S03.E13: Mayday

[Baltimore Betty]

I was wondering...if Aunt Lydia is the person in charge of the Handmaids then who is in charge of the Martha's?

[secnarf]

On 8/19/2019 at 12:40 PM, BrindaWalsh said:

 I have no idea how close the Toronto airport is to downtown. 

Far. Nowhere near downtown. Technically, it's not even in the city of Toronto - it's in Mississauga, about 25-30 min to downtown.

[Ashforth]

2 hours ago, Umbelina said:

Whaaaaa??? How did I and apparently everyone here miss that? Why wasn't it made more prominent on the show? Why didn't we see her get off the plane? Moira, Emily, et al would have been taken aback. It's so important.

Oh, show, I want you to be so much better. You have everything you need and it gets squandered for more close-ups of June's face.

[Umbelina]

30 minutes ago, Ashforth said:

Whaaaaa??? How did I and apparently everyone here miss that? Why wasn't it made more prominent on the show? Why didn't we see her get off the plane? Moira, Emily, et al would have been taken aback. It's so important.

Oh, show, I want you to be so much better. You have everything you need and it gets squandered for more close-ups of June's face.

I noticed the red cloak when I lightened the screen caps, so maybe at least one handmaid got out.  You can't look in the "Hey Bruce Miller!" thread for them.  

My question is WHY a "wife" when so many Marthas and Handmaids were left behind?  Maybe the wife's been part of Mayday all along though...

I think the wife was seen in the forest.

Oh well, here it is:

Edited August 21, 2019 by Umbelina

[greekmom]

8 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

I noticed the red cloak when I lightened the screen caps.  You can't look in the "Hey Bruce Miller!" thread for them.  

My question is WHY a "wife" when so many Marthas and Handmaids were left behind?  Maybe the wife's been part of Mayday all along though...

Oh well, here it is:

Could it be she's an Econowife or a young wife that was forced to marry?  

[Umbelina]

20 minutes ago, greekmom said:

Could it be she's an Econowife or a young wife that was forced to marry?  

I doubt an "econowife" would be called a "wife."  Also, the show has barely mentioned them.

Other than that?  Who knows?

Edited August 21, 2019 by Umbelina

[secnarf]

I believe the person in the red cloak in the photo above is a girl wearing a handmaid cloak for warmth - you can see her as she gets off the plane.

[Token]

WTF... this show is going to kill me.  How did so many of those people stay behind when they had the chance to escape?  Do none of them have any brains?  You’re going to end up on the wall or in the colonies.  You should have escaped when you had the chance.  I can’t even.  I don’t even care anymore.  These people are too stupid to save anymore.

[Token]

And, as usual, it’s partly June’s fault that those handmaids were left behind.  If she had a plan to fake fall & use the gun the whole time, she didn’t need to run that far and get shot for real.  She could have fallen much sooner and then shot the guard.  Then everyone could have escaped on the plane.  Once again, June’s stupidity rears it’s ugly head.

[Trillian]

12 hours ago, secnarf said:

Far. Nowhere near downtown. Technically, it's not even in the city of Toronto - it's in Mississauga, about 25-30 min to downtown.

It’s rather a relative term, though, is t it?  I almost posted “not far, only about 25-30 minutes”. 🙂.  And that’s only if they landed at Pearson. They could’ve gone to Billy Bishop (quick hop to downtown).  If I were deciding where the plane landed, I’d have sent it to a military base, maybe CFB Trenton, where any danger could be contained (our intrepid heroes have never heard of the Trojan Horse, apparently). If it had to be Toronto for some unknown reason, I’d pick Downsview (former military airport, now leased by Bombardier for testing) within Toronto.  That’s 10-15 minutes from Emily’s house, assuming the house is near Dufferin station where she met Sylvia. 

