S03.E04: God Bless the Child

[Violetgoblin6]

On 6/12/2019 at 1:05 AM, Brn2bwild said:

"This is awkward."

Yes, seeing the wife who was forced to stay behind in Gilead as a sex slave, who had sex parts removed, and who spent months slowly dying in a toxic wasteland, yet somehow finally managed to miraculously escape after all these years, is awkward.

I get that this was never going to be a super happy reunion situation, but it seems like the wife could at least acknowledge the hell Emily has been though instead of acting as though she was seeing her again for the first time after a bad breakup.

Ugh. Sylvia made me so angry. I actually felt resentment while putting myself in Emily's shoes. 

Sylvia seemed so cold. I did appreciate that she asked if Emily was okay and if she needed anything while out on the porch. I admit, I cried in a puddle while Emily read her son a story and he took over. 

What's up with Aunt Lydia? 

As always deeply enjoy the commentary here. So many great thoughts and insight. 

Edit: after reading the thread I see what they're doing with Sylvia and Emily.

Edited June 13, 2019 by Violetgoblin6

[madpsych78]

I mean, Aunt Lydia has always been harsh, but is it possible that she's gotten...even harsher since the stabbing incident?

[Violetgoblin6]

22 hours ago, AgentRXS said:

This show has jumped the shark. While the other handmaids are forced to follow the strict rules of Gilead, June gets to act like she runs the show. She gets to have private conversations with Wives and Commanders (she even gets to have a cig break with one), she can order an Aunt to stop the brutality, she can hang back and eavesdrop on Commander conversations, and now her husband has been found with her baby, and its all okie-dokie. But other Handmaids have died just for looking at an Aunt the wrong way.

I am so over this shit. I'll be watching for Emily, but I've really had enough of June, the most specialist snowflake of all of Gilead.

Yes, my exact thoughts! 

June was totally acting like she ran the place. She just walked breezily away after being questioned by the Eye about Luke and Nichole. And they let her. 

[Lemons]

15 hours ago, Poohbear617 said:

I was really annoyed by the not hating Fred comment. I then watched the 2 minute Inside the S3E4 extra. The producer or director said that that line is in the book. They have all had trouble believing it but because it was in the book they decided to put it in . 

I can actually see it.   Abused people don’t always hate their abusers. 

The stupidest part of the whole episode is when June admitted her husband had the baby and they didn’t take her into custody right away.   They are evil, not stupid. June obviously helped the child escape to her husband. 

[Lemons]

37 minutes ago, madpsych78 said:

I mean, Aunt Lydia has always been harsh, but is it possible that she's gotten...even harsher since the stabbing incident?

Yes!  I think her sobbing at the end showed that she realized she’s not in control of herself.  She did suffer a traumatic attack and she’s taking it out on anybody available. 

[alexvillage]

4 hours ago, Lemons said:

Yes!  I think her sobbing at the end showed that she realized she’s not in control of herself.  She did suffer a traumatic attack and she’s taking it out on anybody available.

I guess there are several points that could be developed into a good story but get lost in the writer's mess. Aunt Lydia could be having PTSD and her reactions could be the frustration she feels, maybe some guilty for training handmaids to be raped. Something could be developed from there but will probably be forgotten after the next slow motion long walk.

[Baltimore Betty]

5 hours ago, Violetgoblin6 said:

Emily read her son a story

Considering how long it has been since Emily was allowed to read I thought this was especially touching, like it is a reminder how free she is.  How long till she and her wife argue about some everyday thing like not replacing the toilet paper or one of them forgot to pick up milk...that is how you know you are home, lol.  

[deerstalker]

I think Luke deliberately exposed himself and baby Nichole, in the hope that word would trickle to June that the baby is safe with him, and loved. 

I’m not sure that the baby ending up with Luke really implicates June. They “know” that Emily kidnapped the baby, and that Emily knows June. Once she escaped to Canada, why wouldn’t the baby eventually find its way to June’s husband? June’s knowledge or help is not needed for that to occur. 

[Helena Dax]

I liked it, more or less. If there's something June has been trying to do for a while is establishing "real" relationships with the people around her. At the beginning, Serena didn't see June as a real person; when she started to do so, there was still some hot and cold moments, but now Serena is simply unable to see June as nothing but June, almost an equal. June's getting there with Fred too and she's trying with Aunt Lydia. Ironically, I think it might be one of the best ways to destroy Gilead: look at the horror in the Wifes' faces.

Also, when she tried to protect Janine, it was instinctive: sometimes happens, just as the handmaids weren't able to stone Janine back in season one. 

[BellyLaughter]

16 hours ago, DiabLOL said:

How stupid is Luke to show up on TV with a "stolen" baby especially with June still in the colonies and Emily running away. Like there won't be any connection to June with all that let alone the WTF of June straight up admitting to knowing him?!?

 Seems like a completely insane, infuriating way to get Nichole back to Gilead thereby extending June’s stay as well .... yippee 🙄

Canada’s gonna cooperate, isn’t it?? 

