Season 23 Live Feeds Discussion

[choclatechip45]

12 minutes ago, himela said:

I watched the talk between Tiff and Claire. How can people insist that this decision is NOT racist? Claire is going home because she is white. I mean, what else is there to say? And I know some former players did go home (maybe) because they were black but nobody said it that openly, there was always a question mark, plus this is not better just cause others did it before...

Howard and Candace both went home because they were black. It was definitely not a question mark. 

Claire played her whole game for Tiffany. She did nothing this whole game. 

Edited September 6, 2021 by choclatechip45

[Auntie Velvet]

25 minutes ago, himela said:

I watched the talk between Tiff and Claire. How can people insist that this decision is NOT racist? Claire is going home because she is white. I mean, what else is there to say? And I know some former players did go home (maybe) because they were black but nobody said it that openly, there was always a question mark, plus this is not better just cause others did it before...

People are going to feel one of two ways about this -- and it's just not going to be resolved. If it's not resolved on the more consequential "pro-BLM vs. All Lives Matter" discourse, it certainly won't be for a summertime game show.   

[Callaphera]

Because you can't just palette swap someone's skin tone from white to black (or any other colour or combination) and put them in the same situation and have it be an exact one-to-one comparison. Just like you can't swap male to female in a situation and have it mean the very same thing. It's not an apples to apples comparison.

[lilmarysunshine]

20 hours ago, Melina22 said:

I've been legitimately blindsided a couple of times in my life, but after the main one I felt sort of paralyzed. It's so shocking that anger is the last thing you feel. It takes a day or two to fully sink in. (Or several months, but that was just me and I wasn't playing a game.) 

That said, once the dust clears, Tiffany's motive will be the most important thing, the knowledge that Tiffany wasn't playing Claire, faking affection, but was playing for a higher cause. Tiffany is making a terrible mistake not giving this info to Claire to brood about in jury. She'll regret it. 

Playing for a “higher cause.” lol How many times just this week has she declared she wants that $750K? 

[lilmarysunshine]

17 hours ago, ByaNose said:

Alyssa is very, very, pretty. Whether it’s a full blowout & or tiny braids she’s effortless. I think she Azah are the prettiest. Azah is runway beautiful. I always look forward to her Thursday outfits & hair. She’s always on 🔥.

This discussion reminds me of ANTM. Azah is more runway or couture. The others are more commercial or conventionally pretty. If I was to pick the “cutest,” I would probably say Hannah. I think Alyssa is thin as a pin so can wear clothes well but really not remarkable.

[Auntie Velvet]

9 minutes ago, lilmarysunshine said:

Playing for a “higher cause.” lol How many times just this week has she declared she wants that $750K? 

I think what Melina meant was that how Tiffany is playing, is what she's doing for a higher cause.

She might have a better chance winning the money if she abandoned the CO, or would feel better emotionally if she told Claire everything, but she's holding on for the sake of the group.

[Coco88]

I don’t know if Tiff tried to pitch the plan of Alyssa using the veto on X but Alyssa took herself off and Claire is the replacement.

[lilmarysunshine]

12 minutes ago, Auntie Velvet said:

I think what Melina meant was that how Tiffany is playing, is what she's doing for a higher cause.

She might have a better chance winning the money if she abandoned the CO, or would feel better emotionally if she told Claire everything, but she's holding on for the sake of the group.

I guess they are hoping people in the jury house won’t be mad they all intentionally picked and intentionally got close to a white/Asian/Hispanic person to *use* to further their alliance and/or own personal games by claiming it was a bigger cause. 

[Blissfool]

4 hours ago, blixie said:

I don't see any universe in which she loses Claire's vote. Claire gets it now

Can't these people hold a grudge!  No way would I give my prize-winning vote to the person who nominated and evicted me! Especially if it's the person I trusted the most. Call me petty, although I don’t agree that trust and $750k are petty things.

3 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

I really doubt Tiffany's sons friends know she was spooning with Ky in the HOH and if they did Tiffany is attractive they might call her a MILF lol which sucks but there are worse things a 15 year old can call your mom. 

I don't know if Tiffany's son's friends watch the feeds or not, probably not. But I imagine that her son does every once in a while (as does her Momma Pat 😆), and this is the equivalent of walking in on your parents having sex, "My eyes. My eyyyyyyes."

