Reel to Real: Backstage, Twitter, & All Media Dram-ugh

[DivaT]

Its obvious that Mal Young has been at the helm for some time and what we are seeing is his vision and stories. 

[Kemper]

I have actually been looking forward to the show lately.  I think it is seeing Cane getting what is hopefully coming to him.  Because it can't be said enough....I hate the character.  Actually, I think the character would be just fine with a better actor.   There are maybe two roles (other than Billy, because that is a whole other subject) that would be far better with a change actors/actresses...Cane and Victoria.  That poor actress just cannot carry a load.  I am in the minority that thinks she is striking, has gorgeous hair and wears clothes well.  I guess that is all we can expect from soaps nowadays.  I would like to see Cane's character (not the actor) put through a trash compactor.  But that wouldn't work as they could not bring the character back with another actor.  And when were soaps run by fanbases?  When a segment of fans has the power to dictate storylines and characters, then we really have gone off the rails and that is maybe a big reason why soaps are failing.  Catering to a vocal group can never end well.  Again....hate Cane.  A trash compactor is really too good for him.  He is not even fun to hate - like Victor is.  Even Billy is fun to hate-on sometimes.  Never, ever Cane.  Also in the minority...dread Kevin coming back.  Love the actor, don't like the character.

[boes]

40 minutes ago, Kemper said:

  Also in the minority...dread Kevin coming back.  Love the actor, don't like the character.

I'm with you.  Not a Kevin fan, to put it mildly.  I hope this doesn't mean Chloe is returning too.

[spinxella]

 

 

Edited August 1, 2017 by spinxella

[valleycliffe]

13 hours ago, boes said:

Never underestimate the idiocy of the executive class.  

With JT being a darling of MY, he's going to be the Cam Mathison of Y&R and ride this show all the way into the ditch.

God only knows what's coming next.

oh phuck....................

my concern tho is what will happen to sharon....

i don't want her back under the bus but i fear that's where she will end up...

[Dream Boy]

I was really enjoying the show as a whole as well. We'll see how this all pans out. 

[basiltherat]

Mal wears a SCARF (or ascot) around his neck in Cali in July . . . he must think he is an ARTISTE !!  Be afraid!

[Toomuchsoap]

13 hours ago, boes said:

Never underestimate the idiocy of the executive class.  

With JT being a darling of MY, he's going to be the Cam Mathison of Y&R and ride this show all the way into the ditch.

God only knows what's coming next.

Well every EP and HW – or EP/HW in this case – have to ultimately answer to the viewers and their studio/network execs. If the viewers aren’t happy, they’re more than willing to vent their spleens in a variety of outlets. The ratings will determine what gets done and doesn’t. And I’m not really certain that JT is a favorite or not. I think this Philly concentration has more to do with GT than it does JT. But if this pairing is consistently scalded on the boards (internet and phone both) and the ratings are dropping, he’ll have to address those problems or face the firing squad just like SSM and KA and everyone else before them. They’ll bring in another co-EP pretty quickly I’m betting. They usually always have another EP to handle the production aspects BTS. Either that or they’ll hire another HW and MY will revert to production, but since he was a HW throughout most of his career, he may keep those reins and somebody else does the EP part of it. I don’t believe wearing both mantles is (successfully) managed today.

[boes]

1 hour ago, Toomuchsoap said:

Well every EP and HW – or EP/HW in this case – have to ultimately answer to the viewers and their studio/network execs. If the viewers aren’t happy, they’re more than willing to vent their spleens in a variety of outlets. The ratings will determine what gets done and doesn’t. And I’m not really certain that JT is a favorite or not. I think this Philly concentration has more to do with GT than it does JT. But if this pairing is consistently scalded on the boards (internet and phone both) and the ratings are dropping, he’ll have to address those problems or face the firing squad just like SSM and KA and everyone else before them. They’ll bring in another co-EP pretty quickly I’m betting. They usually always have another EP to handle the production aspects BTS. Either that or they’ll hire another HW and MY will revert to production, but since he was a HW throughout most of his career, he may keep those reins and somebody else does the EP part of it. I don’t believe wearing both mantles is (successfully) managed today.

