S03.E10: The Final

[Thumper]

1 hour ago, biakbiak said:

There are different kinds of fondant, the type you are talking about is rolled fondant and this was poured/dipping fondant. 

Ahhh, okay -- thanks for that information, @biakbiak!

[irisheyes]

6 hours ago, biakbiak said:

Mary’s recipe has you using a fork, stabbed in at an angle to dip so then you can easily slide it off onto the rack. The bottoms are typically not frosted.

Is self-rising flour more of a thing in Britain than it is in the US?  I feel like most of the cake recipes I see on the BBC site call for it  

[Rinaldo]

5 minutes ago, irisheyes said:

Is self-rising flour more of a thing in Britain than it is in the US?

Yes, it is. This comes not just from my own perception, but from an English friend who has lived in both countries. It does, of course, exist in the US if you look for it. (I have a vague memory of Peg Bracken, back in the 60s, having a quick muffin recipe that used only melted ice cream and self-rising flour. Maybe it had something else too.)

[fib]

6 hours ago, krankydoodle said:

I might have the quote wrong, but John saying bakers just want to be told that they're loved was sort of heartbreaking in light of what we heard from his family. And then after winning, he said that he had finally done something to please his mom and that was the biggest prize. I found that especially sad considering (according to his Wikipedia bio) he got into Oxford but opted to go to a university closer to home to be near his family.

Tht quote stuck with me as a baker too. We are “quite controlling people who jusy want to be loved”. I swear, the best way for my hubby to make me angry is to not complement something Ive cooked for him.  

Blown away that John got into Oxford.  That kid is impressive. 

1 hour ago, irisheyes said:

Is self-rising flour more of a thing in Britain than it is in the US?  I feel like most of the cake recipes I see on the BBC site call for it  

Yup :-).  My mom has loads of british cookbooks from circa 1975 and they all use loads of it too.  Its mostly a nod to the fact that mist baking needs leavening, so it shortens the prep if the flour and leavener are already well mixed. 

My take on John v Brendan is that Brendan did nothing exciting or novel his entire season. He was competent. Very competent, just not ... creative.  I think about many of the bakers who have won and they are all creative.  Id be excited to read a recipe book by John or James, but not Brendan.  That said, I thought John was a shoe-in for third before the episode.  

Ultimately, I think that final cake might/must have been AMAZING.  I swear Paul wanted to give him a handshake. If he hadnt been the first to serve, Im certain he would have been praised more. I think his cake was just better, and thats why he won. 

[Athena]

It's been many years since I have seen this episode, but I remember how much I enjoyed John winning. When I watched the series the first time, I knew Brendan was consistent, but I didn't necessarily think he'd win. It's never that simple in GBBO. Consistency does not make you a winner. I liked Brendan but I never warmed to his baking style either like the judges. The decor was hit or miss for me. I think James and John edged it in terms of creativity and pushing themselves. I would have been glad for all of them. It was only in retrospect did I realize that a lot of people wanted Brendan to win through the season and were disappointed when he didn't. John really pushed himself more this episode and as with every week on bake off, he was the best of the weekend.

John winning did mean a lot to him and he's really taken to being a baker and a TV host as well. A couple of years ago, John spoke about how much baking helped his depression. It was something that meant a lot of to him and you can really feel it in this finale and other episodes.

 

40 minutes ago, fib said:

 Id be excited to read a recipe book by John or James, but not Brendan.

Both John and James have published numerous recipe books. James has done really well as a cookbook author and doctor. Here's a site with some of his recipes.

[justmehere]

I thought Brendan's apparent smugness came across as insecurity. As if he tried to prop himself up because he's not confident, commenting on the other bakers' skills included. Very aware of the competition and thinking: Can I survive? but coming across as thinking himself better than the others. Also, he always looked gutted by any criticism. It's never fun, but it looked like a very personal thing for him. It all felt like insecurity to me.