 

[Auntie Velvet]

10 minutes ago, lilmarysunshine said:

I guess they are hoping people in the jury house won’t be mad they all intentionally picked and intentionally got close to a white/Asian/Hispanic person to *use* to further their alliance and/or own personal games by claiming it was a bigger cause. 

I wouldn't. It's no different than a women's alliance, as others have mentioned. 

[Lady Whistleup]

The last time I could remember it being this explicit was when Cliff was adamant about evicting Tommy over Holly in BB21. Cliff made it clear that he trusted a "gentleman's agreement" with Jackson over ... well, over gay Broadway performer Tommy. 

There were so many people to hate in BB21 but I always thought that was super-scummy of Cliff, to be basically like "I trust straight white dudes better."

[lilmarysunshine]

45 minutes ago, Auntie Velvet said:

I wouldn't. It's no different than a women's alliance, as others have mentioned. 

There is little difference, you are right, in those kinds of alliances. Whether it makes others mad is a different animal. 

[Callaphera]

55 minutes ago, Coco88 said:

I don’t know if Tiff tried to pitch the plan of Alyssa using the veto on X but Alyssa took herself off and Claire is the replacement.

And it was all super anticlimactic. Remember when Keesha melted down upon realizing that her game was done and stomped through the house flinging f-bombs and tears around? I miss reactions like that. We've gone from "Fuck you! Did you fucking know the whole fucking time?!" to "Well, I appreciate you hearing my proposal on this matter and thank you for taking my request into consideration. While I understand your decision, I hope we can work together in the future. All the best."

[tinkerbell]

I'm waiting for derekf to be evicted, so julie can ask about his weird "evote" thing.

I maintain that he isn't aware he's saying it wrong, because he isn't corrected, and he doesn't hear everyone else saying "vote to evict."  I know people are posting that he's hoping it catches on. But the other houseguests never hear it, so it can't. 

[Callaphera]

9 minutes ago, tinkerbell said:

I'm waiting for derekf to be evicted, so julie can ask about his weird "evote" thing.

Dina Lohan was a trendsetter, Deref is just a follower.

[lilmarysunshine]

10 minutes ago, tinkerbell said:

I'm waiting for derekf to be evicted, so julie can ask about his weird "evote" thing.

I maintain that he isn't aware he's saying it wrong, because he isn't corrected, and he doesn't hear everyone else saying "vote to evict."  I know people are posting that he's hoping it catches on. But the other houseguests never hear it, so it can't. 

I cannot imagine she would ask him that to further embarrass him but maybe I am giving her too much credit. lol

[30 Helens]

10 minutes ago, tinkerbell said:

I maintain that he isn't aware he's saying it wrong, because he isn't corrected, and he doesn't hear everyone else saying "vote to evict."  I know people are posting that he's hoping it catches on. But the other houseguests never hear it, so it can't. 

Yeah, I think he’s completely oblivious. And it’s far from the only word/ phrase he’s mangled, just the most repeated one. But people are gonna believe what they believe. 

[Skyfall]

On 9/3/2021 at 9:17 AM, Slider said:

Straight girl here, but I don't think she's that pretty.  She's not ugly, but I don't think she's drop dead gorgeous.  Sorry.

And I can't stand it when she's in the DR and her hair glows purple.  That really bugs me. 

She's more girl next door but without the personality 

[Lamima]

I have missed a lot, like a week. SB got voted out? Who is new HoH and Claire is target? Did they show jury house with Derek X? When is the double or triple eviction? Thanks.

[choclatechip45]

Doesn't Deref have dyslexia? Yeah after the Ian thing last season I doubt Julie will embarrass him plus she really likes him for some reason. 

It's funny Alyssa was bragging to Azah about how smart she is and you can tell Azah really wants to tell her the truth. 

[peachmangosteen]

11 minutes ago, Lamima said:

I have missed a lot, like a week. SB got voted out? Who is new HoH and Claire is target? Did they show jury house with Derek X? When is the double or triple eviction? Thanks.

You can check the Live Feeds Summary thread for game related stuff, they showed the jury in the last live ep, and there will be 2 DEs back-to-back this week and next.

[choclatechip45]

Tiffany has eliminated government, FBI, military, law enforcement officer from Xavier's occupations. 

Now Tiff and Hannah are wondering if anyone speculated about Derrick L's occupation during BB16. 

