Reinstalling Tyra Banks As The Host Of America's Next Top Model Is A Big Mistake

[Primetimer]

Sarah D. Bunting isn't a crackpot. Tyra's a legend. But nobody believes that more strongly than Tyra, and the 23rd season worked better without her.

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[sourpickles]

I'm torn on this. On one hand, probably because I'm way out of the demographic, this season was something to get used to after x number of years before. On the other, Tyra coming back could reboot this into a circus that is wrong in none of the right ways. I'm just not sure. And retooling the panel, AGAIN.......I'm trying to figure out who would be in the running. I don't think we'll get the J's back. And it seems like a lot of other judges left under, shall we say, less than happy circumstances. I don't normally get this worked up about a tv show, but damn. I just think it is a control issue with Miss Tyra. I'll bet she didn't like how this season was run, so back she is, though Ken Mok is still there I think, and the fact that he hasn't been committed over all these years dealing with this is amazing. I'll be watching regardless. I'll be nursing home bound and still watching this show, I think.

[Swellcatt]

I agree with you Sara, you are not a crackpot. This season was refreshing. It felt like the show had gone back to its roots. I enjoyed it so much that I watched it the next day (which says a lot for me). I was so happy to not hear "smize" or "booty tooch" UGH. And she's not going to rebrand herself, so all that stupidity will come back. The only thing that I think would be good is that maybe they will go abroad again. I always enjoyed that. And I enjoyed the seasons when Tyra was actually involved and not off shooting her "Tyra" show. So will I tune in? Probably, but if it gets hokey again, bye bye. I will miss Drew most of all!!!

[dolphincorn]

This change reminds me of the time I was seventeen and modeling in Paris . . .

[OnceSane]

I hope they keep Drew…he seemed to be the most honest & useful in his judging.  Which means he's out and BryanBoy is probably back in.

I don't think Tyra should have returned, but I think it'll make panel more interesting.  Rita was a dud.

[cpansy]

I cosign this x infinity. Tyra could not keep her nose out of this once positive reviews indicated the franchise was revived. She will once again institute meaningless words like "smize" "tooch" and "booch" into our language, hire panelists who will not have the nerve to disagree with her, randomly select someone as a winner and then construct challenges based around that individual's strengths and lower the (slightly) elevated tone that this cycle provided. The girls who participated this time around should consider themselves lucky. Law, Drew and Ashley were excellent mentors, ditto for the fantastic Stacey. While some of the photo or video shoots were repetitive, there was nothing alone the lines of Tyra's crazy stunt photo shoots (remember having to model in that plastic bubble that rolled on water? or walking a runway while dodging swinging pendulums?). I sincerely hope the ratings go down significantly, and Ty Ty decides to stay on as a producer PERMANENTLY. I would take Rita as a host over Tyra any day. She had opinions, was not afraid to contradict the panelists - and they weren't afraid to contradict her. So what if no one really knew what being a "boss" was!

[cpansy]

I'm torn on this. On one hand, probably because I'm way out of the demographic, this season was something to get used to after x number of years before. On the other, Tyra coming back could reboot this into a circus that is wrong in none of the right ways. I'm just not sure. And retooling the panel, AGAIN.......I'm trying to figure out who would be in the running. I don't think we'll get the J's back. And it seems like a lot of other judges left under, shall we say, less than happy circumstances. I don't normally get this worked up about a tv show, but damn. I just think it is a control issue with Miss Tyra. I'll bet she didn't like how this season was run, so back she is, though Ken Mok is still there I think, and the fact that he hasn't been committed over all these years dealing with this is amazing. I'll be watching regardless. I'll be nursing home bound and still watching this show, I think.

Agree on the control issue completely. And, perhaps something else she was working on fell through...or she found it was less interesting staying home and taking care of an infant than she previously assumed.

