S01.E14: I Call Marriage

[Ms Blue Jay]

1 hour ago, Tikichick said:

Not to sound like a super expert or anything, but the nickname Horse Dick is completely inappropriate unless it is being used as an oxymoron.  His behavior makes it clear the comparison would be absurd in the extreme.

It's such a disconnect to me.  To me, this would be an appealing nickname or a compliment, LOL.  Like those Sex and the City characters: Mr. Big, Mr. Marvelous, Mr. Too Big.  That's what it reminds me of.  And yet everyone uses it as an insult.  Too funny.

Quote

So rude and condescending to tell someone you don't even know how to live her life.

Olivia did this to Kate too,  It's like every single person that interacts with Kate has to be an aggressive, sociopathic person with zero respect for boundaries.  The writers are being very clumsy here.  There are normal people out there.  

The one thing that annoyed me about Sophie was her line "Yeah, I'm kind of a badass."  Ugh.  It's just horribly cliched writing.  As an adult woman, I never hear my counterparts speak like that in real life and if they do I'd find it so trite and immature.  It's okay to say you're accomplished or good at your job but that kind of dialogue just reads so phony and cloying.  

Edited February 8, 2017 by Ms Blue Jay

[Tikichick]

20 minutes ago, ShadowFacts said:

I mostly agree, but had a slightly different interpretation of why Beth "called marriage."  I don't think it was for the daughter's chess match, because those are eminently skip-able.  I thought Beth was focusing on the imminent departure of William and the memories being made for all of them but in this instance, especially the kids.  She was also concerned about Randall's apparent detachment.  So I didn't see it as her just putting on pressure to attend a kid's event, I thought she was trying to pull him back into preparing for William's death before it's too late. 

I think you're very likely correct. 

I suspect they have an agreement in place where they can use this phrase with the other because they may have been in a place in the past where one or the other of them was becoming overwhelmed by obligations outside of their marriage and it was causing problems.  It could also have been put in place because of things Randall saw happen between Jack and Rebecca, things he wanted to make darn sure didn't happen in his marriage.

[JudyObscure]

28 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

In my opinion, Kevin was in the wrong and did all the wrong things this episode. I think it should have taken more time for Sophie to forgive him. 

I don't expect Sophie to forgive him or to take him back and I don't think Kevin acted like he was expecting that anytime soon, either. I only expected her to be able to sit down with him and allow him to speak for twenty minutes.  How would that hurt her?  Maybe he wants to express how sorry he is or why he thinks things might be different now if he has another chance.  All she has to do is sit and listen and then maybe, when he's done,  tell him why it just can't happen.  It's the hair tossing, "I'm not speaking to you!" sort of action that seems so childish to me.  I divorced my husband for some very good reasons, but we've always been able to talk.

[Neurochick]

21 minutes ago, bichonblitz said:

Yes, that clearly wasn't a NYC subway train. That looked like it was an above ground train, which if in NYC would take you to New Jersey, Long Island or somewhere in the tri'boro area. Since we saw Kevin last episode get out of a cab and walk up to what looked like a property in the city, where exactly was Sophie going? 

In the show, it was supposed to be a subway train.  At one point they were stuck and when they started moving, they said "next stop 59th street."

[bichonblitz]

1 minute ago, Neurochick said:

In the show, it was supposed to be a subway train.  At one point they were stuck and when they started moving, they said "next stop 59th street."

You are right. Which makes it even worse.  I was agreeing with you. 

[bybrandy]

39 minutes ago, luna1122 said:

Yes, all true. But people DO look up folks from much longer ago than that, and clearly, Sophie has also thought of Kevin often, and so it doesn't seem unlikely to me. But apparently she did not.

But she wouldn't have to look him up on Facebook.  He's famous.  She is going to see way more of what's going on in his life in the tabloids than she wants to know about.  And him popping up in the tabloids is going to keep reinforcing the part where he left her to be a star and then cheated on her.  She could have looked up the rest of the family, sure.  But if she wanted a clean break I could see her not, because she didn't want to be accosted by even more Kevin info.   

[DoubleUTeeEff]

10 hours ago, OtterMommy said:

 I was really hoping that Sophie wouldn't show up at the restaurant the second time--not because I don't like her, but because I am far more interested in watching Kevin being forced to grow up a bit than to see him revive a childhood/young adult romance.  

I agree 100%.  But no, OF COURSE, she shows up at the end!  The grand romantic gesture never fails on this show.  This whole idea would work better for me if Kevin re-established contact with Sophie and they slowly become friends and fall in love.  Instead, after meeting her once, Kevin declares his love for her after 12 years and a divorce with unresolved feelings.  Why do they have to go from 0 to 100 so quickly?  Toby and Kate get engaged way too quickly and Kevin has to go straight to "in love".  Does he even know her?  12 years is a long time.  All these relationships are so over the top. 

