S06.E21: Sean & Dottie's 2018.07.25

[sidka]

Can someone explain to me why you would go to the bathroom in a bucket when you have the ability to walk and a working toilet is only one room-distance away?

Wouldn't crapping in a bucket be more uncomfortable than a toilet? How does someone of that size even manage it? Its so small it must involve squatting (probably harder than walking at that size) and it can't hold your weight and doesn't even have much of a seat.

I'M a horrifically lazy individual and this is confusing me.

Edited July 27, 2018 by sidka

[calpurnia99]

I think he was just peeing in a bucket not crapping in it.

I can't believe I just wrote that.....

[sidka]

Just now, calpurnia99 said:

I think he was just peeing in a bucket not crapping in it.

I can't believe I just wrote that.....

it looked so discolored... but Sean isn't exactly the portrait of good health 

[JunkFoodTV]

9 hours ago, Marilee said:

Is this the first episode where we’ve heard Dr. Now get on someone for smoking? I know Dottie can’t be the only smoker out of all the participants we’ve seen.

I remember him getting on Susan for smoking. And yes Dottie's sister was in pageants and stuff. She wasn't in this episode. And yes Dottie is pretty, but seems to have a shavable amount of chin hair.

I think Dottie's son was in a pull up for over night. And I'm a little in love with the giant light bright. :-) 

Sean's feet/toes look like monkey feet. Maybe his toes spread out to adjust for his weight? To me he looked frightened. Deer in headlights. Sad. I'm sure his mom thought she would out live him. Well bitch...you didn't and now here we are. Hope you're happy. Ugh...

[CoachWristletJen]

I thought about autism when it was suggested, but I realized that Sean had no problem maintaining eye contact with Dr. Paradise and having direct conversation.

It really makes me angry at Renee when I realize that Sean actually did have some potential to live in this world and do some type of things.

I really like the idea of a group home setting for him if he lost some weight. They might need a lock on the refrigerator.

I don't think Sean has ever had the experience of truly making friends and having a peer group. That could have a very positive influence on him. Not to mention the fact that he would have some accountability. He could practice listening to their cares and concerns and he might find that he actually cares.

Also, he really needs the experience of doing something for someone else. Even if it's just stuffing envelopes for a cause.

I know that dogs that assist firemen need special booties that need to be handmade. That's something Sean could do. Just the experience of doing something for someone else might change his perspective... and his heart.

37 minutes ago, 88Keys said:

Or put on pants!  PUT ON YOUR OWN PANTS!  She shouldn't have to do that for you!  :(

Okay, I'm guilty of getting this episode in bits and pieces because I was folding laundry, washing dishes, etc., but near the end it appeared to me that his personal care assistant was treating him for the equivalent of diaper rash, most likely caused by his poor hygiene down there. I imagine if he lets it go, it could get quite painful, and then he would avoid washing all together.

Edited July 27, 2018 by CoachWristletJen

[CoachWristletJen]

14 minutes ago, JunkFoodTV said:

I remember him getting on Susan for smoking. And yes Dottie's sister was in pageants and stuff. She wasn't in this episode. And yes Dottie is pretty, but seems to have a shavable amount of chin hair.

I think Dottie's son was in a pull up for over night. And I'm a little in love with the giant light bright. :-) 

Sean's feet/toes look like monkey feet. Maybe his toes spread out to adjust for his weight? To me he looked frightened. Deer in headlights. Sad. I'm sure his mom thought she would out live him. Well bitch...you didn't and now here we are. Hope you're happy. Ugh...

Dottie's situation was truly devastating! And, she absolutely put it all out there for her kids. She was a loving and tenderhearted mother.

I imagine that her conscientiousness will help her keep her weight down. She will want to keep her weight down to take care of her son.

Sean's feet were starting to look like Stephen's. Very sad.

41 minutes ago, sidka said:

Can someone explain to me why you would go to the bathroom in a bucket when you have the ability to walk and a working toilet is only one room-distance away?

Wouldn't crapping in a bucket be more uncomfortable than a toilet? How does someone of that size even manage it? Its so small it must involve squatting (probably harder than walking at that size) and it can't hold your weight and doesn't even have much of a seat.

I'M a horrifically lazy individual and this is confusing me.

If he missed, I could totally see him ignoring the problem until his caregiver arrived and took notice.

[Elizzikra]

Quote

PUT ON YOUR OWN PANTS!

I'm not sure he owns pants that fit. I'm pretty sure he doesn't have shoes that fit and even if he did, he can't reach his feet to put them on, even with a special assistive device.

Quote

the equivalent of diaper rash

I think it was some elements of that plus just "chub rub" - his skin rubbing against itself. Add in some poor hygiene and I'm sure he had multiple raging infections in there.

Edited July 27, 2018 by Elizzikra

[ams1001]

12 minutes ago, CoachWristletJen said:

but near the end it appeared to me that his personal care assistant was treating him for the equivalent of diaper rash, most likely caused by his poor hygiene down there. I imagine if he lets it go, it could get quite painful, and then he would avoid washing all together.

Okay, I must have missed that bit and for that I am truly grateful.

[JunkFoodTV]

"I think I need to hit rock bottom before I start making my climb back to the top"....huh? Wait...what does rock bottom look like? Your assistant is cleaning this horribly painful looking skin and emptying your piss bucket. Looks like rock bottom to me. 

[Christi]

Im just really glad he doesnt have any pets :(

[Ray Adverb]

It was pretty sad.  Sean went through a lot. It seems like he's really being thrown in the deep end being forced to be independent without the necessary life skills.  Beyond that are his bad physical disabilities.  I don't see how he's supposed to deal with all that AND stick to a strict diet at the same time. 

