S10.E06: Winter Kills

[jewel21]

Quote

Ursula devises a sinister plan. The Gardners write their final act.

Airdate: 09/22/2021

[EllaWycliffe]

4 minutes ago, jewel21 said:

The Gardners write their final act.

I mean, we all know they die but I do appreciate when they make the effort to be coy... 

[Ambrosefolly]

1 hour ago, EllaWycliffe said:

I mean, we all know they die but I do appreciate when they make the effort to be coy... 

I just want baby Eli to be taken somewhere safe. Then they can bomb all the people for all I care.

[Chaos Theory]

Called that Ursula, The Chemist and Alma would be the last ones standing but that was still a fun and intense ending.    I really liked Ursula and her selling of the black pills.  Alma becoming a true psychopath killing when her talent wasn’t enough to get her what she wanted.  And finally The Chemist  driving away with baby Eli.   

Edited September 23, 2021 by Chaos Theory

[ShadowHunter]

Ehh I thought this was the weakest episode of the season.  Evan Peters dies so often on this show I have no reaction to it anymore. Speaking of Emmy winner Evan I think it's time for him to go. This is not an insult he can do other things. Austin was fun but honestly this felt like a bit of a wasted role for him.

 

[txhorns79]

37 minutes ago, ShadowHunter said:

Ehh I thought this was the weakest episode of the season. 

It felt like they ran out of ideas in the middle of writing the episode.  It was interesting to see the town was in on it, and they gave some explanation as to how the pale people would operate during the summer.  The LA epilogue was just kind of silly.  It didn't take a genius to figure out that distributing the pills en masse would only cause chaos.  It was interesting the Chemist was so concerned about things getting out of control in Provincetown, but seemingly shrugged over the full scale orgy of violence that was unleashed in LA.  I did like Alma finding out that in the end, it didn't matter how talented she was.  She could still lose out on jobs.     

I also don't understand why you would cast Robin Weigert for what was essentially a bit part.   

[bobbyjoe]

Quote

The LA epilogue was just kind of silly. 

It’s such a typical Ryan Murphy “screw up the ending” move though.  I predicted it’d be a time jump, but a “let’s go to LA” scene change is equally a bad idea.

Quote

It felt like they ran out of ideas in the middle of writing the episode.

And it felt like they even forgot what they introduced at the beginning of the same episode.  So we spend about ten minutes setting up Dot Marie Jones as the tough “I’m not going to stop looking into this” cop and then it doesn’t do anything else with her.  We get info that the pale people can apparently at least have enough awareness to take in and respond to some information but they don’t do anything with this to let Lily Rabe do something more fun?

Evan Peters and Frances Conroy’s characters— who should have gotten much more fun and epic deaths die so quickly it might as well have taken place off camera.  So with pretty much everyone dead,  we get left with The Chemist— who’s fine but a character we’ve not seen much of except in one previous episode— and Ursula— who practically wears a “My Character is Making a Satirical Obvious Point About Hollywood”* T-Shirt in every episode.  

Alma is so wonderfully monstrous she was the only one I was glad to see hanging around at the end.  Still, you kind of wish she got some sort of comeuppance even if she was just legitimately beat out of the orchestra role.  To me, that scene would have worked better if she didn’t get a chance to kill that guy at the end and was left knowing that her talent wasn’t going to do her as much good as she thought.  As it is, it just ended on “smug,” which is never really an appealing ending for me for any character.

* (And the episode ends with Ursula underlining that satirical obvious point about Hollywood eighteen times in magic marker, just in case you didn’t get it the first one hundred times)

[oh, and am I the only one left wondering if the pale people are that easy to kill that you can just do things like shoot them, then, uh, why weren't they killed off a long time ago? Did I miss something?]

Oh well, this season had four good episodes.

 

[CrazyDog]

That was it? I was really enjoying this season, and when I was all settled in tonight, and saw it was only an hour, my hopes dimmed. 

It was way too rushed, Belle and Evan Peter's characters died way too easily, and the absolutely horrid Ursula and Alma thrived.

I looooved Alma getting smacked down by the other pretentious guy though. That was beautiful. Until, she, uh, murdered him.

Did we even see Doris in the woods?