I was really pulling for John. The judges commented repeatedly on how great his flavors were, and he worked hard to improve. He also had a lot of baking knowledge. During the little interview bits mid-bake, he talked about baking theory a number of times, as if he'd really studied the art. Brendan is very talented, but he was constant and didn't show growth. I was surprised, actually, that Mary and Paul praised his gingerbread men in the showstopper because they had nothing to do with the cake. I get that it was part of the theme of family reunion, but it felt outside the brief. I liked James a lot, too, but it was obvious he wasn't going to take it.

Hoping so hard that Netflix will pick up the more recent seasons. They've got plenty of money.

Edited August 19, 2018 by justmehere

[Quilt Fairy]

56 minutes ago, Athena said:

Both John and James have published numerous recipe books. James has done really well as a cookbook author and doctor. Here's a site with some of his recipes.

It's not related to this season, but when I went to Amazon to look for James' book, I found that Chetna from a different season (it's an earlier or later season depending on if you're in the UK or the US) has also has a baking cookbook and the Kindle version is only 99 cents!  The Cardamom Trail

[Mystery]

I wish I'd had James's GBBO drinking game handy for this season! http://bakingjames.com/great-british-bake-off-drinking-game/

Also a warning, the links sum provided are safe, with the exception as noted, but doing google searches brings up other "special" competitions with spoilers right in the description, even if you don't click on the link. 

eta: a Christmas special is the one I saw, not a regular season. 

Edited August 19, 2018 by Mystery

[biakbiak]

5 minutes ago, Mystery said:

wish I'd had James's GBBO drinking game handy for this season! http://bakingjames.com/great-british-bake-off-drinking-game/

 

That seems like it would be harmful to one’s health so shouldn’t be recommended by a doctor!

[Mystery]

17 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

That seems like it would be harmful to one’s health so shouldn’t be recommended by a doctor!

Ha, OR it's a way of drumming up business (though with the NHS, maybe that's not necessary). 

I have a friend who moved to a very small town, years ago, as a public defender. The Saturday night before his first Monday, he walked over to a bar and got to talking with some people and bought a round of drinks. That night, one of the guys was arrested for DUI. *Not* the way he wanted to start out his job there. 

[HHSScot]

Looking at John’s showstopper, he added something written in chocolate to it.  I couldn’t read/understand what it said.  If someone could fill me in, I would appreciate it.  Excuse me if it was mentioned in the show, but I missed that part.  Thanks!

[dleighg]

He said it was "tartarus" (which he explained is the "offspring of chaos".)

[Ceindreadh]

1 hour ago, dleighg said:

He said it was "tartarus" (which he explained is the "offspring of chaos".)

Also a name associated with hell. 

[dubbel zout]

13 hours ago, Rinaldo said:

13 hours ago, irisheyes said:

Is self-rising flour more of a thing in Britain than it is in the US?

Yes, it is.

I think it depends where you live: Self-rising flour is big in the South for making biscuits.

[adhoc]

Quote

Ironically he felt juggling the two mammoth tasks made him a better time-organizer & helped him do well on the exams and as soon as the exams were over he fully concentrated on preparing for the BO final.

sum, thanks for that. I thought I  did indeed hear John say, during the episode, that he'd had a good amount of time to practice for the BO final as exams were over. On the other hand, I could have sworn I also heard Paul fault Brendan (when Paul and Mary were discussing who should win) because "Brendan does well with things he can practice at home".  The implication to me was that Brendan had not done better than the others on, say, the technical challenges.  Whatever. It just seemed like a double standard to me. John practices at home more, does better and is rewarded for his improved performance, and Brendan, well, he practices at home and gets dinged for it? Or did I just imagine I heard Paul say that?

(And what exactly are the criteria for being the winner of this show, anyway?  Based on this season, I would say that displaying random moments of great inspiration or creativity, even if a number of your bakes are sub-par (and you even miss a bake due to injury) is more important than consistently displaying excellent classic skills and bakes but failing to produce really cutting-edge or innovative output.  I would also say that it helps--if you want to win--to be on the younger side and earnest and emo and maybe a bit hungry. Being older and settled and less demonstrative and more confident in your baking skills will work against you. )

I'm glad John got a new career out of it, and I know it's been 6-7 years since filming, but I honestly believe the winner was chosen based on having the more appealing back story and what it would mean for his future. I know many of you disagree with me, but hey, as the French say, "chacun à son goût".    

