Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[galax-arena]

He certainly presented a youthful potato face.  He's like a walking spud that's been dipped in oil.  Although now I think of him more as pervert potato face.

Also, I don't exactly think of "vibrant" when someone mentions Josh Duggar. He's just so.... blah. Like, I know he had/has all these grand political ambitions, but whenever I see him, his on-screen presence is about as lively and vibrant as a sloth's. I said ages ago on this thread that in the very earliest documentaries, I thought that Josh Duggar was cute in a very squeaky clean throwback-to-the-1950s sort of way. Back then, he had a small degree of charm/presence as well. (Although in retrospect, it makes me shudder because those earliest documentaries were filmed only a couple of years at the most after the molestation, right?) But it's like when his looks eroded as he got older, so did any modicum of charm that he might have possessed. I rewatched the ep where he gets engaged to Anna - because I hate myself - and it made me laugh when Michelle was talking him up, saying how he was called the little governor (or whatever it was) and how charismatic he was and meanwhile there's this freeze frame of Josh just looking like a dork while waiting to call Pa Keller. And then in the actual engagement scene, Josh comes across as energetic and bubbly as a snail doing a 5k. 

 

Someone like Heritage's Ryan T. Anderson - to pick another rightwing anti-gay talking head - comes across as a lot more vibrant and lively than Josh. Obviously Josh had his celebrity going for him, but it makes me wonder if the FRC could have picked some other celebrity religious conservative as their spokesperson. I suppose their pickings were slim if they wanted someone who could appeal to a particular religious subculture. 

[Isthisok]

I want to hear Jim Bob actually speak the words "penile penetration." I don't think he will be able to get the words out, lol. But he has to say it in to in order to draw the necessary distinction between what Josh did and "actual" incest. Because if he can't, by Jim Bob's own edict, Josh deserves to DIE. I can't think of a euphemism he could use ... "penile penetration" is already pretty euphemism-y itself. I am guessing he will come up with one, though.

Whatever he comes up with to say, I am picturing Jim Bob clamping his hands over Michelle's ears as he says it. She is too delicate to hear even veiled references to anything so vulgar, lol. Although with 19 kids (and she delivered every one!), I would guess she is pretty much an expert on the subject.

The scene from 'Now and Then' where Chrissy's mom tells her that a woman has a special flower and a man has a watering can comes to mind. Planting the seed and watering the flower!

"Josh never watered the seeds of the flowers. He's not a gardener. He did not garden with any of the girls."

[Darknight]

really? I read the article and didn't think it was particularly revealing and mostly innuendo. What I want to know is this. Why is it the public's business? If this had happened in my family, with a minor as the perp, it would be the business of my family and nobody would be owed any explanations.

Because they're on tv. I hate when public figures what it both ways. You can't be on tv make money get fame when it's convenient for you. Then say o I want privacy when things get bad. If you want privacy stay off tv. Michelle and JB lost their rights to privacy as soon as they allowed their family to be pimped out. And when it comes to abuse it's everyone's business. Abuse is nothing to not take seriously.

It was brought up about how JB probably defines incest as "penile penetration" & therefore Josh did not commit incest. To protect Mechelle's delicate ears he could phrase it as "Josh did not have sexual intercourse" or that "he touched them through their clothes" which implies no penile penetration.

If they say this, (which I hope they do because it makes them look like idiots) It makes them looks guilty of covering up abuse. Which will angry people more.

[Darknight]

There is an interesting web site -- sasian.org -- which stands for Sibling Abuse Survivors' Information and Advocacy Network. The focus of the site is specifically on issues of sibling abuse. One page of the web site is especially interesting -- Sibling Sexual Abuse -- A Parents Guide.

This page discusses such issues as what is sibling sexual abuse vs. normal sexual curiosity, what are the effects of sibling sexual abuse, and what factors contribute to sibling sexual abuse, among other topics. Many of these are things that have been discussed on this board.

One section I found especially interesting in light of this discussion of the Duggars is the section entitled, "How can I best prevent sibling abuse in my family?" Here's what they advise:

"How can I best prevent sibling sexual abuse in my family?

. The best way to prevent sibling sexual abuse is to pay attention to your children

. Set aside a time each day when your children have a chance to tell you about what they’ve done or felt that day. This might be after school or before bed-time.

. Ensure that children are well looked after by babysitters, whether the sitter is a family member or not. At breakfast you can ask your children specific questions about the previous evening; for example, did they watch their favourite TV program? did they play video games? did they cooperate with the sitter? was the sitter kind? would they like to have the same sitter again?