[BrindaWalsh]

2 hours ago, BellyLaughter said:

 Seems like a completely insane, infuriating way to get Nichole back to Gilead thereby extending June’s stay as well .... yippee 🙄

Canada’s gonna cooperate, isn’t it?? 

Probably.  According to the book, Canada was hesitant to do anything to anger it's nuclear hefty neighbor to the south.

I think what I find so bizarre about June right now - or perhaps it is how Moss is playing her - is that she suddenly seems like a caricature.  In season 1, June had a lot of layers.  Now, she is simply played as defiant and aggressive.  Which is really stupid of her. I don't believe for a second that the same June of season 1 would just wander around the Putnam household smoking a cigarette here, playing marriage counselor there, encouraging rebellion everywhere.  To play June as so one-sided... it becomes boring.  If the show insists on giving us these long close-ups of "June-defiance," then give us other complexities as well (i.e. Emily seeing her wife for the first time).  

Not to mention I dont believe that the Putnams would have opened their home to all of Gilead either.  We are officially in plot driving the character territory and it REALLY doesn't work in a place like Gilead.

That said, I totally laughed out loud about June's mom choosing a vegan restaurant and June saying "but she isn't even vegan!"

[Dakisela]

6 hours ago, alexvillage said:

I guess there are several points that could be developed into a good story but get lost in the writer's mess. Aunt Lydia could be having PTSD and her reactions could be the frustration she feels, maybe some guilty for training handmaids to be raped. Something could be developed from there but will probably be forgotten after the next slow motion long walk.

And was it just me or did Aunt Lydia totally expect to be invited into the drawing room only to be directed to the back with the others?

[Umbelina]

2 hours ago, BrindaWalsh said:

Probably.  According to the book, Canada was hesitant to do anything to anger it's nuclear hefty neighbor to the south.

Part of me seriously hates this idea of a story, and part of me thinks, "If done really WELL, this could be so good."  The problem is, I've kind of lost faith in the writers, this season has been better (to me) but last season stumbled quite a bit. 

I loved the Canada/Gilead interactions though, and it could be a window into the world view (not just former or current Gilead people) which I welcome. 

Canada, in the end though?  Is caring for the refugees, and know what Nicole would face is she returns to that oppressed nightmare of a country.  They may compromise a bit, offer a visit by Serena or something, but I think they would ensure Luke and Nicole get safely to another country, before giving her back.

Sigh, it COULD be done so well!  I'm going to hold out hope.  I've been wanting more world/Gilead interaction for a long time.

2 hours ago, BrindaWalsh said:

I think what I find so bizarre about June right now - or perhaps it is how Moss is playing her - is that she suddenly seems like a caricature.  In season 1, June had a lot of layers.  Now, she is simply played as defiant and aggressive.  Which is really stupid of her. I don't believe for a second that the same June of season 1 would just wander around the Putnam household smoking a cigarette here, playing marriage counselor there, encouraging rebellion everywhere.  To play June as so one-sided... it becomes boring.  If the show insists on giving us these long close-ups of "June-defiance," then give us other complexities as well (i.e. Emily seeing her wife for the first time).  

I'm having the opposite feelings.  I was annoyed last season, although I did just rewatch the show from the beginning, and it was much better (for me) on rewatch than it was the first time, with some glaring exceptions such as "How the HELL did Nick get out of that mess, what happened after he was captured, ditto Fred arranging that visit!"  The entire cast has plot armor. 

On rewatch, June's story made more sense than theirs, she was being punished by Lydia, BUT, Lawrence, far more powerful than most, decided to rescue her for whatever reasons.  The fact that she was pregnant during most of last season protected her, and the fact that she was able to have a non-shredder baby, much like Janine?  Keeps her very valuable to TPTB. 

This season though, I am finally seeing a real change in June, she isn't just passively sitting around hoping others will arrange her rescue.  This season she is putting the pieces in place for her own rescue, and more importantly for June?  For Hannah's. 

She is out there building relationships, taking significant risks, and she's making incremental progress.  She's earned some trust from the Martha rebels.  She's trying to figure out Lawrence and how to either work him, or at least survive him.  She is exploiting the various levels of relationships she has with each of the Wallingfords, and that paid off big time when Serena told her where Hannah probably goes to school.  It's like building a puzzle, one piece at a time, until it's completed.  Only each piece could kill you.

2 hours ago, BrindaWalsh said:

Not to mention I dont believe that the Putnams would have opened their home to all of Gilead either.  We are officially in plot driving the character territory and it REALLY doesn't work in a place like Gilead.

Inviting the handmaids was super odd.  I can definitely see them having a huge party though, since celebrating baby/child milestones is just about all they have there.

It was a clunky way to do it, but I'm glad those wives got a chance to see how the handmaids are treated, although you'd think having a handmaid without an eye might have been a clue.

2 hours ago, BrindaWalsh said:

That said, I totally laughed out loud about June's mom choosing a vegan restaurant and June saying "but she isn't even vegan!"

Yeah, that was cute.

