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The Lonely Js Club: James, Jackson & Johannah

SpaghettiTuesdays

By SpaghettiTuesdays
in Counting On

Scarlett45
Message added by Scarlett45,

Discussing the charges against Jana is fine, but do not post any information that reveals her address/contact information- even if said documents are public (i.e. a part of court proceedings.)

Discussing charges against Jana is NOT a jumping off point to speculate on other instances abuse/neglect etc towards the M-children or to elaborate on Josh's conviction and potential victims.  

 

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Ijustwantsomechips
Ijustwantsomechips

Maybe Jana needs her own thread as a token of the respect she’ll never garner as a single woman in Gothardland.  

andromeda331
andromeda331

How about both hop in the plane close the door really quickly and fly off.  Abbie: "Where are we going?" JD: Cayman Islands. We're elope. And we're not coming back! Abbie: Wait we need

BitterApple
BitterApple

Wow, so this is what, the fourth guy to publicly release a statement denying involvement with Jana? That must be doing wonders for her self-esteem.  These guys are starting to piss me off, though

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

(edited)

She was introduced onstage as a "family friend." *wink wink*

I also heard that Laura DeMaisie was also there. I guess Mechelle had to hire out some help for Jana for kid-wrangling. 

Pickles also reported that the Duggars got a spendy traffic ticket for running a red light. 

Edited by Sew Sumi
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Yukibear

Yukibear

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(edited)

Well, first off I thought the kids presented themselves really well, they spoke well and were lovely to the people who spoke to them. Jana is very tiny, and pretty. Her idiot for a father told the gathering that she was single and 28. She was really  embarrassed. Lauren was giving the J kid lots of deep and meaningful looks. She took Josie out and later held her while she slept, so I would say she was very familiar with the family. The boy twins said the trip was supposed to be just them. Red light story was true, they got a $360 fine and said our police aren’t as forgiving as theirs.

 

That said, I haven’t heard so much hypocracy and bullshit for a long time! Did you know that if you push out lots of kids you will live longer? That you shouldn’t have a tv because it stops communication, but it’s ok to be on Tv and make $$. They kept mentioning that widows need help, most widows I know have fantastic lives travelling, working and don’t need a bunch of people making cookies for them. And the Josh thing (aka “some troubles”) was a media beat up.

Edited by Yukibear
Typos!
  • Love 48
Temperance

Temperance

Thanks! I should have known. Kendra's sister looks like just like Kendra, and that must be Lauren Swanson above.  I agreed a courtship with Kendra's sister seemed possible. I wonder if the Duggars would have the same qualms about family members with the same name as the Maxwells. 

@Yukibear good to know, I find it hard to believe having more kids will help you live longer. Maybe in terms of keeping your DNA on the planet. One of my friends is convinced Michelle must have serious medical problems from having so many kids (she brings it up any time I mention the Duggars).  Anyway JB and Michelle are in their early 50s. Start making that claim a few years into your 80s.  

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

(edited)

Who is the first dude in the picture? I'm thinking maybe Josie needs glasses. At first glance I thought she was napping on the table but she appears to be signing a book. The book posted doesn't have her name. She must take too long and they bypass her until she's done. Where are Jordyn, Jennifer, Johannah, JD and Jana?

I didn't know there were so many different ways to make a J.

Edited by GeeGolly
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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

23 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Who is the first dude in the picture? I'm thinking maybe Josie needs glasses. At first glance I thought she was napping on the table but she appears to be signing a book. The book posted doesn't have her name. She must take too long and they bypass her until she's done. Where are Jordyn, Jennifer, Johannah, JD and Jana?

I didn't know there were so many different ways to make a J.

Josie signed the book. It's in green right under Jason. 

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

52 minutes ago, DangerousMinds said:

Widows need help? Wtf?

They still play it like in the Little House on the Prairie days when a widow my struggle on a farm or something.

God forbid a widow got a job and went into the world without a son or husband by their side to protect them. Then again, they shelter females to the point of almost being unemployable.