What was the point of the cop's big speech? Just to move along what Belle knew already, that Harry and his little Manson family were bringing too much attention?

I laughed at the idea that Ursula was still needing to hustle for clients in LA to sustain their lifestyle while she must be one of the richest people in town, to the point of just flinging pills all over Starbucks.

Coffee, tea, pill, the first one's free, until you immediately turn into a talentless bloodsucking monster on Rodeo Drive.

And sure, random class of screenwiter wannabes, just take that single mysterious black pill left in a baggie under your chair. Why not?

The only creepy part of the episode was the humorous yet disturbing town council meeting at the beginning. 

Seriously, there has to be more to this AHS storyline, right? 

Or we just got Murphied again. Good ideas, poor execution. The rest of the season was pretty good though.

Edited September 23, 2021 by CrazyDog

[Glade]

That was a terrible episode; at first I was sad about how short the episode was, but since we're focusing on these delusional, miserable fuckwads 'winning,' I guess I didn't need more of it.  Having Lily Rabe appear (hopefully to kill Ursula) would have helped, and yeah, the police investigator from the opening scene could have gotten some follow-through. I'm glad Alma was told that actually, people with real talent will often times prevail over pre-teen drug addicts, and no matter how many people she kills, that fact isn't going anywhere.   This episode was really just profoundly lazy writing; clearly Ryan Murphy has not taken the pill.  And that is a shame, because if this show could end these seasons with the same quality as they're begun instead of taking messy shortcuts into dumb satire, it could be so much better.

[zibnchy]

I'm just agreeing with every point you all are making about this failure of an episode. The only upside to this episode was Robin Weigert and the colors Simply White and, to a lesser extent, Mountain Peak White.

I'll just add a couple of random things. I think they made a huge mistake making Belle a baby killer. Frances Conroy is great. She's so good she can make even an evil/crazy character someone we can root for in a weird sort of way. Baby killing took me completely out of the story. I'm a 60 year old childless curmudgeon and I'm never going to root for a baby killer in real life or in fiction. I cared nothing about her death. What a waste.

Leslie Grossman is fine in small doses. She was funny in the Good Place in a small recurring role. This was an overdose.

What happened to Doris? What was even the point of the character? She and Micky were the only characters I actually cared for. If I was Lily Rabe I would run so far away from this franchise. It was painful to watch her character. 

I don't know anything about the second half of the season. Does anyone know if it ties in? And is Robin Weigert in it? 😀 Clearly I have a crush on RW.

[Chaos Theory]

I seriously don't get why people don’t like this.  I thought this season was the best AHS has been in awhile but then I have liked the show and am not one of the people who think it falls apart so I guess I am in the minority.   I thought bringing the pills into the larger world showed the dangers of a "get famous quick" scheme and how someone like Ursula could and would take advantage of all those people who take workshops and such but are largly talentless but when handed a quick answer would risk it.

Also the Alma stuff was pure horror.   The kid with no boundaries or conscience is the kind of horror ending that I appreciate.   I mean she killed her own father because he wanted her to go off the pills.  

I am not sure what people were expecting.  I called Ursula, the Chemist, and Alma being the ones to survive a few episodes back.   It was the only thing that made any sense.  Evan Peters and Frances Conroy played their parts well and they got the deaths that were always coming to them.  I thought having Ursula convince the pale vampires she had a cure and getting them to attack the pair was a great way to have a conflict.

Honestly I thought this was a fantastic way to end Red Tide.

Edited September 23, 2021 by Chaos Theory

[TVMovieBuff]

There's an old show biz adage "always leave them wanting more". No matter how intriguing a character is, if we see too much of them we get sick of them. Small doses make you pay more attention and remember that character. Ryan Murphy & Brad Falchuk seem to understand this, Frances Conroy sure does.

She is my favorite regular on AHS and her roles never seem big enough.

Anyway, I am still going to watch Part 2. But this time I am letting all 4 episodes appear on my OnDemand before I watch Ep 1. I don't have any streaming services, i just have cable and OnDemand. I am a dinosaur!

Edited September 23, 2021 by TVMovieBuff

[Cinnabon]

8 hours ago, CrazyDog said:

That was it? I was really enjoying this season, and when I was all settled in tonight, and saw it was only an hour, my hopes dimmed. 

