S07.E03: The Queen's Justice

[Andromeda]

On 7/30/2017 at 7:10 PM, Advance35 said:

I am VERY intrigued by what's ahead for Varys.  How exactly is he going to die?  I figured he would come to an open ending on the show but that was definitely foreshadowing.  So I'm wondering if he actually will betray Dany at some point and pay the price for it.  Curious about Mel's fate as well.

It seems Olenna was right about the Lords, Ladies and Commoners of Westeros being sheep.  The Nobility cheering and attending Cersei holding Court says a lot.  I do believe Ellaria loved Oberyn and I think a lot of her actions were the product of grief driving her.  I couldn't cheer what Cersei did to her because I am someone who can always choose the lesser of two evils.  Whatever Ellaria and the Sand Snakes have done Cersei has done FAR worse.   And based on what Cersei says she imagines when laying in bed at night, I think she'll do a lot worse before it's all over.

And apparently that's what gets Cersei's motor running.   And Jaimie is so "in love" with her, he'll stand by as she does any and everything.  He's just as big a monster as she is.  

Her meeting with the Iron Bank was interesting because we now know that sh his sending out a false story on what exactly happened with The Great Sept of Baelor.  And though she is insane, she is cunning.  She knows just how to paint Dany to get people on side.

Jon and Tyrion talking about Sansa was a nice call back.  Interesting that Tyrion still apparently thinks highly of her.  And he seemed genuinely pleased to hear she is doing well.

As far as Jon and Dany and being retained as a "Guest", well Sansa tried to warn him.   Jon really does come across as an idiot when matched up against Tyrion.  Jon is for muscle only, the more I see of him, the more convinced I am, he is not meant to sit on the Iron Throne.  He doesn't have the bare intellect or the needed cunning.  

Sansa's hair looked wonderful.  She's worn it so listless for so long, to see it with actual care put into it.  Not as intricate as Dany (who's was exquisite) but I could tell she put effort into it and that was a nice change, maybe power and authority inspires her.  From the little we saw of her running Winterfell.  She seems to be wisely thinking of consolidation in terms of food and other essentials. You can tell she's new at the gig but she seems to be getting the hang of it.  If left to her own devices I have know doubt she would make a wonderful Queen of the North.

It was nice to see Sansa and Bran together again.  Though I can imagine how startling it was to know that Bran, in a way, saw what happened to her during her marriage to Ramsay.

So Dany has the skeletal remains of Casterly Rock but Cersei managed to take the current crown jewel of Westeros which is the Reach.  Meaning Cersei now has control of the food.  Team Cersei outsmarting Team Dany again.  Said it before and I'll say it again, I wouldn't be optimistic about Dany if she weren't a Mary Sue with Dragons.

Highgarden LOOKED BEAUTIFUL.  I cannot believe that's how it ended for Olenna Tyrell.  Jaimie Lannister is a bastard.  She was a remorseless player of the Game of Thrones but I still felt bad for Olenna in the end.  Surrounded by nothing but loss and betrayed by her bannerman.  I don't doubt she did terrible things through the course of her life and I don't doubt that she slept like a baby regardless, but I still felt for her.  I credit Dame Diana for making her so likable.  Even after all she's lost and knowing that Cersei did FAR more damage to her, Olenna still took her last bit of solace in the knowledge that she murdered Joffrey.  And she twisted that verbal knife with Jaimie.  It was the only real victory she had in the end.

Yeah, last night I really saw that he's not an organizational leader. He likes the big picture, but he gets stuck in a rut chasing whatever thing is pulling at him. He shouldn't have left Winterfell; he should have sent an emissary. But he has this idea that he alone needs to personally attend to these things -- going north of the wall, bargaining with Mance Rayder, and now this. He is reminding me more and more of Ned. Sansa, OTOH, was shown to be interested in the practical needs of the realm, something a manager needs to be.

[paigow]

1 hour ago, Andromeda said:

Yeah, last night I really saw that he's not an organizational leader. He likes the big picture, but he gets stuck in a rut chasing whatever thing is pulling at him. He shouldn't have left Winterfell; he should have sent an emissary. But he has this idea that he alone needs to personally attend to these things -- going north of the wall, bargaining with Mance Rayder, and now this. He is reminding me more and more of Ned. Sansa, OTOH, was shown to be interested in the practical needs of the realm, something a manager needs to be.

Who would be the emissary? Davos? He would be dead by now .... He was prepared for a suicide mission to kill Mance if negotiations failed...who else could he have sent? Going to Dragonstone proved to be the correct move...it helped Tyrion prove that Jon was not a threat to Dany...

[paigow]

14 hours ago, TV Anonymous said:

Besides, how do Daenarys transport those Dothrakis to the mainland Westeros?