Edited August 19, 2018 by adhoc
I was trying to say "less demonstrative but more confident"

[dleighg]

6 minutes ago, adhoc said:

The implication to me was that Brendan had not done better than the others on, say, the technical challenges.  Whatever. It just seemed like a double standard to me. John practices at home more, does better and is rewarded for his improved performance, and Brendan, well, he practices at home and gets dinged for it? Or did I just imagine I heard Paul say that?

I heard that as well. I got the impression that he might be implying that since Brendan is mostly retired, he has lots more time to practice.

[dubbel zout]

7 minutes ago, dleighg said:

I got the impression that he might be implying that since Brendan is mostly retired, he has lots more time to practice.

I don't understand that criticism. If the judges don't like that, change the rules and don't give people the opportunity to practice. It's not as if Brendan were cheating. Ugh.

[justmehere]

13 minutes ago, adhoc said:

I thought I  did indeed hear John say, during the episode, that he'd had a good amount of time to practice for the BO final as exams were over. On the other hand, I could have sworn I also heard Paul fault Brendan (when Paul and Mary were discussing who should win) because "Brendan does well with things he can practice at home".  The implication to me was that Brendan had not done better than the others on, say, the technical challenges.  Whatever. It just seemed like a double standard to me. John practices at home more, does better and is rewarded for his improved performance, and Brendan, well, he practices at home and gets dinged for it? Or did I just imagine I heard Paul say that?

(And what exactly are the criteria for being the winner of this show, anyway?  Based on this season, I would say that displaying random moments of great inspiration or creativity, even if a number of your bakes are sub-par (and you even miss a bake due to injury) is more important than consistently displaying excellent classic skills and bakes but failing to produce really cutting-edge or innovative output.  I would also say that it helps--if you want to win--to be on the younger side and earnest and emo and maybe a bit hungry. Being older and settled and less demonstrative and confident in your baking skills will work against you. )

 

23 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

If the judges don't like that, change the rules and don't give people the opportunity to practice. It's not as if Brendan were cheating.

They don't discourage practicing at home at all. In fact, they question those who haven't done so. But doing well in the technical challenge shows how well the bakers have assimilated baking skills in general, specifically because they can't practice. If one falls down consistently in the technical, then it might indicate some need for growth. Repetition obviously improves outcome, and they expect it for signature and showstopper bakes. But for as long as Brendan has been baking, they noted that he still had trouble in the technical challenges where he didn't have an opportunity to practice. I can't remember John's performance in the technical bakes, but maybe he did a little better. When Brendan couldn't control a situation, he kind of fell apart, and I think was more the point. (I liked Brendan; just an observation.)

I honestly don't think it was a matter of age with Brendan and John. They've rewarded older contestants before (another season - name starts with N). I think it's more about growth. Mumbles mentioned Nadiya doing poorly in the technicals: she did at first, but she also showed notable growth over the course of the series. There was someone else in another series whom they praised for doing a classic bake perfectly early on, but then as he kept to that one style, they started to ding him for not showing range or innovation. Consistently doing well is important, but they've also made it pretty clear that there's more to it, i.e. overcoming early issues, showing range, and demonstrating growth. Brendan has his own style, and that's great, but they wanted more.

[Mumbles]

25 minutes ago, justmehere said:

s: she did at first, but she also showed notable growth over the course of the series.

She came in last the first week, second to last the next three weeks. She came in first on week 5, fourth out of 7 on week 6, first on weeks 7 and 8, 4 out of 4, and first the final week. One person’s growth is another person’s inconsistency.

[Kathira]

I don't know if this should go here or in the Media thread, but it relates more to PBS generally than the media about the show. In my area anyway, the show is sponsored by Nellie's Free Range Eggs and they have a super cute promo spot featuring Bob Dylan's "All I Really Want to Do (Is, Baby, Be Friends with You) and I've become fascinated with it over the weeks of watching the show. If anyone else has seen it and is interested, here's a link with more infornation about the company, which seems really cool. The article has a link to the full ad. http://www.unionleader.com/Monroe-egg-company-goes-for-the-gold-with-TV-campaign-during-Rio-Olympics

It makes me want to spend a couple extra bucks on fancy eggs.