[annewithaneee]

I basically hated this season of ANTM, but bringing back Tyra is not the fix. I think in general the modeling industry has kinda killed the spirit of the show for me -- it's not like it's ever turned out the next big thing, but the show debuted in sort of a transitional period where the era of the supermodel was definitely over, but models were still being "discovered". Print media was still thriving, the go-see challenges felt more authentic to how most future It Girls would be doing their hustle. Now, we're in the era of Jenners and Hadids and Insta-famous bullshit.

So, in a way, the idiotic mantra of "business, brand, boss" is authentic for the current landscape, because the modeling hustle has changed, but that doesn't mean it makes for compelling or good reality tv, at least not for me. I mean, basically all of the teaches and challenges were prepping these girls for a #sponcon life after the show. There's nothing special about that! They'd probably be better off auditioning for The Bachelor, because the end result is the same, but they'd get to avoid having a tragic My Little Pony weave.

Personally I'm done with the show and I'd rather see it ride off into the sunset. Bringing back Tyra will only make it more of a cringe-y spectacle. But if ANTM has to hypothetically go on, the better fix would be to fire Rita (because she's terrible, and people need to stop trying to make her happen) and promote Ashley, who fits their current ethos but has more charisma, spark, and is an actual model. Or, even better, bring in someone who is an even more seasoned veteran than Tyra (not that her ego could take it), and could bring in a wealth of experience and some much-needed sophistication. Beverly Johnson or Iman probably have some time, just saying.

[proserpina65]

Like sourpickles, I'm torn on this.

On one hand, Rita Ora was useless, I missed having an overseas location (with a go-see), and the emphasis on social media, however true to the current modeling world it may be, bored me to tears.  Plus, I do miss Tyra as a photographer.

On the other hand, the bat-shit crazy had gotten out of hand, and Kelly Cutrone and Bryanboy nearly killed me.  I would really hate to lose Drew as a judge.  (And sometimes Law and Ashley as well, although they were more hit-or-miss.)  And with Tyra back, I get the feeling that the house DRAH-MAH will be turned up to 111.

But I'm probably still in for next cycle.  I do hope they keep Drew as a judge, and that they use Stacy more, 'cause I miss the days when Ms. J would actually work with the hamsters on their walks, and I think Stacy could fill that role.

[MaggieG]

11 minutes ago, proserpina65 said:

Like sourpickles, I'm torn on this.

On one hand, Rita Ora was useless, I missed having an overseas location (with a go-see), and the emphasis on social media, however true to the current modeling world it may be, bored me to tears.  Plus, I do miss Tyra as a photographer.

On the other hand, the bat-shit crazy had gotten out of hand, and Kelly Cutrone and Bryanboy nearly killed me.  I would really hate to lose Drew as a judge.  (And sometimes Law and Ashley as well, although they were more hit-or-miss.)  And with Tyra back, I get the feeling that the house DRAH-MAH will be turned up to 111.

But I'm probably still in for next cycle.  I do hope they keep Drew as a judge, and that they use Stacy more, 'cause I miss the days when Ms. J would actually work with the hamsters on their walks, and I think Stacy could fill that role.

Agree with at of this, especially the bolded. I really liked Drew and Stacy and I hope they stay on.

[Sarah D. Bunting]

I wouldn't mind Johnny Wujek coming back, but yeah, I can't with Cutrone anymore.

[SuburbanHangSuite]

Make room for me on the "Mixed Feelings" train.  The really sadistic part of me is positively giddy with thoughts of swinging pendulums, unstable floating runways and speeding treadmill catwalks dancing through my head!   But I don't want to lose Law or Drew.  I really enjoyed them both and hope they survive the revamp.  Ashley can go...I won't miss her at all.

[leocadia]

Great article that sums up my feelings perfectly!! I will (likely) watch, but with a heavy heart.

[Canada]

If Tyra coming back means that we get more actual modelling, instead of dancing & acting, then I'm all for that.

[sourpickles]

3 hours ago, dolphincorn said:

This change reminds me of the time I was seventeen and modeling in Paris . . .