It was way too rushed, Belle and Evan Peter's characters died way too easily, and the absolutely horrid Ursula and Alma thrived.

I looooved Alma getting smacked down by the other pretentious guy though. That was beautiful. Until, she, uh, murdered him.

Did we even see Doris in the woods?

What was the point of the cop's big speech? Just to move along what Belle knew already, that Harry and his little Manson family were bringing too much attention?

I laughed at the idea that Ursula was still needing to hustle for clients in LA to sustain their lifestyle while she must be one of the richest people in town, to the point of just flinging pills all over Starbucks.

Coffee, tea, pill, the first one's free, until you immediately turn into a talentless bloodsucking monster on Rodeo Drive.

And sure, random class of screenwiter wannabes, just take that single mysterious black pill left in a baggie under your chair. Why not?

The only creepy part of the episode was the humorous yet disturbing town council meeting at the beginning. 

Seriously, there has to be more to this AHS storyline, right? 

Or we just got Murphied again. Good ideas, poor execution. The rest of the season was pretty good though.

Only one hour, minus a ton of commercials. Maybe 40 minutes of content.

[hatchetgirl]

I always watch the episode the day after because I like to see all y'all's reactions.  :)  I'm not disappointed.  Oh Ryan Murphy...  Maybe the black pills were his wishful thinking?

 

 

[FierceCritter]

It's rare that I complain about a TV show if it gives me the minimum I look for - entertainment. AHS always entertains, and I've never really been bothered by plot holes or loose threads.

Until now.

Too many things stood out in this area, plus a couple more things that left me hanging:

• The filed teeth on the pales - What? Why? When? I liked the story behind the 80's coats, it was a dash of humor I appreciated. But ?wha? on the teeth for them.
• The vamps needing the teeth in the first place if they're always. using. blades.
• Allowing the pales to exist if they're so easily killed.
• Doris? Hello? Doris? Not having an on-camera ending for her is a stupidly hanging thread
• Bringing in Dot Marie Jones for 10 seconds?

There's more. I just... ugh. Just... ugh.

Overall I was liking the season. Especially how there wasn't a lot of fluff due to the number of episodes, that really impressed me. All of this just took me out of the story like I've mostly not experienced before.

[MrPissyPuppy]

10 hours ago, CrazyDog said:

The only creepy part of the episode was the humorous yet disturbing town council meeting at the beginning. 

HOAs:  far more terrifying than zombies or vampires.   Perhaps in a future season of AHS? 

4 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

Also the Alma stuff was pure horror.   The kid with no boundaries or conscience is the kind of horror ending that I appreciate.   I mean she killed her own father because he wanted her to go off the pills.  

I think ending on her killing her father would have worked better.   Very Bad Seed!   The actress did a great job. 

[Lily H]

I was sadly underwhelmed by this episode.  I actually had a hard time staying awake. The best part was the town council meeting! I really wanted Alma to die, but I can see that it's more horrific having a sociopath like her existing.

[rhofmovalley]

Am I the only one who LOL'd (literally) when Alma called Ursula a chicken shit little bitch?? On the one hand it was hilarious but on the other hand that little snot deserved to be backhanded into next Tuesday. 

It couldn't be the pills that turned her into an obnoxious, self centered brat from hell. She must have been coddled and spoiled and catered to by her parents her whole life.

The final scene was a let down. Like, oh, we're out of time, gotta wrap this up. Although I would like to know how the chemist and baby Eli turned out.

[EllaWycliffe]

This was a short episode. 

My likes? The creepy council meeting which I hate to say felt like a whole different eerie creepy tv show than the season in general. The shooting and location of this season really was different and added to the atmosphere.

Harry was too intentionally dumb for me. Alma destroyed her mom over her wish to stay on the pill and then she's all "oh sure dad" to stopping? Also while I don't approve of Alma's sociopath behavior, Harry basically pulled the plug on her with "I got what I wanted so now you're done too. I'm the only one who matters".

The shoot out in the house was dumb. 

The change to Los Angeles was fun but so predictable.  Call me crazy but just passing out the pills wherever was a shitty strategy. If this was about making money, Ursula should have hooked in a few prodigies at screen writing. Making too many talented people means everyone has a killer script.

I did love Alma finding out that its not just about talent.

