S02.E18: The Good, the Bad and the Crispy

[Gigi43]

So I still need to rewatch but I just really wanted to throw this out there talking about "how did real Charlotte come back?" with a friend. What if, although I don't know how it would work with what was happening to her body, we're unluckly enough that Mom/Charlotte was faking not remembering anything? To get Lucifer and everyone off her back to regroup a plan. She better not be kept around after what happened to Linda but the people involved with the show really seem to love Tricia. 

 

At first I thought Maze or Amenadiel knocked Luci out because either they blame him for Linda or to prevent him from telling Chloe the truth given Amenadiel is against humans knowing and he and Maze know what harm its done Linda (even though, as she stated, she's made the choice to be his friend.) Wasn't sure how that fit in with the very end. But Mom putting him in a kind of place he was going to send her.... Did we see the sword after the time freeze? I really need a rewatch. For the first time I was watching with a friend (actually, my brother's friend), which had the unfortunate consequence of talking to each other in real time about it all and missed some things. Also my brother was around and was asking questions "Wait, wait, the devil has a shrink?!" "Wait, he has a black brother who calls the devil Luci?" "How did the cops hire him?" Us: "If you shut up you'll see it all fits!" We almost had a Luci/Amenadiel  adult childish sibling bicker of our own.

[storyskip]

Ah the comics make an appearance ...

Spoiler

They gave "Mom" the Demiurgos powers of Michael.  Nice touch back to the comics!  I know the show has firmly moved away from the source material but it's nice to see it poke it's head up now and again

It was a solid episode, though is it bad that I fast forward through all the Chloe centric scenes?  

Now we wait till September and I have a sinking suspicion that [ and this is purely SPECULATION based on the end ] we're going to end up with an amnesia plot line for the first half of season 3.  Which just ... please can we not?

[johntfs]

21 minutes ago, dippydee said:

Lucifer will probably regret throwing the blade in too.

Lucifer threw most of the blade in.  He kept the Key portion to give back to Amendiel.  Which also means that Mom can't use it to come back.

[Commando Cody]

I'm hoping Tricia's part will be like the one she had on Burn Notice. She was part of a season arc. They got rid of her and moved on to a new handler. It's a bonus if the rest of the cast likes you. Likability off camera doesn't translate to the viewing audience. 

Now that he has his wings back, I hope this means he's a new "juiced up" Lucifer.  I've been frustrated with a weakened Castiel. It was no fun at all. 

[Rosiejuliemom]

47 minutes ago, johntfs said:

Lucifer threw most of the blade in.  He kept the Key portion to give back to Amendiel.  Which also means that Mom can't use it to come back.

I'm a little bummed that he didn't keep the buckle, too. I'd like to see God Johnson again.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

If Mom does somehow come back, she should be in an entirely different body, to make it interesting, but hopefully that won't happen anytime soon.

[Maelstrom]

Adding to the chorus: this episode was awesome, every single part of it. Except for Amenadiel's attempt at improv, which was so terrible it ended up circling back around to awesome. I really appreciated that every character got a moment to shine, even Trixie and Ella, both of whom have been backburnered the most this season. In fact, the only thing that's not awesome about this episode is that I have to wait four months for a new episode!

Count me in with everyone who thinks the ending sequence with Luci in the desert was a flashback to his arrival on Earth. (And to whichever member of the production crew who is responsible for that long lingering shot of Luci wearing nothing but big white wings and tight black pants: thank you. Thank you very much.)

About Linda: I was wondering also if she was suddenly off suspension after last week's goings-on - it seems like that thread got dropped. Understandable, since they had more than enough to cover in this and did a fantastic job of it. But if it turns out she is suspended or (Dad forbid) loses her license to practice, I wonder if she would end up consulting for the LAPD? Total speculation, of course. Can't wait for September!

