S06.E15: East

[peach]

To be clear, I understand why Morgan is the way he is.  I'm not even saying it's not valid, for him.  My problem is how he keeps trying to impose it on the rest of them. 

[AndySmith]

In all my seasons of watching the show, nothing was as gross as seeing Michonne and Rick and fruits in bed together. Not the Michonne part, the Rick part. Now, I might be biased, since I loathe Rick, but c'mon Michonne, you can do better! Then again, given the lack of choices...c'mon Michonne, you don't need a man! You're fine on your own.

Will the ending to this episode be an even bigger cop-out than Glenn's "death"? Guess we'll find out next week. I always thought the characters who were untouchable as far as dying were Rick, Coral, Glenn, Michonne, Daryl, and Carol.

[lulee]

Granted, there is some precedent for things ending up badly when Daryl's on his own (e.g., getting hurt then hallucinating Merle then get shot by Andrea; being claimed by the Claimers) but he's not a helpless waif. They knew he was being hotheaded by going after Dwight and it looks like their collective reckless is going to have big consequences.

[Boofish]

I thought the same thing! Everyone was freaking out - "Daryl left the compound! Oh no!" Um.....so? 

I think because the threat has never been so immediate and severe. 

He left the farm alone to look for Sophia but everyone felt safe there

He left the Sasha/Abraham walker parade but at that time they had no idea the Saviors were lurking in the shadows.

He went off looking for Merle/Michonne but that is only because Rick changed his mind. Again there was a threat but nothing like they face now

He was forced from the prison and left alone after Beth was abducted. 

 

I agree Daryl is a loner but I can't remember too many times (except on runs for supplies) where he took off knowing he was going to face danger head on. While I agree it was stupid for him to leave, the best course of action would have been to tell Rick so he could send a team to bring him back. And yes, I can see why they went after him. He would do the same for any of them. Again it was stupid - but I get it!

[nodorothyparker]

The Saviors really need to consider renaming themselves the Asshole Monologuers.  It would save everybody a lot of time by letting them know who they're dealing with.  Yeah, they're going to kill you but you've got a good 5-10 minutes of listening to them pontificate about it first where if you're quick about it you may have a shot.

 

About the only thing that was right about this episode was ironically Morgan saying that there is no right anymore.  Everybody was abandoning their posts in what they believed was the face of an impending attack to run hither and yon into the woods to have drawn out conversations because why?  Two grown adults chose that time to separately go on walkabout and deal with their internal boogeymen.  We can argue all day whether they were right or wrong to do that, but it eventually boils down to priorities.  None of these people seem to have any sense of them, but we already knew that.  The show could be a lot more honest if it titled episode 15 each season The One Where Everybody Inexplicably Forgets That They're Generally Competent People and We Unnecessarily Drag Stuff Out to the Finale.

 

The crazy thing about the Rick-Morgan scenes is that both of them were talking out of their asses from their respective extreme positions and they both knew it.  And I think they each knew that the other knew it too.  As many have already pointed out, Morgan's circle analogy fails because Denise never would have needed Morgan's pet wolf to have a change of heart in the first place if he hadn't been keeping him in a shoddy cell he could escape from after repeatedly telling Morgan he was going to do exactly that.  Rick is strutting around claiming invincibility when the former cop in him has to know that's not really possible and retconning that he would have killed K&D at the prison himself when it's not season 4 Rick who knew only what season 4 Rick knew talking.  It's this Rick, the man who while he does have perfectly valid reasons to be of the no more second chances mindset did convince himself and our gang that premeditatively murdering a bunch a strangers in their sleep on not much more than secondhand information and less than thorough intel was a good idea.  You can see on some level he's already not as sure of himself he thinks he is as it slowly dawns on them all that the Savior operation is maybe a much bigger bear than the one they thought they were poking. So he keeps telling himself and whoever happens to be in earshot that "it's not over."

 

Of course we know the show will vindicate Rick and his position in the end as it's already doing by painting the Saviors as the biggest assholes who ever assholed because nuance doesn't tend to be its strong suit.

Edited March 28, 2016 by nodorothyparker

[lulee]

Whether Carol shot the guys out of a sense of protection of Alexandria, a sense of self-preservation, or a combination thereof, onscreen Carol hasn't been shown to be suicidal lately (ever? I'm not remembering her mental state well from post zombie Sophia). Those Saviors posed an imminent threat to her (and an impending threat to others) and she reacted.

It did seem sort of odd that she didn't finish off the older guy in the truck cab, but then not so odd when thinking back to how she just wanted to get out ASAP when she and Maggie were escaping.

Edited March 28, 2016 by lulee

[AndySmith]

The Saviors really need to consider renaming themselves the Asshole Monologuers.  It would save everybody a lot of time by letting them know who they're dealing with.  Yeah, they're going to kill you but you've got a 5-10 minutes of listening to them pontificate about it first where if you're quick about it you may have a shot.

