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S07.E01: Hyperion Heights


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Henry leaves Storybrooke in search of his own story. Years later in another realm, he encounters a troubled Cinderella, changing the trajectory of his quest forever. When Cinderella’s evil step-mother, Lady Tremaine, poses a threat, Henry discovers that following his heart will require him to make more difficult choices than he ever could have imagined. Years later, a young Lucy finds a disillusioned Henry at his home in Seattle, determined to make him remember his true self in order to defeat the curse afflicting the fairytale characters of “Hyperion Heights.”

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That was....pretty awful. The actors were trying, but everything else...I just don't think I can with this.

2 minutes ago, tessaray said:

I accidentally caught about 10 minutes of this and spent most of it wondering what was going on with Gabrielle Anwar.  

Well, she got whoever was Snow White's horrible eyebrow makeup artist was, I noticed that. She was the most enjoyable thing in the show, but that was because every time she showed up, I would think about some great Burn Notice scene she was in.

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3 minutes ago, saoirse said:

That was....pretty awful. The actors were trying, but everything else...I just don't think I can with this.

Well, she got whoever was Snow White's horrible eyebrow makeup artist was, I noticed that. She was the most enjoyable thing in the show, but that was because every time she showed up, I would think about some great Burn Notice scene she was in.

I loved her in Burn Notice but not so sure about this show...

  • Love 6
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I did not think it was horrible, but it really did seem like they just dusted off season 1 and change genders and change the core story from Snow White to Cinderella.  I would say the acting and esp. the writing writing in general was not as good as the original season, and Roni's speech at the end was a little painful.  There were a lot of scenes and confrontations that had a huge deja vu factor.

I think a big handicaps will be Henry and Cinderella seemed forced as a couple (as individual characters they were OK) and Lucy is more annoying than endearing.  

  • Love 5
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I felt like that was a completely different show.  Why not call it a spin off?

The only new character I liked was Lucy. And I'm counting adult Henry as a new character, because he seemed so completely different than kid Henry. I mean, people always change when they grow up, but he didn't have any trace of the old Henry. I'm willing to give it a shot, but seeing Emma in the previews made me realize how much I missed her in the episode. That does not bode well for the rest of the season.

I know asking for logic on a show with magic is silly, but shouldn't Hook and Regina look older? It appears Henry had time to grow up before there was a curse, so shouldn't they have aged in that time?

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How did I manage to quit this show for two full seasons and be watching this reboot? Oh yeah; because I had time before my other Friday shows and decided that Andrew J. West is cute enough for me to tune in.

So, Henry Lucy finds Emma Henry who is skeptical and unhappy with life, and tells her him that Henry Lucy is Emma's son Henry's daughter. Emma Henry doesn't believe in magic but Henry Lucy needs Emma Henry to break the curse. They go to Storybrooke  Hyperion Heights where Emma Henry meets evil adoptive mother Regina grandmother Victoria, who wants to make everyone unhappy, but claims that she loves her family so so much. Emma's car gets into a crash as she tries to leave Henry's car gets stolen, preventing him from leaving, so Emma Henry is forced to stick around. Also, Rumple is around, kind of. 

I mean, they DID add in the twist of Cinderella/Jacinda and Lucy wanting to get her parents back together, but yeah, just a total rewrite of the pilot. Hopefully the rest of the season isn't like that. 

So, Adult Henry...is nothing like Kid/Teen Henry. Like, if I tried to compare the two, I couldn't find many similarities. Even in the flashbacks, I don't feel like Adult Henry is much like his younger self. There are some traits there, but not many. Not that I mind because I kind of liked this Henry. 

We got minimal Regina/Roni, at least. I like Lana Parilla a lot but couldn't stand Regina to the point where I did slowly wean myself off of the show. So, by the beginning of season 5, I didn't have issues with not watching. 

Another reason for me quitting the show was that I simply didn't care for Captain Swan and preferred Hook as an antagonist or morally questionable character, at best. So Hook being here doesn't make me happy all that much. I haven't seen Colin in many other roles, though, if any, so I'm hoping that a change in character may help here. If I pretend he's not Hook and Roni isn't Regina until I have to, maybe I'll stick around.

Oh, who am I kidding? I don't even think I'll stick around that long. Lucy is better than kid Henry (sorry Jared) and I liked Adult Henry if I forget about the last six seasons, but everyone else? The actress of Jacinda/Cinderella has bugged me in all of her previous roles. Come on; she was Maya from Heroes, and she was goddamn awful on that show. All the other new characters, except for Alice, interest me. 

