S03.E17: An Academic Crime and a More Romantic Taco Bell

[Bort]

Quote

Dr. Sturgis is furious when Sheldon accuses him of plagiarism. Also, Mary sets out to find a “girl trophy” for Missy’s end-of-season baseball ceremony, and Georgie has an awkward run-in with Veronica while on a date with his new girlfriend, Jana.

Airdate: Thursday, March 5, 2020

As always, please do not discuss events of The Big Bang Theory that have not “happened” yet. 

[Spartan Girl]

Oh man. Sheldon's asinine behavior finally bit him in the ass, big time.

I thought Mary's homemade trophy was cute, but I laughed when Missy blew it up.

God, I miss Chi-Chi's.

[Katy M]

I rarely hate Sheldon, but I hated him tonight.  I actually gasped when he called Dr. Linletter.  Considering their general animosity towards each other I fully expected him to run with it. So, I was pleasantly surprised in that respect.  I did LOL when he told Sheldon his comeback was good but he wasn't going to say it.  I did feel a bit sorry for Sheldon at the end, but also feel that he 100% deserved it.  I hope at some point he can apologize and be let back in the class, but this may be the show's way of writing Dr. Sturgis out.

I liked Mary and MIssy's conversation.  Missy didn't want a special trophy, but at least told her mother she appreciated what she was trying to do.  Why was Mary responsible for getting MIssy's trophy in the first place?  Doesn't the school buy them altogether at a discount?

[ams1001]

16 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

I thought Mary's homemade trophy was cute, but I laughed when Missy blew it up.

Missy's face after Mary yelled "what was that?!" was the best.

You'd think they'd have had a softball trophy...

Edited March 6, 2020 by ams1001

[Bort]

Congratulations, Sheldon. You’re an asshole. I’m glad Dr. Sturgis called him on it. About time someone didn’t roll over and cave when he pitched a fit.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

19 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

Missy's face after Mary yelled "what was that?!" was the best.

You'd think they'd have had a softball trophy...

Or take the head from a soccer trophy, not from a Barbie.

34 minutes ago, Katy M said:

Why was Mary responsible for getting MIssy's trophy in the first place?  Doesn't the school buy them altogether at a discount?

It's not a school team. There was a meeting of the neighborhood moms and Mary was put in charge of all the trophies.  She wanted to get a female version for Missy.

[Bort]

11 minutes ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Or take the head from a soccer trophy, not from a Barbie.

Or golf. That’s what I was expecting Mary to do. But even if she had, I knew Missy would want the same trophy everybody else gets. As someone who played sports with boys, there are enough differences that a girl has to deal with, don’t invent more.

[nora1992]

His reaction when Georgie was told he should cut his hair!  Reminds me of Meatloaf’s lyrics: he’d do anything for love, but he won’t do that.

[Bobbin]

I imagine that at that time, maybe few rural towns in Texas had any girl sports. Or soccer teams.

A ten year old with an uncompromsing ego. Yikes. So Sheldon got the brains and twin Missy got all the compassion, while Georgie got street smarts. And a heart. Maŕy and George deserve a trophy.

[SmithW6079]

1 hour ago, kariyaki said:

Congratulations, Sheldon. You’re an asshole. I’m glad Dr. Sturgis called him on it. About time someone didn’t roll over and cave when he pitched a fit.

Exactly. This episode is why I hate Sheldon, and why this show works better for me when he's a supporting character to the rest of the family.

[Magnumfangirl]

The trophy story was ridiculous.  Girl baseball/softball trophies were readily available in the 80s.  

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, Magnumfangirl said:

The trophy story was ridiculous.  Girl baseball/softball trophies were readily available in the 80s.  

I found it believable because Missy is the only girl playing locally. If there is no demand the local trophy store isn’t going to provide them. 

I’m the same age as Sheldon and Missy and my soccer trophy from when I was a kid is a boy trophy. Everyone got the same one and I didn’t think anything of it at the time. 

[anna0852]

Well we certainly got a glimpse of the familiar Sheldon tonight and I wasn't please to see him.

[jewel21]

Damn, that ending. Go Dr. Sturgis. 

I really like Veronica. I hope if they do have her and Georgie get together they don't screw it up. At least not right away.

[BitterApple]

Damnnnnnnnn, that ending! I was not expecting Dr. Sturgis to boot Sheldon from class, but wow, I'm happy an adult finally put the kibosh on his tantrums. 

Speaking of which, Sheldon was a total snot. I've never liked Dr. Linkletter's character but I'm glad he impressed upon Sheldon what a serious accusation he was making and didn't use it as an opportunity to ruin John's reputation. 