I have no idea why I’m talking about this as if it made any sense at all.  They either knew there were refugees or they didn’t. If they didn’t, the first people on the plane should have been armed border guards and/other police. If they did, the first people should’ve have medical personnel accompanied by police. In fact, they shouldn’t have gotten on the plane at all, but made the occupants come out one by one with their hands up. Like so much about this show, poignant scenes only remain poignant if you don’t stop to think about how absurd they are. 

[Umbelina]

Very interesting about the airports @Trillian!  I love your posts about Canada, law, all of it.  We may not agree about everything, but you add so much great information.

I keep wondering if the pilot is military or at least "secret" because obviously Canada would notice that giant plane, and the plane was used to smuggle stuff to that guy operating out of Jezebels, right?  Unless some trade agreement was actually made and I missed it.

Anyway, my point is that it's very possible "Canada" knew exactly what was on that plane, at least after the plane entered their airspace and was safe(r) from retaliation by Gilead.  That would be only a couple of minutes though, so if I follow that logic line?  It's certainly possible that information had not yet been shared with the refugees, Moira and the rest.

I don't know why anyone would have to come out with their hands up though, obviously if Gilead wanted to bomb them or shoot them (Canadians) they could easily do that anytime with a drone or an attack.  Why on earth would Gilead send their children to do that, or send them willingly for any reason at all?

(there may be a reason, but I can't think of it.)

[CouchPotatoNoLife]

On 8/21/2019 at 6:29 AM, chaifan said:

I'm not a Serena apologist in any way, but from what we saw in the one episode when she was on her book tour, the views she espoused in her book and what Gilead ended up becoming are very, very different.  I don't believe, and I don't think it was ever established, that Serena ever advocated for taking away women's legal rights to a) have bank accounts, b) have jobs, c) drive, or d) participate in any meaningful way in society other than wife and mother.  None of these are antithetical to Serena's view of "traditional" roles, and they are not mutually exclusive ideals.

Comments have been made that Serena was one of the "architects" of Gilead or responsible for the gov't overthrow.  Can someone point me to where this was established, because I don't recall seeing that in the show. 

I think Serena is evil enough just for what we actually know about her that we don't need to create new offenses that she really didn't do.

You have to connect the dots a little but I tend to think the reason Fred is a commander is because of Serena.

That scene is of Serena giving a speech and being protested against. Judging by how they react to Serena you have to imagine some of the things she was advocating for were controversial.

I've seen nothing in the series to indicate to me why Fred is a commander other than his wife being famous for advocating for a Gilead approved lifestyle before Gilead.

I think it's a bigger jump in logic to assume Fred became a commander on his own merits.

At 0:53 the actor that plays Fred says Serena was instrumental in the architecture of Gilead

Another point is that Serena still assumed she would be able to participate in policy decisions in Gilead. To me this indicates that she had some influence beforehand. She seemed surprised that they weren't going to allow her to participate in Gilead's leadership.

At a minimum Serena was aware of the plan to attack Congress and she celebrated once she heard the attack had begun.

Serena was the target of assassins not Fred. Serena was the star Fred was only her manager. I don't really see how Fred would have been a commander without Serena.

Also after the establishment of Gilead Serena speaks fondly of the attacks and violence used to establish Gilead. In one scene Rita reveals that her son died in the wars. Serena thanks Rita for her sacrifice assuming that her son died fighting for Gilead. But judging by Rita's face I think the audience is supposed to assume Rita son died fighting against Gilead. Serena describes Nick as a crusader for Gilead. Up until Gilead turned against her she was all for it.

Edited August 23, 2019 by CouchPotatoNoLife

[CouchPotatoNoLife]

On 8/21/2019 at 6:29 AM, chaifan said:

I don't believe, and I don't think it was ever established, that Serena ever advocated for taking away women's legal rights to a) have bank accounts, b) have jobs, c) drive, or d) participate in any meaningful way in society other than wife and mother.  None of these are antithetical to Serena's view of "traditional" roles, and they are not mutually exclusive ideals.

I mean it depends on how you define traditional, but there was a time when the vast majority of women had no roles other than mother or wife.