JB would be a washed up politician selling cars and houses if he didn't have Michelle's womanly uterus by his side. The way they devalue women is offensive.

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Temperance

Temperance

(edited)
1 hour ago, DangerousMinds said:

Widows need help? Wtf?

That makes more sense if a) someone in their senior years, or b)a woman is young and widowed with a ton of kids. So far all three married parent Duggars get lots of help with their kids. i.e. leaving them at TTH with Aunt Jana. Imagine anyone of them being left with their brood to manage. Or someone with more kids, since they're quiverfull. or c) the Duggar kids seem pretty equally to have skills and education, but a lot of fundie families probably train and spend more training their boys to have skills since they need to support the family but the girls are given less formal education to be housewives. 

Edited by Temperance
to include c
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BCDL

BCDL

(edited)

Find a widow and rake her yard. Your husband is your spiritual leader. We are all broken, but can be fixed (thank-you Jesus).

If they spoke this way on TV, they would not have a show. I've never heard such preaching before.

They did all seem like genuinely nice people who had plenty of time for everyone.

Edited by BCDL
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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

10 hours ago, madpsych78 said:

tumblr_p2haisuth61r9t2zdo1_1280.png

tumblr_p2haisuth61r9t2zdo2_1280.png

Is Josiah courting? The book is signed "Lauren & Josiah." 

My only hope is that the Duggars outnumbered the paying crowd.       I'm sure they didn't, since fame brings gawking, no matter the nature of the famous. 

But I can dream. 

7 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

 

I didn't know there were so many different ways to make a J.

Your subconscious probably provides you with an original way to make a J (and every other letter) when it realizes that this will be the only self-initiated individuality you'll ever be permitted to express!

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riverblue22

riverblue22

2 hours ago, Fuzzysox said:

We all knew the time would come when they would have to start marrying off the boys. Now it's Josiah's turn and they pick a girl that looks like Anna (profile). I hope that Si is happy and not being forced to do something he doesn't want to do.

I think the courtship is all Josiah's idea.  He tried this a few years ago when he was much younger and he has probably always wanted to find another girl.  Now he too will be one of the cool kids~

  • Love 8
Catfin

Catfin

1 hour ago, Marigold said:

Michelle uses glasses/readers and probably posted that without seeing the medical stuff hooked up to Sammy!! 

(said at someone Michelle's age who can't see a damn thing either)

I noticed she usually has a "ReaderRest" glasses clip on her clothes. Those are the magnetic reading glasses holders featured on Shark Tank. She forgot to take it off for that recent family photo shoot. 

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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

(edited)

Response to BigSkyGirl, re: JD fleeing. She wrote: The question is would JD have the skills to live in a Duggar free world. He may have some work experience, but without daddy to buy him planes and the necessary skills to be in the real world, he may end up going back to Duggar Land with his tail between his legs.

 

 

Yep, I agree.

But ... that doesn't happen to everybody. So I still want him -- and the rest of them! -- to try.

I think J.D.'s worst problem in the "real world" would be a total lack of confidence that he could make it and a lack of confidence in his own abilities and self-worth and all that. They've had it drummed into their heads that, individually and on their own and without Duggar religion and family, they're nothing, I think. And they've had it drilled into them that, if they were to run up against obstacles in the real world, those obstacles are to be feared and probably mean the devil and devilish are out to get them, etc.

So mindset would be more of barrier for JD -- who does clearly have some skills, some drive and some work ethic -- than a lack of ability to make a life apart from the TTH, I expect. ... I would not say the same for many of the others. I think a lot of them do lack skills, drive and work ethic. But I think some of them -- notably JD and Jana -- do have those things.

And, no, I don't think they're Henry Ford or Martha Stewart or anything. But I'd bet they have as good a set of skills, drive and work ethic as the average -- or maybe slightly below average person (to state the more pessimistic case). And near-average people can live on their own and make decisions about their own lives and be happy adults who feel like adults. 

