S01.E01: Winter

[TimetravellingBW]

Watched the first episode and am (probably unsuccessfully) trying to ration watching the next few.

Initial thoughts:

I figured the Emily/Lorelai conflict would be divisive but I actually found it organic and sympathized with both sides. It’s good the show indicated that they haven't been fighting non-stop since the end of s7 - they treated each other warmly at the funeral initially - but it's more their issues would naturally crop up post-Richard's death. The flashback fight felt totally in character: Lorelai would panic at having to produce a sweet father-daughter story on the spot and Emily would lash out at her in return. (Yes, it shouldn't have been that hard for Lorelai to say something, but she was exhausted, emotional and the fact that she was devastated and apologetic afterwards helped - she knew she screwed up). And one thing I loved about their argument was that both their criticisms of each other were so true: Lorelai does continue to unfairly villainise her parents and Emily is relentlessly critical rather than letting things go. 

On that note it was frustrating that Lorelai was still so self-absorbed and childish (still clinging to her old jeep, refusing to hire a replacement for Sookie, trying to escape the stories at the funeral etc.) But the story genuinely seems to be highlighting those flaws in order to develop her character. As @Eyes High said, Emily gave a run down of every major criticism of Lorelai's character and I loved Lorelai admitting that she doesn’t think about Luke's feelings and overrides him. #LetLorelaiMature2016. Thank god Luke and Lorelai are stable and happy, I actually like the baby-surrogate-pregnancy plot and hope they pursue it. 

On 11/26/2016 at 6:14 AM, amensisterfriend said:

Oh, Rory. I loved you so much for the first few seasons of this series. And I don't think you've grown and changed over the years so much as pitifully regressed, becoming your less likable self and losing a lot of what made me once love you. Sigh. I mean, look, I've been lost personally and professionally a lot too, so I should be able to really relate to Rory's storyline, but she somehow acts like a passive, vaguely petulant victim of her own life rather than a proactive participant, and it really bugs me.

On 11/26/2016 at 0:37 PM, Anela said:

I've just realized that I did the, "That isn't Rory" thing that bugged me so much on re-watch. She just seemed like she needed some stability. I couldn't picture her in a war zone. Maybe I'm projecting, because I love to travel, to a point, but living out of a suitcase is not my thing, and I most related to bookish, stable Rory. :) Although I dropped out of high school, like Lorelai. 

With Rory...ugh, I was so excited about her story but by the end I was basically rooting against her. It's good that the show depicted the difficulties of being a freelance journalist, but I also can't see the eternally organized, dependent on stability, by-the-book Rory coping with such a stressful lifestyle for years. That said, the idea of her becoming a biographer is nice, it seems far more in-character than being a foreign correspondent. (Though I wonder if this book deal will fall through). And Alex Kingston was hilarious and great. 

Like a lot of people, I loathe the Rory/Logan cheating plot on every level. The “Paul is so forgettable!” gag got old fast, and having Rory cheat on him repeatedly for the last two years is horrible. It also destroys throws away all of Logan's development to become a responsible, ready-to-be-married guy in s7 and honestly seems out of character. Yes Logan slept around a lot but he was honest and up front about where he stood, not a liar and cheater. The episode really didn't need Paul, Rory and Logan having a casual "when in Vegas" FWB relationship would be fine without him. And they could have just dropped in a "oh it's such a shame you broke up with that Paul guy last year" to indicate Rory has actually dated since the show ended.

On 11/26/2016 at 6:47 AM, FrumiusManxome said:

Paris was wonderful. Running a surrogacy agency is not something I'd see her doing, but she did mention at the office that she hardly ever meets face to face any more (or something to that effect) so maybe this is like a booming side job. I can dream. I'm very upset she and Doyle are going through a divorce. I thought they were well-suited and I was looking forward to seeing them as a strong power couple in the face of Rory's floundering. I'm crossing my fingers that they end up reconciling since Paris didn't say anything was set in stone. 

The maid family thing was weird. It felt very dated as joke. Like no one in the family speaks English, no other person even with high credentials (the UN translator niece) can figure out the language, and Emily having to make all those gestures to communicate. It felt a little offensive, tbh. Very 2000s to have a bunch of stereotypes altogether like that. And I couldn't tell if I was supposed to find it funny or not. Though to be fair, I didn't really find Emily's revolving door of maids all that amusing.

Paris's surrogacy business seems driven more by plot (Luke/Lorelai/kids) than what fitted her character. I'm also going to assume it's a side job, while she's also running for President or something. Just running a private business seems too limited for Paris Geller. 

I liked Emily "letting" the maid's whole family move in (an interesting reaction to having an empty house) but yeah the whole "speak loudly and gesture because no one recognizes their language" gimmick was ugh. That kind of joke might have been acceptable in early 2000's but not really funny now.

Love that in the 3 seconds Jason spends with Lorelai, he goes from generic “I’m so sorry about your father” to deep, soul-searching “Are you happy?” Yup, sure that's how people who haven't seen each other in 15 years act. I’m assuming that’s all we'll see of Jason and hopefully he’s got a nice life and family off-screen uncluttered by Gilmore drama. 

Edited November 26, 2016 by TimetravellingBW

[AmandaPanda]

3 hours ago, kieyra said:

I'm an original viewer (and fic writer) and I'm really enjoying the revival (on episode 3 now). 