[Cinnabon]

2 hours ago, hatchetgirl said:

I always watch the episode the day after because I like to see all y'all's reactions.  :)  I'm not disappointed.  Oh Ryan Murphy...  Maybe the black pills were his wishful thinking?

 

 

He doesn’t need to be super talented to get networks to buy his shows. But maybe he use the pills nevertheless!

[Cinnabon]

1 hour ago, FierceCritter said:

It's rare that I complain about a TV show if it gives me the minimum I look for - entertainment. AHS always entertains, and I've never really been bothered by plot holes or loose threads.

Until now.

Too many things stood out in this area, plus a couple more things that left me hanging:

• The filed teeth on the pales - What? Why? When? I liked the story behind the 80's coats, it was a dash of humor I appreciated. But ?wha? on the teeth for them.
• The vamps needing the teeth in the first place if they're always. using. blades.
• Allowing the pales to exist if they're so easily killed.
• Doris? Hello? Doris? Not having an on-camera ending for her is a stupidly hanging thread
• Bringing in Dot Marie Jones for 10 seconds?

There's more. I just... ugh. Just... ugh.

Overall I was liking the season. Especially how there wasn't a lot of fluff due to the number of episodes, that really impressed me. All of this just took me out of the story like I've mostly not experienced before.

The untalented taking just ONE pill and being relegated to being a pale bloodthirsty zombie for life is where they lost me. Maybe the untalented could have taken the pill and gotten so depressed over realizing that lack of talent that they became extremely depressed and committed suicide? I might buy that.

1 hour ago, rhofmovalley said:

Am I the only one who LOL'd (literally) when Alma called Ursula a chicken shit little bitch?? On the one hand it was hilarious but on the other hand that little snot deserved to be backhanded into next Tuesday. 

It couldn't be the pills that turned her into an obnoxious, self centered brat from hell. She must have been coddled and spoiled and catered to by her parents her whole life.

The final scene was a let down. Like, oh, we're out of time, gotta wrap this up. Although I would like to know how the chemist and baby Eli turned out.

So the chemist and the baby went driving off ar the end , right? And where were Ursula and the bad seed?

[EllaWycliffe]

Speaking of Alma.... so she and Violinist were in a relatively public area. She kills him by biting his throat... but doesn't get any blood on her?

[Cinnabon]

26 minutes ago, EllaWycliffe said:

Speaking of Alma.... so she and Violinist were in a relatively public area. She kills him by biting his throat... but doesn't get any blood on her?

And a small 9 year old dragged a body all the way out back?

[JenE4]

I kept falling asleep and waking up, so I can’t really comment on much. Yet, I did particularly enjoy the town council taking a hard stance on not allowing someone to change their home from one shade of white to an ever-so-slightly different shade of white. But “serial killers” on the loose?! Eh, it’s a small price to pay for the panache of having true artists call Provincetown their home away from home.

[archer1267]

3 hours ago, rhofmovalley said:

Am I the only one who LOL'd (literally) when Alma called Ursula a chicken shit little bitch?? On the one hand it was hilarious but on the other hand that little snot deserved to be backhanded into next Tuesday. 

It couldn't be the pills that turned her into an obnoxious, self centered brat from hell. She must have been coddled and spoiled and catered to by her parents her whole life.

And now who's her legal guardian, Ursula? Maybe Harry wasn't the best dad but Ursula is just going to pimp out Alma's talents when it suits her. But instead of having relatively caring parents, that's Alma's karma.

Loved the town board meeting. I live in eastern Mass. and the "they don't serve lobster rolls in Walpole" cracked me up. An old coworker of mine painted his old house a pumpkin color - out of step with the traditional New England white - and a neighbor anonymously asked him "where do you think you are, Castro Street?" I can totally see the board nixing the color choice for being the wrong shade of white.

 

[EllaWycliffe]

12 hours ago, zibnchy said:

'll just add a couple of random things. I think they made a huge mistake making Belle a baby killer. Frances Conroy is great. She's so good she can make even an evil/crazy character someone we can root for in a weird sort of way. Baby killing took me completely out of the story. I'm a 60 year old childless curmudgeon and I'm never going to root for a baby killer in real life or in fiction. I cared nothing about her death. What a waste.

