S06.E14: Second Honeymoons, Part 2

[biakbiak]

7 minutes ago, Jack Sampson said:

Did you really think she would accept responsibility?  Molly's strategy is to deny, deflect blame and play a victim - Jon's twisting her words after all, he's the jerk for trying to make her look bad on TV and Dr Whatshername is a jerk for taking his side! 

Not responsibility, just smarter in her convo with Dr. Nonspice since she knew a recording existed. She clearly is comfortable lying so I assumed she would be better at it and also change her language and tone because she knew it was being recorded.

[becauseIsaidso]

As I watched the show, I was at first dismayed with Jaclyn's comments and expressions of hope for her marriage with Ryan. Then I noticed the expression on her face during the meeting with the 'expert' - it was one of sadness and resignation. It occurred to me then that she is saying what she needs to say in order to placate Ryan - who, I would not doubt for a second, goes nuclear whenever he hears Jaclyn saying anything that suggests his way is not the only/best way and that he is a prince among men (I'd insert a vomit emoji here if I knew one) - until she can say  'no' on decision day and walk away from the oversized two-year old she has been saddled with. Ryan seems to have figured out that when he hears certain key words (rigid, unyielding, one-sided, etc.) he needs to utter a few pat phrases to dig himself out of the hole he has dug. If/when Jaclyn bails, he'll probably blame her form not giving him a chance, or for not 'communicating' her feelings correctly. If she stays with him, I am certain it will be because he has brow-beaten her into believing that with one dead fiancée and one divorce, she'd be nothing but an old-maid failure for the rest of her life. I really want to see her tell Ryan he's just not good enough for her, hand back the ring, and walk out with her head held high.

[becauseIsaidso]

9 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

Wake up Shawnice.  A few fights in a corn maze doesn't constitute not staying together in a marriage.  It's not the end of the world if Jep wanted to walk alone for a bit.  Give the guy a little space and stop being so clingy.   I don't blame him.   Shawnice talks too much.  She would drive my husband crazy.  This is only the beginning.

I don't know what Jon sees in Molly.  He is a complete doormat.  I can't stand to look at her phoney face anymore.

 

Molly would stay with Jon if they could go on rides every week.  That's the only time I've actually seen her laugh so much.  I'm so tired of hearing her say they have so much in common for the hundredth time.  Amusement parks are sooo adventuress.

Party Boy Ryan never has enough.  Jackie wanted to relax for the next day's activities.  It was their weekend together.  He didn't have to go out again with the cousins.  And he's deciding if he wants to stay with her?  That's a laugh.  I hope she dumps his ass.

ITA totally. Not that Jepthe doesn't need a bit of an attitude adjustment - as in understanding he is one half of a couple, he CHOSE this and he needs to make room in his heart and mind for his wife. But clingy is so very unattractive - and I think Shawnice is better than that, and is simply stuck in overreact mode since the early days of the marriage when Jepthe really did seem to be rejecting her/the idea that he had chosen to work in double harness.  I am still worried about the 'push back' comments, but allowing that I may be misinterpreting him, I do like them together and see a lot more genuine interaction than either of the other couples - with the exception of Jon calling Molly on her actual behavior.

[becauseIsaidso]

Last night I started wondering if Jon has been suffering from stress sweat. That stuff is nasty. I've only had it a couple of times, but it was profuse and quite stinky and did NOT go away until the stressor was removed. 

[LennieBriscoe]

Tonight's episode: "Sex,  Lies,  and Videotape"!

silverspoons, Molly said "2" BEFORE Jon said "One."  So she wasn't "One-upping" him. But she WAS pretending.

JocelynCavanaugh, Of course Molly isn't beholden to love or even like Jon,  but she could be at a minimum decent to him.  NOBODY comes back emotionally from being told,  "You're disgusting! You make my skin crawl!" Dead Marriage Walking. (And when did "thin and blonde" stop being America's "cultural ideal"?!)

Ryan,  Ryan,  Ryan. He has quite the self-satisfied opinion,  no? He has nothing to change or improve, not in appearance, not in habits, not in goals or desires. Why can't Jackie SEE this?! Hey, Jackie, you know  that wanderlust you have? KICK IT INTO HIGH GEAR NOW,  GIRL!

Jephte bought a dog. Now, I think the scruffy pup is adorable, but a dog shouldn't be a surprise. It's already sleeping in the marital bed!

And what's with the "I don't trust you" to Shawniece? "Don't trust" her not to leave? Jephte,  have you not been paying attention? She is all in,  if you could get on her "team"!

Which teamwork, Gem10, was, IMO,  the real point of assigning this couple the maze. No,  his walking ahead wasn't "the end of the world," but it WAS, as Shawniece immediately intuited, an indication of Jephte's current level of commitment (which he turned around to "not trusting" HER). Hence, Shawniece's emotional reaction and her wanting to be done with the maze,  then and there. 

Tonight's  highlight: When NotDr. Pepper brought the Blunt Talk Hammer down. Awesome. 

Edited April 11, 2018 by LennieBriscoe

[ElectricCityy]

I don't like Jon but Molly just strikes me as a "perfect princess". I don't  believe Jon did anything behind closed doors to turn her off. She's just a mean person.

[Yeah No]

Ryan said that Jackie fits in his "box" but oh clueless one is too self centered to realize that's only because until this point she's allowed herself to be.  The whole point of the exchange with Dr. Pepper was for her to voice her discomfort with that situation but he keeps twisting reality around to suit what he wants despite constant evidence to the contrary.  I think she is painfully aware of this but still thinks they can overcome all of that.  I'm wondering when she's going to realize that he's not going to change and face that their relationship is ultimately doomed.  I think deep down she may fear this herself judging from her overall defeated demeanor.

At first I thought Shawniece was being clingy and needy in her reaction to Jephte's solo run through the maze, but I later realized that like the doctor said, it was not about the maze at all but what the maze symbolized about their relationship.  When put in that context Jephte was made to see that it was about his lack of relationship communication skills that gives Shawniece the wrong impression that he's not a team with her but still flying solo.  I think the puppy was a grand gesture to show her he's on her team and is committed to the relationship.  I really hope they make it.  I think they both still have trust issues between each other that if not resolved could do in the relationship.  I'll keep my fingers crossed but right now I feel like it could last beyond decision day but not necessarily beyond the year.