[tennisgurl]

"Let there be light" *sniffle*

Agreeing with the consensus that this was an amazing finale, and a great capper to an awesome season. And to think it took me half a season to catch up on this last season because I thought it sounded stupid, and the first few episodes were really generic! This season really stepped its game up, in writing, cinematography, and performances. I love how the show wrapped up the Mom arc, it was a nice compromise. She couldn't stay on Earth, but it would be dangerous to let her back into either Heaven or Hell, so I Lucifer gave her a new land to rule over. Not a bad ending. And Lucifer showed real character growth there, not giving into anger or selfishness, and convincing his mom to do the right thing. He got to be the Lightbringer again.

Dr. Linda! I would say that that I would cause some serious violence if she died, but I think Maze could be MUCH more damage than I ever could if Linda died! I loved her telling Lucifer that she didn't blame him for getting hurt, and Maze and Amenadiel saving her. Its so sweet seeing how much they've connected to humanity, especially compared to where they started. I also really love Amenadiel and Dan doing improve, and Amenadiel making everything weird "HOW CAN I KILL MY OWN FATHERE?!?!" while Dan is trying to get him to chill out. And Dan is Moms favorite human! That's weirdly sweet, coming from a terrifying ancient goddess. Poor Dan is just trying to go alone with all this weirdness. "That family is so weird."

Wait, what the hell happened? I'm actually really interested in the flashback theory, but does that mean he's just unconscious somewhere, and he's having a flashback? I'm so confused. All I know is that Lucifer with wings is something we clearly need to see more of. Like, so much.

I cant be expected to wait until September! I will miss these characters so much. This episode really nailed what a great ensemble they have, and they gave everyone some time to shine and showed off how many of them have grown and changed.

[Arthur]

See this link for word on Season 3, Mom, and "tragedy" in the desert

lucifer-season-3-producer-confirms-charlottes-return-teases-lucifer-chloes-reunion-1623861

[AlleC17]

Loved this season finale!  The writing and acting all wonderful.  A show that can go from the adorable (Dr. Trixie), to silly (I AM Dad's favorite), weird (duct tape really is good for anything) to heartfelt (the reaction to Dr. Linda), and do it so seamlessly, is a very special show.  I resisted starting to watch it because Fox has such a great track record for cancelling shows, but I am SO glad my friend persuaded me to try it.  This is the show I am looking forward to returning the most. 

I don't quite see how keeping Charlotte around would add anything, but I actually trust the writers on this show.  I wouldn't have been sad to have had this be her last appearance though, either as real Charlotte or Mum.

[DEL901]

Tom Ellis deserves an Emmy or at least an Emmy nomination.  He can say so much without saying a word... although his way with words is pretty amazing also.

Actually, I love the whole cast.  Except Mom.  She was starting to grow on me and then she did THAT to Dr. Linda.  Just NO.  And I want Dan to find out, some day, that the woman who told him, "You are one of my favourite humans" was actually god's ex.  That will blow his mind.

[CheshireCat]

1 hour ago, Arthur said:

See this link for word on Season 3, Mom, and "tragedy" in the desert

lucifer-season-3-producer-confirms-charlottes-return-teases-lucifer-chloes-reunion-1623861

I don't see a link.

But since they already filmed the first episodes of season 3 since they were part of S2 I'm not surprised Mom will be back. Otherwise they would have shot four episodes without her. I also wonder if they aired the episodes in the order they were filmed. Would they really would have wrapped up the arc and then ended the season with the stand-alone episodes? Or were the stand-alone episodes supposed to be inserted before this episode and then this episode would have been the finale one way or the other?

[Delphi]

18 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

I don't see a link.

http://www.buddytv.com/articles/lucifer/lucifer-interview-where-is-lucifer-64885.aspx

 

There you go. 

[Jacks-Son]

14 hours ago, dwmarch said:

Welcome! This is my favorite forum and the crowd here is great! Enjoy your stay!