. Be willing to talk about sexuality. Informal sex education could include watching educational videos and reading books with your children. Try to find library materials on sex education that are appropriate to the age of your child.

. Encourage your children’s school to present sexual abuse prevention films and programs. Most of them do, but it doesn’t hurt to ask. The programs usually carry the message, “If someone is making you do something that doesn’t feel good, tell a trusted adult.”

. Find out where your children are playing, and who they’re playing with. Be especially concerned if they’re playing with children who are focused on sexual games.

. Teach your children that they own their bodies and everyone should respect that.

. Monitor television violence. Movies and television programs that link sex and violence carry a dangerous message to children.

Research shows these messages have a strong negative effect on children.

. Encourage non-sexist attitudes and behaviour. For example: give power, responsibility and privileges equally to male and female siblings; assign household tasks fairly, and discourage sexist jokes and sexist put-downs.

. Believe them. Children rarely invent stories of sexual abuse to get a brother or sister into trouble."

The Duggars' belief system and their focus on ridiculously large families fails the children on many of these dimensions.

All shit JimChelle didn't do and still doesn't do

[silverspoons]

You would be surprised at how many people spend years getting an education and go and work for political or religious organizations many times for low wages. Living in Utah it doesn't even shock me anymore. I know many employees of the LDS church that think it is an honor to work for their church but get paid far under their value(jobs like LCSW's, certified teachers, &  CPA's ) and must remain a temple recommend holder to keep their job(so the church gets back 10% of the low salary as well).

 

The latest People magazine article made me a bit ill. The Cross church pastor (the article says he is the Duggar pastor but I think he is Jill's pastor? unless the church of Jim Bob has been dis-banned) of course preaches forgiveness for Josh but somehow adds in Bruce Jenner is the sinner. I'm hoping somehow he was misquoted because a sermon on forgiving Josh and sins should not include Bruce Jenner being needing forgiveness for changing his gender? I'm no Kardashian fan but I have watched the last 3 specials with Bruce and his family talking about his transition and I felt it was from the heart and honest, two things I can't say about the Duggars right now.

[altopower]

 

And because I am prone to chase rabbits, I also googled Tony Perkins. [a blond confession: I thought Tony Perkins had very dark hair, a skinny face, plastic hair, REALLY big teeth, and did infomercials about getting wealthy. NOT the same guy.]

Happyfatchick, I think that's Tony Robbins, performance coach and motivational speaker. I think he looks creepy. https://www.tonyrobbins.com/biography/

[GEML]

But the thing is, someone with a PhD can't go into most of these Fundy subcultures and get them to vote Republican or raise money from within them. They don't value education, remember? That person's language won't be the same. I speak pretty fluent Fundyese (and evangelicalese) but I also have been far too exposed to other Americsn dialects that I'm now suspect.

Josh was hired because he's one of them and speaks their language.

[Skittl1321]

I have to ask, if all the girls was asleep, how would josh have access to a girl that wasn't a family member?

 There was a definite pattern of escalation mentioned in the police report (though I could not read the whole thing.)  At least one episode was described while a child was sitting on his lap having a book read to her.

 

I have no idea how he had access to a girl who wasn't a family member (nor will I speculate who that was), but the girls were not all asleep.

[Emme]

Tony Kornheiser of Pardon The Interruption on ESPN was grossly misinformed when he defended Josh to keep his job.

Why would TK and the producers of a sports show want to align themselves with a incestous monster?

Shame on ESPN.

Google Kornheiser defends Duggar.

Last Friday's PTI show.

Tony Kornheiser has always been an asshole.

[yogi2014L]

Not with people who are the darlings of the Religious Right.    She holds back plenty, because she's pretty much a stooge. 

While I would have preferred Dr Phil after his magic with Kim Richards, I think this might be ok

She doesn't seem like she would forget about the victims here and might advocate for them. 

 

. I don't really for see a soft interview coming. How would she, as a reporter, justify handling child abusers with kid gloves? Also, as a woman, I would hope that Meghan Kelley would take the chance to challenge their BS patriarchy women should only be barefoot and pregnant ideology. Anyone with a brain knows thats harmful for women.  

 

I truly hope she proves me right!! We all need to remember that while it is FOX NEWS they are still dealing with child molestation and everyone hates child molesters

[Aja]

 

But it's like when his looks eroded as he got older, so did any modicum of charm that he might have possessed.

