S03.E09: On Shaky Ground

[WendyCR72]

After discovering that a patient's family might have been abusive, Dr. Choi and April contemplate calling child services. Dr. Manning and Dr. Halstead struggle to see eye to eye in guiding a family who is dealing with their premature baby. Dr. Rhodes is persuaded into preforming a risky surgery on Dr. Bekker's mentor and world renowned surgeon, Dr. Marvin Jaffrey. Meanwhile, Dr. Reese joins Dr. Charles on a visit to the Cook County jail.

[starri]

20 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

After discovering that a patient's family might have been abusive, Dr. Choi and April contemplate calling child services.

Contemplate?  CONTEMPLATE!?!?!

Two words, show:  Mandatory.  Reporter.

[statsgirl]

Why did Halstead and Manning whisk the baby away as soon as it was born, hiding it from the parents?  Why didn't they let the parents hold him, especially since they thought it was a stillbirth? Everything I've read says that it's better for the parents, and presumably for the child, to be held in the final moments.  It was a stupid plot to have conflict! and show Natalie cares!

April should have given the child services guy a break.  He's on call, he doesn't know the kids, and he made a simple mistake.  Why are they assuming that child services will return a child to the home where she was given a brain injury?

And tonight in Connor Saves The World....  I understood everyone's position, Bekker wanting to look good for her mentor, Latham accepting that Jaffrey knows what he's doing, and especially Jaffrey not trusting that anyone else would do as good as job as he can.  But I didn't enjoy it and I don't like the the way they're pushing Rhodes and Bekker together. It's making me dislike Tommy. (Arrow reference)

[LittleIggy]

Malcolm Macdowell cracked me up making comments during the surgery. He’s awesome.

[CoyoteBlue]

1 hour ago, statsgirl said:

Why did Halstead and Manning whisk the baby away as soon as it was born, hiding it from the parents?  Why didn't they let the parents hold him, especially since they thought it was a stillbirth? Everything I've read says that it's better for the parents, and presumably for the child, to be held in the final moments.  It was a stupid plot to have conflict! and show Natalie cares!

But Natalie doesn't care - she was downright cruel. To the parents, to the baby. I agree that they should have just cut the baby free on the spot and let him die in his parents' arms. Once Natalie started taunting them with the idea that their child had a chance and they got their hopes up, I just wanted to punch her in her holier-than-thou face.

[Pippin]

1 hour ago, CoyoteBlue said:

Once Natalie started taunting them with the idea that their child had a chance and they got their hopes up, I just wanted to punch her in her holier-than-thou face.

Moi aussi.  I'll hold her and you hit her.  She seemed more concerned with her own feelings and "winning"  than that of the poor little baby and his anguished parents.  Sometimes death is a friend, Natalie, and prolonging suffering in order to score points (which how it seemed to me) is a big no-no.

And I started to like Dr. Reese for the first time.  Her standing up to the prison patient's bull was great.  And can Dr. Charles please be my shrink?  He's just awesome.

[Netfoot]

5 hours ago, CoyoteBlue said:

Once Natalie started taunting them with the idea that their child had a chance and they got their hopes up, I just wanted to punch her in her holier-than-thou face.

Stand in line!

[SuzieQ]

8 hours ago, CoyoteBlue said:

But Natalie doesn't care - she was downright cruel. To the parents, to the baby. I agree that they should have just cut the baby free on the spot and let him die in his parents' arms. Once Natalie started taunting them with the idea that their child had a chance and they got their hopes up, I just wanted to punch her in her holier-than-thou face.

Count me in too!! I used to really like her but this season she has become insufferable!!  She's turning into Gabby from Chicago Fire!  Maybe she needs to teach her own kid not to throw things in peoples faces!

[Chick2Chic]

Natalie was a mess in this ep.

Good to see Sarah a little more steady in this ep after Dr. Charles pointed out she was being obviously manipulated by that prisoner. 

April and Ethan as a couple have grown on me. I yelped when they pulled that roach out of that girl's nose even though I expected it once they showed something moving around in her head. ::shudders::

13 hours ago, statsgirl said:

I don't like the the way they're pushing Rhodes and Bekker together.

I despise Bekker so I am also not here for them hooking up. Not even a little bit. I may take a break from the show if - when? - that happens. I've no interest in watching that. 

On a side note, with OUAT's cancellation, I am hoping Chicago Med brings Robin back for S4. 