 

Throughout the episode, I wanted Sean to die.  Not because I'm angry with him but because I think he deserves the sweet relief of death.

Edited July 27, 2018 by Ray Adverb

[3girlsforus]

Sometimes when I watch the Food Network I wish we had smell-o-vision. Then I watch Sean and pray they never invent such technology. 

[dahling]

I'm not sure it's realistic to apply normal standards of behavior to Sean.  It's easy to sneer that he's a big baby and he should get up, put on some pants, and get a job. But, he literally - can't. He can't put on pants.  There are no pants for him, and even if there were, he couldn't get them on. He can't get a job. Crocheting seems to be his only skill.  He can't lose weight because he can't take care of himself and knows nothing about nutrition.  He is physically and mentally incapable of the things we consider normal.

The truth is, to have a chance at what we consider a normal life, he needs many thousands, possibly millions, of dollars worth of therapy, support, and resources.  He can't pay for any of it.  So the larger question, beyond the scope of this discussion board, is, who should?  Should anyone?  How do we choose who gets what they need and who doesn't?  There are finite resources for these things, and he "needs" more than his fair share. It truly is one of the saddest stories we've seen on this show. I share the earlier poster's feeling of wanting to cry for him when he, draped in a hospital gown, is dropped off at his apartment by a taxi only to discover that he is homeless.  

[calpurnia99]

"I'm starting to think I'm going to try that" LOL the response to why don't you eat the turkey without the bread?

[Elizzikra]

Quote

He can't lose weight because he can't take care of himself and knows nothing about nutrition.  He is physically and mentally incapable of the things we consider normal.

He can lose weight - we saw him. Not just in the hospital on the controlled diet but for a time at home alone (remember in his first episode when he made himself sandwiches - not great but he did lose weight). And he does know about nutrition - Dr. Now gives him a diet. He is incapable of a lot but all he has to do to get therapy is say "yes." The therapist, with whom he already has a relationship, is available to come to his home. He literally doesn't have to get dressed or leave his chair to take the next step in getting help. That refusal of in-home therapy was one of the most frustrating things for me about Sean. Plus he simultaneously complains of boredom but also not having the time to do therapy, sort his stuff and move, cook, etc. He is such heavy denial that it's almost unbelievable.
 

Quote

 

 I don't see how he's supposed to deal with all that AND stick to a strict diet at the same time. 

 

 

 

Well he is an adult. A poorly raised one at best, but an adult who has some resources available to him and refuses them (see above).

As for the diet - he can't follow it because he uses food for comfort. Eating healthy doesn't take more time or money than eating what he's eating. There are a lot of cheap, high protein foods, some that require little to no preparation but he just doesn't want them. 

I will say that right after I watched this episode, we found about an inch of standing water in our basement. It took a day to suck it all out, toss what was ruined and clean up what was salvageable. And that was only because we are in temporary housing and don't have as much in our basement as we do when we are in our regular house. So I did feel greater empathy for people like Sean who were impacted by Hurricane Harvey. I think it was a blessing that something forced him to toss so much stuff as I do think he was hoarding to a degree, but flooding is a terrible motivation.

Quote

"I think I need to hit rock bottom before I start making my climb back to the top"....huh? Wait...what does rock bottom look like? Your assistant is cleaning this horribly painful looking skin and emptying your piss bucket. Looks like rock bottom to me. 

I wondered that too. I suppose in a hospital, on a ventilator, with half your skin eaten away by staph infections?

Edited July 27, 2018 by Elizzikra

[3girlsforus]

20 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

He can lose weight - we saw him. Not just in the hospital on the controlled diet but for a time at home alone (remember in his first episode when he made himself sandwiches - not great but he did lose weight). And he does know about nutrition - Dr. Now gives him a diet. He is incapable of a lot but all he has to do to get therapy is say "yes." The therapist, with whom he already has a relationship, is available to come to his home. He literally doesn't have to get dressed or leave his chair to take the next step in getting help. That refusal of in-home therapy was one of the most frustrating things for me about Sean. Plus he simultaneously complains of boredom but also not having the time to do therapy, sort his stuff and move, cook, etc. He is such heavy denial that it's almost unbelievable.
 

Well he is an adult. A poorly raised one at best, but an adult who has some resources available to him and refuses them (see above).

As for the diet - he can't follow it because he uses food for comfort. Eating healthy doesn't take more time or money than eating what he's eating. There are a lot of cheap, high protein foods, some that require little to no preparation but he just doesn't want them. 

This is it exactly. He doesn’t want the resources available to him. He has therapy at the ready. He refused. He has a diet told to him. He has personal care givers. He doesn’t want any of it. He wants to be in a care facility and everthing else isn’t good enough. He even said after that appointment with Dr Now that ‘he didn’t get the help he needs’ meaning the care facility. He has LOTS of help. It’s just not what he wants. 

[hnygrl]

I always thought Sean's mom had Munchausen by proxy and kept Sean morbidly obese and sickly for the attention it gave her, the poor, long-suffering momma how loves her sick little boy.

With her dead, Sean doesn't have a freaking CLUE how to care for himself on any level. He needs to be in a care...no...well...maybe. He's obviously mentally ill. OBVIOUSLY. If he's not in a facility being cared for soon and very soon, someone's gonna find him dead. He's so sad I can't even get mad at him. Poor guy doesn't have a clue. Not. One. Clue.