With regards to Mary, I thought she was well-intentioned, but a little ridiculous. Would Missy really have cared or even noticed that she got a boy trophy? But yeah, I'm surprised they didn't at least have softball trophies. 

Jana telling Georgie to cut his hair? Hell, no. I'll be forever Team Veronica after that one. 

[Bobbin]

In fairness, Sheldon deserves more than a footnote. Authors of treatises do give special thanks in the preface to those who contributed in some substantial way. And Sheldon did more than make one suggestion. Dr. Sturgis may have spent years working on his paper, but he wound up re-writing the whole thing after talking with Sheldon. An accusation of plagerism could doom Dr. Sturgis's career, but it wouldn't hurt it to give Sheldon more than a footnote nod. Of course, that would never satisfy Sheldon's demand for equal billing. So in the end, Sheldon deserved what he got:  nothing.

Edited March 6, 2020 by Bobbin
fixed typo

[Guest]

32 minutes ago, Bobbin said:

In fairness, Sheldon deserves more than a footnote. Authors of treatises do give special thanks in the preface to those who contributed in some substantial way. And Sheldon did more than make one suggestion. Dr. Sturgis may have spent years working on his paper, but he wound up re-writing the whole thing after talking with Sheldon. An accusation of plagerism could doom Dr. Sturgis's career, but it wouldn't hurt it to give Sheldon more than a footnote nod. Of course, that would never satisfy Sheldon's demand for equal billing. So in the end, Sheldon deserved what he got:  nothing.

I had the same reaction. Sheldon was completely out of line in his expectations and reaction but Dr. Sturgis downplayed Sheldon’s contribution. 

This whole storyline reminded me a lot of the Big Bang Theory episode where 

Spoiler

a grad student, Ramona Nowitzki, forces Sheldon to stay focused on his theory and then asks for shared credit. It also reminded me of all the times Sheldon promised his friends that they would be a footnote in whatever accomplishment he was working on at the time.

I wonder where they are going with this and what lessons Sheldon will takeaway. 

Also as much as I disliked Sheldon in this episode it highlights how far he progresses through TBBT to give that Nobel acceptance speech.

 

Edited March 6, 2020 by Guest

[UsernameFatigue]

The best part of this episode was seeing that Missy's ears are now pierced. Yay Connie! 

Edited March 6, 2020 by UsernameFatigue

[SmithW6079]

2 hours ago, jewel21 said:

Damn, that ending. Go Dr. Sturgis. 

I really like Veronica. I hope if they do have her and Georgie get together they don't screw it up. At least not right away.

Didn't Sheldon's voiceover once say that Georgie got married for the first time at 18? Maybe Veronica is his first wife. That's what I keep thinking. 

[Snow Apple]

I agree Sheldon was extra unpleasant in this episode. I guess there's no way around turning Sheldon into......Sheldon. At least the writers realized and started giving the other characters more screen time as the series goes further into the future.

[Katy M]

7 hours ago, BitterApple said:

Speaking of which, Sheldon was a total snot. I've never liked Dr. Linkletter's character but I'm glad he impressed upon Sheldon what a serious accusation he was making and didn't use it as an opportunity to ruin John's reputation. 

That's what I thought.  Dr. Linkletter doesn't like either Dr Sturgis or Sheldon.  If he had kicked this up the ladder it would have gone badly for at least one of them.  I was highly impressed, based on what we've seen of him, that he instead chose to defuse the situation.

[hoodooznoodooz]

I liked George trying to ingratiate himself with his trophy wife joke, then immediately ascertaining Mary’s reaction and retreating.

[Frost]

I cringed while watching this episode because I figured it was going to unleash a lot of hatred towards a 10 year old boy (character).  Sheldon was 100% wrong in how he went about trying to browbeat Dr Sturgis into giving him co-writer credit on the paper and he handled it all with the emotional maturity of a child - which he is.  Dr Sturgis was wrong in downgrading Sheldon's contribution to a footnote, but his ultimate reaction in telling Sheldon why he was reacting how he was and then kicking Sheldon out of his classroom was handled like an adult - which he is.

[Beany Malone]

4 minutes ago, Frost said:

  Sheldon was 100% wrong in how he went about trying to browbeat Dr Sturgis into giving him co-writer credit on the paper and he handled it all with the emotional maturity of a child - which he is.

I actually really like the episodes that remind us that Sheldon is still just a little boy.  Sure he's a genius but he's also only 10 yrs old fercrryingoutloud.  It's also good to me that the writers are creating in Young Sheldon the Sheldon he will one day become.  To do otherwise would be a big mistake IMO.  But of course it does mean they have to walk a fine line.