To  add some on-topic material, I was glad John won. His cake really looked fantastic. As soon as I saw Brendan's, I could see that they were going to ding him for being old-fashioned and stodgy. Apparently, James was the big heartthrob for the season, but I really thought John was a cutie-patootie. I'm glad he is finding success as a baker.

I really felt for Brendan, though. It was obvious that he really wanted to win and was very disappointed. I'm sure he's a private person, but I think an American reality show would have made more of his traditional, repressed Irish Catholic family upbringing, his difficulty coming out as a gay man, etc. I barely realized he was gay until they showed his (young, handsome) partner in the final. John was gay, too, wasn't he? 

Edited August 19, 2018 by Kathira

[Mumbles]

Quote

have made more of his traditional, repressed Irish Catholic family upbringing, his difficulty coming out as a gay man, etc. I barely realized he was gay until they showed his (young, handsome) partner in the final.

Do we know this was the case? I’m asking seriously, was there some article or talking head bit where this was mentioned, that I missed?

There are an awful lot of assumptions here being made about Ireland being repressed and homophobic and how hard it must have been for Brendan to grow up there. Maybe it was for him. But was being gay easy for anyone in any country, for  any gay person of Brendan’s generation? Ireland was the first European country to legalize gay marriage by popular vote and has a gay prime minister - these things just didn’t happen out of nowhere, and they make Ireland certainly more progressive than the US. I’m just kinda side-eyeing the stereotypes of Ireland being backward and repressive- or at least more backward and repressive than other countries, including my own (U.S.).

[fib]

1 hour ago, Kathira said:

I really felt for Brendan, though. It was obvious that he really wanted to win and was very disappointed. I'm sure he's a private person, but I think an American reality show would have made more of his traditional, repressed Irish Catholic family upbringing, his difficulty coming out as a gay man, etc. I barely realized he was gay until they showed his (young, handsome) partner in the final. John was gay, too, wasn't he? 

Yes. - Johns partner designed his colloseum. 

I was actually thinking about the way the show handled the families the last episode.  i was fascinated by it: In american shows, we typically spend a lit of time with background and families early on.  We essentially get to view the person’s character on the show through the lens of their backstory.  In GBBO, we learn who they are primarily through the way they behave in the tent. How kind they are to their peers, how they handle stress, etc.   We know a little about their outside lives, but not much, and primarily only through how it impacts their approach to or reason for baking.  Its so different from people being presented as their archetypes. Im glad I didnt know John as a gay son looking for the approval of his callous mum.  Or James as the goofy smart kid from the boonies islands.  or Brendan as the repressed gay Catholic turned Buddist who built a community using   baked goods to bring his neighbors together. 

It was lovely to get to know each of these men through the way they presented themselves, and it was compelling and I love them all. I wish more shows did this.  

[fib]

13 minutes ago, Mumbles said:

Do we know this was the case? I’m asking seriously, was there some article or talking head bit where this was mentioned, that I missed?

There are an awful lot of assumptions here being made about Ireland being repressed and homophobic and how hard it must have been for Brendan to grow up there. Maybe it was for him. But was being gay easy for anyone in any country, for  any gay person of Brendan’s generation? Ireland was the first European country to legalize gay marriage by popular vote and has a gay prime minister - these things just didn’t happen out of nowhere, and they make Ireland certainly more progressive than the US. I’m just kinda side-eyeing the stereotypes of Ireland being backward and repressive- or at least more backward and repressive than other countries, including my own (U.S.).

Im Irish, but have lived most of my life in the US.  yes, Ireland WAS more repressive than the US. They key being that Ireland was remarkably homogenous and very poor through the 80s: there was no San Francisco to run off to - you could run to London, but that meant $$$ for a passport, a ferry ride, etc.  The poverty gave the church a lot of power - and if you want insight into how much, take a look at the movie Philomena. If thats how they treated women, imagine how gay men were treated. Another popular representation is the book Angelas ashes by Frank McCourt, which shows the poverty - the church ran schools, hospitals, universities, food pantries, etc. 

