S01.E06: Departures

[Armchair Critic]

Shane's mother probably will blame Rachel for Shane accidentally killing Armond. She'll think Rachel was not doing her job of "making him happy" and Shane was stressed from her leaving and staying in another room which made him more on edge.

[nilyank]

I didn't understand why Armond was handing out menus and seating his guests for dinner. Wouldn't that be the job of the host/head waiter not that the manager of the whole freaking resort?

[AzureOwl]

2 hours ago, letter8358 said:

This was renewed for another season?!? 

Yes. But it will be an anthology format. 

Next season will be set at another White Lotus property, with a different staff and different guests. 

[dmc]

I'm sorry but Rachel sucks too.

Yeah she is not anywhere in the vicinity as bad as Shane which makes her look better.

But she seems fairly aimless with her career, her decision making, and her sense of autonomy.

She too is on vacation and has done nothing but mope the entire time.  

First she is upset because she got an offer to make 400.00 on a sh*tty article and Shane asked what was the point...no offense but 400.00 articles will be there for her in two weeks.

Second, she was upset because Connie Britton and her kid were mean to her.

Then she was upset because her husband made a comment about liking sex with her, then she was upset because he kept calling her hot.

Every single comment someone makes to her causes an existential crisis...

She acts like Shane is spoiling her good time, but she hasn't made one activity suggestion since they got there.  

Then when she said was breaking things...off she's like you were taking me all around the city...so there entire relationship has consisted of him making plans and taking her places.

How can you complain that you want to be an equal in the relationship when you never assert yourself in any way

 

Also, my father swan laps weekly up until he found out he had cancer and died three weeks later. I don't swim or know much about swimming...but I guess you can be sick and do it.  One of the things my family kept saying other than how did someone who went to doctor all the time (not have caught this) and how was he so active...it also might depend on the type I guess

Edited August 17, 2021 by dmc

[txhorns79]

1 hour ago, WatcherUatl10 said:

 

  I feel that in a real world scenario that the rowers would have just been being nice to Quinn. He does NOT have their body type, and no amount of physical  activity is going to turn him into an asset. They will likely have to let him down gently so that he can return to his boring life.

Yes, he's like a foot shorter and likely doesn't have half their physical endurance. 

[Andyourlittledog2]

I have a soft spot in my heart for Quinn but I also felt like he was slumming when he decided to just go back to the rowers without his family.  It's one thing to row with them while he is staying at the resort on his family's dime (they were super nice to him) but another entirely when he goes back and announces he's there to what? Move in with them? Eat their food, sleep on their couch?  The white blonde rich kid is going to be one of the Hawaiian rowers, leaving his rich family and imposing on the rowers and their families for housing and food etc?  His saving grace for me is his extreme youth and naivete. I don't think he is really thinking how his imposition can be perceived by the folks he is suddenly throwing himself upon.

Not that his family will let him stay once they finally figure out he is missing. I figure when they get off the plane, perhaps at baggage check.

[chediavolo]

13 hours ago, rozen said:

We know that, Rachel does not. All she knows is the one night she leaves him to his own devices he somehow ends up killing the man he's had an ongoing feud with their entire honeymoon. And he seems only mildly irritated about it. Hence, why from the character's POV Shane is looking pretty sus and not worth pissing off right now.

She will reap what she sows. Is she alone in this world? That would partially explain her attachment to him  If she has parents or relatives to talk to about this situation & chooses not to, then she deserves the nightmare her life is going to be. She won’t have that body for long & will cease to be a trophy wife. Shane seems like a cheater anyway. She should get out before homes, finances & children are involved. Go see a counselor woman. A real one. Marriage is not all it’s cracked up to be anyway. Many women lose their identities & wind up second class. Don’t I know it! Especially stubborn men who get worse with age!

[Milburn Stone]

1 hour ago, chediavolo said:

[Rachel] will reap what she sows. Is she alone in this world? That would partially explain her attachment to him  If she has parents or relatives to talk to about this situation & chooses not to, then she deserves the nightmare her life is going to be.

One aspect that hasn't been mentioned yet (I think), which leads to an interpretation that Rachel in the end made the right choice for her, is the plenty of evidence that Rachel isn't particularly good at what she does. The conversation with Nicole was a wake-up call for her, although it took a while to click in. She's a mediocre "journalist" at best. Maybe she can make more of a difference, and utilize her talents more productively, within the bosom of the Patton family.

Rachel, with time, in the alternate reality that she pursues journalism, might eventually become good at it. I don't rule that out. Very few people start out great. But the fact that she initially set her sights so low doesn't bode well for that, IMO. You need talent as well as desire.

[KarenX]

8 hours ago, Andyourlittledog2 said:

“Not that his family will let him stay once they finally figure out he is missing. I figure when they get off the plane, perhaps at baggage check.“

That plane isn’t even leaving the gate without him, a minor child, on it. He’d be missed immediately, snd not just by his family. 

The canoe men were very nice to him and probably like him as an earnest kid. I also don’t mind them telling him what he wants to hear so they can achieve their short-term/long-term goals. As for the Mossbachers… why not let him stay (with his dad)? Online high school, GED, plenty of options. Daughter is in college, family can afford to travel back and forth… money for the training/boat/supplies would flow to that canoe if the crew can really get him to stay. It’s a Reverse Belinda!

He is naive and wrapped in privilege too but he seems pleasant enough. He is capable of friendship. 

Edited August 17, 2021 by KarenX
Quotefail

[Empress1]

16 hours ago, chocolatine said:

He'd be pissed off for a while, have his lawyers make sure that Rachel doesn't get any money in the divorce, but I'm sure he'd move on quickly to another "hot" woman, encouraged by his mother.

