S12.E06: Defending Your Wife

[Boo Boo]

12 hours ago, MyTwoCents said:

Why are they having the couples doing so much together on their honeymoon this season? Were they afraid the Chris shitstorm wouldn’t be enough drama on its own? So they just keep throwing them all together, add alcohol and big egos, light the match that is Chris... why, it’s like shaking a box full of cats and then letting them go at each other!

I actually like the couples doing a lot together!  Especially when there's a wild card like Chris!

[Crashcourse]

I'm sorry to say this, but Jake looks like he stinks.   There's just something about him....

[Jeanne222]

7 minutes ago, Crashcourse said:

I'm sorry to say this, but Jake looks like he stinks.   There's just something about him....

Jake has a very strange diet of just eggs and steak.  Perhaps the glands secreted unpleasant odors.  We need a nutritionist to comment!

[Baltimore Betty]

30 minutes ago, Boo Boo said:

Virginia looks and acts like a meth addict.  I don't like Chris, but the "man up" comments from Erik?  I would want to deck that nerdy guy!

I'm guessing Jacob is not hot in the sack.  

Virginia face looks bloated from drinking, sometimes her eyes are super puffy and sometimes they are not, all the drinking will age a person very quickly.  Her skin could use some TLC.

I may be alone on the Jake Train but I am holding firm that he is not the enemy.  I am also alone in thinking he looks like Will Forte or am I?

 

[seacliffsal]

I was pretty much seething the entire episode.  Having Chris and Paige on has really ruined the honeymoons for the others.  Pastor Cal's voiceover stated that after the fun of the honeymoons comes reality and I'm like "noooooo" the real life circumstances of Chris and Paige have led to a lot of not-fun on the honeymoons.  And, believe it or not, I put much of the blame on Paige (don't worrry-I really cannot stand Chris and will address him in a moment).  Paige has enabled Chris' tantrums and self-centeredness while having a negative impact on these new friends who, I believe, truly want to understand and help her.  Yet Paige just sits back and lets life happen to her rather than making her own decisions about her circumstances, new husband, and life.  She also accepted that it was her responsibility to calm Chris rather than assuming that a grown man should calm his own self down.  What was with his pastor's advice to have Paige pray over him and read scripture to him as if she held all of the responsibility for HIS responses?  And Paige just went along with this.  When the women were talking to Chris and he explored with his responses, why didn't Paige speak up?  She is just as much a part of the drama as is Chris.

And Chris?  Anything anybody says to him is "disrespectful."  And, on a personal note, I really resent it when someone tells me something and then shuts down any opportunity for me to respond.  This is what Chris is doing.  If you don't want to hear what people have to say and are demanding privacy, then don't SHARE your news with them.  It is rude and selfish to tell this kind of news to someone and then refuse to let them comment or ask questions.  It's a way to get to be a victim without being held accountable for the decisions/events that led to the situation.  He so wants the attention and sympathy without responsibility.  Even mentioning that he is going through such a difficult time and never saw it coming emphasizes his denial of his actions.  Who could possible see it coming that having unprotected sex with someone could ever possibly lead to a pregnancy?  Who could have anticipated this?  I do not think that others are getting into this business and should respect his privacy, because he invited them to do so and when they supported Paige over him, he decided he no longer wanted them in his 'business.'  Oh and it is rich that he told Paige she only earns 25% of what he does.  Well, maybe because any money that came into his Subway he saw as his rather than the bank, the investors, the landlord, the vendors, and the employees.  I also think he is showing some aggression (standing up when Virginia and Eric were leaving and not a threat to him) towards Eric as he may view Eric as weaker than himself (especially as Eric appears to be continually drunk).

I understood Clara a bit more when she shared that she always had a solo and loved the attention of being in the concert choir in high school as I thought she loved attention since the first time we met her.  She self-described as life of the party and admits that she says everything she thinks-that's how she gets to focus attention on herself.  However, I also believe that she has a lot of good advice for others and can really read the scenarios in which she finds herself.

I am on Team Jacob as it was really rude for Haley to lie about going to a group event and potentially trying to turn herself into a victim.  Don't know the full story, but it would be really hard to paint someone as bad in this season when Chris has taken all of the negative titles for himself.

[Boo Boo]

31 minutes ago, Baltimore Betty said:

Virginia face looks bloated from drinking, sometimes her eyes are super puffy and sometimes they are not, all the drinking will age a person very quickly.  Her skin could use some TLC.

I may be alone on the Jake Train but I am holding firm that he is not the enemy.  I am also alone in thinking he looks like Will Forte or am I?

 

I like Jacob!  I was just assuming the sex wasn't good if she made a sea change right after.

[Crashcourse]

41 minutes ago, Baltimore Betty said:

I may be alone on the Jake Train but I am holding firm that he is not the enemy.  I am also alone in thinking he looks like Will Forte or am I?

Jake seems like a nice guy, but I just don't find him appealing (and, apparently, neither does Haley).  I don't think anyone is calling him the enemy, just not everyone's cup of tea.  Certainly not mine. 