I thought it was Milan! ;)

 

1 hour ago, Sarah D. Bunting said:

I wouldn't mind Johnny Wujek coming back, but yeah, I can't with Cutrone anymore.

Janice said things that made sense filed under "constructive criticism while doped out of ones mind".  KC was a just a bitch.  Nothing she said made sense (OK, 99% of the time, every now and then she got in a good one) and I always marveled at her sitting there decked out all 1994 squawking at some up and comer.  Couldn't stand Bryan Boy.  That whole social media score thing was utterly purposeless.  And unless Tyra has sobered up and taken a hard look at the insanity that is her legacy, we, as fans, are totally screwed.  Just saying.

[sourpickles]

2 hours ago, cpansy said:

or walking a runway while dodging swinging pendulums?).

Alexandra didn't!  Or, the one they did waaaaaaaaaay  up on a platform?  Or the freezing cold?

[milkyaqua]

What killed the show this cycle was changing it from Mon to Wed.  The ratings dove after that only to eventually start creeping up again once people figured out when it was on.

I agree that Tyra is an egomaniac and Rita is a personality vacuum.  But most blogs seem happy to have Tyra back.  Not everyone mind you but a big chunk.  I don't think she came back because her ego couldn't take it but because of the ratings and the feedback.  She's wanted out of this show since C8.  She has a child and she's just been signed to host America's Got Talent (which a lot of people are not happy about).  While she chose the semi-finalists for this past cycle and showed up at the finale she pretty much had left the running of this show to Ken Mok. 

Most people want actual photo shoots and not music challenges.  They also aren't crazy about the current panel (and indeed the thing I'm most interested in is who will be on C24's panel).  There are some who feel that Tyra will not put up with another pretty model so Ashley may be out.  I can think of other reasons to not have Ashley on panel (like most of this panel, they never actually offered any real advice or if they did, it was done off camera).  Law was good maybe for comedy and the exit interviews but again, no real input.  That left Drew.  As the creative director he didn't add much either he was just more loud about it (but again Mr. Jay didn't really either, he was just more calm about it).

Frankly, it's always bothered me on the mothership that they use a "creative director" any way.  I no pretty much nothing about modeling but most clips I've seen of actual models or entertainers being photographed usually involved the photographer giving them direction and not some creative director.  Tyra has never seemed to do this on her show.  It would be one thing for the creative director to maybe take a model aside who might not be getting the brief and give her actual, you know, useful advice and then let the session resume but that's not how this show has ever rolled.  Then if the model still screws up, okay, eliminate them.

As for possible panel replacements.  I can't see Mr. Jay coming back.  He has a cosmetic line.  Miss Jay and Nigel also seem to have moved on.  Even Stacey has other interests and while I get that some didn't care for her, I like her.  I liked her on CNTM as well.  The thing is that in real modeling life, no one is going to coddle these girls and hold their hands.  People always called Janice Dickinson mean but she was being mild compared to what some of the former contestants have said they've experienced when they eventually went out and tried to get signed.  And no to KC and BryanBoy.

As for the social media aspect of it.  Either bring someone from a modeling agency who deals with this stuff or possibly a publicist, they need to find better methods to try and add that if TPTB are going to insist on it being a part of the show going forward because this cycle was a bust in that regard.  Especially since the  girls who had the most followers were the ones who got kicked off like Justine and Courtney and even Krislian.

But the other thing people need to take into consideration is the budget for this show.  People complained about no overseas trips but that could be budget related.  This coming cycle is supposed to be in L.A. so maybe they could at least take the final six or seven to NYC for go-sees but it's all contingent upon just who else winds up on panel along with Tyra and what the prize package is going to be.

Edited March 17, 2017 by milkyaqua

[C. Toastncrunch]

Could not agree more. Tyra may have created the show, but the show has moved beyond her. I can take or leave Rita, but Ashley, Law, and Drew brought new energy to the show and, as you say, are more relevant. And Stacey is divine--I would LOVE it if Stacey could host, instead! Ugh, Tyra, just leave it alone.