 

Weren't the Terminus crew also talkers who wouldn't shut up as well?

[Ohwell]

If I hear one more thing about that goddamn protein bar...

[Bad Example]

If I hear one more thing about that goddamn protein bar...

 

Heehee.  I like it when it comes up because I always say out loud "Mat said 'welcome'" and I seem to find myself hilarious.  (I'm easy.)

[TattleTeeny]

Carol is now Bruce Banner/The Hulk! She knows she's got that killing machine inside her and doesn't want to go there, but when there's no other choice...BANG!

 

She's the ZA version of Travis Bickle!

[DearEvette]

This episode was so darned frustrating!  Overall I have enjoyed this second half of S6, but this episode will probably go down as my least favorite one.  Mainly because it seems like it existed for no other reason  than for our characters to make out-of-character stupid decisions to put them in positions of vulnerability.  They are not newbs to the ZA.  They are survivors, all of them.  The entire scene of everyone getting into a van to run after Daryl was just ludicrous.  The actors couldn't even make their worry sound authentic.  It was textbook "we must create an excuse move a small group of people from here to there to put them in jeopardy."  

 

I honestly think the time would have been better spent with them interacting with the Hilltoppers or if they wanted them to be put in a place of jeopardy, why not have a big meeting where they discuss the Saviors and have Rick ask for volunteers to go do some more reconnoitering to gather intel about the Saviors.  It would have had the same effect of separating the groups and getting some of them captured.   But it would have been accomplished from a place of logic and action and not a place of dumb decision making.

 

I also liked the conversation with Rick and Morgan.  Like it or not, Morgan's perspective is necessary given how Rick has become Quick Draw McGraw.  Killing strangers just because they are strangers should not be your first instinct.  I also appreciate that he acknowledges that his pacifist approach may not be right but it is right for him.

 

Re: Michonne and the apple.  I don't think it was meant to be some overtly sexy thing.  This is probably the first time they've had fresh fruit in ages.  I read it more as a treat she had been excited to get.  Like a kid on Christmas morning, the first thing you do when you get up because you've been anticipating it.  Also, yes, as dental hygiene.  Sure they may have some toothpaste sitting around, but they've been so low on food as we saw that it isn't outside the possibility that toothpaste is scarce too.  When going on runs, food would have been their priority.  It actually makes sense.  If they are slowly devolving back into a pre-industrial society they have to become more sustainable (Eugene's got the right idea).  Using more natural stuff like apples, mint, eucalyptus oil, pulped strawberries etc. is more beneficial in the long run.

Edited March 28, 2016 by DearEvette

[AngelaHunter]

Weren't the Terminus crew also talkers who wouldn't shut up as well?

 

I think gabby villains must be the oldest trope out there, both in movies and TV. When the good guy cannot be allowed to die, the bad guy(s) will stand there, rambling/gloating/sneering on and on about how clever they are, how they managed to trap/trick/find the good guy, how they're going to kill him, etc, etc. All of which gives

 

a - the good guy time to work loose from his bondage and whip out whatever weapon he had hidden, or

b - gives the "cavalry" time to frantically/brilliantly/doggedly track him down and rescue him one split second before he gets shot/stabbed/crushed in a garbage compactor.

 

I thought the same thing! Everyone was freaking out - "Daryl left the compound! Oh no!"

 

And we saw what happened when they found him. "Daryl come back pleeese. Please. We need you. Come back, yadda yadda PLEESE!"

 Daryl: "No."

Oh. What next? As I said, were they going to bring him back by force? Did the thought he might say no ever occur to anyone?

[catrox14]

If I hear one more thing about that goddamn protein bar...

 

I loved that reference. It was funny when she ate it and it was funny when Rick was trying to be all "Hey that's not right" about it, when he secretly found it amusing. It was funny because she gave no fucks and was surviving.

 

I think Rick mentioned it during their "mutual confessions" 1) to be funny and break the tension and 2) to remind himself and Morgan that everything has changed SO MUCH from when Rick and Morgan first met to the Michonne that ate the protein bar...to now.

 

I loved it. And now I hope it becomes a running joke that Michonne always has a protein bar in her satchel.

Edited March 28, 2016 by catrox14

[nodorothyparker]

I hate Carol's conveniently timed conscience implosion and need for a walkabout as much as anybody else, but I did get a tremendous kick out of her making her survival pack.  All the neatly bagged healthy snacks and survival gear were laid out so nicely while she was sewing herself her own murdering coat.  No one can say the woman doesn't have skills.

[Ohwell]

I loved that reference. It was funny when she ate it and it was funny when Rick was trying to be all "Hey that's not right" about it, when he secretly found it amusing. It was funny because she gave no fucks and was surviving.

 

I think Rick mentioned it during their "mutual confessions" 1) to be funny and break the tension and 2) to remind himself and Morgan that everything has changed SO MUCH from when Rick and Morgan first met to the Michonne that ate the protein bar...to now.