[Boo Boo]

28 minutes ago, seacliffsal said:

I was pretty much seething the entire episode.  Having Chris and Paige on has really ruined the honeymoons for the others.  Pastor Cal's voiceover stated that after the fun of the honeymoons comes reality and I'm like "noooooo" the real life circumstances of Chris and Paige have led to a lot of not-fun on the honeymoons.  And, believe it or not, I put much of the blame on Paige (don't worrry-I really cannot stand Chris and will address him in a moment).  Paige has enabled Chris' tantrums and self-centeredness while having a negative impact on these new friends who, I believe, truly want to understand and help her.  Yet Paige just sits back and lets life happen to her rather than making her own decisions about her circumstances, new husband, and life.  She also accepted that it was her responsibility to calm Chris rather than assuming that a grown man should calm his own self down.  What was with his pastor's advice to have Paige pray over him and read scripture to him as if she held all of the responsibility for HIS responses?  And Paige just went along with this.  When the women were talking to Chris and he explored with his responses, why didn't Paige speak up?  She is just as much a part of the drama as is Chris.

And Chris?  Anything anybody says to him is "disrespectful."  And, on a personal note, I really resent it when someone tells me something and then shuts down any opportunity for me to respond.  This is what Chris is doing.  If you don't want to hear what people have to say and are demanding privacy, then don't SHARE your news with them.  It is rude and selfish to tell this kind of news to someone and then refuse to let them comment or ask questions.  It's a way to get to be a victim without being held accountable for the decisions/events that led to the situation.  He so wants the attention and sympathy without responsibility.  Even mentioning that he is going through such a difficult time and never saw it coming emphasizes his denial of his actions.  Who could possible see it coming that having unprotected sex with someone could ever possibly lead to a pregnancy?  Who could have anticipated this?  I do not think that others are getting into this business and should respect his privacy, because he invited them to do so and when they supported Paige over him, he decided he no longer wanted them in his 'business.'  Oh and it is rich that he told Paige she only earns 25% of what he does.  Well, maybe because any money that came into his Subway he saw as his rather than the bank, the investors, the landlord, the vendors, and the employees.  I also think he is showing some aggression (standing up when Virginia and Eric were leaving and not a threat to him) towards Eric as he may view Eric as weaker than himself (especially as Eric appears to be continually drunk).

I understood Clara a bit more when she shared that she always had a solo and loved the attention of being in the concert choir in high school as I thought she loved attention since the first time we met her.  She self-described as life of the party and admits that she says everything she thinks-that's how she gets to focus attention on herself.  However, I also believe that she has a lot of good advice for others and can really read the scenarios in which she finds herself.

I am on Team Jacob as it was really rude for Haley to lie about going to a group event and potentially trying to turn herself into a victim.  Don't know the full story, but it would be really hard to paint someone as bad in this season when Chris has taken all of the negative titles for himself.

Yes indeed.  My heart broke for Jacob when I got to that part.

[DrewPaul2010]

14 hours ago, answerphone said:

This season is like watching a slow motion train wreck.  
 

Over and  over. 

And loving it...

[Ilovepie]

15 hours ago, gonecrackers said:

Yeah the others too - sounds like this is a fucking juvenile group of assholes.

You just summed up this episode for me. I wonder if Hayley lied to the group and said Jake didn't want to come down? If not, then they are ALL assholes! Let's just work through the shit behavior of this group:

1: Chris obviously. There is not a word I can come up with to describe how loathsome I find him. What a manipulative piece of shit. "I love my ex-fiance and am thinking of getting back with her." "I am now attracted to you." Shut up and get off my tv.

2. Paige - what are you doing? Are you actually this dumb????? Please, please, please, wake up and leave this asshole!

3. Virginia and Clara - what good comes from taunting this jerk? Fine if you support Paige, but starting something with Chris was not going to end well. Clara clearly recognized this but didn't back down anyway. And Virginia - Chris wasn't wrong - she is a drunk. I don't believe for a minute she has "never been spoken to like that in (her) life"; someone who drinks like a fish and parties in a group on the regular is going to find some trouble once in a while, and she was pretty ready for that brawl so I don't think this is VA's first altercation.

4. Erik - who died and made you the de facto leader of this troubled group? Spouting off like you are some grand statesman - shut up and sit down, you are wasted, stoned or something. No-one asked you. Stop with the phony concern and  saying you support Chris when you don't actually give a shit and are judgemental as all get out.

5. Virginia and Erik - shut up and maybe read the room first if you are going to keep showing up late to everything. That right there has caused most of the this drama. Stop it.

6. Hayley - What a mean girl bitch. How hurtful. Jacob might not be your soulmate, but that doesn't excuse ditching him. Why did this girl want to get married if she is so insistent in doing "whatever she wants, when she wants"?

7. Ryan - I appreciate his trying to jump in at the dinner and explain to the drunk latecomers what had transpired in a effort to de-escalate things, but lecturing Clara about zipping it was kind of mean. She looked really hurt when he said that. Where was he when things went so wrong at the ATV outing?

I feel like Briana and Vincent's problems are minimal, and I still like Jake. His TH and face at that dinner was everything. But that is the beginning and end of things I liked this episode. I am not here for this nonsense. I hope Paige wakes up and ditches Chris soon, and everything settles down when  they go to their own spaces. I really dislike all the interaction between the couples. It seems that each season they are together more and more and it's really turned this show into a stupid circus. Just imagine - the first few seasons the couples honeymooned in separate locations and never interacted! I long for those days, but sadly we are stuck with this mess....