Rachel told Nicole she signed a pre-nup and she said there were "levels to it," which I'd guess means the longer she stays married, the more she gets, and there are probably clauses for any children they have. I cannot imagine she'd get anything if she left a week after getting married, which I'd also guess was a factor in her deciding to stay.

40 minutes ago, Milburn Stone said:

One aspect that hasn't been mentioned yet (I think), which leads to an interpretation that Rachel in the end made the right choice for her, is the plenty of evidence that Rachel isn't particularly good at what she does. The conversation with Nicole was a wake-up call for her, although it took a while to click in. She's a mediocre "journalist" at best. Maybe she can make more of a difference, and utilize her talents more productively, within the bosom of the Patton family.

Yep - she was ready to ditch it entirely for an entry-level nonprofit job, and if that's the world she wants to move into, her MIL is right - she'll make more of an impact sitting on boards. 

2 hours ago, chediavolo said:

That would partially explain her attachment to him  If she has parents or relatives to talk to about this situation & chooses not to, then she deserves the nightmare her life is going to be.

She at least has a mother; we saw her on the phone with her this episode.

10 hours ago, dmc said:

Also, my father swan laps weekly up until he found out he had cancer and died three weeks later. I don't swim or know much about swimming...but I guess you can be sick and do it. 

I do swim and it's great exercise because it's easy on the joints - it's a great workout without being overly strenuous. My gym has a pool and there was a water aerobics class that was incredibly popular - packed with seniors. (My father loved the water and was an avid swimmer all his life, particularly in his later years because it helped his bad back. He hated not being able to swim at his gym during COVID.)

Edited August 17, 2021 by Empress1

[DiabLOL]

The way her phone call to her mom went, I got the impression that Rachel has absolutely nobody to rely on in her life. So no talking to Belinda wasn’t the right move for several reasons but it was very telling.

[dmc]

2 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

One aspect that hasn't been mentioned yet (I think), which leads to an interpretation that Rachel in the end made the right choice for her, is the plenty of evidence that Rachel isn't particularly good at what she does. The conversation with Nicole was a wake-up call for her, although it took a while to click in. She's a mediocre "journalist" at best. Maybe she can make more of a difference, and utilize her talents more productively, within the bosom of the Patton family.

Rachel, with time, in the alternate reality that she pursues journalism, might eventually become good at it. I don't rule that out. Very few people start out great. But the fact that she initially set her sights so low doesn't bode well for that, IMO. You need talent as well as desire.

Rachel is in her 20s.  A lot of people aren't good at what they do in their 20s.  It takes awhile to get good at your career.  I think her main issue is she has a lack of ambition or initiative.  For example her conversation with Connie...a person with initiative would have taken the opportunity to research if the article she was splicing together was accurate.  She didn't even seem aware.  Then she blames Shane for turning down that article but a person with initative would have found articles to write preemptively and finished ahead of time knowing they would be unavailable on a trip.  She just waits for people to reach out to her with crappy articles that don't pay much.  

She is completely complacent in all facets of her life and she is unruddered here because Shane is distracted and he is the person that does all the planning normally.  

 

 

[Paws]

34 minutes ago, dmc said:

think her main issue is she has a lack of ambition or initiative.  For example her conversation with Connie...a person with initiative would have taken the opportunity to research if the article she was splicing together was accurate.  She didn't even seem aware.  Then she blames Shane for turning down that article but a person with initative would have found articles to write preemptively and finished ahead of time knowing they would be unavailable on a trip.  She just waits for people to reach out to her with crappy articles that don't pay much.  

Exactly. Any journalist, writer, etc would at least be tweeting or blogging or *something* before and during the wedding/ honeymoon.  Like, in a JOURNAL. If she only bothers writing anything when an assignment comes her way, she is likely a shitty, unambitious writer.

[dmc]

3 minutes ago, Paws said:

Exactly. Any journalist, writer, etc would at least be tweeting or blogging or *something* before and during the wedding/ honeymoon.  Like, in a JOURNAL. If she only bothers writing anything when an assignment comes her way, she is likely a shitty, unambitious writer.

YEP.  And I don't know her husband is in a better situation that she is in this marriage.  She has already decided that any issue she has with her career or feelings of inadequancy she is blaming solely on him.  Nevermind, that they had a whirlwind relationship, and have not been together long.  Nevermind, that she completely lets him take the lead on everything.  But the fact that she doesn't feel enough and hasn't accomplished enough is completely on Shane.  

[chocolatine]

47 minutes ago, DiabLOL said:

The way her phone call to her mom went, I got the impression that Rachel has absolutely nobody to rely on in her life. So no talking to Belinda wasn’t the right move for several reasons but it was very telling.

Her problem is that she needs to have someone on whom she can rely. A woman her age, with a college education, in a free country like the US, does not need a man *or* her parents to support her. If she feels like her self-respect is the price she needs to pay for a cushy life, that's 100% on her and not on her lack of support system.

[dmc]

10 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

Her problem is that she needs to have someone on whom she can rely. A woman her age, with a college education, in a free country like the US, does not need a man *or* her parents to support her. If she feels like her self-respect is the price she needs to pay for a cushy life, that's 100% on her and not on her lack of support system.

Also you can pay someone called a therapist to rely on for the price of a copay.  

[aghst]

4 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

One aspect that hasn't been mentioned yet (I think), which leads to an interpretation that Rachel in the end made the right choice for her, is the plenty of evidence that Rachel isn't particularly good at what she does. The conversation with Nicole was a wake-up call for her, although it took a while to click in. She's a mediocre "journalist" at best. Maybe she can make more of a difference, and utilize her talents more productively, within the bosom of the Patton family.

Rachel, with time, in the alternate reality that she pursues journalism, might eventually become good at it. I don't rule that out. Very few people start out great. But the fact that she initially set her sights so low doesn't bode well for that, IMO. You need talent as well as desire.

