S07.E04: Out of the Past

[Cranberry]

Quote

It was just another average morning on July 22, 1955, when Agent Phil Coulson realized the importance of that day in the S.H.I.E.L.D. history books. With a chip on his shoulder and a genre-bending glitch in his system, he'd set into motion a chain of events that would hopefully preserve the timeline as we know it and ensure those pesky chronicoms get the ending they deserve. What could go wrong?

Airdate: June 17, 2020

 

[swanpride]

Ah, I look forward to this one….really curious why THIS day is so important.

[AimingforYoko]

Solid solution to the Sousa problem, and now we get to keep Enver Gjokaj for a while.

Well, we're off to '73, so say goodbye to the nice wardrobe.

[thuganomics85]

So, LMD Coulson getting zapped with an EMP makes him a) see everything in black and white and b) hear his thoughts in a style of old-school film noir monologues that just happen to fit within the setting and theme of this episode.  Love it!

I figured they were going to find some way to prevent Sousa's death, but I feel like an idiot for taking as long as I did to realize they will just simply replace him with Coulson, since he can survive bullets!  Still, I'm glad that not only is he still alive, but he's now on the ship the rest of the gang and will be going on some time-traveling adventures!  To compare it to a rival comic show, it's similar to many of the team members on Legends of Tomorrow.  I can't wait to see his reaction to the future (especially since everyone else will still be considering it the past.)  Enver Gjokaj really plays off the rest of the cast well.

Looks like Melinda's issue is some weird thing where she is mainly an emotionless robot normally, but whenever she is close or touches someone, she feels their emotions instead, and makes her act out.  A nice way to let Ming-Na Wen get to play against her normal stoic stuff.

Not only is Wilfred Mallory back in the flesh, but he's now in league with the Chromicons.  Oh, boy!

Surprisingly enjoyed the Deke/Yo-Yo scenes.

Enoch!  Glad he's back, but the poor guy is clearly feeling lonely and under-appreciated.  One of the many, many reasons we need Fitz to come back ASAP!

Everyone's reactions to finding out they are now in the 70s was hilarious: especially Mack literally face-palming.  And, understandably, Sousa just seemed baffled by the music that was playing.  Man, he's in for a big surprise next week!

[sinkwriter]

I'm enjoying the season, but I really do hate that they've left Fitz essentially by himself once again and we don't get to know what's going on with him. It's been 4 episodes already, and it doesn't look like he'll be in next week's either, so... *grumbles

How many episodes are in this final season? 

[dwmarch]

They did a Varley extraction! I love it! In John Varley's story Millenium (which is the novel version of his short story Air Raid), humans from the future were grabbing people off of airplanes that were about to crash and replacing them with convincing replica body parts.

I look forward to seeing what Sousa thinks of the future. We had moments like that with Captain America and his list of things to check out so it will be interesting to see what Sousa's list looks like.

Enoch the long-suffering operator was hilarious, especially how he cut Deke off even though it sounded like Deke wanted to do some catching up.

[The Ringo Kidd]

The Film Noir setting was great. The got the nuances right. Really enjoyable.

[Maverick]

 So May is Counselor Troi now.  

 So is Sousa sticking it out the rest of the season?  Or are they going to leave him in the 70s?  

[swanpride]

Why should they leave him in the 70s? He is better off as part of the team.

Okay, was anyone else totally creeped out by May acting all giddy?

Anyway, I saw the ending coming, but I didn't see Wilfred Malick still being around.

Also, can't wait to see what Enoch's bar will look like in the 1970s...speaking of which, who was the guy who keep complaining to him? Was he just a running gag or someone I should have recognized?

You know, I love how they are going all out, basically throwing themselves a huge party in the last season. And now that Enver Gjokaj joined the cast, I can't help myself dreaming of the musical episode. I am usually not a big fan of those but him and Chloe Bennet and the writers of shield behind it, they could actually create something which rivals once more with feelings….

[Raja]

9 hours ago, sinkwriter said:

I'm enjoying the season, but I really do hate that they've left Fitz essentially by himself once again and we don't get to know what's going on with him. It's been 4 episodes already, and it doesn't look like he'll be in next week's either, so... *grumbles

How many episodes are in this final season? 