I used to believe that, because it makes undeniable sense.

Then I watched ABC let Brian Frons tank AMC.  That made no sense but it happened.

[HeatLifer]

15 hours ago, miamama said:

OK. This is bad.

Mal? Here comes The Philly Hour.

I don't believe for one minute Sally left by choice. It's clear there were disagreements BTS. And Mal won????

ugh.

Sally refused to write Philly having sex on top of a toaster oven and Mal got pissed?

[Cupid Stunt]

14 hours ago, spinxella said:

 

Oy ... This is why you don't let some actors speak off-script.

 

16 hours ago, miamama said:

OK. This is bad.

Mal? Here comes The Philly Hour.

I don't believe for one minute Sally left by choice. It's clear there were disagreements BTS. And Mal won????

ugh.

44 minutes ago, HeatLifer said:

Sally refused to write Philly having sex on a toaster oven and Mal got pissed?

 

<wince>

There's a lost SexxxyTimes opportunity for the audience.

[Cupid Stunt]

2 hours ago, basiltherat said:

Mal wears a SCARF (or ascot) around his neck in Cali in July . . . he must think he is an ARTISTE !!  Be afraid!

The ghost of Ronn Moss shakes it's ugly wardrobe at the viewing public, making little children whimper and scaring the horses.

[crosby777]

11 hours ago, Kemper said:

 I think it is seeing Cane getting what is hopefully coming to him.  Because it can't be said enough....I hate the character.  Actually, I think the character would be just fine with a better actor.  

 

I hope he gets what is coming to him too.. he is gross.. I have never liked him.. not a fan of the actor either.. he is creepy.. But I don't know if a new actor would make me like this pathetic character.

[miamama]

DD is salty. Lol. 

 

[crosby777]

LOL that doug retweeted that.

[Kemper]

Was he talking about Amelia Heinle?  Victoria?  And who is Jason?  My mind is blanking.

[HeatLifer]

Gina Tognoni and Jason Thompson are Mal Young's favorites, but sure, Doug! Good luck with stopping favorites and pets. 

[spinxella]

 

 

 

Doug Davidson vs Max Shippee aka "Graham"

[Snaporaz]

Funny...I think Y&R has looked more familiar in the last few months than it's looked in years.  And I like just about all of the new characters!

[peacheslatour]

31 minutes ago, Snaporaz said:

Funny...I think Y&R has looked more familiar in the last few months than it's looked in years.  And I like just about all of the new characters!

I do too, for the most part. I could do without the Pixie Stix Twins. I like Reed and Tessa more every day. I just hate some of the long timers. Cane, Nick and Neil. And re-casts. Looking at you JT and GT.

[spinxella]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Tom Casiello was a breakdown & script writer on Y&R from 2006 - 2011.

[miamama]

I wonder if $$$ is driving this. Mal apparently showed execs long term story plans to nab the HW job. Sally was struggling in the sense it was obvious people were interfering with her stories (show has a disjointed too-many-cooks feel). So they figure let him do it all (less BTS friction if you're dealing with only one HW/EP and less $$). 

The ratings are falling for all soaps. I don't believe Sally was dropped for bad ratings when show has to compete with CNN etc right now.

[Snaporaz]

It sucks because I think she's repaired a lot of the damage left in JFP's/Pratt's wake, which was no easy feat.  I realize it's not perfect, but the show seems much more stable now, and more balanced.  It's not so Newman-centric, and with the exception of Billy (and it may only seem that way to me because I'm hot and cranky and I hate him), no one character is eating the show.  

[miamama]

The thing is Sally wasn't freely writing this show. We know this because she stated Philly was dead and never to be together. Almost immediately they started having "moments" while Villy was sharing scenes and story and then a few months into SS's supposed regime -- despite a lot of screen time put towards an obvious Villy reunion -- Philly were fucking and living together and the really lame triangle with Victoria was born. This screamed Mal "Philly is a master class in romcom" Young.