[DrewPaul2010]

11 hours ago, Chalby said:

I have not read any comments yet, because I'm so angry I had to write while watching my recorded episode. Chris is so self-centered and tone deaf to the people around him, it blows my mind. The fact that he complains he's "being disrespected" when he's the most disrespectful in the group. His outrage awhen the men told him to "man up" and take control of the situation made me laugh because his pea brain doesn't accept that he shouldn't have gone on the show considering he was sleeping with another woman with no protection. Way to put your bride at risk. He also thinks he "manned up" by telling her he got his fiance pregnant during his rendezvous  with his ex, weeks before his wedding. Clearly, he's on the show for exposure and he's on the show to draw attention to any way that he can get money cuz clearly he needs $$ for his nonsense. I wish Paige would just up and walk away. She is so lovely she does not deserve this loser. Doesnt the show vet these losers?His poor parents must be embarrassed

Ironically Chris introduced himself as the expert on pulling during intercourse. I'm still not sure this isn't made up drama.

[DrewPaul2010]

11 hours ago, Linarina said:

I was so pleasantly surprised by Jacob this week, and disappointed Haley is shutting down when it seemed like they were starting to vibe last week.  What I liked about him this week was how communicative and straightforward he was.  That is so rare in a guy, especially an awkward nerdy guy!  And I also like that he wants physical intimacy and has the self-confidence to make moves and ask for that from her.  Again, with his nerdy...dare I say Aspergery side...I was worried he'd be too wimpy to touch her or wouldn't need physical touch.  And I guess I'm alone at the table but I find him very hot!  His wardrobe needs an update, but I'd be thrilled to cuddle up to that muscular chest thankyouverymuch.

Other people on the show have had to deal with the fact that initially they don't find their new spouse attractive or what they expected or hoped for. But dammit they did this, they married someone they agreed to do it. Its like playing a stripping game and if you lose you decide I don't want to play anymore. She doesn't have to stay married but why not give it the full 8 weeks? Last season Henry clearly didn't click with Christina but he was nice about it and made a go of it. 

[KateHearts]

12 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Paige is showing signs of not trusting her gut and wanting to believe Chris's BS.  I hope the other women help her come to her senses because he's all out for himself and trying to reel her in just so he has "options".  I can see that from a mile away.  She'd better stop thinking that "God" is intending this and that Chris is "her person".  Geez, God wouldn't send anyone a douchebag like that and expect them to accept all his abuse.  I don't understand these people that keep thinking everything that happens to them is intended by God even if it contradicts their common sense and crushes them.  In my faith, that's now how God works.  That attitude is so immature, I'm sorry but it is.  It's nothing but superstition.

Here's my take on it: everything that happens to us is a way to shape us and help us grow as people.  Paige herself decided to go on this show and seek a mate this way; there is something called free will that we are all given.  This choice she has made did not go well; she is not relying on God that this "match" was His will but rather relying on a moronic group of "experts" who gave her a total dud- a guy who recently broke off an engagement, who thinks that pulling out is a good form of birth control, who tells her he isn't attracted to her but bangs her anyway, and continues to gaslight her into thinking she needs to fix something to make it all work.  Paige needs to realize that she is not a puppet of God but a human who has the ability to make good choices for her life that may not include someone that was randomly picked for her.  Yowhaahmsayin'?

Well, Jake and Hayley sure went sideways, didn't they? I really think she was trying until she wasn't- and that change seemed to coincide with a night of drunken sex. He is not my type, but I think he could be funny and entertaining to talk to and get to know. He does need to put a shirt on and please ditch the sleeveless hoodie he had on for the airport.  Just no.

What the hell is going on with Erik? I didn't like him from the beginning- way too overeager, laughing exaggeratedly at everyone's jokes and overall just trying too hard.  Now he's waxing romantic with the guys while under the influence of something about how idyllic and magical it all is when he clearly realizes that Virginia drinks too much and they have some very fundamental differences in their philosophies and lifestyles that are going to be monumental to overcome. I'm getting a little bit of whiplash with these people saying out of one side of their mouth that they don't know one another well; that they all are just "processing" it all- and then five minutes later we are hearing things like "Don't talk to my wife like that," or "we are friends with Paige and she's not herself!" Remember these relationships are all less than a week old. So they need to settle down about defending and protecting each other.

Virginia drives me absolutely nuts. I was watching her on the couch when the girls all sat down for (surprise!) a drink and her reactions were all over the top with wide-open mouth, big giant laughs, and wild gesticulating.  I don't know if it's the alcohol or the fact that she wants to emote for the cameras, but it's way too much. And her immaturity really showed during the post-ATV Chris scenes when she absolutely had to try and get the last word... over and over again.  The best thing they all could have done on the bus would have been to completely ignore Chris and not respond. Nothing anyone can say- NOTHING- will convince Chris that he may have been out of line. So why bother? Virginia just kept her yap going, though.  The others were quite pointedly just staring ahead and trying to get the hell back to the hotel so they could escape the crazy.

Back to Chris- he is a classic offense collector.  He didn't get as much sympathy about the baby thing as Paige.  He felt that "jokes" were made when he made the announcement to the group (I didn't think Virginia was "joking," she asked what everyone was thinking: she's pregnant? Wow, with your baby?).  He twists and turns everything he does or anyone says to be about him. But as long as Paige continues to light up with any little scrap of attention from him ("you're my queen; lemme see that ass; I am feeling spiritually attracted to you...") I can't garner much sympathy for her.  How many times have we all listened to him say something completely degrading to her, or drop some bombshell on her and we think :  "YES!!!! THIS IS IT!! She's going to say she is done!!" and... he reels her back in with some shitty fake compliment.  She can retain her dignity if she calmly throws in the towel now.  But her time of looking tolerant and not foolish is quickly running out.