It makes me sad that thanks to the family brainwashing, they'll probably never know what it means to function as individual, free adults. Because I think they could do it. 

Edited by Churchhoney
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bigskygirl

bigskygirl

Of the Duggar men (including sons-in-law) JD does have a half way decent work ethic. I do wonder how many hours a week he does actually work. In order to survive in the real world, he would need to work forty plus hours a week to support a wife and family or even just himself. He probably sets his own hours since technically he runs his own business and flies when JB decides it is time for him to fly. I think it would be more than mental mindset for JD to head out in the real world. He would need to deal with people who do not share his family beliefs and prejudice and realize every one is equal. Plus the fact he would need to live down what Josh did because he would be judge by what his family has done and will be doing in the future. He might feel safer hiding out with his family than to face the big evil world. He has been taught more than once it is the evil world to be blamed for what Josh has done, and no one except for a few people are to be trusted. He may also feel it is easier to let JB run his life than deal with real world. I know people who had a half way decent childhood who feel the same way. Why go out and deal with the real world when it is much safer to hide at home and live with mom and dad because it is much safer and more comfortable and/or let them run their whole life for them.

bigskygirl

bigskygirl

He may not live at home, but he is still under JB's thumb. I think it was in one episode where JB said he wanted to have complete control over his kids until they got married because controlled kids do not get into trouble etc. etc. or he said something close to it. I think they are trying to portray JD has the golden older son since portraying Josh as the golden oldest son came back to bite them in the behind.

GeeGolly

GeeGolly

1 hour ago, Churchhoney said:

Response to BigSkyGirl, re: JD fleeing. She wrote: The question is would JD have the skills to live in a Duggar free world. He may have some work experience, but without daddy to buy him planes and the necessary skills to be in the real world, he may end up going back to Duggar Land with his tail between his legs.

 

 

Yep, I agree.

But ... that doesn't happen to everybody. So I still want him -- and the rest of them! -- to try.

I think J.D.'s worst problem in the "real world" would be a total lack of confidence that he could make it and a lack of confidence in his own abilities and self-worth and all that. They've had it drummed into their heads that, individually and on their own and without Duggar religion and family, they're nothing, I think. And they've had it drilled into them that, if they were to run up against obstacles in the real world, those obstacles are to be feared and probably mean the devil and devilish are out to get them, etc.

So mindset would be more of barrier for JD -- who does clearly have some skills, some drive and some work ethic -- than a lack of ability to make a life apart from the TTH, I expect. ... I would not say the same for many of the others. I think a lot of them do lack skills, drive and work ethic. But I think some of them -- notably JD and Jana -- do have those things.

And, no, I don't think they're Henry Ford or Martha Stewart or anything. But I'd bet they have as good a set of skills, drive and work ethic as the average -- or maybe slightly below average person (to state the more pessimistic case). And near-average people can live on their own and make decisions about their own lives and be happy adults who feel like adults. 

It makes me sad that thanks to the family brainwashing, they'll probably never know what it means to function as individual, free adults. Because I think they could do it. 

JD and Jana may have an average skill set but they lack a typical transition into adulthood. Most kids ease into adulthood by riding their bike a little farther, staying home alone, working a part-time job, going away to college, etc. It's one of the reasons Jill is failing at adulthood - she went from crying in daddy's shoulder at the dentist to the marriage bed without much in between. This lack of transition would certainly add to a lack of self-confidence.

If JD is as laid back as he appears, I think he would be able to manage and push through the initial discomfort of calling all his own shots.

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queenanne

queenanne

19 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

JD and Jana may have an average skill set but they lack a typical transition into adulthood. Most kids ease into adulthood by riding their bike a little farther, staying home alone, working a part-time job, going away to college, etc. It's one of the reasons Jill is failing at adulthood - she went from crying in daddy's shoulder at the dentist to the marriage bed without much in between. This lack of transition would certainly add to a lack of self-confidence.

If JD is as laid back as he appears, I think he would be able to manage and push through the initial discomfort of calling all his own shots.