 

[ByaNose]

Big D talking game & Finals with X & saying he deserves this & that. He’s done nothing. It’s hysterical.

[methodwriter85]

4 hours ago, Lady Whistleup said:

The last time I could remember it being this explicit was when Cliff was adamant about evicting Tommy over Holly in BB21. Cliff made it clear that he trusted a "gentleman's agreement" with Jackson over ... well, over gay Broadway performer Tommy. 

There were so many people to hate in BB21 but I always thought that was super-scummy of Cliff, to be basically like "I trust straight white dudes better."

I didn't watch season 21 but it was apparently supposed to rival season 15 in toxicity, which I didn't think was possible since people were fired as a result of that season.

3 hours ago, Callaphera said:

And it was all super anticlimactic. Remember when Keesha melted down upon realizing that her game was done and stomped through the house flinging f-bombs and tears around? I miss reactions like that. We've gone from "Fuck you! Did you fucking know the whole fucking time?!" to "Well, I appreciate you hearing my proposal on this matter and thank you for taking my request into consideration. While I understand your decision, I hope we can work together in the future. All the best."

Keesha's season was in 2010, right? We live in an entirely different world now. People are much more careful about how they come off now. That's kind of why Ginamarie in BB 15 was kind of a last hurrah because I don't think you'll see someone that unfiltered again.

Quote

Big D talking game & Finals with X & saying he deserves this & that. He’s done nothing. It’s hysterical.

Which is exactly why I'd be wanting to sitting next to Big D as Final 2. Dude is the perfect GOAT. I think everyone in the Cookout would realize that except for Big D himself.

Edited September 7, 2021 by methodwriter85

[ByaNose]

11 minutes ago, methodwriter85 said:

I didn't watch season 21 but it was apparently supposed to rival season 15 in toxicity, which I didn't think was possible since people were fired as a result of that season.

Keesha's season was in 2010, right? We live in an entirely different world now. People are much more careful about how they come off now. That's kind of why Ginamarie in BB 15 was kind of a last hurrah because I don't think you'll see someone that unfiltered again.

Which is exactly why I'd be wanting to sitting next to Big D as Final 2. Dude is the perfect GOAT. I think everyone in the Cookout would realize that except for Big D himself.

Oddly enough, Tiff & Ky want him out first. Although, I’m not sure if they were lying to themselves or each other. I think that they think he’s too likable by the jury & he could beat some people. Time will tell. Heck! It looks like Tiff might be out first. Yikes!

[choclatechip45]

27 minutes ago, methodwriter85 said:

I didn't watch season 21 but it was apparently supposed to rival season 15 in toxicity, which I didn't think was possible since people were fired as a result of that season.

Keesha's season was in 2010, right? We live in an entirely different world now. People are much more careful about how they come off now. That's kind of why Ginamarie in BB 15 was kind of a last hurrah because I don't think you'll see someone that unfiltered again.

Which is exactly why I'd be wanting to sitting next to Big D as Final 2. Dude is the perfect GOAT. I think everyone in the Cookout would realize that except for Big D himself.

Keesha's original season was in 2008 (Damn I feel old). 

[30 Helens]

40 minutes ago, methodwriter85 said:

Which is exactly why I'd be wanting to sitting next to Big D as Final 2. Dude is the perfect GOAT. I think everyone in the Cookout would realize that except for Big D himself.

The things Deref has going for him are: 1) He didn’t have a plus one to betray, if that becomes an issue in bitterness; 2) He wasn’t instrumental in organizing or carrying out the CO plans, if that becomes an issue in bitterness; and 3) People in the house find him funny and likable. Even when he’s being obnoxious, they just write it off as “oh, that’s just Big D!” and laugh about it.

So really, it depends on the jury and if they want to reward gameplay or “likeability” (in quotes because I disagree), or if they’re just bitter overall. In either of the latter two scenarios, Deref wins hands down. And a nation of feedsters hang their heads in shame.

[Brian Cronin]

"Remember when all of the people who are so upset about Claire gave a shit about when I dumped you because you weren't in my alliance? No? Me neither."