[humbleopinion]

Went back to see what was Molly's response to the revealing video of her gutting Jon...Molly says to Dr. Jessica ..."he twists and twists my words"...her lying is so automatic and seamless...she continues to blatantly lie, eyes wide open and unblinkingly...

Jon did make himself vulnerable to Molly and she took advantage of his emotional frailties.

Molly always has to be crushing it ...well, she crushed Jon's soul, made him doubt himself, forced him to swallow all his pride and play her waiting game.

Roll the beautiful bar room footage...Molly still stood tall in her deceit..she did not back down until Dr. Jessica rebuked her.

Molly has never been caught lying on such a big stage(basic cable show big)...she always had gotten away with lying before...

Edited April 11, 2018 by humbleopinion

[Kareem]

The word of the night was "betrayed".  Molly was betrayed and obviously, there is no coming back from that.  I'm still laughing.  smh 

[Yeah No]

8 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

Unfiltered show-Ryan (Grammerians will cringe)

Grammarians!  Sorry, as one I felt it was my duty, lol.  ;-)

[humbleopinion]

Yeah, no....D'oh, thx.

There goes my Junior Orthographers of America membership...it was probationary...epic fail.

Edited April 11, 2018 by humbleopinion

[Booger666]

6 hours ago, Yeah No said:

I don't know what Dr. Jessica was talking about in the beginning of that segment before she saw the video.  She made some comment about Jon not being emotionally mature enough for Molly - I wonder if after seeing the video and having her head turned around 180 degrees she would still say that or whether she would reverse that and say that about Molly instead.

I think she and the other experts were believing Molly’s lies over Jon’s truths for the past 6 weeks and made bad assumptions.  Before the tape the expert was buying Molly’s lie of “I don’t know why Jon gets mad like he does, we were in a loud bar and I couldn’t hear him is all”.  Molly has been painting everything to be Jon’s fault to the experts.  I’m glad he did the tape and was finally believed.  I got the sense the tape was much, much worse than we were shown. I’d love to see the unedited tape, but understand that we won’t.

[psychoticstate]

Molly has been a lying liar since day one, when she "interviewed" to get MAFS.  She presented herself as a fun adventuress, the life of the party, someone so "wild" and uninhibited that she and a friend picked up some guy in a bar for a threesome.  That's not what we have seen, unless you consider going to a water park wild and adventurous.  

She could be like Ashley from Atlanta and was turned off from the moment she saw Jon because he's not her usual type.  Maybe he smacks his food or clips his toenails in bed.  Whatever, Molly has been emotionally closed off and checked out since the beginning.   Unless the editing monkeys are playing with us, Jon has not done anything in order to receive the treatment he's been getting from her.  If that were the case, as another poster noted, don't you think Molly would have brought it up when Dr. Jessica busted her for lying?  Molly didn't say anything about how Jon treated her or acted when the cameras were off; nope, she tried to deflect, threatened to lose her shit and then talk over Dr. Jessica.  

I feel badly for Jon.  He seems like a good guy.  Everyone else appears to like him (except maybe Ryan who is threatened by him) so he can't be all bad.  From what we've seen, he's tried very hard to make this crapfest of a marriage work -  unless he's David Norton 2.0, I am firmly in his corner.  I really wonder what the other couples make of this.

So Dr. Pepper goes to visit Ryan and Jackie, notices Jackie looks sad but doesn't really address it?  Or did I miss it?  (Because I was totally there this epi for the Molly smackdown)  Looks like she said that you have to be in the marriage for the long haul and then everyone was all smiles?  Really?  And not a word was addressed as to Jackie taking off her wedding ring and giving it back to Ryan?   Run, Jackie.  You deserve better.  Call Jon.

In this episode, Jephte came across much more mature than Shawniece.  They have a disagreement and she's ready to call quits on the whole thing?  Jephte gives her an opening by saying he's not sure what she wants, 7 weeks in (we're not sure either right now, Jephte) and she rides away on her Huffy bike to the next room?  With Dr. Pepper there?  Really?  That was a golden opportunity to tell Jephte exactly what you do want, Shawniece  - that you want to act as a team and participate in things together.  As Dr. Pepper said (paraphrasing) - forget the damn cornfield! 

Kiki Pierre is all kinds of cute!  

[humbleopinion]

Jackie's reasoning...she must want the marriage to work because she is so sad and upset about it.

What the hell...?

No, sweetie...you are depressed and defeated because your husband is an insensitive jerk-off who drinks too much, doesn't think about you at all when he goes out nightly with the boys, and basically doesn't want to bother with you...

Edited April 11, 2018 by humbleopinion

[Crazy Bird Lady]

1 hour ago, LennieBriscoe said:

Tonight's episode: "Sex,  Lies,  and Videotape"!

JocelynCavanaugh, Of course Molly isn't beholden to love or even like Jon,  but she could be at a minimum decent to him.  NOBODY comes back emotionally from being told,  "You're disgusting! You make my skin crawl!" Dead Marriage Walking. (And when did "thin and blonde" stop being America's "cultural ideal"?!)

Jephte bought a dog. Now, I think the scruffy pup is adorable, but a dog shouldn't be a surprise. It's already sleeping in the marital bed!

And what's with the "I don't trust you" to Shawniece? "Don't trust" her not to leave? Jephte,  have you not been paying attention? She is all in,  if you could get on her "team"!

[Teamwork] was, IMO,  the real point of assigning this couple the maze. No,  his walking ahead wasn't "the end of the world," but it WAS, as Shawniece immediately intuited, an indication of Jephte's current level of commitment (which he turned around to "not trusting" HER). Hence, Shawniece's emotional reaction and her wanting to be done with the maze,  then and there. 

Tonight's  highlight: When NotDr. Pepper brought the Blunt Talk Hammer down. Awesome. 

I pretty much agree with every word of that. Well said!

I know it's not a popular impression, but I still think Jephte handles frustration and anger badly. He was even talking (again) about 'he doesn't know her and doesn't trust her so he doesn't want to know her'... " Shawniece is an emotional woman, who definitely wears her heart on her sleeve and sometimes blows things out of proportion, but she's for real and she's "all in". 