13,so just under a third of the way through.  If they keep the same "pod" structure I would suppose two each from 70's, 90's and earlier S.H.I.E.L.D 2010's seasons with the last three episodes to wrap up the show.

7 hours ago, swanpride said:

 

Also, can't wait to see what Enoch's bar will look like in the 1970s...speaking of which, who was the guy who keep complaining to him? Was he just a running gag or someone I should have recognized?

You know, I love how they are going all out, basically throwing themselves a huge party in the last season. And now that Enver Gjokaj joined the cast, I can't help myself dreaming of the musical episode. I am usually not a big fan of those but him and Chloe Bennet and the writers of shield behind it, they could actually create something which rivals once more with feelings….

Along with throwing out S.H.I.E.LD. specific lingo of the "S.O."  I think it is just a running joke of Enoch being the bartender for generations of S.H.I.E.L.D.  agents.  And if my speculation about two episodes per time period is correct that extra episode just might be a special like Fear and Loathing on the Planet of Kitson from season 6.

[blueray]

I liked how they explained the episode being in black and white because Coulson was hit by an EMP. I was an interesting way to use the tone and worked from a story point of view. I figured that if they were going to save Sousa (sp) they would have to use Coulson. So I'm looking forward to seeing what he thinks of the 70's. Poor Enoch got left again. I'm hoping he gets rescued by Fitz. He's been gone for to long.

As for May that is an interesting direction. And explains her panic attack as she was feeling it from YoYo. I figured she wouldn't get anything from Coulson but was glad the showed what would happen if she touched him.

[paigow]

Sousa still worked for SSR in 1955. Why would he recognize SHIELD?

[paigow]

12 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Everyone's reactions to finding out they are now in the 70s was hilarious: especially Mack literally face-palming.  And, understandably, Sousa just seemed baffled by the music that was playing.

How do they know for sure? It might be a retro station from 2005...

[Loandbehold]

I enjoyed the Film Noir black & white b/c LMD Coulson was being rebooted. Still, if it was Coulson's viewpoint, then scenes where he wasn't involved should have been in color. He wasn't telling the story to someone else, we were watching it in "real time." So Coulson wasn't around when Deke and Yo-yo were in the car, or when action was taking place on the Zephyr while he was on the train, or in Enoch's bar when he didn't call. 

[tennisgurl]

I loved the film noir setting and style, they really nailed the aesthetic and Coulson was a great narrator. And I love that it was actually explained as glitch in Coulsons robot body, so not only a stylistic choice but character relevant. 

I am glad that they saved Sousa and I am absolutely thrilled that Enver Gjokaj will be along for the ride for a bit! I actually think that this was a more interesting time travel debate than the "should we kill a person who we know will do bad things before they have actually done them?" kill baby Hitler debate. Do we let a good person die because thats what is supposed to happen? Well, that got solved with the help of robotics! I cant believe I didnt see that coming, they had already established that roboCoulson can survive bullets, that works really well.

So now we head for the 70s! Everyone figuring out what time period it is by what music is playing on the radio is cracking me up, I wonder if when they get to the present, they'll hear old music playing and think they went back in time again...only for it to be revealed to be an oldies station and its the present! 

Poor long suffering Enoch. 

So now Sousa has been zapped from the 50s to the 70s? How does this just keep happening to guys who had a thing for Peggy Carter?! Her type is extremely specific...  

[Raja]

19 minutes ago, paigow said:

Sousa still worked for SSR in 1955. Why would he recognize SHIELD?

In the previous episode they established that the S.S.R. had become S.H.I.E.L.D given the rate that S.S.R. agents fell on Agent Carter for Chief Sousa to be the first S.H.I.E.L.D agent to fall the agency must be brand new.

[greekmom]

It's better than the last 2 episodes but I feel the cast at this point are phoning it in.

I feel bad for Enoch who seems like an after thought and taken for granted on the team. Damn, just get him BACK ON THE SHIP.  I hope he doesn't turn on them.

[Raja]

2 hours ago, blueray said:

I liked how they explained the episode being in black and white because Coulson was hit by an EMP. I was an interesting way to use the tone and worked from a story point of view. I figured that if they were going to save Sousa (sp) they would have to use Coulson. So I'm looking forward to seeing what he thinks of the 70's. Poor Enoch got left again. I'm hoping he gets rescued by Fitz. He's been gone for to long.

