Spider-Man: Far From Home (2019)

[QTBlueMoon]

40 minutes ago, TVSpectator said:

I really also didn't like the Peter Parker reveal either. I think it takes away a lot form the core Spider-Man mythos. Now we are not watching Peter Parker/ Spider-Man but just someone pretending to be Peter Parker/Spider-Man. Sucks that Marvel is doing this to their own character.

I don't understand what you're saying here. Who's pretending yo be Peter Parker/Spider-man? 

[Raja]

5 hours ago, ChromaKelly said:

Saw it yesterday. I liked it, but it was also a bit meh. I'm annoyed that the villain is a disgruntled Stark employee. It honestly felt a bit Scooby-dooish. He would have gotten away with it if it wasn't for those meddling kids! I'm also unsure how I feel about the Fury and Hill reveal. So where was Hill? On the ship with Fury?

There has been speculation since the everybody calls me Fury scene in Captain Marvel that Maria Hill has always been a Skrull, part of Fury's secret alliance 

[BooBear]

1 hour ago, QTBlueMoon said:

I don't understand what you're saying here. Who's pretending yo be Peter Parker/Spider-man? 

I can kind of see if if the presumption was that a secret identity less Spiderman was going to be that way for a while. But I get the feeling that this is the way they are telling us that Spiderman is only going to get three movies. And the final movie will not really need his secret identity. Presumably due to the sinister six or something very much like it. 

I also feel like they can completely retcon it if they want. The weird way Peter put his hands on his head kind of felt like it could be another Mysterio (or his team) illusion.  Now that they have that out there... almost anything can be a convincing illusion.  I can see the opening of Spiderman three being Peter with his hands on his head with Mysterio coming up behind him to hit him. 

After a day to think on it I think this movie is going to go lower in my esteem.  What an elaborate plot to get the glasses from Peter.  Everything had to go just right for it to work, including, not having the real Fury there, and Peter being in a childish mood.  How convenient.  Mysterio wanted to be the next Iron man? How is that? When the next Thanos shows up, he aint going to be fooled by your drones. Seems convoluted. 

[ChromaKelly]

Another thing that's bugging me, and I guess this is why you don't think about movies like this too hard -
The whole deal of Peter being left the EDITH glasses. When did Tony write the note and decide to give them to Peter? It had to have been before the battle, so how did he know Peter would even be back? I don't doubt that Tony had a lot of affection for Peter, but would he have really chosen him to have control of something like EDITH? Sure, leave him his cool Tony Stark glasses that could see stuff, but the EDITH weapons part and all that? I would think he would leave that to someone like Bruce, Steve (assuming he didn't know Steve was going to peace out), or Rhodey. Yeah, I know, we wouldn't have the movie without this. I also thought EDITH would have some kind of never kill Peter Parker protocol.

[SeanC]

The best/worst thing about the Led Zeppelin joke is that reception of the joke itself varies widely depending on the age of the audience member -- many of the younger people at my theater clearly didn't understand why that was supposed to be funny.

[Crs97]

On the other hand, Mr CRS thought the joke was even funnier because I had to ask him if Peter was right.  (Right age; no understanding of popular music.) 🤷‍♀️ 

[Chyromaniac]

All Peter has to say is that he clearly cannot be Spider-Man, since he is- in actuality- Night Monkey.

[TVSpectator]

8 hours ago, QTBlueMoon said:

I don't understand what you're saying here. Who's pretending yo be Peter Parker/Spider-man? 

I am saying that Peter having a secret identity and trying to balance it between his normal life and his superhero life was important to the character (Spider-Man has always had this dualistic aspect to his character and also any reveal of his secret identity usually leads to massive problems. Like the death of Gwen Stacy and/or Uncle Ben).  Also, his guilt over losing Uncle Ben is also a very important aspect that the MCU has glossed over, is not one movie but in two Spider-Man movies. 

[Ubiquitous]

I watched this movie last night and enjoyed it. It wasn't great, but Tom Holland might be the best movie Spiderman ( sorry, Toby!). What a senses-shattering closing credits reveal! 😲

[Ubiquitous]

On ‎7‎/‎3‎/‎2019 at 10:03 PM, Crs97 said:

Plot-hole for me:  I think Tony would have made sure EDITH (hilarious acronym!) would never turn on Spider-Man.  Ever.

Yeah, I wondered about that too, but I assumed EDITH would have to be destroyed b/c Peter gave control over to Beck and did a lot more than simply hand them over.

[AimingforYoko]

3 hours ago, Ubiquitous said:

Yeah, I wondered about that too, but I assumed EDITH would have to be destroyed b/c Peter gave control over to Beck and did a lot more than simply hand them over.

He just gave Beck admin access. Beck's blunder was not removing Peter from admin. (Unless he couldn't because that's how Tony set it up.)