 

I loved it. And now I hope it becomes a running joke that Michonne always has a protein bar in her satchel.

Oh, I know why Rick mentioned it.  I'm just tired of the "joke"  and I just offered my opinion about it.  YMMV, of course.

[AngelaHunter]

The reason Morgan doesn't get to complain about that is that he does very little except look at people funny, and in exchange they give him food, housing, electricity, free medical care for his entire household, including for his pets, and unlimited building supplies for whatever he wants. I should be so opressed!

 

Exactly what I said last week! Doing his craft projects, eating well obviously, getting that super clean jacket laundered and practicing his stick-martial arts in the sunshine. Yeah, I'd like to live that way, yet all he does is go around perpetually looking like someone just farted in his face.

 

You have a choice, Morgan. If the actions of the people you're living with (and living ON) are so abhorrent to you, you can just pack up your stick and take your chances back in the woods.  

[marceline]

I felt like the show was just trolling us when they showed Glenn and Maggie in the shower. They have to know that what we really want is to see Darryl in the shower.

 

Morgan should just become a member of the Saviors then they can all just talk each other to death.

[Eln5]

I agree with the Morgan sentiments here. When Morgan was first coming back it looked like he was going to be this new and improved stick wielding ninja Morgan. He could have been such a great character and I was really looking forward to seeing what they would do with him. I get what they are trying to do with him, but it makes me really not like the character at all and I won't miss him if he never comes back. I don't know why the writers couldn't just let him be great.

I'm still trying to figure out the route from Alexandria used by Carol and Rick and Morgan. Carol left Alexandria and approached the bad guys from the driver's side of the truck. When Rick and Morgan drive up, presumably also from just having left Alexandria, they are approaching from the other side. I guess we're to assume they took circular routes? Seemed odd that they wouldn't have driven up from the same side since they all left from the same place.

[The Mighty Peanut]

I hate Carol's conveniently timed conscience implosion and need for a walkabout as much as anybody else, but I did get a tremendous kick out of her making her survival pack.  All the neatly bagged healthy snacks and survival gear were laid out so nicely while she was sewing herself her own murdering coat.  No one can say the woman doesn't have skills.

 

I want a murdering coat. I don't plan on actually murdering anyone. But it's so handy!

[Boofish]

Well, opinions vary, but the whole scene was full of shit.  I wish they hadn't even brought up the David and Karen situation because the whole virus thing was a totally different threat than living, breathing, sentient, enemy murderers planning to kill you with malice aforethought.  Rick banished Carol instead of killing her, because she was family.  It was an internal affairs situation, not an external threat. And in all Morgan's twisted up logic, he's actually making a point that it was better for Carol to have killed them and ended up exiled because that's how she was able to come to the rescue and help Tyreese save Judith and the girls.  As far as Carol killing contagious sick people, that's a different issue.

 

Rick's current cockiness is little bit bravado, and the rest is pure contrivance for the big setup with The Ultimate Bad Guy next week.  And I'll take an episode of swagger after endless seasons of wavering and partial craziness.

 

Rick has no idea what Morgan's going through, because Morgan won't admit what he did when he was "clearing."  Instead he gave an highly edited, self-serving "confession" about his absolutely indefensible actions with the Wolf.  He expects Rick to come his way on the value of life, while not giving an inch or admitting even MAYBE that he shouldn't have kept that Wolf in the compound without anyone even knowing about such a dangerous threat.  Rick's lack of rancor was completely unbelievable to me. 

 

Morgan secretly kept a brutal, psychotic murderer across the street from Carl and Judith, attacked Carol to keep him there, and almost got the doctor killed in the process.  Oh, but it was all WORTH IT because at the last second he shoved a zombie out of Denise's way.  That he thinks that vindicates his actions is the worst bit of fuckery I've heard yet.  But Rick nods wisely and lets him go search for Carol even though he won't kill anybody to save her life.

Peach - if you went off in the woods to look for Dwight I would come and find you :)

 

The only point I would make is that Rick nodded wisely because it was Morgan. Of all the people he has encountered and loved I think Glen, Morgan and in some sense Daryl will always be special to Rick so his forgiveness meter might be a little off center. After what the 3 of them have done for Rick I think it shows his human, vulnerable good guy Season 1 side that his only retort was the confession that Michonne ate that protein bar (still laughing at that). Rick let Merle MERLE FOR GODS SAKE live in the prison just to get Daryl back. That is some serious love right there

Edited March 28, 2016 by Boofish

[ghoulina]

And we saw what happened when they found him. "Daryl come back pleeese. Please. We need you. Come back, yadda yadda PLEESE!"

Daryl: "No."
Oh. What next? As I said, were they going to bring him back by force? Did the thought he might say no ever occur to anyone?