Edited March 6, 2020 by Beany Malone

[Bort]

Eleven is not a little boy. Sheldon is a big boy, who tried pulling the same old crap that he does at school and home, where people cave in because it’s easier than fighting him. This time someone fought him on it and if the rest of the people in his life would do that, he’d learn not to do that. 

[Beany Malone]

Emotionally Sheldon is very young for his age.  He isn't going to react maturely to most situations and the situation in this episode was no exception.  That doesn't make Sheldon right - it makes Sheldon, Sheldon.  He needs guidance but there is only so much any adult can do to change the basic character of the children they are responsible for.  That's another aspect of this show that I really enjoy come to think of it.  I've been around kids similar to Sheldon (by no means as bright though) and for the most part there is only so much you can do to help them smarten the hell up!

[Bort]

I agree that Sheldon is definitely on the lower end of the learning curve when it comes to social behavior. But that’s not because he’s a little boy — because he’s not — it’s because he’s Sheldon. 
 

All the more reason that the authority figures in his life should push back more when he pitches fits like this. If you’ve got a kid who has a hard time learning to spell, you work with them on it more, so that they’ll actually learn it. 

[Katy M]

46 minutes ago, Beany Malone said:

I actually really like the episodes that remind us that Sheldon is still just a little boy.  Sure he's a genius but he's also only 10 yrs old fercrryingoutloud.  It's also good to me that the writers are creating in Young Sheldon the Sheldon he will one day become.  To do otherwise would be a big mistake IMO.  But of course it does mean they have to walk a fine line.

I agree that in order for Young Sheldon to become Old Sheldon that he has to act like this.  Nothing else would make sense.

However, your little boy theory doesn't hold water for me.  Had he told Dr Sturgis that he wanted co-authoring credit and had his little blowup (which actually wasn't that bad) then got in the car, listened to Mee-Maw and let it go, then I could have given him his initial rant as little boy.  The second he called Dr. Linkletter to get Dr. Sturgis in trouble, he lost all my sympathy.  Even if he had gone a little further and gone back to Dr. Sturgis and asked if he could get a mention in the body of the paper, or a mention at the front of the paper, that would have been better than trying to get Dr Sturgis discredited.

 

[Bobbin]

As I see it, Sheldon is spoiled, and respected, because he is incredibly gifted. That may be the whole story. But is he also on the autism spectrum? The flaw in that theory is that while he thoughtlessly uses both family and friends, he also is depressed at the thought of being friendless and alone.

Love 'em or hate 'em, the more I learn about these characters, the better I understand them. Just like real people.

[meep.meep]

Sheldon acted as the first peer reviewer for the paper.  At my institution we are required to have an internal peer review before papers are sent to a journal, where they will be sent out for anonymous peer review.  Peer reviewers, and sometimes their recommendations, are acknowledged in the Acknowledgements section at the end of the paper.  So, he was wrong.

They could have had a reverse situation where Sheldon writes a paper and Dr. Sturgis adds his name to it.  It's common for leaders of labs or research groups to automatically get authorship based on the idea that the junior member's work wouldn't have been possible without their strong foundation.  Imagine how pissy Sheldon would have gotten over that.

Science is full of death battles over stuff like this.

[AriAu]

Quote

Authors of treatises do give special thanks in the preface to those who contributed in some substantial way.

Dr. Sturgis was NOT slighting Sheldon at all by saying he would be recognized in a footnote. In professional journals, these type of crediting mentions often happen in footnote #1 which appears at the bottom of the first page of the article.  I thought it was clear from Dr. Sturgis's tone of voice that he was very appreciative and was giving what he thought was appropriate and appreciative credit in the circumstances.

Quote

Spoiler

a grad student, Ramona Nowitzki, forces Sheldon to stay focused on his theory and then asks for shared credit. 

 

Spoiler

And his response was "GET OUT"....so, no Sheldon does not become any better at sharing in the future!

 

[Bort]

11 hours ago, Dani said:

I had the same reaction. Sheldon was completely out of line in his expectations and reaction but Dr. Sturgis downplayed Sheldon’s contribution. 

This whole storyline reminded me a lot of the Big Bang Theory episode where 

  Reveal spoiler

a grad student, Ramona Nowitzki, forces Sheldon to stay focused on his theory and then asks for shared credit. It also reminded me of all the times Sheldon promised his friends that they would be a footnote in whatever accomplishment he was working on at the time.

I wonder where they are going with this and what lessons Sheldon will takeaway. 