12 hours ago, madpsych78 said:

I mean, Aunt Lydia has always been harsh, but is it possible that she's gotten...even harsher since the stabbing incident?

Aunt Lydia is a stone cold torturer who enjoys her power.  She's psycho.  I don't really care what brought her to this, but I'm certain we will find out.  I think it will have something to do with her dead Godchild.  "It wasn't my fault the baby died!!!!"

6 hours ago, Baltimore Betty said:

Considering how long it has been since Emily was allowed to read I thought this was especially touching, like it is a reminder how free she is.  How long till she and her wife argue about some everyday thing like not replacing the toilet paper or one of them forgot to pick up milk...that is how you know you are home, lol.  

It was such a beautiful scene, all of the Emily scenes have been such a pleasure to watch, and so touching.  It's been so very real, and moving.

6 hours ago, deerstalker said:

I think Luke deliberately exposed himself and baby Nichole, in the hope that word would trickle to June that the baby is safe with him, and loved. 

I’m not sure that the baby ending up with Luke really implicates June. They “know” that Emily kidnapped the baby, and that Emily knows June. Once she escaped to Canada, why wouldn’t the baby eventually find its way to June’s husband? June’s knowledge or help is not needed for that to occur. 

Yeah, I agree with that second paragraph completely.

Luke is still a fucking idiot though, and it is another fairly clunky plot devise.

6 hours ago, Helena Dax said:

I liked it, more or less. If there's something June has been trying to do for a while is establishing "real" relationships with the people around her. At the beginning, Serena didn't see June as a real person; when she started to do so, there was still some hot and cold moments, but now Serena is simply unable to see June as nothing but June, almost an equal. June's getting there with Fred too and she's trying with Aunt Lydia. Ironically, I think it might be one of the best ways to destroy Gilead: look at the horror in the Wifes' faces.

Also, when she tried to protect Janine, it was instinctive: sometimes happens, just as the handmaids weren't able to stone Janine back in season one. 

I agree completely.  I really hope there is follow-through on all of that on the wives' sides, but it's probably too much to hope for that Aunt Lydia faces any repercussions.

5 hours ago, BellyLaughter said:

 Seems like a completely insane, infuriating way to get Nichole back to Gilead thereby extending June’s stay as well .... yippee 🙄

Canada’s gonna cooperate, isn’t it?? 

I think Canada will have to at least negotiate, but I seriously doubt they will allow Nicole to return to Gilead.  There would be a massive uproar about that, and who knows?  Maybe that is what the world needs to see to finally do more than boycott Gilead?

Edited June 13, 2019 by Umbelina

[alexvillage]

I don't like June season 2 and I don't like June season 3. I don't like Elizabeth Moss. I don't relate to beauty in a way TV and movies push on us. I find some people beautiful for some reasons, and not beautiful for others and I don't care if they are not beautiful or attractive, whatever that means. All this is just to say that I think EM has a great smile - not the smirk - but the open, happy smile. Those flashback scenes in the church even got me to warm up to her a little bit. 

[The Mighty Peanut]

How much input does Margaret Atwood have? I wish it was more, and that she'd shut down some of the bullshit.

I am very forgiving, perhaps overly so, of June, first of her name, the unburnt, breaker of chains blah blah blah. She can't narrate from a cell with her tongue cut out, and the show has put her through a lot of torture that people have already complained was too much. I think in some ways the writers are between a rock and a hard place trying to strike a balance between her defiance and her misery BUT THEY ALSO DO LAZY CRAP WRITING. The "it's not love" line in the book was basically June trying to reconcile why she felt a very small amount of empathy with Book Fred, who is horrible but much less explored than the rape hungry, amputating, perpetually cruel dumpster fire garbage monster we know and hate. It was a bad decision to put it in the show--just added to the throwaway filler. 

[Umbelina]

I wouldn't mind seeing Aunt Lydia living out her days in the "colonies" either picking crops, or cleaning nuclear waste.

[LuvizBlind]

Regarding June's reflection, I am not as angry at it as everyone else seems to be.  I took it completely differently.  I don't hate June or the actress who plays her, so perhaps that's partially why. 

Her words exactly were...  

"I ought to feel hatred for this man, but it isn't what I do feel.  I don't know what to call it.  It isn't love."

She's confused.  She's been through hell.  She's been abused by this system horribly.  But she's a survivor, and a Mother...   I certainly don't know what she feels either, but there's bound to be some psychology behind this.  And while I may not completely understand it, I'm hopeful it could simply be a means to an end.   I'm not ready to write the show off completely - yet.

[alexvillage]

21 minutes ago, LuvizBlind said:

Regarding June's reflection, I am not as angry at it as everyone else seems to be.  I took it completely differently.  I don't hate June or the actress who plays her, so perhaps that's partially why. 

Her words exactly were...  

"I ought to feel hatred for this man, but it isn't what I do feel.  I don't know what to call it.  It isn't love."

She's confused.  She's been through hell.  She's been abused by this system horribly.  But she's a survivor, and a Mother...   I certainly don't know what she feels either, but there's bound to be some psychology behind this.  And while I may not completely understand it, I'm hopeful it could simply be a means to an end.   I'm not ready to write the show off completely - yet.