Thanks for the welcome.  I've been posting to this site for a while, just not in the Lucifer forum.  All my previous go-to forum sites have quietly folded. (e.g. TWoP, TV.com)

If anyone is interested, YouTube has a lot of "Lucifer" behind the scenes videos posted by AfterBuzz TV (just go to YouTube and run a search for "Afterbuzz Behind the Scenes Lucifer"). AfterbuzzTV also produces many podcasts for most TV shows.

p.s. I have no affiliation with AfterBuzz TV, I just like their podcasts.  Speaking of, how are the podcasts from Previously.TV? I haven't checked them out yet.

Edited May 30, 2017 by Jacks-Son
Clarification of which podcasts I'm referring to

[johntfs]

5 hours ago, Maelstrom said:

About Linda: I was wondering also if she was suddenly off suspension after last week's goings-on - it seems like that thread got dropped.

One thing to recall is that there were originally nine episodes for the back "half" of Season 2 and that 4 of them were moved to next season.  It's possible that the episode dealing directly with Linda getting her license back was one of the moved episodes - especially if it and the other 3 had little or nothing to do with "Mom." 

It almost works better if it's not explained.  We see Maze going into the guy's office.  We know Maze gets shit done.  We see Linda back in her office.  We assume that Maze got shit done.

[White Sheep]

I think it's nice mom human body got to live after she left it.  That was a nice touch. But we know the show did it so mom could come back.   Just to be sure. Mom human body was dead before she got in the first time correct? 

Ive love to meet up with the husband again latter in the series.  

Did mom just beat up Dr Linda or did she stab her also??  

Why didn't he heal dr Linda in her office?  Cant angel heal sick people?

Love how Lucy made maze worry about mom deep frying trixie, Chole, and Linda.   

What is maze standard fee on finding someone?  

So who your guess on who hit Lucy on the head and how long will it take for season 3 to let us know that fact?   

Here an open ended question.  How much free will does maze have? 

Edited May 31, 2017 by White Sheep

[enoughcats]

Could Mom have left a bit of herself in Dr. Linda?  The stabs to the stomach were in the same place.....  (or have I borrowed something from Harry Potter that is best left unborrowed?

Now about Charlotte's return: can we take him at his word, his precise word?  Mom was never named Charlotte.  Charlotte was a woman whose body Mom occupied.  He say Charlotte returns.  He didn't say 'Mom' returns.  
 

[johntfs]

56 minutes ago, White Sheep said:

Why didn't he heal dr Linda in her office?  Cant angel heal sick people?

Not that has been shown on the show.  The closest we've gotten to that has been Maze using one of Lucifer's feather to heal Amenadiel of the wound inflict by a demon knife.

58 minutes ago, White Sheep said:

Did mom just beat up Dr Linda or did she stab her also??

The main injuries looked to be burns more than anything else, but beating and stabbing might have been part of it, too.

1 hour ago, White Sheep said:

What is maze standard fee on finding someone?  

It hasn't been stated but probably a lot.  And likely overcharged Lucifer to boot.

1 hour ago, White Sheep said:

How much free will does maze have?

As far as I can tell she has as much free will as any of the other characters on the show, which is to say, none, because she's a fictional character who says and does what she's written/directed to say and do.

Within the context of the show's universe, though, she has as much free will as anyone else.

1 hour ago, White Sheep said:

But we know the show did it so mom could come back.   Just to be sure. Mom human body was dead before she got in the first time correct? 

Actually, I don't see "Mom" coming back.  Think about the "Charlotte" situation now.

Charlotte Richards is a rich, high-powered defense attorney who was just woken up on a beach with no memory of the last several months.  She's going to want to know happened during those missing months.  Figure she's finding herself accused of covering up the murder of one of her best clients' children.  She might well be divorced with her ex-husband getting custody of her kids ("Mom" would have been happy to be rid of all of them).  She'll learn she's been having some kind of affair with Dan.  Finally, she'll learn that the person she's evidently been spending most of her time with is some pretentious club owner calling himself "Lucifer Morningstar." 