 

Exactly. I think the only one who might have been able to convince Daryl to go back is Rick. Or maybe Carol. Does he even realize Carol is gone? But yea, I get that their group is currently under threat and now is not a good time to go off and leave. So....three more able bodied members of the group go off and leave? Makes damn fine sense. 

[DearEvette]

Morgan secretly kept a brutal, psychotic murderer across the street from Carl and Judith, attacked Carol to keep him there, and almost got the doctor killed in the process.

 

 

I don't disagree that Morgan's actions re: the wolf guy wasn't dangerous and stupid.  But everything is a matter of perspective.  We never get the wolf guy's perspective we don't know what pushed him to be what he is in that moment.  Kinda like someone happening upon Carol shooting Lizzie in the head could make the assumption that she was a psycho child killer and needed to be put down.  We constantly get "our" people's side of things so it easy to default to their perspective and feel they are right. 

 

But Carol herself is teetering to the side of a brutal and psychotic.  Look at her response when finding out Jessie's husband was beating her.  She used Rick's obvious interest in Jessie to try to manipulate him into killing the man right then and there.  How many times did she whisper in Rick's ear like some modern day Iago "You know what you have to do, Rick." Egging him on to get the result she wanted, which would ironically also lead to getting a doctor killed.

[rab01]

Also, why wouldn't they have toothpaste? They're not out on the road. They're all living in homes that have nice bathrooms, soap in the shower, etc. Tubes of toothpaste can last a long time, and if people are going out on runs, I'm assuming they would grab some. Also, they ostensibly have baking soda - Carol has been baking a lot. You can make your own toothpaste with baking baking soda.

The lack of toothpaste was a plot point in the episode where they met Jesus - it was Michonne's specific request for Rick on the supply run.

[catrox14]

Oh, I know why Rick mentioned it.  I'm just tired of the "joke"  and I just offered my opinion about it.  YMMV, of course.

 

And i was offering my opinion about why it worked...is that an issue?

Edited March 28, 2016 by catrox14

[catrox14]

Peach - if you went off in the woods to look for Dwight I would come and find you :)

 

The only point I would make is that Rick nodded wisely because it was Morgan. Of all the people he has encountered and loved I think Glen, Morgan and in some sense Daryl will always be special to Rick so his forgiveness meter might be a little off center. After what the 3 of them have done for Rick I think it shows his human, vulnerable good guy Season 1 side that his only retort was the confession that Michonne ate that protein bar (still laughing at that). Rick let Merle MERLE FOR GODS SAKE live in the prison just to get Daryl back. That is some serious love right there

 

YES exactly.

 

Rick is a leader but he isn't required to feel EQUALLY about all the people he encounters. I think Rick would be kind of dick if he didn't still value them that way. 

[BananaRama]

Daryl leaves Alexandria because he wants to find Dwight and kill him. INSTEAD, Daryl leaves and three of his friends follow him. Dwight's gang capture Glenn and Michone (because they were standing and talking out in the great wide open!!! Didn't they learn anything from last week and Denise's arrow through the noggin? And not only that, but they made the same mistake with the same group of people. Dwight's group isn't a bunch of master ninja warriors - our heroes are just getting really sloppy) and then Daryl and Rosita try to sneak up on the gang and Dwight sneaks up on them (again!) and Daryl gets shot. Geez, Daryl - way to use your head. Also, why is Dwight so hostile towards Daryl? Daryl tried to help him more than once.

Edited March 28, 2016 by BananaRama

[Boofish]

Slf,

I'm totally with you on Carol. I might argue that what Carol did was worst than the wolves actions because unlike Carol, these wolves never claimed to be something they weren't. Unlike Carol, these wolves didn't kill someone at their most vulnerable time in their lives. Unlike Carol, these wolves didn't know for sure that if they killed this person, there be would loves one mourning them. Carol did all this. She knew these people had people who loved them and would have willingly left with them if it had been a choice between killikg them or going away.

 

I get where you are going with this but I disagree in theory with comparison to the Wolves. 

 

The wolves walked into a community and hacked people to death for the sheer thrill of it all. How was some woman standing on grass smoking and minding her own business unarmed not vulnerable? How can you attack an entire community with 100% certainty people are dead and not think anyone would mourn them? And even if they just attack random people they are still attacking for absolutely no reason whatsoever. What was the point of killing Red Poncho? He was vulnerable and alone. Whether or not he would be missed should be irrelevant.

 

What Carol did was wrong no doubt but I agreed with Rick sending her away because who at the prison would want to live with her knowing what she did? That was a case of the needs of the many outweighed his feelings for her. Maybe in hindsight by him saying he get why she made that decision was his way of letting Morgan know that he don't need to keep bringing it up to justify his Robin Hood act. Carol did what she did, we got past it and if you want to live with her you need to accept it as well. I can't watch another how ever many seasons with people throwing that shit in her face. Morgan tried to kill Rick. Did Rick bring that up in the church when Morgan went all motivational speaker? I am still holding out hope for Morgan. I don't want him to die I just want him to stop talking sometimes. He is a good person and there are not too many of them left.  