That's where I recognize your screen name from! GG was my first entry into fandom and I spent most of my summer break before my freshman year of high school inhaling L/L fics.

As far as the first episode goes, it was classic ASP writing, which is both good and bad. I'm still not a huge fan of Rory and have no idea how she has been making any money at all. Even freelance writers I know are typically working in a coffee shop or something on the side to pay the bills. Waiting around for her "big break" to come at 32 just struck me as extremely naive, but that's classic Rory.

As usual, my favorite scenes are the ones involving Emily and Lorelei. KB and LG are both just such forces of nature onscreen and their relationship is so complex. 

I can believe that Lorelai hadn't pushed for a discussion with Luke, both out of fear and complacency. The last time they talked about that, it didn't go well. And if everything is going well, why rock the boat? Above all else, Luke wants Lorelai. So, if Lorelai wants a kid, Luke wants a kid. But if she doesn't, then Lorelai is all he needs to be truly happy. I can see where her father's death would get her thinking about children again, though. 

This episode definitely had a lot of Kirk. As long as they scale him back in future episodes, I'll be okay with that. 

I can totally see Paris as a fertility doctor. Cancer research would get frustrating for her after a while because there's no way to win at it, unless you completely cure cancer. Fertility is super competitive. She can fight for the best "breeding" material and pursue the biggest celebrities. Every time a baby is born, she gets to win. 

Was not happy to see Rory with Logan. Granted, I hated all of Rory's boyfriends, so any of them were going to be disappointing to me. I hated Logan most of all, though.

[Diana Berry]

9 hours ago, takalotti said:

Not to be funny, but did you get a new TV in the past 10 years?

Any time I watch a movie or show at someone else'a house who has a different kind of TV than we do* it looks completely different to me. It looks like a cheesy low budget production, very fake, like when you see "behind the scenes" clips and can tell it's on a fake set.

* We still have a DLP, and I think most of our friends/family have LCD, maybe plasma)

Well my tv is pretty old.  As noted it, I'm sure it looks fine on more current  tvs'

[snarktini]

20 hours ago, amensisterfriend said:

I think deep down I was hoping to finally fall for L/L during this revival and love them like nearly everyone else does, but it didn't happen for me, either. There's just this lack of chemistry, joy, and compatibility there, at least for me. I wish so much I didn't see them that way. 

20 hours ago, dirtypop90 said:

What gets me is the fact that they had the chance to fix them! Surely they heard the complaints about their joyless, drama filled relationship in the last seasons (even from some LL fans) and they kept them the same! I don't get it. A four episode revival should have showed the lead couple as stupidly happy! IMO I'm starting to think Amy just isn't a fan of them.

I even like L&L but it feels like the writers do everything they can to suck the joy out of them as a couple. 

I so wanted them to be living their HEA in the revival. After all that angst, you put them together. Can't you let them be happy? While they are showing moments of them being loving and content, there is an undercurrent of them not fully connecting -- the questions about kids, conversations about "more", seemingly on cruise control. Some sort of midlife crisis or marriage itch seems to be lurking. Blech.

If they were real people based on the first few seasons, my take is they'd genuinely be good together. To me there was strong chemistry and compatibility. But, sadly they are fictional. The writers never could seem to resist vacuuming away the happy dust and writing plot obstacles in which an angry Luke and self-sabotaging Lorelei fail to be honest, yet again. I swear the writers either don't like L&L or don't like writing happiness.

[tennisgurl]

Its here! And I can finally watch! And it was...a thing that happened. 

First of all, when did Rory become a terrible garbage person? I mean, I could cut her some slack for her bad life choices (sleeping with a married man, dropping out of school, etc.) because she was still pretty young, but holy crap! Shes older than I am, and she has only gotten worse! The whole "Paul is forgettable joke) was not even a little funny, and it just made everyone, especially Rory, look like assholes. It was kind of like the "Her?" joke on Arrested Development, except her boyfriend never got in on it, and the main characters are supposed to be self centered assholes! And shes cheating too? Its not funny, its just really awkward to watch. Her professional struggles are kind of interesting, but not enough to make her less insufferable. 

Hi there Alex Kinsington! Strange but nice to see you here!

WHY are Luke and Lorelai not married yet? Marriage was such a big part of their story, why did they decide not to ever just get married? And why have they not spoken about having babies? I always loved L/L, and I bought them with a chemistry of a couple thats been together for awhile, but ir feels like its only been a year or two for them not a decade. Its just weird to me. 

Damn, that Emily and Lorelai fight was BRUTAL. I feel like the issues between Emily and Lorelai are a two way street, but I was totally on Emily's side on this one. Lorelia really couldn't have found one nice memory of her dad? That was awful to watch.

Anything involving Richard made me all teary. I loved that they went with that picture of them at the funeral. 

I was happy to see so many of the characters back. Jason! Lane! Zach! Gil! PARIS!!!

[dubbel zout]

3 hours ago, lordonia said:

the New Yorker article*

* Which, by the way, are WAY too long to fit on the back of a menu.

It was a "Talk of the Town" piece, which are in the front of the book and are always short. Rory's piece could have fit on the back of a menu.

[Bumblebee Tights]

So, I've only watched Winter so far, as I'm trying my hardest to hold off on watching the other three until I can watch with a friend of mine. However, I've sort of accidentally spoiled myself on most of the major plotlines..I'm going to hold off on talking about those until I see them in context (and of course I won't talk about them within this thread), but I had some thoughts about this episode that I wanted to get out now.