 

Or maybe Shane, Kitty and Nicole all gaslit her, for their own reasons.

It's not unheard of, men and older women gaslighting younger women, to make them compliant to their will.

Nicole telling her she isn't a good journalist?  How does she know, beyond not liking the story Rachel did for her?  Have we not heard this complaint before, from some executive or celebrity complaining of bad journalism?  I bet they didn't go to J school either so how would they know?

2 hours ago, dmc said:

Rachel is in her 20s.  A lot of people aren't good at what they do in their 20s.  It takes awhile to get good at your career.  I think her main issue is she has a lack of ambition or initiative.  For example her conversation with Connie...a person with initiative would have taken the opportunity to research if the article she was splicing together was accurate.  She didn't even seem aware.  Then she blames Shane for turning down that article but a person with initative would have found articles to write preemptively and finished ahead of time knowing they would be unavailable on a trip.  She just waits for people to reach out to her with crappy articles that don't pay much.  

She is completely complacent in all facets of her life and she is unruddered here because Shane is distracted and he is the person that does all the planning normally.  

 

 

Alexandra Daddario is actually 37.  They could have cast her to play a twenty something character but Rachel could just as well be in her early 30s.

Anyways, she's not seen huge professional success.  Doesn't mean she's not good at it.

Shane and Kitty were essentially mocking her for wanting to continue, since she's not making much money at it.  For them it's transactional not about independence or a hedge.

[dmc]

55 minutes ago, aghst said:

 

Or maybe Shane, Kitty and Nicole all gaslit her, for their own reasons.

It's not unheard of, men and older women gaslighting younger women, to make them compliant to their will.

Nicole telling her she isn't a good journalist?  How does she know, beyond not liking the story Rachel did for her?  Have we not heard this complaint before, from some executive or celebrity complaining of bad journalism?  I bet they didn't go to J school either so how would they know?

Alexandra Daddario is actually 37.  They could have cast her to play a twenty something character but Rachel could just as well be in her early 30s.

Anyways, she's not seen huge professional success.  Doesn't mean she's not good at it.

Shane and Kitty were essentially mocking her for wanting to continue, since she's not making much money at it.  For them it's transactional not about independence or a hedge.

LOL the person that played Andrea in 90210 was 37 and playing a 16 year old. Hollywood is notorious for pulling this.   Trophy wife usually doesn't mean 30s but maybe she could be older.  But I don't see Shane going that route, I see him with the mid twentys person

Edited August 17, 2021 by dmc

[nr65000]

1 hour ago, aghst said:

Nicole telling her she isn't a good journalist?  How does she know, beyond not liking the story Rachel did for her?  Have we not heard this complaint before, from some executive or celebrity complaining of bad journalism?  I bet they didn't go to J school either so how would they know?

If I remember correctly, she said she wasn't a very good journalist after Rachel told her she basically lifted the whole story from another magazine.  

[Lastwaltz]

On 8/15/2021 at 10:32 PM, meligator said:

That's 2 things I never thought I would see on a TV show.

And I really, really wish I hadn't. 

[chocolatine]

2 hours ago, aghst said:

Alexandra Daddario is actually 37.  They could have cast her to play a twenty something character but Rachel could just as well be in her early 30s.

I also thought Rachel and Shane are in their early 30s. Maybe 28 or 29, but not younger than that. Rachel talked about spending years building relationships with editors who would give her freelance assignments. If she had been much younger, she wouldn't have been as susceptible to Shane and what he offered. Everyone expects to be broke and struggling in the first few years after college, but when it's still happening as you're nearing/passing 30, it makes you second-guess your life choices.

And if Shane was in his 20s, he would just enjoy screwing around with no strings attached. But after he turned 30, there was at least implied pressure from his family and social circle to settle down with a suitable woman - someone educated, well-spoken, and elegant, who can organize charity events, sit on a myriad of boards, and raise children. I think he zeroed in on Rachel because she ticked all of those boxes, and also happened to be "hot" enough for him to want to have sex with her.

[Empress1]

11 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

But after he turned 30, there was at least implied pressure from his family and social circle to settle down with a suitable woman - someone educated, well-spoken, and elegant, who can organize charity events, sit on a myriad of boards, and raise children. I think he zeroed in on Rachel because she ticked all of those boxes, and also happened to be "hot" enough for him to want to have sex with her.

What's interesting to me is that based on the conversation Rachel had with Olivia and Paula, Rachel doesn't really check off all those boxes aside from being beautiful. She has a degree but it's from a state school (she mentioned SUNY), she doesn't come from a wealthy family (she mentioned student loan debt and Shane said her mother couldn't afford to stay at the resort), and she doesn't make much money. Shane was wearing a Cornell hat and appears to be from at least two generations of wealth (his mother said she had her own money when she got married to Shane's dad). 

I went to an Ivy. To be blunt, Ivy-educated moneyed WASPs tend to marry other Ivy-educated (or schools of a similar tier) moneyed WASPs. I would bet there was a lot of whispering when Shane got engaged to Rachel, and the pre-nup was likely his mother's idea. I think part of what Shane liked about Rachel was that he could control her. (The other part is her beauty.) She doesn't have money of her own (his mother said having money of her own when she came into her marriage gave her leverage) and can't seem to earn it via her chosen profession. If she didn't come from money but worked on Wall St. or was an associate at a BigLaw firm so she was in a high-earning profession, I don't think Shane would be interested in her because he wouldn't be able to control her.

[dmc]

46 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

I also thought Rachel and Shane are in their early 30s. Maybe 28 or 29, but not younger than that. Rachel talked about spending years building relationships with editors who would give her freelance assignments. If she had been much younger, she wouldn't have been as susceptible to Shane and what he offered. Everyone expects to be broke and struggling in the first few years after college, but when it's still happening as you're nearing/passing 30, it makes you second-guess your life choices.