Property rights for women were non-existent about a century and a half ago in many parts of the world.

Also women having less legal authority/standing than men was common in most parts of the world at one time.

We don't know what Serena was advocating for specifically because in the one flashback the people against her were so vitriolic that they stopped her from even speaking. Although that probably indicates she wasn't just advocating for extremely benign two-parent households. The anger Serena instilled in her opposition, to me indicates that Serena was advocating for some extremely controversial positions. Perhaps including women not being allowed financial freedom away from their husbands. Serena and instilled enough hatred that they attempted to assassinate her.

[CouchPotatoNoLife]

On 8/20/2019 at 6:43 PM, BellyLaughter said:

You know it still blows my mind after all these episodes that the founders of Gilead blew up congress and pretty much eliminated the leadership of the United States of America and basically imprisoned a country of people to sexual slavery et al and the rest of the world seemed to be tolerating it and shrugging it's shoulders.....

The scene where Serena was being arrested and she referred to rape as some sort of state sanctioned religious ceremony .... 

It's absolute madness that it's only now that the world seems to be waking up to itself..... or did I miss something??

simply destroying Congress and the White House wouldn't put you in control of the American Northeast. the United States has a massive military including hundreds of thousands of personnel overseas. The only way gilead could exist after attacking Congress is if it had significant amounts of support from within the former US military.

This probably means gilead has access to thousands of nuclear warheads and advanced missiles to deploy them.

I could see why other nations would want to avoid confrontation with Gilead

[Dobian]

I just knew June was going to go Rambo this episode.  All she needed was a headband and some eye black.

So I guess this is how the opening conversation of next season is going to go..."Missing kids?  What missing kids?"

[txhorns79]

1 hour ago, Dobian said:

So I guess this is how the opening conversation of next season is going to go..."Missing kids?  What missing kids?"

I wouldn't be shocked if Gilead claimed the entire thing was staged by Canada to embarrass Gilead.  After Fred and Serena were expelled by the country last season, then arrested and held in Canada this season, I presume the two countries have poor diplomatic relations, at best.  

On 8/23/2019 at 12:24 AM, CouchPotatoNoLife said:

Another point is that Serena still assumed she would be able to participate in policy decisions in Gilead. To me this indicates that she had some influence beforehand. She seemed surprised that they weren't going to allow her to participate in Gilead's leadership.

True.  After the government was taken down, they showed Serena waiting outside the meeting room with note cards, completely prepared to discuss whatever her agenda was.  I honestly can't imagine she would have knowingly supported a reality where she was not allowed a role in anything other than deciding which flowers best suited her garden.  That doesn't mean she isn't complicit, only that there are things I don't think she was always on board with doing.       

Edited August 24, 2019 by txhorns79

[Ceindreadh]

On 8/22/2019 at 2:48 AM, Token said:

And, as usual, it’s partly June’s fault that those handmaids were left behind.  If she had a plan to fake fall & use the gun the whole time, she didn’t need to run that far and get shot for real.  She could have fallen much sooner and then shot the guard.  Then everyone could have escaped on the plane.  Once again, June’s stupidity rears it’s ugly head.

Yeah, I really hated the scene where June dragged those women off the plane and refused to let them escape...except for the part where all of those women made their own decision to help June.  Each of them decided individually that helping June distract the guards would improve the odds for the children to get on the plane without being spotted. 

There's a lot to be said for flaws in June's plan, but she is not to blame for anybody else making up their own minds to help her. 

[Dobian]

On 8/21/2019 at 1:59 PM, Baltimore Betty said:

I was wondering...if Aunt Lydia is the person in charge of the Handmaids then who is in charge of the Martha's?

Martha Stewart?

[watch2much]

 Just binged watched the whole season over about three days. My goodness most of the time it was like watching paint dry. I thought it was going to get interesting when she saved the five women to be Martha’s and she rattled off what they were  by way of occupations I thought maybe it would get interesting then because we’d see how the underground worked. I wish American series would do things like the British often do you like Luther was a four episodes season.   Why they dragged this out for 13 episodes is beyond me. I concur with everyone else about the close-ups of June ad nauseum.  