I liked Clara this episode, but I'm getting glimpses of Ryan's face that are showing doubt.  She is pretty face-on but her profile shots are odd- she has a strangely flat face, a very protruding jaw and a double chin. And the nails- my lord, the nails.  

I don't have much about Vincent and Brianna but he is toting out the old, "this is how I am and I'm not gonna change" line.  Never a good look.  The bathroom scene was weird and she was definitely being bossy- perhaps encouraged by producers.  And why did they have robes on that didn't say "Mandalay Bay" but some other hotel/spa name?

[Hangin Out]

4 hours ago, LakeGal said:

Haley reminds me of those females that always have a lot of girlfriends.  They are extremely popular with a lot of friends.  But they never seem to have a relationship.  She relates well with her friends.  But she doesn't seem to know how to act in a romantic relationship. I doubt she would have been successful with any husband they gave her.  Too bad for Jacob.  I think he really wanted a marriage.  

Girlfriends are all well and good, but in actuality, a husband is your best friend when it comes down to it.  Some girlfriends are catty.

[Crashcourse]

I don't know what airline Erik flies for, but this isn't a good look for him.  I wonder what the other pilots think watching him acting like a drunken idiot and acting a fool with Virginia?

[Hangin Out]

17 minutes ago, DrewPaul2010 said:

Other people on the show have had to deal with the fact that initially they don't find their new spouse attractive or what they expected or hoped for. But dammit they did this, they married someone they agreed to do it. Its like playing a stripping game and if you lose you decide I don't want to play anymore. She doesn't have to stay married but why not give it the full 8 weeks? Last season Henry clearly didn't click with Christina but he was nice about it and made a go of it. 

I don’t get Haley.  What’s wrong with Jacob?  Physically fit, tall, intelligent, has manners, loves his home, not a drunk or bullshitter. She’s choosing girlfriends over him?  Give it the six week at least.  I’ll bet one of those girlfriends would take him in a minute.

[Starlight925]

10 minutes ago, Crashcourse said:

I don't know what airline Erik flies for, but this isn't a good look for him.  I wonder what the other pilots think watching him acting like a drunken idiot and acting a fool with Virginia?

Not only other pilots, but airline executives, airline personnel, and the passengers who will be on his future flights.  If I saw him walk up to the cockpit, I'd return my ticket.

[Crashcourse]

3 minutes ago, Silver Bells said:

I don’t get Haley.  What’s wrong with Jacob?  Physically fit, tall, intelligent, has manners, loves his home, not a drunk or bullshitter. She’s choosing girlfriends over him?  Give it the six week at least.  I’ll bet one of those girlfriends would take him in a minute.

Different strokes for different folks.  Yes, I'd bet that one of her girlfriends would want him, but I can certainly understand if Haley doesn't.  I wouldn't want him either.

2 minutes ago, Starlight925 said:

Not only other pilots, but airline executives, airline personnel, and the passengers who will be on his future flights.  If I saw him walk up to the cockpit, I'd return my ticket.

That's a good point about other airline people and passengers.  I'd return my ticket too.

[Hangin Out]

4 hours ago, Shauna said:

I think she was willing to get married, but she doesn't like Jacob.   If she liked him, she would be willing to work with him and things would be going better, but she's now regretting this and wants out.  I was very surprised to hear they had sex.  I think that was the topping on the cake and after that she said, I'm out.   It is confusing to a guy to give it up and then be cold to him.  I'm not surprised he's confused and doesn't know how to act around her.  Leave her alone (obviously) or try to get close to her.  He doesn't know what to do.  

She’s too proper and a stick in the mud.  Have a couple of drinks, loosen up as she is a tightass and try one more time.  And stay off the phone.  That’s rude.  She’s talking to these girlfriends too much and should be concentrating more on the marriage.

[Ilovepie]

14 hours ago, Yeah No said:

So instead of Erik stabilizing Virginia, Virginia is regressing Erik to the point of drugs, alcohol and confronting people when both of them should STFU.  I think he's scared because he's in too deep with her already and knows that she's a wild child and they are too different to be a really good match.  But dude, you shouldn't be "If I can't beat 'em, join 'em" already!!  Man, he is not as mature as he makes himself out to be.  He is trying to impress her by "defending her honor" from douchebag Chris but the two of them really had no business getting all up into Chris' business like that.  At least take him aside away from the others.  Why spoil their time?  I was trying to remain hopeful about them but now I wish they'd split on decision day.  Even if they say "yes" I don't think they will last unless both of them grows up and that doesn't look too possible to me right now after what I've seen from them in this episode.

 

 

Well, I think he's just going along with it because they are on vacation. I definitely drink more when I am on vacation than I do in my normal life, and I don't fault him for that. His (albeit drunken) comments that this is exactly that situation and he would not be joining her regular drinking binges says to me it's just for this vacation only with him. He did acknowledge that it is not ok for him to do that when he is working because his job is very important to him. And I think he's going to absolutely cringe when he sobers up and sees how horrible he looks both as a sloppy drunk and for his (and his wife's) involvement in the Chris shit show.......

[Rae Spellman]

3 hours ago, Spectator said:

No one wants a hungover pilot flying their plane, or worse, one that’s still drunk. She could drag him down enough to potentially destroy everything he’s spent his life building if he doesn’t pull himself together and fast.

Going from no adult relationships to ruining the life of a respected pilot would be quite a leap for Virginia. If he only works half the month, he could drink plenty on his off days and hold it together on work days. Or, we can all avoid his flights. 