I'm sort of simultaneously surprised and not surprised about all of the negative reactions I'm seeing. Coming into this, I really didn't have (what I thought of as) any expectations whatsoever, so I felt pretty comfortable that I wouldn't be disappointed. I love this show so much that any kind of 'time spent' in Stars Hollow and with these characters is bound to be enjoyable for me. I wasn't hoping for anything other than getting another piece of these character's lives, and maybe some kind of less open ended finale. The show is comfort food to me.

Only, this episode, while still having some of that comfort foody feeling I was expecting, mostly due to the nostalgia factor, was something else. It was ... unsettling? Or maybe the better word is challenging.  I was challenged by it. It challenged my beliefs about some of these characters, made me think about what they're made of and who they are and why I love them. It also, definitely, definitely, made me feel their mortality, and by extension my own. I think, for me, this is a large part of why there's a kind of darker feel here. So, it wasn't what I wanted. But the thing is...I'm not really upset about it. I enjoyed it just as much as I was expecting to, just in a different kind of way.

I also want to say that I'm kind of enjoying and excited about the Rory storyline. Although I'm her age, I was always a bit more invested in Lorelai, because while I loved Rory, Lorelai was just always the soul and sparkle of the show for me. I think though, that this is totally in line with her character development. I actually feel that because of the revival, Rory's sort of clicking into place as a consistent character for me. I don't mean that in a "she was always a spoiled, entitled brat" way, either. It's more that I always felt as Rory evolved through the seasons, though she did retain certain core personality traits, she sometimes swung from one direction to the other, to the point where she could feel like a very different girl from season to season. I could say a lot more about this, but in short, I can look at Rory in any season and picture her growing up into the woman we see in the revival, and that's really working for me. I know others don't agree, but I just think this is such a realistic portrayal of who someone with Rory's experiences would become.

I really didn't like the Paul gag, but not so much due to how it reflected on Rory..I just couldn't take it that seriously, since we obviously weren't meant to. My problem with it, and to a lesser extent the Paris bit, was the same general problem I had with Bun Heads. Sometimes ASP will dial up the quirk and screwball humor to a level that makes it impossible to suspend disbelief and leaves me rolling my eyes instead of feeling charmed...that's definitely what I got from it.

Smaller things I loved:

-The Chuck Berry Record and Leaves of Grass next to Richard's casket. Killed. Me.

-Rory following Emily around at the funeral as Emily insists 'I'm ok' and Rory responds with 'I know' was beautiful.

-The Luke/Taylor subplot was great. Luke's fake wifi passwords and Taylor's sewage system were totally in character, as was their blustering at eachother in the diner, but Luke's change of heart after Taylor goes on a mini Luke like rant of his own about the wifi was super sweet and also just a little bit melancholy, (since we're seeing them come together in their older age due to their irritation with the younger generation),  like all of my favorite GG moments. 

-Given what they had to work with, I think they're doing a decent job with the absence of Sookie. The explanation for her absence was a lot more plausible than I thought it would be.  It's totally believable that Sookie and Jackson might get overly involved in a food growing project like that. And for me, what saves it is how clearly Lorelai feels her absence and loves her.

Edited November 27, 2016 by Bumblebee Tights

[TimetravellingBW]

22 hours ago, dirtypop90 said:

What gets me is the fact that they had the chance to fix them! Surely they heard the complaints about their joyless, drama filled relationship in the last seasons (even from some LL fans) and they kept them the same! I don't get it. A four episode revival should have showed the lead couple as stupidly happy! IMO I'm starting to think Amy just isn't a fan of them.

I'm a huge L/L fan from the original series and was relieved they were at least together and stable in the revival. But the episode completely lacked romantic moments between them and the chemistry fell pretty flat, I can't see how non-L/L fans would convert from watching that :( 

6 hours ago, SlackerInc said:

I'm puzzled by all this talk about Rory as some kind of failure.  If getting a piece in the New Yorker and being hired to co-write a book with some sort of Oxford bigshot is failure, sign me up to fail!  The TV Line review actually sees it just the opposite from how so many here do: that Rory's success is actually too great to be realistic ("Rory’s zero-to-Susan Orlean career trajectory seems a little suspect to me...")  My take is somewhere in between: I don't think it's unreasonable for the character as presented, having been editor of a very prestigious Ivy League paper, to have the amount of success she has had.  But to expect her success at age 32 to be much greater does seem unreasonable.

4 hours ago, lordonia said:

My problem is that the Palladinos couldn't spare a couple paragraphs of dialog in six hours to explain exactly what Rory has been doing for nine years.

I assume she followed through with political reporting on the Obama campaign, but then what? Did she continue with current events journalism for a certain number of years before abandoning that for freelancing spec articles? If so, I'd expect Lorelai (and Rory herself) to have a thick binder full of clippings, but all we hear about is the New Yorker article* that Luke is super proud of. Which to me indicates there haven't been a lot of others.

Whatever the past nine years have been like professionally, when we meet up with Rory here, she doesn't have a job as a journalist or seem to have many freelance options aside from the ghost writing gig.

On 11/26/2016 at 6:40 AM, starri said:

I guess.  I thought her comment about not wanting to buy her apartment and storing her possessions at various places was at least partly due to money and not just to her lack of direction.