[GHScorpiosRule]

8 hours ago, TVSpectator said:

(Spider-Man has always had this dualistic aspect to his character and also any reveal of his secret identity usually leads to massive problems. Like the death of Gwen Stacy and/or Uncle Ben).  Also, his guilt over losing Uncle Ben is also a very important aspect that the MCU has glossed over, is not one movie but in two Spider-Man movies. 

Spidey’s secret identity or the revelation of his secret was not a factor in Uncle Ben’s murder. It was Peter refusing to chase after the thief—the same thief who later killed Ben.

[Silver Raven]

I wonder if people who were dusted while driving a car wound up going the same speed without their car in the exact same spot on the road where they disappeared.  Lots of road rash involved, if not also being immediately run over.

I loved the Into the Spiderverse references in this movie.

[scriggle]

Let me get this straight: Tony essentially recreates Project Insight and gives control of it to a 16 year old boy and I'm supposed to think that's a great thing and something a hero would do?

[Racj82]

I really enjoyed the movie. A lot of fun but much needed development for Peter coming off of endgame.

Just reading through complaints.

I wish every female in every movie didn't have to be zeroed in terms of what they are doing, saying and how much screentime they have.

Why in Earth is there a need for Maria Hill? There is nothing else there. Sure there could be but I don't need it explored. Not everyone needs to be fleshed out. 

What else would one have MJ to do in this movie? She did have more to do in that I learned more about her and what makes her tick. And I just can't with labeling her as a damsel in distress in the final act. All the kids were in jeopardy with her Betty AND Ned all in the same position. And they are humans. They are all in danger when this stuff happens. Shit Ned and Betty needed more saving than she did.

I don't mind Tony looming over this movie because of course he is. Him being gone looms over the universe. There is a whole that needs to be filled. How will it be filled? That had to be touched on here. Peter is the closest to him with his own active franchise. I don't even think Rhodes is going to be a hero anymore.

Even if you don't know who Mysterio is, it was stunningly obvious that he was playing Peter. He was too much of a cool older bro and playing into Peters emotions.

I don't really miss the school aspects. It seems like we have plenty of time to live in high school with Peter so it's cool. I also think trying to live in that high school with all if it's changes would swallow this movie whole. Better to move away from it a bit.

Between this and stranger things, it's a fun week for my entertainment.

I actually may like this more than homecoming. It just felt more lived in. I will say they are 2 for 2 on villains. I wanted him to survive. I need a spider villain team up. He would have been a great piece of the puzzle with connections to Tony like the Vulture.

[Racj82]

Oh, forgot to say, thematically Peter being outed makes sense. It's like a mirror image of Tony but instead of willingly giving out his identity, it was done for Peter. 

A reviewer made a good point in that it's becoming really fucking ridiculous that secret identities are even a thing in the mcu. In this high tech world, images of Peter taking his mask off would have been out there a while ago. I know these are based off comics and it's always unrealistic in that regard but I'm just saying that it's almost inevitable with the way the world is now.

[Jeebus Cripes]

I remain delighted anytime Tom Holland lights up the screen as Spidey. He is perfection in the role. I thought the film was great fun overall. I'm a comic nerd and knew the score with Beck from the start. I didn't mind the Tony stuff so much, but I do think it strange that we only see Iron Man tributes everywhere. The world thinks Captain America is dead, but no props for him? Vision and Widow I can kind of understand from a popularity standpoint. 

I loved the two teachers beyond reason. The one obsessed with magic & witches was cracking me up. 

The J. Jonah Jameson bit has me conflicted. On the one hand, it was a nice nod to the previous films, but on the other hand, I feel strangely shook by it. It almost feels like a Deadpool 4th wall break, and that makes me uncomfortable. If Jameson comes back in the next film, things get weird for me. I don't wanna have Hugh Jackman popping up as Wolverine in a future X-Men film and whatnot. He was great in the role, mind you, but this is the MCU. I don't want films outside of that muddying the water. 

[Racj82]

12 hours ago, Jeebus Cripes said:

I remain delighted anytime Tom Holland lights up the screen as Spidey. He is perfection in the role. I thought the film was great fun overall. I'm a comic nerd and knew the score with Beck from the start. I didn't mind the Tony stuff so much, but I do think it strange that we only see Iron Man tributes everywhere. The world thinks Captain America is dead, but no props for him? Vision and Widow I can kind of understand from a popularity standpoint. 

I loved the two teachers beyond reason. The one obsessed with magic & witches was cracking me up. 

The J. Jonah Jameson bit has me conflicted. On the one hand, it was a nice nod to the previous films, but on the other hand, I feel strangely shook by it. It almost feels like a Deadpool 4th wall break, and that makes me uncomfortable. If Jameson comes back in the next film, things get weird for me. I don't wanna have Hugh Jackman popping up as Wolverine in a future X-Men film and whatnot. He was great in the role, mind you, but this is the MCU. I don't want films outside of that muddying the water. 

I mean, who else are they going to get that is as perfectly cast? Sometimes you just go with what works.