[BooksRule]

Quote

Malcolm Macdowell cracked me up making comments during the surgery. He’s awesome

That was hilarious!  Talk about a back-seat driver!  I had a heart cath procedure done a few years ago and watched it on the monitor, but it was kind of like watching an x-ray and it didn't seem like it was really 'me'.  That's the closest I ever want to get to observing my own surgery!

How did April and Choi know where to find the girl?  There has to be lots of pockets of homeless in Chicago.  

[wonderwoman]

"Once Natalie started taunting them with the idea that their child had a chance and they got their hopes up, I just wanted to punch her in her holier-than-thou face."

"Stand in line!"

Couldn't get quote to work. Just wanted to say: It's a long line!

[FnkyChkn34]

14 hours ago, statsgirl said:

Why did Halstead and Manning whisk the baby away as soon as it was born, hiding it from the parents?  Why didn't they let the parents hold him, especially since they thought it was a stillbirth?

I think it was because the baby was still in the amniotic sac.  I mean no disrespect, but what was there to hold?  

[Ailianna]

He most incredible part of the inmate story was that they would have therapy sessions in the middle of the pod, in front of all the other prisoners, and giving all those other prisoners nothing to do but eavesdrop on his session.  Prisons and jails are surprisingly picky about HIPAA violations, and psychiatrists are very particular about privacy for their patients in session.  No way that guy was going to show any weakness in that session, even if she didn't back down.  All that would happen is that he would hear about it from every one of those other inmates for the rest of his bid.  Bad drama as well as bad medicine.

[statsgirl]

1 hour ago, Ailianna said:

He most incredible part of the inmate story was that they would have therapy sessions in the middle of the pod, in front of all the other prisoners, and giving all those other prisoners nothing to do but eavesdrop on his session. 

And making all the other prisoners return to their cells.  Yeah, they would have been real happy about that.  Just to have a scene of "Here we are in a prison."

If anyone is interested in what real psychiatry in a prison looks like, I recommend John Kastner's  film Out of Mind, Out of Sight, filmed at Brockville Mental Health Centre (aka prison).

2 hours ago, FnkyChkn34 said:

I think it was because the baby was still in the amniotic sac.  I mean no disrespect, but what was there to hold?  

They should have taken the baby out of the sac and let the parents mourn properly.  They treated it like a piece of garbge to be got rid of while the parents had been thinking this was their baby for the last 20+ weeks. Both Halstead and Manning were completely lacking in empathy at that point.

[FnkyChkn34]

38 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

They should have taken the baby out of the sac and let the parents mourn properly.  They treated it like a piece of garbge to be got rid of while the parents had been thinking this was their baby for the last 20+ weeks. Both Halstead and Manning were completely lacking in empathy at that point.

Weren't they taking it to the NICU, where there were the proper doctors and facilities to care for it?  They weren't discarding it; if they were, it wouldn't have been on a gurney and they wouldn't have been waiting by the elevators when they noticed it start to move.  The ER wasn't the proper place to try to care for it in that condition and they knew that.  Opening the sac in the ER would have been a definite death sentence, whereas taking it to the NICU provided some hope.  Maybe they should have asked the parents what to do *after* it was born, but it was hectic and arguably there wasn't time.

[statsgirl]

No, they assumed that the baby was already dead and were surprised when it moved. At that point they began to cut the sac open and take care of it in the hospital corridor.

If they had been taking it to the NICU to be cared for, they would have continued rushing it upstairs instead of opening the sac in the middle of a germy corridor. Or maybe arranged for an incubator to be brought down to the ER before it was born. (Or maybe even have moved the mother to OB when she started to,go into labour.)

Will told the NICU doctor that the parents had said they didn't want extraordinary means for their child so they had discussed it but it sounds like Will and Natalie just assumed that the baby was born dead and didn't think what they would do if it were alive. The whole plot is rather a mess.

[Meowwww]

6 hours ago, Ailianna said:

He most incredible part of the inmate story was that they would have therapy sessions in the middle of the pod, in front of all the other prisoners, and giving all those other prisoners nothing to do but eavesdrop on his session.  Prisons and jails are surprisingly picky about HIPAA violations, and psychiatrists are very particular about privacy for their patients in session.  No way that guy was going to show any weakness in that session, even if she didn't back down.  All that would happen is that he would hear about it from every one of those other inmates for the rest of his bid.  Bad drama as well as bad medicine.