[dleighg]

6 hours ago, watch2much said:

Just binged watched the whole season over about three days. My goodness most of the time it was like watching paint dry.

I watched the first episode a few weeks late. Was bored. Came here and learned that many early episodes were thought to be boring. I asked where I should jump back in. Was told the "Washington DC" episode was not bad. Watched that, felt caught up. Then kept reading that people thought the episodes were boring. I waited, and then watched the last three episodes (I think that's starting with Liars). Was reasonably entertained. DID NOT FEEL LIKE I MISSED ANYTHING (except to be honest, for the rescue of 5 women "in Chicago.")

[Kel Varnsen]

On 8/15/2019 at 3:38 PM, chaifan said:

I do love how someone pointed out above all the food/water they were packing away for a <5 mile hike & hour long plane ride! 

Would it be an hour long plane ride? I am thinking much longer since you wouldn't want to fly directly from Boston to Toronto since that would mean flying over a lot of Gilead airspace. If they have any kind of airforce left it would probably be a bad idea. Probably bettwr to fly towards international waters the towards Canada. The  again if you did that there would be a number of a lot better places to land than Toronto.

[weightyghost]

2 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Would it be an hour long plane ride? I am thinking much longer since you wouldn't want to fly directly from Boston to Toronto since that would mean flying over a lot of Gilead airspace. If they have any kind of airforce left it would probably be a bad idea. Probably bettwr to fly towards international waters the towards Canada. The  again if you did that there would be a number of a lot better places to land than Toronto.

They landed when it was still dark and with them leaving the house after midnight, it would be a six hour trip max... unless they did go out to the water and it was a nearly 24 hour trip for them to land in the dark again.

[Dobian]

It's not far from Boston to the Canadian border.  Instead of flying to Toronto directly, you head straight north, just east of Montreal, then once you're in Canadian airspace you can head southwest to Toronto.

[Umbelina]

Most of the kids seemed to be eating their snacks in the house anyway.  I can see preparing food and snacks and water...what I don't understand is where in hell they got the backpacks or why they would even be needed.

I think they were mostly "just in case" things went wrong, but still?  Where did they find them, and wouldn't gathering those have been suspicious?

[Kel Varnsen]

Thinking about the finale more, one thing I found weird was how relatively easy it was getting those kids out. Which makes me wonder, if it was that easy, why isn't shit like this happening all the time. I mean they even made a point of saying how one of the Marthas killed the commander and his wife to keep them from stopping her.

[Dobian]

1 hour ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Thinking about the finale more, one thing I found weird was how relatively easy it was getting those kids out. Which makes me wonder, if it was that easy, why isn't shit like this happening all the time. I mean they even made a point of saying how one of the Marthas killed the commander and his wife to keep them from stopping her.

It's a trap a lot of shows fall into.  In the first season, Gilead was all-powerful and the handmaids were totally powerless.  Then by the end of season 2, the seeds of rebellion were planted, which was okay.  But this season, you have June calling the shots at her Commander's house.  Aunt Lydia is telling June to try not to be too subversive when in past seasons she would have been cattle prodding the shit out of her.  Gilead's police force had the whole city under lockdown before and now are easily eluded by dozens of women and children running around in the night.

[CouchPotatoNoLife]

10 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Would it be an hour long plane ride? I am thinking much longer since you wouldn't want to fly directly from Boston to Toronto since that would mean flying over a lot of Gilead airspace. If they have any kind of airforce left it would probably be a bad idea. Probably bettwr to fly towards international waters the towards Canada. The  again if you did that there would be a number of a lot better places to land than Toronto.

The show doesnt really make sense if you think about it.

Remember how easy the american agent lured fred into canada? He went back and forth across the border with zero problems. he even lured fred. This indicates the border is almost undefended.