He also gained seven hundred pounds.

 

But yeah, Josh Duggar's "charm" has always come across as painstakingly rehearsed. Every single line he has ever said on that show sounds like he practiced it all day and they probably had to do ten or twelve takes before it came across as genuine enough.

[CherryAmes]

How would she, as a reporter, justify handling child abusers with kid gloves? Also, as a woman, I would hope that Meghan Kelley would take the chance to challenge their BS patriarchy women should only be barefoot and pregnant ideology. Anyone with a brain knows thats harmful for women.

 

The Duggars aren't child abusers and I don't see this reporter treating them as if they are anything other than parents who may have made some bad choices but the choices were choices many other parents would have made.  They have a son who molested children.  They covered it up and now they are dealing with the fallout from that.  But I think the reporter is going to let them go down the road of "we did our best" and "it all worked out so why are the mean liberals picking on us now".

[KittyS]

To me, Josh has always strutted around like he's the chosen one. I'd feel somewhat sorry for him if he had ever exhibited even a modicum of humility, but the fact that he's so freakin' smug all the time makes me wonder if he realizes how incredibly easy he got off from his " mistakes."

[Bella]

We have a new thread for speculating about the upcoming Megyn Kelly interview and special on Fox News.

 

Please take further discussion of these activities to that thread.

 

Thanks!

[Skittl1321]

 

The Duggars aren't child abusers

Well, your opinion differs from mine.

I personally think hitting a child with a rod borders on (if not crosses into) child abuse.

I think the they have without a doubt emotionally abused their children.

[CherryAmes]

I should have said with regard to the specific situation with Josh the parents are not the ones under fire for being abusers and since they are the ones being interviewed I can't see the reporter playing hardball with them.

[hendersonrocks]

Tony Kornheiser of Pardon The Interruption on ESPN was grossly misinformed when he defended Josh to keep his job.

Why would TK and the producers of a sports show want to align themselves with a incestous monster?

Shame on ESPN.

Google Kornheiser defends Duggar.

Last Friday's PTI show.

 

Tiny nitpick: Kornheiser didn't say any of this on PTI (which I watch every day)--he did on his ESPN radio show. I would have positively leapt off my couch if I'd heard him defend Josh on PTI, and now I'm $&*#)@! pissed that he did on his radio show. Gross. GROSS. I cannot fathom why he would even go there--especially after the trouble he got in by commenting on Hannah Storm's clothing (also on his radio show).

 

Stick to sports, Tony.

Edited June 1, 2015 by hendersonrocks

[Bella]

Tiny nitpick: Kornheiser didn't say any of this on PTI (which I watch every day)--he did on his ESPN radio show. I would have positively leapt off my couch if I'd heard him defend Josh on PTI, and now I'm $&*#)@! pissed that he did on his radio show. Gross. GROSS. I cannot fathom why he would even go there--especially after the trouble he got in by commenting on Hannah Storm's clothing (also on his radio show).

 

Stick to sports, Tony.

 

I think I said once before that I had a long phone conversation with him a number of years ago, and he lacks both common sense and social skills. The fact that he's made a ton of money despite that just puts him in the company of people like Jim Bob.

[TomServo]

I have to ask, if all the girls was asleep, how would josh have access to a girl that wasn't a family member?

 

While we can't speculate here about the girl's specific identity, I can tell you that if you go read the police report that In Touch published, it contains a police interview of the victim and gives the circumstances of his having had access to her.

[Zung Li]

According to the legal expert quoted in the In Touch magazine article Jim Bob could still be charged with child endangering by failing to properly report the molestation (one count per child) and could also be sued in civil court, so this is not just about "keeping something private". My husband is a police sergeant. How many times do you think he has gone to a house for domestic violence and was told at the door, "this is a private matter"? Do you think he just walks away because the person doesn't want to let him in? If he did that he would not only be fired but would open himself and the police department up to civil lawsuits.

[wanderwoman]

The Duggars aren't child abusers and I don't see this reporter treating them as if they are anything other than parents who may have made some bad choices but the choices were choices many other parents would have made.  They have a son who molested children.  They covered it up and now they are dealing with the fallout from that.  But I think the reporter is going to let them go down the road of "we did our best" and "it all worked out so why are the mean liberals picking on us now".