3 minutes ago, Kareem said:

The word of the night was "betrayed".  Molly was betrayed and obviously, there is no coming back from that.  I'm still laughing.  smh 

That!

8 minutes ago, humbleopinion said:

Went back to see what was Molly's response to the revealing video of her gutting Jon...Molly says to Dr. Jessica ..."he twists and twists my words"...her lying is so automatic and seamless...she continues blatantly lie, eyes wide open and unblinkingly...

She's been lying since the first day she met Jon, and my guess is that's how she lives her life.

10 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

Ryan said that Jackie fits in his "box" but oh clueless one is too self centered to realize that's only because until this point she's allowed herself to be.  The whole point of the exchange with Dr. Pepper was for her to voice her discomfort with that situation but he keeps twisting reality around to suit what he wants despite constant evidence to the contrary.  I think she is painfully aware of this but still thinks they can overcome all of that.  I'm wondering when she's going to realize that he's not going to change and face that their relationship is ultimately doomed.  I think deep down she may fear this herself judging from her overall defeated demeanor.

At first I thought Shawniece was being clingy and needy in her reaction to Jephte's solo run through the maze, but I later realized that like the doctor said, it was not about the maze at all but what the maze symbolized about their relationship.  When put in that context Jephte was made to see that it was about his lack of relationship communication skills that gives Shawniece the wrong impression that he's not a team with her but still flying solo.  I think the puppy was a grand gesture to show her he's on her team and is committed to the relationship.  I really hope they make it.  I think they both still have trust issues between each other that if not resolved could do in the relationship.  I'll keep my fingers crossed but right now I feel like it could last beyond decision day but not necessarily beyond the year.

I think they're the only couple that even has a chance to make it past Decision Day. But I totally agree --I doubt it would last beyond the year.  Unfortunate, they're a likeable couple usually.

50 minutes ago, ElectricCityy said:

I don't like Jon but Molly just strikes me as a "perfect princess". I don't  believe Jon did anything behind closed doors to turn her off. She's just a mean person.

She could have starred on "Mean Girls"... if she were prettier.

[Empress1]

8 hours ago, scruffy73 said:

Jon is a scary gorilla? Really? What has made him scary and animalistic? I haven’t seen that all.

for the record, the issue, at least for me, is not that Molly is not attracted to Jon, it is that she kept leading him on with the “maybe it will grow” and “we are so compatible”. If a man makes your skin crawl, you are not compatible at all, much less 99%. She is a faker and that sucks.

and the therapist (name?) really behaved like. Most therapists who found out they have been lied to, to her face, minutes before. My therapist would not have gone to “how do you feel in this moment” until he acknowledged that I committed the biggest sin in couseling - lying.

I don't find Jon scary either. He's a big guy and he might be physically intimidating in person, but his personality doesn't come across as intimidating. He seems pretty laid back to me.

Molly is allowed not to like Jon. I've said many times before that Jon is A type but he is not MY type; I understand intellectually that he is good-looking, but he doesn't do much for me. I remember the guy my friend/former roommate dated before she met her husband - he was a nice guy, good on paper, treated her well ... and she wasn't into him. She tried, she knew intellectually she "should" like him, but he just didn't give her the butterflies in her stomach. If Molly wasn't feeling it, she wasn't - you can't force chemistry. What I think is shitty is for her to a) speak to him the way she spoke to him in that video, and apparently that wasn't the first time she's spoken to him that way (a man would only get one time to tell me I made his skin crawl); b) behave COMPLETELY differently on camera vs. off in an attempt to save face, somehow; c) lie to everyone. Do the other couples know about her two-faced-ness?

And the therapist was responding to being lied to - she said outright "I asked you about the fight in FL, it was nothing like [you said it was]." If Molly has been spinning this yarn about how hopeful she feels about her relationship and how she and Jon are on the same page about everything (which we know is a lie since he wanted physical intimacy and Molly did not) while telling Jon he's disgusting and he makes her skin crawl, Molly has been undermining the experts' work all along. You can tell the therapist had bought at least some of what Molly had been saying when they showed her talking head after she met with Molly alone, saying she didn't think Jon had the emotional maturity Molly needed. Therapists use what you give them. Molly gave them bullshit.

I don't have experience with couples' therapy but I DO have experience with individual therapy, and when I've been in a situation that is bad for me (not just romantic), my therapist has pointed out that it's not making me happy and challenged me to look at why I was staying. I don't think any couples' therapist should be encouraging someone to stay with someone who has said they're repulsed by them.

[Gem 10]

5 hours ago, Yeah No said:

I don't doubt he's telling the truth that it happened at other times but I confess I would like to hear the details.  This video was very short (at least what they showed us was) and I'm not sure what the context was of her calling him "disgusting".  Was it was because he was filming her or because he was upset with her for flirting with another guy or both?  Or because she just finds him yucky in general?  I don't get it.  I suppose it doesn't matter, but I am still curious.

I wish they would ask him that next week so we can put the puzzle together.  Sitting at the bar, Molly was probably smiling all cutsey and talking nice with the guy.  Jon went nuts as she never did that with him.  At this point, Molly should come clean and tell us why she turned off to Jon from the beginning as she has nothing to lose now.  Her reputation just went down the toilet for sure.   Molly and Ryan can't walk around Boston with their heads held high anymore.  Poor parents.

[kira28]

I think Shawniece has unrealistic expectations of marriage. It doesn't mean you are tied at the hip all the time and have to agree on everything. 

I think Jon is getting a good edit much like David and David ended up being a skeevy gross asshole. Not sure what Jon's true Personality is and while it's not His fault molly is a lying liar who lies but  I suspect he's not totally innocent. I don't get how he can say he really cares about Molly. If she's been as hands off and cold to him as they have shown and if she's called him names and not been open to his  advances then why in the hell would lead Jon to care about her beside the fact that he finds  her very attractive? The recording.. I interpreted the your disgusting as she finds it disgusting that he's recording her. I would feel that way too. Who knows what was said befor the recording. If Molly looked like Jackie (not really Jon's type) I think he would have checked out a while ago. 