And if Shane was in his 20s, he would just enjoy screwing around with no strings attached. But after he turned 30, there was at least implied pressure from his family and social circle to settle down with a suitable woman - someone educated, well-spoken, and elegant, who can organize charity events, sit on a myriad of boards, and raise children. I think he zeroed in on Rachel because she ticked all of those boxes, and also happened to be "hot" enough for him to want to have sex with her.

see I didnt see them as the same age.  I saw him as older

[ZaldamoWilder]

Damn I feel like the Twighlight Zone dude with the regular nose and the rest of ya'll got snouts.  No one else thought the conversation Shane had in the opening with the couple at the airport asking where his wife was meant that Rachael was in the box?  #illbedamb 

On 8/15/2021 at 10:26 PM, Laurie4H said:

I think that was a first for me watching someone take a dump in a movie or tv show lol.  
Obviously Quinn will be searched for.  Legally he would have to be returned home if found.  
How much money did she give Belinda?  
I don’t think Kai’s name would be mentioned when asked what his name was.  I would think that would have been confidential 
Paula was the worst.  And was that family that bad?  I didn’t think so.  Quinn was a naive kid.  The daughter showed some emotion at the end and the parents meant well. 

Like Hitler level evil?  No, but yea girl, in terms of willful ignorance, they were that bad.  At the point where you're asking your daughter and her brown-skinned scholarship schoolmate to include your son because the world suddenly doesn't have any sympathy for "straight white males", you need to be like, Aunt Lydia style point-shamed.   Nicole was dead ass serious too, that's what made it bad.  Mark's rant about colonialism (though I think he called it Imperialism) "that was then and this is now, well what do you want me to do about it, I can't be racist I have 4 black friends..." ---  ugh if I never hear that shit again in my lifetime.  It's damn near unbearable to listen to the pretense of folk who don't have a racist bone in their body (that's legit always the phrase too lol!).  Zealots and nutcases are more volatile, sure, but they're honest about their bullshit.   

On 8/15/2021 at 11:49 PM, txhorns79 said:

I was thinking she was throwing up because she was terrified she was going to get arrested. 

Hold up.  Am I really the only one here who thinks we'll see a S2 reference made to Paula being pregnant?   

On 8/16/2021 at 12:19 AM, CarpeFelis said:

Belinda has been around long enough to be the manager of the spa  and have a teenage kid — she’s no naïve twentysomething — and she didn’t seem dumb by any means. So it seemed odd to me that she was actually taken in by Tanya’s talk about setting her up in her own business, because everything about Tanya absolutely screamed “flake” from minute one. I didn’t blame Belinda one bit when she told Rachel she had no advice to give her. Even though she’d given Rachel her card and said to call if she needed anything, it was really tone deaf of Rachel to take her up on it. Couldn’t she call her mom? Does she have no girlfriends back home to call?

As for Rachel, I was disappointed she went back to Shane in the end. But yeah, she doesn’t seem to be a terribly strong person. Not only would it take strength to walk out on her honeymoon, but she’d be left to start over with nothing and that had to be a scary prospect. If she’d had a less shaky career she might have been able to pull it off. My husband and I are both engineers and I actually earned more than he did for several years (I’m older and started my career 9 years before he did) so if I’d needed to walk out on him during our honeymoon, I had the resources to cope just fine. Rachel couldn’t say the same.

At least we finally got the explanation as to how she got sucked into marrying him after knowing him such a short time, and how she was so busy with the wedding planning she didn’t realize what living with him would be like. I did really love it when she called him a man baby who was spoiled by his mommy who showed up on their honeymoon!

I wonder how long Quinn got to stick around on the island. How did he think he was going to support himself? Where would he live? No doubt his parents would have found him before long anyway.

But but but?  She got her own room on thelast night.  Now she doesn't have Shane's family level money but do ya'll think she can't live without him financially or something?  That $400 article she was about to write wasn't for herinterest in the subject matter or cash, it was to maintain relationships she'd spent years cultivating.

She is a different type bitch to come back though.  If we were fighting about mamas and you told me the reason mine wouldn've shown up on our honeymooon was that she couldn't afford the airfare, a) bitch?! yes she can, how bout I just busted a hole in ya debit card, she'll be here in the morning; b) don't say no shit like that and go to sleep near me, I'm getting in the bed with the pineapple knife; and c) your mama

 

On 8/16/2021 at 2:41 AM, ichbin said:

Loved it until the end when things wrapped up too much too fast and unrealistically.  

In the end it boils down to people being imperfect, regardless of who they are or what they have.  

Shane is a dick, but Armond was too and fanned the flame needlessly by lying and being unprofessional from the start. A guest booked into the most expensive suite deserves the room that was booked and paid for regardless of who is paying for it.  If Armondhad acknowledged an error had been made and taken steps to make up for it from the get go, Shane would still have been a dick but would have gotten over it. The only reason things escalated was because Armond kept compounding the issue which was initially created by himself.  

Paula looks down on her hosts, thinking them terrible people while she winds up being the worst of them all by being the reason a young man's life and livelihood are ruined.  Kai is a nice guy, but he allows himself to be talked into doing what he knows is the wrong thing.  The stabbing could actually be traced back to what Paula started since it was the reason that the knife was where it was and considered to be needed as a weapon.  

Belinda is a nice, empathetic person, but yet the way she ultimately treats Rachel wasn't great since she is the one who opened her door and welcomed Rachel in knowing she was having a crisis of some sort. Belinda also knew that Tanya was a loony from the start but allowed her own desires to be a blinder of that.  Nobody is perfect.

Every one of the characters pretty much showed different facets of themselves through the show.  I remember watching Mike White and his father when they were on The Amazing Race.  They were delightful!  Funny to think that he is the creator of something as dark and complicated as this was. 