Why didn't DOTTIE have a home health aide? SHE needed the help and badly. I get that husband has to work so he can't be down there with her for 2 months straight but how about a weekend? How about you take 2 weeks vacay and see your woman? How about you send your cousin Lettie down there for a couple weeks? Hire a nurse to stay with her? It was lousy that she was all alone like that. Skin removal surgery (from what I've seen/heard) is the most painful and difficult to heal from of all the surgeries. She needed someone and she was all alone. MAN my heart went out to her.

What a sad, sad, sadly sad sad sad episode....so freaking sad. I expect to hear of Sean's death before the next update.

 

he wants to die

[DC Gal in VA]

On 7/26/2018 at 9:57 AM, Armchair Critic said:

There is something wrong when a 20 something year old guy would rather live in a care facility than try to make a life for himself. In some ways I feel sorry for him because he was so sheltered he doesn't know any better. But then I want to shake him because there are people who truly need to be in a care facility and not just because they are a glutton continuing to eat large quantities and lying around expecting to be helped.

All of this so much Armchair Critic! Sorry I missed hanging out with you and all of my Pounder Pals on Wednesday but I was really under the weather although I did watch some of the original airing and then re-watched the later airing of the episode to catch up; read all of your spot on comments during the Live Chat today as well.

Like you, I go back and forth with Sean. I want to shake him too because of all the resources he has been led to believe he deserves. But mostly though, I feel a great deal of pity for him. He was dealt a truly raw deal with both an emotionally absent father and a seriously creepy, abusive mom. He is so behind the curve as far as being capable of having a normal independent life that it's beyond belief.

[jacksgirl]

This is the episode that makes all of my minor, yet annoying life difficulties disappear. My worst day is 100 times better than Sean's best day. He was dealt a very  bad hand in life and has not been able to overcome, and probably will never be able to overcome it. I am counting my blessings.

[calpurnia99]

Its just insane that the mom fed him to 1003 pounds. Why didnt they get help when he was 800 pounds? Many here say Munchhausen by Proxy and I do agree, but she also liked to feed him, and saw it as a form of love. It was one of the main ways she brought him happiness. 

He said at one point he wished things could go back to the way they were: mom alive, living with her, having his every need met. He has a good reason to be depressed and grieving for her. I think he does have to pull himself up but he is in such a deep depression. It's okay to be depressed about his mom dying.  But we see that he just cannot function AT ALL. He really needs to go back to the shrink. It IS sad. 

[DC Gal in VA]

As ams1001 and Mothra said, I think that Sean's only hope would be in a group home setting. In that regard, I will take a stab at creating his totally imaginary, probably doesn't even exist, perfect group home setting meaning that Sean would only be accepted and allowed to continue to stay under the following conditions:

1. Sorry dear but you must bathe daily AND make your way to the toilet. Nobody will be expected to smell your funk on a daily basis. No adult diapers, pee pads or, emptying buckets full of human waste for you! You can walk, you are not an infant or a paraplegic so you definitely will be expected to take care of your bathroom needs. And, oh by the way, NO HOARDING;

2. Yes Sean, if you want to remain a resident of this place you WILL have to do household chores just like everyone else who lives here. Can't push a vacuum then you will have to dry the dishes or dust or do your own laundry or sit on your butt if need be and clean the bathroom sink, but you DO NOT have the option of doing nothing;

3. Whether you want to believe it or not, you are depressed Sean and you need help. There is weekly group therapy and you MUST participate.  And, no Sean, you cannot sit there like a stump and say nothing. Also, if still available, you WILL meet with Dr. Paradise;

4. Absolutely oh Hells No will we allow you to have pizza delivery or any other deliveries of fattening foods. We know you are a grown man but we are working with Dr. Now to save your damned life so you will eat what's put in front of you AND learn how to make something other than bologna and processed cheese sandwiches on white bread;

5. We will also care about you as a human being and do everything within our power to teach you the life skills you were unfairly deprived of for over the first twenty years of your life. In return we expect you to try, to cooperate and, for God's Sake, learn how to use the words "Please" and "Thank you."

Of course, Sean is a grown assed man and has the right to refuse to abide by any of these restrictions/requirements. However, it will be made extremely clear that, if he chooses to not go along with the program, he will be summarily kicked out and end up living on a stoop, in the woods, or in a van down by the river. There will be no magical facility full of people willing to wash his ass, dump his piss, or funnel him thousands of calories worth of fattening foods every day.

I know this may sound extremely harsh but this man needs both structure and accountability in order to have a chance to survive in this world.

BTW, the people running this home will have to have a lot of patience with Sean with constant reminders of how to behave like a human being since he never ever got those lessons from his disgusting Munchausen Mom during his formative years. As others here have said, the best thing that woman ever did for him was die.

Edited July 27, 2018 by DC Gal in VA
Typos.

[Morgalisa]

I wonder what happened to Sean's first caregiver. He described her as his "friend and caregiver." She encouraged him to get dressed and get it over with.  She was so sweet to him when they left the mattress store. Telling him how proud she was of him and that she knew it was difficult for him. Then she patted him on the leg. 

The second caregiver seemed as if she had had it with him. Who could blame her. He was by then in his piss bucket/toga party stage. The ungloved caretaker. I hope she is well.

Unfortunately we do not have social programs that protect our most vulnerable people beyond a certain point. He qualified for a personal care assistant but Dottie probably did not qualify because her husband was employed. Therefore she wound up in a hotel, alone.

[JunkFoodTV]

Well I was feeling way too cheerful today so I decided to watch Sean's first episode...oh boy...