The Irish  largely rebelled against the church with the influx of $$$ from joining the EU in the 90s and the pedophilia scandal (among other publicization of various scandlas like the treatment of women at Magdalane laundries).  

But the key difference is that til the 80s the Catholic Church ran EVERYTHING in the country. Especially in rural Ireland, like where Brendan was - it really would have been tough. 

[Rinaldo]

6 hours ago, fib said:

James as the goofy smart kid from the boonies islands

I'm glad someone mentioned where James is from. No doubt the UK public knows all about Shetland, where James has lived since age 3, but for those who don't... it's worth looking up. It must be a remarkable place to live, isolated as it is (100 miles north of mainland Scotland, such that Shetlanders refer to their own biggest island as the "mainland", and equally close to the Danish Faroe Islands). Knitting is indeed one of its characteristic industries (using the wool from their famous sheep), hence all his sweaters.

Edited August 20, 2018 by Rinaldo
I left out "miles"

[dleighg]

5 minutes ago, Rinaldo said:

I'm glad someone mentioned where James is from. No doubt the UK public knows all about Shetland, where James has lived since age 3, but for those who don't... it's worth looking up. It must be a remarkable place to live, isolated as it is (100 north of mainland Scotland, such that Shetlanders refer to their own biggest island as the "mainland", and equally close to the Danish Faroe Islands). Knitting is indeed one of its characteristic industries (using the wool from their famous sheep), hence all his sweaters.

and to go a bit off-topic, "Shetland" is a fabulous BBC mystery series set in these islands, based on a (great, IMHO) series of books by Ann Cleves. I haven't been to Shetland but have been to rather similar islands (Orkney, Faroe) and I just love those windswept, isolated, sheep-filled places.

[Jordan Baker]

I've been thinking about this episode more than I typically think about other TV shows after I watch them. (The exception is "The Wire," which I still think about all the time). I realize that much of my rooting for Brendan had to do with Brendan and less to do with his bakes. He just seemed to want it so much, and, though he seems to have a lovely life now, I'm certain it wasn't always the case.  He seems to be a genuinely good person. 

But then so are John and James. 

I do think it's sad that John--this intelligent, talented, good-looking guy who seems to have everything in the world going for him--wanted to win to impress his mother. I know that's not the only reason, but, having listened to what his family said about him, I can see his road hasn't been easy.

I was curious about where Brendan hails from in Ireland. I haven't been able to find anything in the few articles I've read about him. Anyone know?

I'd love to see this show film on Shetland, if only for the sheep. :)

[fib]

46 minutes ago, Jordan Baker said:

I was curious about where Brendan hails from in Ireland.

One of the articles linked above said he is from Kells, Co Meath, Ireland.  The town is about 30 min North west of Dublin. Its a town of 6500 people, and is where the beautiful Book of Kells is from.

My grandparents moved to a similarly sized and located town for safety during WW2.  After the war, my townie grandmum said, If you ever try to make me go back there, we are getting a divorce. (which was very bold in 1950s Ireland)

[Mystery]

5 hours ago, Rinaldo said:

I'm glad someone mentioned where James is from. No doubt the UK public knows all about Shetland, where James has lived since age 3, but for those who don't... it's worth looking up. It must be a remarkable place to live, isolated as it is (100 north of mainland Scotland, such that Shetlanders refer to their own biggest island as the "mainland", and equally close to the Danish Faroe Islands). Knitting is indeed one of its characteristic industries (using the wool from their famous sheep), hence all his sweaters.

James and his father just wrote a cookbook about it: https://www.amazon.com/Shetland-Cooking-World-James-Morton/dp/1849499675

Edited August 20, 2018 by Mystery

[Quilt Fairy]

7 hours ago, Kathira said:

they have a super cute promo spot featuring Bob Dylan's "All I Really Want to Do (Is, Baby, Be Friends with You) and I've become fascinated with it over the weeks of watching the show.

OMG I hate that f*king commercial! The only good thing about the show ending is I won't have to listen to it anymore.

YMMV, obviously.

