S06.E06: Blood Of My Blood

[peggy06]

7 hours ago, Cynna said:

Re: Rintoul, he's credited on IMDB as Aerys Targaryen - aka The Mad King - would have been in Bran's vision.

Ah, thanks! How did I miss that?  

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10 HOURS AGO, BEEBLE SAID:

I'm not sure I buy Arya's exit from the assassin club. She sailed there, went hungry, abandoned her possessions, begged to be let in, cleaned corpses, went blind, suffered, got beaten, resisted temptation, and then decided with her first assignment that it just wasn't for her. I thought she had more sticktoitiveness.

 

I think it was meant to show that she still has a humanity. She wants to kill the people that wronged her and her family, but she doesnt want to just become a random uncaring human weapon.

I used to think Jaqen was a good person, but now I realize that he is totally amoral, not immoral, but amoral. He has no morals at all. He kills because someone pays his organization to kill someone else. If it is for a justified reason it will be a justified kill, if it is a unjustified reason, it will be an injustice.

Arya saw Jaqen's abilities and wanted to learn from him in order to become strong enough to take revenge on her enemies. She realized the cost was too high, and that if she was going to progress further she was going to have to kill good people.

 

I think this is it exactly. It took a long time to get there, but other pieces of the story were being set in place as well. I seriously doubt most fans would have been happy to see Arya become a killer-for-hire.

Edited May 30, 2016 by peggy06

[FormerMod-a1]

6 hours ago, Save Yourself said:

... but I don't think Riverrun is under siege at the moment is it? The Frey sons said Riverrun can withstand a siege for a year, not that they currently are, I thought as they are back and telling Walden about the loss that they had withdrawn their army. ...

This was my understanding as well, but I was beginning to doubt that reading this thread. 

I was mostly bored with this episode.  Enough of Sam and Gilly, they are boring.  He did get the sword but did we need 20 hours* of them to get there?

The only reason I remember Benjen is because of these boards.  He was in an ep or two in the very beginning and hasn't been seen since, but gets huge resounding glee at returning, and not because he rescued Bran and Meera, but because he is Benjen.  My reaction is mostly  "Oh, his uncle.  Interesting... I mostly forgot about you (and if not for this board would have)."  I am interested in seeing where this goes now, of course, like any storyline, but I never would have the "OMG! BENJEN!" reaction.  Especially not before learning what happened to him (being undeadish and all).

I see Dany as more cocky, or even thinking herself special/godlike, than mad.  And since she is impervious to fire and has dragons at her disposal, I don't blame her.  If I was impervious to fire and had dragons I'd be quite full of myself, too.  And if my family had been rulers/kings/queens I'd be taking my magic and working to get back the throne, too.  She is a conqueror.  Whether one thinks she actually has a claim to the throne is another thing, but again... impervious to fire and dragons.  Kingdoms have been taken with much weaker claims than hers.

* what it felt like to me

[maydaymayday]

5 hours ago, Taget said:

Tommen seems genuinely brainwashed.  Though it's possible that is on advice from his mother

I think that Tommen will be pulled between righteous thoughts from the Sparrow and sex with his wife. He is a teenager after all.  I think Margery will win that.

[SimoneS]

Daenerys is pursuing power and the Iron Throne through war so she is mad? RME. I don't remember anyone calling Stannis mad when he was stalking around claiming the throne and he burnt his daughter alive. Here we go again: one rule for women and another for men doing the exact same thing. The Iron Throne belongs to who can take it and hold it and it seems to me that she is the only one who can accomplish this with her dragons, army, and council of adviors. When the Long Night comes, I predict her dragons will be crucial to saving Westeros although Bran's visions will prove to be helpful. Hopefully, Jon will get around to finding a large supply of dragon glass because Valyrian steel is still rare.

I hate Littlefinger, but there is no evidence that he was lying. Blackfish has reformed the Tully army and taken Riverrun. It isn't under siege right now. What Blackfish needs to do is avoid battles with both the Frey and Lannister armies so he can come to Sansa's aid. If Brienne reaches Blackfish before the conflict begins, I could see him abandoning Riverrun so he can do just that. I think that Jaime would let him leave out of guilt about what his family did to Cate, Rob, and Sansa. He sent Brienne to keep her vow to find and protect Sansa. He will likely feel obligated to help Sansa any way that he can, even if just means stepping aside and letting Blackfish and the Tully army leave peacefully.

Edited May 30, 2016 by SimoneS

[Save Yourself]

11 hours ago, SimoneS said:

Daenerys is pursuing power and the Iron Throne through war so she is mad? RME. I don't remember anyone calling Stannis mad when he was stalking around claiming the throne and he burnt his daughter alive. Here we go again: one rule for women and another for men doing the exact same thing. The Iron Throne belongs to who can take it and hold it and it seems to me that she is the only one who can accomplish this with her dragons, army, and council of adviors. When the Long Night comes, I predict her dragons will be crucial to saving Westeros although Bran's visions will prove to be helpful. Hopefully, Jon will get around to finding a large supply of dragon glass because Valyrian steel is still rare.

