S01.E02: Chapter Two: A Touch of Evil

[rho]

2 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

If they absolutely must do a triangle, and considering it's the CW they must, then I'd rather it'd go this way, too. 

I wasn't even thinking about Polly's age in relation to Jason. I just assumed she was older than Betty, but didn't even think about how that would mean she was older than Jason. Now I'm even more intrigued by that situation tbh. ETA: This made me wonder if Polly was a character in the comics. Was she?

Would anyone be interested in a spoiler free spec thread? I'm not reading spoilers but I'd like to discuss what might be happening with the mystery so I was going to make one, but then it occurred to me that there might not be any others interested in such a thing.

All through the first episode I assumed Polly was older but then I did the math. A freshman guy dating an older high school girl just doesn't vibe with the CW. So I looked it up, Wikipedia says Polly is Betty's older sister. She also has an older brother named Chic, who I'm pretty sure didn't make it into the show.

Mrs. Cooper uses Polly like a cautionary tale and doesn't really treat Betty like the oldest child. I'm wondering what the age difference is, and if maybe the twins are older? Would Cheryl really be the queen bee on the cheer squad as a sophomore? Same for Jason being on varsity as a freshman last year?

I don't know, maybe I'm trying to make too much sense out of this garbage. But I would be down for a spoiler-free speculation thread! 

[Oscirus]

1 hour ago, Danny Franks said:

Plot twist: Polly is actually Betty's alternate personality, currently locked away by the drugs that Betty thinks are adderall. Everyone just talks about her like she's a different person because they're scared of Betty going crazy again.

Why would the whole town keep that a secret? Why would Cheryl who'd surely know about this screw with Betty? If anything, Cheryl would likely keep her distance if that was a thing.

[DavidJSnyder]

1 hour ago, rho said:

Mrs. Cooper uses Polly like a cautionary tale and doesn't really treat Betty like the oldest child. I'm wondering what the age difference is, and if maybe the twins are older? Would Cheryl really be the queen bee on the cheer squad as a sophomore? Same for Jason being on varsity as a freshman last year?

I also assumed the twins were older once I thought about it.  Cheryl was supposed to already be running the cheerleading squad when Betty tried out last year.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

Hashtag Riverdale Strong

With a murder investigation now in full swing, Archie is tied in sexy knots over whether to tell the cops what he knows about the 4th of July and ruin his dumb teacher romance forever.

[taragel]

I'm disappointed in this and not seeing anywhere near the potential all the critics did. It feels very Dawson's Creek redux yet with characters that aren't half as likable. Plus, maybe I'm shallow, but I can't see any universe where that unfortunate-looking creepy af Jason Blossom is the most popular guy in school--QB or no QB. **shakes head**

It's really past time for us to meet Polly. Obviously she's going to have a larger role in this whole story.

[zumpie]

  On 2/5/2017 at 10:26 AM, Oscirus said:

Two episodes in still team Ronnie-Archie. Can't get on board with Betty-Archie until they develop that relationship better on the show

The problem I have with Archie/Veronica so far is that neither of them seem into each other, apart from the initial meeting. Even the kiss felt weird and forced. And then in the second episode, Veronica is all about Betty, and Archie is split between Betty, Jughead and his teacher.

The only thing telling me that Veronica is part of a love triangle is the comic book history. Nothing on the show.

Veronica (who remains utter and complete Best Girl---best clothes, best personality, most interesting and adorable) seems more into Betty and Jughead and Archie seemed like they REALLY wanted to kiss....they had vastly more chemistry than Archie's supposed pining for Ms. Grundy.

BTW, why is Hermoine waiting tables at a diner when she has an overnighter full o'cash? Or is it to explain how they're eating, should the feds come sniffing around?

Lastly: Cheryl dresses like a prostitute (she needs "rich girl" tips from Veronica) and would NEVER have been arrested in class. She would've been called into the office or arrested at home. And her parents would've been advised, she's a minor.

And the faux glee routine? Marching band was great, Josie/Cheryl rapping was awful, cover itself "meh" and the River Vixen routine the lowest energy thing I've ever witnessed. Did the ladies miss nap time?