Also as much as I disliked Sheldon in this episode it highlights how far he progresses through TBBT to give that Nobel acceptance speech.

 

 

10 minutes ago, AriAu said:

Dr. Sturgis was NOT slighting Sheldon at all by saying he would be recognized in a footnote. In professional journals, these type of crediting mentions often happen in footnote #1 which appears at the bottom of the first page of the article.  I thought it was clear from Dr. Sturgis's tone of voice that he was very appreciative and was giving what he thought was appropriate and appreciative credit in the circumstances.

  Reveal spoiler

And his response was "GET OUT"....so, no Sheldon does not become any better at sharing in the future!

 

Responding in the comparison topic...

[MarthaEllisanne]

The trophy shop guy was so familiar, but I could not place him so I looked him up.  Louie Anderson!

[zoey1996]

12 hours ago, UsernameFatigue said:

The best part of this episode was seeing that Missy's ears are now pierced. Yay Connie! 

I forgot to check Missy's ears!  Yep, Yay Connie!

[Driad]

I wish they would clarify Sheldon's status at the university.  Is he taking the course(s) for credit, or auditing?  Is the university letting him do this for free?  Is he taking more than one course?  (I thought Mary said courses, but maybe he has taken Prof. Sturgis's courses in two semesters.) 

[Katy M]

6 minutes ago, Driad said:

I wish they would clarify Sheldon's status at the university.  Is he taking the course(s) for credit, or auditing?  Is the university letting him do this for free?  Is he taking more than one course?  (I thought Mary said courses, but maybe he has taken Prof. Sturgis's courses in two semesters.) 

I'm pretty sure he's just taking the one because MeeMaw has to drive him and they're night classes.   I kind of feel like he's auditing, but then it would be weird as to why the college paid for his trip to CA, and to assign him to a group project.  So, probably credit.  Since they were anxious for him to stay I think they'll let him transfer to Dr. Linkletter's class.  I can just hear Dr. Linkletter's shout of joy now.

[Ms Lark]

Best part for me was Louie (Louie!!) Anderson as the trophy shop owner. I miss Christine Baskets.

Sheldon begins to show his true stripes.

I loved Missy with her Mom, but I really loved Missy blowing up the "girl" trophy. Hah.

ETA: Also noticed Missy playing "The Oregon Trail" on Sheldon's computer: "Janice has cholera." (Yes, I'm old.)

Edited March 6, 2020 by Ms Lark

[BitterApple]

13 minutes ago, Ms Lark said:

Best part for me was Louie (Louie!!) Anderson as the trophy shop owner. I miss Christine Baskets.

Sheldon begins to show his true stripes.

I loved Missy with her Mom, but I really loved Missy blowing up the "girl" trophy. Hah.

ETA: Also noticed Missy playing "The Oregon Trail" on Sheldon's computer: "Janice has cholera." (Yes, I'm old.)

Every time I see Oregon Trail, I'm taken back to third grade. My class was addicted to that and Clue. 

[MollyMelrose]

Thought it was interesting that Adult Sheldon's voiceover came before the scene with Dr. Sturgis. We have yet to hear his reflections upon his relationship with the good doc.

[rmontro]

On 3/5/2020 at 8:38 PM, Katy M said:

I hope at some point he can apologize and be let back in the class, but this may be the show's way of writing Dr. Sturgis out.

I hadn't even thought of that.  I hope it's not true, because honestly Dr. Sturgis is one of my favorite parts of the show.  

19 hours ago, UsernameFatigue said:

The best part of this episode was seeing that Missy's ears are now pierced. Yay Connie! 

I didn't notice that!  I'm impressed that they did that, great attention to continuity.  Would have liked to have seen Mary comment about it.

[ProudMary]

Missy: "I could have had a new Barbie?!?!"

😅

[hoodooznoodooz]

I love Georgie also being fine with water. Because it’s refreshing.

[Yeah No]

I agree that Sheldon was being true to form as clueless, snotty Sheldon and what else can we expect?  But I also think he had a point even if he was completely wrong and immature in how he handled it.  I'm not a scientist so I don't know from footnote acknowledgments but in this particular case it would seem like mentioning him and the nature of his help in a more prominent place would be more fitting since Sheldon actually rescued the paper from being completely incorrect in its conclusions.  That's more than just a suggestion and more than just footnote acknowledgment worthy.  I also don't think Sturgis handled this very maturely either.  Him just sticking to his guns and slamming the phone down after telling Sheldon not to come to class was IMO not the adult way to approach this.  He's the adult and should have known how to diffuse and handle Sheldon.  He should have told Sheldon that they would talk it over together at a later time and come to a mutually agreeable solution.  There's a way to handle a difficult person that's making demands but Dr. Sturgis is not mature or socially competent enough himself to know how to do that.