[Ketzel]

I've enjoyed the fact that GBBO is so different from the high-tension US competition shows like Project Runway and Top Chef. It always seems so unfair to me when already difficult creative tasks are artificially made much more difficult (and "suspenseful") by absurd deadlines. ( "Designers, please make a red carpet ball gown with a matching overcoat, using only items you have collected from an oil change franchise. You have one day to complete the challenge.") I liked GBBO for letting creative people create without ratcheting up the pressure for no reason other than to create drama.  So I was very disappointed to see the show adopt that strategy in this finale. Produce perfectly finished fondant fancies in two and a half hours? Ridiculous.

[magdalene]

It's important to keep in mind that the show is not actually ending. PBS is no longer airing it. Somebody else will eventually air it in the US.  I am sure of that.

[Dewey Decimate]

I wouldn't have been disappointed by any of the final three winning, though by the end did feel a little sad that Brendan didn't get it. He and John could have both deservedly won, but I do think they'd rather have a fresh young 'un as the champ than the introverted, laconic older man. Even though I'm right in between their ages, I felt like I identified more with Brendan, as he could serve as inspiration for a 40-something that one can try and succeed at something in a completely different direction when in the "evening" of one's life. It's like when I see older women mowing their lawns - I'm a gardener myself and think "hell yeah!" I wanna still be doing that in "old" age.

Thankfully this is only the second season I've seen - I got my mom hooked this season and we're gonna do a once-a-week Netflix book club viewing!

[lidarose9]

I was rooting for Brendan because to me it seemed obvious he was the best baker. He was experienced, knowledgeable, confident, consistent, and knew what he was doing. If he'd practiced at home, good for him. It's what you do if you really want to win. The other guys were great, I liked them both, but James seemed a little too relaxed, like it was all just a lark, and John was just not consistent. I was shocked that he won.

Also I got the feeling Paul liked James and so cut him slack, and didn't warm to Brendan and so tended to ding him for being old-fashioned or lacking creativity. 

As to Brendan's seeming smug or overly confident, I interpreted his comments as defensive. He knew very well he was much older than the others, maybe felt the need to bring up the fact that in some regards his age could be an advantage. Also it's impossible to know whether they are prompted by certain questions: "So Brendan, obviously you're much older than the others; will you be able to keep up with them?" Maybe I am sensitive to this since I am getting up there myself. 

ETA: I don't mean defensive in a negative way, like hostile or combative. Just saying maybe he meant Sure I know I'm older than the rest of these people, but I'm not ready for the old folks' home quite yet.

Also I wanted to say his manner of speaking may seem kinda stiff and cold to us today but I think he was brought up at a time when that's how well brought up, well educated people talked. People were much bigger snobs about how people talked back in the day. 

Edited August 20, 2018 by lidarose9

[J-Man]

On 8/18/2018 at 6:28 PM, irisheyes said:

Is self-rising flour more of a thing in Britain than it is in the US?  I feel like most of the cake recipes I see on the BBC site call for it  

As mentioned above, it's more common in the South. I've never understood the practicality of self-rising (or as the British say, self-RAISING) flour. Unless you bake really frequently, the baking powder that's included will lose of some of its potency, thus making it impossible to predict how the final product will turn out. It seems like it makes more sense to just add your leavening ingredients to regular flour on an "as needed" basis.

Quote

I came in late to the series, so now I get to binge the previous seasons on Netflix!

I'm assuming by "previous seasons" you mean the seasons that FOLLOWED this one, as Netflix does not have the first two UK seasons, which have never aired in the US. The one we are discussing now was Season/Series 3, and aired in the UK in 2012.  Of course the ones Netflix has (UK Series 4 through 7) were aired in the US prior to this one.

[Brookside]

I was so pleased for John.  He was obviously overwhelmed at achieving his own dream, rather than someone else's.  And his mum and sister were clearly so proud.

(I didn't think they were being mean in the talking head - just having a bit of fun.  The typical route for a bright kid in the UK is university and a career, and it would be very hard to deviate from that route into a baking career.  Don't we all know people who felt pressured to go in a certain direction because of family expectations and then end up years later finally following a long held dream?)