I mean, it wasn't bad and it's not like I have anything else to do. But man, if they don't give me some new material that's not just copying the last six seasons, or more particular the first season, I'm just not sure I'll give this a second chance. 

  • Love 6
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I liked it. Not sure it will be watched over Crazy Ex-Girlfriend, but I think I'll be watching to some degree. Can't believe Henry didn't catch that he was a descendant of Prince Charming was meeting Cinderella. I like New Henry. Cinderella is less annoying than she was on Heroes.

What song was that in the promo for next week? I liked it and want to hear the whole thing.

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2 minutes ago, tessaray said:

I accidentally caught about 10 minutes of this and spent most of it wondering what was going on with Gabrielle Anwar.  

She was the worst part of this. The Evil Stepmother is no Evil Queen. That one scene reminiscent of The Devil Wears Prada was cheesy. I did like the rest of the cast, and I'm willing to give it a chance. There was some chemistry with Henry and Cinderella.

 I'm just hoping we can get more appearances from Jared so that we can see more of Henry's adventures prior to meeting Cinderella. I just wish they would have given young Henry a smaller bike. That big bike overpowered him. 

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It was very slow.

I really didn't like Henry's personality.  it was the isnta puppy love every single time he saw Jacinderella.  He was probably trying to make it convincing that he was a grown up Henry but I didn't like young Henry either so I'd rather he grow out of his most annoying attributes.

With Jacinderella they were just trying too hard to make her a kick ass heroine.  It just didn't work like with Bandit Snow.  Maybe it would have worked better if that hadn't come through so much, so early in the cursed personality too. 

I've got to admit that when Alice went to find Rumple, I fleeting wished that he was the one getting dunked just to revisit his cowardly persona and change things up and maybe get something different and a little more interesting happening.

Hook as the earnest good cop was really working with me.   But I think I might be out after next week because partnering him with Rumple really just killed all my interest in whatever his story will be in Hyperion Heights.

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What a trainwreck, LOL. I'm at the point where it's almost so bad it's amusing.

* I snickered at the beginning when they tried to replicate the pilot with the "Once upon a time..." cards.
* Starting in Storybrooke was very random. "And this is how it happened...", followed by a scene that has nothing to do with the curse. At least in the Pilot, we saw Regina barge in soon after threatening her revenge.
* I realize Henry was probably 18 or whatever, but Emma, Hook, and Regina are terrible parents. Did they make him feel like such an outcast that had he had to desert everyone with no return trip or even a grand farewell at his departure? Yes, people go to college, but they also make sure to text/call their loved ones. Leaving on a risky journey just because you feel like you don't belong (like pretty much every college student) is not inspiring. It's depressing.
* Why the heck did they reuse the same exact musical themes for Cinderella as they did with the original OUAT version? The styles were so similar for something that was trying to be "different". What a knockoff.
* SwanFire keychain. Ew.
* What kid checks a window for dust when they enter someone's apartment? Was her mom's apartment really that much cleaner?
* How is Cinderella in the last chapter of Henry's book when her story is supposed to be in the "new" book?
* Cinderella couldn't just apologize to her boss? It's not like he asked her to kneel and kiss his boot. Was being right more important than having the money needed to provide for her daughter?
* Why is Cinderella's horse named Philippe? Why use a Beauty and the Beast reference there?
* "A lot of squeezing"... no, show. Just no.
* I really hate Murderella. She has zero likable qualities. She's vindictive, irresponsible, and prideful. Only on this show would Cinderella be such a deadbeat.
* Wow, Lucy. You found a quarter. That's some real serious magic there.
* It was nice to see Disney's version of the Prince.
* Was Cinderella really planning on murdering someone without bringing a weapon?
* Alice is by far the only interesting character. Can we just see more of her, please?
* "Hitting the pavement"... could have sworn that was a Graham reference.
* The scene in the garden with Henry and Lucy was poorly acted.
* Lucy is way too over-eager. With Henry in S1, there were multiple layers to his wanting Emma to stay. He didn't just want her to break the curse. He was also abused by Regina and lonely. Lucy doesn't seem disturbed. She's confident and has been living with her "loving" mother. Maybe it's just the actress, but she doesn't come as troubled or disturbed.
* "No story is perfect, it just needs to start." Yes, writers. That's what you like to do - start without a good plan.
* Cinderella's quick change of heart before stabbing the prince... like, what. It was sudden and not acted well at all.
* How does Tremaine have power over the police station? She's a freaking land developer.
* So Henry decided to skip out on his portal home just so he could help out a murderous Cinderella? Does he really not care about his family?
* Operation Glass Slipper? Henry, you're pushing 30. It's more like Operation Cringe now.
* Haha. Cinderella works at Mr. Cluck's.
* Regina talking to Tremaine at the end seemed okay, but then it turned into a voiceover speech. Did Tremaine really stand there all that time just listening to her? Wouldn't she interrupt her because she had more important things to attend to? She doesn't come off as someone who would stand there and hear someone ramble for minutes on end.
* "Regret's really not my thing. " Ha. ha. ha. Yeah, Regina. You're sure right about that.
* I'm not feeling it with Hyperion Heights. It looks like every other show on TV. While Storybrooke got boring after S2, it was better for the escapism. 