Right????   Hubby works for the DOC in Minnesota.  He was all jeering over that scene. 

Even I watch 60 Days In and know that would never be true. 

[MinorL]

I hate how the show writes Natalie as incapable of being rational when it comes to babies because she’s a mother. It’s so sexist. 

[izabella]

Natalie was horrid for torturing those parents with hope when, as an expert, she knows there isn't any.  All she did was prolong everyone's pain.  What is wrong with her?  She loses her mind with every baby case.  Maybe she needs to go into a different specialty.

[Netfoot]

39 minutes ago, izabella said:

All she did was prolong everyone's pain.

And tell me she didn't manipulate them with her, "Are you asking us to perform heroic measures?" or what ever it was exactly.  Little shit that she is.

[SnarkySheep]

12 hours ago, SuzieQ said:

I used to really like her but this season she has become insufferable!!  She's turning into Gabby from Chicago Fire!

Funny how that's turned out...lots of people are saying that since they got together, Will has really mellowed out and become more likable (presumably because he's no longer angsting). But with her, everybody thinks her personality's gone downhill.

As for Natalie vs Gabby...maybe they could schedule a showdown at Molly's between the two. It could be a much-need fundraiser for the hospital! Heck, I'd buy a ticket...

[SuzieQ]

1 minute ago, SnarkySheep said:

 

As for Natalie vs Gabby...maybe they could schedule a showdown at Molly's between the two. It could be a much-need fundraiser for the hospital! Heck, I'd buy a ticket...

Ditto! I'd buy a round for our whole group!  They always take good characters and ruin them!

[Quark]

Natalie has become annoying, but at least she isn't a raving lunatic like she was on One Tree Hill.

[Guildford]

Since when did Natalie become a Neonatologist?

I know they take some liberties as far as reality is concerned, but that was seriously one of the worst storylines ever. Unless that baby was half hanging out of her mother's hoo ha when they wheeled her in she never would have been left in the ER in preterm labour. Then lets wheel the infant still in it's sack merrily down the hall, I was surprised they didn't tie a string to it and use it as a balloon. Seriously an en caul birth would have had every man and his dog in that cubicle. Then suddenly they are both just hanging around the NICU & ventilating a 23 weeker....because they are that good. . It was hamfisted. Maybe I'd be more forgiving of their 'stretching all realms of believability' if they characters weren't so damm unlikeable. 

As for the rest...I was too busy downing gin & tonics like water to care.

[Pippin]

17 hours ago, Guildford said:

I know they take some liberties as far as reality is concerned, but that was seriously one of the worst storylines ever. Unless that baby was half hanging out of her mother's hoo ha when they wheeled her in she never would have been left in the ER in preterm labour.

Slightly off-topic here, but I read a book a while back written by a real ER doctor (which I learned is as much of a specialty as a neurologist, cardiologist) and he was comparing the show e.r. to how real medicine is practiced.  One of the chapters was devoted entirely to the episode Love's Labour Lost, which was about a woman suffering from eclampsia,

Spoiler

gives birth and dies

One of his main points was that any kind of complicated pregnancy would immediately involve the patient being rushed to OBY and an obstetrician would take over.   It was a good book; if I remember the title I'll edit this post to add it.

I know that in this episode, labour came on quickly, but I think any patient with these risk factors would not be left in the ER.

[Court]

On 2/6/2018 at 11:43 PM, statsgirl said:

Why did Halstead and Manning whisk the baby away as soon as it was born, hiding it from the parents?  Why didn't they let the parents hold him, especially since they thought it was a stillbirth? Everything I've read says that it's better for the parents, and presumably for the child, to be held in the final moments.  It was a stupid plot to have conflict! and show Natalie cares!

April should have given the child services guy a break.  He's on call, he doesn't know the kids, and he made a simple mistake.  Why are they assuming that child services will return a child to the home where she was given a brain injury?

And tonight in Connor Saves The World....  I understood everyone's position, Bekker wanting to look good for her mentor, Latham accepting that Jaffrey knows what he's doing, and especially Jaffrey not trusting that anyone else would do as good as job as he can.  But I didn't enjoy it and I don't like the the way they're pushing Rhodes and Bekker together. It's making me dislike Tommy. (Arrow reference)

I agree with everything you said. Also, this doesn't make me like Bekker.