 

Jackie please leave! Most guys are on their best behavior in the first few months

 They blow off their friends they want to spend all their free time with you. Ryan only wants to hang out with you when there is absolutely nothing else for him to do and then he has to run off with his friends to escape being with you. He's shown you exactly who he is so believe him. He's just not into anyone but himself. 

[humbleopinion]

What if it had been Jon saying those hateful things to Molly...because he is physically bigger would it be seen as aggression?

Would the audience react as if Molly was in physical danger  if Jon called her a monster and disgusting...?

Molly was pissed the experts matched her with Jon and she has taken out her disappointment and growing resentment on the one person she was saddled with for 8 weeks.

 Her discontent festered into hatred and she unabashedly took it out on Jon.

Molly's voice was dripping with such hate...no one deserves to be the receiving end of such negative speech.

[gonecrackers]

I want to sit with Jon & Molly separately, sans cameras & repercussions, & ask many, many questions.

I loved scruffy puppy, & realize that was no surprise to Shawniece. I just hope production didn't dig her out of a shelter somewhere & intend to put her back when filming is over. It's like they needed to one up the A&A snail family with a pupper. Hopefully she won't be a casualty if they do the one year divorce thing.

[ShowFan]

I don’t get how Molly says she didn’t know she was being recorded, but in the clip she says “you are recording yourself...” Also, I didn’t get why that video had to be such shaky quality with the lines going through it. That’s like an antenna reception. How do you even do that? I am glad that she is finally revealed, one way or the other. Just curious about the logistics 

[humbleopinion]

To me the topper of Molly's tirade was when she boohooed to taunt Jon... equating him with a baby...I would have lost my shit...

That would be the wrongest reaction....but the most honest.

Edited April 11, 2018 by humbleopinion

[butterflyeludesme]

I may need to rewatch the Molly and Jon scenes but I was totally confused. He said one minute she was dancing and grinding on him and the next she was talking to a guy at the bar and the video tape incident happened? If she is repulsed by him why was she grinding on him? Talk about mixed signals! And why did she act like she had no idea what video tape existed? She said he was videoing IN the video. 

[Gem 10]

9 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

Jon's wet pits.  Jon's unemployment.  John's cat that he loves.  Three reasons Molly doesn't like him!  Add in he's a really nice guy that fell for her and tried to make it work.

Jon became Molly's whipping boy behind closed doors if she did say the mean nasty things she's accused of saying

A real train wreck.

Jackie always looks so sad.  I really like her but that dark cloud hanging over her makes me sad to watch.

The pits can be fixed, he could find a job, he could control his loud laugh.  I still say Molly is a virgin, afraid of men, plays games and is a PSYCHO.  

[humbleopinion]

Botox to the pits will help with the sweating, saw a pix of him in an ugly Christmas sweater in his work cubicle, so he did get a job post production...his laugh is spontaneous so why suppress?

Hope Jon walks away and with therapy (Jon, hope you opted for your job's expensive medical plan that has the highest mental health allowance) learns that he is lovable and deserves love...

Reach out to commiserate with Neil to learn how he coped after the show.

Smoke some weed with Derek...yeah.....

Edited April 11, 2018 by humbleopinion

[humbleopinion]

M@FS Spin off show...Jon drives Tom's bus to visit Neil, Cody, David, Sean...

 Jackie goes road tripping to visit Sonia, Lily, Jackie of Tito's fame, Davina and her hubby, Sam and Mr. Wise, Anthony and Ashley...

[Gem 10]

2 hours ago, LennieBriscoe said:

Tonight's episode: "Sex,  Lies,  and Videotape"!

silverspoons, Molly said "2" BEFORE Jon said "One."  So she wasn't "One-upping" him. But she WAS pretending.

JocelynCavanaugh, Of course Molly isn't beholden to love or even like Jon,  but she could be at a minimum decent to him.  NOBODY comes back emotionally from being told,  "You're disgusting! You make my skin crawl!" Dead Marriage Walking. (And when did "thin and blonde" stop being America's "cultural ideal"?!)

Ryan,  Ryan,  Ryan. He has quite the self-satisfied opinion,  no? He has nothing to change or improve, not in appearance, not in habits, not in goals or desires. Why can't Jackie SEE this?! Hey, Jackie, you know  that wanderlust you have? KICK IT INTO HIGH GEAR NOW,  GIRL!

Jephte bought a dog. Now, I think the scruffy pup is adorable, but a dog shouldn't be a surprise. It's already sleeping in the marital bed!

And what's with the "I don't trust you" to Shawniece? "Don't trust" her not to leave? Jephte,  have you not been paying attention? She is all in,  if you could get on her "team"!

Which teamwork, Gem10, was, IMO,  the real point of assigning this couple the maze. No,  his walking ahead wasn't "the end of the world," but it WAS, as Shawniece immediately intuited, an indication of Jephte's current level of commitment (which he turned around to "not trusting" HER). Hence, Shawniece's emotional reaction and her wanting to be done with the maze,  then and there. 

Tonight's  highlight: When NotDr. Pepper brought the Blunt Talk Hammer down. Awesome. 

 

I misunderstood.  I thought the weekend away for thr three couples was to have fun.  Didn't know it was an "exercise" in teamwork as in the maze.  Twenty lashes for me.  BTW, did Jepthe know it was an exercise?  If so, then he was wrong.

Edited April 11, 2018 by Gem 10

[psychoticstate]

59 minutes ago, kira28 said:

I think Shawniece has unrealistic expectations of marriage. It doesn't mean you are tied at the hip all the time and have to agree on everything. 

I think Jon is getting a good edit much like David and David ended up being a skeevy gross asshole. Not sure what Jon's true Personality is and while it's not His fault molly is a lying liar who lies but  I suspect he's not totally innocent. I don't get how he can say he really cares about Molly. If she's been as hands off and cold to him as they have shown and if she's called him names and not been open to his  advances then why in the hell would lead Jon to care about her beside the fact that he finds  her very attractive? The recording.. I interpreted the your disgusting as she finds it disgusting that he's recording her. I would feel that way too. Who knows what was said befor the recording. If Molly looked like Jackie (not really Jon's type) I think he would have checked out a while ago. 