I hate Littlefinger, but there is no evidence that he was lying. Blackfish has reformed the Tully army and taken Riverrun. It isn't under siege right now. What Blackfish needs to do is avoid battles with both the Frey and Lannister armies so he can come to Sansa's aid. If Brienne reaches Blackfish before the conflict begins, I could see him abandoning Riverrun so he can do just that. I think that Jaime would let him leave out of guilt about what his family did to Cate, Rob, and Sansa. He sent Brienne to keep her vow to find and protect Sansa. He will likely feel obligated to help Sansa any way that he can, even if just means stepping aside and letting Blackfish and Tully army leave peacefully.

Hopefully some of us thought Stannis was mad by the time he sacrificed Shireen, I certainly did - I actually hope he was to have done such a horrendous thing. He had certainly become a zealot which is a kind of madness. However I don't think Dany is mad but she does sound a touch delusional, I don't think she's given any thought to what happens beyond getting the Throne as she is so caught up in getting what is 'hers', conquering cities and collecting devotees. She's left a trail of destruction behind her. She could absolutely take the Throne but whether she could hold it... I'm yet to be convinced. I think Margaery would do the best job of anyone! She's clever, kind, compassionate, is a good politician and everybody bar Cersei likes and respects her. 

It would be great if Jaime allied with the Starks! Cersei would completely lose her shit. It will be interesting when he gets there as KL don't know yet that the Starks are starting to make moves. 

Edited May 31, 2016 by Save Yourself
I got my Lannisters and Starks mixed up

[Lady S.]

1 hour ago, myname2use4now said:

Meera's trying to protect Bran til the very end really got me in the feels. Poor kid could use a break.

IKR? Poor girl only got wrapped up in this shit following her weirdo brother and trying to protect, she ended up having to mercy-kill said weirdo brother, before that she was threatened with rape by Karl the Fooking Legend, she spent however long trapped in the cave while Bran had his vision quests and then had to fight wights (again) and kill a white walker to get him out of there alive. I'm sure she also feels guilty about leaving Hodor and Summer behind to die.

So the CotF had Benjen this whole time and no one thought of reuniting him with Bran before now? Those little creeps were such dicks.

At first I felt bad for Jaime getting demoted by his nephew-son, but then I wondered why the hell Jaime and Cersei keep letting him meet with the High Sparrow on his own. He's their last surviving child, prophesied to die, he's the king and he's a naive kid. Take a break from the twincest (which is suddenly creepier with matching hairdos) and keep an eye on your stupid son, assholes!

This ep could've used some northern scenes below the Wall, but I'd gladly trade Meereen for Braavos. At least Arya's scenes had a fun play with Miss Fisher and the Posh Nosh guy.

[Philbert]

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After just seeing him on The Night Manager (and hearing some of the stuff his character did on Outlander), it's weird having sympathy for a Tobias Menzies character. 

Oh God, You have no idea. I'm still trying to mentally wash out the images of Black Jack Randall's 'fun with a married couple' in Season One. Menzies can play an absolute monster along with the best of them.

[Ambrosefolly]

24 minutes ago, Save Yourself said:

I think Margaery would do the best job of anyone! She's clever, kind, compassionate, is a good politician and everybody bar Cersei likes and respects her. 

Absolutely. I think if Margaery and Dany were both ruling separate kingdoms (not Essos as Dany does have to deal with the fact the people think she is a foreign conquerer), I think Margaery would have the more successful kingdom.

 

19 minutes ago, Lady S. said:

IKR? Poor girl only got wrapped up in this shit following her weirdo brother and trying to protect, she ended up having to mercy-kill said weirdo brother, before that she was threatened with rape by Karl the Fooking Legend, she spent however long trapped in the cave while Bran had his vision quests and then had to fight wights (again) and kill a white walker to get him out of there alive. I'm sure she also feels guilty about leaving Hodor and Summer behind to die.

So the CotF had Benjen this whole time and no one thought of reuniting him with Bran before now? Those little creeps were such dicks.

At first I felt bad for Jaime getting demoted by his nephew-son, but then I wondered why the hell Jaime and Cersei keep letting him meet with the High Sparrow on his own. He's their last surviving child, prophesied to die, he's the king and he's a naive kid. Take a break from the twincest (which is suddenly creepier with matching hairdos) and keep an eye on your stupid son, assholes!

This ep could've used some northern scenes below the Wall, but I'd gladly trade Meereen for Braavos. At least Arya's scenes had a fun play with Miss Fisher and the Posh Nosh guy.