As for May that is an interesting direction. And explains her panic attack as she was feeling it from YoYo. I figured she wouldn't get anything from Coulson but was glad the showed what would happen if she touched him.

I missed the explanation as everyone in the room kept complaining about the black and white. After I said like the Spider-Man Spiderverse the whining stopped.

As for the panic, it wasn't from Yo-Yo but from the technicians as they planned. The Chronicoms ignored the gas. And this episode had confusion from Chief Sousa.

[KittenPokerCheater]

14 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Enoch!  Glad he's back, but the poor guy is clearly feeling lonely and under-appreciated.  One of the many, many reasons we need Fitz to come back ASAP!

I know, I feel bad for Enoch too. I hope they can make it up to him.

Hope they explain how May got her empath powers.  Curious to see what Yo-Yo (I adore that nickname) and Deke (and Daisy?) do next, now that they are no longer Agents of Status Quo.

Super glad that Enver Gjokaj is sticking around.  Wonder if he will stay in the 70s for some reason under a pseudonym, or if he'll be there through the end of the season.  I hope he doesn't die.

[maczero]

2 hours ago, paigow said:

Sousa still worked for SSR in 1955. Why would he recognize SHIELD?

I think canonically, SSR turned into SHIELD.  Did something in this episode contradict that?

[swanpride]

At this point I am starting to wonder if someone in the writers room time travelled. Or is clairvoyant.

Honestly, first Deke's little speech about the clothes changing but the people staying just as racist and sexist, and then the talk with Yoyo about the status quo sucking - if I didn't know that it is impossible, I would wonder if they went back to shot some last minute stuff to address the current situation. Stan Lee would be so proud of them!

[swanpride]

Oh, regarding when the SSR became Shield: They mentioned in one of the earlier episodes that the switch happened in the 1950s. So Shield just got its start.

[Raja]

2 hours ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

I know, I feel bad for Enoch too. I hope they can make it up to him.

Hope they explain how May got her empath powers.  Curious to see what Yo-Yo (I adore that nickname) and Deke (and Daisy?) do next, now that they are no longer Agents of Status Quo.

Super glad that Enver Gjokaj is sticking around.  Wonder if he will stay in the 70s for some reason under a pseudonym, or if he'll be there through the end of the season.  I hope he doesn't die.

She just said that when Azel and Sarge sent her through the monolith she felt nothing on the other side. So it is just unexplained as to the how it is happening . Right now she can fight Chronicoms alone but can't control the emotions of other people infecting her.

[Raja]

8 minutes ago, swanpride said:

Oh, regarding when the SSR became Shield: They mentioned in one of the earlier episodes that the switch happened in the 1950s. So Shield just got its start.

During Agent Carter I was speculating that it would be 1947 when the Defense Department was reorganized and CIA was created. The post war S.S.R. did seem more law enforcement than a spy agency.

[Orbert]

I just wanted to mention that, as someone who didn't watch Agent Carter, I like how Agent Sousa was introduced.  It's interesting when shows do something like this.  His introduction needed to be enough for newbies to understand who he is, but not explained to the point where people who know him from the other series are gonna be bored by it.  And if they're really good, they'll include things that will be fun callbacks for those who are familiar, but not distracting to us noobs or leaving us feeling like we've missed out on something.

Anyway, they've done a great job here.  I didn't know Sousa before, but I like him and I'm glad he's (apparently) joining the team.  And if there have been callbacks, I've never felt like I missed the joke or the significance of something.  Bravo!

[Jack Shaftoe]

Not too bad of an episode and I like Enver Gjokaj, so I don't mind him sticking around but time traveling on this show is even more boring than time traveling in general. So I keep thinking "make it stop" but they keep doing it. The Chronicoms are such pathetically clueless villains that they resorted to bribing Coulson as their new "sinister" plan.

Also, I really don't believe that any of the team members except maybe Coulson by virtue of being a robot would remember the number of Enoch's bar, that was just too silly. And they sure got lucky that the assassin didn't bother checking the face of the guy he had "killed".