I can read this and accept that she is confused/conflicted. Abuse is the worst, it messes up with feelings and reason. The problem I have with this being included in the show has more to do with the bad writing related to this; bad directing; bad acting by EM. Pick one, or all. It doesn't convince me in the context of what the episodes have shown and how the characters are being written.

She is confused when reflecting on her life, but she doesn't act confused or conflicted when chit-chatting with Fred. They should have left the reflection in the book.

[kittykat]

3 hours ago, Umbelina said:

I think Canada will have to at least negotiate, but I seriously doubt they will allow Nicole to return to Gilead.  There would be a massive uproar about that, and who knows?  Maybe that is what the world needs to see to finally do more than boycott Gilead?

I have definitely been wondering if knowing Nicole's location will create an international dispute.  Gilead demands the return of the baby but Canada won't budge possibly causing war threats.  It would be a way to bring Gilead's human rights violations to the world front but who knows.

A way to possibly alleviate this is have the baby and Fred submit to a paternity test.  If paternity doesn't rule in Fred's favor then Gilead has no case.  However it does put June and Nick in tremendous danger, she would be wall bound via Salvaging and the writers won't have that.  Which is why it would be interesting to have Fred end up being the father if that is route the writers take because then it takes international relations into a different level of negotiations and questions.

But this is all speculation and having faith in the writers to tell a cohesive story.  And considering we all went through this a month ago with GOT spirits aren't exactly high.

[Cranberry]

Hi guys! Quick reminder that we have a Things We Hate About The Handmaid's Tale thread -- if you're talking about your dislikes and they encompass more than just the events of a specific episode, take it over there.

Also, if you see a post you think is in the wrong place/breaking rules/whatever, report it and the mods will look into it. Thanks!

[The Mighty Peanut]

I forgot to mention this in an earlier post because I was too busy complaining about June/Gilead:

I love Emily to the point where it's weird. She is so terribly, horrifically hurt and it breaks my black heart. It's very sweet that Sylvia let Oliver know Em may not be ready to be touched...but I still want to give her all the hugs. To make it up to her somehow, even though I know she isn't real. I watched this show initially b/c I love Margaret Atwood...now I watch because I love Alexis Bledel. And Emily, dammit.

Edited June 13, 2019 by The Mighty Peanut

[Angry Moldovan]

Glad I found you guys! I watched this episode in complete disbelief for all of the reasons mentioned. I couldn’t believe that June in her bright Scarlett dress had the run of the house. The worst for me is when Fred dismissed everyone to the buffet apart from super June. Just once can we have June not scowl, cry or smirk 😏. I really thought I was the only one who thought with this episode they had jumped the shark, all my friends are still raving about how great it is.

Edited June 13, 2019 by Owww ma legs

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 6/12/2019 at 2:01 PM, LordOfLotion said:

 This man has a serious brain deficit. 

Luke goes into my most hated television characters.  Ironically, another one of them is Rory Gilmore!  And yet I love love love love love Emily and how Alexis Bledel is portraying her!

On 6/12/2019 at 5:49 PM, DuckyinKy said:

As if Luke's character needs an extra glass of haterade, he gets doused with it this week like he won the Superbowl. Honestly, what a douche move. His wife is still being held against her will in Gilead but he's dancing around "Baby's First Protest!" 

Luke:  She's just like her Mom!  Her Mom, who's name is June Banknote!  Who was captured by Gilead and was living with the Waterfords!  She stole this baby!  Then gave it to Emily, who escaped to Canada ----

Cameraperson:  Dude we don't need to know all this

I seem to be on a different page than everyone else.  I hate Aunt Lydia and don't care about her!  I fastfowarded her entire "This is my moment to cry alone" scene.  Boring.  

Something that really struck me this episode is that I never realized how SHORT Elisabeth Moss is next to Yvonne.  It was SHOCKING.  I felt bad for Elisabeth.  They make her look so horrible.  And Yvonne seems to have no flaws, it's really annoying.

Edited June 14, 2019 by Ms Blue Jay

[charmed1]

On 6/12/2019 at 8:01 PM, ferjy said:

Someone remind me, did we see a flashback to Aunt Lydia's life pre-Gilead in a previous season? I seem to remember  her in regular street clothes, but I might be mixing it up with Ann Dowd in The Leftovers.

It wasn’t necessarily a flashback, but we learned a little tidbit about Aunt Lydia having a nephew who died and she emphasized that his death was not her fault.

[ferjy]

1 minute ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Luke goes into my most hated television characters.  Ironically, another one of them is Rory Gilmore!  And yet I love love love love love Emily and how Alexis Bledel is portraying her!

I agree about Alexis Bledel. The Rory character was pretty one dimensional (as were a lot of characters in Gilmore Girls, it was more of a romp) but she's hitting it out of the ballpark in this role.