So, after waking up with no memory of the last few months and potentially having her life ruined, Charlotte Richards, who, as a criminal defense attorney knows not just people, but Bad People, is going to be Hell-bent on finding out what happened to her and punishing the responsible party.  Who at this point seems to be "Lucifer Morningstar."

[sinkwriter]

Quote

My second addition is a question to be put out to this thread: Is it possible, that this ending was a Flashback to when Lucifer first landed on Earth? I know a lot of fans wanted to see Lucifer "pre-Los Angeles"; could this be it? 

That would be pretty fascinating. I'd love to see a visit to when he first arrived.

I chime in with everyone else - if Dr. Linda had died, there would have been hell to pay, MUM. 

Looks like Tricia will be back (per a tweet):

Quote

Nope, I'll be there for season three. Mum may be gone but Charlotte Richards is breathing again : )

That really does baffle me. Charlotte was murdered. As others have said in this thread, she should be dead now that Mum has vacated her body. She was stabbed to death; that's how the Goddess was able to jump into and borrow her body. Exiting it should have left Charlotte as a corpse (and possibly one that seems inexplicably "dead for months and months" - for however long Charlotte had been in her). I understand them wanting to keep Tricia, but that's the one thing in this episode that made me shake my head and say, "That doesn't track." Are we supposed to believe God saved her?

[rainsmom]

2 hours ago, White Sheep said:

Why didn't he heal dr Linda in her office?  Cant angel heal sick people?

Excellent question. In season 1 didn't Amenadiel brought the guy in the coma back from the dead. Wouldn't saving Linda from her wounds be much, much easier? I recognize that he isn't working at full strength, but he managed to stop time for everyone. Again, wouldn't healing that one person -- even enough to get her to a hospital -- be significantly less of an effort?

[Jacks-Son]

19 hours ago, dwmarch said:

Speaking of fashion, Chloe's purple trenchcoat. She looks weird in leather jackets and plain in everything else but that purple coat rocked.

 

Speaking of Chloe's purple trenchcoat, is it just me or was there something unusual about the way Chloe kept holding her left hand over her stomach while she was wearing that coat?  I kept looking at her left hand and it didn't move from that position. At the scene where Chet's "Extra Crispy" body was found, Chloe complimented Ella and Ella hugged her for the kind words. Chloe's right hand held Ella in the surprise hug, but I never saw her left hand appear.

[Jacks-Son]

Lucifer's phone while checking out Chet's body.  Gotta love Luci's Texts to Amenadiel:

 

[johntfs]

3 hours ago, sinkwriter said:

Are we supposed to believe God saved her?

Not really, but Charlotte was inhabited for several months by the Goddess of All Creation.  Resurrection from the dead should be the least of the side effects from something like that.

3 hours ago, rainsmom said:

In season 1 didn't Amenadiel brought the guy in the coma back from the dead. Wouldn't saving Linda from her wounds be much, much easier? I recognize that he isn't working at full strength, but he managed to stop time for everyone.

Two points, Lucifer's feather aside, we've never seen any angel do any kind of direct, "lay-on-hands" healing, like, say Castiel from Supernatural (or, you know, Jesus) used to do.  Amenadiel used his angelic power and authority to reach into Hell, grabbed Malcolm's soul and stuffed it back into his body, which presumably was healed of the gunshot damage, possibly by the return of the soul.

Second, the power that Amenadiel most commonly used ( to the point that it happened almost instinctively)  was the time slow/stop.  Of all the angelic abilities, it would clearly be the first one to return.  As far as affecting the whole world, presumably it always did that and this is just the first time we've had viewpoint characters in different locations which confirmed it.  Otherwise humans would be talking about seeing the weird effects from the outside.  Presumably as well, Amenadiel can exclude those he wishes(though angels/God/Mom are always immune), which is why Maze was unaffected (and I think she was affected by it before).