Empath May is such a weird development. Speaking of powers, Yo-yo and Daisy again were no show. Coulson is the one doing most of the heavy lifting in the field this season, not exactly what I would prefer since I find the whole state of the art LMD thing to be too silly. Especially against Chronicoms - you would think they would know how to get rid of a robot easily but nah, they are as clueless as ever. 😉

[MisterGlass]

This was a lot of fun.  I was glad to find the Sunset Boulevard opening was a misdirect.  I like Sousa and am glad this show is giving him more of a send off. 

I was a little disappointed that Stark's man in L.A. wasn't Jarvis.  And at this point I just feel bad for Enoch.

3 hours ago, Jack Shaftoe said:

Also, I really don't believe that any of the team members except maybe Coulson by virtue of being a robot would remember the number of Enoch's bar, that was just too silly.

They may have asked the operator to put them through.

Time to make the 70s episode bingo card.  I'm guessing disco and a fringe jacket figure somewhere.  I also feel like we're due the middle generation Koenig.

[Raja]

What's so hard about remembering one phone number? Does the audience need a scene of Coulson's computer brain briefing agents on numbers and frequencies for us to believe they could do what everybody did before cell phone memories relieved humanity of that burden?

[swanpride]

Honestly, when I was a child I had ALL relevant numbers in my mind...family, close friends, emergency….and I would still be able to call at least my family on memory alone. It's not that complicated.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Raja said:

What's so hard about remembering one phone number? Does the audience need a scene of Coulson's computer brain briefing agents on numbers and frequencies for us to believe they could do what everybody did before cell phone memories relieved humanity of that burden?

Exactly.  Plus 1955 was before area codes and when phone numbers were alphanumeric making them easier to remember. 

[Llywela]

9 hours ago, Orbert said:

I just wanted to mention that, as someone who didn't watch Agent Carter, I like how Agent Sousa was introduced.  It's interesting when shows do something like this.  His introduction needed to be enough for newbies to understand who he is, but not explained to the point where people who know him from the other series are gonna be bored by it.  And if they're really good, they'll include things that will be fun callbacks for those who are familiar, but not distracting to us noobs or leaving us feeling like we've missed out on something.

Anyway, they've done a great job here.  I didn't know Sousa before, but I like him and I'm glad he's (apparently) joining the team.  And if there have been callbacks, I've never felt like I missed the joke or the significance of something.  Bravo!

The only real callback I noticed was the guard asking Sousa if he knew Peggy Carter and Sousa saying that yes, they'd met - an understatement, since he was her will-they-won't-they love interest in Agent Carter and finally got together in the finale, although the relationship clearly didn't work out long term. That, and Sousa telling Coulson that he could easily believe in robots from another planet trying to take over Earth, because he's already seen some pretty incredible things - neatly worded as standalone character detailing for viewers who've never met him before, while also calling back to his adventures with Peggy and the gang over on Agent Carter, which have been obliquely referenced in the show before.

[swanpride]

Well, they also mentioned some of his exploits in Agent Carter when they introduced him. But I guess the more important part is that they introduced the character well enough that even viewers who didn't know him beforehand latched onto him enough that they cared about his possible fate. That's how you do it.

Peggy's type is incredible specific though...what is it that she keeps falling for men who are smarter than other people give them credit for, who have somehow be disadvantaged in live, who are keen on fighting Hydra, even if that means that they die in the process and who end up in the future after a heroic sacrifice?

[mrspidey]

On 6/18/2020 at 7:48 AM, Maverick said:

 So May is Counselor Troi now.  

 plus Spock!

Edited June 19, 2020 by mrspidey

[blackwing]

Another powerless episode.  Yo Yo full out pretty much said she lost her powers, and this episode she didn't even try at all.  You'd think that Deke getting taken would have made her at least want to try again.  Daisy was confined to the ship.  I don't understand why they wouldn't have sent Daisy with Deke to get the package.  At least send someone who still has powers just in case.  Oh but of course, she was kept on the ship to save money.

Convenient that May gets empath powers, which not so shockingly, don't require a whole lot of budget expenditure.  Coulson didn't even use his super strength unless you count getting shot in the back.