On the hero thing, I think they may be treading lightly with diving into Cap because of how he changed his own legacy or wants it to be is still a mystery and Captain American in a new form may still exist. Vision and Widow were not heroes. They worked in the shadows. The public didn't know them really beyond a few sightings. I get it. We may be also seeing it the way Peter does. He's zeroing in on Tony all the time. Like on the plane. There was more to watch than the Stark story but that's where he focused. Stark was the most in your face, yes I'm a hero of them all so it kinda makes sense that he gets more headlines in death.

Edited July 7, 2019 by Racj82

[Shannon L.]

7 hours ago, Racj82 said:

And I just can't with labeling her as a damsel in distress in the final act. All the kids were in jeopardy with her Betty AND Ned all in the same position. And they are humans. They are all in danger when this stuff happens. Shit Ned and Betty needed more saving than she did.
 

Not to mention, they wouldn't have survived that long had MJ not picked up that weapon and bashed the drone with it.  Even Happy (I think?) was shaking his head at her, but she went through with it. 

On 7/5/2019 at 4:30 PM, SeanC said:

The best/worst thing about the Led Zeppelin joke is that reception of the joke itself varies widely depending on the age of the audience member -- many of the younger people at my theater clearly didn't understand why that was supposed to be funny.

That made me laugh because when my husband and I went to a Queen concert a few years ago, they were playing music before it started and when "Shook Me All Night Long" came on, two kids behind us said excitedly "Guns and Roses!!".  lol.  I do like the way they showed his age this time while using a cultural reference.  It came across much more naturally than "Have you ever seen that really old movie Empire Strikes Back?"  That one, while cute, seemed a bit forced, as did the Alien reference in Infinity War.

I liked it a lot.  It would have been more fun had I not found out in this forum ahead of time that Mysterio was a bad guy (I thought details weren't allowed until after the movie opened?).  I didn't know that because I know nothing about the comics and try to avoid spoilers.  Of course, my teenager said that she knew because they made it obvious in the trailers ::shrug::.  Maybe I'm just dense, but then again, I only saw each trailer once, so, I could have missed something.  

I understand the points of people who did and didn't like Tony being such a big part of the movie.  It didn't bother me too much.  My heart did swell a little when, after Happy gave him the pep talk, he started working on his suit with Back in Black playing in the back ground.  Our boy's growing up.  And speaking of growing up, damn has Tom Holland filled out with even more muscle.  If I were a teenager, his picture would be all over the walls of my bedroom. What a cutie! 

[ChromaKelly]

8 hours ago, Jeebus Cripes said:

I remain delighted anytime Tom Holland lights up the screen as Spidey. He is perfection in the role. I thought the film was great fun overall. I'm a comic nerd and knew the score with Beck from the start. I didn't mind the Tony stuff so much, but I do think it strange that we only see Iron Man tributes everywhere. The world thinks Captain America is dead, but no props for him? Vision and Widow I can kind of understand from a popularity standpoint. 

I'll speculate that there were Cap tributes, but because Tony was Peter's mentor/father figure, those are the ones we're seeing everywhere because Peter is seeing them. We also don't know exactly what the story is to the world of how Cap died, or if he's even dead. Going missing (I'm guessing this is what the general public thinks) is a little different than sacrificing one's self to save the world.

[BooBear]

8 hours ago, Racj82 said:

What else would one have MJ to do in this movie? She did have more to do in that I learned more about her and what makes her tick. And I just can't with labeling her as a damsel in distress in the final act. All the kids were in jeopardy with her Betty AND Ned all in the same position. And they are humans. They are all in danger when this stuff happens. Shit Ned and Betty needed more saving than she did.

I would have liked to seen Peter and her spent 10 minutes together where you know, they actually talked... the "romance" was wayyy too fast. I have a beef with all the tropes here.. Brad being the rival, the writers chose to put MJ in danger so she could run up at the end and kiss Peter, it really didn't need to be that way. Brad imho was a completely unnecessary character having the effect of taking MJ's agency away and pushing her to a "thing" in the background.   Kind of the same for ned. Last movie he took out the shocker and was the man in the chair. This movie he is a something to be saved. 

It would have been more funny if MJ walked in on Peter with the blonde. Maybe Michelle and Ned found a way to take care of the drones on their own because you know, like Peter, they are intelligent kids and go to a school for the gifted?  

I sensed some lazy writing and falling into many tropes of the Rami movies. MJ had more to do in the last movie. She won the academic decathlon in homecoming when Peter couldn't be there.

8 hours ago, Jeebus Cripes said:

The world thinks Captain America is dead, but no props for him?

I took it that Peter tends to focus on the Iron Man stuff simply because it is so painful for him. But irked that I have to do so much handwaving of the movie. 

Another thing that kind of irked me is that seriously, there is no other super hero available- not one? I mean are they just watching London being savaged and being like, nahhh. They had no way of knowing that Peter was even there.  I can see edith being given to Peter but I would also feel that Pepper, Happy or the Avengers would have the kill switch. 