[Callaphera]

Alyssa, basically: "So I finally stopped admiring myself in the mirror and thinking about how pretty and Cool I am and I realized because Xavier pointed it out to me that after Claire goes, the final seven are all people of colour."
Deref, basically:

Also,

Alyssa, basically: "So, like, I was looking at all of us in the bathroom mirror earlier... well, okay, I was looking at myself and glanced over at everyone occasionally to make sure I'm still the prettiest. And when I did that, I saw that Claire is the last, like, white-white person in the house. Boy, it's a good thing I'm pretty. And I'm half-white. Wouldn't it be a giggle hair flip if you got rid of me next because of that? LOL! Funny, right?"
Deref, basically:

[Melina22]

Do you think she just thought of this now? Is that even possible? Also, is she naive enough to believe no one but her has noticed this, or is she just pretending to be that clueless? 

[30 Helens]

Azah thinks she and X are playing similar games. They are both low key. He has thrown a lot of comps, and so has she. Now I get it— she’s not terrible, she’s strategically terrible!

 

 

[30 Helens]

Deref is practicing his nomination speech for X, for when he becomes HoH on Thursday. “I nominate Alyssa and Tiffany because you are two strongest females, and I am more comfortable playing with the guys. As for the other two females, I don’t see you as competition.”

I hope he delivers it just like that, to turn all the women (including jury members, who will see the tape) against him.

And the 4-1 vs 3-2 debate continues. Guess which side Deref is on? 

[30 Helens]

X explains the CO: It was not designed to get all the white people out. It was designed for us to work together and get ourselves further. Just like every other alliance. It’s a coincidence that all the white males went pre-jury. We didn’t plan it that way.

He says he came in to the game unapologetically black. Anyone who has a problem with all his alliance members being black, he doesn’t care. 

Side note: Based on my memory of early CO member conversations, none of them had any idea the makeup of this house would be so radically different from the past. And when they saw it was, they came together organically, with a goal of furthering each other in a way that no black cast members ever had a chance to before. It was never anti-white, just pro-black. That’s an important distinction, and frustratingly one that so many have failed to understand.

Edited September 7, 2021 by 30 Helens

[30 Helens]

And while I was typing the above, X and Deref were complaining about Tiffany to the point where Deref felt the need to rehash the storage room fight and how he was so abused. And X expanded his Circle of Selfishness from Tiff and Ky to include Hannah.

Meanwhile, Tiff, Ky and Hannah continue to try and solve the mystery of Who Is X and what does he do for a living and is Shelley real? (Ok, not the last part.)

Sometimes, being a CO supporter is really hard.

 

[Melina22]

31 minutes ago, 30 Helens said:

Sometimes, being a CO supporter is really hard.

 

Well, if this is the worst we're going to see after having them under a microscope for weeks, it's pretty good.

Also, I don't imagine being trapped in a house for weeks under constant surveillance, while fighting each other for money is going to bring out the best in people. No one's tried to strangle anyone, no one's threatening to DOR - they're doing WAY better than I would have. 

[himela]

The Cookout is the reason fewer people will sign up for the game next year and even the ones that do play will be scared to death to make alliances, to target people of color, to target anyone in general. It's sad but social media does real harm to the strategy of the game because people are frightened of how they will be perceived.

[Brian Cronin]

11 minutes ago, himela said:

The Cookout is the reason fewer people will sign up for the game next year and even the ones that do play will be scared to death to make alliances, to target people of color, to target anyone in general. It's sad but social media does real harm to the strategy of the game because people are frightened of how they will be perceived.

True, social media was not around when they eliminated all of the minorities right away two years ago or when no minority HG (and with five of them last year, they had more than normal) made the final six just last year. They finally got around to inventing Twitter in June of 2021.

Even this year, the notion that any non-Black contestant was intentionally avoiding nominating a Black contestant isn't supported by anything outside of Frenchie who then nominated...a Black guy. The non-Black players weren't going against the Black players because they thought they were aligned with them, nothing more. 

Seriously, it is just so silly, because we're here, we watch the actual game, we see what they're doing and not a single darn non-Black HoH INCLUDING Frenchie has even HINTED that they were not nominating Black HGs because they were "frightened of how they will be perceived." Not even a hint. Frenchie had his own nonsense but even there, again, he nominated a Black guy and a Hispanic woman after saying he wasn't going to nominate women or minorities, but he never said a THING about being frightened of how he would be perceived.

It's not a thing. 

Nor, I imagine, is "less people applying," but who the heck knows? I have no idea how the amount of applications vary from year to year and neither do you.