Abuse comes in many forms, including neglect and failure to protect. It was, in my opinion, emotionally abusive to require a five-to-seven year old child to offer hugs and forgiveness to the person who abused her under the false notion that God would only find her worthy she did. I think their parenting is bordering on neglect. You simply can't schedule a child's needs for emotional support or farm it out to a buddy.

According to the legal expert quoted in the In Touch magazine article Jim Bob could still be charged with child endangering by failing to properly report the molestation (one count per child) and could also be sued in civil court, so this is not just about "keeping something private". My husband is a police sergeant. How many times do you think he has gone to a house for domestic violence and was told at the door, "this is a private matter"? Do you think he just walks away because the person doesn't want to let him in? If he did that he would not only be fired but would open himself and the police department up to civil lawsuits.

My husband has been making the same assessment. As he said, "Any officer of the law who deems molestation a "private family matter" would be publicly flogged." He made the same comment about people who pull the "we can handle this privately" card.

[CherryAmes]

It would be nice if the woman doing the interview looked at things the way most of us posting here do but I don't see that happening - and if they have never been called out as being abusive by their right wing media friends before I don't see it happening now.  I can see them taking the approach that the parents may not have handled things perfectly but then many parents wouldn't have, not just the Duggars.  I may be wrong but the message I am seeing here is that they're going to focus on redemption and forgiveness and incidentally how mean everyone is being to them just because of their good Christian lifestyle.

[NextIteration]

If this is too off topic, feel free to move or delete.  I see that we have established that the FRC is indeed an offshoot of James Dobson's Focus on the Family.  A really good book that covers the regression of our politics in the U.S. towards authoritarianism and a theocracy is Max Blumenthal's Republican Gomorrah: Inside the Movement that Shattered the Party, it's written from a liberal perspective but it covers the history from Eisenhower's speech that nobody remembers through publication very well.  It sure as heck opened my eyes about a lot!

 

Hasn't the statute of limitation run for JimBob and Michelle as it has for Josh?  It would be great for the survivors if it hasn't, that would open their eyes and give them a means to seek therapy and real recovery if true.

[mbutterfly]

I should have said with regard to the specific situation with Josh the parents are not the ones under fire for being abusers and since they are the ones being interviewed I can't see the reporter playing hardball with them.

i agree with you, but then is it that much of a story? Two shows about a couple who have sadly had to come to grips with the fact their son is a sexual abuser (presently inactive we hope). How is that a story? And, if the story is really, liberals are mean, how is this a good example? Surely liberals do worse stuff than criticize people for child abuse/endangerment/fail to report. 

[CherryAmes]

Let's face it if the story was really going to be about Josh Duggar he'd be in on the interview.  After all he is a married man with children of his own.  If the purpose of the interview was anything other than an opportunity for the Duggar family (i.e. Jim Bob and Michelle) to whitewash themselves and try to salvage their reputation and their careers he'd have been involved.

[farmgal4]

Well, your opinion differs from mine.

I personally think hitting a child with a rod borders on (if not crosses into) child abuse.

I think the they have without a doubt emotionally abused their children.

I think the fact that they have deprived all 19 kids of a decent education to be some sort of abuse/neglect. I would give anything if someone would give all of those kids a standardized test to determine grade level. I'm betting that not one of them would be over a sixth grade level, and that's being generous.

[Fuzzysox]

I think the fact that they have deprived all 19 kids of a decent education to be some sort of abuse/neglect. I would give anything if someone would give all of those kids a standardized test to determine grade level. I'm betting that not one of them would be over a sixth grade level, and that's being generous.

I've been saying this for years too. Now that the show is over those kids have no education to fall back on. The Duggar name is tainted what does that leave the kids with?

[Morgalisa]

 

Hasn't the statute of limitation run for JimBob and Michelle as it has for Josh?  It would be great for the survivors if it hasn't, that would open their eyes and give them a means to seek therapy and real recovery if true.

I heard an attorney on tv say that any minor child has until they are 21 years old to file suit.  

[Bella]

The mods have talked about this and decided that if Jim Bob and Michelle did what they are accused of with the rods and all, it is definitely child abuse.  But since we don't have solid proof, we should not use the term in that regard.

 

Also, this is the Josh and Anna thread. Jim Bob and Michelle should be discussed in their own thread.

 

Thanks!

[Happyfatchick]

He also gained seven hundred pounds.

 

But yeah, Josh Duggar's "charm" has always come across as painstakingly rehearsed. Every single line he has ever said on that show sounds like he practiced it all day and they probably had to do ten or twelve takes before it came across as genuine enough.