Given how cruel Gilead is, you would then assume that there would be millions of refugees trying to reach canada. The only reason that a country like north korea isnt totally abandoned is because they so strongly guard the border to prevent people from escaping. America also has about 10x the population of canada so the refugee crisis would be completely overwhelming to canadian institutions.

[Kel Varnsen]

6 hours ago, Dobian said:

 Gilead's police force had the whole city under lockdown before and now are easily eluded by dozens of women and children running around in the night.

I really wonder how Gileas manages their security/police forces. I mean I live in a major city and  just thinking about those scenes where June goes grocery shopping there are more security guys in that one store then all the cops and security guards I see on an average day. 

2 hours ago, CouchPotatoNoLife said:

 America also has about 10x the population of canada so the refugee crisis would be completely overwhelming to canadian institutions.

I am not sure it is that simple. The real Canada has a really low natural population growth rate now. I read an article that stated that in 20 years it could be close to 0. Now consider how much lower fertility rates are on the show. Plus you have to imagine that with the political instability of Gilead not to many people from other countries would be moving to Canada. So the country would by pretty much dying for immigrants, especially ones who are adults that already speak one of the official languages and know the basics of the culture, just to keep the economy from falling apart.

[Baltimore Betty]

12 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

The real Canada has a really low natural population growth rate now.

Fun Fact: There are more Barbie Dolls than Canadians.

[RachelKM]

This fucking show.  The lack of tension all season really hit home for me in this episode.  I actually had to force my attention away from expecting Rolf to appear in the woods with a whistle.

I don't think about Luke all that much.  But my heart broke for him a bit as he stared at the empty plane doorway.

But then the handmaids were carrying June like Jesus on the cross and I snapped out of it. 

I get that the show is over once June is out of Gilead and that not leaving without Hannah is her sworn rule.  But exactly how many seasons will end with June declining to escape? Do they have to put her within reach of it everytime? 

Whatever.  At least Serena was arrested.  "It's still rape," was almost worth it.

[BrooklynRat]

Just binged this in 3 days.  Total wreck of what started as arguably the most thought-provoking show out there.  If the writers' goal was that at the end I would be mostly bored by a totally improbable escape and practically praying for the demise of the show's star (whose character I've come to despise), then well done, show.  Only 2 highlights of this entire episode: Serena being arrested and the few nanoseconds, I hoped the show would do something shocking and June's limp body would turn out to be dead.  I could totally get on board for a June-less Season 4--otherwise, count me out.  What a steaming pile of shit this entire season was. 

I mean, the entire conceit of June's master plan is so basically flawed: why would children be excited and willing to leave the only home they know, love, and remember?

Who has ever kept 52 children under the age of 13 silently cooperative for hours at a time, much less stumbling around in the dark, tired and probably cranky?

Why wasn't there a complete shut-down of Gilead as wives became aware children have been missing for hours?

As with the rest of the Season 3, where the fuck are Commander Lawrence's guards?  

What power does gun-toting June really have?  She can't really discharge that weapon anywhere in the house without inviting the attention of neighbors (or Lawrence's fucking MIA guards).  

Why does Lawrence give in when he says he wants the whole thing put on hold?  Because June said no in a really creepy voice?  Why does that scare him into submission?

Canadians apparently know all about the plane's arriving stowaway but Gilead has no clue?  All the hours this season wasted on long, slow close-ups of June's face could have been better spent actually developing stories that helped the plot make any fucking sense at all and show us how any of these things make any sense.

Why have the little girl that was reunited with her father, state clearly 15 minutes before the reunion scene that she has no memory of life before Gilead?  It's like a workshop in terrible writing.

I'm almost finished with Atwood's follow-up book in less than 3 days.  These half-wits responsible for Season 3, really should have just waited for the actual writer in the room to show them how to develop a plausible and engaging continuation of the original story.  Season 3 has been such a disservice to a compelling and politically relevant thought experiment that will now be more remembered as this cut-rate-dystopian-Lifetime-movie-sopa-opera.