This. Not 60 but I am a childless curmudgeon and this was a disconnect. Partly because they emphasized not killing noticeable people in the  area, but Belle was also getting babies to eat from the meth head who clearly didn't own a car?   Thats almost the definition of shitting where you eat. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

I actually liked this. I thought the entire half season was concise and told a story, if a silly story. I won't deny the many, many plot holes. They did Doris dirty. I didn't mind the L.A. epilogue because it was only 20 minutes or so. If it was a full season it would have stretched on for another 2 episodes at least. The 6 episode story helped it make some sense, at least for this show. 

Ultimately though, Billie Lourd's, Sarah Paulson's and Macaulay Culkin's characters added nothing to the story. 

[foxfreakinmulder]

7 hours ago, Cinnabon said:

And a small 9 year old dragged a body all the way out back?

Thank you, I was wondering the same thing. And her dad plus the buff guy in the pool house couldn't push a 9 year old girl off them before she bit their neck? I'm an old, petite women that works with violent middle school kids and I can hold them back from biting and scratching me and these grown ass men can't. Also, you wouldn't die the minute your neck got bit I think when her dad felt the bite he could've pushed her off. I liked the story idea of this season but the writing was wonky. For me anyways.

[Wicked]

Did I miss something, do we know what happened to Ursula and Alma in the end?  Are we to assume the pale people got them?

 

[MaggieG]

The ending felt pointless to me. So Ursula just gives the pill out willy nilly, LA turns into pale person central and gets destroyed and then what? It's the start of a zompie, pale person apocalypse? 

[EllaWycliffe]

2 hours ago, Wicked said:

Did I miss something, do we know what happened to Ursula and Alma in the end?  Are we to assume the pale people got them?

It really wasn't made clear what happened to Ursula and Alma. I'm not convinced Alma could have gotten away with killing the violinist. Ursula struck me as someone who would get out of town if she needed to. They could be alive. 

[Chaos Theory]

I think Ursula is just being proactive.  She could sit in her office and wait for the right person to come in or she can go to a writing workshop or start her own reality tv entertainment competition and hand put the pills to the people desperate enough.  She is the only access to the pills so even if they don’t make a deal beforehand once the pill runs out the person she gave it to only has one person to go back to.   The first one is free works for drug dealers.

Alma on the other hand works because she is a nine year old girl.   Who would ever suspect her of such a brutal murder?  You can nitpick all you like but Alma was always a bit sociopathic anyway and the pills turned her into a full fledged psychopath and I don’t think anyone would suspect her for years to come.   

[TVMovieBuff]

18 hours ago, Cinnabon said:

And a small 9 year old dragged a body all the way out back?

In classic vampire lore, they have superhuman strength.

[sugarbaker design]

On 9/23/2021 at 7:05 AM, zibnchy said:

I'm never going to root for a baby killer in real life or in fiction.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say very few people are going to root for a baby killer.  Belle is supposed to be irredeemable, it's the way she was written.  Every season of AHS has at least one irredeemable character.

On 9/23/2021 at 7:05 AM, zibnchy said:

What happened to Doris? What was even the point of the character?

Doris represented most of us.  The 90% that don't have a major artistic talent.  She's a good person, smart, a great mom, but not worthy to the talented 10 percent.  That's what this whole season was about to me.  The arrogance and callousness of the artist.  It reminds me of the novel Atonement, how the novelist narrator thinks she can correct her fatal mistakes by writing a novel with the right ending.

And, finally, because of the episode's title, I was hoping to hear Yaz's Winter Kills over the final credits (like RM's Halston).

Edited September 24, 2021 by sugarbaker design

[TVMovieBuff]

Hinting in a tongue-in-cheek manner that L A is full of people with no talent is a cheeky thing to do. 

[sugarbaker design]

1 minute ago, TVMovieBuff said:

Hinting in a tongue-in-cheek manner that L A is full of people with no talent is a cheeky thing to do. 

That was a hilarious!

[hatchetgirl]

2 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

Doris represented most of us.  The 90% that don't have a major artistic talent. 