Other weird disjointed stuff that began mere weeks into Sally's tenure:

• Reed was not connecting to his mom but was instead feeling close to Billy. And that was dropped. (For Philly/Villy I guess.)
• Lauren and Fenmores had front burner story and then she disappeared. Completely.
• Jack and Ashley suddenly started fighting (which I hated) but it abruptly ended.
• The Dina story has paced oddly.
• Nikki and Victor were all good and lovey dovey and together forever as a couple (MTS said on Twitter that is something she and EB requested of Sally, no more break up make up for them; they're too old for that shit). Victor pretty much mellowed and everyone "forgot" his big crimes. Suddenly viewers were to believe that Nikki (and Nick and Vicki) would accept everything, including her dear friend Jack being tortured, but drew the line at Victor being responsible for Adam's death and told Victor to FOAD? 
• Sally stated no Jack vs Victor but now Jack's hooking up with Nikki and everyone's warning him that he's going to piss off Victor?
• The B&S sweeps week in L.A. was NOT Sally. No way, no how. That narrative-free, cross-promotion crap on the CBS roof was ALL Mal and McDaniel.
• Ashley and Ravi were building into something. But then that kind of fell away. He went from quirky guy who was probably going to bed Ashley to wizened boring guy with no personality and no apparent desire for sex despite being in his 20s.

I'm sure there are more examples of disjointed storytelling. But the point is Sally was not running the show on her own and cannot in fairness be held responsible for ratings or anything else in an overarching way. I think show realized this "team" of Sally/Kay/Mal (also network/Sony) was not working, and because Mal offered to take the HW reins as well as his EP post, they could go cheap while having a modicum of continuity by keeping him and dropping Sally (and Kay I guess; who knows why she left). If they dropped Mal they'd need to find a new EP. This way no need to hire anyone.

I don't love everything Sally did. But she should have had the chance to do it on her own with creative freedom. Too many cooks made a mess. They won't let Mal be free either. It's been clear that all HWs are under many pressures and the revolving door can't be very reassuring. In any case, according to that guy Spinx posted, Mal won't have the time/energy to write properly.

Edited August 3, 2017 by miamama

[peacheslatour]

Excellent post MM. You have so succinctly stated what has been nagging at me with this whole mess,

[jewel21]

The thing is I'm liking the direction things are going. I like normal Sharon, love Nikki and Jack, Cane being a turd and outed, the Dina story in it's entirety. I'm just wondering who is the person responsible for these story lines? If it was Sally, and she's now gone, I worry. If it's Mal, well with the exception of his Philly obsession, I guess I can handle it. The pace seems to have picked up a bit, too.

[HeatLifer]

48 minutes ago, jewel21 said:

The thing is I'm liking the direction things are going. I like normal Sharon, love Nikki and Jack, Cane being a turd and outed, the Dina story in it's entirety. I'm just wondering who is the person responsible for these story lines? If it was Sally, and she's now gone, I worry. If it's Mal, well with the exception of his Philly obsession, I guess I can handle it. The pace seems to have picked up a bit, too.

But even with Philly, besides the ridiculous overuse of sex scenes, Phyllis is written as unstable and jealous and the two of them don't go a day without talking about Victoria. Sometimes it's hard for me to believe that's Mal's idea.

[spinxella]

 

 

Apparently Sara Bibel was Sally Sussman's No. 2 on the Y&R writing staff.

[miamama]

^^Number 2 behind only Sally you mean? 

I too find it hard to believe that Phyllis obsessed with Vicki was Mal. Nor was Dina. Jack and Nikki is harking back to Bell era as well and screams Sally. But really who knows. Network interference is a factor too.