Edited February 18, 2021 by Rae Spellman
giving up talking about Paige and Chris for Lent

[StatisticalOutlier]

16 hours ago, answerphone said:

If we, the viewers, took just a sip of a drink 🍸every time Chris or Paige mentioned he’s a “man of God,” we would all be as drunk as Virginia.

Aah, that's amateur level drinking.  Try doing it with every time Chris says "you know what I'm sayin'?"  I think there was one sentence where he said it three times.

 

16 hours ago, Soup333 said:

MAFS and Paige: Chris is a man of God. 

Chris: Make sure you wear something that shows that ass. 

For a plane ride!

 

16 hours ago, Mean Jeanne said:

Can’t believe that Vincent was siding with Chris about the dinner debacle. Even though things might have been a little different if Erik and VA had heard Chris’ (IMO insincere) apology,

As this was playing out, I was thinking, "See?  This is what happens when you're late all the time."  Virginia has now experienced a real-world ramification from being late, and it would be wonderful if it led to a moment of reflection.  She clearly doesn't care that it's rude, but maybe she'll realize it can cause problems for her, too.

 

15 hours ago, answerphone said:

Chris is scary and totally screwed up. He needs psychiatric counseling ASAP. 

I hate to admit it, but I'm actually starting to feel a little sorry for him because he's so very messed up.  His life must be miserable.  Doesn't give him an excuse to make others part of his misery, too, of course, but I'm not sure he can even help it. 

 

12 hours ago, Racj82 said:

I was watching this at work with friends.

Say what?  Y'all hiring?

 

10 hours ago, Ms.C. said:

Quote

Someone said [Jake] looks like a serial killer. I concur.

Ted Bundy perhaps? 

Nah.  Ted Bundy was handsome.

 

5 hours ago, Booger666 said:

Yeah, she seemed happy with the sex in her talking head.  Jake mentioned that it happened after a night of drinking.  My theory is she wanted sex, enjoyed it, and later it sunk in that this isn’t a guy she is just dating and can ghost but that she is tied to him for the next 6-8 wks. 

Thank you for mentioning the drinking, because I knew one couple had drunken sex, but wasn't positive it was them.  Maybe she wanted sex, or maybe she wanted to want sex, maybe she liked it or maybe she didn't, but when I heard they were drunk, and knowing they hadn't really hit it off, I thought, "Uh oh."

 

2 hours ago, Empress1 said:

This makes me think she’s still kind of in a college mindset. When I was in college, it was rare to have class on Fridays and if you did, you almost never had a full day. Maybe you had a lab or an intro-level language class but your class obligations were generally minimal. So for us, the weekend started on Thursday. (The worst hangover I’ve ever had to this day came from a Thursday night drinking session in college. It’s why I don’t do tequila shots.) I’m sure Virginia does work on Fridays but she figures that it’s just one day she has to grit her teeth and make it through, and the trade-off of going out on Thursday nights is worth it to her.

I recall that going out on Thursdays became popular about the time singles bars were on the rise, like the late 70s.  I always thought that for women, it had to do with not having to display the fact that you didn't have a date on Friday or Saturday night, which was still kind of embarrassing.

 

2 hours ago, Spectator said:

PAIGE/CHRIS: I wish I could tell Paige that God’s path for us doesn’t always run in a smooth, straight line. I wish I could tell her that, in all likelihood, Chris is not part of God’s forever plan for her but instead he is just one of the many bumps in the road that we all hit in life that help to steer us toward our true destinies.

If I were Paige, I'd be wondering what I'd done that made God hate me so much.  I think this is more like a mountain in the road than a bump.

 

[KateHearts]

3 hours ago, Soup333 said:

One thing that's bothering me now on reflection is Ryan asking Clara to keep her mouth shut regarding Paige/Chris. I get it to a degree. He gives "middle child mediator" energy and definitely seems like he would try to keep everyone calm in a tense situation. However, people choosing to mind their own business is how folk end up in abusive situations for years, isolated from friends/family and even neighbors and coworkers who know or suspect abuse but have decided to stay in their own lane and not get involved. 

We need to remember, though, that these people barely know each other. Their common bond is that they chose to do this stupid TV show and put their lives out there on display.  So it's not fair to say "oh, the others were just sitting idly by while Paige was abused and they let terrible things happen."  They can't pretend to have much insight into how any of the other couples relate, what they've been told to portray, how much is real or how much is acting. So the onus can't be on the other participants in this show to determine whether or not Paige needs to be "saved."  In addition, they are all surrounded by production crew so it's not like anyone is in true danger here.

I have no problem, however, with Clara telling Paige she thinks Chris is a jerk and that she's concerned that Paige might need to walk away.  

I do have a problem with Ryan saying he doesn't want to talk about his impressions of Chris/Paige with his wife in private, though- I would be surprised if my husband said, "yeah, I don't want to tell you what I think." However, we have been married for 37 years.  Again, Ryan doesn't know Clara that well. Oh, and there's a camera on them too. So there's that.

[Racj82]

3 hours ago, princelina said:

Because it sucks being the only one without a date at every social function!  (See Olivia). And I got the impression from her mom AND her bitchy girlfriends that they heckle her about it.

She doesn't need a husband to fill that void and she could just not go to some of the dozens of marriages that keep popping up around her. 