I would have agreed with you years ago, but now I just don't believe in talent.  I think talent is just a lot of practice.  I never was an artsy person, didn't understand it at all, but picked up painting about 5 years ago.  I was TERRIBLE at it.  But after a time, I noticed my stuff became better and better.  I think if I actually practiced often, I'd be good at it.  Good enough to have a small table at the art fair in my neighborhood.  The whole myth of the special talented few is too much for me.  :)

 

Alma Alma Alma.  Boy that kid bugged me.  I want to go back and rewatch, but I just can't because that character is so awful.  

 

I don't mind that Belle is gone, she was truly horrible, but Austin.  Pretty pretty Austin.  Couldn't he be redeemed?  LOL

 

Quote

Ultimately though, Billie Lourd's, Sarah Paulson's and Macaulay Culkin's characters added nothing to the story.

I agree on Billy and Sarah, but I think Macaulay brought a level of sweet urchin to the mix.  Even after taking the pill, he didn't seem to be awful.  Did I miss something?  I didn't like when he left poor Karen with the choice of pill or pales, but I still didn't think he'd turned as mean and nasty.  He even struggled to kill.  I wish he'd survived so maybe he could have redeemed himself?

[Cinnabon]

2 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

I think Ursula is just being proactive.  She could sit in her office and wait for the right person to come in or she can go to a writing workshop or start her own reality tv entertainment competition and hand put the pills to the people desperate enough.  She is the only access to the pills so even if they don’t make a deal beforehand once the pill runs out the person she gave it to only has one person to go back to.   The first one is free works for drug dealers.

Alma on the other hand works because she is a nine year old girl.   Who would ever suspect her of such a brutal murder?  You can nitpick all you like but Alma was always a bit sociopathic anyway and the pills turned her into a full fledged psychopath and I don’t think anyone would suspect her for years to come.   

I’m sure Ursula receives dozens (if not more) of scripts every week. She could try reading them and contacting those who appear talented?

[iMonrey]

This was oddly unsatisfying. It was like one person wrote the first half and someone else came along and wrote the second half . . . without reading the first half. What was the point of establishing the town council and bringing in the state police officer if they were just going to drop it and not follow through? Was it just for exposition? That could have been accomplished by any other character prior to this episode. And then to have Evan Peters and Frances Conroy die off in such an anticlimactic way. 

Plus, I really wanted someone to murder that bratty kid!

Ugh. Not the worst season but a lot of wasted potential. Stylish as usual but much less cohesive than usual too. Way too many unanswered questions and things that just made no logical sense.

[hatchetgirl]

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

Was it just for exposition? That could have been accomplished by any other character prior to this episode.

Right?  They could have had the house manager come back and say something like "we weren't going to tell you this, but in light of Doris' disappearance..."  

AND I WANNA KNOW ABOUT THE RED LIGHTS!!!! 

[Craft Cocktail]

Boy, in the last 20 minutes the plot anvils starting falling out of the sky like frogs in a Biblical plague. In addition to what others have discussed, bad cops went on a rampage and brutally killed innocent people, only to be taken out by their fellow officers. The writers may have thought this was icing on the cake to make the final biting commentary on society, but I think it trivialized the whole issue of police brutality.

But even within the confines of the storyline, this new addition to the plot didn't make a lot of sense. So the Chemist roots out the bad cops by searching their disciplinary records, then gets (or forces?) them to take the black pill. Since they are not "talented" at what they do, they don't ascend to greatness, and instead become even worse cops, i.e., murderous pale people.

I know it's best not to dig too deeply into shows like this that Stop Making Sense. Could it be that this whole story has been an exercise in self-parody? See, the writers know that slinging dreck on the wall and seeing what sticks is enough to sell a series or a franchise. And it's not necessary to take a black pill if your lack of talent is not an obstacle. So maybe this was a brilliant tour de force, but we the audience are not "talented" enough to realize it!

[hatchetgirl]

7 minutes ago, Craft Cocktail said:

The writers may have thought this was icing on the cake to make the final biting commentary on society, but I think it trivialized the whole issue of police brutality.

You are so right with this.

[Mattipoo]

This was the worst episode of the season, and possibly one of the worst season finales for me. The whole council meeting at the beginning was so pointless, especially the cop who was investigating the police chief's murder. Ursula and Alma should've been killed at the end by the pale people, and the ending with the screenwriters workshop students taking the pills was just dumb. Oh well, on to "Death Valley". Hopefully it will be better than this dreck.