[Indy]

She really just can't leave well enough alone, can she?

I wasn't into Rita as a host, but she was pretty innocuous. And I very much liked the new judging panel. Oh well, this cycle was the first time I'd watched ANTM in years so it's not that big of a deal to me to remove it from my show line-up again. I just can't do Tyra anymore (though I suppose if Tyra as to be back on my TV, I'd rather her be on ANTM than AGT...I'm very much not okay with that casting decision...)

[sourpickles]

Yeah, Stacey!  Love, love, love.  But I get she has other irons in the fire.  I've not seen CNTM, but I have seen other countries shows, and been pretty impressed, though it has been a while.  I'm just cautious about how this new and improved Tyra vehicle is going to work out.

[milkyaqua]

I'm not actually sure it'll be "improved."  The general consensus was that people missed Tyra and didn't necessarily care for the panel.  But again, what really hurt the show was starting it on Monday and then moving it to Wednesday.  That threw people off.  Yes, people had problems with Rita, most importantly, who the heck was she.  Some of us knew but most didn't.  Then the panel didn't help.  People also hated the eliminations (Justine, Marissa and Courtney to be exact).

So, even if Tyra comes back, who winds up on panel with her?  Will they actually offer advice/guidance (again, something this panel was criticized for not doing).  Will they have more photo shoots (people didn't love the video/motion stuff).  Will they have actual challenges where the winner gets a prize that's more than a massage or visit to a reality park (see MMAS for actual working prizes).  Will the final six have go-sees or even go over seas or in this case from L.A. to at least NYC?  Can they work social media into the show where it actually makes sense???

[Ms Blue Jay]

Dammit, I'm sad guys.  I'm vehemently anti-Tyra.

I just wanted to say this is a good show board.  I've had fun with you guys this season. I haven't watched ANTM in like, a decade.  Seriously.  I went to look up the last season of ANTM I watched before this past season.  It was Cycle 5, I think.  I couldn't take Tyra's abuse anymore.

I just wanted to say I really had fun this year.  I don't mind Rita Ora at all.  I DO mind Tyra.  I don't think I can come back next year.  It's too bad.  Thanks guys.

Stacey hosting is an amazing idea by the way.  Love her.  So proud of her.

Edited March 17, 2017 by Ms Blue Jay

[NeenerNeener]

Damn. That means Tyra's back to using this show as her video "Christmas Newsletter" to tell the world how fabulous her life is.

The biggest problem I saw was with VH1 giving it short shrift: moving it around the schedule, airing new episodes late-ish in the evening and not airing reruns at consistent times. Bringing Tyra back isn't going to fix any of those things.

[Straycat80]

I have to agree with Ms. Blue Jay. I am also anti-Tyra. Her and her ego were the reason I stopped watching ANTM a long time ago. I watched this past season only because Tyra was gone. This season wasn't that great, it was OK, Rita and the other people were new and maybe given a chance would have gotten better.

I won't be watching anymore but I'll check in to see how you guys like it with Tyra back. 

[sourpickles]

Aww, I'm so sad that there are some fellow commenters leaving!  Maybe it'll be better than we think and when you check back in you'll be pleasantly surprised. 

[itainttippithebird]

300000% agreed with Sarah on this - this bums me out so much. And I didn't dislike the old show, as OOT as Tyra was! It was its own, weird, absurd thing. But then the new hosts and style gave the show a breath of fresh that it really revived it. And this feels like a devolution. BOOOO.

Edited March 18, 2017 by itainttippithebird

[saraslizabeth]

I wish Ashley Graham was the host! She's actually a model and not insane like Tyra.

[GreyBunny]

10 hours ago, Canada said:

If Tyra coming back means that we get more actual modelling, instead of dancing & acting, then I'm all for that.

If the best alternative they can come up with is Rita Ora, then I'd rather have Tyra. At least Tyra was a real model and can give good advice when she has a mind to.  Drew was the only one who was worth a damn from this season.   