[DEL901]

10 hours ago, johntfs said:

So, after waking up with no memory of the last few months and potentially having her life ruined, Charlotte Richards, who, as a criminal defense attorney knows not just people, but Bad People, is going to be Hell-bent on finding out what happened to her and punishing the responsible party.  Who at this point seems to be "Lucifer Morningstar."

She also has a duct tape bandage on her stomach, LOL!

9 hours ago, sinkwriter said:

That really does baffle me. Charlotte was murdered. As others have said in this thread, she should be dead now that Mum has vacated her body. She was stabbed to death; that's how the Goddess was able to jump into and borrow her body. Exiting it should have left Charlotte as a corpse (and possibly one that seems inexplicably "dead for months and months" - for however long Charlotte had been in her). I understand them wanting to keep Tricia, but that's the one thing in this episode that made me shake my head and say, "That doesn't track." Are we supposed to believe God saved her?

My best guess is that although mom had to inhabit a dead body, she had to make it functional, which basically healed it.

[seveneightnine]

Just add me to the chorus of all those who loved the finale. Everything that was so great about the season included is some small way. And Trixie!!

I don't have a problem with Charlotte coming back as a lawyer or confused person, but Mum better be gone. After what she did to Dr. Linda, I almost ripped my husband's arm off, sitting on the couch chanting "she better not have killed Dr. Linda" through half the show.

I'm not sure how I feel about Luci attempting to tell Chloe who he really is. On the one hand, it would be nice for someone else to know, but she just doesn't strike me as the most open-minded person. If he was going to tell someone I'd probably vote for Ella ("Oh right, your Dad is always watching...") or maybe even Dan.

And yes, definitely big thanks for the beautiful ending scene and shirtless Tom Ellis. Hallelujah!

[Zipper]

13 hours ago, Jacks-Son said:

Speaking of Chloe's purple trenchcoat, is it just me or was there something unusual about the way Chloe kept holding her left hand over her stomach while she was wearing that coat?  I kept looking at her left hand and it didn't move from that position. At the scene where Chet's "Extra Crispy" body was found, Chloe complimented Ella and Ella hugged her for the kind words. Chloe's right hand held Ella in the surprise hug, but I never saw her left hand appear.

I noticed that too, and wondered briefly whether Ms. German is pregnant.  I haven't looked to see what was up with that, but it was an odd and continuous gesture.

[Zipper]

This was, as many of you have noted, a great season finale.  So much good work from all of the actors-- the Dan and Amenadude pairing continues to delight me.  I was so freaked out about Dr. Linda, but I had a strong sense that they wouldn't let her die die.  Seeing her in agony was rough, but Maze/Amen working to get her saved was so rewarding (particularly the return of his power, at least some of it).  Every one of these characters has grown in meaningful ways (other than Chloe, who seems the constant).  The Maze/Trixie/Luci scene made me so happy!  No lolly for you, wuss.

Not sure I like the return of Charlotte Richards idea.  It took me a whole season to warm up to Mum enough to enjoy her and I don't know if TH has the range necessary to make CR a whole new character.  Even if she does, what's the point, unless it's a revenge theme.  Honestly, I would much rather we get away from focusing on human-caused problems and work a little more in the celestial.  But that's probably a non-starter, given that we spent much of this season grounded in humanity and this realm even though the premise of the main story arc revolved around the God family dynamic. 

I thought Lucifer once said he came to earth/this dimension on the beach... or am I confusing that with where he burned his wings?  Tom Ellis killed it in this episode, and I'm am so excited about next season!!

[CheshireCat]

2 minutes ago, Zipper said:

 

I thought Lucifer once said he came to earth/this dimension on the beach... or am I confusing that with where he burned his wings?  Tom Ellis killed it in this episode, and I'm am so excited about next season!!