 

As a NICU parent and an aunt, I've spent a lot of time in there. They don't automatically decide 22 weeks isn't viable. There were 22 and 23 week babies in the NICU. I've met ones that have graduated from the NICU so that bugged me as well.

 

That baby should have been in the room with his parents. The NICU team should have been in the room and waiting for the potential birth. 

[athelyna]

One of my ongoing issues with this show is that I know most of the docs are based in the ER, but a lot of these cases should be transferred to other departments.  Why was the pregnant mom left in the ER to give birth?  It wasn't like she was already fully dilated and pushing when she came in, they had time to try the drugs to stop contractions, why wouldn't she have be transferred to maternity?  Presumably the actual OBs have dealt with extreme premature labor and/or stillbirth and would know how to counsel the parents.  Babies at 22 weeks have survived and babies less than 500 grams have survived, but it's rare, and my understanding is different hospitals have different criteria for when they will try to help an infant that premature.  Shouldn't Natalie and Will have checked if the baby was still alive when he was born?  I assumed they were taking him off to get him out of the sack and clean him up a bit so the parents could see him and say goodbye, but then they were in the hallway and looked shocked that he was alive.  They had a monitor on him before he was born so they should have known he was alive up to birth, right?  Then of course at the end, Natalie is the one who feels bad and the parents are the ones comforting her.

I hated the Choi/April storyline.  I'm no expert on child services, but if you have a teenager reporting her stepfather hit her hard enough to cause brain fluid to leak out her nose even the biggest idiot should know not to send her back to that home.  And claiming there are no foster homes for teenagers?  Surely they can find a temporary emergency placement - heck, Gabby on Chicago Fire has fostered and loves helping teenage girls in rough situations.  And of course they send the most incompetent overworked cliche of an uncaring social worker.

I liked April and Dr. Charles, even if I'm sure real prisons would have interview or exams rooms where the doctors could talk to their patients instead of the middle of a public space where all the other inmates can hear what they're talking about.

[kgg]

SO MANY things were wrong with the premature baby storyline.  It's almost funny how bad it was.  My beef with this show and high-risk pregnant women continues as they refuse to get OB involved the moment a pregnant woman with severe issues is wheeled through the door.  Unless the baby was halfway out, she would be taken straight to Labor & Delivery and people who actually know what they're doing would talk to the pregnant woman and her husband regarding what will happen, any possible interventions, etc.  In situations like this, there are some parents who are adamant very early on about not intervening given these circumstances.  Most - if there is time - would get an emergency NICU consult so questions can be answered.  Resuscitating a 23 weeker with all hands on deck is typical nowadays (unless parents refuse).  Maybe small hospitals without resources don't regularly intervene when it comes to 23 weekers, but that is not the norm.  As for 22 weekers, more and more hospitals are offering the parents intervention at that age of gestation.

So this woman delivered in the freaking ED and they just...whisked the baby en caul away?  I did not understand that.  They were clearly surprised it was moving so it's not like they had planned to take it to the NICU for resuscitation.  So they were just taking it away to be cruel?  And once you cut the cord, you are suffocating it in the sac.  The fluid isn't magically protecting it when the cord isn't delivering oxygenated blood because it was cut.  It made no sense.  The parents didn't want it to suffer, wanted it to pass.  So why put it in a warmer and take it to the hallway?  Awful.  And then what the hell were they doing in the NICU?  How was the baby "holding on" when he wasn't intubated?!?!?!  You don't wait even ten or 15 minutes to take action after these kids are born.  The moment they are out, you need to establish an airway and access (via the umbilical vein and one of the arteries).  He wasn't getting oxygen or glucose in that period between birth and when they started resuscitating him.  So even if he may have had a CHANCE initially right after birth, waiting however many minutes for the mom to deliver the placenta and come to the NICU would have killed the baby.

The fact that the birth, resuscitation, and death took place solely in the hands of these two idiots is ridiculous.  

[debraran]

On 2/11/2018 at 4:36 PM, kgg said:

SO MANY things were wrong with the premature baby storyline.  It's almost funny how bad it was.  My beef with this show and high-risk pregnant women continues as they refuse to get OB involved the moment a pregnant woman with severe issues is wheeled through the door.  Unless the baby was halfway out, she would be taken straight to Labor & Delivery and people who actually know what they're doing would talk to the pregnant woman and her husband regarding what will happen, any possible interventions, etc.  In situations like this, there are some parents who are adamant very early on about not intervening given these circumstances.  Most - if there is time - would get an emergency NICU consult so questions can be answered.  Resuscitating a 23 weeker with all hands on deck is typical nowadays (unless parents refuse).  Maybe small hospitals without resources don't regularly intervene when it comes to 23 weekers, but that is not the norm.  As for 22 weekers, more and more hospitals are offering the parents intervention at that age of gestation.