 

Jackie please leave! Most guys are on their best behavior in the first few months

 They blow off their friends they want to spend all their free time with you. Ryan only wants to hang out with you when there is absolutely nothing else for him to do and then he has to run off with his friends to escape being with you. He's shown you exactly who he is so believe him. He's just not into anyone but himself. 

Totally agree about Shawniece having unrealistic expectations of marriage.  Yes, you should be a partnership, a team but that doesn't mean you do absolutely everything together at all times.  And if you have any type of disagreement, IT'S OVER!  

I hope Jon is not David 2.0, as I said above.  I think he's hung in there and stated he cares for Molly because she IS his wife.  I think he went all in on this and he got saddled with a cruel, cold witch.  I believe he's tried the routes of being affectionate and then giving Molly her space and nothing is working because she's got her mind made up and it's been that way.  Really unfair to Jon.  And really unfair to go on this show if you aren't open.  It must have been terrible for Jon to go to these couple things, see and hear how things are going for the other two couples, while Molly is talking to him and treating him the way she has been off-camera.  He really needs to tell her to just go eff herself and be done with it. 

[humbleopinion]

Second honeymoons forces them to be together 48 hours without places to hide or escape.. work, family, friends are taken out of the equation...

For all 3 of this season's couples it was the lit match to their volatile marriages... whoosh...bonfires...

 In comparison, last season, Ashley/Ant had fun with their taxidermy roommates.....

Edited April 11, 2018 by humbleopinion

[psychoticstate]

This is for Dr. Jessica, calling Molly on her b.s. 

Bam!  Bitch goes down! 

[discoprincess]

11 hours ago, JocelynCavanaugh said:

I realize I’m the only person here who doesn’t think Molly is a complete monster for not being attracted to that scary gorilla (or for daring to be thin and blonde, even though that hasn’t actually been the cultural ideal in decades), but I would hope people can at least see how totally out of line and unprofessional that alleged therapist was. If she’s just there for entertainment purposes, then fine, but she’s flaunting her credentials while undermining the basic tenets of her training. 

Molly did not choose Jon. She can’t help it if he makes her skin crawl. We’ll probably never know what he actually did to make her feel that way. 

And FTR, this “Jon gave up his JOB FOR HER” shit can miss me. He allowed himself to be fired so he could go on a reality show. Hardly the stuff of legends. 

 

 

12 hours ago, Neurochick said:

I don't like Molly, not because she's not attracted to Jon, but because of her dishonesty. 

I watch a lot of Animal Planet/Blue Planet, nature type shows.  One thing I have noticed with many species is that the female decides whether the male can mount her or not.  If the female agrees, it's all good, if not, oh well.  With Jon and Molly, I'm watching a female just say, "no."   Now in nature, if it's a no, that's it, everybody understands.  But this isn't nature, it's not natural.  This is a TV show and Jon and Molly are married.  Molly says no, which if fine in nature and in life, but not fine on a reality show.  If Molly had said no early on, said she wanted a divorce, said she wasn't feeling it, she might have feared how she would have been seen.  Now she looks even worse, because now she's been exposed as a liar.  She just should have been honest from the start.

 

 

10 hours ago, scruffy73 said:

Jon is a scary gorilla? Really? What has made him scary and animalistic? I haven’t seen that all.

for the record, the issue, at least for me, is not that Molly is not attracted to Jon, it is that she kept leading him on with the “maybe it will grow” and “we are so compatible”. If a man makes your skin crawl, you are not compatible at all, much less 99%. She is a faker and that sucks.

and the therapist (name?) really behaved like. Most therapists who found out they have been lied to, to her face, minutes before. My therapist would not have gone to “how do you feel in this moment” until he acknowledged that I committed the biggest sin in couseling - lying.

 

10 hours ago, After7Only said:

People don’t dislike Molly because she isn’t attracted to Jon  or that she is thin and blond.  They dislike her because she is obviously lying to everyone including the audience.   The words she chooses to use towards  Jon are cruel and not how you speak to your husband.   If Jon had said similar things to her or mistreated her in any way, I’m pretty sure she would have used that as her excuse to exit the marriage.   She and Ryan are 2 peas in a pod, living in their own alternate realities.

 

8 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Well now the truth comes out.  I knew Molly was faker than a 3 dollar bill and now we know for sure.  She is a mean bitch on top of a liar.  I would like to know what Jon did to deserve her vile treatment.  She was caught dead to rights, there was no way for her to lie her way out of it.  I feel sorry for Jon that he had to come down to her level in order to "out" her.  I think Dr. Jessica might have been admitting that she didn't take Jon's complaints seriously prior to seeing the video.  She probably was reserving judgment or remaining skeptical because she was also buying Molly's act.  It took Jon showing her the video to convince her that he was for real and Molly was not.  I think that's why she came down so hard on Molly - because she felt duped.  

Dr. Jessica also seemed to criticize Jon for staying in the relationship for as long as he did if he was getting that kind of treatment when the cameras were off.  She then told them both not to stay in the relationship "just for the show".   I'm not sure I buy that they aren't strongly pushed by the show to stay and keep the game face on to the cameras even if things are rotten when they're turned off.  Otherwise a lot of them would back out mid way through and there would be no show.  I understand that she's a therapist and is looking out for their best interests, but we all know that the show itself only cares about ratings.  So I really don't blame the participants for seeing the 8 weeks through to the end.  If anyone should be blamed for staying too long it's Molly as she was the one with the big problem with Jon.

I was trying to give Molly the benefit of the doubt, even though she was being trashed on the boards and social media. If one is not attracted to someone else, that's understandable. There isn't much others can do to fix that. We saw that last season with Danielle and Cody and in the Miami season with Derek and Heather. Heather for whatever reason felt that she truly could not submit herself to stay in the marriage for the full 8 weeks, so she got out. Danielle chose to stay, but we didn't hear any reports of her being extraordinarily cruel to Cody (aside from Cody groaning about not having consummated the marriage). If Molly's level of disgust was on apparently on the level of Heather's, then why did she choose to stay? She really should have done whatever she could to get herself out, if not to spare Jon, but for the sake of her own mental health! Either that, or speak to Jon off-camera and come to an agreement that even though this "marriage" was DOA, they were going to have to make due because they were stuck with each other for 8 weeks. From what Jon was saying, that didn't happen, and Molly had been sending mixed messages. 