[Racj82]

People, all people, have leave this where are other heroes stuff alone. This is Peter's story. The avengers aren't going to come and save the day in every movie. Just like in the comics. Imagine the other heroes are busy with their issues and call it day on that one. 

1 hour ago, BooBear said:

I would have liked to seen Peter and her spent 10 minutes together where you know, they actually talked... the "romance" was wayyy too fast. I have a beef with all the tropes here.. Brad being the rival, the writers chose to put MJ in danger so she could run up at the end and kiss Peter, it really didn't need to be that way. Brad imho was a completely unnecessary character having the effect of taking MJ's agency away and pushing her to a "thing" in the background.   Kind of the same for ned. Last movie he took out the shocker and was the man in the chair. This movie he is a something to be saved. 

It would have been more funny if MJ walked in on Peter with the blonde. Maybe Michelle and Ned found a way to take care of the drones on their own because you know, like Peter, they are intelligent kids and go to a school for the gifted?  

I sensed some lazy writing and falling into many tropes of the Rami movies. MJ had more to do in the last movie. She won the academic decathlon in homecoming when Peter couldn't be there.

I took it that Peter tends to focus on the Iron Man stuff simply because it is so painful for him. But irked that I have to do so much handwaving of the movie. 

Another thing that kind of irked me is that seriously, there is no other super hero available- not one? I mean are they just watching London being savaged and being like, nahhh. They had no way of knowing that Peter was even there.  I can see edith being given to Peter but I would also feel that Pepper, Happy or the Avengers would have the kill switch. 

I would have spent a bit more time on the romance element. I don't really care about your other elements in that regard. I don't need movies stretching for profound or busy work for side characters. On TV show, sure. Every main character should have their own arcs. But, in a movie, not everyone needs their own arc or moment to shine. And MJ did. She saved herself during the carnival and was the bravest of the team trapped in the museum. Ned had his own story in romance. He was too preoccupied. I'm sure he will be back on track with them not being far from home next time.

And I like that Brad was a rival in Peters mind only. Peter, as a character, is always juggling so many things. This was one that he kind of didn't need to worry about. All he needed to do was be open to her. 

While I get why Peter is into MJ. He said why he was and I get it. I wish I knew why she would be into him. I know Peter is great but another movie to establish more between them would have been fine.

I do think there is something to the notion that the mcu don't want to leave too many dangling threads just in case they do indeed lose him after the film deal expires. Hopefully they finalize another deal soon and spiderman can be free to just BE with no constraints.

[Morrigan2575]

4 hours ago, Shannon L. said:

Not to mention, they wouldn't have survived that long had MJ not picked up that weapon and bashed the drone with it.  Even Happy (I think?) was shaking his head at her, but she went through with it. 

Not just MJ. I loved that scene because MJ went for the Mace but it was Betty using the Halberd to knock over the Suit of Armor that gave MJ the chance to destroy the Drone.

I don't get the accusations of Damseling MJ since (as you said) MJ, Betty, Ned and Happy were all in the same situation and, out of the 4 Betty/MJ actually took action. I'll give Happy an assist since he came up with the idea of the Crown Jewel Vault to buy them time. Although, that also trapped them in a room with no means of escape, so 50/50?

[Morrigan2575]

3 hours ago, Racj82 said:

While I get why Peter is into MJ. He said why he was and I get it. I wish I knew why she would be into him. I know Peter is great but another movie to establish more between them would have been fine.

MJ had a major crush on Peter in the first movie. I didn't need any explanation for her feelings that, was obvious since Homecoming, IMO.  They hinted at Peter liking MJ towards the very end of Homecoming but, if anything they could have done more to develop or explain his crush, IMO.

Edited July 7, 2019 by Morrigan2575

[Crs97]

But they’re in high school!  Does anyone remember having a reason for a crush at that age beyond “he/she is cute” and “he/she already likes talking to me”?  I don’t.

[Racj82]

18 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

MJ had a major crush on Peter in the first movie. I didn't need any explanation for her feelings that, was obvious since Homecoming, IMO.  They hinted at Peter liking MJ towards the very end of Homecoming but, if anything they could have done more to develop or explain his crush, IMO.

2 minutes ago, Crs97 said:

But they’re in high school!  Does anyone remember having a reason for a crush at that age beyond “he/she is cute” and “he/she already likes talking to me”?  I don’t.

As a person watching a movie telling a story, moving beyond he's cute would be appreciated. I don't need it. I'm fine with the story as is.

In homecoming we spent far more time with the other girl than MJ. That even had more development. I don't even remember her establishing any sort of crush on Peter. Not saying it didn't exist. I just don't remember it happening in any major way. She liked messing with him. Which I guess is her firm of flirting. But, there wasn't much movement. 

In general, I always appreciate when main character romantic relationships get fleshed out beyond you are attractive. For the most part, we just see Peter being super awkward around MJ. She may like that but how should I know. As is, we haven't seem them really get to know each other. 

As it stands now, I have no investment in the pairing. It's cute. I'm happy for them. But, that's about it. 

[Kromm]

Just got back from seeing it.