I never minded Brendan, but I felt he was pretty condescending towards James and Jon in his talking head at the beginning of the final.

I thought his gingermen were an odd addition to his cake because the flavours were so disparate.  He could have made figurines or cut outs in a flavour mirroring his cake's.

Edited August 22, 2018 by Brookside

[Emkat]

13 hours ago, Kathira said:

I don't know if this should go here or in the Media thread, but it relates more to PBS generally than the media about the show. In my area anyway, the show is sponsored by Nellie's Free Range Eggs and they have a super cute promo spot featuring Bob Dylan's "All I Really Want to Do (Is, Baby, Be Friends with You) 

I cannot hit mute fast enough when that commercial comes on! 

[Sharpie66]

The technical challenges do expose gaps in one’s baking knowledge. I remember one that required a Genoese sponge, but one of the bakers had never made one before. Sure enough, he came in last in that round. 

Loved seeing James at home in Shetland! I haven’t been there yet, but have been to Orkney, which I just loved. They use an ancient form of barley up there called bere that I would love to see show up in a recipe on GBBO. It makes a tasty cracker to go with cheese from their renowned dairy industry and a battle of local craft beer—a great dinner! 

[Adiba]

I would’ve been okay with anyone in the final winning, but I am happy that John won because I think he needed that validation to continue on as a baker.

Brendan didn’t bother me so much—he admitted he was a perfectionist and he did have many years of baking experience over the younger guys.

I liked James, but I knew when I saw his showstopper it wasn’t going to happen for him.

I enjoy the show because I find out baking tips and learn about differences in taste preferences as well as baked goods that I’ve never heard of before—so who wins is actually not that important to me.

[Rinaldo]

Back when I first saw this final I was hugely disappointed (I'll say "gutted" as they would) that James didn't win, because to me he'd been the star all through; with time, and maturity, I've come to realize that (A) the judging operates within the single weekend, as I've said in other threads, and (B) James took some risks that took him out of the running.

But beyond that, I now agree that John was the right choice, because he shows that he understands the principles of baking, and and can invent new possibilities and procedures. This, I think, it what Paul meant by saying that Brendan was good with things he'd practiced -- not that it's wrong to practice! but that Brendan was essentially an extremely meticulous and polished recipe-follower. Which is an excellent thing (I wish I were on that level). But John (like James) was a step beyond -- he understood (or was on the way to understanding) the processes well enough to free himself from needing to rely constantly on recipes. And that kind of freedom is the essence of an outstanding cook or baker. It's what James emphasizes in his books too: he's going to explain the Why, so that in the end you won't be tied to the book any more.

[dubbel zout]

11 hours ago, lidarose9 said:

Also I got the feeling Paul liked James and so cut him slack, and didn't warm to Brendan and so tended to ding him for being old-fashioned or lacking creativity.

I got this feeling, too. This isn't the first time the male judge has let his personal feelings influence his judging. (Or maybe it is, seeing as this is an earlier season, LOL.)

[Kohola3]

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

This isn't the first time the male judge has let his personal feelings influence his judging.

Totally agree, even in later seasons.

[MorganSte]

12 hours ago, Brookside said:

thought his gingermen were an odd addition to his cake because the flavours were so disparate. 

I thought John's Heaven and Hell cake had an odd flavor combo.  I just don't like lemon and chocolate together.

[Kohola3]

27 minutes ago, MorganSte said:

I just don't like lemon and chocolate together.

The only citrus I think goes with chocolate is orange. I agree it was an odd combo.

[proserpina65]

On ‎08‎/‎18‎/‎2018 at 1:37 AM, Winter Rose said:

Also, fondant fancies sound disgusting. Marzipan, butter cream, and fondant yet the male judge complains that American pies are too sweet.

Agreed.  The fondant alone would've been enough for me to say "yuck", although the dipped kind is not as bad as the rolled kind.  The other two would've been fine on their own, but together it was just too much.