Two Hook's... well then.

Edited by KingOfHearts
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I accidentally caught about 10 minutes of this and spent most of it wondering what was going on with Gabrielle Anwar.  

I did wonder why the person doing her "Hyperion Heights" make up decided that her look should emulate late-stage Joan Crawford. 

  • Love 6
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That was  ... a thing.  I don't think it was completely terrible -- in fact, there were a few ideas I even kind of liked, like Cinderella on the motorcycle and Alice stopping Henry from interfering with someone else's story.  Except ... why does Alice suddenly start interfering now, when Henry's apparently been doing this for who knows how long?  And why did Cinderella punch Henry in the face when he was willing to let her use his motorcycle already?  (I don't care for Henry, but punching someone who is only trying to help you is not exactly endearing.)   And forget about gas, how does Henry keep a smartphone (synced to portals, no less!) charged in a fairy tale land?! 

There were just too many moments where I thought "That's kind of stupid" (far more than I feel like listing).  And I don't really care for any of the newbie characters at this point.  Alice is intriguing on the surface, but perhaps only because she was used sparingly.  Nothing else really drew me in.

Still ... I'll at least hang in there a little while for old times' sake.

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8 minutes ago, bettername2come said:

What song was that in the promo for next week? I liked it and want to hear the whole thing.

 

Fool For Love by Lord Huron.

Edit: Oops, read this too fast and thought you meant the song playing in the Swyft. Well...if anyone was curious...

Edited by Curio
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9 minutes ago, Stacey1014 said:

I just wish they would have given young Henry a smaller bike. That big bike overpowered him. 

And that big ass helmet made him look like a little kid. They cut out the part where Henry said August taught him to ride.

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8 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

* Cinderella's quick change of heart before stabbing the prince... like, what. It was sudden and not acted well at all.

I thought that Henry's dagger somehow was spelled to only allow the user to use it in non-murderous situations. But nope, I know I'm wrong; just a badly acted scene. 

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5 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

I thought that Henry's dagger somehow was spelled to only allow the user to use it in non-murderous situations. But nope, I know I'm wrong; just a badly acted scene. 

Yes it came across like there was magic that wouldn't let the dagger plunge.  I was also working out why she believed the Prince was responsible for taking her father away.  After he was killed it was clear it was a lie fed to her by her stepmother.  But during the whole thing I was wondering if Cinderella thought the Prince had a temper tantrum when he was a kid and ordered her father's death.

In other news, the Prince was probably still supposed to be Cinderella's true love in that story.

Edited by ParadoxLost
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It wasn't as bad as the S6 finale... actually, I thought it was better than the majority of S6. At least stuff was happening and the characters weren't just standing around waiting for the baddies to come to town. Henry made the proactive choice to involve himself with Murderella, Jacinda is trying to raise her kid, we've got cursed personalities, etc. The premise isn't as stale as Clone Queen/LoUS/Black Fairy/Death Prophecy, but that's not really saying much. It's the same recycled material with a fresh coat of paint. (Yet, it's more than what the writers usually do.)

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With Jacinderella they were just trying too hard to make her a kick ass heroine.  It just didn't work like with Bandit Snow.  Maybe it would have worked better if that hadn't come through so much, so early in the cursed personality too. 

Bandit Snow didn't rob from anyone but the Queen. She also didn't murder anyone, save for maybe the guards trying to kill her.