Controversial opinion time:  The first one was better.

That said... the difference was inches.  This was still a really good film. And while there were a few bits I might have taken a different road with... they were minor.

And then there was that ending. Well. the mid-credits thing.  I will say... that really stunned me. It totally blindsided me (in a good way). 

I'm usually one to say I enjoy keeping to the spirit of the thing without slavishly copying the details. That's a big part of what I love about the first film.  It FELT like Spider-Man, even while the details were totally different in many ways. 

And the twist is not that. It's a HUGE change. But I actually think it's an interesting direction and maybe great precisely because it's totally new ground and can simply show the character we know in a new situation.  Not totally new, because Peter HAS famously been publicly outed in the comics before, but that was a.) an adult version and b.) wasn't outed in a way that made him Public Enemy #1.  Spider-Man HAS been Public Enemy#1 a ton of times in the comics, but Peter Parker hasn't been. So that's new. 

So I'm cautiously optimistic about it.  It's new, but it's not changing the character or core personality of Spider-Man, it's simply putting him in a unique situation. 

Some of the knock-on effects are interesting too. And I do understand being upset by them.  This means Peter will never work at The Daily Bugle and interact directly with J. Jonah Jameson, for example. Then again, May isn't a doddering old woman ignorant of Spidey's identity who's constantly cooking him wheatcakes, so it's not like key elements aren't already different anyway.  Peter is still a nerd.  He still gets lucky and manages to date the hot girl in school.  Spidey still wisecracks (not enough in this film--it's one of my issues with it).  There's still just as much light in Spidey's life and surroundings as dark (that balance is the most important aspect). 

My gut feeling actually is that there's a good chance they won't actually go with a full version of Spidey/Peter as Public Enemy #1, but instead with a more nuanced version. I think (maybe even off-screen) Nick Fury (or the substitute we saw for him!) may step in and somehow have the credibility of that video discredited. But the cat will be out of the bag in many ways.  The point won't be to have Spidey be on the run, it will be to hit those classic Spidey beats of him NOT being friends with the cops, NOT being popular with much of the public... frankly... NOT being an Avenger. Because this will enter into the range of our current "fake news" society. Putting out the truth won't undo the lie. This is a deliberate mirror of how our current leader, and most of his party, do business now. Put out the lie, and even if it's disproved or leaned back on, the seeds have been sown.  Spidey won't be in jail. but he will no longer be joking around with cops (curious they edited that out of the movie, even though it was in the trailers), he will no longer be cheered by crowds or doing public appearances, and even some people he saves could turn on or distrust him now. 

The new aspect is how this will all work with May, MJ and Ned.  All at risk from people out to get Spider-Man.  Even with a cover story saying that Spidey isn't Peter, you can never undo the suspicion.  And being publicly distrusted and thus bad from a P.R. standpoint, he likely won't be allowed to use Avengers resources.

And finally Flash (so far such a minor character in this version of Spider-Man) comes into play.  He's got some stuff to do now, based on if they have him turn on Spidey or the reverse and bond with Peter now.  How they write Flash will be interesting.

I'm on the fence about Gyllenhall and Mysterio overall.  Not all of it worked for me.  I liked that he wasn't a lone crazy and had his army of helpers.  I like that he was genuinely crazy and not just greedy.  But I found some of the acting choices, some moments, a bit odd.  A bit off.  But it was relatively minor stuff, again.  

I wonder if there was ever any truth to the rumor that Keaton was supposed to be in this (at least a little)?  That said, I can see a potential setup for him being in the next one based on the new position Spidey will be in.  

Oh.. the very end?  Okay, clearly it's S.W.O.R.D.  And that's highly suggestive of Nova, Captain Marvel 2, and Guardians 3.  But I bet only the fanboys/nerds realize the connections here.  Then again, just knowing they're building something in space might be enough for most people.

I'd say the single biggest shock to me (even more than the identity reveal) was J.K. Simmons. I gasped out loud at that casting choice. Was it a nod to the multiverse, since the rest of the movie veers away from commenting on that, or was it MORE than a nod?

Edited July 7, 2019 by Kromm

[Morrigan2575]

1 hour ago, Racj82 said:

In homecoming we spent far more time with the other girl than MJ. That even had more development. I don't even remember her establishing any sort of crush on Peter. Not saying it didn't exist. I just don't remember it happening in any major way. She liked messing with him. Which I guess is her firm of flirting. But, there wasn't much movement. 

As I recall, Homecoming had a very subtle Love Triangle going on; Peter was into Liz and MJ/Michelle was (IMO) shown to be crushing on Peter. They constantly showed MJ staring/looking at Peter, she showed up when he got sent to Detention even though she wasn't supposed to be there. She was always popping up when Ned and Peter were talking and, she'd make a snarky comment. All signs pointed (IMO) to HS/Teen girl with crush trying to get crushes attention. Heck, the going to detention (or getting detention) to spend time with your crush is straight out of Some Kind of Wonderful.