[Trees]

Gosh!  Watching Sean struggle alone, I felt like screaming!  Everyone is failing him!  He's clearly very low IQ AND mentally ill.  He qualifies for commitment to a hospital for mental evaluation as a danger to himself because he does not take care of the basic needs of life.

Dr Now yelling at him to take responsibility!?  He doesn't know how!  Sean does not have life skills.  He seems to mentally be about age 10.

SHAME ON SEAN'S DAD!  He brought Sean into this world.  Clearly Sean does not need to stay in Houston... he is not following Dr Now's program. He's a trainwreck.

Fine, if Sean's dad can't have Sean living with him... fine.  But he's Sean's father and Sean is incapable of independent living.  Dad - come pick up Sean and bring him to your hometown and find a place for him to live.  Get him on disability and help him.  He's your son and he is in hell.

I feel emotions at these various episodes but none has worried/upset me as much as this one.  All Dr Now's yelling is not going to give Sean any life skills.  He can't go to the grocery store and doesn't know how to cook.  The only way he knows to feed himself is to order pizza.

When does the line get crossed of "too much" and irresponsible?  Shouldn't these film crews notify Drs Now and Paradise that the "freak show" needs to be over and they need to step up to the plate for a this very vulnerable lost soul?

[libgirl2]

2 hours ago, calpurnia99 said:

Its just insane that the mom fed him to 1003 pounds. Why didnt they get help when he was 800 pounds? Many here say Munchhausen by Proxy and I do agree, but she also liked to feed him, and saw it as a form of love. It was one of the main ways she brought him happiness. 

He said at one point he wished things could go back to the way they were: mom alive, living with her, having his every need met. He has a good reason to be depressed and grieving for her. I think he does have to pull himself up but he is in such a deep depression. It's okay to be depressed about his mom dying.  But we see that he just cannot function AT ALL. He really needs to go back to the shrink. It IS sad. 

As I read somewhere, his mother maimed him. How can you do that to your child? Sorry, there is no real love there. 

[Morgalisa]

6 minutes ago, libgirl2 said:

As I read somewhere, his mother maimed him. How can you do that to your child? Sorry, there is no real love there. 

Could you elaborate on this please. I missed hearing about this.

[DC Gal in VA]

23 hours ago, MillieSparklepants said:

Whoa ... so much sadness and tragedy in this episode.

Dottie - bless her heart. She loved her little boy and took such fervent and ferocious care of him. My sister has a fully disabled CP child and it is 100% DRAINING. Dottie was amazing with him. I think she'll be okay, because Landon will pull her through. She's got a mama bear vibe going on and if that kid needs her, she'll show up. I was really impressed she went to the kid's museum with him and didn't seem to care about the odd shape of her body or if people were staring, she was totally focused on him. And her husband seems very caring and patient, if a bit too passive at times.

Sean - I could barely watch. What his mother did to him was evil. I got a bit of an autistic vibe coming off Sean, so I don't think he would be a totally normal adult in the best of circumstances, but he could certainly be doing much better than he is. She infantilized him to the point that he can't function without her and that's exactly the opposite of what a mom is supposed to do. What a selfish, detestable woman! I'll wonder if she even considered he could outlive her. 

I don't have much hope for Sean. I was expecting the episode to end with his death either by suicide or from infection. I think he'll be right back to 1000 pounds soon and living in a state home before long.

I could not agree with you more MillieSparklepants when it comes to your opinion of that woman. If she was beating the crap outta him or starving him or locked him up in a cage people would be saying what a horrible excuse for a human being she was, lock her up and throw away the key, and rightfully so. But no, she gets the title of Munchausen by Proxy. I don't want to get into a debate with anyone here about the accuracy of that diagnosis. What I'm saying is that that's a $1,000.00 word for child abuser. In that sense, I see absolutely no difference between her any other child abuser, even though he was 18 when all this feeding started, he was still her child.

She single handedly crippled him, both literally and figuratively. He was a football player on his high school team--IIRC, a photo was shown of him in his uniform during his original episode--and I'll bet that she really couldn't stand him starting to develop a life and friends apart from her. When he somehow injured his foot, it didn't heal right, and just "took to his bed" as the saying goes, what did she do? Did she take him to another doctor, did she sue the pants off the one who botched his treatment, did she insist that he get off his ass because she was not going to wait on him hand and foot (pun intended)? No, she fed him and fed him until he was completely disabled and eventually over 900 pounds. Then, after being sent home to help him lose weight she kept feeding him and they both returned to Dr. Now with him weighing in at 1,003 pounds! She even tried to fool Dr. Now that she just didn't understand what he was supposed to be eating. Thank goodness he gave her a verbal smackdown on her bullshit. What kind of a "mudder" would do that?

And I think that stupid "progress/reward" chart of hers was just another manipulation by her to make poor Sean and anyone else believe that she had his best interests at heart. Ugh, evil and selfish indeed.

[CousinOliver]

Anyone ever watch the 2007 series, Inside Brookhaven Obesity Clinic? It's actually a program at a normal rehab center, and it looks like the obesity program is now strictly 90 days (it seemed to be indefinite-length treatment during the documentary).

That seems like something Sean needs: a nursing home environment geared towards the obese.  

If Dr Now wasn't heading towards retirement (presumably), such a thing might be a good thing for him to start.  Several of his patients would benefit, and with the TV notoriety, I bet there would be a waiting list for open beds, especially if covered by insurance.  