• Dorne has civilian & merchant ships that could be "rented"
• Davos might have some pirate buddies that survived Blackwater Bay
• Daario could find some ships around Meereen, Astapor etc...

[Traveller519]

One performance I think isn't getting a lot of attention, but likely deserves it, is Meera Reed.  Ever since they arrived at the Tree Cave, Meera's been stuck with really no one to talk to that isn't part of a bigger quest of the Three Eyed Raven, except for some one-sided conversation with Hodor at the cave. Meanwhile she's been forced to flee the cave a physically push herself to the brink, and mourn her brother all in service of something that really appeared to be Jojen's quest, not hers.

In both Dragonstone and The Queen's Justice you can see the exhaustion on her face. Emotional, intellectual, and physical exhaustion. Bran (and probably in eventuality Westeros owes her a massive thank you for all she's sacrificed. I hope this pays off for her and she gets some engagement that fulfills her

[CletusMusashi]

3 hours ago, Calamity Jane said:

Maybe he'll push her out a window high up in a tower.

Well, that is the traditional method for dealing with evil queens.

[CletusMusashi]

Let's see... what else?

1. I think it's hilarious that the Dothraki traveled all that distance just to work as bouncers. Well, what do they expect? No shields. No armor. And they forgot about allegedly being archers years ago. So while the eunuchs get the big manly battle gigs, the Doths are standing around saying "Yo, gotta take your sword, brah. I'll stamp your hand so you can get it back later."

2. Tyrion knew immediately that Ser Davos was "The Onion Knight." So I think we can guess how they will get food and supplies to Casterly.

3. Euron is a weird, ridiculous, almost buffoonish Villian Sue, and I should just want him off my show. But he's so bad that I'm starting to find him hilarious. Come on, the black leather jacket with the kraken on back, like he's pretending to be a 50s biker? There's only so stupid you can make something before I kind of love it.

4. I understand the Dr. Branhatten schtick, but... really? You want to make your least cinematic character emote less? Interesting choice.

5. I absolutely love everything they've done at The Citadel. Hell, even Ser Friendzone developed a noticeable sense of humor there. Probably didn't hurt that Sam was so ridiculously freakishly good at surgery that they were able to remove every trace of the pathogen without even chafing SFZ's perfect five day beard. But still, I loved every second of what they've done there. Which worries me a lot. Because Kindly Archmaester Guy is way too positive a father figure to survive the season. 

6. Was that actually Lena we saw nude, or a body double? Not that she ever looked bad, but if that was her: whatever the hell she's doing now works. As they say in Dorne: Giggety!

7. I think even Missendei is a little bored with the list of titles. She had the same tone of voice as an airline stewardess pointing out where the exits are.

8. Melisandre really never mentioned bringing Jon back from the dead? What the fuck did they talk about all this time, football?

9. Makes sense that Jaime is coming into his own as a military commander. He and Tyrion were both taught by their father. And they both worked with Bron. Jaime has the advantage of working with Bron after Bron has learned to anticipate Tyrion. 

10. Where the hell is Salladhor Saan? He's missing out on a whole pirate themed season! That's why the Sand Snakes lost, you know. Pirates beat ninjas. Anyway, if he wants to beat out Captain Urine and Jaime Hook and have a chance at Cersei, he needs to hurry. 

11. Remember the time someone didn't call Joffrey a cunt? Heh heh. Me neither.

Edited August 1, 2017 by CletusMusashi

[dramachick]

[MisterBluxom]

To be fair, Danny doesn't spout her own titles usually. In most cases it is one of her servants or advisers that does that. But once per season is plenty. More than plenty. We really don't need to hear that list any more often. It gets to be extremely tedious and objectionable. I don't know why. But I'm very glad to see that many other people feel the same way.

As it stands today, seems to me the most interesting story line is Circe and her mental state. She was never very sane and appears to be headed down the road to full blown insanity. I don't put too much blame on her given all the torture and other hardships she has suffered.

As far as Joffrey goes, there's just no explanation for why he turned out to be such a monster. But once he was king, there was really nothing much she could do. He was still her son. But she couldn't tell him to shut up and listen to good advice. He would have had her beheaded. She was still his mother and no matter what else happened, it truly broke her heart when he died. It also took away a chunk of her sanity permanently. Then she lost her daughter and her other son. It's easy to undestand how she is going insane.

She really did a wonderful job of torturing the woman who killed her daughter. Of course, most people cannot really approve of torture. But as far as it goes, she is a master of the art. I wonder if anyone can help me. There were 3 sand snakes. One of them was quite attractive and there was a flirting session when Jaimie and (Dang. I forget his name) the man who fought for Jaimie were imprisoned in Dorn. Can anyone tell me if the daughter that Circe killed was the same one who told Jaimie's fighter to say that she was the most beautiful woman in all the world before she would give him the antidote to some poison he took?