Mal thought Philly were funny in a romcom way. There is no attempt at humour now. I'm afraid he'll completely change direction and make Philly the true big love story with many opportunities to showcase JT and GT's comedic skills as well as the humour inherent in a couple that came together in betrayal. /end sarcasm

[Snaporaz]

11 hours ago, jewel21 said:

The thing is I'm liking the direction things are going. I like normal Sharon, love Nikki and Jack, Cane being a turd and outed, the Dina story in it's entirety. I'm just wondering who is the person responsible for these story lines? If it was Sally, and she's now gone, I worry. If it's Mal, well with the exception of his Philly obsession, I guess I can handle it. The pace seems to have picked up a bit, too.

I feel the same way.  Although I agree with a lot of the problematic areas @miamama and her writer's sensibilities laid out above, I find the show infinitely more watchable than it was a year ago (in terms of day-to-day viewing).  I wonder if the faster pace is Mal?  The pace of Eastenders was super fast.

@spinxella, where did that screenshot for your avatar come from?!!  

[spinxella]

 

 

 

Edited August 7, 2017 by spinxella

[crosby777]

I really hope they go there.. these 2 girls are on fire.. chemistry out the ying yang.. Camryn hasn't connected with any of the males they have paired her with but sure has it with Cait.,,

and poor Tessa stuck with the oh so boring Noah.. a very soapy soap couple

[spinxella]

[crosby777]

I can't stand DG.. what a whiner. He is almost as bad as Cane.

[Gam2]

Crosby777, I agree. There are other actors on soaps who are villians/assholes/clueless but they don't go on social media to defend themselves and their characters. Upthread, I specifically mentioned Hillary as someone I never confused as a character and as an actress because she doesn't do what DG does constantly. Apparently, he's confused HIMSELF with his character and takes criticism of his character personally. Also, I think he's just a terrible actor as I've said many times so don't need to repeat myself. I will be very happy when he's finally fired from this show. 

[KnotsLanding]

Daniel Goddard got the best story of his career and has done nothing but complain. He is an idiot. Cane always should've been written as a bad boy, as the new Brad Carlton. It opens him up to doing so much more. He is basically the second lead on the show with Billy. Would he rather what he had before? A small C story with Lily and being featured once a week? This literally creates nothing but possibility for him so his complaints are bizarre.

As for Mal Young as HW, I think it'll be a mess. With Sussman I know things haven't been perfect, but if you look at her first interview and even a month into her tenure, you can tell the show was heavily run by committee. Everything she said she didn't like actually happened. Melody Thomas Scott said she specifically requested Victor and Nikki not be broken up again because the story needed to progress and Sussman agreed, then a few months in Victor goes back to his old ways after she just repaired him. She said Ravi was meant to lead Ashley into her next big love story, yet that love interest never developed and Ravi disappeared. She worked on repairing Phyllis as a character (and Billy) and moving them out of each others orbit but they're instantly back together. She wanted to give Lauren a story and Lauren was quickly removed from the story because the show hasn't had interest in putting Lauren or Michael in a main story in years. I also believe Mal was writing the show for months when before Pratt officially left. We know Pratt was busy with his primetime show Star. I think those last couple months prior to Sussman are a good example of the type of show Young is going to write and it won't be very good. At the very least they could've gotten rid of Sussman and kept Alden, or perhaps since Sara Bibel is staying and she was Sally's #2 (probably her unofficial Co-HW) he could've given her an official Co-HW slot, but clearly he just wants total control. We will see, but I can't see how he'll be successful in both roles alone.

[boes]

51 minutes ago, KnotsLanding said:

Daniel Goddard got the best story of his career and has done nothing but complain. He is an idiot. Cane always should've been written as a bad boy, as the new Brad Carlton. It opens him up to doing so much more. He is basically the second lead on the show with Billy. Would he rather what he had before? A small C story with Lily and being featured once a week? This literally creates nothing but possibility for him so his complaints are bizarre.