[Reneeisxena]

When I heard that a new host was replacing Tyra in cycle 23 I was not sure if I would watch, I love Tyra. But I gave it a chance and I found I liked the new show. There were problems but that could be worked out. I do wish there had been more “modeling” and less acting/music video stuff but it i VH–1 so that wasn't surprising. I missed the stress of go–sees and the thrill of them travelling to a foreign location. I will watch cycle 24 and hope that the spark is back. 

[Crazydoxielady]

It did not work better. Rita was an embarrassment. Telling a contestant she wanted to fu** her? Not agreeing with panel & making a big stink about who was being called next? 

This season was cheap, no trips no go sees. There was too much video and not enough photos. Ashley is great but she cared too much about hurting feelings so gave almost everyone a great criticism, which doesn't help them grow. Drew can stay and I think Law and Stacey M. Should come back to style and consult. 

Welcome back Tyra. Now some advice: Please stop making the show about your crazy weird projects and focus on the modeling. We do not care about social media scores or Brian Boy. Kelly was mean and hard to look at, so please let her stay home with her cauldron.  Either of the Jays returning would be an amazing bonus and welcome by all. I hope you enjoyed your maternity leave. It was no fun with out you. 

[LegallyRed2]

The thing that pisses me off the most is the move back to L.A. I think the series tanked the minute they first moved from NY to LA and then officially jumped the shark when they started including male models (which is apples to oranges competing in the same competition.) New York seasons have always been edgier - possibly to constricted brownstone living rather than luxurious LA mansions...Just my opinion. Booooo. Loved this season. Sad they booted Rita.

[schroob]

I think the biggest issue facing ANTM is that the industry has changed a lot in recent years, making it tough to keep this show relevant. Print magazines are nearly dead. The line between model and celebrity is so blurry that girls with tons of Instagram followers but no ability to walk stomp the catwalks and mug on the arms of designers. Tatiana's business both got her on the show but possibly kept her from winning because of the conflict of interest. Social Media is crucial for success but it's so ephemeral it seems near impossible to maintain any longevity through it. Plus, social media is about video, not photos... it's a different talent.

I didn't warm to this cycle's judges because of the lousy tagline (brand, business, boss...really???), the lack of training for the women, and how fake Rita and Ashley come off (it was obvious this was as much about their own exposure as the theoretical mentoring they were supposed to give). But is Tyra, who comes from the old school of modeling and who definitely went on an extended ego trip for the latter seasons, going to fix things? I love Tyra and I prefer her type of drama to the fake a$$ drama of the contestants. But if the show is going to survive, it would be from moving forward and not backward. 

[roguetamlin]

My first thought when I heard the news was it's a mistake. The NTMs in other countries are much better largely because there isn't a Tyra there gumming up the works. Sigh, I give it a year before it's re cancelled.

[dolphincorn]

Maybe it'll work if Tyra starts doing this instead of this. See the difference?

[EmZeeGee]

On 3/17/2017 at 1:17 PM, annewithaneee said:

I basically hated this season of ANTM, but bringing back Tyra is not the fix. I think in general the modeling industry has kinda killed the spirit of the show for me -- it's not like it's ever turned out the next big thing, but the show debuted in sort of a transitional period where the era of the supermodel was definitely over, but models were still being "discovered". Print media was still thriving, the go-see challenges felt more authentic to how most future It Girls would be doing their hustle. Now, we're in the era of Jenners and Hadids and Insta-famous bullshit.

I mostly share these sentiments. I found the season incredibly boring and mostly awful. The lack of go-sees after the first or second episode, the lack of overseas travel, the weak concepts and even weaker styling on photoshoots, the numerous video challenges, the lack of range in types of shoots, these were all problems that bringing Tyra back won't necessarily fix. I use necessarily, because I'm hoping that since they had enough money to make Tyra happy, they increased the budget as well.  Even so, Tyra, for all her faults, made a lower budget work in Cycles 1 & 2 to much better effect than the mess that was this season. 