I dislike Luke too. But I like the actor. O-T Fagbenle is great in interviews, with his natural accent, a mix of British and African. Sometimes he sounds more English and other times more African. He's funny and intelligent in the interviews. A far cry from Luke!

[kieyra]

41 minutes ago, Owww ma legs said:

Glad I found you guys! I watched this episode in complete disbelief for all of the reasons mentioned. I couldn’t believe that June in her bright Scarlett dress had the run of the house. The worst for me is when Fred dismissed everyone to the buffet apart from super June. Just once can we have June not scowl, cry or smirk 😏. I really thought I was the only one who thought with this episode they had jumped the shark, all my friends are still raving about how great it is.

I have a feeling that it’ll keep some “critically acclaimed” momentum as long as Yvonne S. is still giving a great performance. (I’m trying not to jump on the Elisabeth Moss hate train because my feelings about her are biased due to the Scientology thing ... I really can’t discern whether she’s giving a good performance or not, because all I see is “you’re in a cult playing a character trying to escape a cult” and then my brain shuts down.)

Plus it’s still so damned dark and edgy and people equate that with quality. (See: GoT.)

[ferjy]

2 minutes ago, kieyra said:

I have a feeling that it’ll keep some “critically acclaimed” momentum as long as Yvonne S. is still giving a great performance. (I’m trying not to jump on the Elisabeth Moss hate train because my feelings about her are biased due to the Scientology thing ... I really can’t discern whether she’s giving a good performance or not, because all I see is “you’re in a cult playing a character trying to escape a cult” and then my brain shuts down.)

Plus it’s still so damned dark and edgy and people equate that with quality. (See: GoT.)

Hate is a strong word. I don't hate Elisabeth Moss, I just never thought she was all that good an actress. And I'm not basing that on her performance here alone. I've seen her in a few things. I think they needed a stronger lead for this show. I think that Natasha Richardson fit the part much better in the movie. I find almost everyone outacts Elisabeth Moss in this show.

[jenn31]

2 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Luke goes into my most hated television characters.  Ironically, another one of them is Rory Gilmore!  And yet I love love love love love Emily and how Alexis Bledel is portraying her!

Luke:  She's just like her Mom!  Her Mom, who's name is June Banknote!  Who was captured by Gilead and was living with the Waterfords!  She stole this baby!  Then gave it to Emily, who escaped to Canada ----

Cameraperson:  Dude we don't need to know all this

I seem to be on a different page than everyone else.  I hate Aunt Lydia and don't care about her!  I fastfowarded her entire "This is my moment to cry alone" scene.  Boring.  

Something that really struck me this episode is that I never realized how SHORT Elisabeth Moss is next to Yvonne.  It was SHOCKING.  I felt bad for Elisabeth.  They make her look so horrible.  And Yvonne seems to have no flaws, it's really annoying.

I’m sure autocorrect helped you out 😄 but it’s “Bankole”, Luke’s surname. She was Osbourne before she got married. 

[Quickbeam]

I really liked the mood of this episode, quite a bit. But I found myself missing the Bradley Whitford character’s insight a lot. He may be weird but he’s alert. 

[AnswersWanted]

4 hours ago, ferjy said:

I agree about Alexis Bledel. The Rory character was pretty one dimensional (as were a lot of characters in Gilmore Girls, it was more of a romp) but she's hitting it out of the ballpark in this role.

I dislike Luke too. But I like the actor. O-T Fagbenle is great in interviews, with his natural accent, a mix of British and African. Sometimes he sounds more English and other times more African. He's funny and intelligent in the interviews. A far cry from Luke!

Alexis shocked the hell out of me with her portrayal of Emily during season 1, and she hasn’t let me down since. She is absolutely brilliant and is one of the last, very few, reasons I am hanging on watching to see where they take Emily. 

Her scenes in this episode are a start, I just hope they don’t pull a hard left and somehow have her go through more trauma, yet again, for “reasons”. I want to see some healing and love bloom again for her. 

One of my biggest pet peeves about a TV show is when a clearly talented and gifted actor is wasted or given stupid shit to do, and that sums up how I feel about the way THT handles O. T.

I know him from other work he’s done, he’s quite terrific, but Luke is written as trash most of the time. Brainless trash at that. They use him more to push a plot point than actually giving him a real role of substance. 

They need someone to verbally harass Emily to create drama? Here comes Luke. 

Need to get a video of the baby out of Canada and somehow discovered by Gilead so that more drama can happen while Serena coos over the footage? Bring in Luke. 

I honestly wish he’d been cast as a commander with a central role. Or he could have been a high ranking resistance leader or operative. Perhaps he could have been an Eye like Nick, something.

But as Luke he is being given mere scraps from the writing table and I find it both ridiculous and dumb. Why waste a good actor for nothing? I will never understand it.

[Emily Thrace]

17 hours ago, deerstalker said:

I think Luke deliberately exposed himself and baby Nichole, in the hope that word would trickle to June that the baby is safe with him, and loved. 

I’m not sure that the baby ending up with Luke really implicates June. They “know” that Emily kidnapped the baby, and that Emily knows June. Once she escaped to Canada, why wouldn’t the baby eventually find its way to June’s husband? June’s knowledge or help is not needed for that to occur. 