The one seemingly true innocent, Quinn, was allowed to have his happy (although totally unrealistic) ending.  

I'd like to see Rachel and Shane show up in the next season.  I can picture Rachel having gone full trophy wife and blossoming into Kitty 2.0.

mmmm.  coincidence.  It was there for the pineapples lol.

On 8/16/2021 at 5:16 AM, Armchair Critic said:

When Olivia cried to her mother I thought it was a fake boohoo and that she was going to rat out Paula and act innocent like she just found out about Paula and the robbery. But I guess she was genuinely crying.

This.  But I also didn't feel anything for Olivia. Throughout.  I thought the strand she and Paula had in common was emotional manipulation and garden variety shiddyness.  That thing with going up to Kai after the dancers performed, given her tearful heartfult speech to Paula about trust was *blech*

On 8/16/2021 at 8:29 AM, AheadofStraight said:

So we see Paula texting Kai in this episode. Makes absolutely NO sense that she wouldn't have texted him (or even called in a panic) when the diving plans changed and Nicole went back to the room. 

This is what I was waiting for.  You don't take your phone on a heist?  Also why wouldn't Kai have known the hallways are camera'ed?  weird shit.

On 8/16/2021 at 11:10 AM, Empress1 said:

I didn't see this at all. I don't think Rachel has a sense of what her own person is - if she did, as someone else said, I don't think she'd have married Shane in the first place. Half her "I made a mistake" speech was about how she basically got swept up into Shane's orbit and then she looked up and she was married. She said she was coming off a bad breakup when they met; he's the rebound guy. She's had to face that she's not a good journalist but she doesn't know what else she could be good at, and I don't think she has the fortitude to try and figure it out. She told Shane she was happy and would stay with him while crying.

I do agree with this, although Paula isn't white (the actress is biracial with a Black mother and white father, and this article says that she and Belinda are the only Black women around). I also think Paula calling out Olivia resonated with Olivia (hence the tears), although I very much doubt it'll change Olivia's behavior.

It wouldn't.  She's this kid, grown up.

On 8/16/2021 at 1:15 PM, aghst said:

Paula never rejected privilege.

She still let the Mossbachers pay for her meals and other expenses, after she tried to rip them off.

She didn't care about Kai.  It was a summer fling for her and she told him she won't see him again when he asked her to stay.

Did she really believe the stolen jewelry would help Kai or did she think of it to stick it to the Mossbachers?

Armand said Kai was a good employee, surprised he would do such a thing.  Paula corrupted him.

This remiinds me of soomething my neighbor says about 95% of the prison population.  It's either about money or tail.

On 8/16/2021 at 4:05 PM, tennisgurl said:

Dear Trip Adviser, 

The White Lotus has lovely rooms, spectacular views, and a breakfast buffet with a wide selection of food and beverages. I was however, mostly disappointed in my trip. I spent an hour in line behind a very loud man arguing with the manager about a room change, my surfing excursion of ruined by a woman attempting to toss what looked like dust out of a vacuum into the ocean while screaming, my morning jog was interrupted by a teenager sleeping on the beach (very concerning) who I almost tripped over, I spent half of my pool day avoiding a middle aged man who kept asking me if I knew anything about anal sex, the couple in the room across the hall from me were victims of an armed robbery (I heard that the robber was wielding an AK-47) and assault, various staff members seemed to be on the verge of tears whenever I was looking for assistance, and when I went to look for the manager he was nowhere to be found and his office door was shut. I later asked the aforementioned manager why I was no longer scheduled for my previously arranged snorkeling trip, and he would only say that I was mistaken, and then wandered away. I was greatly shocked to discover that that same manager was later accidently stabbed by a guest, which really put a damper on the whole vacation. Also, it literally smelled like shit. 

Will not return. 

Andplusalso:  I stepped in some weird goo on the floor in the lobby.  No yellow caution cones anywhere.  Very dangerous! 

18 hours ago, WatcherUatl10 said:

Well, I was wrong about Tanya's hook-up's cough being a pretense. He's doing some pretty serious swimming for a dying guy. (I'd guess the sex might be strenuous, as well, but maybe he's not active, and I found out more about bodily functions this episode than I ever want to know about in a fictional universe.) Speaking of bodily functions, my television experience is that if a woman/girl is vomiting, she is either drunk, dying, or pregnant. "Let me tell you about how I met your father. It's a funny story..."

  I feel that in a real world scenario that the rowers would have just been being nice to Quinn. He does NOT have their body type, and no amount of physical  activity is going to turn him into an asset. They will likely have to let him down gently so that he can return to his boring life.

   Poor Belinda. Again, never trust someone who offers too much. Especially one as ditzy as Tanya. Belinda should just shop around her proposal, since getting it on paper was probably a hurdle that Tanya DID inspire her to overcome.

  Lastly, when you're at a drug-and-booze-fueled party with a few shirtless guys, don't let things outside that room distract you. It never ends well.

I'm so doing this outta order.  Okay, I don't feel alone anymore :) 

[chediavolo]

8 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

One aspect that hasn't been mentioned yet (I think), which leads to an interpretation that Rachel in the end made the right choice for her, is the plenty of evidence that Rachel isn't particularly good at what she does. The conversation with Nicole was a wake-up call for her, although it took a while to click in. She's a mediocre "journalist" at best. Maybe she can make more of a difference, and utilize her talents more productively, within the bosom of the Patton family.

Rachel, with time, in the alternate reality that she pursues journalism, might eventually become good at it. I don't rule that out. Very few people start out great. But the fact that she initially set her sights so low doesn't bode well for that, IMO. You need talent as well as desire.