[Farley]

I'm lost, if the Chemist and the baby left to go to a new quiet place where she could go back to research and creating a new drug, such as one that will make her and the baby live forever, what does that mean for Ursula and Alma?   How does Ursula stay succesful, who takes care of or even cares about Alma if she's now less talented?   

[Dobian]

The ending for me was mired by a couple of suspension-of-disbelief points.  The first was Alma killing dad with the old neck bite.  Sorry, but the moment she chomped down on a grown man like that he would have flung her 60 pound self halfway across the room.  The second was when she took out Snarky Violin Guy without getting a drop of blood on her.  Did she have time to send her dress to the dry cleaners and wash up?

Overall though, I would say this is the most cohesive story I have seen since season 1.

Edited September 24, 2021 by Dobian

[TattleTeeny]

Quote

But even within the confines of the storyline, this new addition to the plot didn't make a lot of sense. So the Chemist roots out the bad cops by searching their disciplinary records, then gets (or forces?) them to take the black pill. Since they are not "talented" at what they do, they don't ascend to greatness, and instead become even worse cops, i.e., murderous pale people.

Does the pill know which of any given person’s talents is the one the person wants to expand? Is it all of someone’s talents, even ones they may not know they have? And what if a bad cop’s (or anyone's) desired “talent” was being a prolific murderer? 

Edited September 24, 2021 by TattleTeeny

[EllaWycliffe]

2 hours ago, TattleTeeny said:

And what if a bad cop’s (or anyone's) desired “talent” was being a prolific murderer? 

It worked for Dexter Morgan....

[Cinnabon]

4 hours ago, Craft Cocktail said:

Boy, in the last 20 minutes the plot anvils starting falling out of the sky like frogs in a Biblical plague. In addition to what others have discussed, bad cops went on a rampage and brutally killed innocent people, only to be taken out by their fellow officers. The writers may have thought this was icing on the cake to make the final biting commentary on society, but I think it trivialized the whole issue of police brutality.

But even within the confines of the storyline, this new addition to the plot didn't make a lot of sense. So the Chemist roots out the bad cops by searching their disciplinary records, then gets (or forces?) them to take the black pill. Since they are not "talented" at what they do, they don't ascend to greatness, and instead become even worse cops, i.e., murderous pale people.

I know it's best not to dig too deeply into shows like this that Stop Making Sense. Could it be that this whole story has been an exercise in self-parody? See, the writers know that slinging dreck on the wall and seeing what sticks is enough to sell a series or a franchise. And it's not necessary to take a black pill if your lack of talent is not an obstacle. So maybe this was a brilliant tour de force, but we the audience are not "talented" enough to realize it!

Maybe Ryan and Brad need to start taking some black pills! 😂

2 hours ago, Dobian said:

The ending for me was mired by a couple of suspension-of-disbelief points.  The first was Alma killing dad with the old neck bite.  Sorry, but the moment she chomped down on a grown man like that he would have flung her 60 pound self halfway across the room.  The second was when she took out Snarky Violin Guy without getting a drop of blood on her.  Did she have time to send her dress to the dry cleaners and wash up?

Overall though, I would say this is the most cohesive story I have seen since season 1.

Agree. Season 1 was the only one I truly loved, and felt like they put a lot of thought into every single part of it. Now why do I continue to watch? No idea!

[Craft Cocktail]

"These black pills (not pretzels) are making me thirsty!!!"

[Black Knight]

On 9/23/2021 at 11:23 AM, EllaWycliffe said:

If this was about making money, Ursula should have hooked in a few prodigies at screen writing. Making too many talented people means everyone has a killer script.

That's not an issue right now. There are all these streaming providers in fierce competition with each other, plus the fading broadcast networks desperate for anything that might help them compete with streaming. Everyone wants content, content, content. Every genius Ursula produces will make bank for her. This just pushes out the hacks.

Alma isn't really going to have that much trouble either. Sure, she won't get a symphony orchestra position right now for the reason the now-dead guy said, because she would overshadow the orchestra. But she can go out on her own touring for exactly that reason; people would be excited about the pre-teen prodigy. Ursula is smart enough to realize that. And when she becomes an adult she can get that symphony orchestra position.