At its core, the industry is made up of more models who aren't "super" than are, and that's always been the case. I believe the show, if they took it as seriously as the Korean and Australian franchises do, can still achieve the ends of finding a well booked working model. In fact, I think this franchise is well positioned for living in an age of the insta-famous. They just need to find a girl who is unquestionably a model and push her after the season wraps.

I think a casting director or an agent from wherever the winner would sign with needs to be on the panel, that would help more than having Tyra back. But if they aren't serious about the modeling portion, then I at least welcome Tyra's entertaining antics. 

[cpansy]

Maybe it'll work if Tyra starts doing this instead of this. See the difference?

You win everything for this.

[cpansy]

I wouldn't mind Johnny Wujek coming back, but yeah, I can't with Cutrone anymore.

Please no Johnny W - someone on So Cosmo just mentioned to him that it's interesting to see a creative director who dresses like a personal trainer and I had to laugh. That's exactly how he dresses - like a personal trainer from the '90s.

[sourpickles]

2 hours ago, cpansy said:

Please no Johnny W - someone on So Cosmo just mentioned to him that it's interesting to see a creative director who dresses like a personal trainer and I had to laugh. That's exactly how he dresses - like a personal trainer from the '90s.

Don't forget the hats!  I hated those hats, and the sayings on them.

[milkyaqua]

I'm going to hope for the best but expect the worse because, you know, Tyra...

No Wujek, Cutrone or BryanBoy.  I want a decent panel but in no way should any of those three come back.  I'll even take Law who served no real purpose (other than he did good elim interviews) and Ashley (though she has to stop calling herself a supermodel and offer some actual, useful criticism).

Schroob's post hit the nail on the head.  The industry has changed and social media is a part of it for bad or worse and can Tyra really find a way to incorporate that into ANTM better than that boss, brand nonsense?

OTOH I've seen comments from people who want Tyra back and don't care about the modeling portion of it so much as they want to hear her spout her made-up words like tooch, pot ledom, and smize.  They like her antics and the rest is beside the point.  I'd prefer if she kept her crazy in check and actually tried to find girls who could actually model and conduct the show like a modeling show but we'll see.  There's been no casting as of yet and I'm really wondering about the budget because this past cycle looked like it was filmed on the cheap.

[Mabinogia]

2 hours ago, milkyaqua said:

There's been no casting as of yet and I'm really wondering about the budget because this past cycle looked like it was filmed on the cheap.

It will be interesting to see if the budget goes up with Tyra back. She will probably insist on it so that the ratings will go up and she can boast about how much we missed her when really it has nothing to do with her and everything to do with the move, the new network, and the near lack of any actual modelling in the "modelling" competition this season.

[sourpickles]

2 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

It will be interesting to see if the budget goes up with Tyra back.

I don't know if it is budget so much as serious legit sponsors.  I mean, the show went from having Sephora to Walmart.  Not knocking WM, shop there every week, but in terms of upscale, it really isn't.  Then the show reinvented itself a bit with the high fashion cycles (RIP Franca Sozzani) then fell straight back into a bunch of screaming bad (boys and) girls and that was about it.  This is going to be a very interesting process IF it sticks.  I'm not at all convinced.  If Tyra is running the show well.............

[cpcathy]

OMG, I forgot about pot ledom!

The more I think about this, the more it irks me that she'll be back. I think it's Tyra's ego that the show literally went on without her. We can't just have a low-key modeling competition, we now have to have all the nonsense back that Tyra brings. I like Rita Ora, she opened for one of my all time favorite bands, so she's cool in my book. I don't think she needed to be replaced.

[RealReality]

I dont know.  Seasons 1-14 of antm are on prime, so I've been watching older seasons that I never watched.  And those were wonderful.  There were real model tips, and they didn't always come from tyra.  Nigel giving tips on where girls should place their light..etc,etc.  