[Racj82]

8 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

As I recall, Homecoming had a very subtle Love Triangle going on; Peter was into Liz and MJ/Michelle was (IMO) shown to be crushing on Peter. They constantly showed MJ staring/looking at Peter, she showed up when he got sent to Detention even though she wasn't supposed to be there. She was always popping up when Ned and Peter were talking and, she'd make a snarky comment. All signs pointed (IMO) to HS/Teen girl with crush trying to get crushes attention. Heck, the going to detention (or getting detention) to spend time with your crush is straight out of Some Kind of Wonderful.

That's one way to read it. She never said anything. This movie actually puts it into focus. Was she genuinely into him or was she trying to figure out his secret. The answer is both. 

I don't really care about this in broad strokes. It's just conversation. Their relationship isn't very fleshed out. I don't know how that can be argued. That's not new to comic book movies or franchises in general. As time goes on, I hope to see more interplay between and how they work as a couple. I know personality wise they balance each other out. I would just like to see it.

[swanpride]

Honestly, I am just glad that MJ stopped stalking him.

Well, I just watched the movie, and I think it was great. I always like unpredictable movies, and while Mysterio being the villain was pretty obvious pretty early on, this one had some great twists. And the illusions looked great.

I was laughing so hard at the "in memoriam". Set the tone for the movie perfectly. also loved the whole scene in the plane....Happy being all fatherly to Peter, Peter designing his own suit, the use of the song which once started the MCU...

Loved how they develop the characters in the background, especially Flash. They are slowly moving him to something more likable aren't they? Poor Mr. Harrington though. Kind of unfair to make him the butt of the joke all the time, he is really trying to be a good teacher after all.

I am not sure which one is better - this one felt a little bit less disjointed then the first part for sure - but I loved how imbedded this one was in the MCU.

Not sure about the identity reveal...I don't like it, I think Spider-Man should always have a secret identity, but maybe it doesn't stick. After all, everything else in the video is a lie, too.

Here is my one big negative: I know this is an American movie, hence I was able to handwave Venice but the Austrians and Dutch really deserved better. Honestly, the way they portrayed those countries and the people there took me right out of the movie because it felt as if I was suddenly at Epcot. I was outright offended on behalf of every Dutch football fan out there. And I am GERMAN!!! So that is saying something.

It also felt weird to see so many historical buildings getting destroyed so casually, especially after Notre Dame. I mean, the Tower Bridge isn't THAT old, but old enough that the repairs would cost millions.

[Shannon L.]

9 hours ago, Racj82 said:

I don't even remember her establishing any sort of crush on Peter. Not saying it didn't exist. I just don't remember it happening in any major way. She liked messing with him. Which I guess is her firm of flirting. But, there wasn't much movement. 

My daughter is showing a friend all of the Marvel movies because her friend has never seen them before and I literally just finished watching Homecoming a few minutes ago.  There were little looks throughout the movie, but the most telling one was at the end when he had to go see Happy and she gave him a hard time, then said "I'm just kidding, I don't care" and turned toward the group.  A second later, when he was walking away, she looked back at him and her look said everything.

I think part of the problem is that we never got to see what happened between Homecoming and Far From Home to make him start to like her that much.  Last we knew, he had a crush on Liz and was nice to MJ, but she was just there--not someone he sought out to be around.  Personally, I don't need more--I still enjoyed the movie a lot and, like @Crs97 said, in high school, it's not typically any deeper than he/she's cute and nice to me.

Edited July 8, 2019 by Shannon L.

[Racj82]

3 hours ago, Shannon L. said:

My daughter is showing a friend all of the Marvel movies because her friend has never seen them before and I literally just finished watching Homecoming a few minutes ago.  There were little looks throughout the movie, but the most telling one was at the end when he had to go see Happy and she gave him a hard time, then said "I'm just kidding, I don't care" and turned toward the group.  A second later, when he was walking away, she looked back and him and her look said everything.

I think part of the problem is that we never got to see what happened between Homecoming and Far From Home to make him start to like her that much.  Last we knew, he had a crush on Liz and was nice to MJ, but she was just there--not someone he sought out to be around.  Personally, I don't need more--I still enjoyed the movie a lot and, like @Crs97 said, in high school, it's not typically any deeper than he/she's cute and nice to me.

Like I said, I don't actually care either. I just don't have the investment I would have if the relationship had actual development. It's light and cute. That's fine. But, flaws are flaws. Whether or not they make or break a movie for me is something different. There isn't anything going on in the movie that doesn't make me like it.

[swanpride]

Not sure if "flaw" is the right word. Some would say that not having to deal with the usual romance beats which are just boring because we have seen them countless times before is a plus.

[Ubiquitous]

On ‎7‎/‎6‎/‎2019 at 4:23 PM, AimingforYoko said:

He just gave Beck admin access. Beck's blunder was not removing Peter from admin. (Unless he couldn't because that's how Tony set it up.)