[Danny Franks]

5 hours ago, Oscirus said:

Why would the whole town keep that a secret? Why would Cheryl who'd surely know about this screw with Betty? If anything, Cheryl would likely keep her distance if that was a thing.

I thought it was clear I was facetiously mocking the melodrama and lack of logic in this show. 

[zumpie]

I just thought of another murder suspect/character done wrong: Roid Ragin' Reggie.....which, I think the actor fits the bill nicely---but Reggie was a snobby, self-satisfied prankster.....not this guy who clearly needs to dial back his dosage. Does make him really buyable as a killer...though more likely to have ripped Jason limb from limb than just wussing out with a pansy GUN

[jay741982]

8 hours ago, Danny Franks said:

Plot twist: Polly is actually Betty's alternate personality, currently locked away by the drugs that Betty thinks are adderall. Everyone just talks about her like she's a different person because they're scared of Betty going crazy again.

You might be on to something cause Bettys mom won't let Betty see Polly. But Betty talks like Polly is real and Polly is in the Comics 

[Oscirus]

18 hours ago, Danny Franks said:

I thought it was clear I was facetiously mocking the melodrama and lack of logic in this show. 

Not really. There are still people who legit think that Jughead is a figment of Archie's imagination.

[ByTor]

On 2/4/2017 at 4:15 PM, Bill1978 said:

Speaking of Jason, I feel the actor who was cast is incapable of delivering lines well. I still find it awkward that he didn't speak in that little flashback. And both times he has appeared in moving there was no talking.

How can you tell if he is incapable of delivering lines well since he really hasn't had lines?  Have you seen him in something else?

On 2/5/2017 at 0:31 PM, iMonrey said:

If it's cool enough in the daytime to be wearing a heavy letter jacket, it's probably too cold at night to run around in nothing but shorts. Just sayin'. 

I get insanely overheated when I run, that rang true to me since it's something I'd do.

[Bill1978]

1 hour ago, ByTor said:

How can you tell if he is incapable of delivering lines well since he really hasn't had lines?  Have you seen him in something else?

No I haven't. I was joking in my ponderings. My thoughts were something like this. They cast the actor as Jason based upon the fact that he looks like what they wanted Jason to look like. They then go film the flashback scene and discover that he is truly terrible at delivery lines, but they really like his appearance. So they decide that whenever Jason appears he will just be silent. And then it becomes a behind the scene running gag. Don't let Jason speak when he appears.

[jay741982]

4 hours ago, Oscirus said:

Not really. There are still people who legit think that Jughead is a figment of Archie's imagination.

LOL that's a weird theory 

[Maximum Taco]

7 hours ago, jay741982 said:

LOL that's a weird theory 

Also one that makes no sense.

Jughead has clear interactions with people other then Archie. Archie's dad asks him if he's staying for dinner, Reggie accuses him of murder, Betty asks if BOTH of them want to join her and Veronica, Veronica comments on his unique name. Is Archie imagining his dad and friends interacting with his imaginary friend?

And if that's the case how can we assume anyone is real? Maybe EVERYONE is a figment of Archie Westphall's special mind.

Edited February 8, 2017 by Maximum Taco

[MarkHB]

On 2/6/2017 at 10:08 AM, peachmangosteen said:

Would anyone be interested in a spoiler free spec thread? I'm not reading spoilers but I'd like to discuss what might be happening with the mystery so I was going to make one, but then it occurred to me that there might not be any others interested in such a thing.

Ask and you shall receive :)

[MV007]

I know I'm probably being manipulated in some way but I just want Betty to get everything she ever wanted.

My only issue with Jughead is that he talks like he's on Dawson's Creek and everyone else talks normally.  It worked on DC because everyone talked the same.  Here, though, where it is just one person, it sticks out like a sore thumb.

[Danny Franks]

2 hours ago, MV007 said:

I know I'm probably being manipulated in some way but I just want Betty to get everything she ever wanted.

Me too. The main reason I favour Betty/Archie is because it's what Betty wants. I don't give a crap about what Archie wants.

If it doesn't work out, then whatever.  But she should at least get the chance to find out what dating the guy she's loved for years is like. 

