones since then.  If he did something on the set during those years surely it will come out now.   A lot of women find the courage to come forward after other women come forward first.  The similarity in these women's accusations make me think he has done this a lot.  You know with most celebs who have had sexual harassment/assault accusations  against them I usually think yeah I totally saw that coming (even with Bill Cosby I knew something wasn't right with him) but with Noth I never got that vibe.  Clearly I misjudged him.  

Edited December 22, 2021 by ifionlyknew

[SlovakPrincess]

21 hours ago, Maysie said:

I read the statement as a “we have to say something and show support for other women but also try to stay neutral” kind of thing. It was a safe, generic statement, imo. And honestly, I can’t fault them for that if they don’t have any negative experience with Noth, and I’m willing to bet they don’t. My guess is if he did what he’s accused of (and I have no reason to believe he didn’t), he’s smart enough to not shit where he eats (forgive my crudeness). I figure he knows well enough to not pull that shit onset, especially on a show that is so women-centered. It’s not like he was Harvey Weinstein and had a whole system set up to do damage control. He’s likely just one of those assholes who knows he’s famous, charismatic and uses it to get - or take - what he wants.

This.  I think sexual predators are very calculating in determining who around them has some power and who doesn't.  They will go after somebody they think they can bully into silence, whereas they would be on their best behavior around the stars of the show they work on.  SJP, Nixon, Davis and Cattrall all were series regulars, he was a supporting or guest character, and (if the allegations are true), he likely would've hid his true nature from them and anyone else with some power to affect his career.  

[BrindaWalsh]

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/just-todays-york-disappeared-sex-150000564.html

Great article about NYC as AJLT's missing character. 

[Chit Chat]

10 hours ago, Yeah No said:

In a social climate like the one we have now not supporting the accusing women in some way would make the cast members a target of criticism themselves and probably turn into another shitstorm of outrage culminating badly for them and their careers.  And I'm sure he understands why they wouldn't want to do that.  In this kind of situation it's "every man for himself" so to speak.  I think not saying anything would have been just as bad for them and some people would take that as tacit support of him.  So they really had no other choice.

In today's world, it's best to stay mum if one doesn't know anything about a given situation.  Maybe they've seen that behavior with him and that's why they spoke out.  If they haven't seen it though, I think it's best to say what Bridget said.   It's like being on a jury.  You need to wait to hear all of the evidence before commenting on it.   I don't think their careers would suffer for it.   

I support people who speak their truth, but if I don't know what the actual truth is, then I need to keep my yap shut.  :)  

[Yeah No]

1 hour ago, ChitChat said:

In today's world, it's best to stay mum if one doesn't know anything about a given situation.  Maybe they've seen that behavior with him and that's why they spoke out.  If they haven't seen it though, I think it's best to say what Bridget said.   It's like being on a jury.  You need to wait to hear all of the evidence before commenting on it.   I don't think their careers would suffer for it.   

I support people who speak their truth, but if I don't know what the actual truth is, then I need to keep my yap shut.  :)  

I disagree.  This situation is not new and every time a person's also famous colleagues have not made a statement to distance themselves from the accused the rumors and criticism fly on social media and elsewhere as to where their sympathies lie and some have been ostracized for it by their peers.  I'm also sure the show's lawyers counseled them on how to handle it.  I would really doubt they would make a group public statement that wasn't cleared first with the show producers and lawyers.

[Chit Chat]

2 hours ago, Yeah No said:

This situation is not new and every time a person's also famous colleagues have not made a statement to distance themselves from the accused the rumors and criticism fly on social media and elsewhere as to where their sympathies lie and some have been ostracized for it by their peers. 

I understand what you're saying, but I think people worry too much about what other people think regarding situations that really don't involve them.  In my experience, I have found that sometimes it's better to lay low and wait for all of the facts/information to come out in order to make an informed opinion before saying something. 

I think they're just trying to play the PC/CYA game.  If they knew that these accusations were true, why didn't they speak out years ago?  Why was he still allowed on the show?  They're going to clutch their pearls now?   So many unanswered questions.   

[RealHousewife]

14 hours ago, Yeah No said:

In my opinion what they said in their statement was done to stave off any potential criticism they might receive for giving the appearance of supporting Noth.  Their statement gives us absolutely no idea of how they actually feel about him or the accusers.  In climates like the one we're living in people can feel forced into saying things publicly that are PC just to save their own necks.  From what I've read Noth appears to love SJP and the two have always had a positive relationship so I can only wonder how she or any of the women really feel about him right now. 