Edited October 2, 2019 by BrooklynRat
More to complain about

[BrindaWalsh]

Quote

I mean, the entire conceit of June's master plan is so basically flawed: why would children be excited and willing to leave the only home they know, love, and remember?

Who has ever kept 52 children under the age of 13 silently cooperative for hours at a time, much less stumbling around in the dark, tired and probably cranky?

Agree, but I can suspend a bit of reality in this case to say that I think the children of Gilead have been terrorized into being completely obedient.  Somebody says quiet, you be quiet.  Somebody says run, you run.  Somebody says pray, you pray.  Don't put a toe out of line.  Otherwise, you may find a body swinging from your chandelier or some such thing.

Quote

Why have the little girl that was reunited with her father, state clearly 15 minutes before the reunion scene that she has no memory of life before Gilead?  It's like a workshop in terrible writing.

Again, I can get behind this one as according to the Gilead law, there is no before.  You don't talk about it.  Period.  The little girl didn't know who June was, just that she was asking about the time before that the girl has been trained/terrorized into stating she has no memory of because it didn't exist.  

Now - the rest of the show doesn't adhere to that.  But the kids probably would under the current regime.  

AND...That's all I've got.  

[lucindabelle]

I can believe the little girl has suppressed her memories until she SAW her dad. Then it would be like waking from a dream.

its true that in much of history women did not have bank accounts or many rights. And yet, it was never gilead. Some women always worked: housemaids, cooks, dairy maids, nurses... widows owned property. And so on. Women talked back to husbands who certainly had no right to mutilate them.

it’s puzzling in a way that Serena wojld ever have wanted a seeming Saudi existence. 

[AngelaHunter]

On 10/31/2019 at 11:32 PM, lucindabelle said:

it’s puzzling in a way that Serena wojld ever have wanted a seeming Saudi existence. 

Maybe it didn't look that way on paper, or even start that way? Maybe it was akin to the way the Nazis would operate initially when taking over. Occupation began as a seemingly benevolent rule and people would say, "Well, this isn't so bad" and gradually the rule would become more and more oppressive, one thing at a time, so each freedom taken away wouldn't cause instant, mass rebellion.

[uninvolved]

On 8/14/2019 at 3:11 PM, chocolatine said:

Too much suspension of disbelief required for the rescue plot. There's a random Martha and child popping up in Lawrence's front yard in broad daylight and June waves a gun at them, but nobody notices? Every commander's house is supposed to have one or more guards, but all the Marthas managed to get out with sleepy, disoriented kids in tow? And there were multiple patrol cars during the walk through the woods, but only one to guard the plane?

But I'm willing to forgive all of that, because SERENA IS FINALLY GETTING WHAT SHE DESERVES!!! Praise be!

Well considering none of this was actually included in the book, someone has been reading between the lines. Guess you have to read between the lines ....that is of course if you are allowed to read ;)

My recommendation is to read the book...if you can still find a copy that hasn't been burned that is ;)  I will add this however. Unless any of you have ever been unfortunate enough to have been associated with a religion/belief system/ideology/cult/patriarchy or group that that is very internally secretive, then this book will not have the same deep impact on you as it has had to some of us that have read it.

[uninvolved]

Artistic license is obviously being taken with the TV series. My recommendation, (for those who have not done so yet) is to either read the actual book or listen to the audio book read by Claire Danes.

The ending in the book answered so many thoughts I had throughout seasons 1 to 3 of the series. But if you don't wish to read the book, I hope in season 4 the writers adopt the same ending as the book because to date so many liberties have been taken, so much reading between the lines so to speak. Just my opinion.

In the mean time lets all hope fascist types never become a predominant power in the world..but I guess that's up to us, even when they are disguised as somewhat "legitimate" faiths/cults/religions/ or even cultures. Hatred is hatred, no matter what color you place on it or however one tries to camouflage the true intent. Power corrupts, ultimate power, corrupts ultimately.