Also, I don't know that I'd see Lorelei Gilmore's daughter being willing to live off family money.  Lorelei would sooner sell a kidney.

She wouldn't get paid for that until she had a contract with a publisher.  And it didn't sound like she and River Song had that yet.

The plot holes in Rory's career are frustrating. Her floating around, writing random articles would be realistic for her first few years out of college. But she's been doing that continuously ever since she left Yale? All they needed to do was mention that she had a few permanent positions at [insert smaller, generic but respectable sounding papers] for a few years, working her way up, but lost jobs due to the cuts in the journalism field. 

Rory must have some kind of extra income - an allowance from Richard and Emily, or Trix's trust fund - to keep her afloat between jobs. Because there's no way she could afford rent or food or anything on her once-in-a-blue-moon freelance articles that fall through half the time. (But her Brooklyn apartment was small and crappy because she's trying to make the money last). While Lorelai would never live off someone's money,  Rory's always been less bothered about depending on her grandparents. So on whether she's successful or not, she's obviously not successful enough to have a steady journalism job but I think she's just someone who has the opportunity to pursue specific, niche pieces and sometimes she get's them. Most people couldn't hang around hoping to get those pieces, they'd have to find a regular source of income and stay put. 

(Ironically that's accurate for how the journalism field is changing. There's been a huge trend in recent years that creative fields like journalism, music, drama, writing or even stuff like politics, are basically impenetrable for young people from low-income backgrounds because of the lack of a steady income and requirements to do internships and jobs for free. So they're dominated by people from wealthy families who have a safety net or extra support). 

Edited November 27, 2016 by TimetravellingBW

[SlackerInc]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

First of all, when did Rory become a terrible garbage person?

Since always.  IMO anyway, and I know I'm not the only one.  Ben Travers of IndieWire was cracking up on the Very Good TV podcast when he heard from his podcast partner that she knew a guy who said something about wanting to date Rory Gilmore.  I was cracking up right with him (this was before seeing any of the Netflix stuff, understand), and sort of snickered in the presence of my wife that "the only positive thing I could see about dating Rory is her basic physical attractiveness, but that's not nearly enough to overcome everything else".  She gave me a withering stare for that one, and it felt like the temperature in the room dropped ten degrees, heh.  (It was worth it, though.)  What's funny is that we can feel so differently about the characters and still both be big fans of the show (although I guess truthfully it's a "four out of five stars" type level for me, and it's her favorite show of all time).

4 hours ago, lordonia said:

My problem is that the Palladinos couldn't spare a couple paragraphs of dialog in six hours to explain exactly what Rory has been doing for nine years.

I assume she followed through with political reporting on the Obama campaign, but then what? Did she continue with current events journalism for a certain number of years before abandoning that for freelancing spec articles? If so, I'd expect Lorelai (and Rory herself) to have a thick binder full of clippings, but all we hear about is the New Yorker article* that Luke is super proud of. Which to me indicates there haven't been a lot of others.

Why can't there be lots of others, but they're just not the New Yorker?  That's what I assumed the deal was: that she has done tons of freelance work for lesser publications.

[cuddlingcrowley]

1 hour ago, Bumblebee Tights said:

I also want to say that I'm kind of enjoying and excited about the Rory storyline. Although I'm her age, I was always a bit more invested in Lorelai, because while I loved Rory, Lorelai was just always the soul and sparkle of the show for me. I think though, that this is totally in line with her character development. I actually feel that because of the revival, Rory's sort of clicking into place as a consistent character for me. I don't mean that in a "she was always a spoiled, entitled brat" way, either. It's more that I always felt as Rory evolved through the seasons, though she did retain certain core personality traits, she sometimes swung from one direction to the other, to the point where she could feel like a very different girl from season to season. I could say a lot more about this, but in short, I can look at Rory in any season and picture her growing up into the woman we see in the revival, and that's really working for me. I know others don't agree, but I just think this is such a realistic portrayal of who someone with Rory's experiences would become.

YES!!! Someone who feels like me!!

I'm under the opinion ASP lost "Rory" somewhere in S5 and the character just continued to drift farther and farther into some generic, bland barbie. I see next to nothing of S1-S3 Rory in S6-S7 Rory. In the revival, on the other hand, I finally feel like I'm seeing her as a fleshed out character. She seems to much more tangible and present and stronger.

When I see her travelling to London, NY, etc. and gushing about being rootless I think back to the girl whose childhood bedroom to this days is full of travel posters and who told Richard she wanted to go to Fez, see something, do something!

Spoiler

We also see her falling in the pattern of taking what doesn't belong to her (*cough*), when she feels unsteady and because the boy was HERS first! Her cockiness which led her to not do her homework and ruin her chances with Sandradee mirrors her turning down a great job opportunity in S7 because it wasn't her dream job. And of course, Rory rising to save the Stars Hollow Gazette from death without any hope of personal gain is quintessential Rory, the "town princess". I could go on and on and on.

I think ASP was VERY smart in how she wrote Rory as a 32 year old. Her former brand of generic perfection was NEVER gonna fly with today's audience. Flawed, interesting, sometimes unlikable women are what people want to see.  Just check "Unreal". I don't think I've ever liked Rory more.