I don't know that this show will ever make a supermodel but it can be entertaining, informative and at least help a model get exposure and a decent career.

To me, this year was so far below what this show can be that it's too bad.  I really like law and drew and Ashley.  

But this show no longer feels like it's about modelling.  Tyra was primarily a model who tried to do other things...so she understood modelling in a way that Rita doesn't.  Ashley is a model, but much more of a niche model.  She is known and successful, but tyra was both mainstream and high fashion and runway.  Law is a stylist, can he teach these girls how to walk?  Pose? Spin?  All the things they might need to be a working model?  And while I like drew, if you have tyra, and miss j back you have to have mr j there is no other way.

[SuburbanHangSuite]

I think the lack of real "modeling" focus is just a sad by-product of where we are today.  Tyson was on WWHL last week and Andy asked him if he respects this new breed of model that's being discovered and made in the age of Instagram.  He said, "Not at all." He explained that models used to beat the pavement with their portfolios and really put in work for their paychecks - - now any fool with an iPhone and a big following can get paid.  He also mentioned how today's designers will sometimes book a look alike if they can't afford the real deal so he felt that degraded the quality of high fashion modeling too.  Interesting to hear his view since he truly could be considered to be a Supermodel.  

[azshadowwalker]

12 hours ago, absolutqt said:

 Tyson was on WWHL last week and Andy asked him if he respects this new breed of model that's being discovered and made in the age of Instagram.  He said, "Not at all." 

Respect? Models? Lol. Drug dealers work the streets pretty hard, too, and they don't have to stand around in their underwear looking vapid while doing it. 

[Sugar]

I'm curious to see what the demographic breakdown is for this show. Is it mostly older folks who have watched the show from the beginning? Or do teens really tune in? I understand that they're trying to keep up with industry practices and trends to capture a new generation of viewers, but I feel like it's the equivalent of a dad trying to relate to his teen kids by imitating their slang- desperate and pathetic. I watch AUSNTM, and it's a completely different show - a MUCH better show. So would ANTM really suffer and lose viewers if they lost the cray-cray and went back to being all about modeling, like their international counterparts? Or is it just American culture - that everything needs to be over the top and dramatic?

There are so many reality shows where people say they don't want drama, just a focus on the skills being showcased (i.e. modeling, singing, tattoing, fashion design, etc.), but I wonder whether this is just a small part of the population. Maybe most viewers enjoy Tyra's antics, and they'd rather have hamsters who have big personalities even though they aren't really models...?

Would love to see stats for the ANTM audience!

[sourpickles]

@Sugar You make an excellent point.  From what I've observed here (not from TWOP) it seems many of us are long term fans, though age is up in the air.  I watched from minute one, though sporadically till season six, then I was in full time until season 20, I watched that, and 21, 22 in reruns because it was on so early and the content was, ah, questionable with a child running around.  I'm (I can't believe I'm going to admit this) 40.  My daughter still watches as well, and she is now 24.   I think that may be a little high for what they are going for, but I'm not sure.  Observing here, I can say they aren't pulling in too many new viewers, seems like the bulk of us are long suffering fans.  But it would be interesting to see.  I love to see the other countries versions of TM, maybe I need to check YouTube because VH1 hasn't run any in a long time, though I know I saw Britain and Australia at some point.  I read an interview with Tyra a day or two ago and I'm not sure where the show will be going direction wise, but there was a lot "mememe" that I felt.

[Sugar]

@sourpickles
I'm right there with you - started from Season 1, and have never missed an episode - and I'm a far cry from being a teenager :P
From my time at TWOP and here at PT, it seems as though the majority of viewers are "long-suffering fans", but it's so easy to get locked into that bubble feeling when you're part of an online community. It's true that WE may have disdain for some of the ridiculous components - social media, Tyraisms, music videos, etc. but it may go over well with the younger demographic and casual viewers. If they hadn't seen Seasons 1-8 (I picked a cut-off at random), they may not know that the show used to be "better".