 

Edited to add: It's also notable that the experts didn't seem to have any clue of how Molly felt about her husband. Why didn't Molly at least let it slip that she wasn't really attracted to Jon?

Edited April 11, 2018 by discoprincess

[Captain Asshat]

16 hours ago, JocelynCavanaugh said:

I thought therapists weren’t supposed to take sides and get emotionally involved. “Dr. Jessica Griffin” was embarrassing with her “this has been intense for all of us,” (us?! This isn’t about you.) and getting all aggressive and obviously favoring one client over another. 

I realize I’m the only person here who doesn’t think Molly is a complete monster for not being attracted to that scary gorilla (or for daring to be thin and blonde, even though that hasn’t actually been the cultural ideal in decades), but I would hope people can at least see how totally out of line and unprofessional that alleged therapist was. If she’s just there for entertainment purposes, then fine, but she’s flaunting her credentials while undermining the basic tenets of her training. 

Molly did not choose Jon. She can’t help it if he makes her skin crawl. We’ll probably never know what he actually did to make her feel that way. 

And FTR, this “Jon gave up his JOB FOR HER” shit can miss me. He allowed himself to be fired so he could go on a reality show. Hardly the stuff of legends. 

 

Totally agree with you on the therapist point. Then again, I hate that a pastor is involved in this show. Sorry, but I can't respect a clergyman who participates in something called a "marriage experiment," much less an experiment with a dismal success rate. But, it's a TV show, and the "experts" are aware of what they're doing. We, the audience, are aware of what this show really is.

That all said, I don't think Molly is a monster for not being attracted to Jon, or for being thin and blonde. She wouldn't be the first on this show who wasn't attracted to her husband and didn't want to have sex with him. She wouldn't even be the first to share those feelings with her husband or the audience. I think Molly's heinous, because she tells the cameras and audience and experts that she and Jon are 99% compatible, and their marriage has a chance. Then, when the cameras are off, she apparently berates Jon about how not attracted she is to him. Look, you can not be attracted to someone, be honest with him about not being attracted to him, but also not be a colossal dick about it. Granted, we have a recording of only one instance. However, Jon stated he resorted to recording Molly, because no one seemed to believe him when he's mentioned that type of behavior in the past. If that recording is an indicator of her usual "no-camera" interaction with him, she's horrible. That's not how an adult treats someone. That's not how a friend treats a friend. That's not how a decent person treats another human being.

Edited April 11, 2018 by Captain Asshat

[Palomar]

10 hours ago, PupCal said:

I'd be sad too if my husband spent most of his nights out drinking with the boys,

And you know it is only going to get worse.  Wait until the kids come.  He will not want to come home and be expected to "help out".  He flat out does not want to change his single lifestyle and doesn't feel he should have to compromise. His priority is "the boys", his activities, then Jackie. That is not likely to change unless he doesn't want to lose her and he makes a last ditch effort.

[Empress1]

11 minutes ago, Palomar said:

And you know it is only going to get worse.  Wait until the kids come.  He will not want to come home and be expected to "help out".  He flat out does not want to change his single lifestyle and doesn't feel he should have to compromise. His priority is "the boys", his activities, then Jackie. That is not likely to change unless he doesn't want to lose her and he makes a last ditch effort.

Ryan appears to be the kind of person who would refer to raising his own kids as babysitting.

[SnarkAttack30]

This episode confirmed everything I have felt about Molly: she piles on the makeup to hide her acne just like she piles on the lies and deflects to hide her disgust and disdain for Jon. She is not a "terrible person" or a "monster" but if we take the show away from this equation and this was a blind date, she would have never called him back in the first place. With the cameras rolling, and perhaps she feels a duty to the show, she kept up the fake persona and when it all became too much, her true colors showed. Being forced to be with someone you have no interest in sucks and I can imagine it sucking even more with media attention. That being said, she probably should not have signed up to do the show. There was always a chance that she would not like the man she was partnered with and she should have been mature enough to say to herself that she shouldn't go through with it if she couldn't be honest. Jon isn't a bad looking guy and has been seemingly patient enough, but he is immature. He has admitted his weaknesses and it is about time that makeup-Molly does too. I think most people find her repugnant not because she has no affection for Jon but the way in which she handled it was deceitful and hurtful. 

 

To me, the most manipulative person on that show is Ryan. He completely doesn't listen to the experts and misses the point in any advice or feedback his wife gives him. Everyone knows the saying, "happy wife, happy life" and the meaning of that is that compromise has to happen. Not all the time from the guy, but in a marriage everyone compromises at some point. He refuses to see it that way. He should WANT to spend more time with his wife to get to know if forever is possible for them. Instead, he goes out with his boys and talks shit and then comes home drunk and then, just to spite her because she is upset he went out, he goes and does it again. Being spiteful and unwilling to bend will end a marriage. Yes, she seems a bit needy at times, but on a weekend that was FOR them he shouldn't have planned to go out with friends or cousins. Even his "friends" should advise that he take the time to really devote to his wife. This isn't frat time, it's commitment time. He wants someone to "fit in his perfect box" but what isn't occurring to him is that he should not have a rigid box to put people in in the first place. 

[bichonblitz]

I don't like it when Shawniece or Jep walk out of the room in the middle of an argument. They both do it and it's an immature way to handle the situation. They both seem childish to me in so many ways. 

I was once married to a guy that liked being with his buddies too much of the time. The marriage didn't last. Cut your losses, Jackie, and don't settle. 

I guess we can add "phony" to the list of things that are wrong with that insufferable bitch Molly. I still want to know what it is about Jon that makes her skin crawl. It's like the elephant in the room. These two must be sooooo different off camera. 

[Crazy Bird Lady]

22 minutes ago, SnarkAttack30 said:

Everyone knows the saying, "happy wife, happy life" and the meaning of that is that compromise has to happen. Not all the time from the guy, but in a marriage everyone compromises at some point. He [Ryan] refuses to see it that way. He should WANT to spend more time with his wife to get to know if forever is possible for them. Instead, he goes out with his boys and talks shit and then comes home drunk and then, just to spite her because she is upset he went out, he goes and does it again. Being spiteful and unwilling to bend will end a marriage. Yes, she seems a bit needy at times, but on a weekend that was FOR them he shouldn't have planned to go out with friends or cousins. Even his "friends" should advise that he take the time to really devote to his wife. This isn't frat time, it's commitment time. He wants someone to "fit in his perfect box" but what isn't occurring to him is that he should not have a rigid box to put people in in the first place. 