[Tikichick]

What if this episode showed us each of the kids struggling with an issue Jack and Rebecca faced?  Kevin, marriage v. career as an artist.  Kate, trying to do something for herself but feeling pulled by a guy who loves her and shows it with grand gestures and another who just wants what he wants from her.  Randall, pulled to the breaking point between career obligations/supporting your family and family obligations.

[Neurochick]

Just now, bichonblitz said:

You are right. Which makes it even worse.  I was agreeing with you. 

Right, it makes it A LOT worse, because it shows someone didn't do their homework, which isn't very hard to do in the age of Google.

[llewis823]

3 hours ago, luna1122 said:

I see others are charmed by Beth's "I call marriage" but I wasn't really. Bossing your spouse/partner around, no matter if you're right or not, is not pretty to me. Poor Randall really is at the end of his emotional rope, but I'm uncertain that was helpful. I'm hoping his hand tremors are anxiety-related and not a precursor to Parkinson's or something.

I agree. Randall's work means a lot to him. His place in the company is at risk. He goes to almost all of the girls' other things - one chess match in which both her mom and grandpa were there - would not ruin his relationship with his daughter. I did like the "I call marriage" card but only in super important circumstances.

[DoubleUTeeEff]

30 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Olivia did this to Kate too,  It's like every single person that interacts with Kate has to be an aggressive, sociopathic person with zero respect for boundaries.  The writers are being very clumsy here.  There are normal people out there.  

Yes.  At least in that case Kate immediately gave Olivia a dressing down.  Now if she can only learn to do that in cases where men think she is sexy.

[Tikichick]

4 minutes ago, llewis823 said:

I agree. Randall's work means a lot to him. His place in the company is at risk. He goes to almost all of the girls' other things - one chess match in which both her mom and grandpa were there - would not ruin his relationship with his daughter. I did like the "I call marriage" card but only in super important circumstances.

I think we need more of the backstory about why they made the agreement before we can judge Beth for pulling the card.

What kind of surprises me is, for as tight a couple as Randall and Beth are, she's not picked up yet on things being very stressed and far out of whack with Randall.  I think it must be because she assumes it's all about William and isn't seeing beyond that yet.

[OtterMommy]

1 hour ago, ShadowFacts said:

They could go a few different ways with this, but the straightforward approach where she goes and tells him to back off or she will report him is certainly the one I favor.  However, she has already had ample opportunity to do it, including immediately before that in the gym, and she hasn't, so I don't know if that is what we'll see.  What I really don't want to see is her going there to tell him to step off, and then falling into his arms for the hot, forbidden sex that she has to keep secret from Toby and which causes guilt and overeating.  I think the repeated Cabin 13 references have been planted for a reason and that something pretty significant is going to happen inside of it, and I hope it's not super soap-y.

I'm hoping "Cabin 13" is just to send home the fact that HorseDick is a bad guy.  The tradition is that nothing good comes from things numbered 13....

[Kenz]

Jack is pretty perfect, but why do they have to make the back of his hair so strange and greasy? (Sorry if someone has commented on this already.)

[3 is enough]

Honestly I just don't see Jack and Rebecca divorcing before he dies.  The fact that she wore the necklace at the funeral, and still wears it now (and the show seems to focus on that), just doesn't add up to a divorce.  And given the timeline, I can't see her divorcing and jumping right into Miguel's arms.  Plus, Miguel is Jack's friend.  I can't see him scooping up Rebecca while Jack is still alive.  I don't think he is that awful.

Kate and Duke- where is this going?  Does she have a fling with him and feel compelled to confess to Toby? Because given how his wife's cheating affected him, that will not end well. Or is it just a tease and we will see her turn around and leave next week?

Only 4 episodes to go, and I guess we will learn how Jack dies, but with two more seasons guaranteed, there is plenty of time to drag out the story.  At this point I am dreading it so much I wish they would just tell us already so I can focus on the story and details without imagining various scenarios.

[ShadowFacts]

I forgot to mention previously that, in the Jack and Rebecca scenes from their marriage when the kids were teens, they would have been something like 45 and 50-something, and there is absolutely no effort to make them look those ages.  I guess the youthful appearance is familial;  Sophie mentioned how fantastic Kevin always looks. 