Yeah I think Luke was also giving a deliberate fuck you to Gilead there. He wanted the Waterfords and everyone else to know that Nicole is free and safe. I also don't think it was anything like a dangerous situation. It was a peaceful march probably mostly people he knew I doubt Nicole would have been in anymore danger at a walk in the park.

[Ms Blue Jay]

3 hours ago, jenn31 said:

I’m sure autocorrect helped you out 😄 but it’s “Bankole”, Luke’s surname. She was Osbourne before she got married. 

No, I really had zero idea what Luke's surname was.  No clue, no cares, at all 🙂

[Anela]

10 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

No, I really had zero idea what Luke's surname was.  No clue, no cares, at all 🙂

Oh, I laughed at the thought of auto-correct switching it to banknote. It keeps getting me that way. 

[AnswersWanted]

1 hour ago, Emily Thrace said:

Yeah I think Luke was also giving a deliberate fuck you to Gilead there. He wanted the Waterfords and everyone else to know that Nicole is free and safe. I also don't think it was anything like a dangerous situation. It was a peaceful march probably mostly people he knew I doubt Nicole would have been in anymore danger at a walk in the park.

On a totally unrelated note to the story, the baby playing Nicole (I still much prefer the name Holly) is freaking adorable. 

The sweet baby face with the chubby cheeks just kills me, and I am not much of a baby person, heh. 

I will hope that her first words are "fuck Gilead" with accompanying middle finger. 

[ferjy]

1 hour ago, AnswersWanted said:

Alexis shocked the hell out of me with her portrayal of Emily during season 1, and she hasn’t let me down since. She is absolutely brilliant and is one of the last, very few, reasons I am hanging on watching to see where they take Emily. 

Her scenes in this episode are a start, I just hope they don’t pull a hard left and somehow have her go through more trauma, yet again, for “reasons”. I want to see some healing and love bloom again for her. 

One of my biggest pet peeves about a TV show is when a clearly talented and gifted actor is wasted or given stupid shit to do, and that sums up how I feel about the way THT handles O. T.

I know him from other work he’s done, he’s quite terrific, but Luke is written as trash most of the time. Brainless trash at that. They use him more to push a plot point than actually giving him a real role of substance. 

They need someone to verbally harass Emily to create drama? Here comes Luke. 

Need to get a video of the baby out of Canada and somehow discovered by Gilead so that more drama can happen while Serena coos over the footage? Bring in Luke. 

I honestly wish he’d been cast as a commander with a central role. Or he could have been a high ranking resistance leader or operative. Perhaps he could have been an Eye like Nick, something.

But as Luke he is being given mere scraps from the writing table and I find it both ridiculous and dumb. Why waste a good actor for nothing? I will never understand it.

Completely agree. In fact, when Luke entered Canada, I figured that’s exactly what would happen, he’d eventually head up a resistance operation and finally grow up a bit. I was convinced that they intentionally made him a bit of a sad sack so he could grow under dire circumstances. What better person to lead one of these ventures than someone who was almost caught and whose wife and child were still captives. He’d have the passion to egg him on. I gave them too much credit. They thought it better to have him whining and snivelling about trivial matters. 

Alexis was a surprise, wasn’t she? She’s come a long way since her Rory days. I love her scenes. I’m also impressed with the actress playing Janine. A different personality from Emily but she plays it brilliantly. 

[Armchair Critic]

So unrealistic that June is left by herself so much after all she has done.

[ferjy]

8 minutes ago, AnswersWanted said:

On a totally unrelated note to the story, the baby playing Nicole (I still much prefer the name Holly) is freaking adorable. 

The sweet baby face with the chubby cheeks just kills me, and I am not much of a baby person, heh. 

I will hope that her first words are "fuck Gilead" with accompanying middle finger. 

Not if she keeps hanging around Luke. She’ll end up bawling and fussing and making a nuisance of herself. Give that baby back to Moira, Luke!

[serenitynow]

Shouldn’t Angela be older?  That distracted me the entire episode.

[Baltimore Betty]

2 hours ago, serenitynow said:

Shouldn’t Angela be older?  That distracted me the entire episode.

Yes,I thought last season she was almost a year and this season the writers are making Angela in to Benjamin Buttons.

[BrindaWalsh]

Quote

Yeah I think Luke was also giving a deliberate fuck you to Gilead there. He wanted the Waterfords and everyone else to know that Nicole is free and safe. I also don't think it was anything like a dangerous situation. It was a peaceful march probably mostly people he knew I doubt Nicole would have been in anymore danger at a walk in the park.

Was that video of Luke and baby Nicole from news footage of the protest or does Gilead have people in canada somewhat tracking their refugees.  I find it interesting that it was Luke who showed up at the Waterford protest, Luke who winds up on camera with Nicole, etc.  There are presumably a lot of american refugees up in Canada at this point, small world that it's always Luke.  