Except her piece of shit husband has already showed his temper. Her mother-in-law is awful her husband is awful.  I think she can’t see past the cushy lifestyle, money, the comfort. Just the ease Of it all. Until something happens. Her husband will certainly cheat on her.   Or years later she realizes how she wasted her life. 

[aghst]

Rachel was literally skeeved out as Shane pawed at her.

If she didn't jump out of bed, he'd have grabbed her and satisfy himself.

Earlier he told her he can't wait to fuck her in Tahiti.

 

OK, Belinda refused to give her advice, after giving her her card and inviting her to call her.

Then in her own room, she called someone.  Earlier she tried to talk to her mom, who was too busy to talk at that time.

 

So Rachel made her own call?  Promised Shane she will be happy, even when Shane gropes her some more.

She'd rather sleep with someone whom she despised, at least when she called him a man-child, than be poor?

Can either of them take back what they'd said to each other?

 

Maybe her exit plan is to endure him touching her for enough years to get a tidy payout on the prenup and GTFO.

[dmc]

11 minutes ago, aghst said:

Rachel was literally skeeved out as Shane pawed at her.

If she didn't jump out of bed, he'd have grabbed her and satisfy himself.

Earlier he told her he can't wait to fuck her in Tahiti.

 

OK, Belinda refused to give her advice, after giving her her card and inviting her to call her.

Then in her own room, she called someone.  Earlier she tried to talk to her mom, who was too busy to talk at that time.

 

So Rachel made her own call?  Promised Shane she will be happy, even when Shane gropes her some more.

She'd rather sleep with someone whom she despised, at least when she called him a man-child, than be poor?

Can either of them take back what they'd said to each other?

 

Maybe her exit plan is to endure him touching her for enough years to get a tidy payout on the prenup and GTFO.

I think the growth for Belinda's character is just she actually cares about the guests in personal way and it's not good for her.  She gives and gives and is ultimately disappointed.  I didn't take her saying that to Rachel as a diss.  Tanya comes to Belinda and basically admits to doing the same thing to Belinda and its a mistake because she keeps getting hurt and exhausted.  Belinda realizes she does the same and draws a line with Rachel.

Edited August 17, 2021 by dmc

[Hanahope]

Wow, that felt like  6 hours wasted.  if this really does get a second season, i'm going to wait until its done, and read a review first before deciding whether to watch again.  all we saw was awful rich white people doing whatever they wanted, getting away with everything, while the poc/poorer people got all the damage.  no hidden gems, no words of wisdom, no good story.  i know its probably real life, but that's not what I want when I spend my precious free time for 'entertainment.'  

 

[CarpeFelis]

Did anyone besides me assume that when Rachel got her own room it would be charged to Shane/Shane’s mom?

ETA: There should have been a scene where Armond tells her the room is complimentary because of the earlier mixup, but he’s really just doing it because he knows it’ll piss Shane off!

Edited August 17, 2021 by CarpeFelis

[Broderbits]

7 hours ago, dmc said:

Rachel is in her 20s.  A lot of people aren't good at what they do in their 20s.  It takes awhile to get good at your career.  I think her main issue is she has a lack of ambition or initiative.

I get the feeling that Rachel has been skating by on her good looks. If she's going to stay married she should use some of his money to further her education and find out what she's good at. Then get the hell out!

This series was mildly interesting but I didn't learn anything new about rich people, grieving people, or teen-age people. I did learn that there are several actors I never wish to see again!

[dmc]

4 minutes ago, Broderbits said:

I get the feeling that Rachel has been skating by on her good looks. If she's going to stay married she should use some of his money to further her education and find out what she's good at. Then get the hell out!

This series was mildly interesting but I didn't learn anything new about rich people, grieving people, or teen-age people. I did learn that there are several actors I never wish to see again!

agreed

[ichbin]

2 hours ago, ZaldamoWilder said:

mmmm.  coincidence.  It was there for the pineapples lol.

Initially, but during his conversation in the room with Rachel he decided they could also be a target based up on being in the most expensive room and they should have a weapon to defend themselves,  He then took the knife and placed it on the bedside table in case it would be needed for that reason.  The weird part for me is I could have sworn he had been shown on the  left side of the bed and Rachel on the right in previous scenes so I remember thinking it was odd for him to put the knife on the right side night stand.

[ichbin]

2 hours ago, dmc said:

I think the growth for Belinda's character is just she actually cares about the guests in personal way and it's not good for her.  She gives and gives and is ultimately disappointed.  I didn't take her saying that to Rachel as a diss.  Tanya comes to Belinda and basically admits to doing the same thing to Belinda and its a mistake because she keeps getting hurt and exhausted.  Belinda realizes she does the same and draws a line with Rachel.

All it showed to me is that anyone, regardless of how nice, has it within them to be as nasty and cruel as anyone else.  Rachel did not demand anything from Belinda.  Aside from being unable to hold back the tears she did not ask more of her other than if she knew if there were any available rooms.  Belinda made the decision to come over and give  Rachel her card and  the offer to contact her. Belinda may have learned a valuable lesson, but putting it into play when she had been the one to open the door to Rachel wasn't the time to exercise her newfound ability to slam it shut.  Under those circumstances she demonstrated cruelty.

If this series shows anything it is that people will ultimately put themselves and their own needs first.

[dmc]

7 minutes ago, ichbin said:

All it showed to me is that anyone, regardless of how nice, has it within them to be as nasty and cruel as anyone else.  Rachel did not demand anything from Belinda.  Aside from being unable to hold back the tears she did not ask more of her other than if she knew if there were any available rooms.  Belinda made the decision to come over and give  Rachel her card and  the offer to contact her. Belinda may have learned a valuable lesson, but putting it into play when she had been the one to open the door to Rachel wasn't the time to exercise her newfound ability to slam it shut.  Under those circumstances she demonstrated cruelty.

If this series shows anything it is that people will ultimately put themselves and their own needs first.