[PrincessPurrsALot]

Pounders,

As you know we have a mod note pinned in this thread.  This applies to the My 600 Lb Life forum. To break this down:

• We do not speculate about who is or is not receiving public services.  If the show states it explicitly, it can be discussed in regards to that situation only.  Otherwise it is speculation that often leads to larger political discussions.
• When something is off limits so is talking about the fact that it is off limits.  PTV does not allow discussion about Mod actions in the forums.  That is absolute.  So comments like "that thing were not allowed to talk about" or "I wish I could discuss" violate that standard.  No one is harmed by this small limit on what you can discuss.  

If you have questions regarding this please PM your breakfast treat Mod @frenchtoast or your kitty Mod @PrincessPurrsALot.  

[3girlsforus]

55 minutes ago, DC Gal in VA said:

I could not agree with you more MillieSparklepants when it comes to your opinion of that woman. If she was beating the crap outta him or starving him or locked him up in a cage people would be saying what a horrible excuse for a human being she was, lock her up and throw away the key, and rightfully so. But no, she gets the title of Munchausen by Proxy. I don't want to get into a debate with anyone here about the accuracy of that diagnosis. What I'm saying is that that's a $1,000.00 word for child abuser. In that sense, I see absolutely no difference between her any other child abuser, even though he was 18 when all this feeding started, he was still her child.

She single handedly crippled him, both literally and figuratively. He was a football player on his high school team--IIRC, a photo was shown of him in his uniform during his original episode--and I'll bet that she really couldn't stand him starting to develop a life and friends apart from her. When he somehow injured his foot, it didn't heal right, and just "took to his bed" as the saying goes, what did she do? Did she take him to another doctor, did she sue the pants off the one who botched his treatment, did she insist that he get off his ass because she was not going to wait on him hand and foot (pun intended)? No, she fed him and fed him until he was completely disabled and eventually over 900 pounds. Then, after being sent home to help him lose weight she kept feeding him and they both returned to Dr. Now with him weighing in at 1,003 pounds! She even tried to fool Dr. Now that she just didn't understand what he was supposed to be eating. Thank goodness he gave her a verbal smackdown on her bullshit. What kind of a "mudder" would do that?

And I think that stupid "progress/reward" chart of hers was just another manipulation by her to make poor Sean and anyone else believe that she had his best interests at heart. Ugh, evil and selfish indeed.

I just want to say that I think  Sean is an entitled brat who is being offered a host of options for help but only wants things his way. But that doesn’t mean I don’t think his mother was evil. She was clearly horrendous.  She definitely contributed to who he is and the situation he finds himself in. It makes his “journey” more difficult but it doesn’t excuse him for life. 

I know you didn’t imply that anyone was defending his mom. It just seems like the two opinions are she’s evil and abusive or he’s a lazy, entitled prick. To me they’ve are both true. 

[Scarlett45]

2 hours ago, CousinOliver said:

Anyone ever watch the 2007 series, Inside Brookhaven Obesity Clinic? It's actually a program at a normal rehab center, and it looks like the obesity program is now strictly 90 days (it seemed to be indefinite-length treatment during the documentary).

That seems like something Sean needs: a nursing home environment geared towards the obese.  

If Dr Now wasn't heading towards retirement (presumably), such a thing might be a good thing for him to start.  Several of his patients would benefit, and with the TV notoriety, I bet there would be a waiting list for open beds, especially if covered by insurance.  

Yes I used to watch that series. That would be a great thing to start- especially for people who needed help post surgery but couldn’t have family etc care for them. 

I was so eager to see the update on Dottie- I wished her only the best in her original episode. I think she will be a success story at the end of the day.  Her husband didn’t say much but I got the feeling that he was a good guy. 

I wouldn’t mind another update on her. Even in her grief she made so much progress. 

[pdlinda]

8 hours ago, 3girlsforus said:

This is it exactly. He doesn’t want the resources available to him. He has therapy at the ready. He refused. He has a diet told to him. He has personal care givers. He doesn’t want any of it. He wants to be in a care facility and everthing else isn’t good enough. He even said after that appointment with Dr Now that ‘he didn’t get the help he needs’ meaning the care facility. He has LOTS of help. It’s just not what he wants. 

I think Sean should be placed in a long-term care facility where he can wile away his time on a controlled diet, doing his crocheting and watching TV.  It is very costly; however, with his acute needs I think that is the most efficient way to go.  Chances are, if he doesn't thrive there, he will likely reach the end of his life in a dignified way.  I think any other more aggressive approaches (like therapy and skills training) is a total waste of time for Sean.  I think the assessment piece alone is very costly and has little to no chance of success. I don't see him deviating much from the lifestyle he had with his mother (with the exception of the calorie level) so just assisting him to live with a very basic lifestyle is the best he probably can do.  Also, unlike assanti (and some other agitators) Sean has a more placid personality so he would not likely be a challenge to the management staff at the care facility.

[Elizzikra]

Quote

 

Gosh!  Watching Sean struggle alone, I felt like screaming!  Everyone is failing him!  He's clearly very low IQ AND mentally ill.  He qualifies for commitment to a hospital for mental evaluation as a danger to himself because he does not take care of the basic needs of life.

Dr Now yelling at him to take responsibility!?  He doesn't know how!  Sean does not have life skills.  He seems to mentally be about age 10.

SHAME ON SEAN'S DAD!  He brought Sean into this world.  Clearly Sean does not need to stay in Houston... he is not following Dr Now's program. He's a trainwreck.