[uninvolved]

On 8/22/2019 at 9:14 AM, Umbelina said:

I noticed the red cloak when I lightened the screen caps, so maybe at least one handmaid got out.  You can't look in the "Hey Bruce Miller!" thread for them.  

My question is WHY a "wife" when so many Marthas and Handmaids were left behind?  Maybe the wife's been part of Mayday all along though...

I think the wife was seen in the forest.

Oh well, here it is:

I think they are just children with the colored cloaks given to them by some of the handmaids or Marthas, (notice the pink cap on the one with the red cloak)

from memory of the final scenes, no handmaids went on the airplane because they went back to help OfFred, with the diversion.

Edited November 3, 2019 by uninvolved

[scowl]

On 8/15/2019 at 7:16 AM, mamadrama said:

Honestly, I didn't get all the soapy window stuff. They weren't getting there until after sunset...close the curtains.

Also windows don't get soapy by themselves. They get soapy because someone doesn't want you to see inside. Not that these dopey Guardians think that hard.

So I guess season four will start with fifty or so Marthas hanging from nooses. Just kidding! We know June's plan worked perfectly and the Commanders will be scratching their heads trying to figure out how fifty plus kids walked to the airport by themselves. If this were a Soviet-style dictatorship, they would beat confessions out of people who had been in jail the whole time and then pretend it never happened.

[Lukeysboat]

On 8/21/2019 at 7:14 PM, Umbelina said:

My question is WHY a "wife" when so many Marthas and Handmaids were left behind?  Maybe the wife's been part of Mayday all along though

Eleanor Lawrence was supposed to be on the plane to seek treatment for her mental health. Perhaps the wife that made it out also had a similar need not able to be met in Gilead. 

[smartymarty]

Quote

I've seen nothing in the series to indicate to me why Fred is a commander other than his wife being famous for advocating for a Gilead approved lifestyle before Gilead.

Fred said in a scene with Serena when they were daydreaming about going back to the before time (scene in the woods before she betrays him the next day?) that she was an author, he just sold insurance.
 

On 8/25/2019 at 12:26 PM, Umbelina said:

Most of the kids seemed to be eating their snacks in the house anyway. 

Trivial thing that bothered me about the snacks: they cut the apples up. Those slices would be brown within half an hour unless they poured lemon juice over them, which I doubt they had/did. Ridiculous that they pre-sliced the apples.

On 11/3/2019 at 4:42 AM, uninvolved said:

I hope in season 4 the writers adopt the same ending as the book

I see that a season 5 has been green-lighted. So expect much of the same as 3 for season 4.

I also did not understand why the Americans were giving Serena access to Nichole, knowing that the baby wasn't even biologically her husband's and that June and Nick did not consent to any adoption. If they hadn't arrested Serena, was the end-game to be to give her Nichole? That makes no sense and made me angry in every scene of her with the baby.

When a child asks "So what will I be," you answer immediately and confidently "You." You don't wait 10 freaking pregnant pause seconds to to answer. Same with "what can I wear?" It's not like those freedoms are not exactly why you are staging this escape that very day.

In the beginning flashback, though admittedly I've never had my child taken from me, but are we really expected to believe that June, being herded about with other women by machine gun-toting guards, seeing disabled women brutalized, believed that she though was an extra-special prisoner because they took her child from her? That the guard she talked to was going to pull her out because "oh, that was probably a mistake, we'll take you to your daughter and release you post haste"? Really, the writers just insult us over and over.

Edited December 18, 2020 by smartymarty

[HC87]

Just binge-watched this season with the free Hulu deal this weekend. I'll nevah get those 13 hours of my life back....what a mess this show has become. Can't believe there's a Season 4 out there now. 