I think Belinda crossed the line though.  Belinda works there, she is not a professional counselor.  She doesn't know Rachel and her job isn't to be moral support for the customers.  The last time she crossed the line to be an emotional coach for Tanya.  She went to her because she is a compassionate person but ultimately she shouldn't be providing this support for Rachel.  She just realized enough is enough.  She is an employee and these people are just guests.  

Edited August 17, 2021 by dmc

[CarpeFelis]

2 hours ago, dmc said:

I think Belinda crossed the line though.  Belinda works there, she is not a professional counselor.  She doesn't know Rachel and her job isn't to be moral support for the customers.  The last time she crossed the line to be an emotional coach for Tanya.  She went to her because she is a compassionate person but ultimately she shouldn't be providing this support for Rachel.  She just realized enough is enough.  She is an employee and these people are just guests.  

Completely agree. She doesn’t owe these people her time or emotional energy when she’s off the clock, and I thought Tanya had a hell of a nerve taking up so much of her off-duty time.

[chocolatine]

1 hour ago, CarpeFelis said:

Completely agree. She doesn’t owe these people her time or emotional energy when she’s off the clock, and I thought Tanya had a hell of a nerve taking up so much of her off-duty time.

Belinda needs a cache of excuses that nobody can argue with. "I have to make dinner for my family/visit my elderly mother in the nursing home/check on a sick friend, so I really can't stay after work, so sorry."

[Bulldog]

So, if Shane had not been "upgraded" to the Pineapple Suite, he would not have had the knife used to stab Armond?  And yes, Shane was totally justified.  There is no jurisdiction that would have charged him and no court that would have convicted him for killing an unknown prowler in his room accidentally.  It just would not have happened. 

Are we to believe that the police never asked Kai how he got the code to the safe?  And if they did ask, was Kai so in love with Paula, a girl he had known less than a week, that he would not have given her up?  Not buying it.  Of course, Paula did get him to commit multiple felonies so clearly he was not the sharpest tool in the shed either.  Olivia will definitely use what she knows about the burglary against Paula at some point in the future. 

One touch that I thought summed up Tanya perfectly was when she returned to the spa to retrieve her sunglasses after giving Belinda the money.  That one little act really seemed to twist the knife. 

Quinn staying on the islands was totally unrealistic.  Someone up thread said the plane would not have even departed with him not being accounted for.  Totally agree.   It did seem that Mark and Nicole finally grew some sort of backbone with regards to their children.  Mark emphatically telling Quinn no about staying (I got the impression that might have been the first time they had ever told one of them no.)  And Nicole trying to teach Olivia a little empathy when Paula was vomiting on the boat.  One recurring theme I found amusing during the series was Nicole's increasing exasperation at Paula's seemingly myriad of health problems.  

I was hoping Belinda might get a somewhat happy ending and be made manager after Armond's death.  I'm assuming the guy in the pink coat at the end was the new manager.  Although Belinda was clearly the most sympathetic figure on the whole show, I do think she brought some of it on herself as she seemed more than willing to be a sounding board for the rich clients (especially after hours).  Even at ritzy resorts like this, the staff can draw clear boundaries.  I enjoyed her telling Rachel that she couldn't help her with her problems at the end, but why did she earlier give her her card and tell her to call if she needed anything. 

[Phillygurl]

Hmm well I might be alone in thinking this but Belinda was not innocent. She was clearly pretending to care about Tanya to get that investment money. Her son basically told her to do just that. I don't know if anyone else noticed but when Tanya first arrived and she wanted to book a Massage, Belinda said there were no availabilities. She then did the immersive holistic experience instead and then right after a guest called for a massage and all of a sudden the schedule was wide open. So I'm not sure what Belinda's original problem was but she only became extremely accommodating when she thought she had something to gain. So I don't feel sorry for Belinda. She was able to put a business plan together and she has some seed money. She needs to find another way to make her dreams come true.

As for Rachel, I'm not sure why some people think her only 2 options are be a mediocre journalist or have daily sex with a man you can't stand. She can go back to school, change careers, back pack around Europe. Do whatever she wants. But yes if she rather trade her happiness for money then she deserves Shane 100%. Don't feel sorry for her either.

The only one I empathize with is Kai. He was a nice guy who just wanted Paula to stay. She of course would never leave her comfy life for him so she convinced him to steal to take attention off the fact that he as just a stop on her tour bus and nothing more. Paula is definitely the worst. Why even go to Hawaii with a bunch of rich white people if they are so deplorable to you? Their privilege is acceptable as long as it extends to you. Awesome.

Quinn was ok and a mostly acceptable human being. I really hated how his sister treated him. I wish she had to sleep in the closet.

[CarpeFelis]

31 minutes ago, Phillygurl said:

I don't know if anyone else noticed but when Tanya first arrived and she wanted to book a Massage, Belinda said there were no availabilities. She then did the immersive holistic experience instead and then right after a guest called for a massage and all of a sudden the schedule was wide open.

Quinn was ok and a mostly acceptable human being. I really hated how his sister treated him. I wish she had to sleep in the closet.

I noticed that, too, and wondered if there had been a sudden cancellation or something. I was surprised Tanya didn’t take note of it and say something.

Olivia? I wish that snotty little bitch had to sleep with the fishes, especially after the way she’d talked to Rachel back in the first episode. It was so annoying when Paula finally texted Kai to ask if he was all right and Olivia narrowed her eyes and asked what she was doing and who she was texting. It was none of her damn business! Granted, at that point she was suspicious about Paula’s involvement in the robbery, but it wasn’t the first time she’d acted that way either.

[aghst]

So they have the biggest suite in a 5-star resort.

When they ask for room service to bring them pineapples, they don't cut it already and slice it for them?