[Calamity Jane]

11 hours ago, bybrandy said:

I never go out through the garage entrance unless I'm parked in the garage.  If I'm parked in the driveway I walk out the front door.  And I'm mostly parked in the driveway.  Now I don't have a 100,000 dollar car or a ridiculously sized house with disturbingly few bedrooms.  But it is a nice sized house in a middle class neighborhood.   But my garage is mostly storage and in my neighborhood almost nobody parks in the garage.  This might be a Texas thing.  My sister certainly thinks it is weird and comments on it every time she visits.  

 

Not me, I go out through the garage even if the car is in the driveway because I live alone so nobody else needs to leave, and it saves me the extra step of having to lock the front door after I go out.  The door stays locked at all times, I just push the button to go out the garage door and push the button in the car to close the garage door.  When there are other people in the house, it could be different, of course.  

On another topic, I'm holding out hope that Randall's tremor is just anxiety manifesting itself.  That actually happened to me when my mom was dying and my teaching assignment was a complete disaster, and I went to the doctor certain that I had Parkinson's or MS or something else terrible. The shaking was so bad that the vet couldn't read what I wrote as my dog's name and had it wrong in the records for years.  My wonderful DO quickly eliminated the bad, scary diagnoses and had me try two weeks of an anti-anxiety med (since there wasn't much I could to reduce the stress of what was happening in my life), and hey, presto, the tremor went away.  So, please, let Randall just be showing the stresses he's under in so many directions.  

Edited February 8, 2017 by Calamity Jane

[mmecorday]

What's Kate's deal? She grew up in the 80s and was exposed to the "Friday the 13th" franchise. She should know what happens to people who have sex at a camp!

[qtpye]

4 minutes ago, llewis823 said:

I agree. Randall's work means a lot to him. His place in the company is at risk. He goes to almost all of the girls' other things - one chess match in which both her mom and grandpa were there - would not ruin his relationship with his daughter. I did like the "I call marriage" card but only in super important circumstances.

3 hours ago, luna1122 said:

I see others are charmed by Beth's "I call marriage" but I wasn't really. Bossing your spouse/partner around, no matter if you're right or not, is not pretty to me. Poor Randall really is at the end of his emotional rope, but I'm uncertain that was helpful. I'm hoping his hand tremors are anxiety-related and not a precursor to Parkinson's or something.

 

2 hours ago, cardigirl said:

Loved your entire post, but singled out these two thoughts as being exactly what I was thinking while watching this episode.  Too much 'lecturing' and I totally did not like the "I call marriage" without any discussion as to why Randall felt he had to go to the dinner.  That seemed false to me.  Real couples would ask why and what for, not just shut each other down.  

 

I hated the "I call marriage" thing as much as I hated William showing up out of the blue for father/son day.  Look, it is one thing if Randall was a disengaged father who rarely made time for his family, but that is not the case.  My husband is in healthcare and the men and women in that field have crazy schedules.  Many of his colleagues have missed birthdays, games, and other activities.  This was a chess tournament everyone forgot about until saintly William turned the oldest daughter into Bobby Fischer.   The thing is the spouses (husbands and wives) understand that this is part of their job and those same jobs provide handsomely for the families.

I work as well, but thankfully it is only a 40 hour week.  My husband does great with balancing work and family, but anyone with an important career is going have crazy hours sometimes.

I remember the CEO of Pepsico (who is a woman) truthfully admit that she was not there for many of her children milestone activities and that her and her husband leaned heavily on grandparents for help and support.  It was such a breath of fresh air, particularly after another CEO had just claimed they were always home at 5 to eat dinner with the family and help with homework.

I feel like there is a giant pressure in this country (particularly for women, but it also applies to many men) that you have to get that high paying job that supports the lifestyle, but God forbid if you can not find time in your 12 hour days to go to every family event.  It is ridiculous and "calling marriage" is just going to add to your spouse's work stress.  I understand Beth does not know about Joker face Sanjay, but she does understand her husband is in a highly competitive industry that pays very well.  To be quite frank, it is probably unrealistic to have Randall hanging around the house as much as he does.

I still love Beth and the girls.  Randall's family is too adorable for words.

[Calamity Jane]

3 hours ago, PRgal said:

I think Toby is gross too.  He's verging onto stalker territory by barging in on Kate's retreat like that.  And also, I didn't know light up shoes came in adult sizes. 

My daughter (32) just happened to show me an ad for some the other day!

[Ms Blue Jay]

Does anyone know if Milo Ventimiglia is going to act in the next 2 seasons?  Logistically, this show being guaranteed for 3 full seasons doesn't really mesh well with the popular characters of William and Jack being near their deaths.  I guess I'm supposed to assume the show will just play out in the next (undetermined) amount of years as flashing back and forth to present?  Thanks.