That's because he strayed from his mantra: "you'll have to talk with my dad."

[galax-arena]

I also googled Tony Perkins. [a blond confession: I thought Tony Perkins had very dark hair, a skinny face, plastic hair, REALLY big teeth,

 

 

You rang? 

Edited June 1, 2015 by galax-arena

[GEML]

Ok, but if we are going to say that Jim Bob and Michelle are abusive, are we pretty much prepared to say that nearly all Amish, and quite a few Orthodox Jewish families (to pull two fairly well respected fundamentalist groups out of a hat) are also abusive? Both deny a robust education to their children. The discipline methods of the Pearl book were based significantly on Amish methods. Both groups often have families so large individual children do not get the attention they need....

I think it's one thing to say this is not an ideal environment in which we would choose to raise a child. But if we cite the Duggars for abuse, we open a BIG can of worms.

[sometimesy]

I heard an attorney on tv say that any minor child has until they are 21 years old to file suit.  

Didn't a minor request the statement to be destroyed? That probably ends that law suit.

 

Wouldn't it be something if the Duggars actually sued law enforcement for not taking action when they brought Josh in. ($$$)

[3 is enough]

To me, Josh and his pontificating have always come across as false bravado.  I think he was painfully aware of his lack of education, and tried to make up for it with his fancy speeches, and using big words (often in the improper context).  That probably only got worse when he started at the FRC , and even when he worked for Rick Santorum during the last campaign, because he was surrounded by educated co-workers, and he knew they were making fun of him behind his back.

 

In hindsight, the pompousness also probably came from his fear of  his secret coming out.  Working in DC, he had to know that skeletons in closets ALWAYS come to light eventually. The stress certainly took a toll on him physically, and I would wager that might be part of the reason he didn't appear to be thrilled about the prospect of M4- he wasn't sure how long he had before his secret came out and the gravy train ended.  

 

Not excusing his actions at all, but I imagine his life has not been very pleasant, and he could have benefited greatly from proper counselling. If nothing else, to realize just what hell he put his victims through, and that they do not have to forgive him.

[galax-arena]

Ok, but if we are going to say that Jim Bob and Michelle are abusive, are we pretty much prepared to say that nearly all Amish, and quite a few Orthodox Jewish families (to pull two fairly well respected fundamentalist groups out of a hat) are also abusive?

I think certain practices common among those groups are abusive, yes. I really can't stand how the Amish in particular are often romanticized within the larger mainstream culture. (I don't necessarily dislike the Amish, btw, just the whole "omg they're so pure and holy and a throwback to simpler times and a Christ-like example to us all!!" attitude that so many of us have is completely misguided IMO.) 

Edited June 1, 2015 by galax-arena

[zoomama]

first time posting here but looong time reader. don't know how to copy another post in a box like you guys do so this is my best effort, for now:

 

'To me, Josh and his pontificating have always come across as false bravado.  I think he was painfully aware of his lack of education, and tried to make up for it with his fancy speeches, and using big words (often in the improper context).'

 

i do think this is acccurate. in fact, there is much on this forum that i believe is right on the money. as for josh, i think his guilt and embarrassment may have led to his unhealthy lifestyle (eating) as well as what happened when he was a teen. i do not release him from responsibility but i do see where the only examples he had were two very sexually active parents both in the bedroom and blatantly in his face in their daily life.

 

as for the girls involved in this, i am so desperetly sad for them. i pray that they will realize their innocence in this mess and move forward with positive life changes. i think about them every day and wonder how they are. i know, from experience, that it takes years and years to recover from molestation to the point that it does not cross your mind every single day.

[GEML]

I'm another who thinks Josh was always overcompensating. Washington DC is a BRUTAL city. It literally chews up and spits out hundreds of people every day. (I say this as someone who got kicked to the curb twice before my husband and I "made it."). Coming from nothing to DC is HARD. I know people are going to say he had his TV show and his name, but in a lot of ways that was a disadvantage in DC. I bet he wished every day he had a degree from Patrick Henry and no TV show.

And knowing this was out there? No wonder he looked sick and exhausted. He learned quickly enough his Dad was a nobody in DC. If this came out, he was done. (Which is exactly what happened.)