I agree with you about the public pressure and it's possible they don't necessarily believe the women, but that statement did say who they stand with to me. 

1 minute ago, ChitChat said:

I understand what you're saying, but I think people worry too much about what other people think regarding situations that really don't involve them.  In my experience, I have found that sometimes it's better to lay low and wait for all of the facts/information to come out in order to make an informed opinion before saying something. 

I think they're just trying to play the PC/CYA game.  If they knew that these accusations were true, why didn't they speak out years ago?  Why was he still allowed on the show?  They're going to clutch their pearls now?   So many unanswered questions.   

This

[Black Knight]

On 12/18/2021 at 5:12 PM, Winston Wolfe said:

Neither do I.  Sometimes it seems like women don't truly understand what we men find attractive.  Unless a guy is into the lean look, "pear shape" works for so many of us. The curves are, ah, visually appealing.

That's at least partly because if you look at media, at the well-known couples out there, at famous men and their wives and girlfriends, there aren't many examples of famous men being partnered with curvy women. I can really only think of two off the top of my head, Pierce Brosnan and Hugh Jackman (and in Brosnan's case, she was thin when they got together and married, and I'm aware there are rumors about Jackman). The curvy women in Hollywood are generally partnered with non-celebs and/or less attractive men (e.g. Joan Hendricks's now ex-husband). So many male athletes are married to thin women with long blonde hair that there is clearly something driving that. With the exception of Howard J. Marshall (Anna Nicole Smith's husband, and let's be real, at 89 even he had limited options, the thin gold-diggers could all find somebody a little younger and less nausea-inducing), the old rich dudes marrying younger women are always marrying thin younger women. It gives one the perception that a man might like to have sex with a curvy woman, but he won't marry a curvy woman. Whyever that is, the truism is that "A-list" men generally partner with thin women. To bring this back to the show, I don't think uber-wealthy Big would have partnered with Carrie if she weren't thin.

[Yeah No]

1 hour ago, ChitChat said:

I understand what you're saying, but I think people worry too much about what other people think regarding situations that really don't involve them.  In my experience, I have found that sometimes it's better to lay low and wait for all of the facts/information to come out in order to make an informed opinion before saying something. 

I think they're just trying to play the PC/CYA game.  If they knew that these accusations were true, why didn't they speak out years ago?  Why was he still allowed on the show?  They're going to clutch their pearls now?   So many unanswered questions.   

Of course ideally it's better not to worry about what people think, but when your career and public image might depend on it you'll make a statement to placate the people who would not accept anything less than complete support of the accusers.  Anything else, even silence is seen as support of the accused.  These women's careers are far too important to them to risk losing over their support of a cast member.  It's not about finding the truth, it's about appeasing and placating the people with the power to sway public opinion against them.  This is my opinion, but the movement that has done a lot of good in empowering women to come forward with their very real stories of sexual abuse and harassment only gives one option of acceptability.  You either believe without question that all women are telling the truth and would never lie or exaggerate such accusations or you stand with a rapist and/or sexual harasser.  There is no gray area allowed, no innocent until proven guilty.  All that is necessary is an accusation to ruin someone's career, no evidence other than a testimony.  That's the reality.  The cast of AJLT does not have the luxury of being allowed to live in a gray area while they weigh the evidence as it comes in.  They have to play the PC/CYA game or be judged harshly if they don't.

[Black Knight]

10 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

You either believe without question that all women are telling the truth and would never lie or exaggerate such accusations or you stand with a rapist and/or sexual harasser.  There is no gray area allowed, no innocent until proven guilty.  All that is necessary is an accusation to ruin someone's career, no evidence other than a testimony.  That's the reality.  The cast of AJLT does not have the luxury of being allowed to live in a gray area while they weigh the evidence as it comes in. 

That isn't what's happening with Noth though, and that's why he's being dumped all over the place, because people at his shows and agency and so forth have reviewed the material and found it credible: Two women came forward who didn't know each other but yet had accounts strikingly similar in certain specifics, who had confided in others back when the incidents occurred. Nobody tells someone a story like that with the idea that this will set up for many years later when they will finally go public and ruin some guy with a lie. Noth would not have been dropped if it were just one woman making an accusation that she'd never shared with anyone. There's a lot of worry, mostly on the male side, that a guy will get cancelled for something like saying "you look nice in a dress," but really, that's not what's going on with #MeToo. Hollywood does not drop very successful men unless there is a lot more there than just one woman's testimony. Aziz Ansari is doing fine. Michael Weatherly still has his show even though CBS had to pay out Eliza Dushku's contract after definitive proof of his harassment of her surfaced. Cosby had a damning deposition in which he admitted giving women drugs and it still took so many women coming forward before he sank. Noth is not losing his career because of one testimony. His employers and agency have seen there's quite a bit more there.