[Browncoat]

Sheldon's contributions to the paper were not co-author-worthy.  Where I work, there are specific guidelines to determine co-authorship, and they were not met.  That said, if the primary author wants to include people as co-authors who don't meet the criteria, they can  do so.  I've been included on one that I really don't think I should have been, but mostly I've just been in the acknowledgements section, which is more of a short paragraph at the end than a footnote.

Sheldon's review was just that -- a review.  

[Katy M]

5 hours ago, Yeah No said:

He's the adult and should have known how to diffuse and handle Sheldon.  He should have told Sheldon that they would talk it over together at a later time and come to a mutually agreeable solution.

I disagree.  First of all, Sheldon's only agreeable solution would be to be listed as co-author.  He actually thought he was being generous in allowing Dr. Sturgis's name to go first.  Like you, I don't really know about these things, but clearly Dr. Sturgis didn't think that was appropriate.

More importantly, Sheldon attempted to get Dr Strugis discredited.  If it hadn't been for Dr. Linkletter not kicking it up the ladder, Dr. Sturgis may have lost his job and any standing he had in the scientific community.  Sheldon may be a child, but he reads scientific papers, he goes to lectures, he takes a class at a university.  So, even though he's only' 11, I feel like he knew the ramifications of what he was doing.  Even I he were completely in the right, why would he do that to a mentor who has been nothing but kind and helpful to him?

So, basically what I'm saying is this had nothing to do with Sheldon demanding co-authorship.  Dr. Sturgis may very well have been open to discussing some sort of compromise (though I doubt Sheldon would have been).  This was about the unacceptable betrayal of a mentor that up until that time he had respected.

[Chit Chat]

22 minutes ago, Katy M said:

So, even though he's only' 11, I feel like he knew the ramifications of what he was doing.  Even I he were completely in the right, why would he do that to a mentor who has been nothing but kind and helpful to him?

Sadly, Sheldon doesn't usually think through how his actions will affect other people.  All he can see is how something affects him in that moment.  He can be a real turd at times!

[Katy M]

42 minutes ago, ChitChat said:

Sadly, Sheldon doesn't usually think through how his actions will affect other people.  All he can see is how something affects him in that moment.  He can be a real turd at times!

No, he doesn't.  Which is why I have no problem with how Dr Sturgis dealt with him.  If this had been a one-off in terms of his behavior, or not taking other people into consideration, I would feel differently.  So too, I think, would Dr Sturgis.  But, since it's not, I think this is a hard lesson that he needs to learn.  Even so, like I said before, I hope he is able to eventually apologize and renew their relationship.  Because Dr Sturgis is a very positive role model in his life.  

[ams1001]

11 hours ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

I love Georgie also being fine with water. Because it’s refreshing.

I also loved his "that's too bad" after Jana informed him that no, they would not be making up from their fight in the back seat.

[Yeah No]

3 hours ago, Katy M said:

So, basically what I'm saying is this had nothing to do with Sheldon demanding co-authorship.  Dr. Sturgis may very well have been open to discussing some sort of compromise (though I doubt Sheldon would have been).  This was about the unacceptable betrayal of a mentor that up until that time he had respected.

I don't agree with that.  Sheldon is a child and if handled skillfully he could have been made to compromise, in my opinion.  He supposedly respects Dr. Sturgis and the right words and actions coming from his superior and mentor could have made him see that co-authorship is too much to ask but that maybe an honorable mention in the preface with credit given where credit was due would be more appropriate.  Sturgis didn't give him any other option than just a mere footnote as a contributor.  If he had given him this other choice in the right way I think Sheldon might have seen the light.  I don't think he is THAT rigid.

[Katy M]

5 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

I don't agree with that.  Sheldon is a child and if handled skillfully he could have been made to compromise, in my opinion.  He supposedly respects Dr. Sturgis and the right words and actions coming from his superior and mentor could have made him see that co-authorship is too much to ask but that maybe an honorable mention in the preface with credit given where credit was due would be more appropriate.  Sturgis didn't give him any other option than just a mere footnote as a contributor.  If he had given him this other choice in the right way I think Sheldon might have seen the light.  I don't think he is THAT rigid.

Are you not understanding the fact that Sheldon tried to gut his career?  He literally called the university and cried "Plagiarism."  Yes, supposedly respects is the correct phrasing because you wouldn't do that to someone you actually respected.