[BitterApple]

In hindsight, the pompousness also probably came from his fear of his secret coming out. Working in DC, he had to know that skeletons in closets ALWAYS come to light eventually. The stress certainly took a toll on him physically, and I would wager that might be part of the reason he didn't appear to be thrilled about the prospect of M4- he wasn't sure how long he had before his secret came out and the gravy train ended.

It begs the question, why the hell did he take the job in the first place? Given that politics is such a dirty business, he HAD to know this would blow up in his face eventually. If he were still Josh Duggar:Used Car Salesman I don't think we'd be here right now.

[GEML]

I don't think anyone knows how brutal DC is until you live there. Not really.

[questionfear]

Ok, but if we are going to say that Jim Bob and Michelle are abusive, are we pretty much prepared to say that nearly all Amish, and quite a few Orthodox Jewish families (to pull two fairly well respected fundamentalist groups out of a hat) are also abusive? Both deny a robust education to their children. The discipline methods of the Pearl book were based significantly on Amish methods. Both groups often have families so large individual children do not get the attention they need....

I think it's one thing to say this is not an ideal environment in which we would choose to raise a child. But if we cite the Duggars for abuse, we open a BIG can of worms.

I don't know much about the Amish or fundie christianity. But bear in mind when you talk about the Orthodox you're likely referring to the fringier edges of Hassidim, which doesn't reflect Orthodox Judaism or Judaism in general.

 

As an overall rule of thumb, Judaism expects a certain level of intellectual curiosity and education. If the Duggar kids were jewish, they'd all likely be fluent in hebrew as well as english, and possibly yiddish as well depending on their family.

But any further discussion can go to the religion thread. 

[GEML]

But neither does Gothardism reflect Protestant Fundamentalism in general. It always comes down the fringe sects. Even the Amish have their fringe sects within their subculture.

[3 is enough]

 

It begs the question, why the hell did he take the job in the first place? Given that politics is such a dirty business, he HAD to know this would blow up in his face eventually. If he were still Josh Duggar:Used Car Salesman I don't think we'd be here right now.

Totally agree, but who knows?  Maybe desperation to get away from dear old Dad's control won out.  It was probably really hard to support his family on the income from the car lot.  FRC comes along and offers him mega-bucks, and how can he say no?  He knows it is the best offer he will ever get, plus he leaves Jim Bob behind. He probably figured it was worth the gamble.

[msblossom]

I don't think anyone knows how brutal DC is until you live there. Not really.

My aunt lived there for 6 or 7 years and worked for a politician and loved DC, but she was single without children, and had so many interests, energy and drive -- it was the perfect match for her personality and stage in life. And I think she would have stayed there longer had she not been offered an opportunity of a lifetime in Brussels.

[ZoloftBlob]

 

Ok, but if we are going to say that Jim Bob and Michelle are abusive, are we pretty much prepared to say that nearly all Amish, and quite a few Orthodox Jewish families (to pull two fairly well respected fundamentalist groups out of a hat) are also abusive?

Well, first I consider it straight abuse/neglect on Jimbob's part that he knew his son was molesting and did nothing for a year. There's no way around that little fact - Jim knew and did nothing at all for a year. Then he sends Josh off to remodel homes and get a lecture. His daughters were living with their abuser for a year before he bothered.

 

Second, I could tell stories about the Amish and Orthodox Jews and abuse because its perfectly valid that they get away with a lot under the veneer of being quaint and religious but its off topic and I'm mostly focusing on the Gothard stuff and the actual facts (like Jimbob waiting a year and doing nothing) because this is about the Duggars not the Amish.

[GEML]

I was referring to above posts that were general saying they found the Duggars abusuve because they use strong corporeal punishment, don't offer individualized attention and deprive their children a robust education. That's a very different type of "abuse" than having a son sexually assault his sisters and not follow proper channels to get said son and daughters the help they all need.

[galax-arena]

My aunt lived there for 6 or 7 years and worked for a politician and loved DC, but she was single without children, and had so many interests, energy and drive -- it was the perfect match for her personality and stage in life.

Yeah, a close friend of mine works in DC politics and she seems to love it. It's very fitting with her personality! But unlike Josh, she is highly educated. And she's not really one for posturing and swagger; from what I know of her, I can't imagine her ever running for office or being the public face of anything, she's more content to work and do strategy behind the scenes. (Although she did appear in a documentary once about politics!) I can't imagine Josh being content to "settle" for behind-the-scenes work. I think he always liked the attention. 