The pineapple knife contrivance, well I don't know why they needed any corpse.  I guess other than a good way to hook people in from the first episode to watch until the end.

[MBayGal]

1 hour ago, Bulldog said:

  I enjoyed her telling Rachel that she couldn't help her with her problems at the end, but why did she earlier give her her card and tell her to call if she needed anything.

I think she gave Rachael her card before Tanya came and showed Belinda that she really didn't give a shit about her.  After that, Belinda didn't want to get involved in any guests' problems.

[nomodrama]

Let's be honest, every character on this show sucked to some degree. 

Mark, Nicole and Shane were the cliche rich people full of elitism. They were a prime example of money not being able to buy happiness. 

I really don't understand the "Poor Kai's". He made the choice to commit a crime, he was stealing and then he decided to assault someone. He got caught so he will receive punishment for that. That is how that works. You do the crime, you do the time. I don't understand this thinking that because he is suffering from some injustice he should have clearance to steal from people and get away with it. 

Paula was beyond exhausting. It doesn't make sense for someone with such strong convictions about social injustice would choose to be friends with and vacation with a wealthy white family that stands for everything she absolutely hates. Her behavior was incredibly gross. 

Belinda was ready to get as far away from Tanya as possible until she actually believed that Tanya was going to help her with start a Spa business. The attention she paid Tanya was fully based on self interest and it back fired on her. 

Quinn actually wasn't so bad but he's still young and unfortunately growing up in the family he's in there's probably not much hope that he will turn out to be a decent person. 

The whole thing with Shane and Armond was also exhausting. As much as Shane was an asshole, Armond pretty much instigated the entire situation by lying about the room in the first place, then he continued to do awful unprofessional things to continue to escalate the situation. 

Armond and Olivia were the absolute worst out of the bunch. Rachel was so boring, I couldn't care less about what happens with her character and honestly would have found the show more interesting had it actually been her in the coffin at the end rather than Armond. 

 

[Nellise]

37 minutes ago, nomodrama said:

Belinda was ready to get as far away from Tanya as possible until she actually believed that Tanya was going to help her with start a Spa business. The attention she paid Tanya was fully based on self interest and it back fired on her.

It didn't even really backfire on her. She got at least several thousand dollars as a tip for having a couple of dinners. It's kind of ridiculous the show tried make us feel bad for her. I said before the show essentially tried to make us feel bad that someone didn't win the lottery, but it wasn't even that. She did win the lottery, just with 5 numbers instead of 6.

Edited August 18, 2021 by Nellise

[kn51]

10 hours ago, Phillygurl said:

Hmm well I might be alone in thinking this but Belinda was not innocent.

You're not alone.  Granted, she wasn't at the level of the others but there was definitely an element of "what am I getting out of this" for her altruistic ways.  Heck, even the bellhop was taking advantage of situations.  Trading a night with Armond for better work hours.

I found the Mossbachers being the most interesting just due to their level of being oblivious to absolutely everything at every level.  Nicole's line to Quinn about "what about your family back home?" was so rich.  

[Phillygurl]

8 hours ago, nomodrama said:

I don't understand this thinking that because he is suffering from some injustice he should have clearance to steal from people and get away with it. 

I don't think feeling bad for what happened to Kai is the equivalent of saying oh yeah he should have gotten away with it. I felt he was manipulated into doing something he clearly didn't want to do. But of course he should be punished, not just for the stealing but the physical assault was upsetting and completely unnecessary.

I felt bad that he allowed himself to be manipulated not that he got caught

Edited August 18, 2021 by Phillygurl

[Harvey]

8 hours ago, Nellise said:

It didn't even really backfire on her. She got at least several thousand dollars as a tip for having a couple of dinners. It's kind of ridiculous the show tried make us feel bad for her. I said before the show essentially tried to make us feel bad that someone didn't win the lottery, but it wasn't even that. She did win the lottery, just with 5 numbers instead of 6.

This like she still got an exorbitant amount of money for just talking to a nice lady for 5 days. She still got off extremely well, no need to feel sorry for her. If she is so unfulfilled in her job she can change it.

[MBayGal]

11 hours ago, nomodrama said:

Paula was beyond exhausting. It doesn't make sense for someone with such strong convictions about social injustice would choose to be friends with and vacation with a wealthy white family that stands for everything she absolutely hates. Her behavior was incredibly gross. 

I think she enjoyed spending a week putting them down for their values and beliefs, despite their values and beliefs having helped them become the rich white people she takes advantage of but claims to despise. What a hypocrite!!  Mark and Nicole were correct saying no one is willing to give up whatever privilege and advantages they have, and people who are lower on the social scale want to take over at the top. There are a few exceptions of course, but not many.

[MartyQui]

Was it ever established that Paula came from a poor background?  That backpack full of pills had to cost something.  And I don't think the Mossbachers were as rich as they would have liked to appear...otherwise they would have had a two bedroom suite, instead of the kids sleeping on the pullout sofa.  And a cot.

[mansonlamps]

On 8/16/2021 at 6:30 PM, letter8358 said:

This was renewed for another season?!? 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/deadline.com/2021/08/the-white-lotus-renewed-season-2-hbo-1234812342/amp/

 

Yes.

[Hanahope]

1 hour ago, MartyQui said:

Was it ever established that Paula came from a poor background?  That backpack full of pills had to cost something.  And I don't think the Mossbachers were as rich as they would have liked to appear...otherwise they would have had a two bedroom suite, instead of the kids sleeping on the pullout sofa.  And a cot.

The suite/sleeping arrangements are clearly a plot device in order to create conflict between Quinn and Olivia in order to get Quinn out of the room and onto the beach where he loses his phone, meets the paddlers and has his 'revelation."  The "handwave" i did was that they made this trip decision last minute (because Nicole's work keeps her "so busy" she can't get away) and that was the only suite left.