That said, I'll allow that they'll likely not have six of the eight non-White HGs be Black next year. That's likely their one major change that we'll see next year. 

Edited September 7, 2021 by Brian Cronin

[JudyObscure]

2 hours ago, 30 Helens said:

X explains the CO: It was not designed to get all the white people out. It was designed for us to work together and get ourselves further. Just like every other alliance. It’s a coincidence that all the white males went pre-jury. We didn’t plan it that way.

He says he came in to the game unapologetically black. Anyone who has a problem with all his alliance members being black, he doesn’t care. 

That all sounds so creepily like a white supremacist saying, "We don't hate black people we just want to support white people.  We're white and we're proud of it.  It's not that we don't want black people in our neighborhood we just want to keep property values up."  Deja vu the 1950's.  Shudder.

[keke23]

If anything think this encourages more people of color to apply because now the thought can be yes I really do have a shot to win. If white people stop applying because this one season scares them out of it, then what does it say about those people? Are they only willing to play games where they have an unearned priveledge of being part of the majority race in the game?

I know there are some typos in there but I had a 3 day weekend and my brain isn't fully juiced yet.

[Brian Cronin]

25 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

That all sounds so creepily like a white supremacist saying, "We don't hate black people we just want to support white people.  We're white and we're proud of it.  It's not that we don't want black people in our neighborhood we just want to keep property values up."  Deja vu the 1950's.  Shudder.

The platypus lays eggs, but it isn't a bird. 

Similarly, a group of Black people banding together might seems like White supremacy to someone, but it isn't, since they're not White.

When you perpetuate the power structure of society with a group, it is different than when the subjugated people in society band together in response to that power structure. Hence, Black-only groups are not the same as White-only groups and Female-only groups are not the same as Men-only groups. 

It'd be like some Imperial soldier in Star Was saying, "By forming a structured group to fight against us, you Rebels sure sound a lot like the Empire."

[30 Helens]

8 minutes ago, Brian Cronin said:

The platypus lays eggs, but it isn't a bird. 

Similarly, a group of Black people banding together might seems like White supremacy to someone, but it isn't, since they're not White.

When you perpetuate the power structure of society with a group, it is different than when the subjugated people in society band together in response to that power structure. Hence, Black-only groups are not the same as White-only groups and Female-only groups are not the same as Men-only groups. 

It'd be like some Imperial soldier in Star Was saying, "By forming a structured group to fight against us, you Rebels sure sound a lot like the Empire."

OK, now you’re just pandering to Kyland with the Star Wars talk. (He thinks he’s a Jedi, remember?)

But as to the rest of it, a big Yes and thank you.

[JudyObscure]

49 minutes ago, Brian Cronin said:

The platypus lays eggs, but it isn't a bird. 

Similarly, a group of Black people banding together might seems like White supremacy to someone, but it isn't, since they're not White.

When you perpetuate the power structure of society with a group, it is different than when the subjugated people in society band together in response to that power structure. Hence, Black-only groups are not the same as White-only groups and Female-only groups are not the same as Men-only groups. 

It'd be like some Imperial soldier in Star Was saying, "By forming a structured group to fight against us, you Rebels sure sound a lot like the Empire."

But you see no one in the BB house is actually in an outer space Army.  None of them are engaged in purposely taking advantage of any sort of power structure. 

Clair does not have power over Xavier and he has never been subject to her. 

You can talk power structures and history all you want but these are just ordinary people being cruel to other people.  I grew up in West Virginia and knew people who were part of the Hatfield family still feuding with the McCoys. It was stupid.

You can always find an excuse based on someone in the past being mean to someone in the past who looked like you, or was the same religion.  When you come right down  to it we are none of us guilty, or owed anything based on  what our ancestors, or last year's houseguests did.  We are  each responsible for our own actions. 

[plotpointer]

3 hours ago, himela said:

The Cookout is the reason fewer people will sign up for the game next year and even the ones that do play will be scared to death to make alliances, to target people of color, to target anyone in general. It's sad but social media does real harm to the strategy of the game because people are frightened of how they will be perceived.