[Retired at last]

I am pretty sure that Ryan told Clara his thoughts once the cameras were off. He just wants to keep as much between them and maintain as much privacy as they can. That's why they won't talk about their sex life (although Clara did imply that they had been intimate, which is what I would have expected from them). I think Clara would be fine sharing everything, but she is respecting Ryan's wishes.

[JAndy]

3 hours ago, Empress1 said:

This makes me think she’s still kind of in a college mindset. When I was in college, it was rare to have class on Fridays and if you did, you almost never had a full day. Maybe you had a lab or an intro-level language class but your class obligations were generally minimal. So for us, the weekend started on Thursday. (The worst hangover I’ve ever had to this day came from a Thursday night drinking session in college. It’s why I don’t do tequila shots.) I’m sure Virginia does work on Fridays but she figures that it’s just one day she has to grit her teeth and make it through, and the trade-off of going out on Thursday nights is worth it to her. 

Oh God. I can’t drink cosmos after a Thursday college party night. I think I have myself alcohol poisoning from them. 
 

I also have to wait until I see the actual conversation to judge Erik about the texting. If I’m going out with the girls, my husband asks me to text to make sure I get there ok - and I do the same for him. He was home late one night and forgot to text me and I was freaking out that he got into a car accident or something. It’s not to check up on the person or be controlling, more like to make sure they are ok. That’s how we use it anyway. It doesn’t take a long time to send a “got here ok” or “leaving now” text message. But I’m a worrier and automatically think about the worst sometimes. 

[JAndy]

I also don’t think Erik was on drugs this episode. If you don’t drink a lot, you can definitely get like that. It seems like he just got caught up in the drinking with her on vacation, sobered up (somewhat) and was like wtf am I doing? This isn’t me and freaked out a bit. I am interested to see their dynamic outside of their honeymoon. 

[KateHearts]

1 hour ago, seacliffsal said:

And Chris?  Anything anybody says to him is "disrespectful."  And, on a personal note, I really resent it when someone tells me something and then shuts down any opportunity for me to respond.  This is what Chris is doing.  If you don't want to hear what people have to say and are demanding privacy, then don't SHARE your news with them.  It is rude and selfish to tell this kind of news to someone and then refuse to let them comment or ask questions.  It's a way to get to be a victim without being held accountable for the decisions/events that led to the situation.  He so wants the attention and sympathy without responsibility. 

This was clearly evidenced by his telling everyone after the ATV ride that he didn't want their fake sympathy.  He sets it up so no one can do the right thing. Heads I win, tails you lose.  

Chris, if certain topics are "private," then don't bring them up. If you want people to stop talking to you, then don't start a fight on the bus. How about you don't put yourself on a TELEVISION SHOW if you feel like you don't want your tea spilled.   Idiot.

[DrewPaul2010]

Quote

Yes, and I blame the experts.  They are good for nothing.  Where are they anyhow?  HIDING, because they fucked up?  Who needs them?  Put all of us on and you will see perfect matches.  Maybe they think opposites attract.  Over the years, some couples made it, but it just happened to be a fluke, not because of the experts.  They are useless.  I’m sure the Pastor and Shorty would say”try harder”.   And they picked Chris?  Were they blind?  He’s a self centered blowhard baby you could see from a mile away.  A bullshit artist who has a mean streak.  Yeah, he’ll make a great Father.  I feel sorry for the kid already.  Rant over!

Good rant. In the past I've defended the experts (or whoever it is that matches these people) for doing something very difficult and bound to have negative results. This season I believe they spiked the punch bowl. They wanted some drama and conflict. If it bleeds it leads. Its actually scandalous because I don't believe it would be crazy difficult to at least match people who have a chance of working.

They could do an extensive questionnaire on folks who ended up making a great couple and get a profile from that. Some things are just instant red flags like matching a non-religious person with a religious one. That's practically a non-starter. Jake and Haley from every aspect appear to be a mismatch. If she had sex on account of being horny and not out of any kind of affection that was a terribly misleading thing to do.

Chris is the ringer this season. No one could mistake what kind of person he is. He revealed himself amply on wedding day.

Erik and Virginia could still pull this out but at 26 its time for Virginia to grow up. She has to accept that being married is a life changing event. I assume she's not remotely thinking of having kids because she'd have to quit drinking. Her friends soon will be pairing off and having children (another life changing event). It's a life changing event but doesn't mean a life of drudgery and no more fun times. Doesn't mean no partying ever just in moderation.

Erik needs to check his ego and domineering ways at the door. Being late to every group event is an indication of not giving a rats ass about anyone else. I'm not sure if the confrontation would have been avoided had Erik been there earlier. He had what he wanted to say rehearsed. And I don't think Chris had any intention of specifically apologizing to Virginia. They both behaved poorly. Its not her job to be the moral police.

 

Edited February 18, 2021 by DrewPaul2010
Clarity

[DrewPaul2010]

Quote

I'm sorry to say this, but Jake looks like he stinks.   There's just something about him....

I'm sure Haley would let us know...does the scent come through the TV?

[DrewPaul2010]

Quote

3. Virginia and Clara - what good comes from taunting this jerk? Fine if you support Paige, but starting something with Chris was not going to end well. Clara clearly recognized this but didn't back down anyway. And Virginia - Chris wasn't wrong - she is a drunk. I don't believe for a minute she has "never been spoken to like that in (her) life"; someone who drinks like a fish and parties in a group on the regular is going to find some trouble once in a while, and she was pretty ready for that brawl so I don't think this is VA's first altercation.

I imagine her friends do all manner of talking...behind her back.