So this woman delivered in the freaking ED and they just...whisked the baby en caul away?  I did not understand that.  They were clearly surprised it was moving so it's not like they had planned to take it to the NICU for resuscitation.  So they were just taking it away to be cruel?  And once you cut the cord, you are suffocating it in the sac.  The fluid isn't magically protecting it when the cord isn't delivering oxygenated blood because it was cut.  It made no sense.  The parents didn't want it to suffer, wanted it to pass.  So why put it in a warmer and take it to the hallway?  Awful.  And then what the hell were they doing in the NICU?  How was the baby "holding on" when he wasn't intubated?!?!?!  You don't wait even ten or 15 minutes to take action after these kids are born.  The moment they are out, you need to establish an airway and access (via the umbilical vein and one of the arteries).  He wasn't getting oxygen or glucose in that period between birth and when they started resuscitating him.  So even if he may have had a CHANCE initially right after birth, waiting however many minutes for the mom to deliver the placenta and come to the NICU would have killed the baby.

The fact that the birth, resuscitation, and death took place solely in the hands of these two idiots is ridiculous.  

I worked in a hospital many years ago and thought this show was not researched well. And on FB a lot of women who had babies that young or close to it and made it are angry. They do exist. Most of the anger is on how they were treated on both sides and how the baby was shown in the NICU. The airway, how the dad touched the baby, all not shown accurately.

I realize this is a show, but ER and Law and Order sped things up, had more drama and better looking characters, but they made the laws the laws and ER and even MASH showed what really happened in many hospitals with many consultants. If you want General Hospital, fine, but I thought Dick Wolf would do better. My hubby will say since many shows are worse today , "If you dummy down and they like it, why bother" I hope they hear the complaints. When I watched another episode, there was a diseases Dr Charles said was fatal and a 'real doctor' in a trivia/blooper sectio said it wasn't true. I looked it up and it wasn't. Not Dr Charle's fault but the writers have to google a little more.

The Psych scene in the prison didn't seem real to me, but done for effect. I have no way of knowing how it's really done but it seemed off. You treat someone "on stage" with inmates yelling ? I guess HIPPA isn't around in prison but it seemed very odd.  I think Oliver Platt is a great actor and worthy of more than this, they have had some good episodes with him and even short scenes, like the one where he sensed the guy who wanted to commit suicide by walking into a car.  That scene later when he talks to him in suicide hold made me tear up but it wasn't full of drama.  Reese always seems like a deer in the headlights and i hope they make her more secure in the future. Sure you see new residents at the hospital scared at times, but they usually don't show it or act the way she does. I hope Dr Charles' patience pays off.

Edited February 13, 2018 by debraran

[starri]

In my hospital, women who are over 20 weeks pregnant don't even come to the ER, they go to Labor and Delivery for evaluation, which has two rooms that are set up like an ER.  For better or worse, potential liability issues on a baby that premature are insane (I don't think private insurance companies even underwrite malpractice insurance for it; that tends to be done through a state fund that all doctors, no matter of speciality pay into as part of their licensing fees), and no ER doc wants to touch it.

[greyhorse]

On 2/9/2018 at 4:15 AM, Guildford said:

Since when did Natalie become a Neonatologist?

I know they take some liberties as far as reality is concerned, but that was seriously one of the worst storylines ever. Unless that baby was half hanging out of her mother's hoo ha when they wheeled her in she never would have been left in the ER in preterm labour. Then lets wheel the infant still in it's sack merrily down the hall, I was surprised they didn't tie a string to it and use it as a balloon. Seriously an en caul birth would have had every man and his dog in that cubicle. Then suddenly they are both just hanging around the NICU & ventilating a 23 weeker....because they are that good. . It was hamfisted. Maybe I'd be more forgiving of their 'stretching all realms of believability' if they characters weren't so damm unlikeable. 

As for the rest...I was too busy downing gin & tonics like water to care.