Edited November 27, 2016 by cuddlingcrowley

[txhorns79]

Quote

I liked Emily "letting" the maid's whole family move in (an interesting reaction to having an empty house) but yeah the whole "speak loudly and gesture because no one recognizes their language" gimmick was ugh. That kind of joke might have been acceptable in early 2000's but not really funny now.

I think the joke was one note, and got old since they kept returning to it, but the joke in and of itself worked just fine.

I'm mixed on the Emily/Lorelai fight.  I can understand Lorelai feeling like she was being put on the spot, and didn't know what to say, since her relationship with her father was hit and miss and she was dealing with her own grieving.  Having said that, it was pretty surprising that Lorelai couldn't come up with anything beyond what she said.  Emily definitely overreacted, but I got why she was so offended and unhappy with Lorelai.      

[tennisgurl]

Now thats I've thought about it, Lorelai really has a bad habit of making a big Lorelai scene at most personal events. There was her drunk wedding toast at Lane and Zach`s wedding, her and Rory's fight in the middle of Sookies kids baptism, her melt down over Rory using Yale as a back up school at Thanksgiving, and I`m sure there are more I`m forgetting. One time you use a friend or relatives event as a platform to announce your issues in public and make everything about you? Might be a lapse in judgement. More than once? The problem might be you. 

[Last Time Lord]

My biggest complaint is we didn't get a new opening title sequence. 

[rags]

Probably no one cares but in the end credits was, Alex Borstein as Drella. Did I miss her? I checked the end credits twice and there it is.

I would have loved Drella to make a cameo. Or Amy should have had Alex play Sookie. Just for the hell of it.

[starri]

12 hours ago, TimetravellingBW said:

And one thing I loved about their argument was that both their criticisms of each other were so true: Lorelai does continue to unfairly villainise her parents and Emily is relentlessly critical rather than letting things go. 

Lorelai is almost 50 years old.  At a certain point, actual mature human adults acknowledge the ways in which their parents failed them and move on.  But Lorelai is still a rebellious teenager and holding on to every slight and willing to throw it in Emily's face at every opportunity.  Because Emily committed the crime of disapproving of the choices she'd made with her life but supporting her anyway.

Some of Emily's comments were out of line, like her putting down Stars Hollow (although I kind of agreed with that).  But other than that, all she did was point out, accurately if angrily, all of Lorelai's bad qualities.

Because Lorelai did exactly what Emily was accusing her of:  making everything about Richard's death about herself.  Even Rory pulled her head out of her ass long enough to see how shell-shocked Emily was.

[David Selig]

I was pretty disappointed overall. Mostly by how weak the dialogue was. Too many jokes didn't work for me, and the few that worked were often repeated way too much. I also didn't like how dim Luke was throughout the episode.

Lorelai is still quite immature, which isn't a surprise, but even by her standards she was pretty terrible here. She had sufficient time to come up with a nice story about Richard. Yes, their relationship was strained, and he was too busy throughout her childhood, but it's not like they never had nice moments together.

Frankly, I couldn't care less about Rory's love life so it was a bit of a relief it didn't get much attention so far. She is still selfish, irresponsible and spoiled just like she was in the latter seasons and yet everyone is treating her like a princess so nothing new there.

[Mumbles]

Quote

At first I was surprised at Paris' line of profession but then I realized it was the closest she can come to playing god.

This is the best explanation I've read of this weird storyline. Paris was always driven and tough, but casual reference to selecting "breeders" and casually callous references to the appearance and socioeconomic status of the surrogates just didn't sit well with me and seemed very cruel, even for Paris at her worst.

 

19 hours ago, lordonia said:

problem is that the Palladinos couldn't spare a couple paragraphs of dialog in six hours to explain exactly what Rory has been doing for nine years.

Yeah I get that the first scene was meant to be very meta, but it had the feel as if mom and daughter hadn't seen each other in years, which didn't jibe with Rory living like two hours away.

i have nothing original to say about the fight, just wanted to say that I thought Lorelei was out of order, all she had to do was say she wanted to take a pass. 

[jjj]

On ‎11‎/‎26‎/‎2016 at 7:53 AM, Lady Calypso said:

I gotta admit that I had to close caption Michel's dialogue because I couldn't quite understand what he was saying on the first try. And I just kept CC on the entire time. 

Well, you sound just like Mia in "The Ins and Outs of Inns"!  "You've been in the U.S. quite some time Michel, your enunciation really should be better by now.  Did you get the tapes I sent you?"

Have not read all the comments here yet, but I loved the return to Stars Hollow.  And I am someone who has never watched a rerun of any episode from Season 7, although I have seen most of the other seasons' episodes so, so many times.  I was completely unspoiled, so seeing Jason pop up at the funeral reception was one of my favorite moments -- and also called back his complete discomfort with the funeral for Richard's mother, because he was standing in a similar spot in the Gilmore hours when he told Lorelai how much he could not stand funerals.  I was always a Jason/Lorelai shipper -- he was the boyfriend who made her intelligence shine.  (ETA:  I see one or two of us preferred Max, and he was intelligent, but in a "let me teach you what paternalism is" kind of way.  Jason was much more playful, and his parries matched Lorelai's.) 

I did not see Drella, but maybe she was somewhere in an inn scene?  And hardly anyone has mentioned the thinness of Miss Patty!  She had already lost a lot of weight in Season 7, but without her voice, I would not have recognized her. 