[Arcadiasw]

14 hours ago, SimoneS said:

 

Yeah, I can't with Kevin. He still has the weakest story, IMO. 

I'm not feeling Kevin and Sophie. It seems they are going to start dating again which is ugh. Sophie has a guy and he's nice and good for her but since he's not a main character in the show he has to go and we the audience should root for Kevin and Sophie. :rolls eyes:

14 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

 

Up until now I haven't been bothered by Jack's near-perfection, but this was a little too much.  I liked his wedding vows, I liked the fact that he wanted to make the effort to keep things going 16 or whatever years later, but it felt overdone, with the getaway to the conveniently vacant apartment highly bedecked with lights and champagne, etc.  I have to say that even though I thought it felt overwrought, I am still appreciating Milo's acting. 

 

This is the first time I thought Jack was over the top. Since Jack got rid of the kids for the night he could've done all that at home. 

12 hours ago, breezy424 said:

 

On a side note...why does Randell go out the front door to go to work?  This bothers me in so many TV shows.  There's a two or three car garage.  Do they not park their $100000 car in the garage?  Don't they go directly to the attached garage from the house?  OK.  Super critical.  When I or my husband go somewhere in our cars, we go to the door to the garage.  Even our kids, when they go to their cars, go to the inside garage entrance to the garage to the driveway where their cars are parked.  Yeah, I'll go back to the corner on this but it just 'bothers' me.  I know it's TV....yadda, yadda, yadda.

It could be that they have a lot of stuff in the garage that they can't park their cars there or they use the garage for something else. As big as Randall's house is, they couldn't find a room for William. So it's not surprising the car isn't in the garage. Nearly all the cars in my subdivision are parked outside. The few times I've seen the garage door open they have a lot stuff in the garage.  My coworker's wife uses the garage to store things for her side business and I have a friend who turn the garage into his man cave. 

[Tikichick]

1 minute ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Does anyone know if Milo Ventimiglia is going to act in the next 2 seasons?  Logistically, this show being guaranteed for 3 full seasons doesn't really mesh well with the popular characters of William and Jack being near their deaths.  I guess I'm supposed to assume the show will just play out in the next (undetermined) amount of years as flashing back and forth to present?  Thanks.

Bite your tongue!  That's why I don't understand everybody's hurry to know how and when Jack dies.  The minute it becomes canon it limits the stories they can tell including Jack.

That said, simply because of the way this show has structured it's delivery of story to us, I absolutely believe Jack will continue to be an ongoing part of the story we see.  Depending on how young everyone is at his death there will be a certain point where his storyline potentials become pretty thin.

[saber5055]

TV husbands have been leaving for work via the front door since Father Knows Best. Otherwise, viewers won't know if they are going to work or getting a rake from the garage. And Toby shows up to invade Kate's space because he's been cleared for ... SEX. Toby and SEX. That's all he (appears to) want Kate for. SEX. In the hospital, at her brother's house ... he doesn't care. He is so gross And Beth, for pete's sake, Randall's JOB is paying for that house and your ability to live well. A person in an important position who is at a critical point with the boss (read: He's going to get canned) cannot be late, cannot miss meetings, has to put work first. Meanwhile, Rebecca with three kids is putting her music first. Who is going to take care of those kids while Jack is at work 24/7 and you are on the road? I guess it's her mom, like mom volunteered a few episodes ago. And Randall starting his own business? Please. Then he'll be at work 24/7, 365 days a year. Anyone here who works for themselves knows THAT'S the truth.

[roughing it]

Randall is experiencing two different kinds of loss - his dad's sudden death (we're assuming) and watching his bio dad's impending death.  I experienced the same with my parents - watched my dad die from cancer and my mother's sudden death.  Neither one is "easier", although people always tell me that at least my mom didn't suffer.  Doesn't help the pain.  I can see how Randall is in denial, he doesn't think he can handle losing another parent.  Beth played the "I call marriage" card not for the chess match per se, but for the family being together, because she's not in denial, and knows it won't be long.

I'm not liking the Kevin/Sophie pairing.  She's is dull....  I'm hoping that Kevin realizes that young love doesn't always translate into adult love.

[Tikichick]

Do we know how Beth is employed or how much income she brings into the home?  Her contribution to their home and lifestyle may be substantial even if Randall is doing well.

[ClareWalks]

4 minutes ago, saber5055 said:

Meanwhile, Rebecca with three kids is putting her music first. Who is going to take care of those kids while Jack is at work 24/7 and you are on the road?

To be fair, the "kids" are like 15 years old, so they can fix their own dinner and do homework for the couple hours after school lets out before their dad comes home. 