Fine, if Sean's dad can't have Sean living with him... fine.  But he's Sean's father and Sean is incapable of independent living.  Dad - come pick up Sean and bring him to your hometown and find a place for him to live.  Get him on disability and help him.  He's your son and he is in hell.

I feel emotions at these various episodes but none has worried/upset me as much as this one.  All Dr Now's yelling is not going to give Sean any life skills.  He can't go to the grocery store and doesn't know how to cook.  The only way he knows to feed himself is to order pizza.

When does the line get crossed of "too much" and irresponsible?  Shouldn't these film crews notify Drs Now and Paradise that the "freak show" needs to be over and they need to step up to the plate for a this very vulnerable lost soul?

 

I think Sean's mother failed him but I don't see that anyone else did. He doesn't seem to me to have a particularly low IQ although it's not clear to me how far his education went. I don't think that he qualifies for commitment because he isn't threatening to harm himself. He does take care of his basic needs with the exception of hygiene which he attends to only minimally. That's very dangerous to his health given the condition of his skin but it doesn't qualify to have him committed.

Having said that though ... who would evaluate him? He has a therapist, whom he knows and has worked with well in the past, offering to come into his home and do therapy with him. He declined. I don't think that is a sign of any mental illness (though I do think he suffers from depression among a whole host of other things); that's a sign of just not wanting to do the work of therapy. He is very avoidant of hearing things he doesn't want to hear. He let his skin get terribly infected before he would go to the hospital because he didn't want to hear Dr. Now talk to him about his diet and his weight gain. 

Sean does know how to feed himself beyond ordering pizza. We saw him eating a microwave meal and in his original episode he capably made sandwiches. He's no gourmet but he knows how to move food in and out of a refrigerator and I'll wager he has basic microwave skills as well. He can't go to the grocery store now because his mobility is so bad and he has no clothes that fit, but I'm sure he can order groceries online. He could probably even talk the church people or the nice neighbor guy into getting groceries for him.

Dr. Now and Dr. Paradise have done everything they can for Sean. He has refused any help that they have to offer. Sean has no interest in learning life skills. There is nothing they can do about that.

[88Keys]

11 hours ago, dahling said:

I'm not sure it's realistic to apply normal standards of behavior to Sean.  It's easy to sneer that he's a big baby and he should get up, put on some pants, and get a job. But, he literally - can't. He can't put on pants.  There are no pants for him, and even if there were, he couldn't get them on. He can't get a job. Crocheting seems to be his only skill.  He can't lose weight because he can't take care of himself and knows nothing about nutrition.  He is physically and mentally incapable of the things we consider normal.

 

By "put on your pants," I meant "stretchy shorts."  Which we saw the aide put on him, so we know that shorts that are big enough for him do exist.  And I don't believe that he is incapable of putting on his own pants/shorts/underwear/basic body coverings.  

With that said, I do kind of agree about the rest of it.  I really hate the entitlement mentality, but in Sean's case, I think he's just been held down by his mother for so long, he doesn't know what to do now.  

[Suzywriter]

18 hours ago, DC Gal in VA said:

As ams1001 and Mothra said, I think that Sean's only hope would be in a group home setting. In that regard, I will take a stab at creating his totally imaginary, probably doesn't even exist, perfect group home setting meaning that Sean would only be accepted and allowed to continue to stay under the following conditions:

1. Sorry dear but you must bathe daily AND make your way to the toilet. Nobody will be expected to smell your funk on a daily basis. No adult diapers, pee pads or, emptying buckets full of human waste for you! You can walk, you are not an infant or a paraplegic so you definitely will be expected to take care of your bathroom needs. And, oh by the way, NO HOARDING;

2. Yes Sean, if you want to remain a resident of this place you WILL have to do household chores just like everyone else who lives here. Can't push a vacuum then you will have to dry the dishes or dust or do your own laundry or sit on your butt if need be and clean the bathroom sink, but you DO NOT have the option of doing nothing;

3. Whether you want to believe it or not, you are depressed Sean and you need help. There is weekly group therapy and you MUST participate.  And, no Sean, you cannot sit there like a stump and say nothing. Also, if still available, you WILL meet with Dr. Paradise;

4. Absolutely oh Hells No will we allow you to have pizza delivery or any other deliveries of fattening foods. We know you are a grown man but we are working with Dr. Now to save your damned life so you will eat what's put in front of you AND learn how to make something other than bologna and processed cheese sandwiches on white bread;

5. We will also care about you as a human being and do everything within our power to teach you the life skills you were unfairly deprived of for over the first twenty years of your life. In return we expect you to try, to cooperate and, for God's Sake, learn how to use the words "Please" and "Thank you."

Of course, Sean is a grown assed man and has the right to refuse to abide by any of these restrictions/requirements. However, it will be made extremely clear that, if he chooses to not go along with the program, he will be summarily kicked out and end up living on a stoop, in the woods, or in a van down by the river. There will be no magical facility full of people willing to wash his ass, dump his piss, or funnel him thousands of calories worth of fattening foods every day.

I know this may sound extremely harsh but this man needs both structure and accountability in order to have a chance to survive in this world.

BTW, the people running this home will have to have a lot of patience with Sean with constant reminders of how to behave like a human being since he never ever got those lessons from his disgusting Munchausen Mom during his formative years. As others here have said, the best thing that woman ever did for him was die.

 

You are advocating for finishing school for useless lumps. I'm in. We'll make a fortune...enough to pay people to do everything for us!