I was under the impression that all control was handed off to Beck, especially when EDITH asked for triple confirmation of the transfer, but yeah, I can handwave that Tony setting it up to never remove Peter, his first choice, from control.

Edited July 9, 2019 by Ubiquitous

[swanpride]

Yeah, knowing Tony, he would have set up something to ensure that Peter would always have access.

[Racj82]

6 hours ago, swanpride said:

Not sure if "flaw" is the right word. Some would say that not having to deal with the usual romance beats which are just boring because we have seen them countless times before is a plus.

And I would call not dealing with actually developing your core romantic relationship in any kind of real way as a flaw. It is a flaw when you are telling a story and development happens that isn't really explained. 

And again, for the third time, I'm cool with it as is. It's not a big deal. But, having a few scenes or moments showing people bonding or why, as characters they are into each other is too much to ask. And everything has been done here countless times before. Hero out of his element, relevant hero, crazy bad guy who feels neglected, etc. That doesn't mean trying to give some substance is a bad thing. 

But, I'm done addressing this. I'm just repeating myself here.

If anything, this movie does make me think about who will step up and fill these empty voids. I think it will be someone we don't know or know much about. Captain Marvel and Black Panther, for example, will be great core members but I don't think either one of them would want to be the head of the avengers. They have communities they are more worried about.

[swanpride]

I understand that YOU have a problem with it. But in my eyes, it is more a neutral feature. Some people want more. Others are happier when the romances largely develop in the background.

The only problem I see in MJ being "emotionally stunted" is that she never expresses why Peter interests her. Other than him being smart, and she obviously likes smart.

[nilyank]

1 hour ago, swanpride said:

The only problem I see in MJ being "emotionally stunted" is that she never expresses why Peter interests her. Other than him being smart, and she obviously likes smart.

I haven't really overthought this but if I was still a teen girl, I would say cute, smart, funny and friendly Peter is extremely attractive especially if we were friends and have been hanging out for the past year.

Honestly, as soon as she said in the first film to call her MJ, it made sense why she was always curious in everything that Peter did. Add into the fact, that she was 67% certain that he was Spiderman, he would be already more attractive to her.

[VCRTracking]

[swanpride]

I think MJ was interested even before the whole Spider-Man thing. I mean, she was already paying attention to him before Washington, which was the first time she had reason to believe that he is Spider-Man.

[shantown]

I liked it. There was a bit too much Tony overshadowing it for me, only because I don't follow the MCU. (Gasp! A heathen! Please don't shun me.) This was only my 7th MCU movie, so I like the ones that are able to stand on their own as a film. All the easter eggs and call backs are great, but I don't get any of them so it's nice when you're still able to enjoy the jokes and characters without having to do so much homework beforehand. 

I love Tom Holland and I love Zendaya and think they are adorably cute, both as individuals and together. They're both really smart and a little awkward, which is endearing to watch (it helps that they're both really attractive too). I would like to see more of a core trio of Peter, MJ, and Ned working together in the next movie. Agree that Ned needs to get to be The Guy in the Chair again next time around.

The scene where Peter was fooled by the simulation and getting beat up was hard to watch. Not only because you were worried for him, but I had trouble tracking exactly what was going on that whole time, where exactly he was in relation to the real world, etc. How could Mysterio create and adapt to so many augmented realities so quickly? It seemed like were practicing their one big attack quite a few times to make sure they knew what was happening, but then he was able to knock Peter around through a bunch of different settings without batting an eye. Was cool to watch but it just went to fast!

[swanpride]

Honestly, I don't think that I hate any other villain as much as I hate Mysterio. Maybe because he is such a smart man and could have done so much good for the world, but he was ready to kill a kid he supposedly likes because of his ego. Not to mention the whole "it is you fault when I have to do it" thing. Urgh!!!!! I would usually say that it is unrealistic that people would follow a guy like this except, well, there are Trump and Farage. Which might be why this villain unsettles me so much. He hits to close to home.

[BooBear]

47 minutes ago, swanpride said:

I think MJ was interested even before the whole Spider-Man thing. I mean, she was already paying attention to him before Washington, which was the first time she had reason to believe that he is Spider-Man.

Don't forget some pretty major stuff happened before Homecoming. Such as Peter's Uncle being murdered. I am sure that got everyone's attention focused on him. And MJ makes a remark that she noticed he quit some clubs. 

I took Peter getting interested in her as sort of a mistake. Peter started noticing that she was looking at him all the time and following him and that got him to take interest in her and eventually develop feelings. I felt bad for him when he thought all of that had been because she suspected him of being Spiderman. In a way it was but it more like she found out he was Spiderman because she was interested in him before all of that. 

I just didn't feel like we got a lot of development on this front. But I guess it is a Marvel movie and they typically shy away from that.  I wonder if the next movie will take a time jump to either after high school or as they are graduating.

[Racj82]

7 hours ago, BooBear said:

Don't forget some pretty major stuff happened before Homecoming. Such as Peter's Uncle being murdered. I am sure that got everyone's attention focused on him. And MJ makes a remark that she noticed he quit some clubs. 