 

On 2/11/2018 at 1:36 PM, kgg said:

SO MANY things were wrong with the premature baby storyline.  It's almost funny how bad it was.  My beef with this show and high-risk pregnant women continues as they refuse to get OB involved the moment a pregnant woman with severe issues is wheeled through the door.  Unless the baby was halfway out, she would be taken straight to Labor & Delivery and people who actually know what they're doing would talk to the pregnant woman and her husband regarding what will happen, any possible interventions, etc.  In situations like this, there are some parents who are adamant very early on about not intervening given these circumstances.  Most - if there is time - would get an emergency NICU consult so questions can be answered.  Resuscitating a 23 weeker with all hands on deck is typical nowadays (unless parents refuse).  Maybe small hospitals without resources don't regularly intervene when it comes to 23 weekers, but that is not the norm.  As for 22 weekers, more and more hospitals are offering the parents intervention at that age of gestation.

So this woman delivered in the freaking ED and they just...whisked the baby en caul away?  I did not understand that.  They were clearly surprised it was moving so it's not like they had planned to take it to the NICU for resuscitation.  So they were just taking it away to be cruel?  And once you cut the cord, you are suffocating it in the sac.  The fluid isn't magically protecting it when the cord isn't delivering oxygenated blood because it was cut.  It made no sense.  The parents didn't want it to suffer, wanted it to pass.  So why put it in a warmer and take it to the hallway?  Awful.  And then what the hell were they doing in the NICU?  How was the baby "holding on" when he wasn't intubated?!?!?!  You don't wait even ten or 15 minutes to take action after these kids are born.  The moment they are out, you need to establish an airway and access (via the umbilical vein and one of the arteries).  He wasn't getting oxygen or glucose in that period between birth and when they started resuscitating him.  So even if he may have had a CHANCE initially right after birth, waiting however many minutes for the mom to deliver the placenta and come to the NICU would have killed the baby.

The fact that the birth, resuscitation, and death took place solely in the hands of these two idiots is ridiculous.  

Agreed.  I think with any "ER based" show, you're going to have to give the writers the liberties to carry stories that normally wouldn't occur in the ER.  For sure, that woman would have been taken right up to Labor and Delivery if this was a regular hospital.  I remember the ER episode with preeclampsia where Dr. Greene did a c-section in the ER and the mother died.  That's pretty much what to expect with these shows.  It's the same reason why Connor does major CT procedures in the ER too. 

Anybody that has seen a delivery would also know that even if the baby was born in the sac like it was here, the placenta is still attached to the mother and you have to cut the umbilical cord.  In this case, the woman pushed once or twice, and the entire baby in the sac and the placenta all came out at once?  And then the baby is moving in this sac until they just decide to cut it open?  Yeah, that's not believable.  

I agree with everyone that Natalie is becoming a little insufferable.  She is the designated character for any baby/child storyline, presumably because she has a pediatric background?  Or is it just because she is a mother of a young child?  

I thought the awake surgery was hilarious.  Connor saying it was time to put the patient to sleep and McDowell's reaction was so funny.

[Brookside]

Reece needs to grow a backbone and leave the puppy dog eyes at home.  Dr Charles is way too good for her and has the patience of a saint.  He must see something in her that we don't!

Love Malcolm McDowell.

I find the mannequins they use for preemies very hard to look at.  (Sorry to anyone who's gone through this themselves.) It was bad enough on Call The Midwife, but at least there was comic relief on that show (hello Sister Monica Joan) and character development.

Edited February 14, 2018 by Brookside

[debraran]

5 hours ago, Brookside said:

Reece needs to grow a backbone and leave the puppy dog eyes at home.  Dr Charles is way too good for her and has the patience of a saint.  He must see something in her that we don't!

Love Malcolm McDowell.

I find the mannequins they use for preemies very hard to look at.  (Sorry to anyone who's gone through this themselves.) It was bad enough on Call The Midwife, but at least there was comic relief on that show (hello Sister Monica Joan) and character development.

Yes Reece has the deer in headlight look a lot and almost clueless at times. it's getting better but the pepper spray, the fear, the outbursts, it gets tiring. A head of Psych wouldn't be as patient as Dr Charles probably but I hope relationship grows in coming episodes.

I feel Dr Charles can have more meat to his role, they can have him explore a lot of issues. I like the subtle story lines too, like the one with the guy he guessed was trying to commit suicide and didn't trip off the sidewalk talking on his phone. His talk to him in his room, while suffering his own depression was very touching, actually made me tear up a little.  Watching Natalie in angst and slamming lockers or overstepping her bounds, isn't as interesting.