[CletusMusashi]

On 2/3/2017 at 2:12 PM, Jenniferbug said:

Maybe I missed something but- Jason and Cheryl went out the morning of the 4th of July, right? That's the morning Archie and Grundy heard the gunshot, and Jason supposedly drowned. But didn't they say at the end of the episode that Jason didn't die (via gunshot) till a week after the 4th? So Archie hearing the gunshot wouldn't matter as much, if Jason wasn't shot till a week later. I mean, it's still relevant in case Jason was abducted at gunpoint or something, but it doesn't sound like they heard the shot that killed Jason. Or do I have the time line confused? 

Does Sabrina have time travel spells? My answer for everything that doesn't make sense is going to be witchcraft. How does a heterosexual teenaged boy not want to have sex with Betty? Witchcraft. Why aren't all the kids playing with their phones instead of talking like real people? Witchcraft. Why are people just randomly named "Moose" and "Jughead?" Witchcraft.

[CletusMusashi]

On 2/3/2017 at 7:47 PM, femmefan1946 said:

But didn't they say at the end of the episode that Jason didn't die (via gunshot) till a week after the 4th? So Archie hearing the gunshot wouldn't matter as much, if Jason wasn't shot till a week later.

Who do we know that owns a large freezer? Anybody in the abbatoir or grocery business? Does Pop have a walk in freezer at the Chok'lit Shoppe?

I smell an iZombie crossover! Please?

[Chinspinner]

I can't decide if these first two episodes have been great or terrible... at the moment I'm finding it an incredibly camp smorgasbord of teen cliches, tropes and stock characters, delivered with a wry wink... it could wear thin fairly soon though. 

[Anna Yolei]

On Mon Feb 06 2017 at 9:29 AM, rho said:

Mrs. Cooper uses Polly like a cautionary tale and doesn't really treat Betty like the oldest child. I'm wondering what the age difference is, and if maybe the twins are older?

Cheryl is in the same biology class as the others, which suggests they're all in the same grade. 

But this is a big plothole, though.

Edited February 9, 2017 by Anna Yolei

[Bort]

5 minutes ago, Anna Yolei said:

Cheryl is in the same biology class as the others, which suggests they're all in the same grade. 

But this is a big plothole, though.

Not in high school. The only class that ends up being grade-specific is English. I had a mix of all grades in my other classes.

[jay741982]

On 2/8/2017 at 3:39 PM, MV007 said:

I know I'm probably being manipulated in some way but I just want Betty to get everything she ever wanted.

My only issue with Jughead is that he talks like he's on Dawson's Creek and everyone else talks normally.  It worked on DC because everyone talked the same.  Here, though, where it is just one person, it sticks out like a sore thumb.

Same! Betty is my favorite and I want her to have the world Goddammit lol. Shit Archies a idiot for not seeing the fabulous gorgeous babe she is. 

 

On 2/8/2017 at 6:00 PM, Danny Franks said:

Me too. The main reason I favour Betty/Archie is because it's what Betty wants. I don't give a crap about what Archie wants.

If it doesn't work out, then whatever.  But she should at least get the chance to find out what dating the guy she's loved for years is like. 

LOL yep that's the only reason I want Betty/Archie as well. And I agree with all of your post 

[Dobian]

I had to laugh at Ms. Grundy's "We might go to jail!".  Uh, no, you will go to jail, the minor gets counseling to cope with his abuse.  Even if, um, he really enjoyed it.

This isn't the first show to revive the Twin Peaks style.  Bates Motel has been doing it for four years (with the final season about to begin).

Okay I'm on board with this show.  It's good dumb fun.  It's totally unrealistic, the parents act like older siblings, and everyone is ridiculously hot looking, but I really like most of the young actors, especially Betty/Veronica/Cheryl/Jughead.  Jughead reminds me of someone, haven't figured it out yet.

[DigitalCount]

Were Jason and Cheryl sharing a milkshake at the diner?

[MarkHB]

1 minute ago, DigitalCount said:

Were Jason and Cheryl sharing a milkshake at the diner?

Yes.  Two straws, one cup.