There's even something to be said for making your kid do their own dentistry, outside of the years when you can't trust the kid to be able to report accurately upon what a dentist says to them.  I now go to solo doctors' appointments for surgeries where my parents are all, "Um, are you sure you don't want one of us to travel out to be with you?", and it's largely because neither has accompanied me into a doctors' office post-aged fourteen, unless something that needed parental permission was being discussed.

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Churchhoney

Churchhoney

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

JD and Jana may have an average skill set but they lack a typical transition into adulthood. Most kids ease into adulthood by riding their bike a little farther, staying home alone, working a part-time job, going away to college, etc. It's one of the reasons Jill is failing at adulthood - she went from crying in daddy's shoulder at the dentist to the marriage bed without much in between. This lack of transition would certainly add to a lack of self-confidence.

If JD is as laid back as he appears, I think he would be able to manage and push through the initial discomfort of calling all his own shots.

Oh, yeah, I had this transition problem. Thanks for this analysis. 

I had to go from close to zero to highway speed literally overnight. And I was a huge mess in most ways, for years, because of that. But I just kept going -- because I was not going to go back -- even though I was basically a disaster area for a long long time.  And I've always been way behindhand in the confidence area because I could see the vast differences between where I was and where everybody else was who was the same age. I'll die that way no doubt.

But you can still do it. .... I'm laid back in some ways and not at all in others. So I can definitely see what you mean about JD's laidbackness, to the extent that he has it, being helpful to him. 

But as @bigskygirl mentioned earlier, the sticking point for them may be on that thing that kept me going. I'd realized the wrongness of my early situation for so long and so acutely that I would rather have died than have returned to it. ....

But ... not at all clear where a Duggarling -- or anybody, really -- will come down on a point like this. For some, it might be persisting in the outside world that seems like the fate worse than death. Hard to see who'll feel which way, when push comes to shove, I think. 

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ChocolateAddict

ChocolateAddict

Let's just look at what skills and knowledge one of the kids would need to have (or learn quickly) to break totally free. 

How to find a house or apartment - nope. They've all been living in TTH or daddy's rental properties. They have no contacts or friends who aren't part of the cult and probably wouldn't have the cash for a deposit or bond. 

How to find a job - definitely not. Most of us learnt that you walk around asking businesses or look on the internet. Then we learnt how to put together a resume and how to present ourselves in interviews. Not only to the Duggars have no qualifications (JD excluded), all their work experience has been for Duggar Industries. They've been told for years that the only acceptable employment is self employment. That's a lot to overcome just to start earning. 

How to be financially stable - probs a no on this one too. The oldest would remember what is was like living on "love offerings" but the middle and younger ones have grown up with trips to New York to be on "Good Morning America" and MacBooks. They wouldn't know how to open a bank account, balance a budget or pay taxes. 

The SOTDRT certainly didn't teach any of that. And the deliberate isolation means that they would struggle to find people to support them while they learnt. They would have to leave their family, friends and whole belief system to go. 

Since they've been on TV, they have been able to get away with filming some stuff, taking some photos and otherwise sitting on their backsides doing very little. Even though it might be miserable, the outside world with all its challenges would be petrifying and hard work. Sadly, I can't see any of them fully breaking away. 

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mythoughtis

mythoughtis

(edited)

Chocolate addict- people who say ‘ well they can leave any time’ need to read your post. It’s an excellent reminder of why that’s so difficult. 

Add to that the fact that that 2 of the 3 offspring that have left(Josh, Jill, Jinger) have come  back home defeated by life.  Yes, Jill is now in an apartment off the compound- but we don’t know how long that will last.  She couldn’t even do the apartment thing without Derick. 

Edited by mythoughtis
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bythelake

bythelake

1 hour ago, ChocolateAddict said:

Let's just look at what skills and knowledge one of the kids would need to have (or learn quickly) to break totally free. 