[proserpina65]

On ‎08‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 10:50 AM, adhoc said:

sum, thanks for that. I thought I  did indeed hear John say, during the episode, that he'd had a good amount of time to practice for the BO final as exams were over. On the other hand, I could have sworn I also heard Paul fault Brendan (when Paul and Mary were discussing who should win) because "Brendan does well with things he can practice at home".  The implication to me was that Brendan had not done better than the others on, say, the technical challenges.  Whatever. It just seemed like a double standard to me. John practices at home more, does better and is rewarded for his improved performance, and Brendan, well, he practices at home and gets dinged for it? Or did I just imagine I heard Paul say that?

(And what exactly are the criteria for being the winner of this show, anyway?  Based on this season, I would say that displaying random moments of great inspiration or creativity, even if a number of your bakes are sub-par (and you even miss a bake due to injury) is more important than consistently displaying excellent classic skills and bakes but failing to produce really cutting-edge or innovative output.  I would also say that it helps--if you want to win--to be on the younger side and earnest and emo and maybe a bit hungry. Being older and settled and less demonstrative and more confident in your baking skills will work against you. )

I'm glad John got a new career out of it, and I know it's been 6-7 years since filming, but I honestly believe the winner was chosen based on having the more appealing back story and what it would mean for his future. I know many of you disagree with me, but hey, as the French say, "chacun à son goût".    

The winner is the contestant who does the best on the three bakes on the final weekend.  Previous weeks do not count towards it, as it's not a cumulative type of prize.  Thus, being consistent, while helpful in getting through week to week, does not necessarily help you win.

[proserpina65]

On ‎08‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 11:36 AM, justmehere said:

I can't remember John's performance in the technical bakes, but maybe he did a little better.

John did better than Brendan in six out of the ten weeks, and was Star Baker once. 

[proserpina65]

On ‎08‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 12:08 PM, Mumbles said:

She came in last the first week, second to last the next three weeks. She came in first on week 5, fourth out of 7 on week 6, first on weeks 7 and 8, 4 out of 4, and first the final week. One person’s growth is another person’s inconsistency.

It's pretty obviously growth, since her poor weeks were all early in the season, except for week 9; she came in first in the technical in 3 of the last four weeks.

1 hour ago, Kohola3 said:

The only citrus I think goes with chocolate is orange. I agree it was an odd combo.

I've had chocolates with lemon flavored filling, and they were delicious.  (Edited to note that they were dark chocolate - maybe that's why they worked.)

Edited August 20, 2018 by proserpina65

[stitcher73]

On 8/18/2018 at 3:03 PM, Mittengirl said:

Could they have poured the icing over the “fancies”?  The icing looked thin enough to frost the bottom, pour over the top and then move to a clean surface to present.  Or use two forks - stab one in the middle and rest the bottom on another one.  

 

John’s showstopper chocolate cake was the only one I really wanted to taste.  The others were more like - sure i’d try a bite out of curiosity.  But I think I could eat that chocolate cake all by my self.  Sure I would regret it, but YOLO.

I was thinking if I was doing this I would have used an old fashioned potato masher.  Balanced the fancy on there, dipped it in the icing and raised it up.

[dleighg]

1 hour ago, stitcher73 said:

I was thinking if I was doing this I would have used an old fashioned potato masher.  Balanced the fancy on there, dipped it in the icing and raised it up.

what a clever idea!

[Kathira]

19 hours ago, Quilt Fairy said:

OMG I hate that f*king commercial! The only good thing about the show ending is I won't have to listen to it anymore.

YMMV, obviously.

 

13 hours ago, Emkat said:

I cannot hit mute fast enough when that commercial comes on! 

Aww, you guys don't like Bob Dylan and the friendly chickens! My only problem with it is that it's a bit of an ear worm, which is what led me to seek it out. Sometimes listening to a whole song will cure an ear worm, especially if you have just one line or phrase stuck in your head.

 

15 hours ago, Brookside said:

I was so pleased for John.  He was obviously overwhelmed at achieving his own dream, rather than someone else's.  And his mum and sister were clearly so proud.

(I didn't think they were being mean in the talking head - just having a bit of fun. 

I also thought his family were "taking the piss" which is a very British tradition of saying the opposite of what you mean when you like someone or are proud of them.