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I’m just hung up on how Henry got gas for his motorcycle in the Enchanted Forest Redux.

And charged his freaking iPhone.

Edited by KingOfHearts
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4 minutes ago, greekmom said:

What the heck did I just watch? The Evil Queen.. THE EVIL QUEEN was reduced to a bar maid by the wicked step mother?

That's freaking bullshit.

Based on the fact they forgot what Operation Cobra was about and Regina's cursed personality I'm leaning towards them trying to make her more like Emma which requires being dumped on.

Edited by ParadoxLost
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Once Upon a Time is back.... kind of?

It wasn't the worst thing I ever seen, but I suspect that it will be best going forward to not think of this as the mothership anymore, but as Once Upon A Time: The Next Generation or Once Upon A Time in Seattle.  Because it basically felt like a reboot with mainly a new cast of characters and a few old one sprinkled around.  In this version, New Adult Henry is Emma, Lucy is Old Henry, Tremaine is Regina, Cinderella is kind of Snow, Hook is Sheriff Graham, Regina is Granny (OK, that's kind of funny), and Rumple is... well, not quite sure now, but I really wouldn't be surprised if he's basically Rumple again, and it will end up that he isn't effected by the new Curse.

I want to like the new Cinderella, but it's kind of hard since Dania Ramirez apparently hasn't improved ever since I first saw her as the hilarious annoying Maya on Heroes.  Maybe she'll get it together, but right now I'm not impressed.

Lucy must have some high standards if she thought Henry's apartment was a "dump."  It looked like a nice, average apartment to me, but she was actually like Henry was in the slums or something.

I actually enjoyed Tremaine, but that admittedly could be cause I just enjoy seeing Gabrielle Anwar again.  Sometimes I really miss Burn Notice.  Weird seeing Adelaide Kane as Drizella, because while there is no shame appearing on this show, going from starring on one show to just guesting here feels like a major downgrade.

Speaking of weird, sorry Andrew J. West, you are doing your best, but you'll always be Creep Cannibal Gareth from The Walking Dead to me!

Honestly, the more I think about it, I really wish the spin-off was just a cop show with Hook and Rumple.  He's the Eagle Scout who goes by the book!  The other breaks the rules, but gets results!  Colin O'Donoghue and Robert Carlyle star in "The Pirate and the Crocodile: Special Magic Unit!"

Edited by thuganomics85
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39 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

What kid checks a window for dust when they enter someone's apartment? Was her mom's apartment really that much cleaner?

 

Right? And then Lucy had the audacity to call Henry's apartment a dump when it honestly wasn't even that bad. Heck, if he's living in Seattle, that place might cost him a couple thousand dollars a month to rent. Was Lucy's comment meant to reflect the fact that she's been spoiled by Victoria and automatically looks down upon people who live in less-than-perfect living conditions? We're only one episode in and Lucy already bugs me so much. This isn't good.

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Cinderella couldn't just apologize to her boss? It's not like he asked her to kneel and kiss his boot. Was being right more important than having the money needed to provide for her daughter?

This part really bothered me. She's a single motherSuck it up and make money because you have to support a child now. The boss yelled at a dude for knocking over a whole bunch of chicken. Well, yeah, guess what? That dude kind of deserved to be yelled at. That was a lot of chicken. And the restaurant specializes in selling chicken. That costs the restaurant money. This show always makes me root for the people the writers don't want me to root for. Like with Victoria—she kind of has a point, Cinderella. You were day drinking. You did let your child escape and had no clue where she went. You did quit the only job you had just because you had a petty fight with your boss. Get over yourself, Cinderella.

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"A lot of squeezing"... no, show. Just no.

Why was Henry spending so much time showing Cinderella how to use the motorcycle anyway? He clearly told her he was on a time crunch. She wasn't expected to drive the bike, all she needed to do was sit on the back of the bike and hold on. Skip all of the lessons for later. It's like the writers thought "wouldn't it be funny if Henry taught Cinderella how to use the bike, only for her to punch him and use that lesson to her advantage?" without reading their own script a few pages earlier.

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I really hate Murderella. She has zero likable qualities. She's vindictive, irresponsible, and prideful. Only on this show would Cinderella be such a deadbeat.

I'm not a fan, either. Which is bad because I'm also not a fan of Lucy...so I'm pretty much going to despise most of Season 7.