I took Peter getting interested in her as sort of a mistake. Peter started noticing that she was looking at him all the time and following him and that got him to take interest in her and eventually develop feelings. I felt bad for him when he thought all of that had been because she suspected him of being Spiderman. In a way it was but it more like she found out he was Spiderman because she was interested in him before all of that. 

I just didn't feel like we got a lot of development on this front. But I guess it is a Marvel movie and they typically shy away from that.  I wonder if the next movie will take a time jump to either after high school or as they are graduating.

They won't time jump out of high school. They put him in this age to play around with high school Peter. I could see it being senior year though. 

If all goes well, they will want him to be still a teenager to interact with the young avengers potentials we have out there. 

Actually I think that would be fun. Him not being a head of THE avengers but heading up a young group of heroes. This would be down the line of course. 

[ruby24]

I could see them doing another movie in high school and then one in college. The next one could be Spider-Man: Graduation or something.

First year of college is still a teenager, and the college years are important to Spider-Man's history too. Not that these movies care much (or at all) about Spider-Man lore, it's all Tony Stark/Avengers shit.

Did Uncle Ben even exist in this universe? Because neither Peter nor May seem to have any lingering grief or feelings about his violent death.

[Guest]

56 minutes ago, ruby24 said:

Did Uncle Ben even exist in this universe? Because neither Peter nor May seem to have any lingering grief or feelings about his violent death.

His initials are on the suitcase Peter takes to Europe. They vaguely hinted at his death in Homecoming when Peter is telling Ned why May can never know he’s Spider-Man. He talks about not worrying her after all she’s been through. 

[Raja]

7 hours ago, ruby24 said:

I could see them doing another movie in high school and then one in college. The next one could be Spider-Man: Graduation or something.

First year of college is still a teenager, and the college years are important to Spider-Man's history too. Not that these movies care much (or at all) about Spider-Man lore, it's all Tony Stark/Avengers shit.

Did Uncle Ben even exist in this universe? Because neither Peter nor May seem to have any lingering grief or feelings about his violent death.

If it would have happened it would have had to be in Homecoming. As that movie opens, with a Civil War call back of Peter starting his hero's journey giving back after failing to act and his uncle being murdered off screen. Aunt May had already recovered enough to comfortably allow Tony Stark to flirt with her. By Far From Home another 4 years down the line well people do move on.

15 hours ago, shantown said:

I liked it. There was a bit too much Tony overshadowing it for me, only because I don't follow the MCU. (Gasp! A heathen! Please don't shun me.) This was only my 7th MCU movie, so I like the ones that are able to stand on their own as a film. All the easter eggs and call backs are great, but I don't get any of them so it's nice when you're still able to enjoy the jokes and characters without having to do so much homework beforehand. 

 

The problem is the movie is part of a series and in the series Tony Stark literally just gave his life to save everybody in the universe. And the world has confirmation from the surviving Avengers, alien Asgardians and the Wakandan army in the field. As a hero only a creator god, if you believe in it, can be bigger. And in Infinity War Thanos set up the aftermath when asking would anybody even remember you, the brave Earth hero who as the last fighter standing stood alone against him.

Everybody no matter what heroic action they take will be seen as second to Tony Stark so you have to deal with that big elephant sitting on top of any story in the series. Or kill the series,

[johntfs]

8 hours ago, ruby24 said:

I could see them doing another movie in high school and then one in college. The next one could be Spider-Man: Graduation or something.

First year of college is still a teenager, and the college years are important to Spider-Man's history too. Not that these movies care much (or at all) about Spider-Man lore, it's all Tony Stark/Avengers shit.

Did Uncle Ben even exist in this universe? Because neither Peter nor May seem to have any lingering grief or feelings about his violent death.

I think he did.  For my part I'm happy to not rehash that after, what, five previous movies went through his origins.  One thing we really did not need was Peter Parker getting bitten by the spider again and letting Uncle Ben die again.  I'm also grateful that the Osborns/Green Goblins aren't a thing yet. 

As for the next movie, I'd kind of like to see them bring back the Scorpion guy and the Beetle (you can look him up online).  I also enjoy how the villains in this version of Spider Man have some shades of (dark) gray.  The Vulture cared for his family saw himself as fighting/exploiting a system that was rigged against him.  Even Mysterio liked Peter even as he was tricking him.  I think his sympathy for Peter and his advice about letting himself be a kid was genuine in the moment.  Mysterio just cared a whole lot more about himself and his own goals.

[swanpride]

Though it would be nice to see Peter grow up and eventually encounter the Osborns too once he is in college. I just fear that that we won't get Tom Holland for long enough to get there.

[Raja]

1 hour ago, swanpride said:

Though it would be nice to see Peter grow up and eventually encounter the Osborns too once he is in college. I just fear that that we won't get Tom Holland for long enough to get there.

I would time jump past graduation. In the first scenes before movie magic happened I thought Tom Holland had survived the Snapture and wasn't one who blipped back in