I seemed like the Original 3ER knew about Benjen as well.Out of all the Crows that were killed and attacked, his successor's Uncle was the only one supernaturally revived by the CoF, can't be just luck.  While I think the CoFs can only cover so much ground if Benjen is riding around the lands, apparently 3ER can summon just about anyone to him. 3ER seemed to keep a lot of helpful information from Bran and Meera. Maybe Bran wouldn't have been mentally searching for him instead of coming mind to mind with the Night King.

 

14 minutes ago, Philbert said:

Oh God, You have no idea. I'm still trying to mentally wash out the images of Black Jack Randall's 'fun with a married couple' in Season One. Menzies can play an absolute monster along with the best of them.

I think the guy is a great actor. He did an excellent job of having Edmure come across as well meaning and brave yet spoiled and childish, often at the very same time. In a way Edmure is a proto-Bran, he is fully capable, kind hearted, and well meaning, but the fact they both grew up high born makes them both spoiled and reckless, which can have disastrous results. 

Edited May 30, 2016 by Ambrosefolly

[GrailKing]

17 minutes ago, Philbert said:

Oh God, You have no idea. I'm still trying to mentally wash out the images of Black Jack Randall's 'fun with a married couple' in Season One. Menzies can play an absolute monster along with the best of them.

Tobias and Clive are very busy this year, glad to watch them on both shows.

[knaankos]

So Sam's dad hates him so much just because he perceives him as "weak"? C'mon of all the faults in the Game of Thrones world I would say Sam's is pretty far down the list for reasons of banishment.

[BitterApple]

14 hours ago, SourK said:

Daario has it wrong. Dany isn't a conqueror -- she's a motivational speaker. It is her only passion in life.

Seriously, I feel like I'm at a freaking Tony Robbins seminar every time she does one of her monologs. "You can do it!" "You're special!" "If you believe you can achieve!". It's the same thing every week. Just get on the damn boats and go to Westeros already. Sheesh.

I am very happy to see the return of Benjen though.

[RedHawk]

I enjoy Gilly and Sam because of their growing relationship. She isn't afraid to speak plainly to him, and he gains strength from her. The scene where he took the sword could have been a bit stronger but I was so glad to see him do it. 

[dmc]

Why would the Blackfish give Walter Frey Riverrun for Edmure??? Didnt he call him a fool at the Red Wedding? This seems like a lame bargaining chip.

[Save Yourself]

1 minute ago, BitterApple said:

Seriously, I feel like I'm at a freaking Tony Robbins seminar every time she does one of her monologs. "You can do it!" "You're special!" "If you believe you can achieve!". It's the same thing every week. Just get on the damn boats and go to Westeros already. Sheesh.

I am very happy to see the return of Benjen though.

AND it's always for her, she doesn't give any motivation for how it will help them: 'You can do it - for ME! So I can conquer the world! Go to battle for ME! Even though this (soon to be) war has absolutely nothing to do with you and you didn't even know about Westeros or the Iron Throne til I showed up. So come on and risk your lives for a cause you don't care about!' And they ALWAYS say yes! Why?! I don't get it. Although I guess the slaves she unchained feel they owe her but the Dothraki? All of them can't be enthralled by her. 

PS - I know all the power mad folk on this show are pushing others to risk their lives for them but at least those battles are in their homelands, I don't see what's in it for all Dany's peeps to join in her invasion. 

25 minutes ago, knaankos said:

So Sam's dad hates him so much just because he perceives him as "weak"? C'mon of all the faults in the Game of Thrones world I would say Sam's is pretty far down the list for reasons of banishment.

Exactly, he hasn't even banged his sister!

[Tyro49]

I I think Dany and her Dragons will be the last defense/offense against the White Walkers - Fire and Ice.

I think maybe the Iron Throne will be destroyed - "breaking the wheel".

If both White Walkers and dragons are destroyed, will that break the hold of "magic" on the seasons?

Maybe the Seven Kingdoms will revert to being seven kingdoms as they were before the conquest of the Targareons, but with some better form of government??

I may be obtuse, but most of the twists this season have taken me completely by surprise - good.

There are more seasons to come, but glad to see that events are beginning to gather together towards an eventual finale. Hope all the "missing" characters are accounted for, too.

We will lose some more beloved (and unbeloved) characters along the way; accept it (even if we don't like it).

I think it is not going to turn out as we expect it.  GRRM and TPTB seem to have a knack for surprising us.

[bluvelvet]

So essentially we had 3 seasons of Arya getting hit in the face with a stick for nothing ?? Okay maybe it hasn't been 3 seasons but it sure feels that way..

Way too much Sam and Gilly but glad he got the sword, he's gonna need it. 

Dany *yawn*.. Great visual but yeah.. 

[AliShibaz]

Tommen is a twit. For sure. But it's not really his fault. He's been completely sheltered and given his life lessons by his mother. I'm surprised he isn't more of a monster like his older brother after being raised by Cersei.

Besides, didn't the witch who told Cersei her future when she was a young girl prophesize that all of her children would die before they became adults?