I don't understand why murder is the only option people think about on this show. How about bringing the Prince to justice, Cinderella? How about putting your intelligence to good use and learn to become a skilled judge or attorney and sentence the Prince to prison instead? Why murder?

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Alice is by far the only interesting character. Can we just see more of her, please?

Amen! I'm surprisingly intrigued by her. More, please.

Edited by Curio
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I don't know what new, fresh hell they have inflicted upon us when the only character I liked was fucking Regina.

 

Oh and did appreciate that the prince looked like the Disney version. Though, it's always annoyed me on the main shoe because Prince Charming is Cinderellas, not Snow White, so Snow and Charming always sounded silly.

Edited by Watt
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This part really bothered me. She's a single mother. Suck it up and make money because you have to support a child now. The boss yelled at dude for knocking a whole bunch of chicken over. Well, yeah, guess what? That dude kind of deserved to be yelled at. That was a lot of chicken. And the restaurant specializes in selling chicken. That costs the restaurant money. This show always makes me root for the people the writers don't want me to root for. Like with Victoria—she kind of has a point, Cinderella. You were day drinking. You did let your child escape and had no clue where she went. You did quit the only job you had just because you had a petty fight with your boss. Get over yourself, Cinderella.

Yes to all of this. Again, the writers are trying echo S1 with Victoria slapping Jacinda's wrist and trying to take her son away. First off, Emma was not Henry's guardian. She had no intention of trying to get him back. We're supposed to believe Victoria is still a terrible person, but she had every right to be angry at Jacinda. When Regina yelled at Emma, she had no reason to. Jacinda was jobless and Lucy could have ended up homeless. What was Victoria supposed to do? "Oh well. Keep my step-granddaughter. I'm sure you two will be fine."

Jacinda can't be both the good parent and the bad parent. Victoria will probably end up being abusive, but at least she was trying to put a roof over her granddaughter's head.

Edited by KingOfHearts
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I can't go with Regina being called Roni.  I'm re-naming her Gina.  I shall refer to her as Gina henceforth (or Regina).

This show was....I wonder if it will get cancelled before the season is out.  

And Hook has two hands!  Finally!

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I tried to put myself in the shoes of a new viewer, coming into this without any baggage or expectations, and I think if this had been the first episode I saw, I wouldn't watch more. It was utterly lacking in the charm of the original pilot. I know they go on and on about this being a show about hope, but I found this episode to be rather grim. At least the first pilot was as much about setting up the Savior as it was about the curse -- it was about the start of breaking the curse. We knew that Emma really was the key to the curse breaking, and there were little magical moments, like the sparks when she got out of the car in Storybrooke. We saw the backstory about how she was born to be the hope, so we knew her showing up in Storybrooke meant something, and then there was the clock starting to move at the end. I don't feel like we got that here. Lucy said Henry was the hope, but we saw nothing to back that up. It was just something she said. It wasn't like there was a book saying Henry was the one to break the curse or like we saw the backstory setting him up to break the curse.

Meanwhile, most of the major characters struck me as jerks. Teen Henry was a jerk and a glory hound for wanting to go off to entirely different worlds because he wasn't in a storybook. Adult Henry was a jerk for riding so fast down narrow roads in a world where everyone else is using horses. He was being a real road hazard there. And, yeah, where is he getting the gas and the power for his phone? I guess he pops through a portal every so often to recharge/refuel? What was the point of him teaching Murderella to drive rather than giving her a ride? Meanwhile Murderella rubbed me the wrong way, past and present. She was the one who was late to work, and the other guy did destroy several orders worth of chicken by being careless. I think I'm on Team Boss there. I guess I'm having Burn Notice flashbacks, too, because I kept waiting for Lady Tremaine to blow something up or pull out a high-powered weapon.

Henry really is kind of dense. So, he's a Not!Uber driver, and he apparently didn't know about the giant troll sculpture in his city? But he only reacted when he saw it, not when he got directions to turn at the troll under the bridge? Then he parked half a block away from the bar on a totally empty street instead of driving to the bar itself and parking nearby? And he had to double check a post-it note and ask if he was in the right place when he was looking for a place called "Roni's" and the name was literally in neon in front?

Officer Rogers was endearingly earnest. I suspect they thought they were being clever with all the references to what an Eagle Scout he was, you know, since Captain Hook is a terrible, horrible villain. Except Hook has been a hero for at least a couple of seasons. When a guy sacrifices his life and gets brought back to life by a god as a reward for being good, it's no longer an ironic joke to call him an Eagle Scout.