[bannana]

On 2/19/2020 at 5:44 PM, scowl said:

So I guess season four will start with fifty or so Marthas hanging from nooses. Just kidding! We know June's plan worked perfectly and the Commanders will be scratching their heads trying to figure out how fifty plus kids walked to the airport by themselves. If this were a Soviet-style dictatorship, they would beat confessions out of people who had been in jail the whole time and then pretend it never happened.

As flawed and implausible as this entire scheme was, this is the thing that made absolutely no sense. Unless they intended for all the Marthas to escape, of course the ones that remained would be tortured and killed.  So why would those Marthas cooperate and what was the plan for their survival?

[EllaWycliffe]

2 minutes ago, bannana said:

As flawed and implausible as this entire scheme was, this is the thing that made absolutely no sense. Unless they intended for all the Marthas to escape, of course the ones that remained would be tortured and killed.  So why would those Marthas cooperate and what was the plan for their survival?

I think more Marthas intended to go on the flight?

I mean, isn't it a bit weird that we've seen absolutely NOTHING concerning this from Gilead's perspective? No crying hysterical parents on tv begging for their children's return, no rows of dead Marthas, no real mention at all. 

[paramitch]

I loved this finale and found it really strong on multiple fronts.

(Yes! My table has lots of room! We have plenty of space for our appetizers, too!)

The opening flashback to just after June's immediate capture was sickening and brought back very vivid thoughts of the Holocaust. Just masterful direction, lighting, chaos and visceral fear. The guards calling them "bitches" (already relishing the new world), the women alternately begging and stoic. Terrific TV.

And I loved the ratcheting tension, as well as the horrible ways we see June is evolving (her almost shooting the little girl was horrifying).

I loved that we see Lawrence abet all of this, enable June, and yet also he (and she, and we)  still knows he is damned no matter what for what he did.

I loved the forest trail by the handmaids, the ripping of the sheets to show the way (so symbolic), the ways the handmaids diverted the sentinels so the escapees could get away. Loved June thanking the sentinel then shooting him.

Yes, the final ending was contrived, with Moira and my darling Emily and Luke all there to see the 80+ kids delivered, but it was also so emotional I don't care. I loved seeing Rita reach safety, and hug Luke. Loved seeing the little girl find her father.

Edited November 18, 2022 by paramitch

[crashdown]

On 11/18/2022 at 9:54 AM, paramitch said:

I loved that we see Lawrence abet all of this, enable June, and yet also he (and she, and we)  still knows he is damned no matter what for what he did.

One other thing that I loved in this episode was the small Lawrence/June moment at the end, right before June started off with the kids. She and Lawrence called each other by their first names: June said something like "May God grant you peace, Joseph," and he answers, "And you, June Osborne." It was really a beautiful moment, in which they both acknowledged their mutual affection and respect. (And, of course, seeing Lawrence reading Treasure Island to kids that he insists he dislikes was adorable!) I'll be a Lawrence fan until he proves me wrong, and even then I'll leave kicking and screaming.

[paramitch]

12 hours ago, crashdown said:

One other thing that I loved in this episode was the small Lawrence/June moment at the end, right before June started off with the kids. She and Lawrence called each other by their first names: June said something like "May God grant you peace, Joseph," and he answers, "And you, June Osborne." It was really a beautiful moment, in which they both acknowledged their mutual affection and respect. (And, of course, seeing Lawrence reading Treasure Island to kids that he insists he dislikes was adorable!) I'll be a Lawrence fan until he proves me wrong, and even then I'll leave kicking and screaming.

I loved that too. The use of a woman's real name is so powerful here, so his using not just her name, but her full name, really moved me.

I love Bradley Whitford in this role, and how unpredictable he is. He's a textbook example of chaotic neutral; we never know what he'll do.

[crashdown]

6 hours ago, paramitch said:

I loved that too. The use of a woman's real name is so powerful here, so his using not just her name, but her full name, really moved me.

What makes it even more powerful is the fact that June was the one to initiate the first name usage, not Lawrence. I liked seeing her take some of her self-ownership back with that little move.