As for Mal Young as HW, I think it'll be a mess. With Sussman I know things haven't been perfect, but if you look at her first interview and even a month into her tenure, you can tell the show was heavily run by committee. Everything she said she didn't like actually happened. Melody Thomas Scott said she specifically requested Victor and Nikki not be broken up again because the story needed to progress and Sussman agreed, then a few months in Victor goes back to his old ways after she just repaired him. She said Ravi was meant to lead Ashley into her next big love story, yet that love interest never developed and Ravi disappeared. She worked on repairing Phyllis as a character (and Billy) and moving them out of each others orbit but they're instantly back together. She wanted to give Lauren a story and Lauren was quickly removed from the story because the show hasn't had interest in putting Lauren or Michael in a main story in years. I also believe Mal was writing the show for months when before Pratt officially left. We know Pratt was busy with his primetime show Star. I think those last couple months prior to Sussman are a good example of the type of show Young is going to write and it won't be very good. At the very least they could've gotten rid of Sussman and kept Alden, or perhaps since Sara Bibel is staying and she was Sally's #2 (probably her unofficial Co-HW) he could've given her an official Co-HW slot, but clearly he just wants total control. We will see, but I can't see how he'll be successful in both roles alone.

Very good analysis, thanks.

[JasonCC]

So agreed about what's likely the case with Mal Young and Sussman situation and the plots that kind of seemed to start Sally and then get tweaked. I wonder, though, if Sally (or Sara) took the reigns after they were directed that Nikki & Victor need to be part of a splitting up plot and not allowed to be settled together grandparents? If directed to, the Jack angle was probably the best way to do it with all the history there is. I'm buying it.

Glass half full: Sara Bibel is still writing (she knows the history and characters), Mal hopefully will build from where Sally has re-established the GC families as they should be: Abbott family is back and re-established more than anytime since Bill Bell was at the helm (get Traci in there, though), Chancellor home has been re-established as Jill & Esther's domain. Yes, Jill is travelling too much and a Chance return/recast would be nice but at least JFP idea of making it into BILLY'S crash pad with Phyllis was sharply undone.  Teen characters have potential: Reed, Mattie, Charlie and (soon, probably) Faith were not OVER-SORASED which I always feel is a mistake (missing out on the awkward teen years and immediately having them some vague 21 age). Cane/Lilly/Juliet has been good and broke the lame sense that those two have to be a cardboard cutout perfect couple. Victor is not eating show. I know some don't like Scotty but it was good to bring him back (now just figure out what to do with him). Sharon is more or less redeemed now.  Gloria's return was appropriate: not too much Gloria but wickedly funny when she is there. 

Edited August 7, 2017 by JasonCC

[Joimiaroxeu]

Oh man, I forgot Billy Miller was going to be on Ray Donovan. He's playing a cop and definitely has that "one too many donuts" thing going on. It was a pleasant surprise to see him pop up.

[miamama]

10 hours ago, KnotsLanding said:

Daniel Goddard got the best story of his career and has done nothing but complain. He is an idiot. Cane always should've been written as a bad boy, as the new Brad Carlton. It opens him up to doing so much more. He is basically the second lead on the show with Billy. Would he rather what he had before? A small C story with Lily and being featured once a week? This literally creates nothing but possibility for him so his complaints are bizarre.

As for Mal Young as HW, I think it'll be a mess. With Sussman I know things haven't been perfect, but if you look at her first interview and even a month into her tenure, you can tell the show was heavily run by committee. Everything she said she didn't like actually happened. Melody Thomas Scott said she specifically requested Victor and Nikki not be broken up again because the story needed to progress and Sussman agreed, then a few months in Victor goes back to his old ways after she just repaired him. She said Ravi was meant to lead Ashley into her next big love story, yet that love interest never developed and Ravi disappeared. She worked on repairing Phyllis as a character (and Billy) and moving them out of each others orbit but they're instantly back together. She wanted to give Lauren a story and Lauren was quickly removed from the story because the show hasn't had interest in putting Lauren or Michael in a main story in years. I also believe Mal was writing the show for months when before Pratt officially left. We know Pratt was busy with his primetime show Star. I think those last couple months prior to Sussman are a good example of the type of show Young is going to write and it won't be very good. At the very least they could've gotten rid of Sussman and kept Alden, or perhaps since Sara Bibel is staying and she was Sally's #2 (probably her unofficial Co-HW) he could've given her an official Co-HW slot, but clearly he just wants total control. We will see, but I can't see how he'll be successful in both roles alone.