[OtterMommy]

2 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

Do we know how Beth is employed or how much income she brings into the home?  Her contribution to their home and lifestyle may be substantial even if Randall is doing well.

It was said in a past episode, when Beth thought she might be pregnant, that she was getting ready to go back to work full-time, which I took to mean that she is currently working part-time (from home, which is why she needed Kevin out of her home office).

[Biggie B]

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One annoying thing for me.  The budget on this show must be ZERO because they're not even trying to pretend they're in NYC.  Subways looked like that that decades ago, show.  I guess no one knows how to Google, "New York City subways."

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Yes, that clearly wasn't a NYC subway train. That looked like it was an above ground train, which if in NYC would take you to New Jersey, Long Island or somewhere in the tri'boro area.

Apologies if this has already been pointed out, but correct, the train that Kevin and Sophie were on was a Metro North train. Although I was born in Brooklyn, I grew up in Westchester County, which borders the Bronx. My backyard was 18 miles from the Empire State Building. For 25+ years, my dad commuted daily into the city on those Metro North trains, as did I, later in life, when I moved to Connecticut and worked in Manhattan. Not sure why they decided to use those trains as a substitute for an actual NYC subway, I guess they are visually a bit more appealing and perhaps the interior layout was more conducive to how the two actors needed to move around. But even so, I assumed that scene was filmed on a set, so why not make it look like the real thing?

I tuned in 15 minutes late and at first thought this would be an episode with no flashbacks and was thrilled! I'm actually getting tired of them, or rather, would prefer they be used much more sparingly. I know they flesh out a lot of things for us viewers, but...I feel as if the balance between past and present is off kilter somehow, at least, for me. As for Jack decorating the vacant apartment - major eye rolling from me. Ugh (and how did he get in there fast enough to already have the candles lit??). And then re-reading their wedding vows? My blood sugar spiked. All of that, every moment of it, was just so over the top.

I am still enjoying this show but there's so much to pick apart! Sometimes that's fun, sometimes it's not. I try not to take the show too seriously, it's basically a fancy soap opera.

[luna1122]

I don't have a problem with Rebecca going off on a brief music tour. The kids are teens, they can take care of themselves after school til Jack gets home). It's not ideal, and Jack might hate it and I don't blame him, but it's not a deal breaker, I'd think, and it doesn't make Rebecca a bad mom.

[Cardie]

2 hours ago, Crs97 said:

Do we know how old the children are at this point?

It's after Kevin moved into the basement, so they are around 15.

[Biggie B]

3 minutes ago, Cardie said:

Do we know how old the children are at this point?

When Jack was preparing to whisk Rebecca away and she asked where the kids were, Jack said they were at friends' houses for a sleepover (paraphrasing). Hearing the word "sleepover" made me think of elementary school. It's like the words "play date" - you wouldn't say your 15 year old is having a play date with his friend, but you'd say that about a much younger kid. So if the triplets are indeed 15-ish at this point, perhaps the writers could have come up with a different phrase than 'sleepover.' Very minor and picky on my behalf, but it jumped out at me.

[zumpie]

TV husbands have been leaving for work via the front door since Father Knows Best. Otherwise, viewers won't know if they are going to work or getting a rake from the garage. And Toby shows up to invade Kate's space because he's been cleared for ... SEX. Toby and SEX. That's all he (appears to) want Kate for. SEX. In the hospital, at her brother's house ... he doesn't care. He is so gross And Beth, for pete's sake, Randall's JOB is paying for that house and your ability to live well. A person in an important position who is at a critical point with the boss (read: He's going to get canned) cannot be late, cannot miss meetings, has to put work first. Meanwhile, Rebecca with three kids is putting her music first. Who is going to take care of those kids while Jack is at work 24/7 and you are on the road? I guess it's her mom, like mom volunteered a few episodes ago. And Randall starting his own business? Please. Then he'll be at work 24/7, 365 days a year. Anyone here who works for themselves knows THAT'S the truth.

Agreed. I've already found this show to be VERRRRYYYYY weird and suspect (typical of TV TBH) in how depicts work situations: Randall earns so much $$$ that he owns a ridiculously huge house (that still should have more bedrooms, even with a home office and their public rooms are overall kinda small) and was able to pay cash for an obscenely $$$ car, while living in a very expensive state, with a high tax burden---at the ripe old age of 38 and entirely from his own efforts.

Yet we notice he's home every night to hang with his family before dinner time. Jobs that pay at least $500K per year (because, yes, that's what his job would need to pay, if not more) generally require a LOT of time at the office. Actually, normally jobs that pay $50K per year require a fair amount of devotion to your company. And, again, if he's about to be canned from that, UI and "starting your own business" (which takes YEARS to get off the ground, etc) is not going to even approach covering their lifestyle (actually it would barely cover food and gas).