No, you're right, he said that he and Maze landed on the beach and that it was where she cut his wings.

[Jacks-Son]

1 hour ago, Zipper said:

I noticed that too, and wondered briefly whether Ms. German is pregnant.  I haven't looked to see what was up with that, but it was an odd and continuous gesture.

That was my initial thought, but when she pulled out her gun on the boardwalk and pointed it at Chef's brother, you could clearly see her stomach beneath her surprisingly short blouse; she didn't appear pregnant. Perhaps the trench coat wasn't secure and kept opening up? I don't know, but it was odd.

[johntfs]

1 hour ago, Zipper said:

I don't know if TH has the range necessary to make CR a whole new character.

I saw Battlestar Galactica.  I don't think that's going to be an issue.

[enoughcats]

1 hour ago, Jacks-Son said:

Perhaps the trench coat wasn't secure and kept opening up?

Or somehow somewhy her hand had a big bandage on it that was both distracting and from real life?

Or it was cold outside?

[Jlina]

Quote

 

I think - off the wall here, and my impression/imagination at the time - that the brother guy made a big deal about "my family....", and even though he was explained away as having a blow torch that he is some other kind of supe.  Thus he could knock Lucifer out.  The scabs looked like he'd been there awhile, peeling and re-healing to me and we just caught him in mid peel?  It would be good to have some *other* thing to fight perhaps.

Watched the wings one minute video on YouTube and he's definitely smiling.  My first thought was that it was a reward for the Mom solution; I hope it is. As was Amenidel's time stopping. Have no interest in flashbacks - at least not now with this mystery!  The he showed up on a beach seems to be cannon so I'm guessing this is the next mystery - which he obviously gets back to Chloe pretty quickly from the previews. 

Love the show, yet glad to have the summer off :).  Love the show twice for such a nice visual to end on!

[theatremouse]

17 hours ago, Jacks-Son said:

Speaking of Chloe's purple trenchcoat, is it just me or was there something unusual about the way Chloe kept holding her left hand over her stomach while she was wearing that coat?  I kept looking at her left hand and it didn't move from that position. At the scene where Chet's "Extra Crispy" body was found, Chloe complimented Ella and Ella hugged her for the kind words. Chloe's right hand held Ella in the surprise hug, but I never saw her left hand appear.

It just made me think she had some sort of minor injury. Enough that her movement were impeded but not enough that she couldn't still do the scenes. Like maybe only certain positions for her arm were comfortable.

[enoughcats]

37 minutes ago, theatremouse said:

some sort of minor injury.

And the show wasn't ready to disguise it.  Unlike Maze's RL pregnancy.  

[njoh]

Chloe and Dan weren't phased by Luci and Charlotte laying on the beach when they were standing right next to them? Nobody questioned how they moved faster than a bullet? I was waiting for Chloe to ask how that happened, but nothing...

Anyway, great finale

[Cowgirl]

Add me to the (non-angelic) chorus of those who love the season finale! I found it interesting to learn that there were four more epis this season.  Thanks to the posters above who gave that information.

I will need to re-watch to see if we see Amenadude put the key in Dan's pocket during that long weird after-improv hug. 

I liked the fact that Lucifer got to refrain from lying (which he never does anyway) because his mother told Chloe that she was married to his father.  Chloe just assumed she was his stepmother and Lucifer didn't disabuse her of that notion.  So, he didn't tell a lie, he just omitted the truth (or didn't correct the misassumption).

Count me in with those mystified that he had a sunburn at all, let alone such a bad one.  Oh, and besides what others have mentioned about Trixie and Maze and Lucifer's interaction, I laughed when he first comes to the door and Maze tells him in a resigned voice, something like, "Just go with it. She's fierce." 

I hope we get more of Ella's backstory next year.  I like her!

16 hours ago, johntfs said:

Presumably as well, Amenadiel can exclude those he wishes(though angels/God/Mom are always immune), which is why Maze was unaffected (and I think she was affected by it before).