How to find a house or apartment - nope. They've all been living in TTH or daddy's rental properties. They have no contacts or friends who aren't part of the cult and probably wouldn't have the cash for a deposit or bond. 

How to find a job - definitely not. Most of us learnt that you walk around asking businesses or look on the internet. Then we learnt how to put together a resume and how to present ourselves in interviews. Not only to the Duggars have no qualifications (JD excluded), all their work experience has been for Duggar Industries. They've been told for years that the only acceptable employment is self employment. That's a lot to overcome just to start earning. 

How to be financially stable - probs a no on this one too. The oldest would remember what is was like living on "love offerings" but the middle and younger ones have grown up with trips to New York to be on "Good Morning America" and MacBooks. They wouldn't know how to open a bank account, balance a budget or pay taxes. 

The SOTDRT certainly didn't teach any of that. And the deliberate isolation means that they would struggle to find people to support them while they learnt. They would have to leave their family, friends and whole belief system to go. 

Since they've been on TV, they have been able to get away with filming some stuff, taking some photos and otherwise sitting on their backsides doing very little. Even though it might be miserable, the outside world with all its challenges would be petrifying and hard work. Sadly, I can't see any of them fully breaking away. 

But, don't you remember in an early episode when Michelle was still teaching at the SOTDRT she told the children, that today they we're going to learn about bankruptcy. Can you all say bankruptcy? Who knew it might come in handy one day.

  • Love 12
Lady Edith

Lady Edith

JB and MeChelle successfully raises a small army of lifetime dependents.  Those two had the benefit of a “real” education through HS and can somewhat navigate the pitfalls of the “real world”.  Nearly all of their offspring have no marketable or life skills in general to be able to survive on their own. JD is probably the most marketable with his piloting.  

IMHO this was done on purpose.  They wanted to always have control of their kids and grandkids.  JB built a fiefdom and us going to be hugely invested in keeping it going through financial controls.  No doubt about it, he has all of those kids under his thumb. Including the Duggars-in-law.  The only inlaw who has a chance of making it on his own is Jeremy (and you know how much JB loves him...).

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bigskygirl

bigskygirl

JD piloting skills comes from flying his family around in planes his father owns. I do not see much marketable skills in flying your family around because your father gives the orders. In order to work in the real world he would need to learn to take orders from others who is not his father or *gasp* females and others who does not share his family's values. Does he works with others or for others who do not share his family values in his construction business. How well is his construction business doing? I also bet JB has some say so in how he runs his business or who he works for. He does have some contact with others with his volunteer constable work, but he probably still has to report to JB and if JB does not like something JD gets involve in, he probably would put an end to JD being a volunteer constable. Plus the fact is JD really happy about the jobs he has because these type of jobs are Gothard approved, and he had to get approval from JB before being able to do anything. JB may "allow" JD to leave and do his own thing, but I seriously doubt JD would be totally free because daddy would still be in the background running parts of JD's life. You can take a Duggar away from the Duggars, but you cannot take the Duggar out of the child.

Lady Edith

Lady Edith

I disagree on the piloting not being a marketable skill.  It’s something JD has that he can take with him outside of the Duggar fiefdom (if he so chooses).  It’s something that JD has that JB cannot take from him.  If JD were to leave today, he could find employment elsewhere, maybe as a private pilot or as a pilot for a charter company.  He has enough miles under his belt to qualify, I’m sure.  And with a little more school and training, he could go for his commercial license and really go places (pun intended).  None of the other kids have the benefit of a professional skill like this.  

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BitterApple

BitterApple

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Just my take, but I think out of all the Duggar kids, JD is one of the few who could find and maintain a full-time job. He has a pilot's license, CDL and heavy equipment operator's license. Those are actual skills you can put down on a job application and show proof of, rather than the ambiguous "jack of all trades" stuff the rest of the boys do for Boob. It might be a bit of an adjustment going from Duggar Time to a set schedule, but I think he could do it. Hell, if Josh managed to shlep his chubby, lazy butt to D.C. for that FRC gig, JD could definitely hack it in the real world.