In Rebecca's case-----I'm the parent of ONE teen, I've always worked F/T with jobs that sometimes require me to do things in the evenings and my spouse working F/T----and even then, it doesn't nearly have the impact that a job requiring you to travel extensively does.

There's a huge difference between coming home at 6PM every night, even being gone a few nights (even per week) and being gone indefinitely. In fact I've turned down jobs that required extensive (i.e. 6-12 weeks on the other side of the country) training for precisely this reason. And it wouldn't just affect the kids, it would also affect your relationship with your partner.

[qtpye]

As much as I like Jack, I am beginning to think he must have died saving puppies and orphans from a burning building, since they have confirmed he is a superhero dad.  Perhaps we will be treated to Miguel twirling his mustache and giving an evil laugh in the process.

I like this show, because I thought it did a great job with balancing sweetness with the right amount of nostalgia.  Life does not always turn out the way you expect, but that is not necessarily a bad thing.

However, whisking the wife away to a fairy lighted old apartment for the night to recite wedding vows,  just reeks of Hallmark channel saccharine.

It was also weird to me that Rebecca announces she is going on tour that very moment.  I have no problem with her going on tour...she sacrificed for her family and the kids are older.  It was just an odd moment to announce it. 

[biakbiak]

8 minutes ago, Biggie B said:

When Jack was preparing to whisk Rebecca away and she asked where the kids were, Jack said they were at friends' houses for a sleepover (paraphrasing). Hearing the word "sleepover" made me think of elementary school. It's like the words "play date" - you wouldn't say your 15 year old is having a play date with his friend, but you'd say that about a much younger kid. So if the triplets are indeed 15-ish at this point, perhaps the writers could have come up with a different phrase than 'sleepover.' Very minor and picky on my behalf, but it jumped out at me.

When they were getting ready for dinner, Kate came in and asked Rebecca for a tampon and Kevin was already living in the basement so older than elementary school.

[Biggie B]

Quote

When they were getting ready for dinner, Kate came in and asked Rebecca for a tampon and Kevin was already living in the basement so older than elementary school.

I missed the first 15 minutes of the show, but based on what everyone had commented here, I know the kids were not in elementary school at the time of this episode's flashbacks, that they are 15. Which is why I mentioned that use of the word 'sleepover' seemed a bit off, since that's a word I only used with my kid (now 20) when he was quite young.

Edited February 8, 2017 by Biggie B

[qtpye]

14 minutes ago, zumpie said:

Yet we notice he's home every night to hang with his family before dinner time. Jobs that pay at least $500K per year (because, yes, that's what his job would need to pay, if not more) generally require a LOT of time at the office. Actually, normally jobs that pay $50K per year require a fair amount of devotion to your company. And, again, if he's about to be canned from that, UI and "starting your own business" (which takes YEARS to get off the ground, etc) is not going to even approach covering their lifestyle (actually it would barely cover food and gas).

I think this might be one of these shows were the financials make no sense.  The only thing we have is that Kevin made millions on his sitcom and Randall is well off.  We have no idea how Kate is affording the camp (those are usually quite expensive).  I wish there was a throw away line about Toby working remotely for an IT company and therefore can live anywhere, as long as his projects are completed in time.

We are to believe Randall's work environment is toxic, but we see him spend tons of time with his family, including a dying bio dad he just found.  Randall's company is actually pretty reasonable for his probably 500K plus probably bonus compensation ( I agree it has to be around that, New Jersey is expensive and property taxes alone will kill you).  The family would have to making a multiple six figure income to keep up this lifestyle.

I know t.v. is not supposed to make sense and this is fictional, but the "Randall's job is too stressful and he needs to spend more time with dying father her barely knows" is falling flat with me.

Chessmaster William is very lovable, but he feels like a plot device, rather then a real person.

Edited February 8, 2017 by qtpye

[Laurie4H]

I really like this show but the dialogue gets a little Grey's Anatomy esque sometimes....with the monologues.  A little too writers trying to be clever yet turns out  unrealistic.   

High school Kate didn't look that overweight?

In the flashbacks Rebecca is about 45 and Jack about 50?  They try to age Mandy Moore it seems but not Milo as much.  

Definitely a fake out about Kate going to the guys room as well as Randall's hand shaking.  I assume it will end up being anxiety.

Edited February 8, 2017 by Laurie4H

[luna1122]

16 minutes ago, qtpye said:

 

It was also weird to me that Rebecca announces she is going on tour that very moment.  I have no problem with her going on tour...she sacrificed for her family and the kids are older.  It was just an odd moment to announce it. 