But if you get a chance, definitely check out AUSNTM (especially seasons 3-7). I believe they're on season 10 now, and still cranking out international working models - and the photoshoots are gorgeous and expensive.

And to get back on topic: I think the problem is that Tyra has done such a great job of integrating herself into the ANTM brand, that it doesn't work without her.  I felt that even though I liked Drew, tolerated Law, and didn't miss Tyrant, I was conscious of her absence, and it felt empty. If she's going to be behind the scenes doing her thing and calling the shots anyway, then I'd rather have her on screen, where I can at least snark on her ridiculousness.

What I'd really love, is a spin-off. Maybe a modeling 'boot camp' or school type scenario, where they take younger girls and really develop them. Hire a Coco Rocha or Chanel Iman to host/mentor (no Kardashians/Jenners please) and assemble a credible panel of credible industry experts - photographer, agent, fashion editor, rotating designer/stylist, etc. Keep ANTM as Tyra's vanity project, and let her keep casting old, busted, and bowlegged fame whores who just want 15 minutes on the D-list. Then, go back to basics with a new show that may actually produce models that the industry cares about.
 

[sleepyjean]

Tyra's problem is she wants so badly to be a mogul, but she can't seem to make that happen. She was an amazing model. ANTM was a genius concept. In truth, she's kind of bored with both, but she can't seem to get anything else going, so here she is, back again. Singer, actor, writer, cosmetics brand, Hah-vad professor...nobody cares about her doing any of those things. And I guess being a full-time mom isn't what she wants to do.

I try to pretend like Tyra's ego isn't ginormous, because she used to be so relatable and I liked her so much. But I can't help but wonder if - as others have speculated - the only reason she's back is because she can't stand for the kudos for HER show to be showered on someone else. To be honest, if I were Tyra, watching Ashley repeatedly refer to herself as a supermodel would grate on my last nerve.

On the other hand, maybe she's back to try to rescue the show. I didn't like this last season. I wasn't planning to watch the next. The photo shoots sucked. Most of the models were mediocre and showed little to no growth. (Largely because - Stacey McKenzie aside - the mentoring was minimal.) Rita didn't add much. Drew was good on panel, but kind of a pain in the ass on shoots. If Tyra is back to fix this, maybe I'll give her a shot.

However, if she's back and still on her SJW kick, I'm out. Political correctness be damned. I'm not here for the struggle for equality in the modeling industry. It's a shallow shallow field, and I'm ok with that. I don't really care about blind models, deaf models, short models, plus models, trans models, vitiligo models, homely models, homeless models, or anything else of the kind. If she shows up with a token model who has special needs, or who is little person, or a paraplegic, or a conjoined twin, and starts going on about how inspiring they are, I'm out. Bring me 12 young, pretty women with large eyes, symmetrical features, slim physiques, and the requisite height, who actually some skill in this area, are willing to work, and have a chance in hell of getting booked for real jobs and a real career, after the show, and that will make me happy. I can overlook a lot of tootching and smizing for really amazing photos.

I will be very interested to find out the rest of the cast. I hope Ashley is out. I'd like Drew to stay. I don't really care if Law is in or out. The only thing I really disliked about him were his braids. I want her to keep Stacy, even though I find Stacy's voice a little disturbing. I definitely hope they find different photographers.

Edited April 2, 2017 by sleepyjean

[sourpickles]

14 hours ago, sleepyjean said:

However, if she's back and still on her SJW kick, I'm out. Political correctness be damned.

I don't know if you or anyone else has seen, but there was an article yesterday about how they have removed the age restriction for the show now, used to be 27 and under.  So there's your token winner, coming soon!  I'll see if I can find the link.  That's all we need, some forty year old woman dressing and acting like she's 18. 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-4371942/I-don-t-care-old-Tyra-ends-ANTM-age-limit.html

Here's one, in traditional DM style it is short and pasted together, but you get the gist.....

Edited April 2, 2017 by sourpickles
Found link