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2 minutes ago, MostlyC said:

And Hook has two hands!  Finally!

 

I was shocked to see his left hand moving. Are they going to go with a backstory where Rogers' left hand was severely burnt in the "fire" that took Henry's fake wife and child? Or is that too much continuity for this show?

  • Love 2
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You can see from my screen name where my loyalty lies.  Very happy Robert Carlyle is still on board, I can count on him being terrific.  That said....not really feeling this reboot.  I will give it a chance, after all Colin is there too, but it has to put more Robert on to keep me.  Pretty slow for a premiere.

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I think Henry was a combo Emma/Charming.  Regina in a way is also playing the role of Emma and you there will be a lot of sassy Regina thrown in.  Rumple seems to be Gold without the suit and Alice seems to be playing imp Rumple.   Tremaine was bascially season 1 Mayor Mills almost down to the hair cut and threatening her grandchild's biological mother being unfit.    I also thought her fairy tale character was a little over-mannered and not that compelling.

I am beating a dead horse at this point - but of all characters to bring back Rumple seems like the one who is going to be the biggest retread of things they have already covered with him.  At least Hook and Regina make sense in that they do care about Henry and they do seem to be doing a slightly different twist with the characters.  I see nothing new on the horizon for Gold..  Alice did seem interesting, but if she ends up being too much like original imp Rumple and pops up and talks in smug riddles being mysterious she might get old fast.

I actually did think adult Henry occasionally did capture original recipe Henry with some  of his mannerisms.  They did give him some cringe-worthy quips that seemed like they were rejected from an smart-ass 80's action hero.  The actor was not bad - but am not sure he has enough presence to be the main male lead.

So a prince was stabbed -- and the crowd and guards are too slow to react that Henry can stop and grin at the room for a few seconds before exiting without too much difficulty?

I forgot about Maya the wonder twin with tears of death.  Dania was also on Devious Maids (which ok - I watched - it was a guilty pleasure).  Her acting was not bad there per se, but the character did the little girl coy voice when trying to be sexy which could be annoying and/or creeping.  Occasionally I heard that voice in the character.  But overall I did not mind her -- they just need to not go overboard on the pluckiness.

2 minutes ago, Shanna Marie said:

Teen Henry was a jerk and a glory hound for wanting to go off to entirely different worlds because he wasn't in a storybook.

Well put -- I thought Henry came off pretty shallow and selfish.  He just wants people to tell him what a great brave hero he is.  I am still a bit bitter they gave Jared so much screen time in the season 6 finale when so many other characters were having their swan song.

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9 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

Which probably means someone will cut it off at some point.

 

Rogers' hand will probably be cut off by someone without a moral compass, like...say...someone who doesn't mind forcefully drowning someone.

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54 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

 

I know asking for logic on a show with magic is silly, but shouldn't Hook and Regina look older? It appears Henry had time to grow up before there was a curse, so shouldn't they have aged in that time?

There was an EW interview with the showrunners in which they made a mentioning of time running differently in different universes. It wasn't in reference to Hook and Regina but it could explain why they haven't aged.

 

I didn't think it was too bad. At the beginning, I was comparing but I stopped the longer the episode went on. What bothered me the most is the fact that the Stepmother was merely that. The stepmother. According to Google, in most states, a step-parent doesn't even have a right to see the child if the biological parent won't allow visitation and they have no legal right to their stepchild unless the child was adopted. So, taking the biological child of their stepchild would be kidnapping and since this is not Storybrooke but Seattle, so, the real world and not a cursed town, it would be really easy to fight this in court. It's these little things which bother me the most because they're so easy to find out. All it takes is one look at Google.

Other than that, I liked fairy tale Cinderella isn't so much a Snow White but has some Regina traits: a desire to avenge the death of someone she loved and that that death led to her losing hope, to an extend.

I also liked that in a way they are continuing Regina's character growth as Roni as she stood up to the Stepmother (forgot her name) like she should have stood up to her mother. What she couldn't do with her mother, she did with the Stepmother. I don't know if it was intentional but it was neat. I also liked that a little bit of Regina/The Queen shone through in that scene.

And I can appreciate that they changed the villain's tenor. While Regina, as the Evil Queen, was all about magic and she had been taught that magic was power, the Stepmother thinks magic isn't power because it can be taken away. I think that considering this attitude, it makes sense that they'd all end up in the real world instead of a magically conjured town.