I thought it was odd, too, but then I kind of thought she was feeling really happy and secure at that moment, after they had such a romantic night, and thought that it wouldn't be such a big deal, that they could get thru anything and Jack would be okay with it. Or something.

2 minutes ago, Laurie4H said:

  

High school Kate didn't look that overweight?

 

 

Yeah, we've seen the teen actress before and she looks a lot like Chrissy Metz, but she's only a little pudgy, not even close to obese. She's very cute. I think she always had a weight problem, but it only truly escalated until she was an adult. Or, perhaps, til after Jack died.

[tennisgurl]

I thought this was a pretty good episode, didn't really blow me away, but it certainly didn't suck either. There were things that worked, and things that didn't.

As for as things that worked, I liked the Jack/Rebecca flashbacks quite a lot. I enjoyed Rebecca telling Sam from True Blood to screw himself for implying that Jack didn't "really love her" if he didn't want her to go on the tour. Jack is PERFECT, and Rebecca is very much aware of that. And I liked seeing them dealing with their friends divorce, and then Jack trying to add spice to their marriage. I know Jack gets all the BIG romantic moments, like here, but I thoughts Rebecca's rant to the band leader showed how much she loved Jack in return. As for the tour? I think the kids are supposed to be teenagers at that point, and its only for five weeks, so I don't think it makes her awful for wanting to go. I`ll see what happens before I pass judgement.

I WILL pass judgement if Kate actually sleeps with Duke, who is such an unbelievable asshole that I'm legitimately shocked that his ass hasn't been fired 20 times over for being shitty to the campers, sexually harassing the female campers (no way is Kate the first women he's pulled this shit on), and saying over and over how stupid this whole camp is. Its like the writers heard about how some audience members thought Toby came on too strong and was too sexual towards someone he doesn't know very well, and thought "lets add in this guy who makes Toby look like a virginal shrinking violet!" and hoped we wouldn't dislike him anymore. Well, I will say, Toby at least seems like a real person now. He was pretty annoying this week, but I felt like he was trying too hard, in universe, and was just feeling scared and alone. I have no idea what Dukes deal is, but it would have to have a ridiculously tragic backstory for me to not want him to get kicked in the nuts by several passing horses.

Normally I love Beth, but I rolled my eyes at the I Call Marriage thing. I mean, I get that its important for him to be there for his kids, but couldn't he have explained better about his work troubles, or couldn't Beth have asked why this diner was so important? They usually do so well as a team, it was weird to see them falling into this clichéd "dad wants to work but mom wants dad to come to kids play/game/chess tournament" conflict. This is Randall's job, which is, from everything we have seen, a very intense and cut throat environment, and he is being phased out, which is bad for EVERYONE in the family, because he might lose money, or even his job, or he might just feel increased levels of stress, which, as Beth knows, Randall does not do well with. In fact, trying to guilt him into going to the chess tournament should just make him worse. The only thing I can think of that would make it less cliché is the idea that some people have put out, that she really wants him to create memories with William, and that he is clearly not doing well with his bio dads impending death. Maybe its just because I was a child of the 90s/early 2000s where every damn kids movie had the "dad with fancy job neglects family and misses a recital so he's the worst person ever who must drop his work load and spend all his time with his wife and kids who nag at him constantly" plot line, and my kid self (who had seen her dad struggle with unemployment and her family struggle to pay the bills) thought were bullshit and the wife and kids were annoying, ungrateful idiots. So maybe its just my personal preference.

So Miguel's marriage just died out, no drama or cheating. It makes me less suspicious of him, but I still need to see the Rebecca/Miguel backstory before I can really get on board with the guy.

Edited February 8, 2017 by tennisgurl

[ClareWalks]

I also thought Beth "calling marriage" was a bit much. I mean, she chose that time to set her foot down: when Randall is obviously stressed and feels pulled in too many directions; there's all of a sudden this chess tournament nobody knew about until the day of, but hey, let's clear our schedules; and not only Beth but William were ALSO going to the tournament, so it wasn't like the kid wouldn't have anyone cheering for her there. Just weird, IMO.

[luna1122]

4 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

. As for the tour? I think the kids are supposed to be teenagers at that point, and its only for five months, so I don't think it makes her awful for wanting to go. I`ll see what happens before I pass judgement

Did they say five months? I heard five-city, so I assumed it would be couple weeks or something. Five months is a pretty long time for a marriage to withstand one partner/parent being AWOL.