18 hours ago, DC Gal in VA said:

 

Edited July 28, 2018 by Suzywriter
Duplicate

[Suzywriter]

I used to think my mother was mean because she made us do everything for ourselves. Now I get it. My sisters and I could build an addition on the house while cooking dinner for 18 if we had to, cause mom taught us how. Mean moms rock!

[satrunrose]

I wonder what happened between Shawn and his mom before the injury. The broken ankle(?) didn't happen until high school, but most kids have some basic self care by grade 7 or so. Plus, by 17-18, most people's basic personality is pretty much set, so Shawn's mom must have been messing him up long before the football injury put the nail in the coffin. 

[sidka]

20 hours ago, DC Gal in VA said:

learn how to use the words "Please" and "Thank you."

THIS

I lost it so many times during this episode when people lent him a hand and he immediately started barking orders and/or getting an attitude when they weren't doing exactly what he wanted them to do. Or he will make others do things for him that are abhorrent and don't even NEED to be done for him (washing out his bathroom bucket)(there's no reason for him to be using one of those anymore).

 

If you need help, at least try to not make it a horrible experience for those that do come to help you. 

 

Be considerate. Its free, yet very valuable. 

[aliya]

20 hours ago, CousinOliver said:

Anyone ever watch the 2007 series, Inside Brookhaven Obesity Clinic? It's actually a program at a normal rehab center, and it looks like the obesity program is now strictly 90 days (it seemed to be indefinite-length treatment during the documentary).

That show was one of my favorite addictions. However, I didn't agree with the food I saw; it looked so unappetizing, no wonder the patients cheated. There was another show about folks in a facility in Ohio, I think. The environment seemed more human focused. I became FB friends with one of the show's subjects, tho sadly he died a few years ago. 

Sean could use something like the Ohio facility, but it would have to be structured - here are cooking lessons, here is how we clean the house, here's how you talk to people who are helping you, here's how you manage your finances, get the electric & gas turned on, etc. I don't think he has a low IQ. He might benefit from an online community college class that's done in real time so that he actually has other people to talk to. I just see him as a sad case, but not beyond redemption. 

[Hellga]

I just got to watch this episode today.   Kind of symbolic that I myself pretty much vegetated on the couch all day and ate an entire small pizza (technically 3 servings, but other than a yogurt and some cherries and baby carrots, it is all I ate all day).   This was a really sad episode, and it ended really abruptly too.  I hope they show us how it all ended!

I liked Dottie, at least, she tried to do the right thing, even if not all the time.  

Now, Sean.. there is little I can add to what has already been said, both here and in the chat thread.  On one hand, I feel kind of sorry for him because he was dealt a really shitty hand with a mother who turned him into a useless blob.  On the other hand, I am quite convinced that his ship has sailed and he has no chance of becoming a productive member of the society at this point.  I may be callous, but I don't see how pumping more and more resources into him is going to turn things around.  Sure, he may lose a hundred pounds if put on a controlled diet at a facility - but as soon as he is let out, he will revert back to his current state, and those facilities are not meant to be "forever homes".  I think he is very likely to die soon, because he is not interested in doing anything he should be doing to keep himself alive.  And I wonder if in the more recent months/years his mother wasn't overfeeding him precisely because she wanted to make sure he doesn't outlive her and end up in this situation. 

[Colleenna]

12 hours ago, satrunrose said:

I wonder what happened between Shawn and his mom before the injury. The broken ankle(?) didn't happen until high school, but most kids have some basic self care by grade 7 or so. Plus, by 17-18, most people's basic personality is pretty much set, so Shawn's mom must have been messing him up long before the football injury put the nail in the coffin. 

Grade 7 or thereabouts is where we typically begin to push at our parents' boundaries in order to prepare for adulthood. Somehow, Sean got stunted before then. 

[3girlsforus]

On 7/27/2018 at 11:44 PM, 88Keys said:

By "put on your pants," I meant "stretchy shorts."  Which we saw the aide put on him, so we know that shorts that are big enough for him do exist.  And I don't believe that he is incapable of putting on his own pants/shorts/underwear/basic body coverings.  

With that said, I do kind of agree about the rest of it.  I really hate the entitlement mentality, but in Sean's case, I think he's just been held down by his mother for so long, he doesn't know what to do now.  

I don’t know. I still think it’s more of not wanting to do than not knowing what to do. There is no way he doesn’t know he should go to the bathroom in a toilet and not a bucket. He just doesn’t want to. He has people all around him at the ready to help. I think a lot of his behavior is purposeful. He realizes if he acts incapable he won’t have to do something. That’s different from not knowing what to do. 

[Colleenna]

On 7/26/2018 at 4:43 PM, calpurnia99 said:

I have to agree because I imagine when a person reaches 300-375 pounds things start to get very bad, with their health, and they start to have pain from the weight,  and they see how quality of life is very much declining.  The person is out of breath walking,  uncomfortable all the time and you know you MUST do something.  The weight begins to affect many aspects of your life , you can't fit into an airline once becoming more than 150 pounds over your ideal weight. 

Those who allow the weight gain to go on and on and get up to 400 pounds really start having trouble.  At 400-475 pounds you are having issues reaching your ass and showering yourself and pain in your knees and feet, and can't find any clothes to wear, cant find a seat to sit in in a public place. Can't fit through turnstiles. But these people  STILL don't face it, gain another 100 pounds,  now they are over 500 pounds, and then still do not face it, and then are immobile, can't walk to the bathroom, can't fit through the bathroom door, can't do anything for themself, because they are 600 pounds or more and keep cramming in food.  They are completely miserably yet do nothing about it.