  • Love 32
bigskygirl

bigskygirl

There is a different from your father owning the planes and flying your family around to flying commercial or even being a private pilot. I have heard getting a pilot license is not that hard, but you need strong math, reading, logic and people skills to do so. He would be taken orders from people who is not his father and actually need to be on time. By flying for his father and owning his own business, he is still in a way running on Duggar time instead of what people in the real world would expect of him. He is riding on his father's coattails by flying planes his father owns and doing things a Duggar male is expected to aka volunteer constable, CDL, and heavy equipment operator license. Why leave his father's backing by going out and getting a job where you are expecting to get up and get moving and following orders made by others. Maybe JD is enjoying his life the way it is now. Yes, he has been brainwashed by JB about the evil world out there, but he may feel safe and secure where he is without the brainwashing. Would I like to see a Duggar child go out on their own and succeed beyond their dreams? Of course, I would, but JD may not be one of them because he may be a little too comfortable where he is at now.

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madpsych78

madpsych78

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1 hour ago, Lady Edith said:

JB and MeChelle successfully raises a small army of lifetime dependents.  Those two had the benefit of a “real” education through HS and can somewhat navigate the pitfalls of the “real world”.  Nearly all of their offspring have no marketable or life skills in general to be able to survive on their own. JD is probably the most marketable with his piloting.  

IMHO this was done on purpose.  They wanted to always have control of their kids and grandkids.  JB built a fiefdom and us going to be hugely invested in keeping it going through financial controls.  No doubt about it, he has all of those kids under his thumb. Including the Duggars-in-law.  The only inlaw who has a chance of making it on his own is Jeremy (and you know how much JB loves him...).

I would add Austin with his house flipping business. I actually liked his father's guidelines for getting married (i.e., flip five houses first).

Derick SHOULD have been able to make it on his own given his educational background, but hasn't. He's the only one where I would squarely place the blame on him for ending up the way he has, rather than any parents or in-laws. I don't believe for one second that Cathy discouraged him from getting an education or developing any life skills since he obviously got a bachelor's in accounting. I do believe that Derick has become dependent purely out of his own choosing.

  • Love 27
bythelake

bythelake

49 minutes ago, Lady Edith said:

JB and MeChelle successfully raises a small army of lifetime dependents.  Those two had the benefit of a “real” education through HS and can somewhat navigate the pitfalls of the “real world”.  Nearly all of their offspring have no marketable or life skills in general to be able to survive on their own. JD is probably the most marketable with his piloting.  

IMHO this was done on purpose.  They wanted to always have control of their kids and grandkids.  JB built a fiefdom and us going to be hugely invested in keeping it going through financial controls.  No doubt about it, he has all of those kids under his thumb. Including the Duggars-in-law.  The only inlaw who has a chance of making it on his own is Jeremy (and you know how much JB loves him...).

Very true. With the way the family is growing, JB is going to run out of money. He already subsidizes  Josh, Jill, Jessa, and Joe. None of them would make it on their own. They have never been taught self reliance or coping skills Everything, including choosing a mate, has to be approved by Daddy, and those mates so far have not been anything to be proud of. Derick is a religious zealot, Ben cleans toilets,Kendra is a pregnant teen, and Anna lives with a pervert. 

Unless JB has set up trusts for them after his death, it will be a disaster. Anna is already homeschooling, with Jill and Jessa soon to follow. None of these girls is disciplined enough or intelligent enough to teach at home. We've all seen how well Michelle taught. (Can you spell perpendicular?)The next generation will be worse off than this one by far.

  • Love 14
Scarlett45
Message added by Scarlett45,

Discussing the charges against Jana is fine, but do not post any information that reveals her address/contact information- even if said documents are public (i.e. a part of court proceedings.)

Discussing charges against Jana is NOT a jumping off point to speculate on other instances abuse/neglect etc towards the M-children or to elaborate on Josh's conviction and potential victims.  

 

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