[glitterpussy]

5 hours ago, sara416 said:

And hey Chris, in the words of Inigo Montoya, "you keep using that word (disrespectful). I do not think it means what you think it means." Get over yourself Marble Mouth.

Don't forget "I'm an integral man..." LMAO. No dude. That's the wrong word.

I think something happened with Haley and Jake.  I don't think she seemed "happy" with the sex at all in her TH. She was like, we had sex....aaaaand that's all I have to say.  I think whatever it was scared and repulsed her, she told the girls at least, and it was bad enough that the WHOLE GROUP conspired to ditch Jake.  Maybe she was really wasted and felt like she didn't give consent? Maybe he has some super weird 80s kink? I don't know, but that whole scene where he was asking what went wrong was excruciating and she seemed like she was saying anything but the truth.

I have never seen a more pathetic drunk than Eric. WTF man, you're in your 30s.  I'm sure he was drunk when he came up with his plan to lecture Chris about speaking to VA. VA herself is doing more than drinking, IMO. Coke?

I must be the only one who doesn't like Ryan.  "you need to control what comes out of your mouth" really?  You've been in multi-year relationships and never said I love you?  He seems rigid and controlling to me. Yuck.

 

Edited February 18, 2021 by glitterpussy

[AnnMarie17]

18 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

I have to stop mentioning cocktails. I’m getting plastered with treatment center ads lol. I’m sober as a judge right now. 

I've never heard of "sober as a judge"...but it reminds me of the time RBG fell asleep at the State of the Union and then confessed to being "not 100%  sober".  Probably the ONLY thing Erik has in common with that legend.  👑

[Soup333]

40 minutes ago, KateHearts said:

We need to remember, though, that these people barely know each other. Their common bond is that they chose to do this stupid TV show and put their lives out there on display.  So it's not fair to say "oh, the others were just sitting idly by while Paige was abused and they let terrible things happen."  They can't pretend to have much insight into how any of the other couples relate, what they've been told to portray, how much is real or how much is acting. So the onus can't be on the other participants in this show to determine whether or not Paige needs to be "saved."  In addition, they are all surrounded by production crew so it's not like anyone is in true danger here.

I have no problem, however, with Clara telling Paige she thinks Chris is a jerk and that she's concerned that Paige might need to walk away.  

I do have a problem with Ryan saying he doesn't want to talk about his impressions of Chris/Paige with his wife in private, though- I would be surprised if my husband said, "yeah, I don't want to tell you what I think." However, we have been married for 37 years.  Again, Ryan doesn't know Clara that well. Oh, and there's a camera on them too. So there's that.

When did I say this?

 

[KateHearts]

4 hours ago, Soup333 said:

However, people choosing to mind their own business is how folk end up in abusive situations for years, isolated from friends/family and even neighbors and coworkers who know or suspect abuse but have decided to stay in their own lane and not get involved. 

This is what I was referring to. Regarding whether or not Ryan was right to tell Clara to not get involved.  I wasn't quoting you, rather bringing up the difference between these couples and their involvement in others' drama vs people who have had long-standing relationships with the couple in question.

1 minute ago, KateHearts said:

 

 

Edited February 18, 2021 by KateHearts

[StatisticalOutlier]

29 minutes ago, glitterpussy said:

Don't forget "I'm an integral man..." LMAO. No dude. That's the wrong word.

I forgot about that.  Was he thinking "integral" is the adjective form of "integrity"?  That's all I could come up with.

 

59 minutes ago, JAndy said:

He was home late one night and forgot to text me and I was freaking out that he got into a car accident or something.

That's precisely why I don't like the constant checking in that people do now.  Tell me what time you're coming home, and if it's going to be later than that, then issue an advisory.  The advisory will be an "event" rather than the type of SOP that can get overlooked.  And I'll luxuriate in being able to assume that everything is fine because I haven't heard otherwise, like we used to do in the olden days.

[JAndy]

16 minutes ago, StatisticalOutlier said:

That's precisely why I don't like the constant checking in that people do now.  Tell me what time you're coming home, and if it's going to be later than that, then issue an advisory.  The advisory will be an "event" rather than the type of SOP that can get overlooked.  And I'll luxuriate in being able to assume that everything is fine because I haven't heard otherwise, like we used to do in the olden days.

I mean it was like 3 am and I woke up in the middle of the night without him there. I was honestly very worried. I don’t need to check up on him, but I thought it was a bit ridiculous he didn’t say anything and chewed him out afterwards. 

[karenbrady]

20 hours ago, gonecrackers said:

Erik, dude, it's like, absolutely, like, time for like, a bag of Doritos & a nap, dude.

Ahhhh...those were the days :-).

[karenbrady]

15 hours ago, Racj82 said:

I was watching this at work with friends. Someone said he looks like a serial killer. I concur. 

Omg!!! I feel the same way..TOTALLY. DUDE FREAKS ME OUT!

[karenbrady]

4 hours ago, Crashcourse said:

I'm sorry to say this, but Jake looks like he stinks.   There's just something about him....

Like meat? Ugh. Lol

[scruffy73]

So many things to say...

I believe the Chris/Clara/VA convo was producer driven. No way that happened organically.

will someone PLEASE tell Paige that God has NOTHING to do with the foolery that is her marriage? There is NOTHING decent and in order about her and Chris!!! “I still love [my ex]” “I’m spiritually attracted to you” “I don’t want another man raising my kid.” What in the hell?

I didn’t see Champagne Vinny as siding with Chris in the Chris vs Erik as much as getting him out of the situation.

