S03.E05: Week 3, Night 2

[greyhorse]

It's pretty obvious that Ashley has issues.  But some of the fault lies on Jared here for stringing her along.  They've gotten to second base according to her.  Now when that happened who knows, but if it was last summer's BIP and nothing has happened since, well then that's her fault for thinking that something romantic is still there.  We don't know if Jared has had the "we are just friends" conversation, which I'm guessing he has had.  But what male-female friends sleep in the same bed together?  Maybe if the guy is gay, sure.  But two heterosexual platonic "friends" usually don't do that.  Yet it sounds like they do.

He needs to cut her off pronto from all contact with him.  Nick was right on - "You'll never be with him."  I also don't understand why she chose to come.  She says she didn't think he would like anybody else.  What?  So she chose to go to BIP thinking that it was yet another chance for her to win him over.  Not because she was looking for a new guy.  The girl is sick in the head.

I felt really bad for the twin (Emily?) that got left by Jared.  For her to say that she's always in this situation and that even though she's prettier, she never gets the guy.  Clearly this is an example of beauty not always trumping personality and intellectual conversation.  I think the twins are hot.  But they seem pretty vapid.  Maybe that comes across even clearer in real life and that's why the guys are not all over them.  Even Daniel who thought they were smoking hot when they walked in hasn't really shown any interest whatsoever in either of them.

[ljenkins782]

20 hours ago, TheFinalRose said:

  And listening to the girls' chatter that Jared is "indecisive" and they never saw him "light up" before like he did when Caila arrived, just kind of says everything about this guy's personality. It's pretty dull.  

Ha, could the twins have been any more tone-deaf in that conversation? Way to throw fuel on the emotional wreck fire by not only saying he clearly like Caila, but that you were amazed by how MUCH he liked her. 

The twins were being complete shit-stirrers throughout this whole episode. No wonder they don't have any relationships going, all they do is sit around and find new ways to help the drama along. Which I'm not really complaining about, it beats watching Amanda and Josh noisily make out. 

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As for Ashley and the crying, it makes me seriously wonder what kind of upbringing she has. She is smart, I think she has a master's degree, but to be so emotional, nonstop? Heck, if that was me I would make myself get over Jared simply because at some point I would just want a life without all the tears. I think what happened to Ashley is that she went to Paradise thinking she'd either get with Jared or get distracted by someone else, and when she saw there was "no one else" for her, she went nuts over Caila and Jared. The previews show her kissing Wells, so I think that's going to be a step in the right direction for her, and also, maybe redeem the producers from using her immaturity so shameless, by sending in a nice catch like Wells to distract her. 

Eh, I kinda think Ashley's constant tears are just part of her show personality. Like, she probably IS high drama and overly emotional IRL so her behavior on Chris Soules' season was probably a decent representation, but now that she's so known for the over-the-top tears, she gives them what they cast her for. 

And Jared is probably playing right along with that too, he wants to stay and get a free vacation and he knows his storyline is intertwined with Ashley's.

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I'm not a guy so maybe I don't get what Ashley I's attraction would be.  I've had to work with weepers and they just are miserable to deal with.  Everything thing hurts these sensitive souls, life is too cruel, and they can't function for long period of time before they insist everyone stop and feel sorry them and then they can't figure out why eventually people resent them.  What boulder has to land on Ashley I.'s head to make her realize Jared is not the knight who will rescue her?  Did she expect him to marry her out of pity?  I had a friend who was much like Ashley I.  She was not a standard beauty but she had a slightly unusual prettiness thanks to a heart shape face, large eyes and dimpled cheeks.  She had no problem finding boyfriends but she had a big problem keeping them because she went into needy, weepy, pity mode almost immediately.  She wanted the guys to do everything for her and if they failed to attend to her every need, she would get irrationally angry at them (and we are talking about really minor issues).  Maybe she found someone who didn't mind her sad sack self, or maybe she changed; I don't know because I couldn't deal with her as a friend after several years of listening to her stories that she repeated over and over and over again. She was also a very inconsiderate friend...she would be an hour late to a lunch and never apologized but always had great excuses like she needed to get her nails done.  Ashley I forces me to flashback in a bad way.  I don't wish her harm, but I do think it is time for her to grow up  Or maybe she doesn't have to.  I suppose there are men who like weepy women.

Yeah, I suspect she's that friend that you like, but find exhausting because of their need for self-created drama. Some people really can't stand to not be in the middle of a "crisis" (I shudder to think what they would be like in ACTUAL crisis) and need to spew their emotions everywhere. Which makes them reality TV gold. 