Now you weigh 650 pounds, your life is utter and total hell, you are in constant pain, but now you have only a year to live, you have your relatives bathing and changing your diapers. Only at this point do you think about getting help. Yes, a huge difference psychologically from a 300 pound person. There is something very very wrong to allow yourself to reach 600 pounds. Weight loss surgery cannot fix these issues.

I think I've mentioned before that I knew a man years ago who was in the 600 lb range. He held a job (college professor), drove, was married.... diagnosis of type 2 diabetes scared the crap out of him (this was 40+ years ago). He and his wife went on Atkins (she was 250+). With Atkins and swimming, he got down to the 180s ---actually too thin for his 6'2" frame. 

So not all 600 pounders are blobs like Sean and the Assanti brothers.

[CoachWristletJen]

3 hours ago, 3girlsforus said:

I don’t know. I still think it’s more of not wanting to do than not knowing what to do. There is no way he doesn’t know he should go to the bathroom in a toilet and not a bucket. He just doesn’t want to. He has people all around him at the ready to help. I think a lot of his behavior is purposeful. He realizes if he acts incapable he won’t have to do something. That’s different from not knowing what to do. 

I think you're absolutely correct. He simply doesn't want to do for himself. 

He practically jumped up when the pizza guy came to the door. He can make it to the toilet.

I think he has some antisocial tendencies because he clearly sees other people as things who are there to do his bidding. Certain natural responses to other human beings don't have to be taught unless the empathy isn't there to begin with. He went to high school. He even played football. He wasn't so isolated that he wouldn't have picked up on these things. He simply doesn't connect with other human beings because the empathy isn't there.

Most antisocial people blend in better because they learn to mimic the reactions to people with empathy. That's where Sean is behind the ball. He never learned that.

[LuvMyShows]

46 minutes ago, Colleenna said:

I think I've mentioned before that I knew a man years ago who was in the 600 lb range. He held a job (college professor), drove, was married.... diagnosis of type 2 diabetes scared the crap out of him (this was 40+ years ago). He and his wife went on Atkins (she was 250+). With Atkins and swimming, he got down to the 180s ---actually too thin for his 6'2" frame. 

So not all 600 pounders are blobs like Sean and the Assanti brothers.

This is what fascinates me.  The man that Colleenna described is not a mystical unicorn.  He's a man who got motivated and used his determination (and a healthy approach) to both lose the weight and keep it off.  Many overweight people keep making it seem like the 95% failure rate is some kind of inevitableness based on physiology of the body, and use that as a reason to not even try.  But I have yet to see any study show that after weight loss, if people keep eating well and exercising, that they will gain the weight back.  They gain it back because they return to the problem eating habits that they had before the weight loss.  Those are two very different causes.

[dahling]

19 minutes ago, LuvMyShows said:

This is what fascinates me.  The man that Colleenna described is not a mystical unicorn.  He's a man who got motivated and used his determination (and a healthy approach) to both lose the weight and keep it off.  Many overweight people keep making it seem like the 95% failure rate is some kind of inevitableness based on physiology of the body, and use that as a reason to not even try.  But I have yet to see any study show that after weight loss, if people keep eating well and exercising, that they will gain the weight back.  They gain it back because they return to the problem eating habits that they had before the weight loss.  Those are two very different causes.

Assuming the man in question didn't gain back any weight, he kind of is a mystical unicorn.  I'm going to post a couple of articles in the small talk thread since they're clearly off topic for this episode. 

[LuvMyShows]

4 minutes ago, dahling said:

Assuming the man in question didn't gain back any weight, he kind of is a mystical unicorn.  I'm going to post a couple of articles in the small talk thread since they're clearly off topic for this episode. 

Just wanted to clarify that I don't mean literally not gaining even one single pound back.  The body's metabolism would undergo significant changes during this time, and gaining some amount back is understandable.  But that is not the same as gaining it all back, and then some.

[Colleenna]

1 hour ago, LuvMyShows said:

Just wanted to clarify that I don't mean literally not gaining even one single pound back.  The body's metabolism would undergo significant changes during this time, and gaining some amount back is understandable.  But that is not the same as gaining it all back, and then some.

I can say that at 5 years, he had not regained. After that, I lost touch so I can't say for sure. 

[the-grey-lady]

"I think I just need to hit rock bottom before I can begin my climb back to the top," says Sean. As his care assistant empties his pee bucket, cleans up his pizza boxes, and washes the rashes between his fat folds.

Where exactly is rock bottom, Sean, and how will you know you've arrived?

[MillieSparklepants]

On 7/28/2018 at 9:34 AM, satrunrose said:

I wonder what happened between Shawn and his mom before the injury. The broken ankle(?) didn't happen until high school, but most kids have some basic self care by grade 7 or so. Plus, by 17-18, most people's basic personality is pretty much set, so Shawn's mom must have been messing him up long before the football injury put the nail in the coffin. 

This is a very good question. I haven't seen his original episode in a while, but there were pictures of him playing football as an older teenager, so he seemed on the right track into his late childhood. And he didn't have any horrific backstory of abuse either. If I'm remembering correctly, he said his dad would get in his face and yell, but they didn't say physical abuse happened. Having a verbally abusive dad is not nothing, but we've seen people with far worse on this show who end up being successful.

Mom said she'd bring him treats to make up for the yelling and then later to make up for the divorce, but there's something missing here. She was so afraid of Sean growing up and leaving her that she resorted to turning him into a helpless, 1000 pound man on the edge of death? It's mind-boggling. 

Edited July 30, 2018 by MillieSparklepants