Edited March 28, 2016 by Boofish

[Snaporaz]

My heart sank when Rick and Morgan were crossing that field and saw the walker wearing clothes similar to Carol's.

I don't find it hypocritical (or lazy writing) that Rick is now "ok" with Carol having killed David and Karen. Is it not possible to have a change of heart about something once you have the benefit of hindsight, or just to forgive somebody with time? I know I'm not the same person I was two years ago. At the core, yes, but life happens and gives you different perspectives. That must happen in an amplified manner when you've experienced everything they have.

[Ottis]

I think that season 6 has been pretty strong overall. Yes, there have been a few blimps, but it has been entertaining as hell.

 

 

I don't get this at all. What has been entertaining about the plot going in circles as we watch characters begin to make choices that make less and less sense?

 

They all keep covering the same ground. Rick says they have to aggressively protect themselves. Morgan says life is precious. Daryl is loyal to one person, then another, letting it drive him to take actions that end in disaster. Carol is in, then out, a killer, then ashamed of killing, then a killer again.

 

Meanwhile. the world they live in doesn't change. There is no indication of any progress through the ZA. Shouldn't we be running out of zombies at this point? Or there should at least be fewer? iIs there any attempt at all by remaining elements of society to achieve something positive? Is every single damn group about taking your stuff, eating you or crazy?

 

And now the Daryl Fake Out, which follows the Glen Fake Out. The writers are even repeating plot devices, in addition to actual plot.

 

As someone else said, I like the characters I met and enjoyed in seasons 1-4 or so, so I read these summaries and comments. But I won't watch the show anymore, and won't until there is some sign of forward progress.

[catcory]

Call me a sap but I loved, loved the Rick and Michonne morning scene. The way I saw it, the apple represented something they have not had, some fresh fruit and yes it was sort of corny but so what. They are so damn sexy that even biting into that apple was erotic and I loved that Rick wanted some morning something something and trust me if I had been in that bed he would have gotten something so Michonne has some damn good willpower. I know it was mentioned before but remember that Michonne ran out of toothpaste and was using Rick and Carl's and they also ran out. Then Rick found that truck of supplies with a crate of toothpaste but sadly it is at the bottom of the lake. So he got her some mints which are probably gone by now.

I loved everything about that scene including Rick's bravado but his one motivation is protecting his immediate family and his extended family. That is all that Rick has ever done. I am sure that some people find that off-putting but he is not preying on people like the Saviors are. Remember last week when Dwight told Daryl and Rosita that he wanted to take them back to Alexandria and get whatever and whoever he wanted. These are not good guys. And it is the same thing that the guys in the truck told Carol.

I love Morgan but he exhausts me to no end. I get that he is a CO and he believes that no one has to die, but maybe that was a good thing pre-ZA but not now when at every turn someone wants to kill you for what you have. He really believes the load of bull that he told Rick about the Wolf he saved. The Wolves came into a peaceful community and basically killed everyone they came in contact with. Yet he lets some of them get away with weapons and they almost kill his friend and he thinks he did a good thing.

My heart broke at the end when Rick realized that Michonne was not back and he just looked out the gate and I wanted to say "AWWWW how sweet is that" but I know that she has been captured and I just want to cry. I could not understand what Abraham said to him but whatever it was it had a profound affect on him. He loves that girl and she loves him.

Edited March 28, 2016 by catcory

[piequinn35]

What is the plan of Dwight for Daryl, wound him and bring him to Negan to kill?

I won't be surprised if Carol saves the day again :>

(after Glen dies???)

[SimoneS]

I don't get this at all. What has been entertaining about the plot going in circles as we watch characters begin to make choices that make less and less sense?

Obviously, I don't share any of the opinions that you wrote. This is the one episode where I felt it was plot driven more than character driven. This doesn't lessen my enjoyment of the season as a whole which I think that overall this has been an entertaining season.

Of your opinions that I don't agree with, I don't get how you expect that in a country of 318.9 million people there could be substantially fewer walkers in only two years time, especially as you approach the more populated areas on the east coast. If anything, it is unbelievable how few they have encountered since Rick showed up. And really, it is beyond a reach to try to use demographics to critique a show about zombies. Either you buy into the fictional world building or you don't and stop watching. It is like watching Star Trek and wondering when they are going to run out of strange new worlds, new life and new civilizations to explore.

Edited March 28, 2016 by SimoneS

[Ocean Chick]

Hey Morgan, you dimwit - Denise wouldn't have needed saving if the Wolf hadn't grabbed her and taken her out among the walkers, like everyone else has pointed out.  She would have been safe and snug in the clinic, able to save Carl's life.  And guess what else?  If Daryl had killed Dwight the first time they met, then Dwight wouldn't have stolen Daryl's crossbow and used it to kill Denise.  Not all life is precious, Mr. Miyogi. 