Also, I think Paris had a throwaway joke about Brad Pitt during the office visit -- and that certainly was written/filmed before the current news about him. 

Edited November 27, 2016 by jjj

[ZuluQueenOfDwarves]

Alex Borstein played Miss Celine. 

[Eeksquire]

I rematched (most of) the first episode today and hands down my favorite line of the episode was Lorelai handing Emily a scotch during the Kondo-ing: "Taste it. See if it brings you joy."  

[Spartan Girl]

Emily calling out Lorelai for her immature, selfish behavior was something she had coming to her for a very long time. Especially loved the one line about how she runs to all the townies so they can coddle her and vilify her parents (or anyone else that doesn't give her what she wants). 

Man. If only someone had made that kind of speech in season 6 or 7...

[jjj]

7 hours ago, ZuluQueenOfDwarves said:

Alex Borstein played Miss Celine. 

No, the credits say she was Drella in this episode.  But I did not see her.  (She played both roles in the original series.) 

[Primetimer]

A funeral provides an occasion for some tears, some laughs, and a whole lot of realness.

View the full article

[dmc]

19 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

Emily calling out Lorelai for her immature, selfish behavior was something she had coming to her for a very long time. Especially loved the one line about how she runs to all the townies so they can coddle her and vilify her parents (or anyone else that doesn't give her what she wants). 

Man. If only someone had made that kind of speech in season 6 or 7...

I have been waiting for Emily to do this for years.

 

On 11/27/2016 at 8:15 AM, David Selig said:

I was pretty disappointed overall. Mostly by how weak the dialogue was. Too many jokes didn't work for me, and the few that worked were often repeated way too much. I also didn't like how dim Luke was throughout the episode.

Lorelai is still quite immature, which isn't a surprise, but even by her standards she was pretty terrible here. She had sufficient time to come up with a nice story about Richard. Yes, their relationship was strained, and he was too busy throughout her childhood, but it's not like they never had nice moments together.

Frankly, I couldn't care less about Rory's love life so it was a bit of a relief it didn't get much attention so far. She is still selfish, irresponsible and spoiled just like she was in the latter seasons and yet everyone is treating her like a princess so nothing new there.

Thank you. Can we please stop with the princess Rory?

[teddysmom]

I tried to watch the first episode three times and couldn't get thru 15 minutes total. I used to love GG. I had a rather cantankerous relationship with my own mother, and could relate to Lorelei & Emily's situation.

When it premiered it was new and different, but now it just seems ridiculous.

[Guest]

I had so many thoughts about this episode and I don't remember any of them besides "Rory tap dancing her stress away? she would never."

[Louise]

I've only watched the first episode and a half because it was bumming me out. The highlights were the Emily/Lorelei fight (I'm 100% with Emily on that fight) and Paris. Paris was a delight.

[teddysmom]

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I had so many thoughts about this episode and I don't remember any of them besides "Rory tap dancing her stress away? she would never."

Any reason why Rory couldn't tap dance her stress away in her room? Other than there wouldn't be an excuse for Lorelai to get up and make fun of her and drink coffee? 

Oh plot devices, you're SOOO obvious. 

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I've only watched the first episode and a half because it was bumming me out. The highlights were the Emily/Lorelei fight (I'm 100% with Emily on that fight) and Paris. Paris was a delight.

It doesn't help that a lot of reviews are saying things like "Good Lord, Lorelai and Rory are really terrible people". 

[takalotti]

32 minutes ago, teddysmom said:

Any reason why Rory couldn't tap dance her stress away in her room? Other than there wouldn't be an excuse for Lorelai to get up and make fun of her and drink coffee? 

Oh plot devices, you're SOOO obvious. 

I think you forgot about Paul ???

(NOT laughing at you! Just the running gag coming to life.)

 

I've only watched Winter so far and wish to remain spoiler free on the other episodes. Does anyone know if the "Episode 1 Full Spoilers - Do Not Enter If You Don't Want to Be Spoiled!" thread ONLY has spoilers for Winter?

Edited November 28, 2016 by takalotti

[teddysmom]

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think you forgot about Paul ???

OMG.   That made me so angry.  

So, has it been ten years in Stars Hollow time since the show ended?  Rory has been in NYC being a journalist for ten years? 

[takalotti]

I meant, I think Paul was staying in her room, so that's why she didn't tap dance in her bedroom. 

Except that I just noticed her door was open while she tapped. So I'm guessing she left her room out of consideration for Paul, but forgot about him again by the time she set her stuff down which is why she didn't go back to close her door.

Edited November 28, 2016 by takalotti

[kittykat]

  57 minutes ago, teddysmom said:

Any reason why Rory couldn't tap dance her stress away in her room? Other than there wouldn't be an excuse for Lorelai to get up and make fun of her and drink coffee? 

Oh plot devices, you're SOOO obvious. 

I think you forgot about Paul ???

(NOT laughing at you! Just the running gag coming to life.)

 

I've only watched Winter so far and wish to remain spoiler free on the other episodes. Does anyone know if the "Episode 1 Full Spoilers - Do Not Enter If You Don't Want to Be Spoiled!" thread ONLY has spoilers for Winter?

There was an issue a couple days ago with posters spoiling plot points from Spring and Summer without tags, but I'm pretty sure the mods deleted those. Every episode has its own thread so you should be safe.