Actually, I think just the opposite will happen.  White players will automatically assume Black players are working together.  Whites will be “forced” to target some of the African Americans, with the justification that they “simply can’t take the chance” and embarrass themselves in front of America by “falling for the same trick again.”  They will take the stance Cody had last season that they’re here to win the money, not support social messages.  So what will happen is an X, Ky and Hannah will get evicted early on (just not back-to-back so there will be semblance of colorblind play), while the Azahs and DerekFs will be allowed to stick around.  In other words, the weak and non-threatening POC will get to stay.  I think the producers are also going to select fewer Black players and instead add more Asian and Hispanic players.  Will those ethnic groups also play based on race remains to be seen.

I blame the white alliances of the last two seasons for the mess we’re in now… because they refused to care about how things looked or change their gameplay, even though fellow players pointed out the negative racial history of BB.  At the very least, the white players coming in had to be aware of the racial problems in the past,

[blixie]

Quote

White players will automatically assume Black players are working together.  Whites will be “forced” to target some of the African Americans, with the justification that they “simply can’t take the chance” and embarrass themselves in front of America by “falling for the same trick again.” 

Yup even at 6 the  house was majority None Black people, and will remain so going forward, they will be no opportunity to do this again. All the more reason to justify the CO doing this. 

Having said that fuck X and his continued justification of an alliance that explicitly benefits black men over black women, and when you crystal clear plan for the double is for Alyssa to win and take out Tiffany. Ky maybe annoying but X? he's shown his entire ass this week. 

[choclatechip45]

Danielle Reyes losing in season 3 is one of the worst things that happened to this show. 

[peachmangosteen]

5 hours ago, 30 Helens said:

Based on my memory of early CO member conversations, none of them had any idea the makeup of this house would be so radically different from the past.

See, I don't understand how they couldn't have known this. The fact that CBS would be making all their reality show casts 50% BIPOC was announced long before this season premiered. And many of these people really are fans so I feel confident that they did know this. But yea I guess they imagined there'd be maybe 3 Black people and then 5 other POC. 

4 hours ago, Brian Cronin said:

That said, I'll allow that they'll likely not have six of the eight non-White HGs be Black next year. That's likely their one major change that we'll see next year. 

Which I welcome. It's never a bad thing to see more people represented! Honestly. I wish they'd do a season with all BIPOC (or maybe even better, 1-3 white people) but I'm sure CBS is afraid white people would boycott it lol.

2 hours ago, keke23 said:

If anything think this encourages more people of color to apply because now the thought can be yes I really do have a shot to win. If white people stop applying because this one season scares them out of it, then what does it say about those people? Are they only willing to play games where they have an unearned priveledge of being part of the majority race in the game?

This made me think about how a lot of past HGs have really shown their ass this season. Them not watching, claiming this season 'triggers' them, complaining on twitter about how this season is boring when they never cared about the past 5 years of boring seasons, making videos about how no one is playing for themselves when they spent their whole time in the game trying to get the cools kids to let them in their group, etc. It's really embarrassing.

1 hour ago, blixie said:

Ky maybe annoying but X? he's shown his entire ass this week. 

Seriously. My main rooting interest now is in X losing. 

[Yogisbooboo64]

Peach, I’m joining you at the anti-X table.  For me, the bloom was off the rose when he intimidated DX when he was HOH and backdoored Christian.  Lately X has been extremely cocky (pun intended) and Sunday’s eppy left me done with him.

[Nashville]

2 hours ago, plotpointer said:

I think the producers are also going to select fewer Black players and instead add more Asian and Hispanic players.  

This is the primary outcome I expect; a greater degree of racial diversity will be preserved in future castings, but it will be more evenly spread across multiple racial groups to dilute the possibility of single-race alliance juggernauts.

[choclatechip45]

I don't know how much we will see of single race juggernaut alliances. I mean look at David I doubt he would have been in a cookout alliance. DX this season wanted to bro out with Christian and Tyler during the first week. It really depends who they cast.

Also are the alumni really complaining? I only follow Janelle and she complains every season.

Edited September 7, 2021 by choclatechip45

[peachmangosteen]

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

This is the primary outcome I expect; a greater degree of racial diversity will be preserved in future castings, but it will be more evenly spread across multiple racial groups to dilute the possibility of single-race alliance juggernauts.

There will always be half white people tbh.

24 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

Also are the alumni really complaining?

Yes. BB19 Jessica even posted that many past HGs have told her they won’t watch this season because it’s ‘triggering.’ I mean!