[DigitalCount]

7 hours ago, MarkHB said:

Yes.  Two straws, one cup.

I'm not sure if that wording was deliberate, but if so, bravo...and ugh. 

Haven't gotten a chance to watch episode 3 yet, so this might be dashed to pieces already, but my girlfriend is hoping one of the Blossom Twins was switched with Archie at birth, and everyone involved knows this. It would at least explain why they themselves seem(ed) so content to flounce around openly. The problem is that everyone else seems to have no issues with them acting like a couple. I mean, who doesn't share a drink with their sister, or go for a lonely boat ride with her at 6AM dressed like they just hopped out of a painting?

[halkatla]

This episode should have been called: "I´m sorry"

[ByTor]

On 2/7/2017 at 2:33 PM, Bill1978 said:

No I haven't. I was joking in my ponderings. My thoughts were something like this. They cast the actor as Jason based upon the fact that he looks like what they wanted Jason to look like. They then go film the flashback scene and discover that he is truly terrible at delivery lines, but they really like his appearance. So they decide that whenever Jason appears he will just be silent. And then it becomes a behind the scene running gag. Don't let Jason speak when he appears.

Haha this theory is awesome!

[Bruinsfan]

On 2/3/2017 at 1:20 AM, Temperance said:

The adults I don't really like as much. I wish Miss Grundy was a old lady and the young teacher named something else. All the adults except Miss Grundy were fatter in the comics. 

Personally I wish they'd had Miss Grundy be an old lady but doubled down on the squicky subversiveness and still had her seducing Archie. Like, back a truck full of money up to Ellen Burstyn's door and film her letting her hair down out of Grundy's distinctive bun and offering to show Archie what she learned from the boys when they came home from Korea.

[Mabinogia]

Helen Mirren would have made a great Old Mss Grundy. I could see her tempting a young man into sin. lol (she did once, actually, ages ago in Teaching Mrs. Tingle. Terrible movie, but she was hot!)

[Bruinsfan]

Based on that swimsuit photo a year or so ago, it's not jarring enough that Mirren would be able to get a hot teenage boy panting after her. I can believe she'd have little trouble convincing some real world college jock to let her rock his world were she so inclined. A more elderly-looking actress like Burstyn or Frances Sternhagen would better fit the shocking visual I'm going for.

Edited March 1, 2017 by Bruinsfan

[methodwriter85]

On 2/9/2017 at 3:01 PM, kariyaki said:

Not in high school. The only class that ends up being grade-specific is English. I had a mix of all grades in my other classes.

That was my experience, too. Every year I had classes with people a grade above or a grade below. Hell, senior year of high school, I somehow managed to have classes with freshmen, sophomores, and juniors. (Although I only had to take gym with freshmen because I put off taking my last marking period of gym until the third quarter of my senior year.)

Quote

My boyfriend said that not only does he not pass for 15, he doesnt pass for 19 either.  He said that Apa just has a certain body AND facial maturity that most guys dont get until they approach or hit 30.  

It's the scar between his eyebrows. It gives him this line between them that a 19-year old guy wouldn't normally have. Even though it's not a wrinkle, it still kind of looks like one, hence making him look like he's pushing 30.

It's really funny when you compare him to Cole, who's 5 years older but doesn't look out of a place in a high school even with the slight bags under his eyes.

[Bruinsfan]

Physique-wise he looks older too though. Usually athletic teens are also pretty lean and wiry; Apa is muscular in a way that looks like a boxer in his late 20s.

[methodwriter85]

On 3/6/2017 at 1:48 PM, Bruinsfan said:

Physique-wise he looks older too though. Usually athletic teens are also pretty lean and wiry; Apa is muscular in a way that looks like a boxer in his late 20s.

I feel positive that Apa can't be taller than 5'9", like 5'8". His build at that age usually only happens with guys that aren't tall.

Quote

ETA: I think Apa and whichever Sprouse twin is playing Jughead have some chemistry, and it really stands out given the total lack of chemistry between Apa and the Grundy, Betty, and Veronica actresses.  iMHO, he didnt generate chemistry with Brie Larson in A Dog's Purpose either.