It reminds me of those terrifying stories that we've heard of ISIS captives who finally escaped or were liberated, but then run into their captors in Germany or something like that and are told "We'll always know where you are."  It's creepy.  

[chaifan]

1 hour ago, BrindaWalsh said:

Was that video of Luke and baby Nicole from news footage of the protest or does Gilead have people in canada somewhat tracking their refugees.  I find it interesting that it was Luke who showed up at the Waterford protest, Luke who winds up on camera with Nicole, etc.  There are presumably a lot of american refugees up in Canada at this point, small world that it's always Luke.  

It reminds me of those terrifying stories that we've heard of ISIS captives who finally escaped or were liberated, but then run into their captors in Germany or something like that and are told "We'll always know where you are."  It's creepy.  

IRRC, Luke deliberately went to the Waterford protest, as he knew that June was assigned to them.  But him going to an everyday protest/rally, then being focused in on by a cameraman, then randomly showing up on a news feed, with Nicole, then having that news feed seen by someone in Gilead who knows who he is, is all a bit too convenient.

[Baltimore Betty]

On ‎6‎/‎13‎/‎2019 at 12:33 PM, Dakisela said:

And was it just me or did Aunt Lydia totally expect to be invited into the drawing room only to be directed to the back with the others?

Yes, that was exactly that!  She might have been ticked off about not being included and took it out on Janine as a show of power.

Are we supposed to believe that June could roam around the Putnam's house when everyone else was on the van and yet not one of the Aunts came looking for her?  Wouldn't you think they run a tight ship and anyone lagging behind would get the prod?

Edited June 14, 2019 by Baltimore Betty

[Umbelina]

5 hours ago, chaifan said:

IRRC, Luke deliberately went to the Waterford protest, as he knew that June was assigned to them.  But him going to an everyday protest/rally, then being focused in on by a cameraman, then randomly showing up on a news feed, with Nicole, then having that news feed seen by someone in Gilead who knows who he is, is all a bit too convenient.

This one isn't hard for me to fan wank.

Babies are very rare in Canada and Europe as well.  Reporters would be drawn to anyone with a baby.  So, I can believe that Luke and Nicole got camera time, and certainly they would get broadcast time.  If I make myself give Luke some credit?  He knew that as well, which is why he took her to the protest, hoping June would somehow find out, and know Nicole (and Emily) made it to Canada.  He would have no way of knowing she knows that.

We don't know how long the news broadcast was, or how many people they interviewed, could have been quite a few, could have been long or short.  The part Gilead would care about, and bring to show the Commanders though?  Would be the part with the baby and Luke.  They have extensive files on all handmaids, and that includes their spouses and photos. 

Nicole is still an "active kidnapping" and a baby matching her description, with the husband of the handmaid who gave birth to her?  Is going to catch the attention of the Eyes.  They didn't really need June to confirm anything, they have the tech to confirm Luke.

[AnswersWanted]

I think I’d actually prefer if the show just went all in and made the claim that June’s cloak is actually an invisibility shield at this point. 

Let’s do away with any pretense that she’s a “normal” handmaid anymore, because it’s clear she now has almost unlimited privileges when it matters to the plot. 

In reality a handmaid with June’s history would be, at the very least, guarded 24/7 by an Aunt or guard, any and all privacy stripped from her. 

A smoke break in the pool house while she secretly plots with a wife? Not a chance in hell. She would have been sat in a chair and probably would have been lucky not to receive a nudge from a cattle prod for good measure as a reminder to behave herself. 

[Umbelina]

They all have plot armor.  Every character with significant scenes does.  Nick, Serena, Emily, Janine, Fred, Serena, Moira, Luke, Aunt Lydia...all of them.

June was being punished but Lawrence, one of the most powerful men in Gilead, decided to choose her, much as he chose Emily.  He showed us he "knows" all about her, as he knew all about Emily.  Hopefully we will find out why.

The Guardians checked the handmaids as they went in for weapons/explosives, they weren't hanging around the party and making things ugly for the guests.

Of all the various plot armors they've all had?  This party bothered me the least.  Hell, if Janine is there?  Anything is possible.  That was the most unbelievable thing to me, but at this point?  I'm just going with it.

[alexvillage]

18 hours ago, chaifan said:

IRRC, Luke deliberately went to the Waterford protest, as he knew that June was assigned to them.  But him going to an everyday protest/rally, then being focused in on by a cameraman, then randomly showing up on a news feed, with Nicole, then having that news feed seen by someone in Gilead who knows who he is, is all a bit too convenient.

Yes, but we know how the writers work. They believe their ideas for plots are super awesome and they need to get to the plot fast. They are also lazy as fuck, so anything will do, even things that make no sense, even in a dystopian world. Because elaborating the "how" to get there would take too much time that they MUST have for the close ups, or they would have to stop the slow motion walks.

12 hours ago, Umbelina said:

Babies are very rare in Canada and Europe as well.  Reporters would be drawn to anyone with a baby.  So, I can believe that Luke and Nicole got camera time, and certainly they would get broadcast time. 