I'd like to know because I thought she was extremely attractive and I am disappointed we won't be seeing her again - no matter how she died. I really liked her. Found her very alluring and sexy.

Edited August 1, 2017 by MissBluxom

[MisterBluxom]

53 minutes ago, CletusMusashi said:

Let's see... what else?

1. I think it's hilarious that the Dothraki traveled all that distance just to work as bouncers. Well, what do they expect? No shields. No armor. And they forgot about allegedly being archers years ago. So while the eunuchs get the big manly battle gigs, the Doths are standing around saying "Yo, gotta take your sword, brah. I'll stamp your hand so you can get it back later."

2. Tyrion knew immediately that Ser Davos was "The Onion Knight." So I think we can guess how they will get food and supplies to Casterly.

3. Euron is a weird, ridiculous, almost buffoonish Villian Sue, and I should just want him off my show. But he's so bad that I'm starting to find him hilarious. Come on, the black leather jacket with the kraken on back, like he's pretending to be a 50s biker? There's only so stupid you can make something before I kind of love it.

4. I understand the Dr. Branhatten schtick, but... really? You want to make your least cinematic character emote less? interesting choice.

5. I absolutely love everything they've done at The Citadel. Hell, even Ser Friendzone developed a noticeable sense of humor there. Probably didn't hurt that Sam was so ridiculously freakishly good at surgery that they were able to remove every trace of the pathogen without even chafing SFZ's erefect five day beard. But still, I loved every second of what they've done there. Which worries me a lot. Because Kindly Archmaester Guy is way too positive a father figure to survive the season. 

6. Was that actually Lena we saw nude, or a body double? Not that she ever looked bad, but if that was her: whatever the hell she's doing now works. As they say in Dorne: Giggety!

7. I think even Missendei is a little bored with the list of titles. She had the same tone of voice as an airline stewardess pointing out where the exits are.

8. Melisandre really never mentioned bringing Jon back from the dead? What the fuck did they talk about all this time, football?

9. Makes sense that Jaime is coming into his own as a military commander. He and Tyrion were both taught by their father. And they both worked with Bron. Jaime has the advantage of working with Bron after Bron has learned to anticipate Tyrion. 

10. Where the hell is Salladhor Saan? He's missing out on a whole pirate themed season! That's why the Sand Snakes lost, you know. Pirates beat ninjas. Anyway, if he wants to beat out Captain Urine and Jaime Hook and have a chance at Cersei, he needs to hurry. 

11. Remember the time someone didn't call Joffrey a cunt? Heh heh. Me neither.

Did we see Lena or a body double? I have no idea. But I can't imagine an actor of her stature getting naked and going through all the preparation that must be required (like makeup and shaving and weight loss and plucking, etc.) to present herself naked for just a very few seconds on camera.  I would think that unless Lena is extremely vain about her body and it is in beautiful condition, she would choose to use a body double. Can't imagine she would show us her naked body for just a second or two. That just doesn't make much sense to me - given how easy it would be to find a double and how many of them would be happy to make themselves available. But, if you can find out, I would love to know.

[Lady S.]

22 minutes ago, Traveller519 said:

One performance I think isn't getting a lot of attention, but likely deserves it, is Meera Reed.  Ever since they arrived at the Tree Cave, Meera's been stuck with really no one to talk to that isn't part of a bigger quest of the Three Eyed Raven, except for some one-sided conversation with Hodor at the cave. Meanwhile she's been forced to flee the cave a physically push herself to the brink, and mourn her brother all in service of something that really appeared to be Jojen's quest, not hers.

In both Dragonstone and The Queen's Justice you can see the exhaustion on her face. Emotional, intellectual, and physical exhaustion. Bran (and probably in eventuality Westeros owes her a massive thank you for all she's sacrificed. I hope this pays off for her and she gets some engagement that fulfills her

Poor girl had to watch the Sansa/Bran reunion when the last time she held her own brother was to mercy-kill him. 

Back to Cersei's hair, was just reminded that back in s5, Bad Pussysnake's hair was not much longer than Cersei's is now but it was almost shoulder-length at the time of her death. So there's definitely been reasonable hair-growing time since 5.10.

10 minutes ago, CletusMusashi said:

6. Was that actually Lena we saw nude, or a body double? Not that she ever looked bad, but if that was her: whatever the hell she's doing works.

I assumed it was the same body double from the Walk for continuity of buttcheeks if nothing else, though it is a bit weird since this scene didn't really need nudity like that one did. 

 

1 hour ago, dramachick said:

Just missing Dany's reaction, where she looks unimpressed by someone introduced with only a name, which is why Jon's eyes darted back to Davos and he adds the KitN bit. (Though really Jon has plenty of other potential titles, the White Wolf, King Crow, Slayer of White Walkers, Destroyer of Wights, the Best Hair in Westeros, Master of Cunninglingus, etc. etc.)

Updated.

[kieyra]

9 hours ago, Luckylyn said:

I'm going to be optimistic that the wedding day Bran was talking about was in Sansa's future.   Maybe Sansa will have a happy wedding day someday. 

He specifically talked about bad things happening to her, and being sorry they happened to her there at Winterfell. So again Sansa's rape was framed in the perspective of some other male's reaction, some male who was watching.

Sorry, but I do feel this was the showrunners' way of sneaking in rape references in the creepiest way possible, given that I bet they've been asked to pull back on the literal rape this year. 

[Gobi]

9 hours ago, sashabear21 said:

I'm starting to think the White Walkers are like me trying to play Battlefront after a couple of cocktails, they just keep walking into walls and keep walking even though they keep hitting walls. "Maybe this way..nope wall, I'll go... crap..corner, okay I'll try to move backwards and then.. awww...dammit another wall".  It's really the only explanation for me after all this time has passed, but they're still just kind of hanging out back there.  

My theory is that it isn't cold enough yet for them to move further south.

[Popples]

4 hours ago, Lady S. said:

(Though really Jon has plenty of other potential titles, the White Wolf, King Crow, Slayer of White Walkers, Destroyer of Wights, the Best Hair in Westeros, Master of Cunninglingus, etc. etc.)

Knower of Nothing

[DrSpaceman73]

9 hours ago, sashabear21 said:

I'm starting to think the White Walkers are like me trying to play Battlefront after a couple of cocktails, they just keep walking into walls and keep walking even though they keep hitting walls. "Maybe this way..nope wall, I'll go... crap..corner, okay I'll try to move backwards and then.. awww...dammit another wall".  It's really the only explanation for me after all this time has passed, but they're still just kind of hanging out back there.  

It must be, because I don't understand either what is taking them so long. 

Also how long is it going to take to mine and refine and make dragonstone into a usable substance?  That seems like a week to months long process. 

I don't think Jon Snow is interested in ruling the seven Kingdoms.   Maybe winterfell, but he does not want to be king of it all, just like his father didn't either. 

16 hours ago, Dobian said:

I think Lady Olenna's final conversation with Jaime was a lot of foreshadowing.  I think he is the one who will kill Cersei in the end.  If anyone else does it, like Dany or Jon, it will just be cliché and not have as much meaning.  "Yay, we killed the bitch queen, Revenge!!".  Jaime has earned the right to be the one who does the deed, the story of him and Cersei goes back to the beginning of the show and needs to end with the two of them.  Anything else would fall way short.

I have been thinking as well Jaime will be the one to kill Cersei.

Glad Lady Olenna at last got in one final job by telling Jaime she was the one that murdered his son. 

[DrSpaceman73]

Can't say I am too upset about the Dornish brood dying.  They were annoying and stupid, outside and Oberyn.  He was just stupid. 

Also in terms of the Whitewalkers, I think I would be like screw the dragonstone, how about you fly around on one of those dragons if we see them coming and burn them all?

[paigow]

5 hours ago, Lady S. said:

(Though really Jon has plenty of other potential titles, the White Wolf, King Crow, Slayer of White Walkers, Destroyer of Wights, the Best Hair in Westeros, Master of Cunninglingus, etc. etc.)

Updated.

Pretty Crow

[DrSpaceman73]

Spoiler

 

I figured Podrick would be the Master of Cuninglingus

Maybe he and Podrick could have a contest.  Call if the War of Two Kings

[Clanstarling]

6 hours ago, MissBluxom said:

As far as Joffrey goes, there's just no explanation for why he turned out to be such a monster. But once he was king, there was really nothing much she could do. He was still her son. But she couldn't tell him to shut up and listen to good advice. He would have had her beheaded. She was still his mother and no matter what else happened, it truly broke her heart when he died. It also took away a chunk of her sanity permanently. Then she lost her daughter and her other son. It's easy to undestand how she is going insane.

Actually, to me, the path that Cersei's taken finally made Joffrey make sense. His own mother's a monster - she just didn't truly reveal the monster within her until she had some power, though there were certainly signs. Now with absolute power, she doesn't even pretend. Also, incest - it's a roll of the dice for the crazy train. The Mad King also lost that throw.

5 hours ago, Lady S. said:

I assumed it was the same body double from the Walk for continuity of buttcheeks if nothing else, though it is a bit weird since this scene didn't really need nudity like that one did. 

I think the nudity did serve a purpose here it's the shorthand for Cersei's DGAF state of being. She's the all powerful queen and she'll do whatever she wants.  She's flagrantly unashamed of her nudity, not hiding anything, not even her incestuous relationship with Jaimie. 

1 hour ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

I have been thinking as well Jaime will be the one to kill Cersei.

It's the thing that makes dramatic sense to me. The perfect bookend to the story of the families in The Game of Thrones - if another Targarean ends up on the throne.

Edited August 1, 2017 by Clanstarling

[FnkyChkn34]

On 7/31/2017 at 1:04 AM, KaleyFirefly said:

I'm worried Dany will fire Tyrion as her advisor because all his advice hasn't worked out so well.

If she does that, then I think he'd join up with Jon and Davos in a heartbeat.  And I wouldn't mind seeing that.

[candall]

Lady Olenna, Dame Diana--both fabulous.  I loved how she didn't swirl that poison around and examine it, just knocked it back.  Down the hatch, Death.

And speaking of expedient:  Naturally I hate that they've shortened the season, but I appreciate some of the shortcuts they might otherwise have drawn out far longer.  There's no agonizing delay or misunderstanding while Sam struggles to get Jon the dragonglass message.  Jorah's not "on the mend."  Boom, he's ready to roll.  On my way, Khaleesi!

Sansa's amazed by Bran?  Wait 'til she gets a load of Arya's new skillset.  Maybe just a touch unfair that Sansa gained all that fortitude, strength, cunning, maturity from years of being used as a chew toy by one sadist after another and then her siblings show up enhanced with supernatural powers.

 

Superficial, but I'm distracted from fully focusing on Cersei's treachery by the poufy "feminine layers" look of that appalling wig.  LH has the bone structure to look smashing with a severe cut, combed back, styled like a man's.  Oh wait, I just realized Brienne has that hair.  Well, fine . . . Brienne's a warrior and Cersei's at war.

Edited August 1, 2017 by candall
felt the need to throw in a "poufy," for some reason.

[Katalina]

Quote

I think even Missendei is a little bored with the list of titles. She had the same tone of voice as an airline stewardess pointing out where the exits are.

Lolz!

Quote

Also how long is it going to take to mine and refine and make dragonstone into a usable substance?  That seems like a week to months long process. 

I was assuming that they would just need to chip off bits of it and attach the bits to spear heads and arrow heads. Possibly a small amount would do to destroy a white walker.

It seems to me that Varys' dedication to what's best for the most people has been mentioned twice this season. Is this a heads up that Varys would betray Dany if he thinks it's the best for the most people? This ties in nicely with her increasing ego-inflation and Targaryen crazy roots.

[MisterBluxom]

1 hour ago, FnkyChkn34 said:

If she does that, then I think he'd join up with Jon and Davos in a heartbeat.  And I wouldn't mind seeing that.

 

Oops! I thought that I was replying to a post that discussed how Cersei would likely fire Tyrion because he had given her bad advice as her Hand. I don't know what happened. But I'm pretty sure it was my fault. I seem to make these kinds of errors often. Doggone it!

Anyway ..............

I have to disagree. I think she is smart enough to know just how difficult it is for anyone to give advice in that situation and I think she knows just how well he has done. She really needs some quality advice and I can't imagine just where she would get it if Tryion isn't around.

I'd love to be present when Jaimie tells Circie that it was Oleanna who poisoned Joffrey. In her present mental state, I would guess she will either ignore that fact and carry on believing that Tyrion was responsible. She may even lash out at Jaimie for telling her something that she doesn't want to hear. She's convinced that Tyrion was responsible and I can't imaigne that she might accept any other facts in that case. Cersei is def headed for Crazy City.

Edited August 1, 2017 by MissBluxom

[FnkyChkn34]

5 minutes ago, MissBluxom said:

 

Oops! I thought that I was replying to a post that discussed how Cersei would likely fire Tyrion because he had given her bad advice as her Hand. I don't know what happened. But I'm pretty sure it was my fault. I seem to make these kinds of errors often. Doggone it!

Anyway ..............

I have to disagree. I think she is smart enough to know just how difficult it is for anyone to give advice in that situation and I think she knows just how well he has done. She really needs some quality advice and I can't imagine just where she would get it if Tryion isn't around.

I'd love to be present when Jaimie tells Circie that it was Oleanna who poisoned Joffrey. In her present mental state, I would guess she will either ignore that fact and carry on believing that Tyrion was responsible. She may even lash out at Jaimie for telling her something that she doesn't want to hear. She's convinced that Tyrion was responsible and I can't imaigne that she might accept any other facts in that case. Cersei is def headed for Crazy City.

Do you mean Dany, not Cersei?  I agree that no one will actually fire Tyrion, but I was just stating my preference if that would actually happen.

[MisterBluxom]

I thought you were talking about Dany firing Tyrion because he has given her bad advice as the Hand of the Queen.

Tyrion made it clear that if Dany is going to be successful in ruling Westeros, she will need a lot of help. One thing she will need is the advice of someone who is familiar with all the various players and Houses and factions. Tyrion is an excellent choice to fill that role. Don't you think?

[ChipBach]

15 hours ago, SimoneS said:

This is so off the wall...

 

22 hours ago, Lucelu said:

To be frank, the only legal slaves in Westeros are women (besides the whole feudalistic bended knee/swearing fealty bullshit that the Wildlings despise them for so much).

I guess I didn't articulate that very well.  My point was that I do not view a person who "frees slaves" only to force them into being subjects as "benevolent".  Her perceived right to exercise power comes from a birthright.  

[enoughcats]

3 hours ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

dragonstone into a usable substance

 

1 hour ago, Katalina said:

I was assuming that they would just need to chip off bits of it and attach the bits to spear heads and arrow heads. Possibly a small amount would do to destroy a white walker.

Dragonstone is obsidian with is volcanic glass.  Every broken edge is sharp and can cut human flesh.  

[Luckylyn]

19 minutes ago, ChipBach said:

 

I guess I didn't articulate that very well.  My point was that I do not view a person who "frees slaves" only to force them into being subjects as "benevolent".  Her perceived right to exercise power comes from a birthright.  

That's a valid point.  So far Dany hasn't talked about what makes Cersei a bad ruler and why she's the better choice.  Dany's main argument is her birthright which is really means nothing as far as who is a good or bad ruler. It's about entitlement.  Ruling by birthright is still subjugating people even if you are benevolent.  

Maybe that will be Jon's role if he survives  to end up creating some sort of Parliamentary system to settle things.  He clearly doesn't want to be king and doesn't buy into the idea of birthright alone for picking a leader.   

 The real test of Dany's character will be what she does if Jon is revealed to be the true heir since his father was crown prince and if he married Jon's mother.   That would mean by her own argument she has to step aside to support Jon but she's firecely ambitious.  I don't know if she'd stick to her principles or be a hypocrite to hold on to power.

[paigow]

10 hours ago, CletusMusashi said:

3. Euron is a weird, ridiculous, almost buffoonish Villian Sue, and I should just want him off my show. But he's so bad that I'm starting to find him hilarious. Come on, the black leather jacket with the kraken on back, like he's pretending to be a 50s biker?   NEGAN!!!!

[DrSparkles]

9 hours ago, MissBluxom said:

To be fair, Danny doesn't spout her own titles usually. In most cases it is one of her servants or advisers that does that. But once per season is plenty. More than plenty. We really don't need to hear that list any more often. It gets to be extremely tedious and objectionable. I don't know why. But I'm very glad to see that many other people feel the same way.

As it stands today, seems to me the most interesting story line is Circe and her mental state. She was never very sane and appears to be headed down the road to full blown insanity. I don't put too much blame on her given all the torture and other hardships she has suffered.

As far as Joffrey goes, there's just no explanation for why he turned out to be such a monster. But once he was king, there was really nothing much she could do. He was still her son. But she couldn't tell him to shut up and listen to good advice. He would have had her beheaded. She was still his mother and no matter what else happened, it truly broke her heart when he died. It also took away a chunk of her sanity permanently. Then she lost her daughter and her other son. It's easy to undestand how she is going insane.

She really did a wonderful job of torturing the woman who killed her daughter. Of course, most people cannot really approve of torture. But as far as it goes, she is a master of the art. I wonder if anyone can help me. There were 3 sand snakes. One of them was quite attractive and there was a flirting session when Jaimie and (Dang. I forget his name) the man who fought for Jaimie were imprisoned in Dorn. Can anyone tell me if the daughter that Circe killed was the same one who told Jaimie's fighter to say that she was the most beautiful woman in all the world before she would give him the antidote to some poison he took?

I'd like to know because I thought she was extremely attractive and I am disappointed we won't be seeing her again - no matter how she died. I really liked her. Found her very alluring and sexy.

INCEST!!!!!!!!

[CletusMusashi]

Hmm. I guess Euron is what Negan is supposed to be.  To truly be Negan, though, he'd need about forty-five more minutes of dialogue every week. Euron is a very talkative villain, but he stops just in time, while I'm still chuckling at how outlandish he is. I think I am going to start calling his battle axe "Hew-cille," though. (And I want to get one of those kraken jackets for myself!)

Edited August 1, 2017 by CletusMusashi

[DrSpaceman73]

29 minutes ago, enoughcats said:

 

Dragonstone is obsidian with is volcanic glass.  Every broken edge is sharp and can cut human flesh.  

Still I would think they have to dig down somewhere to find it.  Its not just out there lying around. 

 

And I don't think they aren't just going to hand out glass shards to everyone, I hope, should make it into some sort of weapon

[charmed1]

10 hours ago, CletusMusashi said:

3. Euron is a weird, ridiculous, almost buffoonish Villian Sue, and I should just want him off my show. But he's so bad that I'm starting to find him hilarious. Come on, the black leather jacket with the kraken on back, like he's pretending to be a 50s biker? There's only so stupid you can make something before I kind of love it.

I'm kind of right there with you. His Mr. Bill impersonation of Reek won me over.

[Absurda]

I don't think there's any reason to believe Rhegar married Jon's mother. Wasn't he the one already married to the Dornish princess? If he was already married, he couldn't marry Jon's mom so John would still be illegitimate. Plus, Jon doesn't want any throne let alone the iron throne. It is fair to say he doesn't have what it takes to be king, but it's also fair to point out that he never claimed he did. Leadership (other than battlefield leadership) has always been somewhat forced on him it's not something he's really sought. He might make an okay general but not a king or even king's/queen's hand.

[Nutjob]

As I understand it, legitimacy in Westeros comes from being born into two established houses, not necessarily whether the parents were married. Jon Snow is a (supposed) bastard because he was born to Ned Stark and some nameless woman while he was off at war. Jon Targaryen would be the son of Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Stark, born after or around the time of the death of Elia Targaryen (nee Martell) and her children with Rhaegar. As we've already seen with Sansa, marriages can be dissolved almost at will, and women remarried to others as long as the houses deem it proper. I think as long as the major houses are amenable to it, Jon will be accepted as a Targaryen.

[paigow]

1 hour ago, Luckylyn said:

That's a valid point.  So far Dany hasn't talked about what makes Cersei a bad ruler and why she's the better choice.

But other characters have... Varys said most of Westeros hates Cersei...she has no concern for the general population and does not even try to hide it. Implementation failures acknowledged, but Dany is committed to a degree of social justice / reform. 

Edited August 1, 2017 by paigow

[ImpinAintEasy]

1 hour ago, Absurda said:

I don't think there's any reason to believe Rhegar married Jon's mother. Wasn't he the one already married to the Dornish princess? If he was already married, he couldn't marry Jon's mom so John would still be illegitimate. Plus, Jon doesn't want any throne let alone the iron throne. It is fair to say he doesn't have what it takes to be king, but it's also fair to point out that he never claimed he did. Leadership (other than battlefield leadership) has always been somewhat forced on him it's not something he's really sought. He might make an okay general but not a king or even king's/queen's hand.

 

Just because somebody doesn't actively seek power or to rule, doesn't mean they wouldn't be good at it. Quite the opposite, actually. It's the ambitious ones who seek power or feel entitled to it who usually wind up abusing it. I feel Jon is the character best suited to be a good and just ruler. But he would need a really good small council and hand to help with the political aspects of the game. It's why I feel he and Tyrion are a great team. Tyrion is exactly the type of person that compliments Jon so well. He can help Jon articulate his objectives in a way that is more persuasive. 

[kieyra]

4 hours ago, candall said:

Superficial, but I'm distracted from fully focusing on Cersei's treachery by the poufy "feminine layers" look of that appalling wig.  LH has the bone structure to look smashing with a severe cut, combed back, styled like a man's.  Oh wait, I just realized Brienne has that hair.  Well, fine . . . Brienne's a warrior and Cersei's at war.

The wig is so bad, and it looks so uneven with the crown on it. It's all I can look at. 

Edited to add/unrelated: Since she's still alive, is Ellaria still technically a player in this game of thrones?

Edited August 1, 2017 by kieyra

[Katalina]

Quote

f Jon is revealed to be the true heir since his father was crown prince and if he married Jon's mother.  

Jon is the prince's son, and the king's grandson, although a bastard. But in the sense of bloodline, Dany still has a stronger claim, as the king's daughter. Or so it seems to me.

I just have to comment on the aesthetics of the Dragonstone throne---a throne that actually makes the hideous iron throne look, not good, but not entirely awful. I hate that throne room, with it's big chunk of rock cutting off the light from the window behind it, and an uncomfortable-looking little cut out of a seat. Grotesque.

Quote

It's why I feel he and Tyrion are a great team. Tyrion is exactly the type of person that compliments Jon so well.

My favorite new bro-mance, political subdivision. But there's that other political bro-mance, Tyrion and Varys. Hmm, has to be a three-way, then...

[MisterBluxom]

3 hours ago, DrSparkles said:

INCEST!!!!!!!!

Oh yeah! I forgot about that. DOH!

Thank you.

[Couver]

1 hour ago, kieyra said:

 

Edited to add/unrelated: Since she's still alive, is Ellaria still technically a player in this game of thrones?

I was musing about this earlier today as well. Ellaria has got to have at least a month or 2? Cersei made it seem like she wanted Tyene to be dust before she dealt with Ellaria so she may have even longer. If she can hang on and KL isn't ruined if/when Dany takes it she could be liberated. Though I suspect this was the last we will see of Ellaria. 

[meep.meep]

4 hours ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

Still I would think they have to dig down somewhere to find it.  Its not just out there lying around. 

 

And I don't think they aren't just going to hand out glass shards to everyone, I hope, should make it into some sort of weapon

Dany told Jon that he could mine the dragonglass and that she would provide men to help him fashion it into weapons.  

[DrSpaceman73]

40 minutes ago, meep.meep said:

Dany told Jon that he could mine the dragonglass and that she would provide men to help him fashion it into weapons.  

Yes I heard that part, but I am still just wondering how long that will take.  We know the white walkers are on their way. 

 

Even with modern technology mining it and creating weapons is not something that happens overnight. 

[rmontro]

7 hours ago, CletusMusashi said:

Hmm. I guess Euron is what Negan is supposed to be.  To truly be Negan, though, he'd need about forty-five more minutes of dialogue every week. Euron is a very talkative villain, but he stops just in time, while I'm still chuckling at how outlandish he is.

There are some similarities between Euron and Negan.  They're both very lewd, and somewhat comical.  I think Negan is more likeable though, he has a few redeeming qualities.  I can't think of any with Euron.

[meep.meep]

Euron doesn't lean, and he gets out of town regularly.  As far as we know, he hasn't named his weapons.

[CletusMusashi]

Ellaria could still surprise us. Maybe she'll make a bone shiv and turn Gregor into Frankencyclops.

[Dewey Decimate]

When brooding Tyrion nudged brooding Jon about "is there anything you'd like to ask?", I swear I thought he was hinting that Jon should ask for Dany's hand in marriage. Dragonglass? Oh sure, that too.

Felt very tense during the whole awkward throne room convo, afraid one side would commit an unforgivable faux pas. Didn't expect the Jon-Dany interactions to be a slow-ish burn; I like that they're kind of learning about each other's motivations and similarities in a gradual way. It almost feels quaint and sweet in the shit-hole world that is Westeros.

Jon cutting off Davos in mid-"he took a knife to the heart" and then having Dany ask about it later: I cannot remember from the first couple seasons, but when she got those various curses/predictions from the witchy woman who revived zombie-Drogo (still the most fuck-worthy man in this universe, imo) and/or the freaky Qarth warlock dudes in their dungeon maze thing... did part of it ever mention something about a resurrected Northerner crow? With the accelerated pace of wrapping this entire story up, I have to think every line/scene must be relevant. (Ex. Nymeria's pack last ep - c'mon now, you know at some point she's gonna tear in like the LoTR eagles at the most opportune moment!)

[Keepitmoving]

Quote

The real test of Dany's character will be what she does if Jon is revealed to be the true heir since his father was crown prince and if he married Jon's mother.   That would mean by her own argument she has to step aside to support Jon but she's firecely ambitious.  I don't know if she'd stick to her principles or be a hypocrite to hold on to power.

OK, if I think of the monarchy in England, the crown is passed on to the first born and his/her offspring and so on and so on. So my question is, is Danny the Mad King's first born? No, right? My next question would be, is Jon the son of the Mad King's first born? Because if he is then yes, he would have more claim to the throne than Danny if I model this all after the present day monarchy in England.  What's the birthing order here?

I mean was it right for any of Robert's brothers, I forgot their names, but was it right for them to think that they had a claim to the throne when Joffrey was supposedly Robert's son? We know he wasn't but, did Robert's brother know that? I can't remember. Wasn't it supposed to naturally pass down to Robert's first born son?

Edited August 2, 2017 by Keepitmoving

[paigow]

3 hours ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

Yes I heard that part, but I am still just wondering how long that will take.  We know the white walkers are on their way. 

 

Even with modern technology mining it and creating weapons is not something that happens overnight. 

If you have 3 dragons digging and melting...maybe a few days...Dothraki should be able to mass produce arrow / spear heads....

[paigow]

35 minutes ago, Keepitmoving said:

 Joffrey was supposedly Robert's son? We know he wasn't but, did Robert's brother know that? I can't remember. 

Yes. Stannis knew.

[Calamity Jane]

4 hours ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

Yes I heard that part, but I am still just wondering how long that will take.  We know the white walkers are on their way. 

 

Even with modern technology mining it and creating weapons is not something that happens overnight. 

Let's solve two problems at once - the throne is ugly and Jon needs dragon glass.  Devise a better throne, cut up the current one for Jon's use.  It is made of dragon glass, right?