I'm curious to see who Rumple turns out to be. At first, I thought he was evil (again) but he may not be entirely as it seems that Alice was responsible for the disappearance of Henry's car? Would that mean that Rumple remembers?

I agree that the "The Devil wears Prada" scene-a-like was ridiculous. Isn't the line "look awake people" in the movie as well? Drizella seems rather harmless in both worlds. She's not actively fighting her mother but she didn't exactly assist her either.

Overall, I enjoyed the episode more than I thought I would. I do and then don't miss the other characters. Yes, it would have been nice to have them all there, or most of them at least. But since this is a new book, I'm okay with them not being there and I'm looking forward to finding out more and how Regina, Hook and Rumple ended up in this story as well.

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25 minutes ago, Shanna Marie said:

I know they go on and on about this being a show about hope, but I found this episode to be rather grim. At least the first pilot was as much about setting up the Savior as it was about the curse -- it was about the start of breaking the curse. We knew that Emma really was the key to the curse breaking, and there were little magical moments, like the sparks when she got out of the car in Storybrooke. We saw the backstory about how she was born to be the hope, so we knew her showing up in Storybrooke meant something, and then there was the clock starting to move at the end.

I think the other thing it was missing was atmosphere.  The pilot of this show played beats of the fairy tale in StoryBrooke despite all the cursed memories.  Mary Margaret and the bird.  Regina and the apples. The role reversal of Mary Margaret awake and David in a coma.  It tied itself back to the flashbacks and the fairy tale

Seeing a troll under a bridge isn't the same thing. 

They should have had Jacinda more under her stepmother's thumb.  The Devil Wears Prada thing was a mistake.  They should have had traits of their fairy tale characters and that can't happen when nodding to a different story.  Henry certainly should not have met Jacinda in Hyperion Heights by now, he should be searching for his Princess. That is a fundamental part of the Cinderella story and I don't care if its different in different worlds.  It needs to be somewhat recognizable or what's the point.  Now  they would have needed to figure out how to do the flashback so I cared if they met but that is another problem for another day.

The other kind of sad thing is that we saw other new characters or extras and there wasn't anything particularly intriguing about who they might be.

Edited by ParadoxLost
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Do not like.  I might not stick around for this.  I will give it a couple more episodes but this looks like it's going to suck.

I do not like this Henry.  To be fair, I didn't much care for the original Henry but at least he was familiar.  This is just a new show with a similar theme so why don't they just admit that?  Hate the little kid Lucy and same goes for Jacinder-Ella or whatever her name is supposed to be.  I don't see anything about her that would be attractive to anyone.  Oh wait, this is supposed to be Henry so all bets are off.  Do not like the back story and it makes no sense.  Henry has been in this fairy tale realm for several years and still has a functioning motorcycle and phone?

Regina, Rumple, and Hook...  Why are they here and what happened?  Also makes no sense.

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23 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

Henry certainly should not have met Jacinda in Hyperion Heights by now, he should be searching for his Princess. That is a fundamental part of the Cinderella story and I don't care if its different in different worlds.  It needs to be somewhat recognizable or what's the point. 

Yeah, I think that's part of where they went wrong in echoing the season one premiere so strongly, with it being all Lucy telling Henry about everything, like Henry told Emma. It might have worked better if things had been playing out without Lucy pushing so much, if, say, Henry and Jacinda had met at a party, chatted, she had to flee (maybe because Lady Tremaine showed up), but she left something behind that he then used to start tracking her down, and he didn't realize she was Lucy's mother and that things were playing out just as Lucy said. He could have enlisted Officer Rogers to help him find his mystery woman, and then we have the fun irony the audience can appreciate that Henry's stepfather is giving him advice about women, just as we know Hook would do. Jacinda just showing up at the bar with the laptop was probably the least interesting way they could have gone with it. Even in the season one premiere, things were happening around Emma and Henry, without them forcing the situation. Snow was visiting Charming in the hospital even before Henry started pushing her about trying a True Love's Kiss or reading to him. Red and Granny's relationship was echoing their Enchanted Forest struggles.

28 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

I think the other thing it was missing was atmosphere.  The pilot of this show played beats of the fairy tale in StoryBrooke despite all the cursed memories.  Mary Margaret and the bird.  Regina and the apples. The role reversal of Mary Margaret awake and David in a coma.  It tied itself back to the flashbacks and the fairy tale

Seeing a troll under a bridge isn't the same thing. 