Yeah, I liked Dr. Pepper's remarks that Ryan seems to want to keep his marriage 'in a frame'. But the stupid dork didn't even understand what she meant!! In fact,I think he took it as encouragement to keep on doing what he's been doing --whatever the hell he wants! And then he thinks he's "keeping his wife happy" in bed!!

Sure, sex is part of a happy marriage, almost always. But any idiot who thinks good sex is enough to keep his wife happy, deserves to live alone forever.

Edited April 11, 2018 by Crazy Bird Lady

[crazychicken]

Poor Molly her face dropped when she realized that Jon wasn't going to pretend anymore she really thought she could spin it as Jon was saying mean things to her for no reason as she doesn't fight dirty like that. It makes me wonder how many times she has got away with her spin in the past as she was so sure that she could shift the blame to Jon. It looks like Molly is going to keep up the pretense next week as well, at the wives meeting and while packing the apartment she has her ring on while Jon has removed his for boys night. From Jaclyn's face it looks like Molly spun it as she is still trying to save her marriage while Jon has given up.

 

I wish Molly and Ryan had of been paired, she would have really struggled to keep up the nice girl image she wants to portray because I am pretty certain that Ryan would have outed her in a hot minute.

[qtpye]

3 minutes ago, crazychicken said:

Poor Molly her face dropped when she realized that Jon wasn't going to pretend anymore she really thought she could spin it as Jon was saying mean things to her for no reason as she doesn't fight dirty like that. It makes me wonder how many times she has got away with her spin in the past as she was so sure that she could shift the blame to Jon. It looks like Molly is going to keep up the pretense next week as well, at the wives meeting and while packing the apartment she has her ring on while Jon has removed his for boys night. From Jaclyn's face it looks like Molly spun it as she is still trying to save her marriage while Jon has given up.

 

I wish Molly and Ryan had of been paired, she would have really struggled to keep up the nice girl image she wants to portray because I am pretty certain that Ryan would have outed her in a hot minute.

Ryan is king of Dorklandia. Molly and Ryan love to gaslight their partners. For me, gaslighting is the ultimate dealbreaker. It shows that the person is mean and manipulative.

[Gem 10]

14 minutes ago, bichonblitz said:

I don't like it when Shawniece or Jep walk out of the room in the middle of an argument. They both do it and it's an immature way to handle the situation. They both seem childish to me in so many ways. 

I was once married to a guy that liked being with his buddies too much of the time. The marriage didn't last. Cut your losses, Jackie, and don't settle. 

I guess we can add "phony" to the list of things that are wrong with that insufferable bitch Molly. I still want to know what it is about Jon that makes her skin crawl. It's like the elephant in the room. These two must be sooooo different off camera. 

We all just HAVE to know why Molly is so repulsed by Jon.  She has to spit it out.  At this point, she has nothing to lose anymore.   So Molly, spit your guts out and be honest for once in your life.  You owe it to Jon and us, the viewers.

[DrewPaul2010]

11 hours ago, JocelynCavanaugh said:

I thought therapists weren’t supposed to take sides and get emotionally involved. “Dr. Jessica Griffin” was embarrassing with her “this has been intense for all of us,” (us?! This isn’t about you.) and getting all aggressive and obviously favoring one client over another. 

I realize I’m the only person here who doesn’t think Molly is a complete monster for not being attracted to that scary gorilla (or for daring to be thin and blonde, even though that hasn’t actually been the cultural ideal in decades), but I would hope people can at least see how totally out of line and unprofessional that alleged therapist was. If she’s just there for entertainment purposes, then fine, but she’s flaunting her credentials while undermining the basic tenets of her training. 

Molly did not choose Jon. She can’t help it if he makes her skin crawl. We’ll probably never know what he actually did to make her feel that way. 

And FTR, this “Jon gave up his JOB FOR HER” shit can miss me. He allowed himself to be fired so he could go on a reality show. Hardly the stuff of legends. 

She lied to the therapists face and if Jon hadn't video taped her melt down she would have denied any wrong doing and eventually called Jon a liar. She called Molly out for lying to her that's not taking sides its calling it out the way it was. 

She isn't a monster for not being attracted to Jon (not sure why he's a scary gorilla) she's a monster for carrying on this charade and pretending for the past 6 weeks their marriage is workable. There is something very odd about a person who continues to lie even when everyone knows she's telling lies and the truth of her deception is in plain sight. Who does she think she is Hillary Clinton?

Quote

Molly did not choose Jon.

The six people all chose to let the choice be made for them. If she wanted to choose someone she didn't have to go through all the hoops to get married at first sight.

[NoWhammies]

Just started watching the recorded version and had a few thoughts - not all the way through yet.

Poor Jephte. I feel like he's trying REALLY hard, but he hasn't had healthy relationships modeled for him, so he has no idea what that looks like and he's trying his hardest to learn and figure it out as he goes. He really seems clueless. 

I'll probably have more comments on Ryan and Jackie and Jon and what's-her-butt later, but what kind of doffus responds to the compliment, "I like your eyes," by saying, "That's what they all say, baby." What an insufferable doink Ryan is. 

[ReadMeLattice]

12 hours ago, gonecrackers said:

I wonder why Molly would lie when she knew Jon had a recording.

She was recorded that once. Sounded awful & immature, but there are no other recordings of 'repeated' verbal abuse.

Why would she consistently verbally abuse him apparently unprovoked? Who has that much anger toward someone who treats them well?

She has definitely been fake in her THs about the marriage; she wasn't attracted to him & openly admitted it.

So why after all this are they staying married?  What do they need to "think over" anymore?

This whole thing is off somehow.

I tend to agree. And I'm IN NO WAY defending Molly--she's obviously a faker and a liar, and seems like someone who's never been called on her BS.