It was still an entertaining episode, but I am tiring of the Enoch scenes... he's clearly being played off as the comic relief, "oh poor me, they don't care about me, they only call me when they need something".

I'm glad Sousa survived, but isn't it kind of hypocritical of Mack?  He was so concerned about not changing history when he allowed Freddy to escape, and now he goes and saves Sousa?  I wonder if there will be any implications that come out of this.

[RobertDeSneero]

15 hours ago, Jack Shaftoe said:

Also, I really don't believe that any of the team members except maybe Coulson by virtue of being a robot would remember the number of Enoch's bar, that was just too silly.

As soon as Coulson calls in, they know they can call that number.  It should be drilled into the head of anyone entering the field at that point.

[blueray]

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

It was still an entertaining episode, but I am tiring of the Enoch scenes... he's clearly being played off as the comic relief, "oh poor me, they don't care about me, they only call me when they need something".

I'm getting tired of that too. Because it at best case scenerio sad at worst he's going to turn on them (as someone said above).  I think if they didn't want to include the actor in more scenes then they could have just left it that he got stranded in the 30's and have their coms work so he's wasn't needed.  Also they could have attempted to get him. If Coulson (who called that number first) did it in the episode before, that would have gave Enoch at least a day or so to get there which may still not be enough time.

[Raja]

24 minutes ago, blueray said:

I'm getting tired of that too. Because it at best case scenerio sad at worst he's going to turn on them (as someone said above).  I think if they didn't want to include the actor in more scenes then they could have just left it that he got stranded in the 30's and have their coms work so he's wasn't needed.  Also they could have attempted to get him. If Coulson (who called that number first) did it in the episode before, that would have gave Enoch at least a day or so to get there which may still not be enough time.

They established that they don't know when a time jump countdown will start. So the team has to stay in quinjet pick up range

[blackwing]

17 minutes ago, Raja said:

They established that they don't know when a time jump countdown will start. So the team has to stay in quinjet pick up range

True.  But as mentioned above, they knew Enoch's phone number.  And Coulson knew he was going to be on a train to Los Angeles.  So why not call Enoch and say "hey, sorry for ditching you for the past 24 years, but we are going to be in Los Angeles, try and get there".  

Also, where did the Quinjet last land?  Were they still in the same city they were last in, just in a different time?  If the Quinjet could fly to meet Coulson's train, could they really not have afforded the time to make a slight detour and pick up Enoch?  I just don't think I am going to enjoy seeing Enoch the Sad Bartender in different eras wearing different clothese, still hoping that his friends will come by and pick him up.

[Taeolas]

There time in the 50's was only a day or two at most, maybe 3. But they didn't contact Enoch until the last day regardless. And they were busy stopping the Chronitons and then fixing up the mess to maintain the timeline. If after saving Soussa the timer wasn't ticking down, they probably would have done the trip to NY to pick him up; but they were literally out of time at that point. 

 

As for Enoch heading west to meet them; this is the 50's. Fast travel across the continent isn't necessarily easy, even if Enoch had a nest egg he could use to do it. While being stuck as an Operator for the team in the 50's, I suspect he knows and understands why he's left behind again. 

 

Considering he's shown saving them in the 70's, he probably won't be left behind again.

[Raja]

28 minutes ago, Taeolas said:

There time in the 50's was only a day or two at most, maybe 3. But they didn't contact Enoch until the last day regardless. And they were busy stopping the Chronitons and then fixing up the mess to maintain the timeline. If after saving Soussa the timer wasn't ticking down, they probably would have done the trip to NY to pick him up; but they were literally out of time at that point. 

 

As for Enoch heading west to meet them; this is the 50's. Fast travel across the continent isn't necessarily easy, even if Enoch had a nest egg he could use to do it. While being stuck as an Operator for the team in the 50's, I suspect he knows and understands why he's left behind again. 

 

Considering he's shown saving them in the 70's, he probably won't be left behind again.

By time Deke called in Enoch was acting like a Signal Corps soldier, or S.H.I.E.L.D agent manning his communications relay.

[Jack Shaftoe]

13 hours ago, Raja said:

What's so hard about remembering one phone number? Does the audience need a scene of Coulson's computer brain briefing agents on numbers and frequencies for us to believe they could do what everybody did before cell phone memories relieved humanity of that burden?