Yeah, there was nothing fairy tale about any of this, no echoes of their real selves. I couldn't even tell who among the extras/tertiary characters was supposed to be from the fairy tale world. Like, I kept expecting to see the chicken boss and the clumsy employee in one of the flashbacks and was trying to figure out what characters they were, if the dropping the chicken thing was meant to be a clue to who the character was, but now it looks like we'll never see them again. In season one, the pilot showed us Archie, the dwarfs, Red, and Granny in the fairytale world, in addition to Regina, the Charmings, and Rumple. Here, we've just seen Murderella, Lady Tremaine, the stepsister, and Alice. That doesn't exactly establish the neighborhood as a fairy tale enclave full of people who are going to be torn apart if Lady Tremaine gets her way.

What does Lucy know, and how? In the flashbacks at the end of last season, didn't she have one of the real books -- not Henry's supposedly published novel? Here, it seemed like she just had the novel, but the novel was about seasons 1-6, it seems, not setting up this new stuff. Does she know any more about these people? She didn't react to Rogers at all. Even if she hasn't met Hook, we know Emma's in the book, so surely Hook should be.

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12 hours ago, Shanna Marie said:

 That doesn't exactly establish the neighborhood as a fairy tale enclave full of people who are going to be torn apart if Lady Tremaine gets her way.

But we had an Uber passenger montage and that's a fair trade.

I'm thinking that the world of the show is going to be smaller.  There isn't going to be a community of visible fairy tale characters.  They will trot out one or two when they run out of flashbacks and they will fade to the background never to be seen again. 

Edited by ParadoxLost
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I think a major issue I'm having with this initial setup is that the writers didn't establish high enough stakes.

What's so evil about Victoria? Obviously, Lady Tremaine in the flashback murdered two people, but Hyperion Heights Vicky didn't seem all that bad. What is the big, bad, ultimate villain scheme here? Making the neighborhood more hipster? Buying property in Hyperion Heights so the residents have to move out of the neighborhood? That's not a supervillain scheme, that's called everyday life. Okay, so let's say the Three Billy Goats brothers have to move to the south side...are they never allowed to visit their friends in Hyperion Heights again? Can't they still text Goldilocks and FaceTime Merida? Meet up for coffee once a week? There doesn't appear to be some magical border blocking people from entering and leaving.

And then there's the Lucy/Henry/Jacinda situation. Unlike Henry and Emma, Lucy grew up with her biological mother in the picture. Jacinda has been able to keep partial custody of Lucy this entire time. Regardless of what Lucy says, Henry seems to be living in a fairly decent apartment in a really cool city. Jacinda and Henry live a few blocks away from each other and can easily text each other daily if they really wanted to. Roni owns a hipster bar with modern interior decorations. Besides not having True Love, these people could have much worse lives.

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Hyperion Heights Vicky reminded me of Rachel from 'Orphan Black'.

The fairy tale folks seem to have real, decent lives. No bippity-boppity-boo but can easily spend time with each other, if they wish to do so. They live in a nice city with plenty to do.

Not liking Henry - has no charm and not really interested in him. Or Jacinda or Lucy, or anyone.

Only time I was interested was when 'Hook' met his new detective partner - Rumple. Now that might have been an interesting spinoff - the Dark One and the Pirate having a detective agency.

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What's so evil about Victoria?

Victoria is just Mayor Mills 2.0. Somehow she's got her hands in the police department, and everyone bows to her will. Yet... Mayor Mills was still worse in the Pilot. Victoria is only Lucy's step-grandmother. Regina was Henry's adoptive mother who had been raising him for years. The question was posed whether she even loved him or not. In this episode, who cares how Victoria really feels about Lucy?

Edited by KingOfHearts
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The people of Storybrooke were trapped in town with a mayor who had absolute power. Messing with her meant really bad things because they couldn't escape from her. The people of Hyperion Heights are free to move to a better place. There is no worry about pissing off Victoria because they can move only a couple of miles away and she will have zero power over them. They could probably even stay in the same school district. Why wouldn't they leave? This is dumb. Also, apparently real world people are mixed in there, so if Victoria does anything too shady or corruption at the department gets too rampant, officials outside her control will step in and both she and her cronies will have a nice long stay in the state prison. Problem solved. 

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