Britt Robertson. Brie Larson is about the same age, but she's an Oscar Winner and is for the time being a bit too high-profile to make a movie like that. (She also doesn't seem to play teenagers anymore.)

Quote

I truly thought he was pushing 30. I couldn't believe it when I read he was only 19.

Check out his Twitter. My god, he's a delightful guy but damn he's still a kid.

Edited March 26, 2017 by methodwriter85

[abhi]

1 hour ago, methodwriter85 said:

I feel positive that Apa can't be taller than 5'9", like 5'8". His build at that age usually only happens with guys that aren't tall.

Apa is 5'11''. He was with a modeling agency so the stats are out there. Besides, he's half Samoan and Samoans are built quite differently. Apa shouldn't be compared to normal  Caucasian standards. 

[starri]

He's a quarter Samoan.

And Hollywood is famous for adding a few inches to actors' heights.

[Bruinsfan]

Yeah, safe bet to subtract 2 inches unless they're over 6 feet tall. Then start adding them above maybe 6'4".

Edited March 26, 2017 by Bruinsfan

[secnarf]

11 hours ago, starri said:

He's a quarter Samoan.

And Hollywood is famous for adding a few inches to actors' heights.

He's half-Samoan according to this interview. His father is a Samoan chief.

[starri]

I swear I read somewhere that it was his father that was the half-Samoan.  Who knows.

Still, I take any official Hollywood height with a grain of salt.

[methodwriter85]

On 3/26/2017 at 7:35 PM, starri said:

I swear I read somewhere that it was his father that was the half-Samoan.  Who knows.

Still, I take any official Hollywood height with a grain of salt.

On the other hand, model agencies don't seem to allow their models to fudge their heights, so maybe he really is indeed 5'11". I honestly would have guessed 5'9" though.

Cole Sprouse's height is listed as 6 feet, which gave me a "bullshit!" reaction, especially since it seems like he and Apa are close in height but I guess he might actually be that tall, or at least close to it.

That is a good point to remember that KJ isn't a typical white boy.

[millennium]

This show's like Degrassi meets ABC Afterschool Special meets Roswell.  Or something like that.  (If Joey Jeremiah shows up, I'm gone.)

The one vibe I don't get is Twin Peaks. 

The camera sure loves Veronica.

I don't ask much of any show that has Luke Perry so I have no complaints.   

[thuganomics85]

Oh, Veronica!  I get that you feel like shit over what you did and I'm glad your making amends, but you might have gone just a wee bit overboard with the flowers, the special cupcakes (from New York!), and practically saying that you feel like turning Betty against you as derailed what her life was suppose to be.  You sure you just want to be BFFs with her?  Still think she's the best.  Really surprised after I glanced at IMDB and found out that this is Camila Mendes first gig ever.  She really is a natural.

Poor Betty.  I know that Archie isn't required to have feelings for her, but it still sucks knowing someone you have romantic interest in, doesn't return the feelings, and while I know Archie and Veronica didn't mean any harm and felt bad for what they did, it is hard to just get over that.  Glad she seems to be understanding this and a bit more civil to Archie and back to being friends with Veronica.  I do think their relationship feels a bit rushed, but I'm fine with thinking that part of it is that Veronica probably never really had any friends (or good ones) during her time in NYC and Betty's seems to be a bit of loner besides Archie, so that's why they are already this friendly.  Overall, I just find the Veronica/Betty friendship to be the highlight so far.

Glad to get more Jughead.  His scenes where the most Archie's been likable.

Speaking of which, still don't hate him, but Archie really is dim, huh?  Or is just so infatuated with Miss Grundy that he can't see she is manipulating him.  And has the world's worst poker face, since he might has well been wearing a sign that said "I'm lying!", when Principal Weatherbee confronted him.  Could thing that Luke Perry is a good dad so far, and is able to talk some since in him.  Jughead too.

So, Kevin is the sheriff's son, while the mayor (Robin Givens!) is Josie's mother.  That's a bit pact, but then again, it is a small town, so I would guess almost everyone would be connected on some level.

There totally was something inappropriate going down with Cheryl and Jason Blossom.  And I'm not just talking about sharing a milkshake....