Of course people can remember phone numbers but why would the protagonists assume Enoch had remained at that bar all these years? The whole thing played out as if they had literally watched the end of episode two of this season rather than left Enoch without knowing what he was going to do from then on. I guess you could say Couson was trying to reach Koening first but it's not like Koening could have helped him much from New York - if he was even still alive. And of course Enoch having already come up with a way to contact Zephyr was pretty damned convenient too. Enoch in general is too much of a plot device/comic relief instead of a character in his own right, even though the actor is doing a great job. Everyone just blithely cutting him off when he kept saying that he wanted to reunite with them was a little too sitcom-y for my taste.

Come to think of it, wouldn't 1955 SHIELD notice that Souza's body is missing? Did they mention something about getting around this little problem?

[Taeolas]

I like to think that when he was left behind in the 30's, Enoch and Koening have been working behind the scenes, watching for ripples and guiding SHIELD in certain directions to make sure things flow right. Enoch is expecting the Zephyr to pop back into the timeline at some point, so prepping a way to connect to its comm systems isn't too unexpected. With 70's tech he probably has a way to pick up when it arrives too.

As for Coulson calling Enoch, he admitted it was a Hail Mary. He had to call someone, but the only one he could remotely call that might be around would be Koening. Finding Enoch there was a nice surprise as was the way to reach the Zephyr. He probably didn't have the number directly, but just used operators across the country to finally make the connection. Once the number was known, it was probably included as part of his briefing to the rest of the team. Briefing Enoch more on what was going on would probably have been nice, but probably an oversight.  

 

*Edit* Soussa's body disappearing is a bit of a hole, but probably just a small stick in the stream of time; it'll be a mystery that runs through SHIELD in the years to come, possibly making him a bit of a "bogey man" for Hydra-SHIELD agents (especially if they knock out a cell in the 70's and he's IDed). "He's dead but he's not dead and he's coming after us!" 

Edited June 19, 2020 by Taeolas

[swanpride]

I pretty much keep imagining Peggy turning up at the hotel, trying to find proof that Sousa is still alive only to learn that 1. There are witnesses who saw him getting shot twice and 2. he stayed in the pool way longer than it would have been possible had this been a ruse. Eventually she would most likely put the vanished body down as the killer trying to hide evidence.

[Guest]

31 minutes ago, Taeolas said:

I like to think that when he was left behind in the 30's, Enoch and Koening have been working behind the scenes, watching for ripples and guiding SHIELD in certain directions to make sure things flow right. Enoch is expecting the Zephyr to pop back into the timeline at some point, so prepping a way to connect to its comm systems isn't too unexpected. With 70's tech he probably has a way to pick up when it arrives too.

This is especially true when you remember that Enoch is a anthropologist who spent 30,000 years observing Earth before he befriended Fitz. Watching and making small adjustments with as few ripples as possible is what he’s spent thousands of years doing. 

 

1 hour ago, Jack Shaftoe said:

Come to think of it, wouldn't 1955 SHIELD notice that Souza's body is missing? Did they mention something about getting around this little problem?

It’s unlikely to be an issue since Sousa’s boss is one of Hydra’s highest ranking agents within Shield. Even if Malick suspects Sousa isn’t dead he would still have every reason to cover up the missing body. 

[paigow]

Enoch built a dial up MODEM in 1955!!! Maybe he has changed history..Koenig will invent AOL

[swanpride]

Well, Howard Stark invented a flying car in the 1940s and it didn't really impact history all that much.

[paigow]

2 hours ago, swanpride said:

Well, Howard Stark invented a flying car in the 1940s and it didn't really impact history all that much.

Coulson already saved the world using one...

[AnimeMania]

Maybe Enoch is a homage to The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy's Marvin the Paranoid Android who was also left in the past and had to wait a long time for his party to return and collect him. 

[swanpride]

Either way it is a good thing that he stayed because a Chronicon stayed, too

[chitowngirl]

1 hour ago, AnimeMania said:

Maybe Enoch is a homage to The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy's Marvin the Paranoid Android who was also left in the past and had to wait a long time for his party to return and collect him. 

That’s who he reminds me of when he talks!! 😆