[tennisgurl]

2 minutes ago, luna1122 said:

Did they say five months? I heard five-city, so I assumed it would be couple weeks or something. Five months is a pretty long time for a marriage to withstand one partner/parent being AWOL.

Ah, I meant to write in 5 weeks! That's what I heard anyway. Whoops! Sorry!

[zumpie]

  36 minutes ago, qtpye said:

 

It was also weird to me that Rebecca announces she is going on tour that very moment.  I have no problem with her going on tour...she sacrificed for her family and the kids are older.  It was just an odd moment to announce it. 

I thought it was odd, too, but then I kind of thought she was feeling really happy and secure at that moment, after they had such a romantic night, and thought that it wouldn't be such a big deal, that they could get thru anything and Jack would be okay with it. Or something.

  23 minutes ago, Laurie4H said:

  

High school Kate didn't look that overweight?

 

 

Yeah, we've seen the teen actress before and she looks a lot like Chrissy Metz, but she's only a little pudgy, not even close to obese. She's very cute. I think she always had a weight problem, but it only truly escalated until she was an adult. Or, perhaps, til after Jack died.

I noticed Kid Kate didn't look all that overweight, either....both of them were about the same as my slightly chubby daughter, who is nowhere and probably never will be the morbidly obese Metz is. Just as this show has financials that make zero sense, so they apparently don't understand "levels of fat" (and haven't for awhile).

Both younger actresses ARE the case of "you need to diet and exercise more and you'll probably always have to largely watch what you eat". Metz is "morbidly obese and should be under a physician's care" (and I'm not being mean, I'm stating a fact).

I frequently feel as if they really need to have an intern do a google search because their ignorance of basic facts is irritating and embarrassing

[Tikichick]

I realize a lot of viewers are into picking apart the minutiae of each and every detail of the setting and time period, but I'm generally able to look past an awful lot of that.  One thing that jumped out at me, yelled right in my face and I could not look away from in the episode was Jack and Rebecca sitting on the bathroom floor of that empty apartment -- with Rebecca's champagne glass millimeters from the commode!  Kinda killed the romantic ambiance we were supposed to be looking at, at least for me. 

[elle]

17 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

Also, did Beth imply that Jack died suddenly then during the memory box scene? 

I thought she said *my* father.   Maybe someone can confirm that on rewatch.

[Tikichick]

Just now, elle said:

I thought she said *my* father.   Maybe someone can confirm that on rewatch.

I agree, she was talking about the loss of her father, how it affected her.  That's what the box of memories was about.

[qtpye]

20 minutes ago, zumpie said:

Both younger actresses ARE the case of "you need to diet and exercise more and you'll probably always have to largely watch what you eat". Metz is "morbidly obese and should be under a physician's care" (and I'm not being mean, I'm stating a fact).

Yes, there is a big difference between needing to lose some weight and being morbidly obese.  I mean there is no way Kate will not suffer from extremely tough health problems as she gets into her forties.  I am not very tall and have some weight to lose.  It really reeks havoc on my small frame.  This is not a lifestyle choice, but she probably is a great choice for the surgery, because I do not think diet and exercise alone will get her to a place where she can be healthy (and I mean healthy, not skinny).

[luna1122]

27 minutes ago, zumpie said:

I noticed Kid Kate didn't look all that overweight, either....both of them were about the same as my slightly chubby daughter, who is nowhere and probably never will be the morbidly obese Metz is. Just as this show has financials that make zero sense, so they apparently don't understand "levels of fat" (and haven't for awhile).

Both younger actresses ARE the case of "you need to diet and exercise more and you'll probably always have to largely watch what you eat". Metz is "morbidly obese and should be under a physician's care" (and I'm not being mean, I'm stating a fact).

I frequently feel as if they really need to have an intern do a google search because their ignorance of basic facts is irritating and embarrassing

Plenty of chubby people grow up to be obese tho. So do some skinny folks. I wonder what Metz looked like as a teen?

Beth was definitely talking about her dad when she was showing the girls the memory box, but she mentioned to Randall that neither of them had been prepared for their fathers' deaths.

Edited February 8, 2017 by luna1122

[Tikichick]

58 minutes ago, Biggie B said:

I missed the first 15 minutes of the show, but based on what everyone had commented here, I know the kids were not in elementary school at the time of this episode's flashbacks, that they are 15. Which is why I mentioned that use of the word 'sleepover' seemed a bit off, since that's a word I only used with my kid (now 20) when he was quite young.

I don't think that particular choice of word was out of place.  Could have said, sleeping at friends', sleeping over friends'.  I'd agree play date would be out of place referencing teens, but I'm not so sure shortcutting to sleepover in this case is noteworthy.