[tarotx]

7 minutes ago, teddysmom said:

OMG.   That made me so angry.  

So, has it been ten years in Stars Hollow time since the show ended?  Rory has been in NYC being a journalist for ten years? 

 

Well she was on the press bus traveling "with" Obama for a year and was probably writing political website stuff maybe through his first 100 days or longer. They really could have had her still there for years and grew disillusioned and that is why she was the way she was with her career now.  I so wanted them to mention she already worked for an online magazine, had issues and that is why she was being snobby with the new startup.  I so wish they didn't ignore season 7. 

[teddysmom]

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I meant, I think Paul was staying in her room, so that's why she didn't tap dance in her bedroom. 

OH!!    He IS easy to forget! ;)

And I was just laughing about Paul, gofugyourself.com Jessica  referred to that story line as a rip off of Ann Veal on Arrested Development.

"Her?" 

Edited November 28, 2016 by teddysmom

[ichbin]

On 11/26/2016 at 6:34 PM, TimetravellingBW said:

 

Love that in the 3 seconds Jason spends with Lorelai, he goes from generic “I’m so sorry about your father” to deep, soul-searching “Are you happy?” Yup, sure that's how people who haven't seen each other in 15 years act. I’m assuming that’s all we'll see of Jason and hopefully he’s got a nice life and family off-screen uncluttered by Gilmore drama. 

If anyone was going to go deep shouldn't it have been Lorelai!  Jason was the one royally screwed over by the Gilmores.  In real life I doubt someone in his position bother to show up at the funeral of the  guy who stabbed him in the back for any reason other than to dance on his grave..  I liked Digger, but wish they could have brought him on for moment under other circumstances.  Just adding that to the rest of the WTF moments.

[Mumbles]

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When it premiered it was new and different, but now it just seems ridiculous.

There is a moment in a later installation -don't worry, I will not spoil it - where I realized that this show hasn't aged well. Or, we've changed as a society (mostly for the better, I hope). I think we have all become more aware of privilege and boy, do these two have it in spades. During the 2012 election, Ann Romney talked about how when she and Mitt where students they would eat mac and cheese etc - all the while ignoring that they also had a trust fund to fall on if they needed. The same goes with the Gilmores. And as privilege and income inequality etc have grown as issues in the past few years, I look at a lot of what happened on this show differently than in the mid-2000s. And all the stuff with Emily and her house servants - it just feels and sounds icky to me now. I know Emily isn't the most enlightened person, but still.

When this show was on originally, I liked it as a show that made protagonists out of a smart, bookish, introverted teenage girl and an independent mom.  So there's that.  And even in the eps when men/boy issues were involved, the show passed the Bechdel test in spades. That smart girl has grown up to be a sort of entitled brat. Not cool.

[dubbel zout]

8 minutes ago, ichbin said:

In real life I doubt someone in his position bother to show up at the funeral of the guy who stabbed him in the back for any reason other than to dance on his grave.

I could see him coming back out of respect for Emily and Lorelei. Plus, it's been quite a while since the business stuff with Richard happened. Jason seemed in a good place, so why not put the bad feelings aside? 

But I love Chris Eigemann, so I'm always glad to see him.

[Melancholy]

I strongly believe Digger was raiding clients and maybe checking to see if Lorelai was still hot and single. Hence the weird "are you happy?" stuff. Jason overcame his distaste for E/R and distaste for funerals out of pure self interest. I don't really have a problem with either. I love Richard but he really fucked Jason over. 

[txhorns79]

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Especially loved the one line about how she runs to all the townies so they can coddle her and vilify her parents (or anyone else that doesn't give her what she wants). 

I thought Emily should have allowed Lorelai some leeway due to her grief, but the line worked so well because it was true.  This is the woman who casually compared her mother with "Pol Pot" in an interview regarding the Dragonfly.  Her life is constructed around the idea that she is a victim of her parents.      

[SlovakPrincess]

Things I liked:

- The Michel scene was gold.  "Why are you not on Xanax?  It was invented for you."  "Abalone! Yay!"  

- I never enjoyed either Kirk or Taylor during the series' regular run ... but I really got a kick out of Kirk's terrible ride service.   And I actually felt for Taylor when he let his guard down for the first time, crestfallen that the Stars Hollow community didn't care enough to talk to each other rather than staring at their devices, or band together to get sewer lines.  I've literally never liked Taylor, and I wanted to comfort him in that scene!!  I loved that Luke felt bad and agreed to give Taylor a testimonial ... and how happy it made Taylor.  

- I actually get Lorelai's screw up after the funeral, though I wish she'd just blurted out "I'm too emotional, please skip me."  But the poor woman wakes up from being pass-out drunk, to her father's friends telling off-color, "funny" stories about her Dad.  She panics, goes for the same kind of awful "humor" even though it's not appropriate from Richard's daughter ... and then immediately feels remorse.  The fight between Emily and Lorelai was painful but very real.

- I liked the surrogacy clinic stuff only because Lorelai obviously took Emily's criticism to heart - like, "maybe I am selfish toward Luke and cheating him out of something!"  She ends up driving Luke nuts with it, but it was done out of a genuine concern that she had been thoughtless toward Luke and wanted to fix it.    

- I loved the giant Richard portrait, and liked the handling of Emily's grief.  I thought it was well done, and very Emily.