[DebbieM4]

On 2/7/2018 at 12:52 PM, Chick2Chic said:

 

Good to see Sarah a little more steady in this ep after Dr. Charles pointed out she was being obviously manipulated by that prisoner. 

 

I liked that too, but I kind of wished he had given her a heads-up about that kind of thing earlier.  I think that's probably pretty typical of prisoners, so it seemed to me that he didn't prep her very well re what she should expect, what might happen, and the reasons why.  If that had been explained to her, she would have reacted completely differently the first time.

That's a minor quibble, though.  I do find a lot of what he says and does very interesting.  And for the first time, I didn't dislike Sarah.  Usually, I find her annoying.  She's too easily overwhelmed and doesn't seem stable enough for the demands of her job.

I really do love this show, flaws and all.

Edited February 18, 2018 by DebbieM4

[DebbieM4]

On 2/7/2018 at 4:56 PM, FnkyChkn34 said:

Weren't they taking it to the NICU, where there were the proper doctors and facilities to care for it?  They weren't discarding it; if they were, it wouldn't have been on a gurney and they wouldn't have been waiting by the elevators when they noticed it start to move.  The ER wasn't the proper place to try to care for it in that condition and they knew that.  Opening the sac in the ER would have been a definite death sentence, whereas taking it to the NICU provided some hope.  Maybe they should have asked the parents what to do *after* it was born, but it was hectic and arguably there wasn't time.

No, they weren't going to the NICU until they saw the baby moving and after they opened the sac.  That's when they changed their plan.  One of them hurriedly said, "Let's get to the NICU!" right after that.  I thought it was pretty clear they had been headed elsewhere and not in any kind of hurry.  They also both looked sad as though it was a done deal and the baby was gone.

[RedbirdNelly]

caught up on this show last night and was shocked (not really) to see Manning act like an idiot. It's weird that they keep going back to that.

and I echo those who were puzzled by the Choi/April storyline. I stopped fully paying attention so I could not figure out why calling child services was a big debate--since it's mandatory.

Please, show, give us better writing.

[Chas411]

Because of course Manning gets a hug and a thank you for her moronic actions. At least Halstead called her on it. What a moron. She's worse than Dawson.

[debraran]

I don't watch Chicago Police much or Fire but I think the writing is better on the few I caught. They can make this show much better with little effort. My husband said they dummy down when people accept it, which is why older shows like ER, Law and Order, MASH, so many to list, were on 10+ years and still are strong.

I hope they up the ante a little and give the show some fresh air before the finale. I sneaked a peek at the next 2 wks on TV Guide and it seems kind of same old.

"Upon hearing news of a pregnant teen, Dr. Manning and Dr. Choi venture to a homeless encampment to help deliver a baby under dire circumstances. Dr. Rhodes and Dr. Bekker argue about the best way to treat a young boy with a chronic disease. Dr. Halstead and April are put in an uncomfortable situation when they find out their patient is a pedophile. Goodwin and Maggie have to deal with a lawsuit against the hospital. Dr. Charles learns of important news pertaining to Dr. Reese's father."

Edited March 16, 2018 by debraran

[Guildford]

7 hours ago, debraran said:

I don't watch Chicago Police much or Fire but I think the writing is better on the few I caught. They can make this show much better with little effort. My husband said they dummy down when people accept it, which is why older shows like ER, Law and Order, MASH, so many to list, were on 10+ years and still are strong.

I hope they up the ante a little and give the show some fresh air before the finale. I sneaked a peek at the next 2 wks on TV Guide and it seems kind of same old.

"Upon hearing news of a pregnant teen, Dr. Manning and Dr. Choi venture to a homeless encampment to help deliver a baby under dire circumstances. Dr. Rhodes and Dr. Bekker argue about the best way to treat a young boy with a chronic disease. Dr. Halstead and April are put in an uncomfortable situation when they find out their patient is a pedophile. Goodwin and Maggie have to deal with a lawsuit against the hospital. Dr. Charles learns of important news pertaining to Dr. Reese's father."

Wash, rinse, repeat...

[Superpole2000]

On 2/7/2018 at 8:27 PM, MinorL said:

I hate how the show writes Natalie as incapable of being rational when it comes to babies because she’s a mother. It’s so sexist. 

She might be the worst ever TV doctor. If not, she's definitely on the shortlist. She makes more bad decisions than good ones, which is pretty incredible considering her profession.