 

I wonder who Morgan got the story from regarding Carol's banishment, because you know she didn't tell him herself.  She' snubbing him since the whole Wolf thing, and didn't talk to him before that either, when she was undercover.  Yes, she killed Karvid, but she didn't do it for shits and giggles like the wolves were doing.  Nor The Gov or the Termites.  We have no idea what shape Karen and David were in when Carol killed them, so it might very well be that they were in their death spiral and she killed them to save their suffering, as well as to try to stem the virus.  After all, we did see her mercy kill Erin, after she was gutted by a wolf.  It might have been the same thing, only with them bleeding out and suffocating, and no medicine in sight at that point.  And even though they were in another prison block, it was shown that anyone could waltz in and out, just like Carol did, with no keys.  In fact, Ty found them when he went to visit Karen, which would lead to re-exposure to the virus (in case he hadn't gotten it the first time, which he didn't, as he never got sick), and he would have taken it back to the others who currently weren't sick and re-expose them.

 

I think Carol left not because she can't kill, but she's tired of killing on the scale she's been doing, in order to keep her loved ones safe.  After all, one person on their own can hide a lot better from hostiles than a large group can.  So yes, she can kill to save herself, but maybe can slow her roll on the high number of kills she needs to make.  And she surely won't have to watch anyone else she loves die his way either.  Too bad she ran into a group that was on their way to cause havoc back home.  Luck is not on her side.

 

And finally Rick can appreciate the Karvid deaths because he KNOWS that Carol would never do something like that to anyone she saw as family.  Karen and David were neighbors, but not family, at that point.  I have faith that if Glenn got bad enough to want to die, Carol would have talked to Maggie first to get her permission to end his suffering, if Maggie couldn't do it herself.  Because that's what family does.

[catrox14]

 

Call me a sap but I loved, loved the Rick and Michonne morning scene. The way I saw it, the apple represented something they have not had, some fresh fruit and yes it was sort of corny but so what. They are so damn sexy that even biting into that apple was erotic and I loved that Rick wanted some morning something something and trust me if I had been in that bed he would have gotten something so Michonne has some damn good willpower. I know it was mentioned before but remember that Michonne ran out of toothpaste and was using Rick and Carl's and they also ran out. Then Rick found that truck of supplies with a crate of toothpaste but sadly it is at the bottom of the lake. So he got her some mints which are probably gone by now.

 

 

I'm a dirty dirty bird because I totally took Rick eating that apple as the substitute for when he couldn't eat something else. Sure, the apple eating came first but,  I mean come on. That apple juice on his face just before he starts kissing his way down to her nether regions...you sneaky m'fers LOL

 

And Michonne, honestly, a man that will literally go head first to your promised land without being asked?? Grrrllll you need to put a ring, a collar and some cuffs on that one and never let him go. LOL Damn.

 

I might never look at apples the same again LOL

[MissScarlett]

My heart sank when Rick and Morgan were crossing that field and saw the walker wearing clothes similar to Carol's.

I don't find it hypocritical (or lazy writing) that Rick is now "ok" with Carol having killed David and Karen. Is it not possible to have a change of heart about something once you have the benefit of hindsight, or just to forgive somebody with time? I know I'm not the same person I was two years ago. At the core, yes, but life happens and gives you different perspectives. That must happen in an amplified manner when you've experienced everything they have.

 

Yes!  I think over time Rick understood that Carol did what she had to for the good of the group.  During the time that all went down with David and Karen, Hershel was a very heavy influence to Rick and it was all about building a community and starting anew.  At that point, they hadn't even begun to experience the horrors of the dark side of humanity.  

 

This group has been through hell and back since then.  It's normal for perspectives to change over time.

[JackONeill]

Granted, there is some precedent for things ending up badly when Daryl's on his own (e.g., getting hurt then hallucinating Merle then get shot by Andrea; being claimed by the Claimers) but he's not a helpless waif. They knew he was being hotheaded by going after Dwight and it looks like their collective reckless is going to have big consequences.

And this has bothered me since last night: Does Dwight seem a lot more capable now than when we first ran into him? Maybe it's just me, but I wasn't overly worried about him the first time, but he's gotten the drop on Daryl twice. Or is that just for convenience for the script's sake?

[AndySmith]

to the Wolves

 

Speaking of...what was the point of that whole group and their disco trailer truck and the carving and crazyness?

 

I don't get this at all. What has been entertaining about the plot going in circles as we watch characters begin to make choices that make less and less sense?

 

Amen. I guess treading water and padding things out till Negan finally arrives?

Edited March 28, 2016 by AndySmith

[Boofish]

And this has bothered me since last night: Does Dwight seem a lot more capable now than when we first ran into him? Maybe it's just me, but I wasn't overly worried about him the first time, but he's gotten the drop on Daryl twice. Or is that just for convenience for the script's sake?