 That's fair but, as someone already mentioned in this thread, the birth of a child in a world where birth rates are falling would make everyone a little more concerned about the dangers of bringing an infant to a protest. Lazy writing either way.

[AnswersWanted]

21 hours ago, chaifan said:

IRRC, Luke deliberately went to the Waterford protest, as he knew that June was assigned to them.  But him going to an everyday protest/rally, then being focused in on by a cameraman, then randomly showing up on a news feed, with Nicole, then having that news feed seen by someone in Gilead who knows who he is, is all a bit too convenient.

3 hours ago, alexvillage said:

Yes, but we know how the writers work. They believe their ideas for plots are super awesome and they need to get to the plot fast. They are also lazy as fuck, so anything will do, even things that make no sense, even in a dystopian world. Because elaborating the "how" to get there would take too much time that they MUST have for the close ups, or they would have to stop the slow motion walks.

This episode (but really aren’t they all) was brought to us by the word of the day: convenient.

Even if Luke wanted to attend a rally with the baby and had no concerns of baby snatching, how likely would it be that a video taken of him and the baby would be discovered in the nick of time and then brought to the home of another commander who has nothing to do with anything regarding this specialty footage, but his home is where Fred, Serena, and June all just so happen to be clustered due to pure baby propping party coincidence, and June manages to hang back just long enough while her fellow handmaids are being loaded up in their maid mobile to leave so that she eavesdrops on the sudden meeting, and therefore manages to get called over to make positive identifications. 

The writing is so lacking and aloof, they just write this shit to happen, the square peg will fit wherever it damn well pleases. There’s no rhyme or reason, no real method to their madness, no purpose shown other than needing to get from plot A to plot B ASAP. 

There is a way to write this show advancing without all the fuckary, they did it during season 1, they have no excuse, imho, for what’s going on now. 

At this point I feel like every single scene June’s in, especially, is full of contrived convenience now.

[SuzieSioux]

Speaking of Canada - the comment by the woman in the Post Office (was it?) about how: "everyone loves Canada" or similar and said in quite a sarcastic way I think is an early sign that things may be starting to change with attitudes to the refugees, possibly even leading to more of a normalising of Canada's relationship with Gilead to come in the future. That comment stuck out to us during our watching (I now attend a The Handmaid's Tale watching night each week with friends).

Everyone else has spoken well on the lazy writing this season. I find I can let a lot of things slide when I'm generally enjoying a show, but this season I haven't been enjoying it so much. I'm not sure if it's because I just watched both Chernobyl followed by The Act, but this is really paling by comparison. Those two shows really made me feel all the feelings, and Chernobyl in particular was just truly excellent TV. When I came back to The Handmaid's Tale I almost felt a sort of relief from the dread I'd been feeling watching the two others, but it really shouldn't be that way. The world of Gilead is awful, I should be on the edge of my seat. But I feel comfortable.

Speaking of lazy writing, I hope I can explain this well, but another area in this episode that really stuck out to all of us watching was the insistence on showing June's religion. It doesn't come across as saying anything particularly interesting, it comes across as the writers freaking out about complaints that their show might be anti-religious, and wanting to reassure religious people who watch it. Which is quite a cliche thing to do, and is not really examining religion in any insightful way. It's just implying: "don't worry, we all know there is a true religion and the leaders of Gilead have warped it". My feelings on this may be due to me not being American and not being from a country that thinks about religion in what seems to be the way is done over there (it's not so important here, and honestly if you meet someone here and they mention they go to church they're going to be viewed with slight suspicion; it can be interpreted as that person having quite extreme views). We all as a group collectively rolled our eyes at June's praying and religion. It seems, I dunno, like it's not a fresh and interesting way to look at the topic, if that makes sense?

At least we still got her mother and Moira making fun of the church and the baptism.

[BellyLaughter]

On 6/14/2019 at 10:02 AM, Ms Blue Jay said:

Luke goes into my most hated television characters.  Ironically, another one of them is Rory Gilmore!  And yet I love love love love love Emily and how Alexis Bledel is portraying her!

Luke:  She's just like her Mom!  Her Mom, who's name is June Banknote!  Who was captured by Gilead and was living with the Waterfords!  She stole this baby!  Then gave it to Emily, who escaped to Canada ----

Cameraperson:  Dude we don't need to know all this

I seem to be on a different page than everyone else.  I hate Aunt Lydia and don't care about her!  I fastfowarded her entire "This is my moment to cry alone" scene.  Boring.  

Something that really struck me this episode is that I never realized how SHORT Elisabeth Moss is next to Yvonne.  It was SHOCKING.  I felt bad for Elisabeth.  They make her look so horrible.  And Yvonne seems to have no flaws, it's really annoying.

Count me in....I seriously do not get the weird "pity" that Aunt Lydia seems to get every so often....no interested in that OR her... she's a savage.  

[Umbelina]

On 6/14/2019 at 12:03 AM, Armchair Critic said:

So unrealistic that June is left by herself so much after all she has done.

Commander Lawrence isn't your typical Gilead control freak. 

Just don't lie to him.  😉