However, I will say that I found the whole thing a little confusing. Maybe it was just wonky editing, but I really couldn't follow the recording. She called him disgusting but it really sounded like she meant "for recording me." That's still absolutely NOT ok to say and nothing could justify it, and I have no issue believing Molly is a cruel person, but I don't think we'll ever know the whole story. Which is frustrating, not because I want more evidence that Molly sucks (don't need it) but because I think it would be a much more interesting story if we knew the truth.

Did he say something crude in his quest for sex? She says he said some nasty things to her, too, in that fight--what were they? & again, he's obviously a much better person than her, but I just came away from that whole interaction more confused than ever about wtf is going on. I didn't feel like we got a complete picture of their issues.

I honestly think Molly seems like the type who's either hyperfrigid OR such a closet freak that Jon's lack of dominance turns her off. Homegirl is wound TIGHT. I kept picturing Jon pushing her into a wall and getting alpha--I frankly think she'd go for it. 

Edited April 11, 2018 by Lm2162

[DrewPaul2010]

10 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

What set Molly off?

She was talking to a stranger at the bar and Jon didn’t like it.

When he complained, that’s when she flipped out and verbally attacked him.

The hatefulness is shocking...but Jon says it is not the first time she’s been this vile towards him.

All things considered he should have left after the first such episode or if she told him his touch makes her skin crawl. Fool me once shame on you...fool me twice shame on me. I assume she gets compensated for each episode I believe that is the only logical reason for her to continue this charade. She is a habitual liar.  

[kira28]

I don't think anyone who goes on this show truly expects the experts to find their perfect match

 Maybe the first season they did bit anyone who has, watched Thai show knows the couples aren't matched based on shared interests or compatibility but on what will cause the most drama. A flight attendant who is regularly drug tested and a slacker pothead who has a very serious habit. A woman terrified of dogs with a man whose dogs are like children to him.. I could go on. The majority of the men who have been selected are not interested in marriage.

I understand why Jon recorded Molly but I would have found it creepy if someone I was dating (because face it these couples may be legally married but they are basically just dating and  get to to know each other)   got upset or accused me of  flirting with Someoen at a bar and the guy started recording me after starting an argument I'd probably find it disturbing. I think she called him disgusting because he was recording her. It wasn't like she called him disgusting  while he walked around in the tiny underwear  she mentioned. 

I bet most of them are different off camera. Jackie has shown herslef to be pretty level headed on camera but off camera she agreed to go out with Ryan's cousins and on the way to meet them she throws some type of hissy fit and jumps out do the cab to walk back to the hotel. Pretty dramatic. 

[Crazy Bird Lady]

19 minutes ago, Lm2162 said:

I honestly think Molly seems like the type who's either hyperfrigid OR such a closet freak that Jon's lack of dominance turns her off. Homegirl is wound TIGHT. I kept picturing Jon pushing her into a wall and getting alpha--I frankly think she'd go for it. 

 

That's possible. My sister-in-law is like that, she's beyond belief. So I think I kind of 'get' Molly. Like my sister-in-law, she's probably told lies and gaslighted the people closest to her since she was a toddler. I bet she's almost always gotten her own way. 

Interestingly enough, the only people my sister-in-law actually likes or respects are dominant people who absolutely won't put up with her BS, and don't hesitate to beat her into submission to make that point.

Edited April 11, 2018 by Crazy Bird Lady

[SnarkAttack30]

9 minutes ago, kira28 said:

I bet most of them are different off camera. Jackie has shown herslef to be pretty level headed on camera but off camera she agreed to go out with Ryan's cousins and on the way to meet them she throws some type of hissy fit and jumps out do the cab to walk back to the hotel. Pretty dramatic. 

I think there was more to that story than either stated. Also the editing was so strange with that situation too so we will never know what really happened. Maybe it just boiled down to him, yet again, wanting to go out with people and her wanting time together? In the end that is what is sounded like. If she stays with him, she's the idiot thinking he will change. Everyone has learned the lesson the hard way that you can't change the person your with and that the little annoyances turn into a divorce lawyer's wet dream in the future. 

[DrewPaul2010]

2 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

To me the topper of Molly's tirade was when she boohooed to taunt Jon... equating him with a baby...I would have lost my shit...

That would be the wrongest reaction....but the most honest.

What that means is while she was excoriating Jon and tearing his heart out she saw he was nearly to the point of tears and mocked him for being a sensitive human being...something she clear isn't.

[DrewPaul2010]

10 minutes ago, Crazy Bird Lady said:

That's possible. My sister-in-law is like that, she's beyond belief. So I think I kind of 'get' Molly. Like my sister-in-law, she's probably told lies and gaslighted the people closest to her since she was a toddler. I bet she's almost always gotten her own way. 

Interestingly enough, the only people my sister-in-law actually likes or respects are dominant people who absolutely won't put up with her BS, and don't hesitate to beat her into submission to make that point.

Interesting you say that because I could imagine Molly being with a domineering tattooed biker type who takes none of her shit or mouth and would have her in the sack in no time. 

[Gem 10]

17 minutes ago, kira28 said:

I don't think anyone who goes on this show truly expects the experts to find their perfect match

 Maybe the first season they did bit anyone who has, watched Thai show knows the couples aren't matched based on shared interests or compatibility but on what will cause the most drama. A flight attendant who is regularly drug tested and a slacker pothead who has a very serious habit. A woman terrified of dogs with a man whose dogs are like children to him.. I could go on. The majority of the men who have been selected are not interested in marriage.

I understand why Jon recorded Molly but I would have found it creepy if someone I was dating (because face it these couples may be legally married but they are basically just dating and  get to to know each other)   got upset or accused me of  flirting with Someoen at a bar and the guy started recording me after starting an argument I'd probably find it disturbing. I think she called him disgusting because he was recording her. It wasn't like she called him disgusting  while he walked around in the tiny underwear  she mentioned. 

I bet most of them are different off camera. Jackie has shown herslef to be pretty level headed on camera but off camera she agreed to go out with Ryan's cousins and on the way to meet them she throws some type of hissy fit and jumps out do the cab to walk back to the hotel. Pretty dramatic. 

Jackie seems pretty levelheaded.  I'll bet the asshole said something stupid in the car that riled her up, so she jumped out of the car and went back to the hotel.   I think Jackie takes a lot of shit from him, and it's just piling up, so she just can't take it anymore, although she's trying.