- Luke messing with everyone about the WiFi password tickled me. 

  

Things I didn't think worked:

- Most things Rory, although perhaps they are building up to her confessing that she doesn't enjoy living like a nomad, or the financial uncertainty of her writer's life ... but feels she's committed to this career that she always said she wanted.  But imposing on everyone by having them store her stuff, having casual flings with Logan, and being thoughtless toward Paul seemed out of character for Rory.  The Paul thing could have been funny, if Rory actually cut the poor guy loose at the end of the episode, but now she's just being rude. 

- Liza Weil killed it in her scenes, though I'm not sure I see Paris loving this career in the long run ... unless she's also researching cutting edge ways to increase fertility or something, I feel like she'd end up getting bored and tired of sweet-talking couples.  She was never supposed to be a "people person."  I always thought she'd end up as a brilliant doctor ... with a terrible bedside manner. 

- Why was Lorelai such an asshole to poor Roy Choi?  That was uncalled for!

[Kohola3]

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Plus, it's been quite a while since the business stuff with Richard happened. Jason seemed in a good place, so why not put the bad feelings aside? 

The whole thing was just a lame chance for ASP brag about pulling in a scad of alumni for cameo appearances.  Having him there was pointless - think back 15 years to a business acquaintance with whom you didn't get along and pretend their family hated you.  Would you go to the funeral. I sure as heck wouldn't.

[jhlipton]

On 11/25/2016 at 9:26 AM, ghoulina said:

I felt a lot of the acting was "off" at the start of this. Blidel was the most noticeable, but most of them seemed a bit rusty, to me.

At first it was like "We're putting on a play about Grover's Corners Stars Hollow -- here are your parts."  A little stiff at the start.  It did get going though.

On 11/25/2016 at 10:43 AM, starri said:

I have a hard time seeing Liza Weil as anything other Bonnie Winterbottom these days.  Which is quite an accomplishment, because all I saw was Paris when HTGAWM started.

I was afraid that might my reaction, since Weil does an awesome job as Bonnie.  But as soon as she spoke, she was Paris.  She's one of those rare actors/actresses who make you believe any role they play.

On 11/25/2016 at 11:26 AM, starri said:

This is the first actual acknowledgment we've had that Michel is gay, right?

I thought right from the start they said he was gay.

[Kohola3]

Nope, Michel was never identified as gay in the original recipe.

[jjj]

5 minutes ago, Kohola3 said:

Nope, Michel was never identified as gay in the original recipe.

No, he talked several times about "the ladies" and how he was like catnip to them.  But this coming out was no surprise!

8 minutes ago, jhlipton said:

I thought right from the start they said he was gay.

[SlovakPrincess]

Still trying to figure out why the Rory stuff felt so off to me ... maybe it was just the Logan scenes (something about the dialogue and their "Las Vegas arrangement" seemed kind of trite and Lifetime movie to me, I guess), and the fact that Alex Kingston (who is great!) kind of took up all the air in the Naomi scene.  

Where I felt Rory shined through as a real person:

- The tap-dancing scene.  Rory admitted she had anxiety and insomnia sometimes, and had come up with a creative, even enjoyable way to cope with it.  Seemed like the optimistic, problem-solver Rory of yore.  

- Alexis Bledel does a nice little thing with her eyes when she reassures Lorelai that articles get bumped sometimes, no big deal ... but Rory is clearly sad and maybe fearful about the article falling through, as she looks down.  

- Her concern for her grandmother during Richard's funeral, as she follows Emily around until Emily calls her on it.

[dubbel zout]

2 hours ago, Kohola3 said:

think back 15 years to a business acquaintance with whom you didn't get along and pretend their family hated you

Jason wasn't just a business acquaintance: The families have known each other for years. Lorelei and Jason met at camp, hence the "Umlauts."

[Sweet Tee]

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And I was just laughing about Paul, gofugyourself.com Jessica  referred to that story line as a rip off of Ann Veal on Arrested Development.

"Her?" 

 

It is.  But that was actually funny.  1) The Bluths are supposed to be horrible people.  2) Her boyfriend didn't forget about her and thought she was great.  3) Ann actually became a character, not just a joke.

[JayInChicago]

Yeah, it's kind of sad that Ann Veal aka egg aka Her had a much better arc (? Sort of) in AD than Paul aka who? Oh. Not the dog. 

I'm so out of it someone had to point out Mae Whitman was Ann Veal and also played Lauren Graham'a daughter in Parenthood. Right?

[Kohola3]

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

Jason wasn't just a business acquaintance: The families have known each other for years. Lorelei and Jason met at camp, hence the "Umlauts."

True but their last connection was extremely unpleasant.  Richard screwed him royally and probably kept him from getting a job anywhere in the eastern half of the US.  Lorelai chose her family over Jason.  Emily never liked him at all.  Not exactly a reason to pay his respects unless it was to dance on Richard's grave.

[starri]

9 minutes ago, Kohola3 said:

True but their last connection was extremely unpleasant.  Richard screwed him royally and probably kept him from getting a job anywhere in the eastern half of the US.  Lorelai chose her family over Jason.  Emily never liked him at all.  Not exactly a reason to pay his respects unless it was to dance on Richard's grave.

We don't know what happened between that and Richard's death.  And is it impossible that he might not have gone out of respect for Richard or to support Emily, but to be there, even in a small way, for Lorelai?