Totally agree with all this. Sally needed to FIX characters in order to build plausible stories but she was stymied at every turn. 

I am convinced Mal in charge officially will be a disaster. But at least he'll have to accept responsibility for the outcome. Right now he's being presented as some sort of saviour. RME. 

[DivaT]

12 hours ago, KnotsLanding said:

Daniel Goddard got the best story of his career and has done nothing but complain. He is an idiot. Cane always should've been written as a bad boy, as the new Brad Carlton. It opens him up to doing so much more. He is basically the second lead on the show with Billy. Would he rather what he had before? A small C story with Lily and being featured once a week? This literally creates nothing but possibility for him so his complaints are bizarre.

As for Mal Young as HW, I think it'll be a mess. With Sussman I know things haven't been perfect, but if you look at her first interview and even a month into her tenure, you can tell the show was heavily run by committee. Everything she said she didn't like actually happened. Melody Thomas Scott said she specifically requested Victor and Nikki not be broken up again because the story needed to progress and Sussman agreed, then a few months in Victor goes back to his old ways after she just repaired him. She said Ravi was meant to lead Ashley into her next big love story, yet that love interest never developed and Ravi disappeared. She worked on repairing Phyllis as a character (and Billy) and moving them out of each others orbit but they're instantly back together. She wanted to give Lauren a story and Lauren was quickly removed from the story because the show hasn't had interest in putting Lauren or Michael in a main story in years. I also believe Mal was writing the show for months when before Pratt officially left. We know Pratt was busy with his primetime show Star. I think those last couple months prior to Sussman are a good example of the type of show Young is going to write and it won't be very good. At the very least they could've gotten rid of Sussman and kept Alden, or perhaps since Sara Bibel is staying and she was Sally's #2 (probably her unofficial Co-HW) he could've given her an official Co-HW slot, but clearly he just wants total control. We will see, but I can't see how he'll be successful in both roles alone.

 

I just think DG fears being fired again. I knows he needs Lane stans to fight for him to remain employed. 

[Gam2]

And if he's unemployed and has no money, what was he doing at the Club? That has to be the most expensive place in town except for the upstairs pool/bar area. And now Noah has been cut off from the Newman account too by Grandpa Victurd. WTH?

[jewel21]

Yeah, I'm surprised Noah was cut off as well. I thought Victor was happy with him for saving the day with regards to Nikki's recital.

How long was Sussman at the helm? I feel like she wasn't there even a year...

[valleycliffe]

jewel21, seems to me, sally's writing started in december wasn't it?

so, about 8 mos. or so.

[valleycliffe]

ick.  ick.  ick.  ick.  ick.

i was at a different board and someone suggested tptb get rebecca budig for y&r as she is available....

ME:  no, no, no, no, no, no. no. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[spinxella]

[PatsyandEddie]

Wouldn't surprise me.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quote

i was at a different board and someone suggested tptb get rebecca budig for y&r as she is available....

ME:  no, no, no, no, no, no. no. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

No kidding. I still hold her and Cameron Mathison largely responsible for the death of AMC. You ain't seen propping unless you saw how those two were propped. But I don't see why her being available is a such a big deal anyway. She was off soaps for years before she got the GH gig. Let DAYS have her.

Quote

Wouldn't surprise me.

Me either and if it's true, I don't like it. This way the Hevon fanatics will get to pretend Mariah and Devon were never really attracted to each other. And wow, I took a quick look at that Twitter feed and am impressed at how butthurt so many of them are about Mariah & Devon. Wah, tell it to the Shick fans. Or the Phick fans.

[jewel21]

14 hours ago, valleycliffe said:

jewel21, seems to me, sally's writing started in december wasn't it?

so, about 8 mos. or so.

Geez, they didn't give her much of a chance, did they? I remember then promoting her quite a bit when she was first hired, and then radio silence. I kind of feel bad.

[spinxella]

 

Edited August 10, 2017 by spinxella