(whimsey98: I had one particular friend like that who was just so clueless about her rudeness. She would be way late for a get together, with the obligatory "I'm 5 mins away" texts that were obviously false, leaving me to wait by myself somewhere and then her explanation would be something like "my hairdresser really wanted to talk and I didn't want to be rude..." Sooo, not rude to leave someone sitting in a restaurant alone for close to an hour when you had an agreed upon time, but it would be rude to excuse yourself saying that you had somewhere to be?? Okay then. Maddening and yes, not worth it in the end.) 

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It also pisses me off that Ashley goes after Caila for going on a date with Jared (even calling her names to Jared), but she's not mad at Jared for going on the date with Caila or with Twinsie.

Ugh, this is where Jared lost any semblance of nice guy credibility with me. If I were Caila watching this at home seeing Ashley call her a "backstabbing whore of a friend" and Jared say absolutely nothing at all to that, I'd be pissed. If they were truly in a new relationship potential kind of a place, he should have objected to that crap, no matter what kind of crazy might follow it. People who let an ex (in this case, not even an ex because they never even dated!) shit all over the current gf/bf just to keep the crazy at bay really piss me off. 

[backformore]

48 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

Ugh, this is where Jared lost any semblance of nice guy credibility with me. If I were Caila watching this at home seeing Ashley call her a "backstabbing whore of a friend" and Jared say absolutely nothing at all to that, I'd be pissed. If they were truly in a new relationship potential kind of a place, he should have objected to that crap, no matter what kind of crazy might follow it. People who let an ex (in this case, not even an ex because they never even dated!) shit all over the current gf/bf just to keep the crazy at bay really piss me off. 

I think that part of what we are seeing is some producer manipulation.   Ashley came on the show knowing Jared would be there, she wanted "another chance"  with him.  Jared might not have known that Ashley would show up, he looked shocked, and asked her "then what are you DOING here?"

A lot of these people have interacted outside the Bachelor/ette/paradise shows.  they party together, date, go on vacations, from what they say.  Which means, to me, that they are all famewhores, and NOT looking for a relationship at all.  If you know someone, and are attracted to them, do you arrange for the two of you to show up on the same reality show?   Or, how about, calling the other person and going on an actual DATE?  (the kind with no cameras)

The beach where Nick and Jen were lounging/making out - looked DISGUSTING.  Not just the crabs, but the garbage the crabs were shown crawling over.  On the after-show, it is said that there is no air-conditioning in "Paradise".  The whole place looks pretty low-rent to me.   If anyone watched the dating show "Coupled", there's a huge contrast.  that show had villas, and nice beaches, pleasant surroundings.   I'm not sure why ABC can't spring for something more worthy of the name "Paradise".   It looks like the kind of vacation place where you might end up booking on impulse, and once you arrive, you say to yourself "NOW I know why we got such a good price on this place!" 

[GracieK]

All 3 are attractive but put me in the camp that doesn't think they are spectacular.  The twins wear too much eyeliner.  Caila does have a more natural look but she isn't jaw dropping imo.  None of them have a raw sexy quality like JoJo.  

[Mabinogia]

The bachelor profile pics are the WORST! Seriously. When the show starts I never recognize these people. I'm curious to see what the twins look like without ten tons of foundation and eye liner but I doubt even they know what that looks like. Caila is cute. The twins are hot but not pretty IMO. Hot and actually beautiful/pretty are very different things. I'd say Caila is pretty. She's got the girl next door look while the twins have the vegas stripper look. It's a matter of what you prefer. I think Jenn is more striking than all three of them. But there's not a whole lot of natural beauty going on in paradise so we have to grade on a curve.

If nothing else, Caila was pretty much the only brunette other than Izzy (who has that "on of the guys" look), and she was the new shiny penny, so I think that's why she turned heads. Blonde's used to turn heads more when they were rare. Now they are 9.99 a box and you can't walk two inches on that beach without tripping over one.

I just find the twin's personalities to be very ugly. It's Twin One that started the whole "I'm prettier" thing in the first place, and anyone who actually says that out loud is instantly not.

[GracieK]

I can also tell Haley and Emily apart.. I actually think Haley is prettier.  

[Wandering Snark]

I think that Ashley's the kind of person who won't let the facts get in the way of a good story/relationship. That's why I compared her to Stacy in Wayne's World who bought him an 'Anniversary' present after they'd been broken up for 2 months...

[Princess Sparkle]

1 hour ago, GracieK said:

All 3 are attractive but put me in the camp that doesn't think they are spectacular.  The twins wear too much eyeliner.  Caila does have a more natural look but she isn't jaw dropping imo.  None of them have a raw sexy quality like JoJo.  