Actually, I re-watched the first four episodes of season one last night and Maze wasn't affected.  That surprised me because, like you, I thought she had been affected.

[johntfs]

20 minutes ago, Cowgirl said:

Actually, I re-watched the first four episodes of season one last night and Maze wasn't affected.  That surprised me because, like you, I thought she had been affected.

In that case everything fits together.  Amenadiel's power affects the whole physical universe aside from beings not from that universe (angels/demons, etc).

[heyitsme87]

Quote

Lucifer completely losing his egotistical self when confronting his mother at the end. No bluster, no bragging, no big swinging ego. Just eons of pain, which Tom Ellis wore like one of his finely tailored suits.

THIS! 

I never thought I would be so into this show as I am. Loved this finale. Great acting all around. Loved that Amenediel was able to slow down time to save Linda. 

Lucifer i was smoking hot in that last image.  

[Zipper]

4 hours ago, johntfs said:

I saw Battlestar Galactica.  I don't think that's going to be an issue.

Right-- that's why I was excited about her as Mum, but something seems to have held her back in Lucifer.  Maybe it's the direction, maybe it's something else.  For me, she never really delivered in this series like she did there, where I was in regular awe of her.  For example, she had a moment, albeit a short one, on the beach to give some indication that Charlotte is again human.  But I heard similar tone and inflection, instead of a slight variation.  I know this is totally picky, but she's surrounded by a really strong team and maybe I'm judging her too harshly in comparison.

[johntfs]

I don't know about harshly, but maybe you're judging a little too quickly.  Maybe she needs more than, what, 15 seconds and two lines of dialogue to fully evoke a different character.  I though she did confusion bordering on anger pretty well and I expect that's going to be a defining aspect of Charlotte going forward.

"Mom" may have kept Charlotte from fully dying, but she clearly cared very little about preserving Charlotte's life.  It's useful thing to compare Charlotte's situation to Linda's.  Linda asked for and got the truth from Lucifer.  She chose to stay involved with him and accept the risks of a relationships with The Devil and his associated family (which includes Maze).  Charlotte had no such choice.

I do wonder if Charlotte will feel the "lust-pull" toward Lucifer and how he'll deal with it.  Aside from being grossed out that "Mom" has the hots for him.

I also wonder if one of the themes of Season Three will involve Charlotte and just how many human lives end up as wreckage in the "Divine Family's" wake.

Edited June 1, 2017 by johntfs

[CheshireCat]

2 hours ago, johntfs said:

In that case everything fits together.  Amenadiel's power affects the whole physical universe aside from beings not from that universe (angels/demons, etc).

Now I have a question though - in one of the early episodes in S1 (the one with the paparazzi) Chloe is affected by Amenadiel's power. Why is she affected by Amenadiel's power but immune to Lucifer's? And why does she make Lucifer vulnerable and no one else (that we know of). If her immunity/effect on Lucifer has something to do with divinity, why does it seem to apply only to her and Lucifer's relationship?

[vavera4ka]

now THAT'S how you do a season finale! (I'm looking at you Murdoch Mysteries >.>)

Such a great episode!

[johntfs]

2 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

Now I have a question though - in one of the early episodes in S1 (the one with the paparazzi) Chloe is affected by Amenadiel's power. Why is she affected by Amenadiel's power but immune to Lucifer's? And why does she make Lucifer vulnerable and no one else (that we know of). If her immunity/effect on Lucifer has something to do with divinity, why does it seem to apply only to her and Lucifer's relationship?

She was affected in this episode, too.

We've never gotten a direct, proper answer to that question, though there have been a lot of theories AKA guesses.  My own guess is that God created Chloe to fall across Lucifer's path and give him a chance at love and happiness as a human.  It's not that Chloe makes Lucifer vulnerable, it's that she makes him human.