Edited May 30, 2016 by AliShibaz

[AliShibaz]

7 minutes ago, bluvelvet said:

So essentially we had 3 seasons of Arya getting hit in the face with a stick for nothing ?? Okay maybe it hasn't been 3 seasons but it sure feels that way..

Way too much Sam and Gilly but glad he got the sword, he's gonna need it. 

Dany *yawn*.. Great visual but yeah.. 

Do you think Arya would be happy and feel fullfilled working for an org that murders anyone and everyone for a price? Seems like a very immoral kind of life. She will be much better off if she leaves that place and kills the waif and reunites with her family and uses whatever skills she has learned to help them.

Then again, the waif may well end up killing Arya. That wouldn't be much of a shock the way this show has gone in the past. Although it would be a very disappointing waste of so many hours of story for nothing.

[Nanrad]

14 hours ago, Jaded Sapphire said:

That was a nice moment but other than that I'm pretty sure nothing happened plot-wise.

Well, there wasn't that much screentime for something to happen at hat moment. But, we found out that he was alive, was dead for a moment, and there is a cure bing stabbed/killed by a white walker if caught in time. Well, and that other stuff about Benjen working for the 3ER and being called. Actually, that seems like a lot of info connected to the plot. 

12 hours ago, ParadoxLost said:

I was shocked that Jamie's power play didn't work because his horse climbed stairs and it was awesome.

I can't stop laughing at this just because you're saying his power playing should've won due to awesomeness. And that's just so pure, imo. lol

12 hours ago, beeble said:

I'm not sure I buy Arya's exit from the assassin club. She sailed there, went hungry, abandoned her possessions, begged to be let in, cleaned corpses, went blind, suffered, got beaten, resisted temptation, and then decided with her first assignment that it just wasn't for her. I thought she had more sticktoitiveness.

Arya is a motivated one, but she is very true to herself and, contrary to popular belief from TWOP, didn't lose her humanity, which is important. She only wants to kill "bad" people. But, ultimately, she understood that she couldn't abandon her identity and prevent her family from receiving justice.

11 hours ago, rozen said:

I think I'm more disappointed in Arya misreading who hired her, than her failing to carry out the assignment. The writer hates the lead actress, hates that she elevates the material, hates that she's who the crowd adores and praises. I'd bet a whole dollar he wants her dead so he can elevate the ingenue who will read her lines passably and do whatever he wants wherever he wants it.

If Arya can't kill A Girl, then she has no business running back to Westeros to finish her murder list. She chose to graduate early, what can A Man do but hope she's ready?

It could be the writing, but I think Arya believes it's the other girl based off the things she's observed. She could be wrong tho. The writer probably resents Lady Crane, but if she's brings in the numbers, why compromise that?

Arya can kill, as we've seen her do before, but she only wants to kill those she's feels are deserving. So, she can effortlessly kill the people on her list, meaning it wouldn't weigh on her conscience. But, when they are innocent/good people, she has an issue with it. She had no issue with wanting to kill the Hound UNTIL she travelled with him, and then she couldn't do it, which A Man called her own on. 

11 hours ago, dramachick said:

I don't know why people are trying to dispute the fact that Littlefinger is a lying liar who lies. 

Littlefinger knows that the Blackfish is under seige and unable to leave his castle.  Therefore, he lied to Sansa about the Blackfish being able to bring an army to help her.  If the Blackfish leaves, he loses his castle again.  Why would he leave?  He can only do that when his nephew is free from the dungeon next door and regains his place as Lord of Riverrun, which Blackfish has much more invested in than helping Sansa and Jon regain Winterfell.

Little finger is a lying liar who lies, but even liars tell the truth every once and a while. The Frey's confirmed that Littlefinger was telling the truth because they said that Blackfish took back Riverrun and several surrounding armies. Now, how long he's had them and what he plans to do next, who knows. Also, during this dialogue, the Frey's also said that he could withstand a siege up to a year. Again, this is from the Frey's themselves--they aren't around Sana, Jon, and co. There is no reason for them to lie to their dad. And we have no idea what blackfish knows about his nephew and where he is or what those plans are.

9 hours ago, Daisy said:

I am curious - Bran disappeared for an entire season before we got back to him this season. I really wonder if Maisie Williams wasn't so popular, if that would have been better for her. to just.. not show a good chunk of Braavos and Arya learning and we just cut into a good chunk of "almost graduated Arya. (to where we got to right now).i'm thinking in my mind if i would have liked it better that way or how it ended up being. 

I wonder if this actually corresponds with the books regarding Arya: I think she's the only primary character who has had a featured POV in every book with a corresponding season. I know this is the show, but it may explain her presence despite her not doing much. 

[Daisy]

.... do we have a reason why the Waif hates Arya? or is she just a cowface?

[iMonrey]

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Wow!! Didn't think that Sam would come from such a wealthy family. I was expecting something dark and small.

I wasn't expecting his family to be so wealthy and prominent either; that castle was ginormous. The other thing I didn't realize was he's the eldest son; I had assumed all along he was a third or fourth son, hence his banishment. 

Normally I would be annoyed with so much time spent on tertiary characters like Sam and Gilly but for some reason I found these scenes engaging. It helps that they cast James Faulkner as Sam's father; I'm willing to bet we haven't seen the last of him.

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Remind me again why Jaime and Cersei want Riverrun? Can't they just let the Freys and the Tullys wear themselves out fighting over it?

Mostly pride, I would guess. The Lannister's downfall. They're allied with House Frey now and House Tully taking back Riverrun means a "loss" for them. 

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So essentially we had 3 seasons of Arya getting hit in the face with a stick for nothing ?? Okay maybe it hasn't been 3 seasons but it sure feels that way..

What I'm beginning to think is that the point of all those scenes where that Other Girl is kicking Arya's ass means now that Arya's no longer trying to be someone else (or nobody), she'll be the one kicking the Other Girl's ass. Like she had to realize she had to embrace herself, or something. It'll be a nice change of pace, but I still feel like it too way too long to get here.

[Isazouzi]

I was very impressed with how Jamie's horse climbed the stairs! Other than that, I thought everything was rather predictable. Benjen, Margery and the High Sparrow, Arya... Somehow it failed to make me as happy or interested as I should have because it was all so expected. And I know it was a nice breather after the last episode, but I still feel some scenes are taking too long. It's like they're stalling.

Although OK, what is Benjen now? Half human half White Walker? Cause the Children created the WW by plunging dragon glass in a human's heart. Do you die when a WW spears you with his ice sword? Or do you become a zombie? How does dragon glass reverse the process without making you a WW?

I agree with whoever said they didn't think the Many-Faced God was that literal. Ew. (Oh see, there I was surprised a little.)

Walder Frey is so old (400 year-old LOL Jaimie), I wonder why none of his sons has ever tried to murder him in his sleep, or even while he's awake. Surely it can't be that difficult.

Emilia Clarke is such a better actress in Dothraki than in English, it's uncanny. Maybe that's why they're giving her all those motivational speeches!

Edited May 30, 2016 by Isazouzi

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

Winter, War, And Difficult Conversations Are Coming On Game Of Thrones

But the Starks are really starting to get the band back together!

[ParadoxLost]

42 minutes ago, Nanrad said:

I can't stop laughing at this just because you're saying his power playing should've won due to awesomeness. And that's just so pure, imo. lol

Well it works for Dany, all the time :)

In retrospect, Jaime was brought low by Lord Tyrell and his stupid blue peacock feathers.

Edited May 30, 2016 by ParadoxLost

[paigow]

44 minutes ago, AliShibaz said:

Then again, the waif may well end up killing Arya. That wouldn't be much of a shock the way this show has gone in the past. 

The Waif should kill Arya easily...she has been unbeatable, even unarmed. The only outs for Arya are poisoning her or Jaquen intervention.

[meep.meep]

13 hours ago, SimoneS said:

 I cannot begin to put into words how happy I am that Brienne and Jaime are likely to meet. I just know that she will tell him some hard truths about how worthless his life has become. He has forgotten that he wanted to find his honor and be respected again.  Hopefully, he will pledge allegiance to Daenerys and eventually take the Lannister army to the Wall to fight the White Walkers. 

Since Daenerys' father was the King who the King Slayer slayed, I don't think she'll be thrilled to have him on the team.

Interested to see what happens when he and Brienne meet up.

[knaankos]

This show is becoming somewhat predictable. The great thing about the first few seasons was you didn't know what the hell was gonna happen. But now it does not have the same feeling. I mean does anyone really think the Waif has any chance of killing Arya? 

[Mya Stone]

14 hours ago, CletusMusashi said:

Maybe when Arya has her final battle against...whatever "a man's" sidekick is called... maybe "Amanda?".. it will take place near the docks, and Gendry's long lost canoe will provide a useful distraction by crashing into the shore. Bonus points if he's somehow picked up Nymeria along the way.

I have dubbed "a man's" sidekick as "Becky with the lank hair." 

[BigBeagle]

3 hours ago, Bad Example said:

I can't believe I know something. I think this calls for a cookie. 

As a non-bookwalker, I have this feeling all the time.

Some random thoughts:

* As despicable as Walder Frey is, I'll take two hours of screen time for him over any random minute of Ramsey.

* I'll give Daddy Tarley this: It takes a special kind of man to take such obvious pride in being an asshole.

* Everything came up crapola for Jaime this episode, but at least he's getting away from Cersei for awhile.

* Dany definitely is channeling the Mad King ... but at least the dragons didn't end up with her brother.

* Anything that gets Arya away from the black hole of Braavos will be a very good thing indeed.

* The episode actually INCREASED the number of Starks ... has that happened, like, ever?

[frogzapper]

19 minutes ago, Isazouzi said:

I was very impressed with how Jamie's horse climbed the stairs!

That was fun to see, but I kept wondering if his horse would be able to get back down the stairs as easily, lol!

24 minutes ago, Daisy said:

.... do we have a reason why the Waif hates Arya? or is she just a cowface?

I was also wondering about this ? And I agree with the person who posted up thread that the waif seems to harbor way too much personal hatred towards Arya. Like the way she said to Jaqen, "You promised *me*" - didn't sound like something a detached, faceless, nameless assassin would say.

I'm also very interested to see what Margaery's got up her sleeve - maybe I'm biased because I've enjoyed Natalie Dormer in other roles I've seen her in, but I'm rooting for her to do something big. I'd love to see her take down the High Sparrow and Cersei!

[Daisy]

2 minutes ago, BigBeagle said:

As a non-bookwalker, I have this feeling all the time.

Some random thoughts:

* As despicable as Walder Frey is, I'll take two hours of screen time for him over any random minute of Ramsey.

* I'll give Daddy Tarley this: It takes a special kind of man to take such obvious pride in being an asshole.

* Everything came up crapola for Jaime this episode, but at least he's getting away from Cersei for awhile.

* Dany definitely is channeling the Mad King ... but at least the dragons didn't end up with her brother.

* Anything that gets Arya away from the black hole of Braavos will be a very good thing indeed.

* The episode actually INCREASED the number of Starks ... has that happened, like, ever?

Right?  like. A big part of me want to read the books (and audio it up), so i can actually "know" what is going on. I have watched every episode and listened to a lot of podcasts (for non bookreaders) but so many things are WOOSH over my head. I can't recall people, places, I don't remember why things are happening...lol I feel so dumb at times. so to actually answer someone's question  hehe yaaay, me!

That will be an interesting turn - if Dany goes Mad King on us. 

and... no we usually lose Starks.

[piequinn35]

I did a marathon of Outlander season 1, so Black Jack Randall is Edmure Tully :))

[dramachick]

9 hours ago, Save Yourself said:

He's definitely a lying liar - and my favourite Machiavellian schemer (he's a dreadful human being but a wonderful chess player) but I don't think Riverrun is under siege at the moment is it? The Frey sons said Riverrun can withstand a siege for a year, not that they currently are, I thought as they are back and telling Walden about the loss that they had withdrawn their army. Especially since no other Houses are supporting them (they don't know about the Lannister army yet). Jaime said 'sent me with an army to the Riverlands in a siege that could last months' which could mean that the Lannisters are going to start the invasion. Even if Riverrun is already surrounded, I think it's possible Baelish doesn't know, IMO it's in his best interests to have the Starks onboard and he always does what's in his best interest. If he's not planning to unite with the Starks I don't see the point in him going to Sansa to beg forgiveness, there are much easier ways to get her killed than sending her to Riverrun.

Littlefinger doesn't want Sansa killed.  He's not finished using her.  He wants her to rely on the erroneous information he's fed her so that she needs him to come in and save the day, which he will then leverage into some kind power play for Winterfell.  Littlefinger is most definitely in the loop regarding what's going on with the Tully-Frey-Lannister situation, and we just saw in this episode that Jaime's on his way with his army to help the Freys storm the Tully castle.

Littlefinger hated Catelyn because she witnessed his greatest humiliation at the hands of Brandon Stark.  He loved her at one time, but that love died and became a thirst for revenge.  He hates the Tully and Stark families and wants to see them destroyed. 

[Daisy]

15 minutes ago, dramachick said:

Littlefinger hated Catelyn because she witnessed his greatest humiliation at the hands of Brandon Stark.  He loved her at one time, but that love died and became a thirst for revenge.  He hates the Tully and Stark families and wants to see them destroyed. 

eh? what was that? (the greatest humiliation part)?
I was under the impression that LF still j'adored Catelyn. and that's why he's kinda into Sansa because she looks a lot like her. 

[MissLucas]

I really liked how Sam and Arya's stories mirrored each other - both were reclaiming their identity by getting their hands on a sword (family heirloom - though in Arya's case it wasn't hundreds of years old) that was theirs yet they were forced to relinquish at one point. Too bad we did not see Arya putting Needle to good use - I would have preferred that to Daenerys delivering another TED talk. (Drogon was cool but still seeing the Waif getting her just deserts would have been more satisfying.) I would also have liked to see asshole-Dad's head exploding when he sees the sword is gone.

I got a bit excited when Sam talked about autumn arriving - would that be a sign that Winter is finally coming? And if so why is nobody more worried? And could the Night King finally haul ass so that we don't have to hear more Southerners snorting at the idea of White Walkers? Sheesh.

Can't wait to see look on Varys and Tyrion's faces when Daenery brings a Mongolian horde back from her little field-trip. That's several thousand additional mouths (human and equine) to be fed in addition to the Unsullied and the Second Sons. Girl still sucks at logistics.

And as a devoted fan of Phryne Fisher I do hope we get lots more of Lady Crane.

[dramachick]

2 minutes ago, Daisy said:

eh? what was that? (the greatest humiliation part)?
I was under the impression that LF still j'adored Catelyn. and that's why he's kinda into Sansa because she looks a lot like her. 

Littlefinger challenged Brandon Stark to a duel for Catelyn's hand, or something like that.  He got stabbed and Lord Tully sent him away.  That's humiliation. Even though Brandon Stark was killed later, Catelyn married his brother, who was even better (Littlefinger's words).  He's into Sansa in a perverse way and only as far as she serves his purposes.

[dramachick]

5 hours ago, myname2use4now said:

I agree with the idea that the Waif is the one who failed the test. She still gets too hot and bothered by her hate for Arya when the FM are supposed to be a tad bit more detached from emotion. I think he sent her to die at the hands of Arya and not the other way around. It's been pretty obvious that Arya will never be anyone other than herself. But now, she's a much better fighter. I can't help but think that fighting while blinded (or in the dark) will end up saving her in the future. I think that was the whole point of her boring story line.

Meera's trying to protect Bran til the very end really got me in the feels. Poor kid could use a break.

Yeah, it's obvious that the Waif really hates Arya. I'm sure Arya will kill the Waif if she has to, but I wonder if she'll end up showing mercy (like Ned) and then always have to look over shoulder for the consequences of that mercy.

[GrailKing]

48 minutes ago, piequinn35 said:

I did a marathon of Outlander season 1, so Black Jack Randall is Edmure Tully :))

I prefer Frank Randall, BJR is such a AH.

[GrailKing]

22 minutes ago, Daisy said:

eh? what was that? (the greatest humiliation part)?
I was under the impression that LF still j'adored Catelyn. and that's why he's kinda into Sansa because she looks a lot like her. 

Go back to season one where Ned first enters the small council where Ned is speaking to LF.

And the 2nd? season where be brings Ned's bones to Cat.

Edited May 30, 2016 by GrailKing
info

[Hecate7]

11 hours ago, KaleyFirefly said:

What if this is still Jaquen testing her? He sent her to watch a play that he knew would remind her of her family and her desire for revenge. He gave her an assignment that he knew she wouldn't carry out. He is sending the other girl to kill Arya. If Arya kills her instead, she passes the test and Jaquen will train her to be the kind of assassin who can get revenge on everyone on her list.

I'm just theorizing this because I'm still hoping this entire Arya sub-plot has not been a waste of time.

I think this is exactly it. Also, Arya proved that she still has empathy after all she's been through. The actress moved her while playing Cersei. She was moved by this woman that she spared her life and defied her trainers--and the reason that she did, was that the actress made her weep for Cersei Lannister--a fictional version, to be sure, but what a moment! In that moment, too, Arya showed that she has a feeling for the faces beneath the faces. An actress is playing Cersei, but not the real Cersei--a Cersei Arya can weep for as she holds her dead son, a Cersei that made Arya weep for Cat Stark. But Arya isn't protecting her because she loved the character, but because of respect for her great artistry as an actress. The layers under layers in that scene, down to the writer himself being the would-be killer, I think were revealing the real nature of Arya's eduction. A Man is sad because only one of his pupils can survive the next challenge, and I think he's fond of both.

[Hecate7]

25 minutes ago, Daisy said:

eh? what was that? (the greatest humiliation part)?
I was under the impression that LF still j'adored Catelyn. and that's why he's kinda into Sansa because she looks a lot like her. 

Yes, he "loved" her so much that he got her husband killed and proposed to her while delivering the remains. When she refused, he set up the Margaery situation, got the Tyrells to join the Lannisters' army, and set his seduction/murder of Lyssa Arryn in motion, which involved helping the Lannisters woo the Freys and Boltons and set up the Red Wedding. His "infatuation" with Sansa led to him marrying her to Ramsey, so I woudn't put one bit of faith in it. LF is the world's most manipulative person, and in Westeros that's saying a lot. Even Varys could be taken in by him. The last woman Littlefinger "j'adored" got shoved through the moon door.

[Hecate7]

2 hours ago, paigow said:

The Waif should kill Arya easily...she has been unbeatable, even unarmed. The only outs for Arya are poisoning her or Jaquen intervention.

Anyone else think the Waif is a Frey?

[Daisy]

38 minutes ago, Hecate7 said:

Yes, he "loved" her so much that he got her husband killed and proposed to her while delivering the remains. When she refused, he set up the Margaery situation, got the Tyrells to join the Lannisters' army, and set his seduction/murder of Lyssa Arryn in motion, which involved helping the Lannisters woo the Freys and Boltons and set up the Red Wedding. His "infatuation" with Sansa led to him marrying her to Ramsey, so I woudn't put one bit of faith in it. LF is the world's most manipulative person, and in Westeros that's saying a lot. Even Varys could be taken in by him. The last woman Littlefinger "j'adored" got shoved through the moon door.

(laugh) okay i totally stand corrected. (I am in total need of a GoT rewatch).

[Save Yourself]

1 hour ago, dramachick said:

Littlefinger doesn't want Sansa killed.  He's not finished using her.  He wants her to rely on the erroneous information he's fed her so that she needs him to come in and save the day, which he will then leverage into some kind power play for Winterfell.  Littlefinger is most definitely in the loop regarding what's going on with the Tully-Frey-Lannister situation, and we just saw in this episode that Jaime's on his way with his army to help the Freys storm the Tully castle.

Littlefinger hated Catelyn because she witnessed his greatest humiliation at the hands of Brandon Stark.  He loved her at one time, but that love died and became a thirst for revenge.  He hates the Tully and Stark families and wants to see them destroyed. 

I just said the bit about Baelish wanting Sansa dead because I thought that was what you were implying, I'm sorry I got that wrong. The theory that you have put forth makes no sense, that Baelish wants to white knight her - he is sending her to a Stark ally. That would be such a convoluted way to go about things when he can simply offer again his army to Sansa and Jon and help them round up the other Houses, Sansa would most likely relent given Rickon's life is at stake and plan to do something about Baelish later. I don't see how he could possibly know the Lannisters are going to Riverrun, the Freys don't even know that yet. I don't know how he could ensure that Sansa's life would be at stake either, not now that she is with Jon and Brienne. 

Baelish never stopped loving Cat, the duel happened long before the show's timeline started and we see him confronted quite a few times about his enduring love for Cat right up until her death, it was an open secret. He declared himself to her when he brought her Ned's remains - yes, I know he's a liar but that doesn't mean every word he says is a lie, he seemed genuinely upset when she rebuffed him. He did betray her, most notably with pinning Bran's murder attempt on Tyrion but he compartmentalises, that didn't diminish the love he felt for Cat (because he is so morally skewed, most people don't betray the love of their life). I don't know if he's driven by vengeance, it's about his quest for power and his love of the game. 

Edited May 30, 2016 by Save Yourself
Spelling

[maydaymayday]

2 hours ago, paigow said:

The Waif should kill Arya easily...she has been unbeatable, even unarmed. The only outs for Arya are poisoning her or Jaquen intervention.

Ah, but now she is in pitch dark, a scenario she has practiced and the waif has not

[RCharter]

I sense Margery will soon double cross the Sparrow.  Tommen is a sweet boy, but just a boy, and very open to suggestion.  In some ways thats a really good trait for a leader, but sometimes it really isn't.

Margery seemed to want feel out Tommen's views on the Sparrow so she could know how best to proceed.  I think if Tommen had given any indication that he was not already enraptured with the Sparrow, her actions would have been different.

She knew that her best course of action was to pretend like she is down with it too......fighting will just get you sent away like Jaime.

[RCharter]

17 hours ago, mojoween said:

Oh and another thing...the Many-Faced God is super literal and I could have gone my whole life without seeing it happen.

agreed....as soon as I saw what he was up to I left the room.

[RCharter]

1 hour ago, Hecate7 said:

Anyone else think the Waif is a Frey?

I could see it, because her intense hatred for Arya doesn't make sense otherwise.  I understand a little bit of jealousy given that Arya is a Stark, but she just despises her for some reason.  And I would have thought that Jacquen wouldn't allow that sort of blood feud/hatred when he is all about giving up who you are.

[Katalina]

Quote

“Margery must have something up her sleeve. No one converts so quickly.  I think she is trying to save her brother

 

That's my take on it—she's too smart. OTOH, Tommen isn't—he's become a sanctimonious little prig.

Quote

“Was hoping Sam would get his hands on that sword. IIRC, Valyrian steel is effective against White Walkers.

And Sam has already killed a white walker with dragon glass. Maybe he's being positioned as the baddest WW killer ever.

Quote

“The only thing I can think of is that she'll kill the girl who clearly wants to kill her, and then Jaquen will reveal that was the test all along.

Oh, I like that. I still have a fondness for A Man.

Quote

“Is Dany displaying her inheritance of the family crazy gene? 

Yeah, I worry about that too.

Quote

 

As for Dany becoming a bad guy ultimately--intriguing idea.

[Macbeth]

1 hour ago, dramachick said:

Yeah, it's obvious that the Waif really hates Arya. I'm sure Arya will kill the Waif if she has to, but I wonder if she'll end up showing mercy (like Ned) and then always have to look over shoulder for the consequences of that mercy.

No - A Man stated that a face needed to go on the wall - he didn't stress which face.  As long as a face is added to the wall things will be cool.  Remember Arya is supposed to be no one. Her identity is not important.