I truly wonder if all these people look different in person, because when everyone was saying how gorgeous Caila and Jen were, I was baffled.  They're pretty, but nothing that made me say "Wow!".  Now granted, I'm a straight woman, but still.  I actually think Ashley I is stunningly beautiful, but all her over-the-top crying ruins it.  When she was on the date when Daniel and was having a good time and joking around with him, I kept wondering where that woman has been the whole time, because that type of personality coupled with her looks would attract men hand over foot.  I just want to shake some self-esteem in her, and ask her why she is crying over JARED of all people.  

I think Lace is quite beautiful too, but she looked better without the extensions.  I actually took a picture of her with short hair into my stylist last time I got it cut, because her shorter hairstyle was so cute and flattering on her.  

[ElectricCityy]

16 hours ago, Armchair Critic said:

Jared reminds me of my high school crush, he even looks a bit like him. We were neighbors so we would go over to each other houses and hang out late at night watching tv and we would also go out places together. But I was always in the friend zone. We also worked together and he asked a girl from work to Prom and also dated a friend of mine from school which broke my heart. Flash forward a few years and my high school crush ends up being gay. To be honest I hate that I wasted 2 years pining for the guy but it does make me feel less rejected finding out he is gay. ;)

In my opinion Jared is not gay. He simply is not attracted to this woman.

He really needs to cut ties with Ashley completely. I was in a similar situation with a very close male friend but I never led anyone on. He had feelings for me and it was not enough for me to tell him I wasn't attracted to him. Every conversation would turn into how he and I should be together and when I started dating other guys he would try to make me feel guilty for liking someone that wasn't him. I became so uncomfortable I disappeared from his life for 4 years. We recently reconnected and he still harbors feelings for me. Jared will soon grow uncomfortable and tired of Ashley's behavior. She is obsessive and won't take no for an answer.

Also, not really seeing the need to compare the women's looks. If Jared is most attracted to Caila, that is his opinion and it is valid. The twin that believes she is so much hotter than everyone else deserves to get ditched every single time.

Edited August 18, 2016 by ElectricCityy

[GracieK]

This show opens it up to doing things like comparing looks.  I certainly don't feel bad about overanalyzing it even down to petty things like appearance.. because it's a petty show.  If I was worried about things like pitting women against each other, I wouldn't be watching a show like this to begin with :)

[greyhorse]

I don't find Caila strikingly beautiful either.  I think she's cute, but she's not jaw dropping hot that would sweep me off my feet.  I think the twins are hot.  Emily is the one on the left in that picture?  Whichever one it is, I prefer that one.  As mentioned, it's their personalities and dimwittedness that make them somewhat unattractive.  They certainly don't seem very bright, but then again, I'm surprised that these guys in paradise seem to actually care about that.  I thought Daniel would be all over them trying to get a threesome.  But obviously not if they are in danger of being cut this week.  Who would have thought?  Perfect 10 blondes not being picked?  And somebody like plain Carly seems safe?  Astounding.

[Kerri Okie]

2 hours ago, backformore said:

The beach where Nick and Jen were lounging/making out - looked DISGUSTING.  Not just the crabs, but the garbage the crabs were shown crawling over.  On the after-show, it is said that there is no air-conditioning in "Paradise".  The whole place looks pretty low-rent to me.   If anyone watched the dating show "Coupled", there's a huge contrast.  that show had villas, and nice beaches, pleasant surroundings.   I'm not sure why ABC can't spring for something more worthy of the name "Paradise".   It looks like the kind of vacation place where you might end up booking on impulse, and once you arrive, you say to yourself "NOW I know why we got such a good price on this place!" 

Those beachfront rooms/huts run from $300-500 (US) per night.  On the Playa Escondida website there's a tab for "the beach bar" with a picture of Jorge, lol, and on their general info page there's also a tab that tells about the crabs.  Seems that early summer is their reproduction/migration time, so yeah, I'd skip staying there in June.  The huts don't have AC because they're all open-air.  They do, however, have mosquito netting. ;)

Edited August 18, 2016 by Kerri Okie

[dleighg]

We stayed in PV (Old Town, not the area where this is filmed) in February a few years ago and didn't have AC and it was fine. I think it might get hot in the summer though. Ours was also (somewhat) open air. 

[greyhorse]

Clearly from Josh's sweating, it is hot.  That is disgusting.  When we saw Amanda and Josh presumably knocking uglies, she voiced over "you're so sweaty". Ewww.