I think the difference is last time he was running away with two women; one of whom needed insulin. This time the idiot has weapons and a squad. That is called Walter Walt to Heisenberg syndrome

 

It also tickcled me when the designated spokes-idiot for the loyal order of saviors was hiding from Carol and didn't want to come out

Edited March 28, 2016 by Boofish

[DonitsYum]

I felt like the show was just trolling us when they showed Glenn and Maggie in the shower. They have to know that what we really want is to see Darryl in the shower.

 

This will never happen as I believe the man has walker blood from Season 1 on his arms, still.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Everybody Goes Stupid And Off-Campus On The Walking Dead
Safety in numbers? Seek shelter? Nah, this is characters acting with no regard for anybody's welfare. Enjoy!

[catcory]

I'm a dirty dirty bird because I totally took Rick eating that apple as the substitute for when he couldn't eat something else. Sure, the apple eating came first but,  I mean come on. That apple juice on his face just before he starts kissing his way down to her nether regions...you sneaky m'fers LOL

 

And Michonne, honestly, a man that will literally go head first to your promised land without being asked?? Grrrllll you need to put a ring, a collar and some cuffs on that one and never let him go. LOL Damn.

 

I might never look at apples the same again LOL

OMG!! I can't stop laughing at this. Hell yes, put a ring on it (crap now I have "Single Ladies" on my brain. LOL) They are just so beautiful together, I always hoped they would be, but seeing it now and knowing it just makes my heart sing.

[BananaRama]

As someone else said, I like the characters I met and enjoyed in seasons 1-4 or so, so I read these summaries and comments. But I won't watch the show anymore, and won't until there is some sign of forward progress.

I'm with you.

[AngelaHunter]

That apple juice on his face just before he starts kissing his way down to her nether regions...you sneaky m'fers LOL

 

Yeah, on top of the sheet. Sorry, Rick, but that's not the way do it. I know it's not their fault they're on a show where we can see an arrow pierce someone's eyeball but sex - oh, I mean "mixing the Bisquick" - is portrayed as though the writers are a bunch of snickering high school boys.

 

And now the Daryl Fake Out, which follows the Glen Fake Out. The writers are even repeating plot devices, in addition to actual plot.

 

 

I really felt as though I were in "Groundhog Day" when we saw Dwight get the jump on Daryl for the third time. The Death Fake Out I don't mind, as it could never be up to the cheesey level of the Glenn Fake Out where he is totally covered in zombies - twice - without getting even a scratch.

[catrox14]

 

Yeah, on top of the sheet. Sorry, Rick, but that's not the way do it. I know it's not their fault they're on a show where we can see an arrow pierce someone's eyeball but sex - oh, I mean "mixing the Bisquick" - is portrayed as though the writers are a bunch of snickering high school boys.

 

Hey, now there is something to be said for the tease of the feel through the sheets...before sliding them out of the way.....If you really think he was gonna stop there if Michonne hadn't stopped him...well...I think you're wrong. 

 

I think back to when they got together on the couch...and him just moving her into position.....whew...

 

That boy's got game is all I'm sayin..'

Edited March 28, 2016 by catrox14

[rab01]

I hated the Morgan/Rick conversation but I don't see where Rick's supposed "hypocrisy" is coming from. Rick already acknowledged that he thought he was wrong to banish Carol when he said that the rest of them needed to join her not vice versa several seasons ago. 

 

Now, I don't really agree with Carol having been right -- she made a hard call in the prison but it was also pretty clearly the wrong call. As a plot matter, she guessed wrong because she didn't prevent the disease from spreading. As a practical matter, she was wrong because the prison had space enough to run a quarantine. As a moral matter, she was wrong to assign herself the role of judge, jury and executioner when they had a government.

 

But ...

 

To Rick, the character as he's been portrayed since being locked up at Terminus? Of course he now agrees with the decision and it's one he thinks he might make now. Of course, he's changed -- what else have we been watching for the past two years?   Would he do actually it? Nope, he's the guy who jumped over the wall to save the idiot Spencer. But he thinks he would.

[phoenix780]

I don't get this at all. What has been entertaining about the plot going in circles as we watch characters begin to make choices that make less and less sense?

 

This is the first season since, well, the first season where I've felt like something happened almost every episode.  And this half of the season I actually felt the tension during individual episodes, up until this last one.  They were showing the part of the story I was curious about- how would our people deal with humans?  Have they learned anything?- which was fun even though the answer seems to be "kinda."  

 

It's this last episode that lost me- I get them being arrogant, I don't get them being careless, and the prepping for the big death(s) to come next week was a bit much for me (Rick/Abe seemed to be chatting about what we chat about- how it's gonna suck when someone important dies). 