I like Jake. Not so much Haley. I like Vincent and Briana but they are going to have challenges. I think Ryan and Clara will be fine.

overall though I am hating this season.

 

[Crashcourse]

2 hours ago, Silver Bells said:

She’s too proper and a stick in the mud.  Have a couple of drinks, loosen up as she is a tightass and try one more time.  And stay off the phone.  That’s rude.  She’s talking to these girlfriends too much and should be concentrating more on the marriage.

Maybe she did have a couple drinks to loosen up and have sex but perhaps didn't enjoy it with him.  I do agree she should stay off the phone though.  I'm guessing her text messages are saying "Help!"  She should just be polite and ride it out until D Day.  Jake will probably leave her alone if that's what she wants, and at least he's not Chris. 

[humbleopinion]

34 minutes ago, karenbrady said:

Ahhhh...those were the days :-).

Honey buns and a bag of peanuts poured into a glass bottle of coke....

[HZAnita]

I get why Vincent (and Briana) may have sided with Chris (and Paige).  They weren't there for the confrontations, so all they heard was Chris's *heartfelt* 😒 mea culpa.

I am of the belief that production wouldn't let Virginia and Erik arrive until after the apology.  The timing was too good.  I smell shenanigans.

Anyway, this episode left me not caring about any of them. 

Great job, Show.

[Crashcourse]

1 hour ago, DrewPaul2010 said:

I'm sure Haley would let us know...does the scent come through the TV?

Yep.  Onions.

[Kdawg82]

19 hours ago, answerphone said:

If we, the viewers, took just a sip of a drink 🍸every time Chris or Paige mentioned he’s a “man of God,” we would all be as drunk as Virginia. 

If you want to be as drunk as Virginia, you'll take a sip every time Chris says "you know what I'm sayin" mid-sentence.  I can hardly focus on ANYTHING he's "sayin" with the nonstop mumbling and quiet talk. 

[humbleopinion]

32 minutes ago, Crashcourse said:

Yep.  Onions.

Meat sweats...mixed with his musk....

You know the smell...you get the meat sweats at those (Pre Covid) All you can eat Churrascaria...Brazilian Meat on a skewer places

You know she can smell it on her...her skin, hair, clothes, pillow after he was most likely butt naked and grinding all over her.....

Edited February 18, 2021 by humbleopinion

[gonecrackers]

As of this episode, Jake seems like the 'adult' in the room, & not just in age maturity. Special interests aside, he hasn't involved himself in the Chris/Paige drama, & did very well communicating his justified confusion reg. Haley's behavior. Something started out different than the way it is now, & the sex further complicated things. I've felt it's been obvious that she was not interested, but there's a lot we don't see so maybe she did express some interest to him, or was at least trying, even though it wasn't necessarily working for her. Regardless, he was feeling something positive. Then she got drunk & had sex with him because, "I'm married to the guy, so why not?". Seems innocuous enough, but she didn't realize she'd sober up & feel even more disinterested, whereas Jake would feel encouraged. She's created a conundrum for herself, but more so for Jake.

I felt Jake's frustration & wanted her to answer his direct questions rather than sit there ready to explode.  For some reason she took a more indirect path to hang out with at least some of the other couples & deliberately exclude him. We don't know who participated but obviously it was not the "girls' night" she told him it was, because he wouldn't have had a problem had he seen her with just the other brides. We also don't know why the crowd all scurried away, but they definitely knew Haley told Jake she was at a "girls' night", so they were participating in her deceit & also hurt Jake in the process. He's had to socialize with the other grooms, maybe even thought they were becoming friends; now they're in on something with his wife & he's not invited to know. W. T. F.

So I considered maybe Haley is having some sort of major problem with Jake, but if that's the case, I would think she'd confer with her thousands of GF's, or Clara/some of the brides, rather than having a night out with everyone behind his back.

The whole thing is ridiculous as is the show this season.

That's the situation this week. Now I want to see how things go with them next week. Does she continue the passive aggressive mean girl behavior for no apparent reason other than not liking him (which is shitty), or is there something dark coming out about Jake in the near future, is what I wonder.

I hate myself for wanting to find out.

[karenbrady]

2 hours ago, glitterpussy said:

Don't forget "I'm an integral man..." LMAO. No dude. That's the wrong word.

I think something happened with Haley and Jake.  I don't think she seemed "happy" with the sex at all in her TH. She was like, we had sex....aaaaand that's all I have to say.  I think whatever it was scared and repulsed her, she told the girls at least, and it was bad enough that the WHOLE GROUP conspired to ditch Jake.  Maybe she was really wasted and felt like she didn't give consent? Maybe he has some super weird 80s kink? I don't know, but that whole scene where he was asking what went wrong was excruciating and she seemed like she was saying anything but the truth.

I have never seen a more pathetic drunk than Eric. WTF man, you're in your 30s.  I'm sure he was drunk when he came up with his plan to lecture Chris about speaking to VA. VA herself is doing more than drinking, IMO. Coke?

I must be the only one who doesn't like Ryan.  "you need to control what comes out of your mouth" really?  You've been in multi-year relationships and never said I love you?  He seems rigid and controlling to me. Yuck.

 

I don't like Ryan. At all.

[gonecrackers]

I can't really form an opinion about Ryan yet. With everything else going on he's kind of just, there.

Did they say Erik is a commercial pilot? Or maybe he flies in some other capacity. None that he should be drunk for, obviously.