[wilnil]

2 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

Now I have a question though - in one of the early episodes in S1 (the one with the paparazzi) Chloe is affected by Amenadiel's power. Why is she affected by Amenadiel's power but immune to Lucifer's? And why does she make Lucifer vulnerable and no one else (that we know of). If her immunity/effect on Lucifer has something to do with divinity, why does it seem to apply only to her and Lucifer's relationship?

I'm going to say it's because God, having apparently decreed Chloe's birth so she could be an influence on Lucifer, decided that plan wouldn't work so well if she were susceptible to his supernatural charms and if he weren't vulnerable around (and to) her, so he tinkered with them both to remove those potential obstacles.

[CheshireCat]

1 hour ago, wilnil said:

I'm going to say it's because God, having apparently decreed Chloe's birth so she could be an influence on Lucifer, decided that plan wouldn't work so well if she were susceptible to his supernatural charms and if he weren't vulnerable around (and to) her, so he tinkered with them both to remove those potential obstacles.

 

1 hour ago, johntfs said:

She was affected in this episode, too.

We've never gotten a direct, proper answer to that question, though there have been a lot of theories AKA guesses.  My own guess is that God created Chloe to fall across Lucifer's path and give him a chance at love and happiness as a human.  It's not that Chloe makes Lucifer vulnerable, it's that she makes him human.

 

I can buy into Dad-tinkering but at the same time, wouldn't that mean that Lucifer is right? That it's all Dad's plan and that he is being manipulated (into the relationship)?

[wilnil]

13 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

I can buy into Dad-tinkering but at the same time, wouldn't that mean that Lucifer is right? That it's all Dad's plan and that he is being manipulated (into the relationship)?

My take on the "manipulation" issue is that it is Dad's plan but that, despite how Lucifer sees it, it's not manipulation as such (since both he and Chloe still have free will), more like God seeing future consequences -- basically, Lucifer and Chloe were made for each other (literally) with the idea that their interaction would eventually teach Lucifer what he still needs to understand about humanity and God's plan.

(As to what Chloe gets out of it, I dunno -- maybe an invitation to become Queen of Hell after she shuffles off this mortal coil?)

[johntfs]

3 hours ago, wilnil said:

As to what Chloe gets out of it, I dunno

She gets much the same thing that Lucifer gets - the chance to be the best version of herself.  It's a little absurd to me that this show featuring The Devil as the protagonist has IMHO one of the truest, most Christian views of God and how He works, but there it is.

[Lonesome Rhodes]

Lucifer Season 3: Groundhog Day Boogaloo.  Ugh.

Chloe can not handle a Luci with wings.  Luci is determined to tell all.  No problem figuring out which will go.

I did like the TSA wanding of Dan for the key.  I love Santa Monica Pier (the actual end of Route 66).  666?

L-AB is due in, what, July?  She may not have to miss many eps, and none at all if they go all Groundhog Day.

Charlotte as a modern-day Lazarus?  Ugh.  I think she will quickly take ill and pass back through whichever portal she originally was sent.

This ep was fun.  And insane.

No way in Hades that Lucifer would casually toss away the sword.  If for no other reason than making Dad damn sure it would not fall into the wrong hands, he would never let that sucker go before securing it in some super duper fashion.  

Tom Ellis is an amazing talent.

[johntfs]

4 hours ago, Lonesome Rhodes said:

he would never let that sucker go before securing it in some super duper fashion.

I don't know about a super-duper method, but Lucifer secured it by removing Amenadiel's "key" portion before tossing it into the portal, thus ensuring it couldn't be used to travel back to Earth.

[Eneya]

3 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I kind of wonder if Lucifer might be in heaven.  Unless his wings were bleached by the sun, I don't understand why they would be white.

There is something really sexy about Dr. Linda.  Glad to see that she is still on the show.

Lucifer had white wings and then they simply burned/fell, they were never black.