 

I also appreciate how the season is about their attempts to be proactive and how it doesn't save them.  They thinned the herd but it still invaded, and they've taken out Saviors but there are apparently infinite numbers (and they're invisible!).  It makes me curious about what they do next.  Do they retreat?  Do they just try to make better plans?  There's entertainment value in that for me, so I'd call the season a good one, knowing I could change opinion that next week if they end on some lame cliffhanger.

 

As far as Morgan- after reading all the comments, I hate him slightly less.  He's kind of a waste, imho, because even though he got his own Emmy-bait episode (which, frankly, is probably part of my distaste for the character- he got caught up in the Glenn nonsense with an episode I thought was terrible) I feel like his purpose is solely to be the conscience, first for Carol and now for Rick; he's not real to me, and I don't remember details well enough to pull from early seasons to flesh him out more.  Might have been cooler if he were actually dead, purely a voice in Rick's head.  As someone noted upthread a lot of these characters are sketches, and I'm one who's only forgiving of weak writing for characters who do stuff that I find awesome, or actors I just like.  Like Carol the Hulk, or Daryl for awhile, or whatshername...Sasha, who I think looks cool.  

 

On another note- I think it's interesting they how they use romance on the show.  It mostly pops up to heighten tension, and it's weirdly effective for me because even though we get, what, 5 total minutes of Glenn/Maggie as a happy couple I'm still rooting for them and will be annoyed when one or both dies.

[AngelaHunter]

This:

 

Everybody Goes Stupid And Off-Campus On The Walking Dead
Safety in numbers? Seek shelter? Nah, this is characters acting with no regard for anybody's welfare. Enjoy!

 

is brilliant.

 

Dwight is some sort of teleporting-douchebag ninja,

 

"No one else leaves!" Rick bellows, after half the cast has already committed to leaving the town.

 

Enough With The Musical Montages

 

Yep.

[Nashville]

You'd think at this point, with dozens of their people dead, they would leave a wide berth around Alexandria.

  

You're not taking into account the mindset of the Big Dog.

By all appearances the Saviors have been the Big Dogs in this area for quite a while. Long enough so to have become accustomed to taking everything they want, and everybody acquiescing to their demands. Long enough so they have gravitated to the mindset that everything and everybody within their sphere of influence already belongs to them, and they just haven't had the time or inclination to take all of it yet. An arrogant mindset to be sure - but one which could be quite understandable, depending upon their circumstances and past history.

Now, however, another Big Dog has moved into the neighborhood - CDB - and is challenging the Saviors' accustomed dominance. Like the Saviors, CDB has had enough successes under its belt to think it can handle anything or anyone who crosses its path - enough so for CDB to carry its own particular air of arrogant superiority.

So what happens when one Big Dog is challenged by another Big Dog for his territory?

Simple: a dogfight - initially, at least.

As to who'll win...?

Depends. CDB clearly has superior fighting skills; heck, Carol is already up on them 7-0 to date by herself at last count. But if (as I suspect) the Saviors have sufficiently greater numbers, CDB's advantage may be nullified. It does no good for Group A to be outkilling Group B 20-to-1 if Group B can send 50 "soldiers" for every member of CDB.

Anyway, my point is: Big Dogs don't dodge a fight when it comes to defending what they consider THEIR territory - they defend it, fiercely.

Also, who wakes up and immediately wants to eat an apple?

Anything else they may have had an idea of eating in bed would have probably taken too long. Maggie does have them on a tight schedule, after all. ;>

  

It isn't only Rosita and Daryl. It is all of them. This is a sparse forest, not the thick covered Amazon rain forest. These people have nowhere to camouflage themselves so how come none of our people see or hear them coming? Usually Daryl can hear a walker or person a mile away, yet the Saviors are always sneaking up on him. Even Rick and Morgan, they are walking across an open field looking for Carol, yet they miss the Savior following them? Talk about dumbing down characters to further the plot.

 

That may come back to the arrogance born of success. CDB has gotten so accustomed to fighting and besting incompetent opponents that they're getting sloppy.

 

The Saviors really need to consider renaming themselves the Asshole Monologuers.  It would save everybody a lot of time by letting them know who they're dealing with.  Yeah, they're going to kill you but you've got a good 5-10 minutes of listening to them pontificate about it first where if you're quick about it you may have a shot.

Every time CDB has some facetime with a group of Saviors, I find myself recalling a piece of James Garner's dialogue from "Support Your Local Sheriff ":

Its bad enough to have to kill a man without having to listen to a whole lot of stupid talk from him first.

;)

[diebartdie]

Of the Elite 4 (Rick, Daryl, Michonne, Carol), two are captured, one is injured and missing, one is where he should be. I just cant with this show, it made not one bit of sense for half the town to go tearing out after Daryl but then for everyone to get caught......I dont know, it just didnt work for me.

[mandolin]

Maggie's haircut reminded me of how she looked when we first met her. Now if only her accent would go back to that. It wasn't great, but it was better than the mush she spits out now.