[Yeah No]

9 hours ago, Black Knight said:

That isn't what's happening with Noth though, and that's why he's being dumped all over the place, because people at his shows and agency and so forth have reviewed the material and found it credible: Two women came forward who didn't know each other but yet had accounts strikingly similar in certain specifics, who had confided in others back when the incidents occurred. Nobody tells someone a story like that with the idea that this will set up for many years later when they will finally go public and ruin some guy with a lie. Noth would not have been dropped if it were just one woman making an accusation that she'd never shared with anyone. There's a lot of worry, mostly on the male side, that a guy will get cancelled for something like saying "you look nice in a dress," but really, that's not what's going on with #MeToo. Hollywood does not drop very successful men unless there is a lot more there than just one woman's testimony. Aziz Ansari is doing fine. Michael Weatherly still has his show even though CBS had to pay out Eliza Dushku's contract after definitive proof of his harassment of her surfaced. Cosby had a damning deposition in which he admitted giving women drugs and it still took so many women coming forward before he sank. Noth is not losing his career because of one testimony. His employers and agency have seen there's quite a bit more there.

I have seen cases where famous men have been dropped and their careers hurt over less than this but that's not the subject of this thread so I won't get into a long discussion about them.  Some of the ones that have not had that happen often have clout, and friends in the right places, IMHO, and have some degree of "teflon" against such charges.  I don't think Chris has that kind of power.  Same is true for Franken.  What happened with him is still considered controversial by a lot of people.  

Some people require more evidence than "credible" testimony even if it comes from more than one woman.  Personally I don't trust Chris' employers and Hollywood in general to make those decisions and play "judge and jury" so early in the game.  They are thinking of their own asses when they cancel someone, not necessarily the truth of the allegations.  If it even smells bad and can negatively affect them they will cancel the person right away.  It's not about weighing evidence with Hollywood.  It's all about appearance and their own self interest, IMHO.

Also, I can think of many cases that were indeed more than credible and with much evidence, such as Cosby, Batali, Weinstein, etc. but in my opinion this case is not like those, at least not yet, it may get there, but for some people it is a little too early to throw the book at Chris Noth based on what has been claimed about him so far, although that may change because not throwing the book doesn't necessarily imply that one does not believe the women and is favoring Chris.  It just means one has not made a decision yet and is waiting for more information before doing so.

Edited December 23, 2021 by Yeah No

[bilgistic]

16 hours ago, Black Knight said:

That isn't what's happening with Noth though, and that's why he's being dumped all over the place, because people at his shows and agency and so forth have reviewed the material and found it credible: Two women came forward who didn't know each other but yet had accounts strikingly similar in certain specifics, who had confided in others back when the incidents occurred. Nobody tells someone a story like that with the idea that this will set up for many years later when they will finally go public and ruin some guy with a lie. Noth would not have been dropped if it were just one woman making an accusation that she'd never shared with anyone. There's a lot of worry, mostly on the male side, that a guy will get cancelled for something like saying "you look nice in a dress," but really, that's not what's going on with #MeToo. Hollywood does not drop very successful men unless there is a lot more there than just one woman's testimony. Aziz Ansari is doing fine. Michael Weatherly still has his show even though CBS had to pay out Eliza Dushku's contract after definitive proof of his harassment of her surfaced. Cosby had a damning deposition in which he admitted giving women drugs and it still took so many women coming forward before he sank. Noth is not losing his career because of one testimony. His employers and agency have seen there's quite a bit more there.

Five women

Edited December 23, 2021 by bilgistic

[WendyCR72]

30 minutes ago, bilgistic said:

Five women

Five?! Last I read, there were three. Sigh. This is horrible.

ETA: Reading this article, it includes behavior on the set of SATC. To think I liked Chris Noth.

[RealHousewife]

3 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Five?! Last I read, there were three. Sigh. This is horrible.

ETA: Reading this article, it includes behavior on the set of SATC. To think I liked Chris Noth.

IKR. I can see one or two lying, but not this many. Those poor women. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

False accusations of sexual assault are not common and no more common than false accusations of any other crime (2 to 10%).  The false belief that lying about sexual assault runs rampant is a (sexist, in my opinion) myth that is propagated to discredit real survivors.

Edited December 24, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay