The Lonely Js Club: James, Jackson & Johannah

[auntieminem]

In the blog Michelle says Joseph, Josiah, Jeremiah, Jason, and James went to ALERT. How did Josh, JD and Jed avoid it, especially Jed since all the other boys from Joe on went?  I don't remember Jason or James going. 

[emmawoodhouse]

I vaguely remember James with a buzzcut maybe 2-3 years ago. I have no memory of Jason going.

[jennblevins]

34 minutes ago, auntieminem said:

In the blog Michelle says Joseph, Josiah, Jeremiah, Jason, and James went to ALERT. How did Josh, JD and Jed avoid it, especially Jed since all the other boys from Joe on went?  I don't remember Jason or James going. 

I assume Josh didn’t go because either a) they knew he couldn’t hack it and would be revealed as a whiny baby rather than a stoic crown prince, or b) he was busy in some variety of Jesus Jail at the time. JD was probably too busy actually being useful to spend that much time away from the family. No idea about Jed. 

[emmawoodhouse]

I think Jed was a model kid, so he didn't "need" ALERT like the other Howlers did. Even Joe doubted his upbringing at one point. 

Poor Josiah. He did 3 tours of duty. I wonder if Boobchelle mace him pay for the extra two? 

[EmeraldGirl]

Justin was the smart one. Since he was going to get married eventually anyway, might as well avoid Jesus/Nazi Youth camp. 

[Sweetpea12]

Jason and James at Alert

https://us.blastingnews.com/showbiz-tv/2019/07/counting-on-james-and-jason-celebrate-graduation-day-after-schooland-alert-002948195.html

[Panopticon]

I remember reading some theories that Jer was sent without Jed! because JB wanted to separate the sinner twin and the good twin for a while. 

[GeeGolly]

7 hours ago, auntieminem said:

In the blog Michelle says Joseph, Josiah, Jeremiah, Jason, and James went to ALERT. How did Josh, JD and Jed avoid it, especially Jed since all the other boys from Joe on went?  I don't remember Jason or James going. 

I think Josh and JD didn't go because the Duggars couldn't afford it then. I know we see Alert mostly as a my way or the highway punishment, but I think most of the brothers wanted to go, so maybe Jed really didn't want too.

[madpsych78]

How long has ALERT existed? Because if it started after Josh and JD were of age, then that explains why they didn't go and why Joseph was the first. They were already making specials when Josh and JD were teens, and Boob spent $250K for his senate campaign before that time, so I don't think it was because they couldn't afford to send them there. 

I think the reasons for Josh and JD not attending were different from the reasons Jed! and Justin didn't attend. Josh and JD = either couldn't afford it or before the existence of ALERT; Jed! = model son; and Justin = got married.

ETA: Never mind. ALERT was founded in 1994. In that case, VERY surprising that at least Josh didn't go. Unless he didn't want to and Boob and J'Chelle conceded because he was the golden child.

Edited June 5, 2022 by madpsych78

[Zella]

I have no actual supporting evidence for this theory and could be talked out of it, but I am wondering if they didn't send Josh to ALERT as continued fallout from his teen scandals.

I usually side-eye the Reddit AMAs, but I do think Justin (who was a childhood friend of Josh's and kept a journal during that time period) was legitimate. He said that in addition to the molestation scandals, Josh ran up a huge phone bill calling a phone sex hotline right before he turned 18. 

Of course, one would think sending Josh to ALERT would have been a default punitive move, but I wonder if they wanted to contain the news about Josh's other indiscretions and part of that was not sending him away to a camp for teen boys where he may well have either bragged about it to other sheltered Gothard youngsters OR been caught redhanded by someone other than his family. 

The TLDR is I think it may have been a total CYA move from his parents not to send him to ALERT. 

Edited June 5, 2022 by Zella

[GeeGolly]

1 hour ago, madpsych78 said:

How long has ALERT existed? Because if it started after Josh and JD were of age, then that explains why they didn't go and why Joseph was the first. They were already making specials when Josh and JD were teens, and Boob spent $250K for his senate campaign before that time, so I don't think it was because they couldn't afford to send them there. 

I think the reasons for Josh and JD not attending were different from the reasons Jed! and Justin didn't attend. Josh and JD = either couldn't afford it or before the existence of ALERT; Jed! = model son; and Justin = got married.

ETA: Never mind. ALERT was founded in 1994. In that case, VERY surprising that at least Josh didn't go. Unless he didn't want to and Boob and J'Chelle conceded because he was the golden child.

They were living 'poor' while JB was saving up his JB! funds. All crammed in a little - possibly free - church house, I believe.

[Scarlett45]

10 hours ago, Zella said:

I have no actual supporting evidence for this theory and could be talked out of it, but I am wondering if they didn't send Josh to ALERT as continued fallout from his teen scandals.

I usually side-eye the Reddit AMAs, but I do think Justin (who was a childhood friend of Josh's and kept a journal during that time period) was legitimate. He said that in addition to the molestation scandals, Josh ran up a huge phone bill calling a phone sex hotline right before he turned 18. 

Of course, one would think sending Josh to ALERT would have been a default punitive move, but I wonder if they wanted to contain the news about Josh's other indiscretions and part of that was not sending him away to a camp for teen boys where he may well have either bragged about it to other sheltered Gothard youngsters OR been caught redhanded by someone other than his family. 

The TLDR is I think it may have been a total CYA move from his parents not to send him to ALERT. 

This is what I assumed. Josh couldn’t be trusted out of the family sight for that long, and JD was actually a useful/dutiful son that JB needed working in some capacity during the times the boys that came after him went to ALERT. 

That explains why they both didn’t go. 

[emmawoodhouse]

28 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

This is what I assumed. Josh couldn’t be trusted out of the family sight for that long, and JD was actually a useful/dutiful son that JB needed working in some capacity during the times the boys that came after him went to ALERT. 

That explains why they both didn’t go. 

I dunno about Smuggar not being trusted while away. They are under 24/7 surveillance at ALERT. He wouldn't have gotten away with anything. From what I understand, it's worse than real boot camp, possibly abusive to a degree. ALERT might have scared Smuggar straight for a little while. Definitely moreso than the IBLP training camp or Jesus Jail. 

[Zella]

1 hour ago, emmawoodhouse said:

They are under 24/7 surveillance at ALERT.

That's exactly my point. It's not him doing whatever he does that alarmed them as much as the idea of him getting caught doing it in a significantly larger social circle. The entire Gothard shtick is that it makes your kids behave, and here's rather significant proof that their golden child isn't behaving. They're not looking at it as "Oh good more eyes on Josh"--it's "Oh shit more eyes on Josh!"

Edited June 6, 2022 by Zella

[emmawoodhouse]

I think the abusive leaders at ALERT might have succeeded in straightening out Smuggar for a while after graduation. But deep down he's a bad seed, so no treatment he ever participates in will cure him. He's a lost cause.

[MunichNark]

Alert is NOT punishment, peeps. That's a common misconception. It's actually quite an honour apparently, as per quite a few people with inside views.

Makes sense. Pseudo Army training form pasty-faced weak boys to feel important and manly

[charmed1]

There was an episode where the family traveled to see one of the boys “graduate” from Alert. The older girls were cheering him on and the camera focused in on Jana who was kind of tearing up. Does anybody remember this? I assumed the boy was JD because he’s her twin, but I fully accept that I can’t tell the difference between Duggar children.

[GeeGolly]

1 hour ago, MunichNark said:

Alert is NOT punishment, peeps. That's a common misconception. It's actually quite an honour apparently, as per quite a few people with inside views.

Makes sense. Pseudo Army training form pasty-faced weak boys to feel important and manly

I agree. Alert is equivalent to giving birth for the guys. They get all kinds of bragging rights for making it through 'boot camp'.

I still stand by lack of money as the reason Josh and JD didn't go. The first Duggar special was in 2004, two years after JB blew $250,000 and when Josh was 16. Since they didn't get picked up as a series until 2008, the year Josh was married, they weren't flush with money until after Josh and JD aged out of Alert. 

[SMama]

1 hour ago, charmed1 said:

There was an episode where the family traveled to see one of the boys “graduate” from Alert. The older girls were cheering him on and the camera focused in on Jana who was kind of tearing up. Does anybody remember this? I assumed the boy was JD because he’s her twin, but I fully accept that I can’t tell the difference between Duggar children.

I recall that episode, it was Joe’s graduation, and Jinger was the emotional sister. She ran to him like he was her guy coming home from war. 

[ginger90]

Jason video:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CeZiyaEgqlG/

[charmed1]

2 hours ago, SMama said:

I recall that episode, it was Joe’s graduation, and Jinger was the emotional sister. She ran to him like he was her guy coming home from war. 

Ha ha! Thank you for proving that I not only can’t tell the difference between any of the howlers, I apparently can’t distinguish between the J’Indentured Servants Hearts either. Yes, the way Jingle was carrying on, I had wondered if something had happened to Joe before or during his time there.

Edited June 6, 2022 by charmed1

[Notabug]

8 hours ago, Zella said:

That's exactly my point. It's not him doing whatever he does that alarmed them as much as the idea of him getting caught doing it in a significantly larger social circle. The entire Gothard shtick is that it makes your kids behave, and here's rather significant proof that their golden child isn't behaving. They're not looking at it as "Oh good more eyes on Josh"--it's "Oh shit more eyes on Josh!"

I think you're exactly right.  JB and Michelle's major concern with Josh was that he not make THEM look bad.  Had he gone to ALERT and gotten caught misbehaving or taught a couple things to other fundie boys; it could've jeopardized their status in the cult.  Remember, too, that JB and Michelle were featured speakers at many IBLP events and probably made a good buck from it. They couldn't afford to lose those gigs which would've probably happened if TPTB at IBLP gotten a hint as to the extent of Josh' extracurricular activities.

[GeeGolly]

It sounded like in that woman's deposition about the molestations that everyone in the Fundy community knew about Josh. I believe 17 is the age when most go to Alert, so by Duggar standards Josh was fixed by then. I wouldn't be surprised if JB & M used a cleaned up version of Josh 'mishaps' and 'redemption' in many of their presentations.

[Scarlett45]

10 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

It sounded like in that woman's deposition about the molestations that everyone in the Fundy community knew about Josh. I believe 17 is the age when most go to Alert, so by Duggar standards Josh was fixed by then. I wouldn't be surprised if JB & M used a cleaned up version of Josh 'mishaps' and 'redemption' in many of their presentations.

Taking my response to the Josh thread.

[Nysha]

17 hours ago, MunichNark said:

Alert is NOT punishment, peeps. That's a common misconception. It's actually quite an honour apparently, as per quite a few people with inside views.

Makes sense. Pseudo Army training form pasty-faced weak boys to feel important and manly

I agree, to a point. Josiah had a fun personality that was totally stomped out of him when he got done with Alert. So, it may be an honor, I think it is run more like the harshest movie version of boot camp to break the attendees into conformity.

[xwordfanatik]

Regarding Michelle's post about Jackson...does that ALERT outfit have any statistics of the number of it's "graduates" go on to public service employment as police, firefighters, military enlistees, or anything except fundie self-employment a la the Duggars?

[cmr2014]

22 hours ago, Nysha said:

I agree, to a point. Josiah had a fun personality that was totally stomped out of him when he got done with Alert. So, it may be an honor, I think it is run more like the harshest movie version of boot camp to break the attendees into conformity.

I think that "honor and priviledge" to go to ALERT is the party line -- I can't imagine any Gothard kid saying anything else. My guess is that it depends on the person and the situation.

I think that there was a lot of concern about Josiah. There was a lot of insinuation on this board about his "fabulousness" and I don't think that it went unnoticed in the Duggar household (the behavior, not the board chatter). Some kids might get sent to ALERT because they want to play with guns -- or whatever -- but I think Josiah was sent to toughen him up and make him present in a more "masculine" way.

[lascuba]

19 minutes ago, cmr2014 said:

I think that "honor and priviledge" to go to ALERT is the party line -- I can't imagine any Gothard kid saying anything else. My guess is that it depends on the person and the situation.

I think that there was a lot of concern about Josiah. There was a lot of insinuation on this board about his "fabulousness" and I don't think that it went unnoticed in the Duggar household (the behavior, not the board chatter). Some kids might get sent to ALERT because they want to play with guns -- or whatever -- but I think Josiah was sent to toughen him up and make him present in a more "masculine" way.

It really struck me how JB cried when Josiah married. He looked almost relieved.

[Heathen]

It bums me out that Jackson is a Lonely J now. He was born on the first special I watched, and now I feel old. 

[emmawoodhouse]

5 minutes ago, Heathen said:

It bums me out that Jackson is a Lonely J now. He was born on the first special I watched, and now I feel old. 

Jackson's birth was featured in the very first special, 14 Kids and Pregnant Again. So, you've been with then since Day One! 😃

[Heathen]

1 minute ago, emmawoodhouse said:

Jackson's birth was featured in the very first special, 14 Kids and Pregnant Again. So, you've been with then since Day One! 😃

Even a little before, I think. I remember reading an article about them and then seeing the ads for the special before it aired. So yes, I have been snarking for way too long now. 

[GeeGolly]

2 hours ago, cmr2014 said:

I think that "honor and priviledge" to go to ALERT is the party line -- I can't imagine any Gothard kid saying anything else. My guess is that it depends on the person and the situation.

I think that there was a lot of concern about Josiah. There was a lot of insinuation on this board about his "fabulousness" and I don't think that it went unnoticed in the Duggar household (the behavior, not the board chatter). Some kids might get sent to ALERT because they want to play with guns -- or whatever -- but I think Josiah was sent to toughen him up and make him present in a more "masculine" way.

I think it goes both ways with some Fundy kids. If they are "struggling with (fabulous) thoughts", they themselves may want to go to Alert. We still have folks in mainstream society struggling with coming to terms with who they are, it must be torturous for a Fundy.

[emmawoodhouse]

So true. I am reminded of a guy on the reality show Family Karma. He grew up fundie, always knew he was gay. He came out to his parents when he was 19 and was basically thrown out. Now in his mid-30s, he's engaged to be married to his longtime boyfriend and hasn't told his parents. He doesn't think it would accomplish anything; it's not as if they would come to the wedding. 

At least he's happy and living his best life. So many gay children of fundies aren't as fortunate.

[lascuba]

10 hours ago, Heathen said:

Even a little before, I think. I remember reading an article about them and then seeing the ads for the special before it aired. So yes, I have been snarking for way too long now. 

Same. an article from when she was pregnant with Jackson about her winning an award was discussed in a message board I was a member of. Some posters were commenting on the weirdness of have 15 kids and why give an award for that, and I thought at the time, "Meh, 14 kids is a LOT. She probably deserves it just for not losing her mind." And then I saw the first special several months later and thought, "Oh, NO. No no no no no no NO!!!!"

[Scarlett45]

23 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

So true. I am reminded of a guy on the reality show Family Karma. He grew up fundie, always knew he was gay. He came out to his parents when he was 19 and was basically thrown out. Now in his mid-30s, he's engaged to be married to his longtime boyfriend and hasn't told his parents. He doesn't think it would accomplish anything; it's not as if they would come to the wedding. 

At least he's happy and living his best life. So many gay children of fundies aren't as fortunate.

Taking my reply to Small Talk. 

[LilJen]

I enjoyed how Michelle titled the post “Jackson’s Big Day!” Like he was a three-year-old who went to the zoo, or used the potty for the first time.

[auntieminem]

Boys and their toys. James and Jason and a couple of other guys that work for Jason I think.  I guess it is nice that the are having fun and in the water in appropriate water wear and shirtless. Hope they are using lots of sunscreen since that skin is not use to sun rays.  From James IG https://www.instagram.com/p/Ce0D27sj5zf/

[GeeGolly]

Yup, drive a personal water craft over/through floating debris. Absolutely brilliant Duggar! 🤦🏽‍♀️

(Edited to include @MargeGunderson's truly brilliant suggestion!)

Edited June 15, 2022 by GeeGolly

[MargeGunderson]

21 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Yup, drive a personal water craft over/through floating debris. Absolutely brilliant! 🤦🏽‍♀️

This would be an appropriate use of Duggar as an adjective - “Absolutely duggar!” 
It could be used in so many ways - for describing just-below-the-knee denim skirts, the overuse of shiplap, random unsafe placement of shelves, inappropriate mini golf course humping, you get the picture. 

[Cinnabon]

2 hours ago, MargeGunderson said:

This would be an appropriate use of Duggar as an adjective - “Absolutely duggar!” 
It could be used in so many ways - for describing just-below-the-knee denim skirts, the overuse of shiplap, random unsafe placement of shelves, inappropriate mini golf course humping, you get the picture. 

Anything hateful and hypocritical as well.

[emmawoodhouse]

I wish I could say shirtless Jason defrauded me, but sorry, kid is soft. 🤮

[Cinnabon]

2 minutes ago, emmawoodhouse said:

I wish I could say shirtless Jason defrauded me, but sorry, kid is soft. 🤮

Cue more ridiculous posts showing him “working out.”

[crazy8s]

His work out buddy Elijah is one of the guys pictured there with him. Their workout pics seem to mostly involve pics of equipment, so that would explain the lack of physical fitness.

[xwordfanatik]

2 hours ago, emmawoodhouse said:

I wish I could say shirtless Jason defrauded me, but sorry, kid is soft. 🤮

Hilaria would beg your pardon, and disagree.  🙃

[Nysha]

On 6/15/2022 at 4:29 PM, Cinnabon said:

Cue more ridiculous posts showing him “working out.”

On 6/15/2022 at 5:07 PM, crazy8s said:

His work out buddy Elijah is one of the guys pictured there with him. Their workout pics seem to mostly involve pics of equipment, so that would explain the lack of physical fitness.

So their next gym photo op will include someone to use a spray bottle of water to make it look like they've just finished working out like real men.

[ginger90]

[GeeGolly]

Wow Jackson is the spitting image of JB.

[BigBingerBro]

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

Wow Jackson is the spitting image of JB.

I see a ot of MeShell

[Heathen]

53 minutes ago, BigBingerBro said:

I see a ot of MeShell

The narrower face looks like Mullet to me, too. 

[auntieminem]

OK, what's up? First Jason does a happy father's day post and now James does one. https://www.instagram.com/stories/jamesaduggar/2864242492117609190/

Jason thanking pops for "investing in him" is odd. That is what parents do. He has to be talking about money because he sure didn't invest much else in his kids. Did any of the kids say anything to Michelle on Mother's Day?