[WhoAmIReally]

I think Ashley is delusional.  She seemed evasive when she was talking to Chris Harrison about her "relationship" with Jared.  "Second base" said in tentative voice?  That means he accidentally brushed her breast while turning around.  I read an interview he gave saying he hated roses and would never give any.  So him sending her roses is probably another exaggeration.  Here's what I imagine:  When the Bachelor folks were at a bar after some fundraiser or something, some girl probably handed Jared a rose that she got from a street vendor and Ashley begged for it, so he gave it to her.  For her that was the equivalent of him sending her flowers. 

We saw how she reacted when Nick talked to her.  She might as well have put her fingers in her ears and said:  "La la la la la.  I can't hear you!".  Pitiful.

[kingshearte]

Oh Daniel... Another episode, another feeling of "what is with this guy"? His comment about how he would take care of the newborn sacrifice if necessary was hilarious. His reaction to his date being carted off at the end was hilarious. (And seriously, WTF was up with that? Was there supposed to be more to the date? Was he supposed to go after her and rescue her in some big romantic drama thing? It hardly seems possible that that's how the date was supposed to end.) His conversation during the date? Hilarious? I think? I said just last ep that I would assume he's straight unless he said otherwise, and now he sort of has, but was he serious? So hard to tell. Either way, I will say that I definitely don't think he's gay. He doesn't appear to be openly out, and closeted men are not usually that comfortable making jokes about finding other men attractive, because they're trying to keep up the illusion. So my guess is that he either is indeed bi, or he's just comfortable enough with his own self that he's OK with joking about or acknowledging other men's attractiveness.

I am a little disappointed, though, that maybe he's not really that into Sarah after all. I was kind of maybe shipping them, just a little.

Evan remains gross and creepy. "I have to go the hospital — ooh, I know! I'll make it into a date!" Even worse was that he didn't openly acknowledge that as his plan. If he'd outright asked her to go with him, I think I'd be less creeped out than by his child-like, manipulative pretending that his wanting her to come along was a spontaneous reaction to her offer to do so.

And then there's Jared and Ashley. Girlfriend really seems unhinged and like she could use some legit help. But the very first help she should get should absolutely be Jared putting a firm and unequivocal end to any relationship or contact with her whatsoever. I don't believe that a fully grown adult doesn't understand that a friendship where one person is pining for the other is wildly unhealthy, so his allowing it to continue does not speak well of him. Yes, there's a distinct possibility that it wouldn't be enough, and that stronger, legal-type measures would be required, but from the sounds of things, he's trying to actually be her friend, and that's not OK under these circumstances. He needs to break all contact and ties with her, and she needs to get whatever help she needs to move on and become the functional human I hope she can be.

[reggiejax]

As annoying as Ashley I. can be, I have to say, my heart tends to go out to her. Strip away all the dramatics, and all she really wants is to make it work with Jared, her sweet baboo.

[Bugs Meany]

2 hours ago, WhoAmIReally said:

I think Ashley is delusional.  She seemed evasive when she was talking to Chris Harrison about her "relationship" with Jared.  "Second base" said in tentative voice?  That means he accidentally brushed her breast while turning around. 

An avuncular figure two decades her senior was asking what "base" they'd gotten to. Of course she was evasive.

[Nowhere]

On August 17, 2016 at 5:02 PM, walnutqueen said:

Weremouse.  I DIE  !!!  :-)

For some reason none of us are good with names in this house so my daughters and I called him Weremouse during Kaitlyn's entire season. :)) 

[DEL901]

4 hours ago, reggiejax said:

As annoying as Ashley I. can be, I have to say, my heart tends to go out to her. Strip away all the dramatics, and all she really wants is to make it work with Jared, her sweet baboo.

If the genders were reversed and a man kept following around a woman who wasn't interested in a relationship and wouldn't take no for an answer, he'd be considered a stalker and restraining orders would be discussed.

[reggiejax]

1 hour ago, DEL901 said:

If the genders were reversed and a man kept following around a woman who wasn't interested in a relationship and wouldn't take no for an answer, he'd be considered a stalker and restraining orders would be discussed.

And his name would be Evan.

Now, I don't honestly believe Carly is in any danger, but I would say Carly seemingly would have more to worry about with Evan than Jared does with Ashley.

On the stalker scale, Ashley I ranks more with Sally Brown (hence, Jared being her sweet baboo) than with Glenn Close in Fatal Attraction. 

[chocolatine]

5 minutes ago, reggiejax said:

On the stalker scale, Ashley I ranks more with Sally Brown (hence, Jared being her sweet baboo) than with Glenn Close in Fatal Attraction. 

Did Sally Brown call other girls who showed interest in her sweet baboo "backstabbing whores"?

[reggiejax]

1 minute ago, chocolatine said:

Did Sally Brown call other girls who showed interest in her sweet baboo "backstabbing whores"?

That would certainly have made for an interesting strip of Peanuts. Probably best saved for the Saturday edition, when less people would read it. ;) 

I'll cut this short here and I say that my estimation of Ashley is purely my own. I am not trying to rehabilitate her image, and I am certainly not trying to change any minds.  If anyone wants to continue to see her as Paradise's resident psycho hose beast, then by all means.

[Canada]

1 hour ago, DEL901 said:

If the genders were reversed and a man kept following around a woman who wasn't interested in a relationship and wouldn't take no for an answer, he'd be considered a stalker and restraining orders would be discussed.

And people would be accusing him of being a date rapist, with no evidence whatsoever.

[thehepburn]

I said this last season: AshleyI is just emotionally stunted. Mentally, she is about 7 years old. I can't get the image of her peeing in the shallow waves and then running away from the waves like a toddler last yr. I think that's why she is still a virgin at age 28. Not from some romantic ideal but in the long picture, it's a conscious step into adulthood or even, teenagehood, which she is not enotionally ready to take. All the 'waaa wah, I want him, you cant have him, you backstabbing whore!' is just her having a temper tantrum. Jared, like everyone else, needs to just ignore her as she holds her breath til she gets her way. 

Edited August 19, 2016 by thehepburn

[mertensia]

17 hours ago, Wandering Snark said:

Bah! Can't fix the screwiness of this but yes! Ashley is Stacey the Psycho Hose Beast! Jared's no Wayne though.

Edited August 19, 2016 by mertensia

[CindyBee]

Ashley's blog for Cosmo sheds some light on what happened; granted its just her side to the Jared/Ashley saga but its an interesting read:

http://www.cosmopolitan.com/entertainment/tv/news/a62964/bachelor-in-paradise-recap-season-3-episode-3/?src=socialflowTW

One thing was the dates were shown out of order as her best friend Nick was out with Jen when she arrived so that contributed to her meltdown as he wasn't there for support.    And Jared had been telling her that there might be a chance and well all know that any perceived chance can mess with your mind.

[GracieK]

Ashley has always been a good writer and she's very honest regarding her feelings.. one of the things I like about her.  But her feelings and responses are still immature and delusional.  She seems to be aware of that.  Now she needs to learn how to reign it in.  

[ghoulina]

17 hours ago, DEL901 said:

If the genders were reversed and a man kept following around a woman who wasn't interested in a relationship and wouldn't take no for an answer, he'd be considered a stalker and restraining orders would be discussed.

Maybe not IF the woman's way of expressing her disinterest was to get to second base with the man, send him flowers, and go on vacations with him. 

I'm not saying Ashley couldn't buy a clue, but I really do think Jared is sending her mixed messages and has his share of the blame in all this. 

[scenicbyway]

It's too bad that Jared and Carly aren't interested in each other although she does seem more mature than him.  The only thing I can figure is that Evan and Carly have some how made a pact to keep each other on the show?  Why else would she agree to spend more time with him?

I think Jared's a nice guy who doesn't know how to get rid of Ashley.  As long as he continues to tolerate her she won't go away.  He needs to stop talking to her completely, only then, and after a while will she finally get the hint.  It's just like Evan think there was a glimmer of hope with Amanda because she at first didn't outright reject him. 

[Nowhere]

20 hours ago, reggiejax said:

That would certainly have made for an interesting strip of Peanuts. Probably best saved for the Saturday edition, when less people would read it. ;) 

I'll cut this short here and I say that my estimation of Ashley is purely my own. I am not trying to rehabilitate her image, and I am certainly not trying to change any minds.  If anyone wants to continue to see her as Paradise's resident psycho hose beast, then by all means.

Thank you for rekindling my love for "psycho hose beast". Haven't heard that said since the 90's. :))

[mertensia]

14 hours ago, ghoulina said:

Maybe not IF the woman's way of expressing her disinterest was to get to second base with the man, send him flowers, and go on vacations with him. 

I'm not saying Ashley couldn't buy a clue, but I really do think Jared is sending her mixed messages and has his share of the blame in all this. 

Do we have any proof aside from Ashley saying so that Jared did any of those things, though?

[ghoulina]

3 hours ago, mertensia said:

Do we have any proof aside from Ashley saying so that Jared did any of those things, though?

Fair point. No, we don't. She could be misreading, exaggerating, or flat out lying. I don't know enough about the girl to speculate. However, we did see her arrive, become clearly upset that Jared was "with" Caila, say she wanted to go home....only to have Jared talk her out of it. He was downright insistent that she stay. If it were me, I would have helped her pack her bags. Maybe he thought if she stayed she would fall for someone else and get over Jared, but if that's the case, he clearly doesn't know her very well. That scene made me believe that Jared is at least partially to blame for the confusion of this off-on relationship. 

[mertensia]

I guessing part of Jared's "no, stay"  is producer-driven. The other parts are his bathmat tendencies and his hoping she sees a different Bachelor and moves her obsession to Him.

[leighdear]

I think Jared insisted Ashley needed to stay so she could SEE that he wanted a relationship with somebody else.  First hand, immediate and up-close proof that he would not have a physical relationship with her.  He wanted her to see him kiss somebody else, hold hands & nuzzle somebody else.  Go on dates with somebody else.  Yes, they could still be platonic friends, but I think he wanted her to watch him fall in love with somebody.  Kind of brutal, but women like Ashley is portraying* don't always believe what they're told, they have to see it. 

If Ashley left, she could continue to delude herself that Jared was still under her spell and that he would regret her leaving the second her feet left the beach.  She could continue to spin out her fantasies of them together.  

* I'm still not convinced Ashley isn't playing a role and acting like a lunatic for the money and notoriety. 

[Pixel]

56 minutes ago, leighdear said:

* I'm still not convinced Ashley isn't playing a role and acting like a lunatic for the money and notoriety. 

I agree.  I was thinking the same about Lace.  It's too bad these reality show "stars" are so willing to sell a negative image of themselves just to stay in the public eye.  I don't know if I believe Lace is an uncontrollable alcoholic, but that's sure how she lets herself be shown on TV. 

I don't feel sorry for any of them, and damned if I don't find it entertaining, but it's at their expense. I know they volunteer for this, but I think the majority of the viewing audience really thinks this is how these people are in real life, and don't realize how "scripted" reality shows are, while the reality "actors" are in such a bubble that they don't even realize anymore that nobody thinks of them as actors.

[Padma]

I think most of these people are terrible actors when they try (like most people) so producers get the "acting" the easy way, by casting for the crazy personalities. Ashley I and Lace are a gold mine for them (unlike Jared), so reliable.

Yes, Chris H. was pretty tacky to ask how far Ashley I and Jared had gotten (after first implying they'd actually had sex, "You two hooked up"). But he asked what everyone wanted to know, and she must have been prepared for it, knowing the show. But I don't get it. The reason she's a virgin is because she's waiting for a guy she's in love with--not for marriage, but for the guy.

Here he is (accd to her)... Jared.  They've slept in the same bed.  So... what happened there?  When she talks about "we have to be together, we love each other so much", what does she want from him? Obviously not marriage. Exclusive dating? Why hasn't she been nagging him to have sex? It would seem so obvious but doesn't seem to be what she means. I think what she means is she wants to go steady,like in middle school, and maybe he'll give her his class pin. It's very odd, especially compared with her sister.

I like Nick a lot and hope he gets a redemption arc on this show where so far he seems like (a) a nice guy and (b) too smart for this (good taste, Daniel!)  I hope he finds someone. Jen is probably very pretty in person, all made up, and I think the camera likes her but without makeup and hair done, she seems like she might look very ordinary. Still, I hope he finds someone who likes him there--I don't get why both Andi and Amanda chose icky, smarmy, sweaty, boring Josh instead but...you never know with this show. I loved that he told Ashley the truth about her and Jared--in a nice, but direct way that Jared should try,too--even though she wouldn't listen.

[Nowhere]

On August 17, 2016 at 7:37 PM, Armchair Critic said:

Even Caila's opening is boring! Most of the people do funny stuff while 'Almost Paradise' is playing at the beginning, but she just is biting a piece of fruit. 

Because she has no personality and nothing that sets her apart so the producers couldn't come up with anything clever. Same with Amanda and Sarah.

Edited August 20, 2016 by Nowhere

[Nowhere]

On August 17, 2016 at 3:42 PM, OldWiseOne said:

Did I hear correctly early in the episode, I thought either Ashley or Caila said they had only met a couple of times? When Ashley was going on and on later in the episode about being betrayed by a friend it seemed weird, because I could have sworn one of them said they didn't know each other well.

It also pisses me off that Ashley goes after Caila for going on a date with Jared (even calling her names to Jared), but she's not mad at Jared for going on the date with Caila or with Twinsie.

No. Caila said they hung out a couple times. And in Ashley's TH she was saying that Caila assured her "so many times" that even if she was into Jared she wouldn't go after him because she values the friendship with Ashley more. 

Caila told the girls she should leave. Why would she care if Ashley was somebody she didn't know or care about?

When Caila and Ashley were talking, Caila explained everything to Ashley from beginning to end. Why would she feel the need to do that if she didn't at least act like a friend to Ashley. Then Ashley asked Caila, "what happened to the whole he's so not your type?", to which Caila replied, "I talked to him." She didn't say that she never said that, which confirms to me that Ashley was telling the truth and Caila was giving her assurances that she didn't like Jared and at least pretending to be her friend. I don't know why she'd do that.

Im not a big Ashley fan but I feel sorry for her this season because I think Jared and Caila have both been lying to her about their intentions with her and each other. Just tell the girl straight up and then ignore the shit out of her until she gets over it. Jared should have done that last season and Caila should have never befriended her if she was open to the possibility of Jared. That's basic girl code.

[Kerri Okie]

On 8/17/2016 at 5:37 PM, Armchair Critic said:

Even Caila's opening is boring! Most of the people do funny stuff while 'Almost Paradise' is playing at the beginning, but she just is biting a piece of fruit. 

Maybe I'm overthinking, but I took that to have a definite Garden of Eden vibe--a beautiful woman enters Paradise, gives into temptation (over something she had promised not to take, no less), and all hell breaks loose. 

[Nowhere]

20 minutes ago, Kerri Okie said:

Maybe I'm overthinking, but I took that to have a definite Garden of Eden vibe--a beautiful woman enters Paradise, gives into temptation (over something she had promised not to take, no less), and all hell breaks loose. 

Nice!

[Mabinogia]

1 hour ago, Nowhere said:

Jared should have done that last season and Caila should have never befriended her if she was open to the possibility of Jared. That's basic girl code.

I have always hated that girl code shit. So, Jared and Caila might be perfect for each other, the love of each others lives, but because Ashley basically peed on him to mark her territory Jared and Caila are not allowed to pursue someone they could have a real connection with? That's BS. It might be different if Ashley and Jared had had a long, deep relationship and Caila and Ashley were really close best friends, but neither of those things is the case. Jared and Ashley have a weird, distructive friendship and Caila and Ashley are TV acquaintances.

I think the truth is somewhere in between what each girl is saying. Caila probably said something in passing like "yeah, he's not really my type" and Ashley read into that what she wanted, which is what she does. Then Caila met Jared and though he isn't physically her type she connected with his personality. It happens.

Ashley is a delusional, possessive stalker and Jared is a weak jerk who is stringing her along. They are both to blame for the mess they are in and both victims of one another.

[Canada]

I didn't see any connection between Caila and Jared.  I think she went after him just to stir up trouble.  I really believe that she won't end up staying long with him and will move on to another guy as soon as a she can.

[Nowhere]

1 hour ago, Mabinogia said:

I have always hated that girl code shit. So, Jared and Caila might be perfect for each other, the love of each others lives, but because Ashley basically peed on him to mark her territory Jared and Caila are not allowed to pursue someone they could have a real connection with? That's BS. It might be different if Ashley and Jared had had a long, deep relationship and Caila and Ashley were really close best friends, but neither of those things is the case. Jared and Ashley have a weird, distructive friendship and Caila and Ashley are TV acquaintances.

I think the truth is somewhere in between what each girl is saying. Caila probably said something in passing like "yeah, he's not really my type" and Ashley read into that what she wanted, which is what she does. Then Caila met Jared and though he isn't physically her type she connected with his personality. It happens.

Ashley is a delusional, possessive stalker and Jared is a weak jerk who is stringing her along. They are both to blame for the mess they are in and both victims of one another.

Yeah if you and I become friends on any level, I won't go for the man you're in love with. That would be some shady ass bullshit on my part.

[kingshearte]

The Jared and Ashley situation reminds me of the HIMYM episode where everyone was "on someone's hook." The vibe I get from Jared is that, while he may have told Ashley no, he's been too much of a chicken to make it a hard-stop, unequivocal no, but has rather maybe walked it back to a "No... but I guess anything's possible. Things could change, maybe someday... Never say never." Which keeps her on his hook, so to speak. He has got to make it a hard break, and, based on their interactions that we've seen, it doesn't seem like he's done that.

I don't want to be with you... right now.

[Padma]

I don't think Jared could have made it any clearer to Ashley that they're "just friends" and always will be. The way she reacted when Nick told her the same thing just made her seem completely delusional.  The only thing Jared could do additionally would be to tell her they should really cut off communication because having hope isn't good for her. But (1) he's too weak to do it and (2) he's probably too nice to do it, worrying that she'd freak out and hurt herself (and, she really might).

As for Caila, I don't see why a man is off limits to you just because some delusional woman you know thinks she's "in love" with him, even though he's made it clear he doesn't feel the same.  Jared's free game, as far as I'm concerned. That Ashley is so obsessive and possessive about him -- STILL!-- is extremely unhealthy.  He should stay in "Paradise" (rundown though it is), date whomever he wants, and just toughen up about how she feels about it. Sooner or later, she HAS to get over him. (I vote for "sooner").

[MsPH]

On 21/08/2016 at 1:35 AM, Mabinogia said:

I have always hated that girl code shit. So, Jared and Caila might be perfect for each other, the love of each others lives, but because Ashley basically peed on him to mark her territory Jared and Caila are not allowed to pursue someone they could have a real connection with? That's BS. It might be different if Ashley and Jared had had a long, deep relationship and Caila and Ashley were really close best friends, but neither of those things is the case. Jared and Ashley have a weird, distructive friendship and Caila and Ashley are TV acquaintances.

I think the truth is somewhere in between what each girl is saying. Caila probably said something in passing like "yeah, he's not really my type" and Ashley read into that what she wanted, which is what she does. Then Caila met Jared and though he isn't physically her type she connected with his personality. It happens.

Ashley is a delusional, possessive stalker and Jared is a weak jerk who is stringing her along. They are both to blame for the mess they are in and both victims of one another.

ITA. Jared is not Ashley's boyfriend and never was. She has absolutely no say over his love life and I find the idea that she should be allowed to keep him away from any potential love interests, in the hopes that he'll someday pick her out of pity, totally twisted. He should be allowed to fall in love with whoever he pleases regardless of how it makes his platonic friend feel. Same goes for Caila. Even if she and Ashley were close friends, which I don't think is the case, she's allowed to do what she feels is right for her and that includes going to Paradise and going on a date Jared, who was the only guy there who was available and attractive to her. If they like each other then great! If Ashley had any real love for Jared, she'd want him to be happy, but she only loves herself and the feeling she gets when fantasising about Jared and their imaginary life together. Trying to dictate who other people can and cannot date is something that goes on in junior high, not between consenting adults. Maybe I'm just cold, but I've always been of the opinion that whoever I spend the rest of my life with has to be my best friend, so I can't even imagine a scenario where I'd pick a platonic friend I see every now and then, let alone some random acquintance, over a man I could see as my life partner. Sorry, but every day and night for the rest of my life trumps just about any sort of friendship, and I would side-eye any friend who tried to stop me from being happy. Luckily I'm usually not attracted to the same guys as my friends anyway.

I am no big Caila fan, simply because I find her boring television. She's so self-aware she loses all her personality and wit whenever there's a camera pointed at her, which makes it hard to read her, which in turn makes her seem fake. Still, I don't think she did anything wrong and Ashley trying to make her out to be some horrible backstabber is completely ridiculous. She said in some interview she was dating someone else when Ashley first brought up going to Paradise, so obviously she had no intention of going. Apparently she's not allowed to change her mind about anything since it might hurt poor delusional Ashley. Sorry, but the world doesn't revolve around Ashley and it's high time she realises that.

[backformore]

Quote

Im not a big Ashley fan but I feel sorry for her this season because I think Jared and Caila have both been lying to her about their intentions with her and each other. Just tell the girl straight up and then ignore the shit out of her until she gets over it. Jared should have done that last season and Caila should have never befriended her if she was open to the possibility of Jared. That's basic girl code.

I think "girl code"  has its place, but that place is not a reality show where a bunch of people are meeting each other and dating.  Caila had a date card, most of the guys were coupled up already, she had limited choices, and she chose Jared.  And then they hit it off, which is what is SUPPOSED to happen on this show.   It wouldn't be fair to each new person coming in, to not date anyone who has been claimed by someone already on the show, AND anyone claimed by someone who may come on the show later. 

[Padma]

I actually think Ashley came on the show BECAUSE she was told (by production) that Jared would be there. Good tv for them and a chance for her to spy on him/ruin his chances of meeting anyone since obviously he isn't going on the show for any reason connected with her.

She sounds like a bright person when it doesn't involve men. It's strange that (1) she'd let herself be manipulated by the show so easily, (2) she'd be so desperate to interfere with Jared's fun--does she stalk him in real life, too? and (3) wasn't it embarrassing enough the first time?  If I were Jared, I'd be a little angry that she showed up since its really all about spoiling his fun.