 

And honestly, I don't believe he was ever worried about the secret leaking in prior years. My impression has been that he was simply filled with too much hubris to ever entertain the thought. Josh isn't unusual in that respect. Why do big-name politicians sexually harass underlings? Why do anti-gay pundits put profiles on Grindr? IMO a lot of them are just too arrogant to consider that it could backfire on them, and why not? They've managed to largely coast through life.... right up until it blows up in their faces. 

[Churchhoney]

Tiny nitpick: Kornheiser didn't say any of this on PTI (which I watch every day)--he did on his ESPN radio show. I would have positively leapt off my couch if I'd heard him defend Josh on PTI, and now I'm $&*#)@! pissed that he did on his radio show. Gross. GROSS. I cannot fathom why he would even go there--especially after the trouble he got in by commenting on Hannah Storm's clothing (also on his radio show).

 

Stick to sports, Tony.

 

He's not that smart about sports either.

 

Just sayin.

Let's face it if the story was really going to be about Josh Duggar he'd be in on the interview.  After all he is a married man with children of his own.  If the purpose of the interview was anything other than an opportunity for the Duggar family (i.e. Jim Bob and Michelle) to whitewash themselves and try to salvage their reputation and their careers he'd have been involved.

 

Exactly. A married man, with children of his own, who, until very recently, held a highly influential position in which he potentially wielded influence to mold the opinion of millions and potentially shape public policy -- much of it involving families, ethics and morality -- at the national level.

 

Yeah. I think that's a person who probably ought to do his own interviews.

[GEML]

Don't get me wrong - I loved being in DC. There is no city like it in the world. But it's also a city filled with people who are all "the smartest people in the room" and have been told since birth they are incredible, talented, brilliant and unusually gifted people. Put all those Type A people in a room and BOOM! Ego explosions are inevitable. You learn to dish it out, and yes, you learn to take it.

And no one ever expects their own messes to come back to haunt them. That's the beauty of it. Josh's story is a juicy one, but it's only one in a long list of DC stories. And once again, it's not really the crime, but the coverup that brings the whole thing down.

[charmed1]

My aunt lived there for 6 or 7 years and worked for a politician and loved DC, but she was single without children, and had so many interests, energy and drive -- it was the perfect match for her personality and stage in life. And I think she would have stayed there longer had she not been offered an opportunity of a lifetime in Brussels.

Your aunt sounds awesome and as a Washingtonian, I'm so glad that she came here and soaked up so much of the rich culture that there is here. There is Federal Washington and there is DC. Not many people know how to differentiate the two. Sounds like she got a lot of both and that's the best thing about living in this city.

I expressed anger early on when Josh was handed this cushy job with no experience and no education while there are so many DC NATIVES who are unemployed and rejected for employment for non-violent offenses. Now that I know that this undereducated bumpkin is also a child molester, I'm 10 times as angry! There are good people here with actual roots in this city who really did make stupid mistakes in their youth not even on the level of sexually violating another human being, yet they're deemed unemployable. Or only eligible for some 10 dollar an hour job way out in Virginia when it costs them 12 dollars a day just to commute back and forth every day. And they're expected to just suck it up and be thankful for the opportunity. And while DC General is swelling with homeless families, they're offered only $2000 a month for housing vouchers, but nobody is willing to even rent their crappy one bedroom basement for less than $2,500.

But this pudgy little disgusting geek can come here with a job handed to him on a platter and get paid good money for spreading hateful messages about people who've done nothing to him, all the while, he knows he's committed these unspeakable acts. That is what I hate about Josh Duggar and everything he stands for.

[Churchhoney]

It begs the question, why the hell did he take the job in the first place? Given that politics is such a dirty business, he HAD to know this would blow up in his face eventually. If he were still Josh Duggar:Used Car Salesman I don't think we'd be here right now.

 

Well, I'm sure he didn't know it until he arrived . It's not a city that gives up its secrets to anyone until that person tries to gain entry, really. When you try to explain to somebody who hasn't tried to get through the door just how hard it is to do it and how risky it can be, they generally don't believe you. It's really the equivalent of making it in Hollywood or in NYC business and finance. Just because it used to look like a sleepy southern backwater doesn't mean it is.

 

And Josh D came up as a completely uneducated, inexperienced guy from the boondocks who'd been given every reason to believe that he was the next big thing and, in fact, Teflon. Once he was in his position, though, he probably saw a few things that demonstrated how precarious a position like his could be. And then he started eating more comfort food, I would guess.